My Cabinet Build *Updated* Post Mortem

[SegaOutrun]

ive got a dfgt but i dont understand the question. What are you looking for?

[Howard_Casto]

You know the base part, where the motor and stuff is housed and not the wheel itself. 

What are the general dimensions of that?

[Howard_Casto]

Well anyway, I'm roughing stuff out regardless. 

I've been at it off and on since around 6pm, but I think I've got the dash-box finished.  Here it is propped up so I can get a general idea of how to mount it.  (I knew those vhs I mentioned in EE would come in handy for something.  ) That piece of tube steel in the pic is what I'll be using for the mount, along with some big old carriage bolts.  The treadmill it came off of was rated for 300 lbs, so I think it should be sturdy enough.  If not I can add additional bracing. 

I'm not sure how I'm doing the front yet.  I'm thinking that I'll put 3/4 plywood for structural reasons with a hole for the base of the wheel to stick out.  I'll put a piece of 1/8th inch finish board over top of that to cover the hole and make everything look nice. 

I'm going to make an actual dash pad via some wiggle board, memory foam, and some vinyl to staple over it.  I want to put a bit of a curve as well so I'll have room for gauges if I ever get around to it. 

[BzZziLLa]

I'm not sure how I'm doing the front yet.  I'm thinking that I'll put 3/4 plywood for structural reasons with a hole for the base of the wheel to stick out.  I'll put a piece of 1/8th inch finish board over top of that to cover the hole and make everything look nice. 

I'm going to make an actual dash pad via some wiggle board, memory foam, and some vinyl to staple over it.  I want to put a bit of a curve as well so I'll have room for gauges if I ever get around to it. 

Good thinking with the wiggle board and memory foam. It'll be awhile until I get around to building the dash on my cab, but this was definitely one of the better ideas i've heard yet. 

Edit: Oh and I especially like the use of old VCR tapes to help visualize the scale of the model lol

[Howard_Casto]

Well let's see how it turns out.  I've re-upholstered stuff before and am decent with it, but your end result is only as good as the material you are using and considering I'll be using the cheapest vinyl I can find..... 

I mounted the seat today, which is long over-due.  Originally I was going to use lag screws to mount it directly, but now that I've got everything together I realized how awkward that would be.  Instead I found these really wide l-brackets that they use for waterbeds and screwed my 2x2's down that way.  It seems pretty sturdy. 

That means I'm locked in btw.... time to figure out the geometry for the dash, cut my steel and mount everything. 

[Howard_Casto]

UGH! 

I was done for the day so I thought that I might try to get the dash bolted on to the base.  So I used my vhs tapes to hold it up again, measured the angles for the tubing... clamped everything together and went to work.  My hand drills just couldn't cut it.  Even stepping up the size when I got to that magic number (1/4 inch) it just wouldn't drill through.  So I was pressing as hard as I could, it finally went through and as per usual when you are drilling through something hollow, it lunged forward as it went through which was just enough to knock the dash box off the tapes and everything went flying. 

So I take the tubes to my drill press and it drills through them like they are nothing.  Long story short, get a drill press.... they are more handy than you think.

Anyway, I've got the holes for the upper stuff drilled, but I need to stop anyway.  I've got to get some big old 1/4inch hex screws for the bottom so it can screw directly into the 2x4 frame.  I'm using machine bolts on top so I can remove the box easily.  I'm hoping this works because if it doesn't I've basically got to re-design the thing from scratch.  We'll see this weekend after I've made a trip to Lowes. 

[twistedsymphony]

Drill Press FTW.

I've got a pretty bad-ass drill press, it's got a 2ft arm and is capable of drilling at measured angles too. paid $75 for it on Craigslist 

I love that thing and I get more use out of it than I would have expected.

[Howard_Casto]

Gee it's only been over a year since the last update..... (stupid medical issues)

Ok so I'm super stressed out so I decided to take a day for myself and I finally mounted the control panel to the base.  I was worried about it needed reinforcement, but damn those lag bolts into the box steel tubes did the trick!  Also my concerns about the rig not collapsing properly seem to be unwarranted as well.  The whole thing, with the wheel mounted seems to slide all the way back in without catching on anything.  I could make it slide back even further if I notched the sides, but I think for now it'll do. 

Anyway I sat in it and for the most part it feel good.  The wheel position could use a little work, but I've left myself some adjustment room. 

I'll take some pics once I've cleaned everything up.  It's a bit of a mess, even by my standards. 

[Howard_Casto]

So even though I'm busy I managed to find a lull in the stuff I have to do and I've been working on this on and off all week.  I think I'll be done with the basic structure soon.  I managed to get the front and back of the dashboard roughed in and I'm currently cutting the trim board that covers them.  I re-mounted the wheel... the board it's on is now on a hinge.  I intend to mount a worm gear to the back of the board allowing for angle adjustment on the wheel.  I think that's a first on these forums, I dunno.  Currently I just have it screwed in place. 

I'm going to finish up the trim boards today and hopefully I can work on the pedal area next.  The pedals are a bit tricky because my rig collapses.  The plan is to make an angled floor to hold the pedals and mount the back of it on a hinge... bolted to my support struts.  So when the rig collapses you fold them upward and they store vertically in front of the seat.  Because the support struts are angled towards the seat, the vertically stored pedals will still fit in my 2'x2' footprint. 

I've also decided to do a vesa mount on the back of the dash.  For now I think I'm going to use an old 4:3 lcd I have lying around, but depending upon how some of the display experiments currently going on in the forums turn out, I might swap to a wrap around layout later on.

*edit*

Pics tonight when I get a chance to upload.

[Howard_Casto]

Ok here are some pics....  after I get all the trim in place I'm going to remove the whole box and run the edges with my router to give it a nice rounded look.  I haven't decided on the color, but the plan is a buttload of polyurethane. 

As you can see I need to do a minor adjustment here and there... the wheel is sticking out just a bit at the highest adjustment so I think I need to pull the hinge attachment point back a little.  If you are thinking there isn't a lot of space between the dash and the wheel you are correct.  More on that later. 

[BadMouth]

I'd want another support leg on each side or maybe an x brace on the back.

[Howard_Casto]

It doesn't need it.  I sat on the control panel after I got it bolted in... didn't budge.  It looks a lot more unwieldy than it is. 

[lolomc2]

what about pedals ?

[Howard_Casto]

Read above ^^

Right now we have bad weather so I'm at a standstill, but the other reason I haven't gotten to them is I have to decide which set to use.  For whatever reason I have a bunch of pedals.  It seems the wheels break over time but the pedals live on.  I've got the ones shown.... a very unique set for an xbox wheel and a set of ginormous (and very sturdy) pedals from a n64 wheel.  Obviously the mounting geometry is going to be different for each one, so I'll have to think on it. 

[BadMouth]

The N64 pedals might not be analog.

I've got a big Friday night of doing laundry and piddling around the basement planned.
I'll dig out a set of those VLT buttons and upload a pic.
The bank of them if mounted Daytona style will be about 4" wide.

I think I've got a round button from cyber sled that says "view point" if you wanted to try a single button solution.
It looks a bit cruddy, but might clean up good.

[Howard_Casto]

They've got pots in them, but I might have to switch them out for a different value.  Both the brake and the gas are these super huge rectangular pedals... they look more like something you'd see on a flight sim BUT they've got a nice feel to them and are super sturdy.  The xbox pedals are part of a pedal/wheel rig that came with a "seat" (yeah I have to use air quotes for that one).  They are a little on the small side, but they are mounted to this steel tube and you can actually adjust the angle.  So I could probably do a set of hang-down pedals with them.    I'm going to fish them all out tonight so I'll post pics. 

In regards to the buttons... I'm looking at the panel now and the space I have to work with isn't THAT bad, so I might be able to use standard ones.  It looks like I have about 3.5 to 4 inches of useable space on either side.  I might end up having to do a vertical line of buttons like someone suggested, but man that's going to look weird. 

[BadMouth]

Belated pics of vlt buttons.  They will need just shy of 4.5" width to fit in.  Thry can't be mounted in anything too thick, 1/8" at most.

[BadMouth]

Tapatalk seems to only let me add one pic per post....

[Howard_Casto]

That's what I was afraid of.  4" I might have been able to squeeze in somehow, but that's not going to work... at least not in a straight line.  Let me pilfer the autoparts websites and stuff outside of our normal scope.  I'm going to have to think on this one a bit. 

[Howard_Casto]

Ok does anyone have any experience with these guys?

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/High-Quality-Angel-Eye-Metal-LED-illuminated-Momentary-16mm-Push-Button-Switch-Car-Dash-12V/32447624253.html

If one can believe the specs they only need a 16mm hole, which would make the total size around .70 - .75 inches a button.  So I could probably squeeze 4 in there somehow.

It's certainly a unique look, and I kind of wanted to do nickel/chrome on wood as the aesthetic anyway. 

[Slippyblade]

I've seen a few builds with that style switch.  They look great!  Though the ones I've seen used were larger than that.

[Howard_Casto]

Yeah what I'm worried about is the size.  if I remember correctly they have a bezel around them so they might be hard to press where they don't stick out any. 

[Howard_Casto]

Ok so I got a lot accomplished today in terms of function but boy do I need to work on the form.  I tried a lot of things with the pedals and ultimately what worked best was a simple 1/8" piece of plywood that hinges to the front of the rig for the pedals to bolt to.  It's ugly, but it gets the job done and I'll make an angled floor to make it look nice later.  It folds up pretty well when the rig is collapsed, but I think I need to put a stop on the control panel struts so that it doesn't flop down in the floor... the seat makes the plywood almost vertical when folded up.  I also made an extremely crude vesa mount.... a 1x4 bolted to the back of the control panel box.  Again, quite ugly, but gets the job done. 

Initially I was going to make this to use in front of the big screen, but as the build has progressed I kind of like the idea of just throwing the whole thing in a corner and pulling it out when I want to play.  Thus the vesa mount.  I threw an ancient 19" 4:3 lcd on there and to my surprise it looks gigantic mounted that close to my face.  I think I'll just pick up a 16:9 or 16:10 lcd the next time I see one on sale.  The smaller sizes are rather cheap. 

Anyway, of the three pedals I mentioned the other day I liked elements of each.  I liked the spacing of the ones that came with the wheel, I liked the pedals and springs on the old n64 wheel and I liked the way the pedals are hinged on the lever on the xbox pedals.  So I might end up taking them all apart and building some sort of franken pedals. 

There is still a lot to do even before I get to the cosmetics and drilling the control panel.  The dashpad has to be finished... I'm warping a piece of plywood as we speak, and the floor's underside has to be routed out so the pc will fit inside.  Then I need to build the trap door, which I might skip.... the floor is easy enough to unbolt.  Holes for airflow will need to be drilled... I'm thinking in the front.  Then I've got to figure out the power distribution and cabling as it's a bit tricky with a pc the slides in and out. 

If I don't get done before winter hits the rig is in a playable state, so at least it won't sit around un-used for another year.  Pics tonight or tomorrow once I've rested.

[Howard_Casto]

Oops!  Forgot to upload pics. 

As you can see from the pictures, the wood I used was a bit rough, but it's temporary.  Also note that the monitor isn't crooked, I'm just a bad photographer. 

[Howard_Casto]

Anyway on the buttons front I'm a bit overwhelmed.  I looked through those metal buttons and the selection is a bit dis-jointed.  In the 16mm buttons it's hard to find any color other than blue.  Nearly all of these are 12v buttons, but I'm assuming a resistor just needs swapped... I can't think of a 12v led.  There is a "high flush" version of the buttons, where the plunger sticks up, but I can only find those in blue. 

Also there are black metal and gold metal buttons.  The black really mimic the look of the old Daytona buttons, only a bit updated.

And that's just one style of button.  If anyone wants to take a look and chime in I'd appreciate it.  Remember I have around 3.5 inches to work with. 

[Howard_Casto]

So taking a break from my button woes, I got a lot accomplished. 


I finally bit the bullet and cut the wheel to make it detachable.  I'm probably going to get a better wheel when all is said and done, but this was more of an exercise on how to do it. 

I first removed the entire shaft assembly (with steering wheel attached) from the gear box.  I then removed the big gear on the shaft and went to the hardware store to find a schedule 40 (aka very thick) pvc coupling that would tightly go over the shaft.  The shaft on my wheel is tapered so it only fits on so far but that is OK. 

I took my dremel and cut the shaft slightly longer than where the coupling stopped. 

With the wheel now detached I sanded the gearbox end of the shaft sliding the coupling over it.  When in place the fit is incredibly tight and the end of the coupling lays flush with the outer housing on the gear box, allowing for added support.  I then put a set screw to hold it in place and re-assembled the box. 

On the wheel end I had to cut off the shaft because it tapered too wide.  With just the slightest bit of sanding, a 2" pvc end cap (with hex top) fit inside the hole on the wheel where the shaft was.  This 2" end cap fits perfectly inside the coupling I put on the gearbox.  I then bolted the end cap to the wheel.  The end result is sturdy, but I'm not super concerned anyway as I think I'll make a wooden wheel like "lew" did. 

Now I can attach the wheel by just sliding it inside the coupling.  I'll eventually get a quick-release pin and put it through the shaft to attach it firmly. 

There's a minor bit of work to do but overall I'm pleased with the end result.  It also gives the shaft an extra inch or two in length, so I won't scrape my knuckles on the dash. 

I'm sure this is a bit confusing without pics... those are coming either in a few, or after the walking dead. 

[Howard_Casto]

Ok pics incoming. 

You'll see some holes on the front of the wheel, that's from a failed mounting attempt.... just ignore them. 

[Howard_Casto]

I can't sleep tonight so I'm sitting here trying to figure out what kind of dongle I'm going to use for the wheel connection.  The original wheel has 7 wires... one for each button and ground.  I also want to run the pedal inputs through there for the yoke.... I think there are four wires for that.  I'm thinking perhaps a 5v line might also be useful and maybe a few other wires for lights if I decide to make the buttons blink (might be useful for spyhunter).  DB 25 might be overkill... maybe a db 14?

If I can beat the cold weather I really want to try making my own wheel.  I've got a new router and router table and they've yet to be used significantly.   I'm thinking an art-deco style wheel would be fun. 

I'm sniping smart phones to use as gauges on the dash.  For now I'll probably use idisplay to put mamehooker on the phones, but eventually I'll probably write my own app. 

I started test fitting that optical wheel I made last year..... yeah it's not going to work attached under the dash..... it just sits too low.  So I might try mounting it above the wheel instead.  I'm thinking of a re-design.... all of the components except the optical sensor and pcb will go inside a pipe.  So a simple hole can be cut in the dash and once inserted, the optical pcb would fold down on a hinge.  It'll take quite a bit of engineering to get it right, so it's a low priority atm. 

I'm also going to add a removable flight stick.  I would like a force-feedback one, but that seems to have fallen out of fashion.  Maybe a hacked gamepad with rumble?

[Howard_Casto]

So I made the top of the dash today.  I still have to put some vinyl on it, but it looks pretty good.  Pics later of course.  I want to tackle the pedals issue tomorrow... I really don't like that mounting solution.  Then I'll try to deal with the trap door and then I need to start applying finish. 

[Howard_Casto]

So the pedals solution for now is a simple one.  I ditched the plywood and just bolted the hinges directly on the pedal assembly.  It looks much better.  I will eventually make a wooden enclosure around the pedals, but as I mentioned before I'm probably going to mod them heavily, so it's better to wait until I'm done. 

[Howard_Casto]

So I upholstered the dash board today and it turned out pretty good!  I know I had mentioned earlier about wanting tan vinyl, but all the samples I could find looked kind of yellowish, so I went with some black I had lying around instead.  Good stuff. 

Pics later tonight hopefully. 

[Howard_Casto]

Ok as promised pics.... first one of the wiggle board without anything on it and then one with the vinyl and 1" of memory foam.  I cut half circles of plywood the contour of the dash and screwed the wiggle board to it if anyone is wondering.  (I'll try to get a pic of it the next time I have it opened.)

[Howard_Casto]

Well minor progress today.  Obviously I don't want a big white pipe for a steering column, so I pulled out a needle and thread and made a real tight sleeve from leftover vinyl to go over it.  I can't believe it is holding.  Thanks jr. high home ec teacher that I can no longer remember your name!  I also pulled the spline from the already stripped back panel on the seat and covered it with leftover vinyl.  I'm not as impressed with the results and I'll probably sand and paint it later on, but for now it looks ok. 

I need to figure out the trap door (if I do one) next.  It's going to take a bit of engineering, so I really need to get it done before it gets cold and I'm stuck in the house away from my tools. 

On the button front I've decided to get a few different kinds and try them out.  They aren't super expensive and it's quite difficult to figure it out without having the buttons on hand.  I found one seller that carries those metal buttons in every color but yellow for a mere $1 a pop, no shipping.  Unfortunately they are the latching type but I'm going to get them anyway because you can often remove the latch or break it by removing a tab.  I'm also going to get some extra white ones and try to convert them to yellow via some yellow leds and the yellow indicator repair tape you can get at auto stores.  You know... the kind of tape used to repair signal lights on your car if the lens gets cracked?

[Howard_Casto]

So something you might have noticed from the pics is the fact that the wheel is a bit off-center from my hole.  Actually it's my front panel that is off, but it's such a small amount I just decided to nudge the wheel over a bit.  The bottom part of that slot is going to be filled with a segment of wood that can slide up and down... remember my wheel will have an angle adjustment. 

I'm going to sit down and order a few sets of buttons tomorrow.  The outrun purist in me wants to get styles that match the sega cabs, but the artist in me wants to get chromed buttons to match the art deco look I'm going for.  We'll see which one wins out.  I've decided that I need to order floor mats before I cut the trap door as the best way to hide it would be to put a mat over top.  With thick enough rubber/carpet I could probably use the mat as the hinge as well. 

[Howard_Casto]

So I'm having a strange issue with the button ordering.....  If I want a full set I might have to order from 5 different sellers as nobody on eBay appears to have a full set of all the colors in stock!  Quite frustrating. 

[BadMouth]

So I'm having a strange issue with the button ordering.....  If I want a full set I might have to order from 5 different sellers as nobody on eBay appears to have a full set of all the colors in stock!  Quite frustrating.

Which style of button did you decide on?
Some of the regular byoac vendors are stocking the round chrome ones now.

I'm still willing to part with a set of my VLT buttons.

[Howard_Casto]

They aren't super expensive, so I was probably going to get a few and just use the styles I don't like on other projects.  I'm going to sit down and have another go at it this evening. 

I did find a set of rectangular buttons that are only 16mm wide.... those might work. 

[BadMouth]

groovygamegear has the standard size chrome illuminated buttons for $2.35 under the name chromalite.

[Howard_Casto]

Yeah and if they would fit I would save myself a lot of trouble and use them.  The nickel plated "angle eye" buttons are a bust for now.  All the good ebay sellers are currently out and what's left are sellers that send a random color.... unless you want to pay 10 bucks a button, and if I was going to do that I'd get a Daytona harness and figure out how to fit it.  Also, and I'm trying to confirm, apparently the leds are on an internal circuit to where they only light up when pressed?  If that's the case then I don't want them. 

I found these and they were so cheap I went ahead and ordered a test set:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-12-24V-16mm-Push-Button-Self-Reset-Self-Lock-Switch-LED-Momentary-Latching-/361421282594?var=&hash=item5426631d22:m:mBHNVOrRkF3sLncLj_vKnDw

They look pretty much like the sega buttons but are only 16mm wide and are designed to butt up against each other.  Again, supply woes.... I had to get half in 12v and the other in 24v... considering I have to remove the resistors anyway to make them work on a 5v system I doubt it'll matter. 

[BadMouth]

Yeah and if they would fit I would save myself a lot of trouble and use them.  The nickel plated "angle eye" buttons are a bust for now.  All the good ebay sellers are currently out and what's left are sellers that send a random color.... unless you want to pay 10 bucks a button, and if I was going to do that I'd get a Daytona harness and figure out how to fit it.  Also, and I'm trying to confirm, apparently the leds are on an internal circuit to where they only light up when pressed?  If that's the case then I don't want them. 

I found these and they were so cheap I went ahead and ordered a test set:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-12-24V-16mm-Push-Button-Self-Reset-Self-Lock-Switch-LED-Momentary-Latching-/361421282594?var=&hash=item5426631d22:m:mBHNVOrRkF3sLncLj_vKnDw

They look pretty much like the sega buttons but are only 16mm wide and are designed to butt up against each other.  Again, supply woes.... I had to get half in 12v and the other in 24v... considering I have to remove the resistors anyway to make them work on a 5v system I doubt it'll matter.

Latching?  Might be a way to break the latching mech.