Ram Controls Yoke - The circle is complete!

[Havok]

I received a much anticipated package today; number 1 off the assembly line, Ram Controls reproduction Star Wars Yoke! Here's some pictures, because it did happen!!!

Here's the box:


Packed well:


First view:


A true thing of beauty:


Top view:


Manual:


And an important part for us Mamers (since this one is going in a Mame cab):


Just a couple of quick impressions:

The build quality is fantastic! It's a real solid piece with silky smooth motion. The yoke returns to center, and the finish is superior to the original. You can really notice the quality above the OEM piece easily. I especially like the handles and trigger buttons; a vast improvement! The overlay is dead on, at least from my memory and is absolutely gorgeous. However, that's to be expected from ThisOldGames.

I really have to compliment Dave on the manual; it is chock full of maintenance, adjustment, exploded views and wiring information - right down to the pinouts of the connector. I can't wait to get this on a control panel for my cabinet!


   

[polaris]

Now aint that a beauty!
 

[XtraSmiley]

Wow looks AWESOME!!!!!

Now if you other pre-order folks would chime in when you get yours...

[HaRuMaN]

Wanna sell it?   

[pmowry]

Wanna sell it?  

 

I'm all for ordering one, if I ever have the cash....

[JMB]

Looks pretty amazing! Glad you finally got it.

Are you going to have a cab dedicated for the controller or a swappable panel type setup? If it is going in a dedicated cab what games (other than the obvious) do you anticipate being a good match for the controller?

[saint]

That looks amazing!

[FrizzleFried]

Did it include an apology for lying to your face.... multiple times?  

I'll reserve my adoration until others have received THEIR yokes as well... hell... who am I kidding... I'll always see this duck for what he is... >quack!<

EDIT: Oh... glad you (finally) got yours brother Havok... Who's #2 again?

[DashRendar]

 



 

[MameMaster!]

I'm with Frizzle....once everyone has theirs in hand...Dave then gets my $$.

It is an impressive accomplishment for Dave....absolutely outstanding. 

[TheShanMan]

Congrats on finally getting your baby, Havok. Sure looks sweet!

[Havok]

Looks pretty amazing! Glad you finally got it.

Are you going to have a cab dedicated for the controller or a swappable panel type setup? If it is going in a dedicated cab what games (other than the obvious) do you anticipate being a good match for the controller?

I have swappable panels for my cabinet; this get's it's own dedicated panel, of course! Each of my panels has it's own menu in my AtomicFE setup, so you know which games work with it. Here's my preliminary list:

Star Wars
Empire Strikes Back
Return of the Jedi
Spy Hunter
Pole Position
Pole Position II
Hydra
Firefox
Stun Runner
TomCat
Vapor TRX

That should keep me and the kids busy...

[XtraSmiley]

What about road blasters?

[Havok]

Oh yeah - forgot about that one. Definitely!

[wp34]

What about road blasters?

I'm actually more interested in this for Road Blasters than SW.  Would love to hear some feedback once you begin testing. 

Glad to see your patience won out.  Congratulations it looks very nice.

[HaRuMaN]

Quit posting and install it already!   

[S0L]

Nice to see one out in the wild

Back to sitting next to the letter box I guess

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S0L
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[XtraSmiley]

I own a dedicated RB and I actually like it better than SW!  Of course, vector graphics always have a special place in my heart...

[Paul Olson]

What about road blasters?

Road Blasters yoke is optical. I wonder how well this yoke will work for that game.

I am looking at my still not mounted gamecab yoke and starting to wish I had I had waited for this one to be done.

[Breaker]

Congratulations Havok!

..and congratulation to Dave as well - a thing of beauty!

I don't know my number in the queue, but based upon Havok's review,
I'm looking forward to the rest of the pre-orders (and new orders) shipping
without delay!

Breaker.

[RobotronNut]

Road Blasters yoke is optical. I wonder how well this yoke will work for that game.

i looked into this several yrs ago. at that time, RB on a SW yoke worked, but not perfectly. does anyone know if mame handles it better nowadays?

if you go to www.marksarcade.com and click on the "return of the jedi" link, you'll see one way of handling this - take the optical wheel and board from an original RB yoke and add it to your SW yoke. this can be done without disturbing anything inside the SW yoke, so you still have the analog output of the  SW yoke, and you have additional wires carrying the digital signal from the RB optical board. i actually bought a trashed RB yoke that had an intact optical system, in anticipation of doing this some day.

[Necro]

Ok, we've now accounted for the one in the picture that was posted before. 

Once a second person has received one, we know for certain that the prototype wasn't shipped to quiet the complaints .

[Havok]

If you look closely, you'll see that mine is different than the proto picture posted on Dave's blog.

Whomever guesses what the difference is gets an Internet cookie!

[Donkey_Kong]

The big scratch on the right side control.

[Bender]

I've tried to keep out of this but....

Things we know:

Dave has not made good decisions about pre-orders and time estimates
the most disturbing to me is the latest lack of communication

But we also know
Dave is an asset to the comunity and builds fantastic products
The guy is doing this as a hobby (yes he wants to break even or make a little profit)
He is not a thief (he has been in business for 5 years and I have not herd of one person not eventually getting the product or a refund)
Everyone will eventually get there yoke or there money

having done a couple little thing like this I know I am much more concerned with making the product perfect, and am not so good at the "Business" end of things, So I think I have a little more patience with Dave than most

Having said all that I'm not ordering mine till all the pre-orders are filled

[Havok]

The big scratch on the right side control.

That's part of it, but you need to be more specific...

[Donkey_Kong]

What is the big scratch on the right side control?    

[Xiaou2]

The handles appear to have a flat top 'edge' on your set.

[Havok]

The handles appear to have a flat top 'edge' on your set.

Getting warmer...

[smalltownguy]

It looks like your yoke has the machined handles, versus the prototype, which has cast handles.

(I cheated and read Dave's blog, but I read it many months ago, so I still get credit, right)

[Havok]

It looks like your yoke has the machined handles, versus the prototype, which has cast handles.

(I cheated and read Dave's blog, but I read it many months ago, so I still get credit, right)

Cheater!  However, that's only half of it. But you still get the cookie:



The other half is that my handles are not hard anodized, as the original yokes were going to be. They are powder coated. And I am glad Dave made the change; they definitely look much better!

[polaris]

i'm guessing you're going to live with the scratch or were you thinking of returning it 

[ark_ader]

Glad we have a happy ending to this saga.

Hope the rest of the extreme doubters out there enjoy some humble pie in the next few days.

Since I like apple crumble - here's the first slice for Ratzz



Nice Yoke you have there Havok!

[Donkey_Kong]

The scratch was on the prototype.

[RayB]

The scratch was on the prototype.

Oh well, Havok can claim to have the prototype! Even cooler.

I think that reveals that assembling these things is a "beeyotch" and Dave hasn't had time to do so.

**I misunderstood. Thought what was being said was that Havok's has the same scratch.**

[UberCade]

Man, just when I thought I was nearing the end of my expenses for my cabinet, I see this. Now Return of the Jedi is one of my most favorite arcade games of all time, and Road Blasters and Stun Runner are fun too, so dang it I'm going to have to get one of these now!  I just received my Tron control panel in the mail 2 days ago which obviously will be used solely for Tron. I have a sort of swappable control panel set up as well, but I designed it so only pieces of my control panel are swappable, so I won't have to remove the whole top to switch controls. This is turning out to be a neverending project. Some games you just have to have the original controls though, and this is no exception. Let us all know how well it works.

[Minwah]

Pole Position
Pole Position II

Eh?!

[Minwah]

i looked into this several yrs ago. at that time, RB on a SW yoke worked, but not perfectly. does anyone know if mame handles it better nowadays?

Last time I looked was a few versions ago, but it didn't work

I played with the code and got it to work to a degree, but I think the game resets the position of the car after crashes etc, so it gets out of sync with the controller. I don't even see how the original optical, limited travel controller would stay in sync 

[Havok]

Pole Position
Pole Position II

Eh?!

Worth a try. Push forward to accelerate, steer left and right. Ultimately, I don't care if it works because I have a real driving cabinet anyways; Race Drivin Cockpit!

[Donkey_Kong]

The scratch was on the prototype.

Oh well, Havok can claim to have the prototype! Even cooler.

I think that reveals that assembling these things is a "beeyotch" and Dave hasn't had time to do so.

Ok, it's no wonder that I did not win the cyber cookie.  

If you look close at Dave's proto you see a scratch on it, but you don't see it in Havok's pictures. Dave could have touched it up with some paint, or maybe he actually sent Havok a production unit.

[ChadTower]

Pole Position is an optical wheel... sure you could do some translation in the software but it will never really feel like Pole Position does.

[Donkey_Kong]

 

[smalltownguy]

Unless the handles were changed out, Havok's yoke is NOT the prototype. The prototype was photo'd with the cast aluminum handles, Havok's yoke has a completely different set of handles on it. As I (correctly) guessed, they are the machined aluminum handles. Not to mention the powder coating, which is also absent from the prototype, according to Havok.

Looks like a production unit to me. Havok, was Dave kind enough to stamp it with a serial number for you?

[HaRuMaN]

Havok, was Dave kind enough to stamp it with a serial number for you?

Will it read 1 of 1?

[Havok]

Havok, was Dave kind enough to stamp it with a serial number for you?

I did ask for that way back when, but didn't check. I'll have to pop the cover and take a look. Good thing I have a Bob Robert's security bit set!

Will it read 1 of 1?

[S0L]

Out of interest, did you get the Mame USB converter in with it Havok?

I think Dave said he's include it with the pre-order ones? I'm quite keen on that (as a pre-orderer!) - as I don't want to start hunting down Dual Strikes or hacking 360 controllers!

Mostly as I can rig it up quick in some form of box and then take it for a test spin Well when it shows up!

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S0L
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[bkenobi]

Pole Position is an optical 360° steering wheel game.  The SW yoke is an optical control, but it has a physical limiter that stops rotation at some angle.  Thus, PP would not play correctly with a restricted wheel.

[ChadTower]

Pole Position is an optical 360° steering wheel game.  The SW yoke is an optical control, but it has a physical limiter that stops rotation at some angle.  Thus, PP would not play correctly with a restricted wheel.

The SW yoke uses pots.

[Havok]

Out of interest, did you get the Mame USB converter in with it Havok?

I think Dave said he's include it with the pre-order ones? I'm quite keen on that (as a pre-orderer!) - as I don't want to start hunting down Dual Strikes or hacking 360 controllers!

Mostly as I can rig it up quick in some form of box and then take it for a test spin Well when it shows up!

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S0L
---

The USB controller isn't ready, however if you haven't purchased anything yet, I would get the AKI controller for it, which is available now. I pre-ordered a controller from Dave, but in the meantime I have a dual Strike that I've been sitting on for a few years that I intend to hack until I get Dave's controller. Here's a link to the AKI:

http://bspeclabs.com/Electronics/8-AKI30JoystickInterface

As far as Pole Position, if it works somewhat, great, if not, not an issue. The yoke is essentially a 270 degree wheel, so I'll just have to see how that works with Mame on a 360 degree game. I know that when I play PP I don't spin the wheel like a madman, I just steer a little left or right, so we'll see what happens. Race Drivin is my favorite driving game, so PP would just be a nice extra. I purchased the yoke primarily for three Star Wars games (well 2 really - ROTJ isn't one of my favorites.) However, I'm glad to see Firefox in Mame now, so that will also definitely be setup.

[S0L]

The USB controller isn't ready, however if you haven't purchased anything yet, I would get the AKI controller for it, which is available now. I pre-ordered a controller from Dave, but in the meantime I have a dual Strike that I've been sitting on for a few years that I intend to hack until I get Dave's controller. Here's a link to the AKI:

http://bspeclabs.com/Electronics/8-AKI30JoystickInterface

Ta - I am one of the original pre-orderers (so called Dirty Dozen!) so I was hoping it'd come along with it. I might grab an AKI on the off-chance, though there was also the A-PAC I was considering before Dave suggested there would be a straight plug-in USB solution.

I'll wait see - not in any rush

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S0L
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[HaRuMaN]

So, you have not yet received your yoke?  The plot thickens...

[ChadTower]

Didn't he say the USB controller is ready and would ship with the yokes for those with preorders?

[Hoopz]

Didn't he say the USB controller is ready and would ship with the yokes for those with preorders?

Nope.  I'm pretty sure the pre-orders were supposed to be done first.  When they were shipped, he would work on the USB interface.

[ChadTower]

Maybe I'm thinking of the overlays, then.   

[Havok]

I might grab an AKI on the off-chance, though there was also the A-PAC I was considering before Dave suggested there would be a straight plug-in USB solution.

I'll wait see - not in any rush

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S0L
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Ultimarc's U-hid Nano would also work, but if you buy the cable it costs more than the Aki, and the Aki is way more versatile...

http://u-hid.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=15&Itemid=19

[Level42]

HAH !

Congrats to Havok for being SO patient and congrats to David for a _perfect_ product.


For those who do not know, I own a SW cockpit, and I can tell you that the original handles SUCK in quality. The halves do not match, making edges "stick out" over the others etc. I discussed this with David before. Although it's no macro pic, I can tell that those handles look SMOOOOOOTHHHHHH

100 times better then the original. I seriously consider getting some of those handles .......

Could you make some close-up shots of the handles Havok ?

[Level42]

Original handles:






Would be great to see some same-angled shots of David's work....

[Havok]

That really does highlight the differences. I'll grab some similar angle pictures and post them later tonight...

[Havok]

Sorry for the poor quality, but I only have a point and shoot digital. I have a really nice Canon SLR, but it's 35mm...

Here's two that came out at least halfway decent. Even though the quality is not the greatest, you can still see how superior the tolerances are on Dave's yoke:

[XtraSmiley]

Wow, much improved!

Try using the macro setting on your digital.  It's the one that looks like a flower.  Helps with up close shots.

[Havok]

Yeah, I tried that. Perhaps if I had better lighting and used a tripod - I took about 35 pictures and those were the best...

[Xiaou2]

Firstly, not all cameras are good at capturing low level spectrum's... That said,

A key to capturing black objects well, is even controlled lighting.

 You have to illuminate all sides of the object well enough, and the lighting
must be flat/even... so it will not create sharp contrast.  A cameras un-diffused
flash for example, will create a bright high contrast area... and reduce the spectrum
of visible blacks captured.

 Many such objects are photoed in a "light-tent".  A small wire frame that has white
translucent bed-sheet type material mounted to it.  They place the object in the tent,
and light all sides of the tent from far enough back to keep a spotlight effect from
occurring.   The camera then may either not use a flash, or will have some sort of
light diffuser attached to it, which will spread the light out more, and keep it from
making bright hot-spots.

 If the object is too light, one can always use photoshop to create contrast,
reducing the spectrums a bit.  However, one can not take a bad photo which is
missing a wide range of spectrum, and make it look good with photoshop.
Turning up the brightness with missing spectrum will reveal the missing colors
that much worse.

[davespicer]

Hmmmm... not so sure about those "improved" handles.  They're much less rounded than the real ones, giving a rather boxy look.  Don't get me wrong, it's a nice yoke, it's just that I would never mistake it for a pristine version of the original.  Given Dave's commendable obsession for perfection, not to mention the time taken, I'm surprised to see results which aren't quite authentic.

Level42... wow that alignment is bad.  My handles align perfectly, which makes me wonder whether Atari messed up when making additional mould sets.

Dave (another one)

[TheShanMan]

Looks to me that the original appears rounded because of the poor fit, so I don't see it as really being different from those pictures, other than correcting the poor fit, and of course the finish.

But then again, I don't have an original yoke to serve as a reference like you do.

[ratzz]

Glad we have a happy ending to this saga.

Hope the rest of the extreme doubters out there enjoy some humble pie in the next few days.

Since I like apple crumble - here's the first slice for Ratzz



Nice Yoke you have there Havok!

 

Yea, fantastic service that - proper customer services - you got your order in?


saint's note - don't do that! Attachment deleted.

[davespicer]

Looks to me that the original appears rounded because of the poor fit, so I don't see it as really being different from those pictures, other than correcting the poor fit, and of course the finish.

But then again, I don't have an original yoke to serve as a reference like you do.

The design looks different to me - the RAM Controls ones are way too chunky looking.

Check out the pics below.  These have been spray painted, rather than recoated, so look pitted as hell.  You can get an idea of the shape though.





The RAM Controls prototype pics seem to have a mix of the boxy and rounded parts for some reason.  Odd.

Dave

[XtraSmiley]

I think it might be the lighting on Havok's that make them look more square.  If you look at the edges, the roundness is there, but hidden in the shadows.

Who knows though, if Havok says it's better, I'm inclined to believe him.

I'm not buying mine for at least a year, so I have time to sit back and wait for a full review (and more shipped units).

[davespicer]

I think it might be the lighting on Havok's that make them look more square.  If you look at the edges, the roundness is there, but hidden in the shadows.

Who knows though, if Havok says it's better, I'm inclined to believe him.

I'm not buying mine for at least a year, so I have time to sit back and wait for a full review (and more shipped units).

Damn, I'm getting all OCD on this now.  Lol.  

Looks like the change happened when switching from cast to machined handles:

http://www.ram-controls.com/blog-sw.html

10/19/08 - PERFECT... 04/14/09 - wtf?  Notice the flat areas around the screw holes.

Maybe you're right and the pics make the difference look more stark than it is in reality.  Where's the emoticon for shrugged shoulders?

Dave

[Hoopz]

Where's the emoticon for shrugged shoulders?

Right next to the bomb and the 'fro.  Your OCD must not have kicked in fully.   

[Level42]

Hmmmm... not so sure about those "improved" handles.  They're much less rounded than the real ones, giving a rather boxy look.  Don't get me wrong, it's a nice yoke, it's just that I would never mistake it for a pristine version of the original.  Given Dave's commendable obsession for perfection, not to mention the time taken, I'm surprised to see results which aren't quite authentic.

Level42... wow that alignment is bad.  My handles align perfectly, which makes me wonder whether Atari messed up when making additional mould sets.

Dave (another one)

Well my cab is Irish, but I think it's very likely that there was only one point of production for the yokes.
I've no idea why they are so bad, but I was shocked when I first discovered it. The hole mismatch doesn't hurt the working of the buttons however, but the top is just unbelievably badly matched.

Let's be honest, the original one's don't look very good at all. You can see all kind of irregularities in the surface and the crumbly finish is also far from nice IMHO.

About the improvement: You can actually feel the bad fit and the sharp edges when playing. Maybe the top is a little bit flatter, but I'm sure it's a lot more comfortable to play...I'd prefer the 1000% better quality of David's handles over the originals any time...

[davespicer]

Well my cab is Irish

Please accept my condolences.  

[MameMaster!]

Sooo.....aside from the merits of this debate. ANYONE get a yoke besides Havok yet?

 

[mytymaus007]

Seems like a fake

[FrizzleFried]

Sooo.....aside from the merits of this debate. ANYONE get a yoke besides Havok yet?

 

I was wondering the same thing.  Who's #2?  When will #2 get their yoke?  "Done & Shipping" doesn't mean only #1 on the list gets his 5 weeks later....


>quack<

[mytymaus007]

I think iM 182

[Gatinho]

I feel like Charlie Brown waiting for a Valentine from the red-headed little girl... the mail box is still empty.

[1UP]

I know I said this before, and quite a while back if I recall, when the last "almost ready" announcement happened...weren't the original pre-orders like, 5 years ago or something?  Glad I held off on ordering, you guys have godlike patience!  

Does look tempting though....   Why oh why did I sell my yoke?!  Oh yeah, probably because I thought I could always get a newer one from Gamecab or Ram.   

[Franco B]

[OT] What happened to ratzz? Did he delete his account or get banned or something?  [/OT]

[Level42]

Well my cab is Irish

Please accept my condolences.  

Well, as long as it's not an Irish priest I'm fine with it.

[saint]

[OT] What happened to ratzz? Did he delete his account or get banned or something?  [/OT]

He asked for his account to be deleted. He's welcome to come back if he wants.

[Havok]

That's a bit severe. I think some people lose sight of the fact that these are games we're talking about. No need to get all worked up about them. Unless you're really enjoying yourself...

 

[Hoopz]

[OT] What happened to ratzz? Did he delete his account or get banned or something?  [/OT]

He asked for his account to be deleted. He's welcome to come back if he wants.

Genesim did too but his account is still around!  Come on Saint, do it.  DO IT! Please....

 

I'll consider ordering from Ram once all the pre-orders have been shipped AND people who start ordering now also start to receive theirs.  This may be the holy grail for some people but I won't support a vendor who can't be a man.  Telling lies and avoiding talking to people isn't good business.

[davespicer]

Well my cab is Irish

Please accept my condolences.  

Well, as long as it's not an Irish priest I'm fine with it.

Heh... no offence meant.  I'd take a pristine Irish cab over a tatty US one any day of the week.  Your looks pretty damn tidy from the pics posted last year.   

Dave

[RayB]

That's a bit severe. I think some people lose sight of the fact that these are games we're talking about. No need to get all worked up about them. Unless you're really enjoying yourself...

 

Not to mention that if he doesn't want to come around here anymore, all he has to do is not come to the site! What's the purpose in deleting the account? LOL

[Havok]

Just completed my Dual Strike hack last night - and finally played my first game of Star Wars with the yoke! Now I can attest to the full quality of Dave's yoke as I have finally spent some quality time using it. Next up; a proper control panel. My mockup is ok, but I need to get this mounted properly.

On a side note; anyone else do a Dual Strike hack? I noticed that the ubiquitous 1UP diagram of the pcb has the X-Axis black and red connections wrong: at least on my pcb they were reversed.

So I wonder if this is the first truly plug and play DS hack, since it has the mate and lock cap on it, instead of cutting the yoke wires...

[Gatinho]

Dave did eventually reply to one of my emails saying he was waiting for a report back from Havok on how his yoke is before he mails out mine.



Havok, if you give an official nod back to Dave, then I can't imagine any other new hold-ups.

I've been a steadfast and loyal holdout on this, and Dave has promised me great rewards for my patience!

[Havok]

Already been done - I've been in contact with Dave quite a bit since I received my yoke. I'm sure people will be chiming in soon about how they like their new yokes...

[XtraSmiley]

Already been done - I've been in contact with Dave quite a bit since I received my yoke. I'm sure people will be chiming in soon about how they like their new yokes...

Why, do you know something?  Please share if you have info!

[Havok]

Just that I've gone through the QC checks with Dave, made a couple of suggestions and we're all set. So, I'm sure Dave is going to sending out the rest of the orders\pre-orders soon.

[1UP]

On a side note; anyone else do a Dual Strike hack? I noticed that the ubiquitous 1UP diagram of the pcb has the X-Axis black and red connections wrong: at least on my pcb they were reversed.

I don't remember exactly, but I'm pretty anal about stuff so I'm sure the way I drew it was the way it was on my board.  There could have been different revisions that were color coded differently, who knows...   You just have to use the connections that work for you.

BTW, I can't believe people are still hunting down Dual Strikes for this--there must be other gamepads that would work.  I just happened to have them laying around when I was looking for stuff to cannibalize to interface my yoke, there's really nothing special that makes them work.  Other than working with 5v pots.

[Havok]

Yeah, they still pop up on ebay, but this one I have had sitting around in my garage for over two years; I figured I'd get everything ready for when the yoke was done back when we thought they would first be shipping. In fact, it took some searching to find the darn thing. I forgot where I stashed it and had to tear apart the garage! I'm sure you're right about other pads working, it's just a matter of pulling one apart and seeing what the analog piece uses.  However, it's tough to beat the current price of a DS; Thumbmonkey is selling them on ebay for $10 BIN shipped. I've bought from them in the past, and they're a great seller.

In case someone is going to hack their DS and was wondering about the X-Axis connections, my pcb has X01-01787-01 on it. Not sure if that is just the part number, or perhaps contains a revision number in it, but figured I'd list it. It would be interesting to see if anyone else that hacked a DS has a different number stamped on their pcb, and whether or not the pot connections match with 1UP's...

[MameMaster!]

Hey 1UP-- I still have about 10 Dual Strikes sitting in my garage (all brand new). Don't talk folks out of them!  

 

[MameMaster!]

SOOO.....is this officially dead? Did anyone here other than Havok order one?

 

EDIT -- I just noticed this thread--- hmmm 

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=101002.0

[Havok]

Yay - they're starting to trickle in...

[RobotronNut]

SOOO.....is this officially dead? Did anyone here other than Havok order one?

i ordered one late december. haven't received it yet.

[Breaker]

Hi All,

I was going to hold off until I received it, but I can confirm that my yoke is currently traversing the
continent (via UPS) and on its way to me in Canada. As promised, Dave has supplied a tracking number so
I have been following its progress all day. I should get it tomorrow or Saturday (if UPS delivers on the weekend)
and I'll advise the BYOAC board when it arrives (and include some pics).

Yes, the yokes are now going out!
Breaker.

[Daviea]

Hey everyone,

I have not been on the BYOAC forum in quite some time.  It looks like at least one melt-down occurred during that time.  Nice.

Anyhow, obviously the lack of communication has been a real problem for me.  I'm sorry about it, but I've been trying to keep focus on this end, especially with what really matters in my life.  Work, family, home, etc.  I've been trying hard to work on RAM Controls projects as time permits and I've made some headway, but I've really slacked on the forums.  I felt that it was a choice of actual WORK or sit and TALK about work.  I know it sounds like a cop out, but in my defense, I have been watching and responding to emails somewhat routinely.  Anyone who has pre-ordered with me should know how to contact me directly.  I do believe those who have contacted me directly have received responses from me.

I'll bring up one specific item that I do feel needs a little clarification.  I said one thing that has bit me on the rear-end ever since I posted it.  "Now Shipping"  Does that ring a bell?  I posted it, then everything in my life started to fall apart with regard to work.  Yes, I said WORK.  The thing that puts food on my table and funds my hobbies (like RAM Controls -- yes, it IS a hobby).  Anyhow, I won't get into the nitty gritty, but suffice to say I had to do some fancy footwork to deal with everything.  That took time.  Too much time, if you ask me.  Slowly, I was able to stabilize work enough to get back to dealing with RAM Controls projects.  I shipped pre-order #1 (Havok) and he got his yoke in short order.  Based on his response and the response from some people I queried directly on the subject, I decided to make two minor changes to the yoke which created a whole new delay.  This and the silence didn't help matters much.

So, I've got life back in order and I'm working on RAM Controls nearly full time right now to pick up the slack I created for myself.

The bottom line is that yokes are shipping.  People will post about it.  We're out of the woods.  Thanks to all of you who held out and stuck in there with me.  I really do appreciate your patience.

To everyone who pre-paid for a yoke and had to wait and deal with delay after delay as well as poor communication, I apologize for everything.  It's my hope that you will enjoy the reproduction yokes and we can move beyond this entire mess. 

To everyone else who had to endure the drama here and on KLOV, please accept my apologies as well.  Hopefully, with these yokes shipping now, we can count on the detractors to go silent so we can enjoy the forums just that much more.

If you need to contact me, PLEASE email me directly.  I'm not on the forums much, so EMAIL is the best avenue to contact me.

Thanks again everyone,

Dave

P.S.  Some of you have been pretty harsh on me.  I hope we can move forward and put it behind us.  That would be nice.

[Hoopz]

Daviea,

I'm glad that you got the important stuff sorted out (home, family, work etc). 

I'll be the first to apologize for any comments that I made that were out of line.  I hope everyone that gets their yokes enjoys them. 

I hope things are going more smoothly for you.

 

[RayB]

Saint, lock this thread before the various "you could have done X Y Z" posts start....
 

[Havok]

In before the lock - and how about those USB interfaces?

 

[Daviea]

Hey Havok,

I'm working on them right now.  I'm going to be slightly off-target, but I should have at least a small batch (~50pcs) ready in the next week or so.  I have to note that the timeframe might be extended without further notice!  LOL  I've got all the parts, I just need to tweak the firmware, flash the PIC's and solder them on.  I think you'll all like the simple plug and play design, plus my PCB's are SO purdy!!! :-)

Dave

In before the lock - and how about those USB interfaces?

 

[Chunce DeLeone]

Got my Yoke last night and it is awesome.  Haven't hooked it up yet but can't wait.  The detail on this thing is sick, its perfect!!!!

[Daviea]

I know that I probably don't deserve it and I might even be out of line for asking, but can you indulge me a little bit and post quick reviews of your brand new yokes?  Pictures and lotsa big words would be good. :-)  I need some love right about now.

Thanks!!

Dave

[Daviea]

PS.  Just so you're all completely in the loop, I shipped out 36 yokes on Wednesday of this week.  If you don't have your yoke by Monday/Tuesday at the latest, you're probably in the next round to be shipped.  I am reassembling a big batch of them now and they SHOULD ship next week.  And that will cover the remainder of the yoke pre-orders.

This is my official update for today.

Dave

[Havok]

Soon to be many happy people out there, these yokes are a work of art!

[MameMaster!]

Dave as soon as the reviews roll in, I'll be happy to order one with the USB gadget.

[Daviea]

I'm sitting on pins and needles waiting for these reviews to roll in.  It's agonizing having to wait.  I think there's some lesson in that, too.  :-)

Dave

P.S.  USB adapters are being worked on right now.  I should have them available in the next week or so.

Dave as soon as the reviews roll in, I'll be happy to order one with the USB gadget.

[Chunce DeLeone]

ORDER ONE NOW before Dave stops making them.  they are perfect,  there really isn't more i can say Dave sorry,  except that they are the yokyest yokes I've ever seen?

[Breaker]

Hi All,

Okay, I worked from home this afternoon to greet the arrival of the yoke!
I have just opened the box and examined the unit and I have to say that it is, in a word, beautiful!
The finish is flawless, the movement is silky-smooth and the level of detail, stunning. It is rock solid!

See pics attached.
One important note about the detail shots of the handles; the camera flash may make the small amount of
packing lint on the parts appear as scratches - THIS IS NOT THE CASE - THE FINISH IS PERFECT!

Congratulations Dave, it's a thing of beauty and the arcade community has a new standard for quality!

Okay, back to work for now...more accolades to come... 

All best,
Breaker.  

[RayB]

Hmmm I just had an evil thought. How much would a NOS original Atari yoke sell for?

[Havok]

Hmmm I just had an evil thought. How much would a NOS original Atari yoke sell for?

The handles are slightly different (somewhat boxier and powder coated); any collector worth his salt would recognize this as a repro - especially since the tolerances on this one are much tighter than an OEM piece. However, you *might* be able to pass it off as a prototype, as the handles are based on that instead of the ones that made it into production. The only difference there would be the coating...

[Daviea]

There's also one more difference which is obvious from the external of the controller.  The steering bracket (or steering weldment) - the black metal frame at the rear of the controller.  It's made from only two pieces of sheet metal instead of three.  It's one of those small design changes I made.  The ability of sheet metal workers in the 80's to make the part with only two pieces would have been tremendously difficult.  It's still difficult, but CAD software makes the process SO much easier now....if you know what you're doing. :-)  I never liked how Atari welded that third piece onto the bracket, so I designed it differently, making the part just that much cleaner.

Dave

[WareWolF]

Dave I never heard from you about a refund so if you want to actually ship me a yoke that's ok. 
Send me a PM with your correct e-mail address if you never got the mail I sent you a few months ago.

[Daviea]

Are you messing with me or did you really ask for a refund on your yoke order?

That's the one constant I've always had - ask for a refund on a pre-order and it was done immediately, no questions asked.

Email me at sales@ram-controls.com and let's discuss.

Dave

Dave I never heard from you about a refund so if you want to actually ship me a yoke that's ok. 
Send me a PM with your correct e-mail address if you never got the mail I sent you a few months ago.

[WareWolF]

Just sent an e-mail now -- let me know if you get it. 

I apologize for blasting you for not responding, no idea why you never got my refund request E-Mail.

[Daviea]

I don't know what the problem is, but I still don't have an email from you.

Are you sending it to:  sales@ram-controls.com

I have my SPAM assassin turned OFF, so I know that's not the problem.  I even looked in my SPAM folder for good measure.  Nada.

I have to assume that there's something else wrong.

Doublecheck the email address you're sending to.  sales@ram-controls.com and also try daviea@ca.rr.com just as a backup.

Thanks

Dave

Just sent an e-mail now -- let me know if you get it. 

I apologize for blasting you for not responding, no idea why you never got my refund request E-Mail.

[Havok]

Trust me - you don't want a refund!

Dave - here's some quotes for ya:

"This is the yoke that Atari wished they made back in 1983!"

"With this yoke on my control panel, I am Luke Skywalker!"

"The craftsmanship of this yoke is far superior to the original; Ram Controls took the original product and made it better!"

"There's a new definition for perfect in the dictionary; it now contains a picture of a Ram Controls yoke!"

"Ram Controls didn't just make a reproduction yoke, they perfected it!"

[Paul Olson]

Does anyone want to buy a Gamecab yoke for $300 so I can get one of these?     

[TPB]

Congratulations Dave.

All's well that ends well, and your yokes look fantastic !


How about having a "now we're REALLY shipping sale" ?   

[SirPeale]

I don't know what the problem is, but I still don't have an email from you.

Because, just like the Real World post office, sometimes letters get lost.  It happens.

[Daviea]

Just as an FYI, I finally did receive an email from WareWolF.  I'm not sure how many tries were involved, but we seem to be communicating directly now.  Praise the internet gh0ds!!  LOL

Havok, thanks for all of those quotes.  Do you guys think I can actually USE those?  I mean.....they're kind of manufactured, right?  If I can get enough of you to concur that they're acceptable for use, I'll go for it.  :-)

LOL @ "now we're REALLY shipping sale".  You're not too far off target - Keep watching, I'll have another BYOAC/KLOV sale shortly.  But, I'm trying to think of a way to make it fun....fun for the entire community.  I'm still mulling over the idea. 

I can confirm that ALL 36 yokes have been delivered (at least, according to UPS tracking on each of them).  I have not received a confirmation from approximately 80% of those individuals, but I'm pestering each of them until I hear those magic words "I got it and it's PERFECT!"  haha

I'll have the next allotment out late next week, possibly early the following week.  I'm trying not to back myself into a corner here, but I think I can manage this.  If not, I will be right back here to inform everyone of any delays which might exist.  I think that's what all of you have been asking for, right?  Or....I could just say, I'll ship them when I ship them....gaRRRRR  LOL  Let's go with the first one. :-)

Enjoy those yokes.

Dave

[TPB]

Havok, thanks for all of those quotes.  Do you guys think I can actually USE those?  I mean.....they're kind of manufactured, right?  If I can get enough of you to concur that they're acceptable for use, I'll go for it.  :-)

It's fine to use them, as long as you attribute the same source to all of the quotes (Havok).

But it would look strange having a whole heap of quotes from the one customer.  Maybe just select a couple of Havok's quotes for publication.


Havok isn't your only source for quotes.  How about Breaker ? ...

I have just opened the box and examined the unit and I have to say that it is, in a word, beautiful!

The finish is flawless, the movement is silky-smooth and the level of detail, stunning. It is rock solid!

... it's a thing of beauty and the arcade community has a new standard for quality!

[jimkirk]

I don't have any investment in this project but I would like to make 1 suggestion to Daviea.
Instead of saying something is going to be shipped on a specific day,when that might change,why not just say I expect to ship on such and such day instead.
That would eliminate a lot of problems.
A follow up post then saying what the delay in shipping was caused by and when you expect to ship.
This would eliminate guys like Frizz calling you a liar and such.

[Havok]

I put a bunch of quotes up there to choose one or none - plus definitely pick some from the other recipients. One that isn't manufactured from me would be "Finally I can play Star Wars the way it was meant to be, thanks for making such a quality controller!"

[MameMaster!]

It's pretty neat to see something like this resurrected from the past....seeing these all brand new and shiny is cool.

As soon as those USB gadgets are ready---- **fingers poised over buy button** 

[daywane]

It's pretty neat to see something like this resurrected from the past....seeing these all brand new and shiny is cool.

As soon as those USB gadgets are ready---- **fingers poised over buy button** 

+1
I will get some fun out of all this  over time I am forsed to do!

[Daviea]

As promised, the USB interface project has been completed, just over 100 boards have been assembled and tested and the project is now shipping!!

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=101145.0

Enjoy!!

Dave

[Havok]

Nice!

[MameMaster!]

OK Havok-- I've been a skeptic-- but I just forked over the cash for a yoke and USB interface. I know you, longer than any of us has been a faithful.....so now that I know you're happy....I gave it a shot to get one too.

Dave-- you have my faith (and money) in your hands now.  

 

[TPB]

This would eliminate guys like Frizz calling you a liar and such.

The yokes are shipping, and that's all that matters now.

If you must mention Frizz, then it's only fair to recall what happended.  Dave did give the impression of lying at the time.

Telling Havok that his yoke was "on its way right now" back at Christmas time, certainly had the appearance of a lie.  How could you say something was on its way, when you hadn't shipped it ?  Many people would call that a lie.  After having been told that, Havok said he emailed Dave on three separate occasions asking for a tracking number, without receiving any reply.  He was disappointed when his yoke was a no-show.

Finally, on February 10, Havok received his yoke.  Now he's a happy chappy.  And he's Dave's biggest fan once more, because the yoke is such a quality piece of merchandise.  That's all that matters now ... Dave's finally delivering the goods.

Congratulations Dave, on coming through in the end !

[MameMaster!]

I didn't get home yet, but Dave just contacted me that my yoke should be waiting for me on my doorstep.

Just so everyone knows-- it only took about 2 days from order to delivery...and he's been all over keeping me in the loop from order acknowledgement to final delivery.

Fingers crossed it's on the stoop! 

[fatfingers]

I didn't get home yet, but Dave just contacted me that my yoke should be waiting for me on my doorstep.

*runs over, steals yoke, sneaks away*

[RobotronNut]

it only took about 2 days from order to delivery...and he's been all over keeping me in the loop from order acknowledgement to final delivery.

hmm...

it's 80 days since my credit card was charged and still counting.
no replies to the email i sent in jan or the email i sent in feb.

how is it that you're getting all the love?

[Daviea]

BTW,

I've had one of these yokes set aside for MameMaster since the first lot went out.

The remaining lot is going out shortly.  I'll have pictures to show approximately 100 yokes sitting side-by-side to share with everyone. :-)

RobotronNut, PM me here on BYOAC.  I don't see any emails from you regarding the yoke--at least nothing I can ID as coming from you.  I've responded to hundreds upon hundreds of emails regarding the yoke, so I know I've been responding to SOMEONE. :-)

Dave

[MameMaster!]

Well the short and sweet is I got the yoke, and man did it truly exceed my expectations.

I haven't seen a mint yoke, perhaps ever, and it's superior to my 20+ year old one in every way.

You know I can truly say it's a thing of beauty and what is obviously rock solid engineering.

More to come.......(and photos of course).

Dave-- since I ordered this originally --- I had a baby, moved into a new home, started a new job, we saw the economy tank and more. It's been a long ride, but man did you make an amazing repro here. 

[RobotronNut]

PM sent.

[RayB]

Out of curiosity, any Canadians get their yokes yet? I'm waiting to find out how much of a butt-raping UPS is gonna do on these. Or did you remember to use USPS for the Canucks, Dave?

[Daviea]

Ask Breaker, he got his:

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=100162.msg1068526#msg1068526

As a side note, I won't EVER be using USPS to ship anything ever again.  After they've REPEATEDLY made me look bad, I've given up on them.  Any argument to their credit will be futile because my rep has already taken too much of a beating to put up with anymore of the "he said my package was lost" posts caused directly by USPS.  I have to be quite blunt about this one because it's a damned if I do, damned if I don't situation and I've got to choose the better of the two.  Trying to ease my rep out of the forum dog-house seems more appropriate given my extreme investment into reproduction parts. So, no more USPS.  No more.  Nope. LOL

For now, I'm planning on sticking with UPS.  Yes, while they do have their problems, they have *real* tracking and a higher caliber of staff working for them.  However, when I do ship outside of the good ol' USA, I've been selecting the "reverse fees to shipper" option so I can take the brunt of the cost involved.  I'm curious to know what charges, if any, might be making their way to the customer.

??

Dave

Out of curiosity, any Canadians get their yokes yet? I'm waiting to find out how much of a butt-raping UPS is gonna do on these. Or did you remember to use USPS for the Canucks, Dave?

[Breaker]

Hi all,

Yep, got my yoke last week and only had to pay approximately $12.00 of GST.
UPS can be a little slow getting their duty invoices out, but if Dave is reversing fees I suspect it's a done deal.

Breaker.

[RandyT]

As a side note, I won't EVER be using USPS to ship anything ever again.  After they've REPEATEDLY made me look bad, I've given up on them.  Any argument to their credit will be futile because my rep has already taken too much of a beating to put up with anymore of the "he said my package was lost" posts caused directly by USPS.  I have to be quite blunt about this one because it's a damned if I do, damned if I don't situation and I've got to choose the better of the two.  Trying to ease my rep out of the forum dog-house seems more appropriate given my extreme investment into reproduction parts. So, no more USPS.  No more.  Nope. LOL

Uhhh.....I have literally shipped about 10,000 packages via USPS to every corner of the world.  Know how many got lost?  About 4, and 3 of those were customer error.

And, the USPS does have numbers a customer can use to follow the delivery process.  The delivery confirmation numbers will show that the package was indeed shipped, most times its progress along the way, as well as if it was returned to sender for some reason.  You only need to provide that number to your customer for them to see that you are telling the truth.  If you are not doing that, or not using the free delivery confirmation service you get when purchasing the postage on-line, then I don't know what to say.

Maybe they just have it out for you for some reason

RandyT

[FrizzleFried]

>couHORSEPUCKYgh<

[CheffoJeffo]

I would be interested to hear about what happens with UPS and reversing the brokerage charge. If it is just a reversal, should result in a $30 increase in upfront shipping costs, which would be insane. If it works like DigiKey's UPS shipping, then I am all for it.

I strongly prefer USPS (when selected with all of the bells and whistles) and their tracking works fine for me (you have to remember to switch to the Canada Post website for tracking once the package crosses the border). Last month I had a package come via UPS and the estimated delivery date was out by a day ... on a next business day delivery.

Having said that, lots of vendors seem to be pulling away from USPS for shipping to Canada and I have to wonder why -- they have exactly the same concerns as sellers that I have as a buyer, except that I have the additional concern of being bent over the sink by UPS.

Nice to hear such good things about the yokes! 

[Xiaou2]

 
 Well, I ordered a 37" LCD tv from California, shipped to Ny.   UPS Lost It!

 If I recall correctly, Tracking said it made it to Buffalo... than it never moved from
that location.
 
 Think about this...  The box for a 37" TV was like 5' long,  1' Deep,  3.5 ' high.
Its Monstrous!  (and pretty heavy)

 Of course, I imagine this kind of thing happens to all the shipping places.
Corruption abound.

 Not to mention... that most shippers like UPS will leave a package on a doorstep
if you are not home.  Its not the drivers fault so much as the policy.  I cant believe
the days that Ive come home to find an expensive packing just sitting against the door.
I would guess that many small packages lost are probably due to doorstep theft.
 
 I believe there is an option however, that Makes UPS get a signature from the customer.
I suspect that it might work similarly for fedex and others too.

[CheffoJeffo]

Not to mention... that most shippers like UPS will leave a package on a doorstep
if you are not home.  Its not the drivers fault so much as the policy.  I cant believe
the days that Ive come home to find an expensive packing just sitting against the door.
I would guess that many small packages lost are probably due to doorstep theft.

I guess that is one advantage to UPS and their habit of raping people for brokerage fees -- they aren't leaving the package until they get their pound of flesh.

In my experience, every shipping method that involves tracking has an option to require a customer signature (and in some cases it is mandatory).

[Daviea]

All I'm saying is that I've had better luck with UPS than USPS and I've decided to ship only via UPS. :-)

To those in other countries, I'm trying to lessen the hit to your wallet which is why I charge a flat rate of only $10 shipping (anywhere in the world) and absorb as much of the additional fees as I can.  I'm not sure how it's working out, but I always select the reverse charges to shipper check box when shipping outside of the U.S.  I hope it's making a difference for everyone.

Say, is anyone who received one of my reproduction yokes planning on writing up a full review?  If so, I can't wait to see it.

Thanks guys.

Dave

[RayB]

Well Dave it's great that you are doing that. It probably takes UPS 30 days or more to get their invoice to you. You can expect to see a minimum of about $30 in broker fees (PER SHIPMENT), unless they give you some sort of bulk or business discount. I think they also scale up the cost based on the declared value of the item (as if that makes any sense).

You're also allowed to use your own broker.

[Hoopz]

I ship fairly regularly (only within the US though) and have found UPS to be the best for my company.   USPS's tracking system is worthless from what I have found.  Yes, it shows when something has shipped.  But that's it.  I very rarely see updates until after it's delivered.  I don't see the value in it.

For the comments about shipping companies leaving expensive packages on the door step, that's at the driver's discretion based on the quality of the neighborhood and frequency or infrequency of delivery problems in the area.  The shipper can also specify whether to require someone to be home or to not leave it on the doorstep.  Both personally and professionally, I have had to sign a delivery ticket authorizing the package to be left the next day without anyone being home.  Also, the driver generally doesn't know the value of the package so that isn't factored in very often.  They may see how much something is insured for up to but that doesn't equate to value.

[RandyT]

I ship fairly regularly (only within the US though) and have found UPS to be the best for my company.   USPS's tracking system is worthless from what I have found.  Yes, it shows when something has shipped.  But that's it.  I very rarely see updates until after it's delivered.

In the context of this discussion, those were the two most important aspects.  As long as it is shipped and delivered, does it really matter if you can see when it passes through Duluth?

[Loafmeister]

That's a pity you won't ship via USPS as because of brokerage fees, I've vowed never to buy anything that ships via UPS.  It's cool that you'll accept that reverse charge thing but if it's what I expect it to be, I suspect you'll be changing your policy.

I get that bad experiences will entice you to do as you have, I don't blame you.  Also on the brokerage fees, the large amount is not what bothers me, it's the inconsistency of it that does.  I've had large fees for a small item (a free replacement item might I add) and almost zero fee on a larger item. I don't get it, but I suspect they have a giant wheel with various lables/fees on it and however has your package in his/her hands just gives the wheel a spin and wherever it lands is what you get.

And yeah, leaving MY UPS package on the doorstep is a nono in my book but they have done so all the time.  I heard it's because I authorized it once and that policy applies to future packages. I don't remember doing so but I guess it's always possible. Thankfully, I do live in a cool neighborhood so I'm not too worrried about it.

BTW, I'm also waiting on various reviews, including the USB adapter.  Those comments from a Mame end will I'm sure entice many more to buy.

[TPB]

I don't get it, but I suspect they have a giant wheel with various lables/fees on it and however has your package in his/her hands just gives the wheel a spin and wherever it lands is what you get.