Author Topic: Wells "P307" schematic needed (Read 8832 times)

Ken Layton · « **on:** August 09, 2006, 11:19:17 am »

I'm in need of a schematic to the Wells-Gardner "P307" video interface board used in the k4600 series monitors. I believe this schematic would have been in the 19k4606 manual (which is very hard to find and not part of the 4600 manuals available to download anywhere).

I have several of these boards and all of them appear to be hacked and each one hacked differently! I need the schematic to return them to original configuration.

SirPeale · « **Reply #1 on:** August 10, 2006, 08:02:01 pm »

*whew* Ken, I wish you the best of luck.

Try emailing both Bob Robers and Randy Fromm. You never know.

I'm sure you've already posted on RGVAC, yes?

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #2 on:** August 13, 2006, 03:32:43 pm »

I thought I had a lead on this for ya Ken, but it turns out the one I have is the typical P317.

But I did inquire with the guys at Wells.... not much help.... but one of them mentioned they thought the P307 was the same as the P306. (not that I've seen a schematic for one of those either)

I'd be interested if you do come across anything else though.

Ken Layton · « **Reply #3 on:** August 14, 2006, 10:54:02 am »

P306 and P307 are definitely not the same. I've done some more poking around and it appears that the P307 was originaly a "Positive sync only" board (one 6 pin connector) whereas the P306 accepts both positive and negative sync (two connectors, 6 pin and 3 pin).

The P306 schematic is on the big yellow 4600 foldout schematic included with Stern Scramble & Super Cobra games.

I see what someone was trying to do with these boards was to convert the P307 from positive sync only to composite negative sync for Jamma boards. They tried, but they ended up fu**ing it up. I think I'll convert one of these boards (the best looking one) back to original factory Positive Sync Only so that I can use it with my battery operated portable monitor pattern generator (the one that's just like the Wells-Gardner "Genie" unit). The other two boards I will convert (and do it right) to composite negative sync for use with Jamma gameboards/conversions.

Ken Layton · « **Reply #4 on:** August 14, 2006, 06:28:35 pm »

Here's some more info. P307 and P298 are electrically the same. Only difference being the pinout of the video/sync input connector.

I've converted two of these P307's into P302 for composite negative sync so they can be used with Jamma boards.

RetroACTIVE · « **Reply #5 on:** August 17, 2006, 08:11:32 am »

Ken,

I think that schematic is part of my Galaga documentation... I know it has both sets of "yellow fold out" schematics for a K4xxx and g07... let me check tonight to see... I could be wrong... you would know more.

- Jim

Ken Layton · « **Reply #6 on:** August 17, 2006, 10:50:45 am »

For anyone that's interested, the P305 and P308 schematics (board layout & parts list too) are included in the 13k4700 series manual.

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #7 on:** August 17, 2006, 01:06:31 pm »

Hey Ken... what would this INTERFACE BOARD be for the 4500 ?
(top right hand corner of schematic)
It only has a single sync input like what you were describing on the P307. But it doesn't distinguish - or + , etc. And it's not labeled with a P designation that I could see anywhere.

http://arcarc.xmission.com/PDF%20Monitors/Wells%20Gardner%20WG-K4500%20Schematic.pdf

Ken Layton · « **Reply #8 on:** August 17, 2006, 06:46:03 pm »

It would be similar to a P297 or P302 and it's a composite negative sync input.

RetroACTIVE · « **Reply #9 on:** August 17, 2006, 09:29:09 pm »

I checked, mine is not 307 its 317. The schematic is for K4625A,K4626A,K4675A-5816.

Its funny because the section of the schematic says "Interface Board 317"... but the parts list says interface board (P305) (Model 19K4604). Anwyay... what the heck do I know anyway

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #10 on:** August 18, 2006, 10:33:20 am »

Quote from: Ken Layton on August 17, 2006, 06:46:03 pm

It would be similar to a P297 or P302 and it's a composite negative sync input.

Theoretically, would bypassing that initial input sync circuit and adding a diode convert that one to composite positive?
(just curious, I was comparing the input on the sync circuit to a P317)
Or does the main chassis also determine what it will accept?

Ken Layton · « **Reply #11 on:** August 18, 2006, 10:52:10 am »

The video interface board determines the sync input to the main board. For positive sync the board has a diode for horiz sync and a diode for vert sync. Normally positive sync is seperate horiz and seperate vert sync, never combined.

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #12 on:** August 18, 2006, 11:02:47 am »

Gotcha... I noticed each had there own diodes on the 317, but didn't know if the positive composite was a possiblity on that single input type interface board.

So the 307 that you were looking for would be strictly a seperate positive input with no option for composite?

Ken Layton · « **Reply #13 on:** August 18, 2006, 06:56:08 pm »

Quote from: Kevin Mullins on August 18, 2006, 11:02:47 am

So the 307 that you were looking for would be strictly a seperate positive input with no option for composite?

That is correct.

DavidsGames · « **Reply #14 on:** August 23, 2006, 12:48:24 am »

I'm unsure if these people have it, but you may try calling P&L Video in Southern California. They have a listing of schematics on their computer that may be helpful. The owner is John.
626-968-2644

SirPeale · « **Reply #15 on:** September 21, 2007, 08:12:12 pm »

bumping this because I just ran across a K4613. It has a P307 interface board.

Couldn't get it to sync with my Arkanoid board (was using it to test) but after I swapped the P307 interface board with my P317 board it synced just fine.

What can I do with this board to get it to accept composite sync? The P317 is going back in the machine I took it from, and I think this K4613 is going into an Outrun machine. Either that or a Defender.

Ken Layton · « **Reply #16 on:** September 21, 2007, 08:58:15 pm »

I still have been unable to find the schematic to the P307 board.

SirPeale · « **Reply #17 on:** September 21, 2007, 09:23:02 pm »

I have what appears to be an unhacked one, want pics?

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #18 on:** September 22, 2007, 12:07:21 am »

Yes.... and um .... draw up some schematics too while you're at it.

(I haven't run across them either still)

SirPeale · « **Reply #19 on:** July 12, 2009, 09:32:02 am »

I forgot all about this until I stumbled upon it via a Google search. Still need that schematic, Ken?

Ken Layton · « **Reply #20 on:** July 12, 2009, 01:52:05 pm »

Yes, I do still need schematics for the P307.

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #21 on:** July 12, 2009, 08:41:54 pm »

Hey Peale..... what game was that Arkanoid originally that you found one of these in?
(with the K4613)

I have found obscure tidbits like this in game manuals before.
But unless you know a specific "separate positive sync" game from that era it's kinda a guessing game on which ones to look in.

SirPeale · « **Reply #22 on:** July 12, 2009, 09:15:00 pm »

It wasn't in an Arkanoid - I was using the Arkanoid to test.

I'm not sure which game it was in originally. It's been a couple years since I pulled the card out of the game it was in.

SirPeale · « **Reply #23 on:** July 15, 2009, 05:11:03 pm »

Hi-res photos. Linking from Photobook because they're too big for the site.

The last is a resistor I THINK is out of spec, but I'm having problems with the colors. Can someone ID it for me? Is it Black Blue Orange, or Brown Blue Orange?

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #24 on:** July 15, 2009, 08:14:21 pm »

Kinda hard to tell, I'd say it was black.
But that should be the tolerance band wouldn't it?
Does your reading closely match any color combinations values?

http://www.sizes.com/materls/resistorcolor.htm

SirPeale · « **Reply #25 on:** July 15, 2009, 08:54:47 pm »

I /think/ the fourth band (the one on the right end) is gold. I think. It's hard to tell, which is why I'm having trouble figuring out if this is bad or not.

If the first ring is black, it's a 6K resistor, and if it's brown it's 16K.

SirPeale · « **Reply #26 on:** July 15, 2009, 08:59:06 pm »

It may be brown. I'm getting 18K from it. And considering where this resistor is it's probably the reason I can't get this card to sync properly. That resistor connects right to the sync pin.

Anyone have a 16K 1/2W resistor kicking around? Of course I JUST placed a Mouser order. Never fails. And my junk pile doesn't have one.

SirPeale · « **Reply #27 on:** July 15, 2009, 09:45:53 pm »

Here's a parts list - hope this helps.

P307 Parts List

R201   91 - I think - missing band?
R203   1K
R204   100
R211   330
R212   330
R213   330
R214   150
R215   150
R216   150
R217   16K

TR201   F2N 3904
TR202   F2N 3904
TR204   FMPS A70
TR205   FMPS A70
TR206   FMPS A70
TR207   FMPS A20
TR208   FMPS A20
TR209   FMPS A20

X201   Can't read it
X202   Has 47K Resistor in this spot
      Diode without identification right below X202 - Can't read it.

ZD201   Can't read it
ZD202   Has "52" plus the Motorola symbol. Something else I can't read because it's on the bottom.

VR201   2.5K

C201   1000uf, 16V

Ken Layton · « **Reply #28 on:** July 15, 2009, 11:15:56 pm »

Your sync problem may be due to the fact that the P307 accepts positive sync only.

It would appear that the P307 and P298 cards are the same except for one difference: on the P307 card they use a 47k resistor instead of diode X202. They moved diode X202 to the empty (unmarked) space directly below diode X201 (same polarity as X201). on the 307 card, the 47k resistor is inserted into the horizontal sync circuit to cut the signal down slightly.

Here are some corrections/additions to your parts list for the P307 card:

R201 is a 91 ohm 1/2 watt resistor.

R203 is a 1k, 1/2 watt resistor.

R206 is a 330 ohm 1/2 watt resistor.

R217 is a 18 k, 1/2 watt resistor (brown-gray-orange).

ZD201 is a 1N5235B zener diode (6.8 volt, 1/2 watt)

ZD202 is a 1N5228B zener diode (3.9 volt, 1/2 watt)

X201 is a 1N4148 diode.

X202 is a 47 k resistor if a P307 card or a 1N4148 diode if a P298 card.

Diode below X201 on a P307 card is a 1N4148 diode.

Drop the "F" from the transistor number prefix. The "F" means it was made by Fairchild.

TR204 & TR207 control the red color.

TR205 & TR208 control the blue color.

TR206 & TR209 control the green color.

TR201 and TR202 control the black level.

SirPeale · « **Reply #29 on:** July 16, 2009, 07:04:59 am »

The middle stripe on R217 is definitely blue.

I knew that it only accepted positive sync. But doesn't Galaxian output positive sync?

Ken Layton · « **Reply #30 on:** July 16, 2009, 10:39:43 am »

It appears that Galaxian outputs composite negative sync.

SirPeale · « **Reply #31 on:** July 16, 2009, 11:10:22 am »

I can get it to sync with massive foldover if I tweak that (it's not a pot, a coil?) thing on the XY card. The one you need a screwdriver to access.

For ease, I guess I'll have to source another card. Preferably a P317.

Ken Layton · « **Reply #32 on:** July 17, 2009, 10:48:52 pm »

Conversion of a P307 from positive sync to negative sync. Pictures of the front & rear of the converted card and a closeup showing the two traces to cut and two jumper wires to add. Basically this makes a P307 (positive sync only) into a P302 (negative sync only).

Components needed:

(2) 1 k 1/4 watt resistors

(1) 100 ohm 1/4 watt resistor

(1) 1.5 k 1/4 watt resistor

(1) NTE123AP transistor or equivalent

The two diodes X201 and X202 are removed and not needed in the conversion. The 47k 1/4 watt resistor that was originally in the P307 card at location X202 is removed and not used.

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #33 on:** July 17, 2009, 11:36:38 pm »

Thanks Ken....

I'll have to dig some of mine out and see if I have any of these.

Ken Layton · « **Reply #34 on:** July 17, 2009, 11:56:00 pm »

Yup those are the spots for the jumpers and the cut traces. Thank you for putting the circles on the pictures.

SirPeale · « **Reply #35 on:** July 18, 2009, 09:30:50 am »

Excellent. Thanks Ken.

So what games output postive sync?

Ken Layton · « **Reply #36 on:** July 18, 2009, 10:52:29 am »

Defender for sure.

SirPeale · « **Reply #37 on:** July 18, 2009, 11:10:07 am »

Aha! Thanks. I've been going crazy trying to remember which game I got this out of. I'll have to put it back in there.

Ken Layton · « **Reply #38 on:** November 30, 2009, 02:47:28 am »

I still have not been able to find the P307 schematic.

qrz · « **Reply #39 on:** December 12, 2009, 09:50:49 pm »

pulled a print for a k4500 for a base line schematic.
there are minor differences between it and the above pictured P307.
r202,3,5,7,8,12. tr203 are omitted (pads/traces on pcb ). connectors P203,5 diff pin out
blocking diodes used on sync input

qrz

SirPeale · « **Reply #40 on:** December 12, 2009, 09:55:33 pm »

Quote from: Ken Layton on November 30, 2009, 02:47:28 am

I still have not been able to find the P307 schematic.

Even without an "official" schematic from WG it shouldn't be hard to draw them up, there aren't that many parts on board.

qrz · « **Reply #41 on:** December 13, 2009, 12:29:13 pm »

Quote from: SirPeale on December 12, 2009, 09:55:33 pm

Quote from: Ken Layton on November 30, 2009, 02:47:28 am
I still have not been able to find the P307 schematic.

Even without an "official" schematic from WG it shouldn't be hard to draw them up, there aren't that many parts on board.

yup , already done . see prev post


Main	Restorations	Software	Audio/Jukebox/MP3	Everything Else	Buy/Sell/Trade
Project Announcements	Monitor/Video	GroovyMAME	Merit/JVL Touchscreen	Meet Up	Retail Vendors
Driving & Racing	Woodworking	Software Support Forums	Consoles	Project Arcade	Reviews
Automated Projects	Artwork	Frontend Support Forums	Pinball	Forum Discussion	Old Boards
Raspberry Pi & Dev Board	controls.dat	Linux	Miscellaneous Arcade	Wiki Discussion	Old Archives
Lightguns	Arcade1Up	Try the site in https mode		Site News


Unread posts \| New Replies \| Recent posts \| Rules \| Chatroom \| Wiki \| File Repository \| RSS \| Submit news