Batman Arkham City

[Howard_Casto]

I got this a few days ago for my birthday and I'm loving it so far.  The main story is REALLY short, it is literally 11 hours (there's a timer, that's how I know).  But the story is good enough to excuse it.  This time I seriously doubt you'll see anything coming.  (Or at least most of the major plot twists).  That being said, even with getting several riddler trophies and doing all the alternate catwoman stages along the way, I'm only 30% finished.  If it took roughly 11 hours to do 30% then I have at least 25 more hours of gameplay left with the side missions, probably more. 

What's most impressive to me was how they managed to weave so many characters into the game. 

Here's a list:

Vicky Vale
Penguin
Joker
Harley Quinn
Two-Face
Mr. Freeze
Poison Ivy
Killer Croc
Hugo Strange
Raz Al Ghul & Daughter
Clay Face
Robin
Solomon Grundy
Bane

Side Missions (at least from what I can piece together) also have an impressive cast:

The Mad Hatter
Calendar Man
Tzsaz (spelling?)
The Riddler
Bane (as an ally?)
The Red Hood
Dead Eye

The game is really good and aside from a glitch or two I think anybody who enjoyed the first one is going to be impressed by how much further this one goes.  They fixed virtually every complaint people had about the first.  It's more open-ended, no more repetative boss battles (each one is totally unique).  More villians, more diverse goals, and a better, less-predictable story.  Just don't expect much difficulty, as this is more of an "Assasin's Creed" style game, but expect a lot of fun. 

I finished with what I believe is the "bad ending" and it was legitimately moving, mostly due to Hamill's performance.

I look forward to getting 100% and beating it again for the good one.

[ark_ader]

I refuse to buy new games for consoles, purely that I find (especially with Fable 3) that these games are not worth the money.

I like how Rage was £39.99 in the shop last week, now I can find it for £29.99 or £32.  I still think most games are poor in design, and will sample Batman when it gets to £15.

Most of the Xbox 360 games six months ago are available for £15-25 now, where as PC games drop dramatically.  I think this Batman game will drop in price similarly.

Nice write up Howard, but I'm sure it is a cool game, but not enough to warrant full price.

Many happy returns on your Birthday Howard. 

[Mikezilla]

Did you get anything special with the version you got Howard? It depends on where you buy it, Target is giving a Blu Ray copy of Dark Knight, and Wal Mart gives you the GOTY Edition of Arkham Asylum. I wish I would have known that, I would have sold my copy of AA a long time ago when it was worth something...

Its getting rave reviews, I plan to get my copy today. The only beef people seem to have, like you said, is that its too easy, the boss fights at least.

Dude, 11 hours is pretty long for that type of game if you ask me. Anything over 8 is considered "long" by todays standards. Unless you are playing a RPG at least.

[Dartful Dodger]

Does it have online multiplayer?

[Howard_Casto]

Did you get anything special with the version you got Howard? It depends on where you buy it, Target is giving a Blu Ray copy of Dark Knight, and Wal Mart gives you the GOTY Edition of Arkham Asylum. I wish I would have known that, I would have sold my copy of AA a long time ago when it was worth something...

Its getting rave reviews, I plan to get my copy today. The only beef people seem to have, like you said, is that its too easy, the boss fights at least.

Dude, 11 hours is pretty long for that type of game if you ask me. Anything over 8 is considered "long" by todays standards. Unless you are playing a RPG at least.

I got it as a gift, so I got jack and squat as a bonus.  I really wished I would have bought it wherever they give you the animated series skin.  Catwoman comes with here animated series skin and it is spot on.  They don't stoop to simple re-colors or cell shading either.  The original suit and animated series character is modeled in it's full glory.  What they did was remove all the extra shading to make it look a but more "cartoony". 

The measuring stick for all action adventure sandbox games for me is the assasin's creed games (because they are the best of the genre) they usually are around 15-20 hours without side quests so anything less than that is short. 

The boss fights aren't necessarily too easy, it depends upon how you play and how you upgrade your equiptment.  If you avoid fights (which nets you less xp) and don't do a full suit upgrade first then they are tough.  But if you are like me all of your initial upgrades went to armor on the batsuit, which ups your health by a factor of 3.  At that point you can get hit a lot and not die, so the boss fights aren't as precise.  Without those upgrades it might be tough though as most of the bosses have the old-school "hit certain weakpoints in order avoiding attack until he's stunned, them move in" strategy. 

[Howard_Casto]

Oh I forgot to mention.  I do have one singular complaint in the form of how they treated the Pneguin.  (You meet him in the first 3 seconds of the game, so this isn't spoilers.)

They changed him into a street thug, which I think kind of misses the point of the character, but sure.  When you meet him he has half of a beer bottle worn like monacle.  I didn't think much of it... in this game and the first many of the inmated improvised their costumes from things they found lying around.  (They are in prison afterall.)  Later in the game, via a riddler trophy, you learn that the bottle is permenantly lodged in his skull as the result of a fight and surgeons won't remove it as it could kill him. 

I call b.s. on that one!  You know people get stuff lodged in their skull that can't be removed all the time... it happens in real-life.  They don't leave the whole frikkin thing sticking out of your head though!  What they would do is remove it down to the skin and let the skin grow-over.  It's certainly less-dangerous than having a object touching your brain sticking out of your head for anybody to hit and kill you!!! 

Even worse, the bottom of the bottle is shattered, meaning that:

1.  With a gentle tap it would probably shatter into pieces and most of it could be removed.

2.  The Penguin has been looking through a dirty, brown, SHATTERED beer bottle for YEARS!

People really need to stop making the Penguin cooler than he is.  He's supposed to be a bit of comic relief, not the uber-thug.

[Malenko]

but a billionare who apparently never sleeps and fights crime, a woman who had her DNA spliced with plants, a guy who needs to keep a subzero body temperature, etc etc etc are all ok with you?

its a comic based world, reality doesnt apply

I picked up the game yesterday despite not finishing the first one; i like this one tons more

[Howard_Casto]

but a billionare who apparently never sleeps and fights crime, a woman who had her DNA spliced with plants, a guy who needs to keep a subzero body temperature, etc etc etc are all ok with you?

its a comic based world, reality doesnt apply

I picked up the game yesterday despite not finishing the first one; i like this one tons more

Yup those are ok.  It's alright to go beyond reality when it suits the character and story, but when it's forced like that it just seems.... well forced. 
They are trying really hard to prove to the player that the penguin is all hardcore the stuff when in reality most interations of the penguin were the complete opposite.  It reminds me of Burtons interpretation of the penguin, what with the flippers and stuff...  it's just not necessary.  TAS had this version of the penguin but once the hype of the movies died down they quickly reverted to the failed aristrocrat who's obsessed with avian crimes. 

Two give a videogame example the penguin personality and costume change is like bomberman act zero.  They are desperately trying to make the character less silly and cute and by doing that they suck away all of the charm that made the character so likeable.



I've been going further into the side-quests.  The ones that feature villians seem like a bit of a tease.  Some are nothing but a boss fight (and a lame one at that) and in others you don't even fight the villian directly! 

It's still worth every penny, just don't expect much from some of the side-quests.  The riddler side-quest is vastly improved though.  Every time you collect X amount of trophies, you get to rescue a hostage from one of the riddler's hideouts via solving a uber-puzzle.  The trphies themselves are harder to get now as well, with "vent navigation", pattern recogniton, gliding, and ball rolling puzzles added to the mix in addition to the types you saw in the previous game. 

But there are 400!  Ugh 400!  500 if you count Catwoman's !!

[Malenko]

the ending you got isnt "the bad ending" its THE ending.  I'm having a dandy of a time with one of the "augmented reality training" points, the one in the bay off of one of the cranes. I cant seem to hit the 3rd ring no matter what.  I have about 100 riddler trophies, but I honestly dont really feel like going on a scavenger hunt. The tragic part is the "side story" section in the upgrade menu, is practically empty, and I have no clue how to find them

[Dartful Dodger]

Since this is an arcade board we have all been guilty of this at one time or another.

Hopefully we can all learn from this experience.

When you complain about fictional characters not being represented the same way you saw them when you were 12, you end up sounding like a 12 year old girl.

[Howard_Casto]

Since this is an arcade board we have all been guilty of this at one time or another.

Hopefully we can all learn from this experience.

When you complain about fictional characters not being represented the same way you saw them when you were 12, you end up sounding like a 12 year old girl.

 

Well when I was 12 he was also protrayed incorrectly  (that's when Batman Returns came out) so your assumption is incorrect.  Batman, was created in 1939 with the Penguin debuting in 1941.  For the majority of his existence he was portrayed as I described.  So yeah I'm a really whiner for complaining that a character that's essentially been one way for about 70 years was totally changed for a game that has become the definative Batman game.



And regardless of this particular example it is NOT whining, it is a legitimate concern.  Hack directors and writers seem to think that it's their duty to "re-imagine" characters and scenarios when they are doing franchise work.  I personally think it's their own way to feel like less of a sellout whore and reassure themselves that they are "artists."  The problem with this logic is that when you purchase/use a franchise, you are doing so to take advantage of an existing, a fully realized, set of characters and a large fanbase of said characters.  You aren't supposed to change things, you are supposed to keep them the same.  If you want to change things up dramatically then what exactly is the point of using the franchise?  The only logical reason one could give would be to trick loyal fans into seeing a movie/buying a game that they normally wouldn't enjoy. 

[Howard_Casto]

the ending you got isnt "the bad ending" its THE ending.  I'm having a dandy of a time with one of the "augmented reality training" points, the one in the bay off of one of the cranes. I cant seem to hit the 3rd ring no matter what.  I have about 100 riddler trophies, but I honestly dont really feel like going on a scavenger hunt. The tragic part is the "side story" section in the upgrade menu, is practically empty, and I have no clue how to find them

There are a couple of other endings, though not the "true" end. 


If I remember correctly, for that one you have to do a slight dive bomb then pull up.  I found the first 4 to be really easy though. 

The incentive to do the riddler trophies is that for every so many you collect, you get to face one of the riddler's death traps and rescue a hostage.  Collecting them is the only way to progress the riddler side-story.  That being said, there's a lot more variety in this game.  At least half of the trophy puzzles are really clever, and at least for me they are fun to figure out.  You do know that if you interrogate "green guys" that they fill in your map with locations right? 


Let's see... side stories. 

One involves finding Nora.  The location is basically marked on the map. 

Another involves finding Mr. freeze's missing gear, it's in the steel mill just like Harely blabs when you find her gagged up.

One is saving political prisoners from getting beaten up, they show up as blinking hexagons on your map randomly... after you've saved so many you are done.

The sniper case involves checking victims for clues... as you get more data you'll be given more locations to check.  (I think they might unlock as you get in the vicinity of a body). 

Phone call killer is self-explanitory... answer ringing phones and do what they say. 

I haven't figured out how to progress the indentity thief yet. 

The watchers are just red guys watching you from odd, out of the way areas.  (They are usually up really high)  when you find one talk to them.  After 4 you are done. 

That should get you started. 

[Bootay]

Since this is an arcade board we have all been guilty of this at one time or another.

Hopefully we can all learn from this experience.

When you complain about fictional characters not being represented the same way you saw them when you were 12, you end up sounding like a 12 year old girl.

 

Well when I was 12 he was also protrayed incorrectly  (that's when Batman Returns came out) so your assumption is incorrect.  Batman, was created in 1939 with the Penguin debuting in 1941.  For the majority of his existence he was portrayed as I described.  So yeah I'm a really whiner for complaining that a character that's essentially been one way for about 70 years was totally changed for a game that has become the definative Batman game.



And regardless of this particular example it is NOT whining, it is a legitimate concern.  Hack directors and writers seem to think that it's their duty to "re-imagine" characters and scenarios when they are doing franchise work.  I personally think it's their own way to feel like less of a sellout whore and reassure themselves that they are "artists."  The problem with this logic is that when you purchase/use a franchise, you are doing so to take advantage of an existing, a fully realized, set of characters and a large fanbase of said characters.  You aren't supposed to change things, you are supposed to keep them the same.  If you want to change things up dramatically then what exactly is the point of using the franchise?  The only logical reason one could give would be to trick loyal fans into seeing a movie/buying a game that they normally wouldn't enjoy. 

I'm with Howard on this one. I get sick of the re-imaging thing. I don't mind slight alterations if necessary, but to totally re-imagine a character or story just to make it "extreme" or "hip" is annoying to me. And it happens with pretty much every comic movie these days.

And I hate when the excuse for the change is "It wasn't believable so we changed it". IT"S A COMIC BOOK CHARACTER! It's not supposed to be believable.

[Malenko]

There are a couple of other endings, though not the "true" end. 


If I remember correctly, for that one you have to do a slight dive bomb then pull up.  I found the first 4 to be really easy though. 

The incentive to do the riddler trophies is that for every so many you collect, you get to face one of the riddler's death traps and rescue a hostage.  Collecting them is the only way to progress the riddler side-story.  That being said, there's a lot more variety in this game.  At least half of the trophy puzzles are really clever, and at least for me they are fun to figure out.  You do know that if you interrogate "green guys" that they fill in your map with locations right? 


Let's see... side stories. 

One involves finding Nora.  The location is basically marked on the map. 

Another involves finding Mr. freeze's missing gear, it's in the steel mill just like Harely blabs when you find her gagged up.

One is saving political prisoners from getting beaten up, they show up as blinking hexagons on your map randomly... after you've saved so many you are done.

The sniper case involves checking victims for clues... as you get more data you'll be given more locations to check.  (I think they might unlock as you get in the vicinity of a body). 

Phone call killer is self-explanitory... answer ringing phones and do what they say. 

I haven't figured out how to progress the indentity thief yet. 

The watchers are just red guys watching you from odd, out of the way areas.  (They are usually up really high)  when you find one talk to them.  After 4 you are done. 

That should get you started. 

Well, the only "bad ending" is if you go to the right with catwoman instead of the left, and that gets rewound and you continue. I just meant you cant finish the story and not get that ending (the one involving batman getting attacked with a sharp object)

Im trying not to spoil anything, its not easy to explain while doing so.

I finished the Nora, freeze gear, most of the political prisoners, finished the sniper one, finished the one with Bane, and talked to 1 or 2 watchers (they are also the guys you hafta throw a batarang at for one of the achievements) I even rescued 1 riddler hostage, I laughed when he called me a cheater cause I used the zip line instead of navigating the electrified floor, classic.

I dont have an issue with he penguin, they kept the spirit of him, I mean yeah they tried to make him kinda hardcore with the glass bottle in the eye but it could have been worse. When he gets put into that place, they keep him there even when you play the catwoman parts. Its not like they made him 7 foot tall and ripped. I really liked the Riddler character, especially the voice acting (but the voice effects on the riddler challenge pause screen got annoying fast!) I still cant believe Mark Hamil does the joker voice, its REALLY GOOD! Even better than his Wolverine in the X2-Wolverine's Revenge game.

I was talking about the "arkham city stories", apparently they fill themselves in as you solve riddler clues (like the organ in the church). Now if you'll excuse me, I have some more tiny green trophies to find in a video game

[Dartful Dodger]

And regardless of this particular example it is NOT whining, it is a legitimate concern.

Yeah, that's why I thought when I explain things to the 20 year olds I work with.

God, I hope I didn't sound as childish as you, but deep down I know I did.

Every time you assume you know the Batman characters better than the people that own the rights to Batman I shrink a little more in my seat. It’s like I’m witnessing how stupid it was for me to be complaining about the new Dr Who, Transformers and Battle Star Galactica.

[Howard_Casto]

And regardless of this particular example it is NOT whining, it is a legitimate concern.

Yeah, that's why I thought when I explain things to the 20 year olds I work with.

God, I hope I didn't sound as childish as you, but deep down I know I did.

Every time you assume you know the Batman characters better than the people that own the rights to Batman I shrink a little more in my seat. It’s like I’m witnessing how stupid it was for me to be complaining about the new Dr Who, Transformers and Battle Star Galactica.

Well I probably DO know the batman characters better than their owners.  DC comics is part of a Time/Warner multi-billion dollar conglomorate.  Do you really think the current owners of the franchise know ANYTHING about Batman... anything at all??  

Here's what they know:  
1.  Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman rakes in "teh moniez"
2.  They want "teh moniez"
3.  They purchased DC because of points 1 & 2


It isn't "childish" to point out a bad decision, a poorly portrayed character or a pos game/film remake.  You seem to forget that fan is short for fanatic.


A little history about the Penguin, just to drive my point home:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penguin_(comics)

Basically he is a gangster in some interations, and nothing more than a stool pigeon in others.  But his consistancy in all interations during his 70 year run are obsessions with bird related crimes, and an obsession of having a refined, gentlemenly appearance.  Also a key thing is that he is perfectly saine.  

A person that refuses to leave his property while a prison is being built around it is clearly crazy.

I mean they put him in kind of a suit and they got the IceBerg lounge in there, but that's about it.


Posion Ivy also got the "Uma treatment" but I can't complain that much about it because she's actually been ret-conned that way for several years and she's barely in the game.    

And I just took exception to his protrayal.....the game is still great, it isn't the end of the world.  But the fact that you took exception over me complaining about it REALLY gets on my nerves.  

[Howard_Casto]

Well, the only "bad ending" is if you go to the right with catwoman instead of the left, and that gets rewound and you continue. I just meant you cant finish the story and not get that ending (the one involving batman getting attacked with a sharp object)

Im trying not to spoil anything, its not easy to explain while doing so.

I finished the Nora, freeze gear, most of the political prisoners, finished the sniper one, finished the one with Bane, and talked to 1 or 2 watchers (they are also the guys you hafta throw a batarang at for one of the achievements) I even rescued 1 riddler hostage, I laughed when he called me a cheater cause I used the zip line instead of navigating the electrified floor, classic.

I dont have an issue with he penguin, they kept the spirit of him, I mean yeah they tried to make him kinda hardcore with the glass bottle in the eye but it could have been worse. When he gets put into that place, they keep him there even when you play the catwoman parts. Its not like they made him 7 foot tall and ripped. I really liked the Riddler character, especially the voice acting (but the voice effects on the riddler challenge pause screen got annoying fast!) I still cant believe Mark Hamil does the joker voice, its REALLY GOOD! Even better than his Wolverine in the X2-Wolverine's Revenge game.

I was talking about the "arkham city stories", apparently they fill themselves in as you solve riddler clues (like the organ in the church). Now if you'll excuse me, I have some more tiny green trophies to find in a video game

Well he has been doing the voice since 1992 ya know. 

(*Flexes geek Muscle*)  You know, he's actually been doing the voice even longer than that.  There was a really terrible live action version of The Flash on tv in 1990-1991.  In it Mark plays The Trickster, who is basically a ripoff of The Joker.  (This is common for flash villians... captain cold, ect...)  Hamill does the exact same voce he will use months later on the animated series.  In one of the later episodes of Justice league Unlimited, Hamill reprises the role of the Trickster again, although with a more subtle voice this time.  It was meant to be his last performance in the "Bruce Timm-verse" (*relaxes*)

I thought freeze's voice was particularly good.  They must have gotten a sound-alike from the animated series, because when the helmet goes down it is dead on.  I get a real kick out of the riddler as well.  The fun thing is he gets more and more frustrated as you progress. 

There's one more psuedo ending.  It's kind of like in the super hero movies where you get a bonus after the credits. 
I'm going to start a thread about the ending btw... It'll be pure spoilers, so it makes sense to make it seperate.



I'm about done with the trophies finally.  I've got two more and from what I've been told I can't get those until I do the stupid phone call missions.  They are annoying and I haven't even started on them.  I haven't really done any of the catwoman trophies because she isn't as fun to play as, but apparently they are optional.  I'm done with the other side quests except this and the identity theft. 

Btw... something I found out.....  When you pull up your map you can go to the ? menu to see how many riddles you have left in a particular area.  If you've completed an entire row (minus the catwoman bonus) you'll unlock an audio clip for one of the villians.  The odd thing is that these clips do NOT unlock unless you pull up the progress for that area. 

[Malenko]

I faintly remember liking the live action Flash, but I was 12 so theres that. I know hes been doing the voice for a LONG time, but never like this. I mean the joker doesnt sound like some comic book ---uvula--- or a cheap gag, it feels like it could be a real person doing all this, I was very impressed.

Do you think they modeled Bruce Wayne/Batman after George Clooney?

Also, if you wanna see a BAD superhero TV show, find the one episode pilot for Aquaman. Two words: Potassium Deficiency.

[Mikezilla]

I dont know if Im going to be able to watch anything with Mark Hamill not being the Joker anymore. Thats MY Joker. From Batman the animated series on, every time I think of the Joker, I think of his voice, and when its not him, it sucks. There was a DC movie called Under the Red Hood or something like that (it was on netflix) and Joe Dimaggio was the voice of the Joker, and it just fell flat. I just kept think "hey its bender being the Joker. This sucks." and I couldnt even get into it. The story was great, but man, when you mess with the voices that youre so accustomed to, its a bummer. 

Kevin Conroy is Batman. Plain and simple. I wish they would have dubbed his voice over Christian Bale's in the new Batman movies. 

[Howard_Casto]

I faintly remember liking the live action Flash, but I was 12 so theres that. I know hes been doing the voice for a LONG time, but never like this. I mean the joker doesnt sound like some comic book ---uvula--- or a cheap gag, it feels like it could be a real person doing all this, I was very impressed.

Do you think they modeled Bruce Wayne/Batman after George Clooney?
Also, if you wanna see a BAD superhero TV show, find the one episode pilot for Aquaman. Two words: Potassium Deficiency.

The voice he did on the animated series was very nuanced as well.  In more light-hearted episodes he was more manic, but when the action slowed down it was the same voice.  During his final appearances in that universe, particularly in the Batman Beyond:  Return of the Joker movie, he had gotten to the level that he uses for this game. 

Nah... he kinda looks like the Frank Miller batman.  IMHO he's a bit roided up for my taste, but then again so are all the villians. 

yeah Mike, Hamill pretty much IS the joker at this point.  I don't think it's nostalgia at all either.  Out of all the live action and voice over actors he is the only one that can make the Joker sound smart, goofy and scary all at once. 

Conroy cracks me up.  He's such a thin man and yet that voice comes out of him.  With Hamill you can see a little bit of the Joker in the way he looks, but conroy is NOTHING like Batman. 

I really wish they would have skipped the cruddy "gotham city is LA" batman films just did some really good animated movies based on the animated series.