Powered USB 1.0 Hub? Is that enough?

[mcseforsale]

I'm running a Dell Optiplex GX260 P4, 1GB RAM as my Mamewah box.  I'm not doing anything graphics intensive, just Mamewah with MAME, N64, Atari 2600, SNES and that's about it...  Just wondering if using a USB 1.0 powered hub would work well enough for my iPac 4 and OptiPac (and in the future, an LEDWiz)?  I know 2.0 is ideal, but I have a nifty 1.0 powered hub that I could remote mount near the CP and I can get it for free.

Thanks!

AJ

[Mysterioii]

Wouldn't 3.0 be ideal now?   

I'm pretty sure my hub is just 1.0 (my cabinet is like 8 years old).  I've got the same sort of setup.  But I have some things running right into the ports in the back of the PC and some spilling over into the hub, and I don't recall what's hooked up where.  But I'm kinda guessing the whole shebang is 1.0 and I haven't had any issues. 

Now, as far as the powered aspect goes...  I have a powered hub but when I tried to hook up a lcdtopgun a few years back it was a version with a recoil device and after the thing fired a few times it would draw too much current and make the port drop out.  I guess maybe not all powered hubs are created equal or the thing was just not designed well enough to play nicely with the hub.  Worked fine if you just left the recoil disconnected but it just wasn't as cool...  Moot point now since I bought an Aimtrak...   

[mcseforsale]

Awesome, thanks!  If I do an aimtrak, I'll def. power it from the PC or external power supply.  For now, though, I have a USB 1.1 hub with 7 ports and a 6V 4A power wart, so I'm guessing it's got the juice.  BTW, it's a Belkin F5U027, if anyone cares. 

I'll be plugging in my Optipac (with only one Happ trackball), and my iPac 4 (with only 2 players) and MAYBE, my 16 GGG buttons.  The buttons will only be running blue until I get a LEDWiz, so I think I'll be alright with this setup.

Thanks!
AJ

Wouldn't 3.0 be ideal now?   

I'm pretty sure my hub is just 1.0 (my cabinet is like 8 years old).  I've got the same sort of setup.  But I have some things running right into the ports in the back of the PC and some spilling over into the hub, and I don't recall what's hooked up where.  But I'm kinda guessing the whole shebang is 1.0 and I haven't had any issues. 

Now, as far as the powered aspect goes...  I have a powered hub but when I tried to hook up a lcdtopgun a few years back it was a version with a recoil device and after the thing fired a few times it would draw too much current and make the port drop out.  I guess maybe not all powered hubs are created equal or the thing was just not designed well enough to play nicely with the hub.  Worked fine if you just left the recoil disconnected but it just wasn't as cool...  Moot point now since I bought an Aimtrak...   

[lanman31337]

How is your GX260 still alive?  Those are notorious for blown caps around the fan area.

[mcseforsale]

I get off-lease Dells for free.  I've had this one running mamewah in the garage for 4 years.  And, it hasn't been treated very well. 

But, I have 2 other Dells sitting in the wings (to my wife's dismay) that will serve as backup. 

When I start going for more power, I'm going to convert to something a bit newer, but that will be months from now.  I have access to some GX620s and a couple of "developer" grade machines as well.

I'll probably do a TV first, though.  Then, new(er) PC and video card to run things like HyperPin, etc.  Also, I want to do some consoles eventually. 

AJ

How is your GX260 still alive?  Those are notorious for blown caps around the fan area.

[lanman31337]

I'm impressed.  Before we phased out our 270s, we were going through motherboards every 3-6 months on those.  The help desk loved it when I had 20-25 machines to call in because of bad motherboards.  They had a new revision with some solid caps, but the row in the back by the fan they still kept the regular caps and they would blow.  Go figure.

[Mysterioii]

Awesome, thanks!  If I do an aimtrak, I'll def. power it from the PC or external power supply. 

Nah, you won't need to.  The aimtrak (at least in the default shell) doesn't have a recoil solenoid so you'll have enough juice for normal operation.  Now, you could fit it into a custom shell that has recoil, but I didn't mess with that, I just got the stock one Ultimarc sells.

Haha just a few months ago my old development machine at work died... and it was a Dell Optiplex (not sure of the model).  All of a sudden the fan started spinning faster than any I've ever seen, so much that all the old dust was blowing like 3 feet out the back... I thought it was smoke...  Opened the case and it had 2-3 fully blown electrolytic caps and about 5-6 more that were bulging.     I took it home though, may be able to use the video card and PSU out of it for something.  Possibly pull a few other components off of it (connectors maybe) put probably not much useful to me.  DVD and hard drives I guess.

[mcseforsale]

I certainly don't envy hardware dudes nowadays.  Being an old fart in this business (I'm 41, but I've been in the biz for 22 years), I just don't want to keep up with the hardware changes anymore.

Fortunately, I've been developing installations for 10 years or so.  First in .EXE, then in .MSI and now in virtual spaces.  So, about the only time I have to deal with hardware is if someone wants to know what the OS is reporting (enumerating he hardware keys, or USB keys in the reg is pretty standard stuff).

I feel old before my time!

AJ

[drventure]

About USB and power, the main things you have to remember is that each usb port is "speced" for +at most+ 500ma of current. Actually, it may be only 450ma. Not exactly sure.

Your optipac, keywiz, as well as trackballs, and USB sticks like the U360 won't come anywhere near that.

BUT...

LEDWizes are another story.

The board itself only draws 50-100ma, but then you have to count each LED you attach, and they're typically 20-50ma EACH, and each RGB counts as 3 leds!

Also, say you pick up a nice 7 port hub. If you look closely at the wall wart that comes with it, you may find it grossly underpowered.

For instance, I picked up a cheapo 7 port hub once, the PS was marked as 1amp.

That means that if I wanted to fully power any devices plugged in, I could really only plug in +1 device+!

So, to fully power all available plugs on a 4 port hub, you'd need at least a 2 to 2.2amp PS for it.

Now, getting back to reality, you almost never will have a situation where you actually need to provide full available power to all the devices plugged into a hub.

If you want to connect an LEDWIZ and drive more than just a few LEDs (and who doesn't)    you'll likely want to provide a seperate power supply for it. The LEDWiz docs show you how.


As far as the speed, I'm not completely sure on that. USB3  I +know+ is totally unnecessary for input devices. usb2 is what I pretty much always use.

USB 1 would +probably+ work, but you might get some input lag. Someone else on here might know more concretely about that.

[Mysterioii]

Actually I'm 41 too, brother.  I've got my MENG in EE but it was old-school stuff even at the time, started out writing automated test programs for circuit cards from naval weapons systems.  I've been out of the EE side for a while doing "legacy system" software support...  man I just can't seem to shake the old stuff...     I'd actually RATHER be doing new stuff but I seem to have pigeonholed myself, would have to pretty much walk away and start something new if I wanted to change up what I'm doing, and I don't know if anyplace in my area would pay me what I'm making here.

Would love to be truly self-employed if I could find something that I enjoyed doing and that I felt would pay the bills comfortably with enough left over to save up some.  Hell I'd build control panels for people if I didn't think that market was already saturated....  

[Mysterioii]

Yeah what Drventure said...  I would definitely patch into the pc's power supply for the LEDwiz.  My system works fine as-is BUT I don't have an LEDWiz hooked up yet.  I'm looking at building a new CP which will have the ledwiz, and when I do I'll definitely be hooking it up to external power.

It's really not that hard man.

[mcseforsale]

Excellent info on USB.  I won't have the LEDWiz until Santa comes probably...if I'm even interested in this at that point (I'm always working on projects...BMX restorations, car repairs, I might build the mother of all forts for the kids, etc.).  But I think I can power the 16 RGB drives using only blue off my existing kit, until I update the PC and go for the LEDWiz. 

Mysterioii, if I was a gambling man, I'd invest in some training in .NET (preferrably C# or other) programming, Microsoft SharePoint administration....segwaying into programming.  Those are the key areas they're hiring for down here in the ATL.  .NET folks usually go anywhere from $45 - $75/hour depending on experience.

Sharepoint architects/programmers (it's a glorified web interface) write their own checks down here.  A lot of companies are seeing that Sharepoint can replace things like SAP and other expensive platforms if programmed properly.

AJ

About USB and power, the main things you have to remember is that each usb port is "speced" for +at most+ 500ma of current. Actually, it may be only 450ma. Not exactly sure.

Your optipac, keywiz, as well as trackballs, and USB sticks like the U360 won't come anywhere near that.

BUT...

LEDWizes are another story.

The board itself only draws 50-100ma, but then you have to count each LED you attach, and they're typically 20-50ma EACH, and each RGB counts as 3 leds!

Also, say you pick up a nice 7 port hub. If you look closely at the wall wart that comes with it, you may find it grossly underpowered.

For instance, I picked up a cheapo 7 port hub once, the PS was marked as 1amp.

That means that if I wanted to fully power any devices plugged in, I could really only plug in +1 device+!

So, to fully power all available plugs on a 4 port hub, you'd need at least a 2 to 2.2amp PS for it.

Now, getting back to reality, you almost never will have a situation where you actually need to provide full available power to all the devices plugged into a hub.

If you want to connect an LEDWIZ and drive more than just a few LEDs (and who doesn't)    you'll likely want to provide a seperate power supply for it. The LEDWiz docs show you how.


As far as the speed, I'm not completely sure on that. USB3  I +know+ is totally unnecessary for input devices. usb2 is what I pretty much always use.

USB 1 would +probably+ work, but you might get some input lag. Someone else on here might know more concretely about that.

[AndyWarne]

The I-PAC and Opti-PAC are full speed USB devices and wont work at all on a USB 1.0 hub.

[Mysterioii]

The I-PAC and Opti-PAC are full speed USB devices and wont work at all on a USB 1.0 hub.

Hmm then maybe my PC does have USB 2 even though it's like 8 years old, because I've never had any issues at all with my ipac.  I honestly don't know when it was introduced.

[drventure]

The I-PAC and Opti-PAC are full speed USB devices and wont work at all on a USB 1.0 hub.

I did not know that.

Thanks for the clarification!

[mcseforsale]

So...what happens when you try to use a 1.1 hub?  This sux because the hub REALLY solved a number of problems for me.   

Will it work properly with a 2.0 hub? 

Also, my OptiPac and iPac are fairly old.  My OptiPac is the one with the serial->USB cable.  My iPac is the P/S2 - > USB cable.

Thanks,
AJ

[Mysterioii]

I'm all for reusing free stuff when you can, but here's a powered USB 2.0 hub for under six bucks...  Don't sweat it too much if your old free one won't cut it.

http://www.amazon.com/USB-Highspeed-Port-Adapter-Silver/dp/B002FFZGCU/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1334326443&sr=8-2

[mcseforsale]

Yeah, but I'm a cheap bastard...by necessity.   

I'll poke around and see what's lying about.

AJ

[lanman31337]

It'll work properly with a 2.0 hub, tested my IPAC4 with one and works fine.

[AndyWarne]

The I-PAC and Opti-PAC are full speed USB devices and wont work at all on a USB 1.0 hub.

Hmm then maybe my PC does have USB 2 even though it's like 8 years old, because I've never had any issues at all with my ipac.  I honestly don't know when it was introduced.

Its probably USB 1.1 which would work. The OP was asking about USB 1.0 which will not work.

Andy

[mcseforsale]

Thanks Andy!  It actually is 1.1. I found out via google around post 15. I just didn't change the OP  . I'll give it a shot and let y'all know.

Thanks!
AJ

The I-PAC and Opti-PAC are full speed USB devices and wont work at all on a USB 1.0 hub.

Hmm then maybe my PC does have USB 2 even though it's like 8 years old, because I've never had any issues at all with my ipac.  I honestly don't know when it was introduced.

Its probably USB 1.1 which would work. The OP was asking about USB 1.0 which will not work.

Andy

[Heretik]

How is your GX260 still alive?  Those are notorious for blown caps around the fan area.

I have a few, one running my MAME cabinet. It helps to be somewhat handy with a soldering iron and a drawer full of spare caps