Danish Pastry guinea pigs needed

[yotsuya]

I'll do my writeup tonight when I get home.

[Dervacumen]

I'll do my writeup tonight when I get home.

As I said, no rush just wanted to make sure the post office employees aren't taking a dip.  They seem awfully interested here.... Hey, it's a small town.

[Mikezilla]

I want another one. I have money. 

[Dervacumen]

I want another one. I have money. 

That's music to my ears, friend. For those who have participated and those who are casual watchers, I'll soon put together a pricing poll.  I still need to work on a few details though.  I'll bet pricing will be all over the place.

I really want pictures of the most recent shipment if any are available, so I can see how these survived.  Heh.  I have to admit it's getting better.  Getting better all the time.

[yotsuya]

I'll post photos with feedback tonight.

[knave]

Fate intervened and I wasn't able to take the Pastry to my moms last night. bit I invited my mom and brother over to finish it Saturday morning. I'll post their feedback later.

For now I have the Photos of the packaging.

My overall impression of the packaging was that it was very secure. There was virtually no movement in the box as I was carrying it inside.
I'm not a big fan of the foam peanuts though, they are annoying to remove and just messy overall. I understand that they do the job but I would encourage you to explore other options if possible. I ended up holding the box over an empty paper sack and lightly blowing the peanuts out.

The cardboard brace looked as if it had gotten compressed in transit but this did not seem to damage the center of the pastry at all.
The edges of the pastry did have some squaring from the box but I still think it looked fantastic. The label stickers are a nice touch.
Whatever you did to secure the almonds was perfect. Only a couple seemed dislodged when I removed the danish.

In conclusion I would have been pleased with the presentation of this pastry had I purchased it. I would have preferred perhaps those plastic air filled packaging as opposed to the peanuts but in the end it wasn't a big deal.

See the pictures below.

Knave

edit* As for adjusting the heating instructions. I would not mind adjusting the temp of the oven as you describe, but I am a firm believer that for-the-masses, simple is better. Plus, not everyone will like their dainish like I do. I was going to stick with 14 minutes at 350 for Saturday morning but now perhaps I will try the new instructions Just-for-fun.

[Hoopz]

Sorry, real life got in the way of me being able to upload pics and post.

We were out of town from Friday mid-morning until late Saturday afternoon so I don't know when the package was delivered.  It was waiting at my door when I got home though.

I thought the packing was great and the danish was very secure when I opened up the second box.  I agree about the packing peanuts that I'd rather not have to mess with them but it's a minor issue.

I thought the smaller brown box that held the danish itself may have been secure enough for the danish without using the USPS priority shipping box.  My danish came out of it in excellent condition.  I don't know if others received their's in that type of setup and had them look less than appealing.  My suggestion would be to ship two danishes to the same person (or even to yourself) and see how they compare with different packing.  It's not exactly apples to apples but it's closer than comparing one container to me and a different one to someone else.  I'd actually be willing to pay for the product to review that aspect for you.  That's how good the danish was.

I too tried it cold and thought it was good.  Waiting for the oven to heat up and then warm the danish was a painful process.  But well worth it.  I had the cherry with almonds and thought it was delicious.  I was not overly enthusiastic about the almonds when I requested them but went with it anyway.  The cherries were delicious.  I don't know if these were the same cherries that others said were tart, but I found them delicious.  They weren't necessarily sweet but not tart either.  Very good texture and great flavor.  The almonds really added a nice layer that went well with everything.  

My initial thought was that the pasty was a little more dense than I thought it would be.  That's not a criticism though.  I thought it was very filling and a small piece filled me more than I thought it would.  The family enjoyed it but I didn't get any feedback that I could post.  One daughter didn't care for the cherries but doesn't enjoy them in general.  I specifically didn't tell her that they were in there but her only comment was that she didn't like cherry.  She liked the pastry itself though.

I'm not a big fan of the other fillings that were initially available but thought the cherry was outstanding.  I'd be curious to try one without a filling though.  I'm ready to order and would definitely get cherry again but my first choice would be cinnamon, then cinnamon again, with cinnamon coming in 3rd too.  Raspberry would then round out the rest of my top 10 choices.  I can only imagine how the warm cinnamon would taste.  

I don't have any criticism and thought it was great.  The only question I had was if any lard was used as the shortening or fat in the pastry?  I tried to see if I could tell but ultimately decided I didn't think so.  Not that it matters, I was just curious.

Somebody better take my order and money for the cinnamon ones asap.  Or else.  

I do much appreciate the opportunity to test these and thought it was great.  10/10.  Thank you.  

[Le Chuck]

What I need to know is how to get it from an 8 or 9 to a 10.  I don't like to settle for less than perfection.
Any ideas?

This got me thinking about how I rate things that I eat.  If I grab a bottle of two buck chuck and it knocks my socks off then I call that a 10, because I'm getting a lot more than a I bargained for.  If I am drinking a retardedly expensive single malt that is outstanding but a bit too smokey or to peat heavy for my taste that will be an 8 or 9 because I didn't get the bang for my buck to justify the difference I could have spent on a cheaper brand.

This is how I personally evaluate luxury items, like alcohols, hotel rooms, and very likely gourmet pastry.  I don't think a price point has been provided yet but I am interested because I know that price does affect my expectations.  In other words, perfection comes more easily for say $20 than for $80.  If you want to share your price (or target range) I think that you could get some valuable comments on whether or not people would buy your pastry at that price, and what it rates at that price.  The poll is a good idea but I don't feel like I could make a realistic contribution without knowing cost to produce and time involved etc.  Rather than get that far in the weeds though it's be easier for you to just put down a fair range.      

[Vigo]

Just looking at the pictures, I think you should change the font you use to state the flavor on the packaging. Comic Sans does not mix with elegant pastry in my mind. I know you are still in beta stage, but I think if it looks more like a font you would find on a champagne bottle, it might bump up the presentation.

[shmokes]

Comic Sans does not mix with elegant pastry anything.

Truth

[Malenko]

these look so good, how do I get in on it?

I wouldnt feel comfortable at LEAST paying for shipping

[knave]

I served up the rest of the danish over the weekend. This time I heated it at 350 for 10 minutes and then upped the temp to 425 for about 3.
It definitely gave the pastry a nice flaky crust but having had it before I think I preferred the more gooey inside. this time around was much less moist, not dry though. This probably was  because the pastry had been in my fridge for a while at this point.

Just about everyone liked it, the consensus was that the flavors were really well balanced and that it wasn't too sweet.

Mom and her friend, really liked the almond flavor. My mom compaired it to the high end bakery we have in our area. Both would buy.

Mom's friends son. Also really liked it he liked the almonds on top, and that it was not too sweet.  he would buy.

My bro liked it just fine he said but He's not a pastry eater so he seemed underwhelmed. Would not buy.

My older daughter said it was yummy.

My younger daughter who is 8 said she doesn't like apricot.

I brought a piece to my Girlfriends Dad and he loved it. Said it reminded him of the old time bakery's he grew up with in San Francisco. He would buy.

My consensus, I enjoyed the more moist pieces to the more crisp pieces that I had but I'm ready for another one to test out that theory!

[Dervacumen]

My overall impression of the packaging was that it was very secure...I'm not a big fan of the foam peanuts though.

The edges of the pastry did have some squaring from the box but I still think it looked fantastic. The label stickers are a nice touch.

Back from vacation with some follow up comments.  The above quote is edited for brevity.

This packaging will be similar to the final package, but I'll ditch the foam peanuts in favor of something else.  I originally wanted to use shredded Easter-like paper grass of varying colors based on the season, but now I'm not sure if that will be more of a pain than an nice touch.  I'll have to play around with that.  Regular bubble wrap squares would work well so I may go that route.  The stickers were just made at home so I'll get nicer ones made.  For the sticker that seals the bag opening, I'm leaning toward using sealing wax with the Hollister Danish coat of arms stamped in to it.

To further secure the pastry and prevent squaring of the edges, I'll have plastic trays made at some point.  The trays will be round and about an inch high or so on the edges.  The center peg will be 3" high and removable, providing a solid brace for the center of the pastry.  The center piece might be something like those little plastic things you sometimes see in pizza boxes to prevent the lid from touching the top of the pizza, with the company logo in the center.

[Dervacumen]

I thought the smaller brown box that held the danish itself may have been secure enough for the danish without using the USPS priority shipping box.  My danish came out of it in excellent condition.  I don't know if others received their's in that type of setup and had them look less than appealing.  My suggestion would be to ship two danishes to the same person (or even to yourself) and see how they compare with different packing.  It's not exactly apples to apples but it's closer than comparing one container to me and a different one to someone else.

Waiting for the oven to heat up and then warm the danish was a painful process.  But well worth it.  The cherries were delicious.  I don't know if these were the same cherries that others said were tart, but I found them delicious.

My initial thought was that the pasty was a little more dense than I thought it would be.

I can only imagine how the warm cinnamon would taste. 

The only question I had was if any lard was used as the shortening or fat in the pastry?

Interesting thing about the double box you got.  I didn't plan on that, but when I got to the post office i found it was less expensive to shove my custom box in to a priority mail box.  For addresses that are closer to CA it was less expensive to ship in my custom boxes.  I think shipping both ways to the same address is a good idea.

Waiting for the pastry to heat up probably adds to the enjoyment of the final product because of the smell.  I know we always go nuts when we bake, even after all these years.  This dough is much denser than a puff pastry, and had a different bite than a croissant.  The filling also has an impact so the pastry with only almond paste will be lighter.

Cinnamon.  Would you still want almond paste, or just a cinnamon and sugar filling?  The production process for these always results in shreads and pieces of left over dough.  Ususally when I'm done for the day I take all of these shreads which contain bits and pieces and globs of various fillings from the day and mix them with sugar and cinnamon, cut them in to bite sized pieces, and bake them in a loaf, like pull apart sticky buns.  They are some of the best things I make, really.  They're full of chewy carmelized goodness with little surprises of fruit every few bites.  I'll sell this by weight.

[Dervacumen]

What I need to know is how to get it from an 8 or 9 to a 10.  I don't like to settle for less than perfection.
Any ideas?

This got me thinking about how I rate things that I eat.  If I grab a bottle of two buck chuck and it knocks my socks off then I call that a 10, because I'm getting a lot more than a I bargained for.  If I am drinking a retardedly expensive single malt that is outstanding but a bit too smokey or to peat heavy for my taste that will be an 8 or 9 because I didn't get the bang for my buck to justify the difference I could have spent on a cheaper brand.

This is how I personally evaluate luxury items, like alcohols, hotel rooms, and very likely gourmet pastry.  I don't think a price point has been provided yet but I am interested because I know that price does affect my expectations.  In other words, perfection comes more easily for say $20 than for $80.  If you want to share your price (or target range) I think that you could get some valuable comments on whether or not people would buy your pastry at that price, and what it rates at that price.  The poll is a good idea but I don't feel like I could make a realistic contribution without knowing cost to produce and time involved etc.  Rather than get that far in the weeds though it's be easier for you to just put down a fair range.       

I'll stop beating around the bush.
The target for these is between $20-$30.  I figure they provide about 8 portions at about $2.50 - $3.50 each.  My individual pastries will be various sizes and shape and range from $2 to $4.
As for knowing the cost to produce and time involved, I guess you could look at it that way, but it makes sense to do so only if you're the producer, not the consumer IMO.  The thing about this pastry is there is a lot of waiting time involved.  I mean, a LOT.  I can make two or ten, and in each case I'll start at the same time and finish at the same time.

Comic Sans does not mix with elegant pastry anything.

Truth

Huh.  I like that font.  I wanted a font that was easy to read for the large event I recently catered.  Point taken though, and I'll change it to something else.  Thanks!

[shmokes]

Huh.  I like that font.  I wanted a font that was easy to read for the large event I recently catered.  Point taken though, and I'll change it to something else.  Thanks!

A Google search of "comic sans" will give you an idea of the widespread disdain for comic sans, especially it's frequent incongruous use (a silly font used for serious subject matter). The Wikipedia entry for comic sans has a section titled "Opposition".

I'm married to a graphic designer, so I am probably exposed to a higher level of comic sans hate than you.

[Mikezilla]

I want another one. I have money. 

That's music to my ears, friend. For those who have participated and those who are casual watchers, I'll soon put together a pricing poll.  I still need to work on a few details though.  I'll bet pricing will be all over the place.

I really want pictures of the most recent shipment if any are available, so I can see how these survived.  Heh.  I have to admit it's getting better.  Getting better all the time.

My pleasure man. It was delicious. A girl at work brought some "pastry" in yesterday and it look like she dumped an Entemanns onto a plate. I was like "blegh, this sucks ass compared to Dervacumens pastry". I didnt even eat any. Thanks for making me a pastry snob. 

[Mysterioii]

If you do another round of taste-testing please count me in, but it looks like I'm a little late to the party...   

[Dervacumen]

Huh.  I like that font.  I wanted a font that was easy to read for the large event I recently catered.  Point taken though, and I'll change it to something else.  Thanks!

A Google search of "comic sans" will give you an idea of the widespread disdain for comic sans, especially it's frequent incongruous use (a silly font used for serious subject matter). The Wikipedia entry for comic sans has a section titled "Opposition".

I'm married to a graphic designer, so I am probably exposed to a higher level of comic sans hate than you.

Jumpin' Jehosaphat!  BTW one of the articles I just read said it may be making a comeback as a retro-chic thing.  I'm either out of touch or ahead of my time.  I guess I better google some font's before I put them to use. 

I want another one. I have money. 

That's music to my ears, friend. For those who have participated and those who are casual watchers, I'll soon put together a pricing poll.  I still need to work on a few details though.  I'll bet pricing will be all over the place.

I really want pictures of the most recent shipment if any are available, so I can see how these survived.  Heh.  I have to admit it's getting better.  Getting better all the time.

My pleasure man. It was delicious. A girl at work brought some "pastry" in yesterday and it look like she dumped an Entemanns onto a plate. I was like "blegh, this sucks ass compared to Dervacumens pastry". I didnt even eat any. Thanks for making me a pastry snob. 

LOL.  I'm going to have to quote this.  Heh.

[Rando]

For the record, I have no problem with Comic Sans font.  It's simple, easy to read, and depending on the context conveys a fun type of styling without getting too silly.  At no point while looking at your packaging did I think "My enjoyment is marred by his choice of font!"

Whatever you choose keep it readable and don't get too fancy/frilly.  I think that will turn more people off than a simpler font will.  The guys in my family were already on the fence about how "fancy" it was.  A difficult to read gotchic type font would increase this feeling I think.

$20ish sounds good depending on shipping, $30ish + shipping may start to sound too high.  Definitely blows away comparable items that I have seen and tried, definitely have us provide tesimonials and such when you put your site together.  Word of mouth will work well for this, difficult to order something like this when you don't have or know anyone who had a previous positive experience.

My wife also had the cinnamon request, I'd like to see the "extra" cinnamon pieces offered as a yummy type option!

Keep plugging along!

[shmokes]

I read this on that Wikipedia page: When selecting Comic Sans to display instant messages in Skype, the emoticon menu icon changes from a happy smiley to a sad smiley.

Tested it and it's true. Lol.

[yotsuya]

Dervacumen-

My review (sorry it took so long, I've been sick)-

The Packaging

I received my Apple pastry in the mail. The box was study, and there was no damage. It was clearly marked as perishable, which I thought was a nice touch. I refridgerated it for a few days since we weren't going to eat it right away, even though there wasn't any instruction to do so. I wasn't sure if it was necessary, but my wife thought it was a good idea.

I opened it in front of my wife after I explained why some stranger was sending me food   (she was a bit apprehensive at first until I explained what was going on). I wanted her to give me feedback as if she had ordered it and received it. She wasn't fond of the packing peanuts, mainly because they're messy once they get all over the place. However, the pastry itself was covered nicely and well protected. There was no instance of food touching foam.

I'm glad to see you are going to get shipping plastic plates made, as she felt the dixie cup looked a bit amateurish. I told her that you were still in the planning phase, so that's just a suggestion. Overall, the outside packing was fine, the actual food packaging was fine, but the shipping materials needs improvement (which you know).

The Pastry

We all went ahead and tried it cold and agreed that it was very, very tasty. In fact, I had a second piece that way  . I had the apple pastry, and I really enjoyed it. The amount of almonds was just right, as well as the amount of filling. The frosting was subtle and not overdone.

Later that day, we heated part of it up. I went with the 10 minutes heating (thanks for the directions, btw). It smelled great when warming up, and when it came out of the oven it looked delicious. It tasted great, exactly as I expected based of previous comments. The center part was still a bit cold and "doughy", but that was probably due to the fact that it had been refridgerated for two days as well as the shorter cooking time. I like my pastries like that, though, so it was fine.

The next day, I heated up the remaining pieces and did it for a longer time. It cooked more evenly, and I didn't notice any cold parts. The middle was still doughy, but not negatively so. It was gone in two days.  

As far as opinions go, my 9 year old daughter really liked it. Her preference was actually for the colder version than warmed up. Not that she didn't like it warmer, but she told me she like the first way better. She loved the apple flavor.

My wife liked it cold and hot, and preferred it heated up. She liked the fact that it wasn't too sweet. She felt like there were quality ingredients, and you could taste it. You are definately on to something good there.

When I asked her if she would order it online, she said that the hard thing is that she would now because we had a chance to taste it, but if it were just some website she found with no prior knowledge, probably not. That's where word of mouth or low-cost trial portions might be nice.  

On the whole, it's a quality product I would be inclined to purchase in the future for events or instances where I needed a pastry to impress.

[Dervacumen]

$20ish sounds good depending on shipping, $30ish + shipping may start to sound too high.  Definitely blows away comparable items that I have seen and tried, definitely have us provide tesimonials and such when you put your site together.  Word of mouth will work well for this, difficult to order something like this when you don't have or know anyone who had a previous positive experience.

Keep plugging along!

I've identified two potential brick and mortar locations downtown and the farmer's market is about to start up so I think I'll have a spot there, handing out samples.  The farmer's market is two blocks from the store location.
I'll start working on financing next week.  The hardest part really is finding the time to put together the website, facebook, twitter, etc... you know, all the digital marketing.

Group 3, I'll be in touch very soon but first I want to tweak the packaging a bit as per feedback.
Group 1 & 2, thank you for your encouragement.

The pricing.  It's easy to sell cheap, it's harder to sell quality, and finding the balance is where I look to each of you.  Shipping will be about $10 for 2-3 day delivery and I'll only ship once a week, probably on Wed so it can arrive for the weekend or a Friday meeting.  As volume increases I'll produce and ship more frequently.

[Malenko]

I read this on that Wikipedia page: When selecting Comic Sans to display instant messages in Skype, the emoticon menu icon changes from a happy smiley to a sad smiley.

Tested it and it's true. Lol.

[Hoopz]

Cinnamon.  Would you still want almond paste, or just a cinnamon and sugar filling?  The production process for these always results in shreads and pieces of left over dough.  Ususally when I'm done for the day I take all of these shreads which contain bits and pieces and globs of various fillings from the day and mix them with sugar and cinnamon, cut them in to bite sized pieces, and bake them in a loaf, like pull apart sticky buns.  They are some of the best things I make, really.  They're full of chewy carmelized goodness with little surprises of fruit every few bites.  I'll sell this by weight.

I didn't have almond paste (cherry filling instead) but I would want just cinnamon and sugar without any other filling.  caramelized cinnamon is more than enough by itself.

My mom makes a dish called a plucket that sounds a lot like what you do with your leftovers.  Delicious.

[Dervacumen]

Cinnamon.  Would you still want almond paste, or just a cinnamon and sugar filling?  The production process for these always results in shreads and pieces of left over dough.  Ususally when I'm done for the day I take all of these shreads which contain bits and pieces and globs of various fillings from the day and mix them with sugar and cinnamon, cut them in to bite sized pieces, and bake them in a loaf, like pull apart sticky buns.  They are some of the best things I make, really.  They're full of chewy carmelized goodness with little surprises of fruit every few bites.  I'll sell this by weight.

I didn't have almond paste (cherry filling instead) but I would want just cinnamon and sugar without any other filling.  caramelized cinnamon is more than enough by itself.

My mom makes a dish called a plucket that sounds a lot like what you do with your leftovers.  Delicious.

Yours had almond paste as a base with cherry as an addition.  Everything I've sent has had almond base as  base.  I guess I can make something with no almond paste.  I'll do that and see how it works out.  I'm sure it will taste good, just have to play with the filling a bit to get the right consistency.

[Hoopz]

I didn't realize that.  Regardless, it was great. 

[lanman31337]

Some shippers are using thin brown paper instead of packing peanuts.  it's inexpensive and not as messy as the packing peanuts.

[Dervacumen]

Just looking at the pictures, I think you should change the font you use to state the flavor on the packaging. Comic Sans does not mix with elegant pastry in my mind.

I'll change the font anyway, but turns out I used Tekton Pro, not Comic Sans.  FWIW.  There doesn't seem to be the same backlash against this font.

[shmokes]

I think probably not worth too much. I can't think of a situation where using a font that appears to be Comic Sans would be any more appropriate than using Comic Sans.

[Dervacumen]

I think probably not worth too much. I can't think of a situation where using a font that appears to be Comic Sans would be any more appropriate than using Comic Sans.

Unless you dabble in architecture.  I owned a steel erection company for a short while so that's probably why I chose it.

For group 3, what about shipping for Mother's Day?  Would you trust what you've read to give this to YOUR MOM?  If you can't share this with your mom for whatever reason I apologize.

[Nephasth]

For group 3, what about shipping for Mother's Day?  Would you trust what you've read to give this to YOUR MOM?  If you can't share this with your mom for whatever reason I apologize.

Funny you should mention this. Today I just realized Mother's Day is coming up and the first thing I thought to get her was a gourmet pastry.

[Le Chuck]

I think my wife would love a giant pastry from our sons for mother's day 

[Dervacumen]

For group 3, what about shipping for Mother's Day?  Would you trust what you've read to give this to YOUR MOM?  If you can't share this with your mom for whatever reason I apologize.

Funny you should mention this. Today I just realized Mother's Day is coming up and the first thing I thought to get her was a gourmet pastry.

Either I'm blissfully ignorant or I got a compliment.

I think my wife would love a giant pastry from our sons for mother's day 

I'm convinced the market for these is as a specialty gourmet food item, and that's exactly how I want to position it.  After all, for the past 30 years my family's enjoyed this only on special occasions.  Thankfully, every day I wake up it's a special occasion.

[Cakemeister]

Mother's day sounds good to me. My kids have been wondering what to get their mother. 

[knave]

Can I buy a pass for all future testing groups...? 

  hehe...

[crashwg]

My mother is not with us anymore and the wife doesn't like almond flavored anything (she says it tastes like cherries which she hates) but whenever it comes is fine by me.

[Vigo]

If you want by chance need some extra feedback, my offer still stands to pay you for your costs to get in on this. Win-win, right?





Not to mention this would double as a perfect mother's day gift, and I hate going out and shopping for gifts.

[Dervacumen]

My mother is not with us anymore and the wife doesn't like almond flavored anything (she says it tastes like cherries which she hates) but whenever it comes is fine by me.

I'll send a PM.

[Dervacumen]

It's been a while but I'm sending out the last two pastries tomorrow, just in time for Mother's Day.  In the meantime I've picked up a few orders locally and have gravitated toward building out a kitchen that I can lease space to for other aspiring businesses.  There are numerous examples of shared kitchens around the country but this will be a first around here.  I'll send everyone that participated a PM after I get the last round of feedback.  Yeah baby!