Katrina Thread / New Orleans

[Stingray]

Then it still goes back to the original point as mentioned here before.


Acting like complete SAVAGES and HURTING your fellow man, while at the same time having the nerve to extend your hands in a desperate cry for help.

I think you're making the all too common mitake of confusing the people who need to be rescued with the crazies who are shooting at the resue workers. They are two distinct groups. One needs help, the other needs extermination.

Does ShapeD actually think all we had in Florida , were PAPERCUTS?

See now I think you are misinterpreting him. I'm certain that he was over exagerating to make a point.

-S

[Setabs]

Help us under stand TheVengeance.  What losses did you incur from the 4 hurricanes?  Who did you recieve water and food from?  Do you live in a home w/ insurance?  Do you have the means to be able to buy products once your arc reached dry land?

I think you may be missing the fact that these people that are in NO are the Poor who if they walked out couldn't have been able to by food or water before they reached a shelter.  They also are sick and elderly who can't help themselves let alone other people.

There ARE people from NO helping out other people.  Its just you not going to see it on the recap of the news at te end of the day because they think all anyone wants to here about is the lotters and rapists and murderers.

[Shape D.]

Actually you might want to re-read your post. I don't think you meant it that way, but using Shape D's analogy, you do sort of come off as saying that the papercut you got was just as bad as the guy who got his arm blown off and since you got over the papercut quickly, you don't understand what he's sniveling about. Again, I don't think you meant it that way, but that interpretation is there.

-S

Thats actually what both of these read like.

Brother, I had four , count them 1-2-3-4 hurricanes knocking on my front door last year, and you know what , I survived every damn one of them. And, I did it without raping, killing or looting! WE no sooner cleaned up from one, and another one got us , and so on & so on.

I still for the life of me, fail to see what makes New Orleans so much more valuable as a whole , compared to the hurricanes we had last year alone in Florida! 

And your point is?

Perhaps you're right, the lot of us here chose not to be victims and decided to do something about it.

So what about the sick and elderly. they don't have the pysical or monitary requirements needed to make it out of the city. before or after this happened.

That's like me telling a man who had an arm blown off in war that the paper cut I got last week at work hurt a lot and I know what he's going through.

Oh please, that's not what I'm saying at all. Try re-reading the post , SISTER !

Insults don't always work great when trying to prove your point. If you would like to inform me I am wrong feel free too correct me without resorting to an insult, and I will gladly lend you an ear.

[TheVengeance]

See now I think you are misinterpreting him. I'm certain that he was over exagerating to make a point.

-S

Well I wasn't exagerating! Florida was hit hard last year, and I defy someone to say different. That's all.

[Setabs]

The people doing these things(rapes, murders) are the same people that would have done it last week, two weeks and three months ago.  The difference no is their behavier has been unchecked for the last 4 days.

Some of these people are abviously not in the, I need to get out of town, state of mind.  Just think about it you house was destroyed or its under water why the hell do you need a tv ar 50 pairs of pants?  where are you going to put that?

[TheVengeance]

Help us under stand TheVengeance.

[Shape D.]

Does ShapeD actually think all we had in Florida , were PAPERCUTS? 

And who says we got over the PAPERCUT quickly? There are still parts of Florida rebuilding from last year's STORM(s).

No, I do not think Florida received "papercuts" from the storms last year. I do however think the amount of damage done to Florida isn't on the same level as the damage done to New Orleans. As stingray stated I exaggerated For the use of emphasis.

[Setabs]

Help us under stand TheVengeance. What losses did you incur from the 4 hurricanes? Who did you recieve water and food from? Do you live in a home w/ insurance? Do you have the means to be able to buy products once your arc reached dry land?

See now I think you are misinterpreting him. I'm certain that he was over exagerating to make a point.

-S

Well I wasn't exagerating! Florida was hit hard last year, and I defy someone to say different. That's all.

Thats why I was curious of you situations,  because not all of florida was hit evertime.  I am just trying to under stand where you are coming from.

how your posts have been going it does sound like the papercut comparison.

Thanks for replying, try not being an ass next time though.

[Arcadiac]

How about we channel all the energy and venom in this nasty, hateful thread into helping with the solution?

[Dartful Dodger]

Acting like complete SAVAGES and HURTING your fellow man, while at the same time having the nerve to extend your hands in a desperate cry for help.

Those that act that way, were like that before the hurricane, there are people like that in your city too.

[TheVengeance]

Okay Setabs, I SEE. You were just making a point, right ? Thank you anyway for your concern.

We all helped one another last year, everyone. Good thing you weren't part of it, or nothing would have been accomplished at all. I can tell from your attitude, just what kind of person you are in reality.

[Shape D.]

How about we channel all the energy and venom in this nasty, hateful thread into helping with the solution? 
Money sent to www.redcross.org , places to shelter the victims of this, the worst natural disaster in recent history, those are helpful solutions, not the hate-filled political backbiting going on here. 
For once, put aside the political bickering and blaming and be a part of the solution.  Blaming the victims is just plain stupid. 
This hurricane was not choosy about who it killed or made homeless or stranded. 
Put aside your prejudice and judgements and do something positive to help.
We can do so much better than this! 

Thanks! ARCADIAC!

See also:   http://www.hurricanehousing.org/ if you can help by sheltering someone in your home
and of course www.redcross.org

This is probably the smartest thing I've read in this entire thread.

Okay Setabs, I SEE. You were just making a point, right ? Thank you anyway for your concern.

We all helped one another last year, everyone. Good thing you weren't part of it, or nothing would have been accomplished at all. I can tell from your attitude, just what kind of person you are in reality.

Please read my above post. Its hard to take someone seriously when they resort to name calling.

[Setabs]

How about we channel all the energy and venom in this nasty, hateful thread into helping with the solution? 
Money sent to www.redcross.org , places to shelter the victims of this, the worst natural disaster in recent history, those are helpful solutions, not the hate-filled political backbiting going on here. 
For once, put aside the political bickering and blaming and be a part of the solution.  Blaming the victims is just plain stupid. 
This hurricane was not choosy about who it killed or made homeless or stranded. 
Put aside your prejudice and judgements and do something positive to help.
We can do so much better than this! 

Thanks! ARCADIAC!

See also:   http://www.hurricanehousing.org/ if you can help by sheltering someone in your home
and of course www.redcross.org

already donated, probably donate more later as a couple thousand people will need to find some sort of permenant housing in my area in the next couple of months.

There ya go we should start discussing what the most effective way to completely rebuild NO will be.  I go with a FDR/ Depression era work force of vast amount of people that where displaced by this.

this isn't political.  Its just a simple discussion.

[TheVengeance]

Thanks for replying, try not being an ass next time though.

WTF man ? What the hell do you even know about storms anyway? Ya ever been in anything outside of the sagebrush blowing like mad? I mean, seriously, Florida's only nice when you come see Disney , right? Everybody wants to move here, right?

If I wasn't an ASS, I'll sure as hell be one now.

[billf]

the most effective way to completely rebuild NO will be

On higher ground, further inland.  Or maybe not at all.

[Setabs]

Okay Setabs, I SEE. You were just making a point, right ? Thank you anyway for your concern.

We all helped one another last year, everyone. Good thing you weren't part of it, or nothing would have been accomplished at all. I can tell from your attitude, just what kind of person you are in reality.

See some people would get on a forum, say they've been through 4 hurricanes in florida. and be like "look at me I didn't have any trouble rebuilding I strated the next day." come to find out hey are in the area grazed or missed by the storms.

Now I know you did suffer from damages.

[Setabs]

the most effective way to completely rebuild NO will be

On higher ground, further inland.  Or maybe not at all.

The "not at all" isn't an option because its a large port and fast way for goods to travel out of and into americas heartland.  The way they rebuild the leeve's will make a big difference.

[billf]

the most effective way to completely rebuild NO will be

On higher ground, further inland.

[TheVengeance]

ARCADIAC is Right!

You can lose a lot of the translation when something's read as opposed to being spoken aloud.

Florida, New Orleans, it's all the same , right? WE BOTH suffered a great loss, so the only solution I see here, is this.

After we ( the people of S.Florida ) finish rebuilding parts of Florida that were hit the hardest by last years storms, then we ( the people of S. Florida ) can go help the unfortunate ones in New Orleans. That's only fair, right?

[JackTucky]

Don't be an ---auto-censored---. Noone is defending rapists here. This is just a huge strawman. Have you stopped beating your wife yet?

Are you sure no one here is defending rapists?  This goes back to my original post asking for Mr C. to blame the looters.  He wouldn't.  He blamed Bush.  Now the looters have formed armed roving gangs and are committing rapes.

I've seen some quotes here, like

"No one knows what they would do in this situation, it's never happened before"

Uh, yeah, I do know.  I'd do what it would take to keep my family alive, and if it was stealing, I would pay the consequences when the time came.  BUT, I would not break the law simply because I could get away with it.

Also, I would have done something for my family way before the hurricane.  I would have done whatever it took to NOT be poor.  Like I did when I WAS poor.  Like work lots of jobs.  Anytime, anywhere.  Oh, and I didn't have a family while I was poor, because I couldn't AFFORD one.

Thanks for the reply.  Not sure why you asked me about my wife.

Art

[Setabs]

Thanks for replying, try not being an ass next time though.

WTF man ? What the hell do you even know about storms anyway? Ya ever been in anything outside of the sagebrush blowing like mad? I mean, seriously, Florida's only nice when you come see Disney , right? Everybody wants to move here, right?

If I wasn't an ASS, I'll sure as hell be one now.

Reread you post to see were my comments came from.

Haven't been anything as bad as any hurricanes that have hit florida recently.  Was in one when I lived in Houston I am not sure what storm it was but all the ones at the time I was there were cat1.  I have also been in some serious thunderstorms that included tornados.  I was in the strom of the century.  But none off these time did I ever incur any loses.

Yes Florida is only nice for disney.

No I wouldn't move there because of the Hurricanes.
Unfortunatly for you, you are supposed to start seeing more at greater intesity. 
Either from global warming or from the cycles the Atlantic does naturally.  which ever you may believe in.

[Shape D.]

looters are not rapists. this may be supprising, but theres a difference.

[TheVengeance]

Thanks for replying, try not being an ass next time though.

WTF man ? What the hell do you even know about storms anyway? Ya ever been in anything outside of the sagebrush blowing like mad? I mean, seriously, Florida's only nice when you come see Disney , right? Everybody wants to move here, right?

If I wasn't an ASS, I'll sure as hell be one now.

Reread you post to see were my comments came from.

Haven't been anything as bad as any hurricanes that have hit florida recently.

[M3talhead]

I have been sickened by how quickly the "entitlement" population of N.O. has turned itself into a jungle society, trampling on the elderly and those who can't defend themselves.  I am also sickened by people who should behave better in the news media (CNN, FOX etc.) who spend more time and breath criticizing and second guessing the relief efforts than doing basic information distribution.  They (Miles O'Brien is a classic example) roll in in their air conditioned motor homes and satellite trucks and assume that because they got two or three vehicles in that the entire relief effort should be able to do the same.  They forget that the storm was over and the trucks were rolling towards N.O. when the levee system failed and the task changed from one of moving support materiel in to one of moving people out.  Further, the very road system that would normally permit fast response is under water hindering movement in either direction.

You know, I lived there for 10 years and it was clear that the culture of South Louisiana was one of take and take (natural resources, government handouts, the bounty of the delta) and put nothing back.  I remember Ducks Unlimited video of south Louisiana hunters using automatic weapons to slaughter geese in rice paddies at a time when folks in the Prairie Pothole region of the upper mid-west were trying to nurture declining populations of geese before they made their annual migrations south.  People from outside the state were appalled; locals shrugged their shoulders and moved on.

St. Tammany Parish (Mandeville, Covington, Slidell) has a large population of folks from outside the state who felt the same way.  I have been asked several times whether I miss south Louisiana and to them my answer has been no.  I have learned never to say never but it is unlikely that I'd ever go back. I have friends who essentially said the same and believe (like me) that it would be a mistake for our federal government to rebuild NO as it was.  Something will have to be rebuilt but why would anyone invest billions of dollars in a hole next to the Gulf of Mexico?

The city's motto is let the good times roll.  Don't worry about or plan for the future, don't build a strong education system and certainly don't help yourself.  Go ahead and drain more marshes and build more subdivisions at or below sea level.  Cut channels directly from the Gulf of Mexico into the heart of the very marshes that buffer the cities from the Gulf which permits salt water incursion to kill the marsh.  Don't let the Mississippi River replenish the marshes with silt and natural build-up because it might flood some of those subdivisions that don't belong in a flood plain.  Then, when the worst of the inevitable happens, cry, and chant "we need help" and let blowhards like Sharpton and Jackson rave about the injustice of the "system".

Thanks for letting me vent!

[Setabs]

Don't be an ---auto-censored---. Noone is defending rapists here. This is just a huge strawman. Have you stopped beating your wife yet?

Now the looters have formed armed roving gangs and are committing rapes.

Damn sounds like a something straight from an ill informed journalist.

I am guessing most of the rapes are happening in the midst of people getting help at different places.

The looters i would think are not at these places they are wondering the streets.

the gangs are also wandering the streets.


Unfortunately there are a small percentage of poor that for some reason do not wish to better there lives or that of they immediate family. its do to drug abuse, mental stability or just plain american laziness

[Setabs]

I have been sickened by how quickly the "entitlement" population of N.O. has turned itself into a jungle society, trampling on the elderly and those who can't defend themselves.  I am also sickened by people who should behave better in the news media (CNN, FOX etc.) who spend more time and breath criticizing and second guessing the relief efforts than doing basic information distribution.  They (Miles O'Brien is a classic example) roll in in their air conditioned motor homes and satellite trucks and assume that because they got two or three vehicles in that the entire relief effort should be able to do the same.  They forget that the storm was over and the trucks were rolling towards N.O. when the levee system failed and the task changed from one of moving support materiel in to one of moving people out.  Further, the very road system that would normally permit fast response is under water hindering movement in either direction.

You know, I lived there for 10 years and it was clear that the culture of South Louisiana was one of take and take (natural resources, government handouts, the bounty of the delta) and put nothing back.  I remember Ducks Unlimited video of south Louisiana hunters using automatic weapons to slaughter geese in rice paddies at a time when folks in the Prairie Pothole region of the upper mid-west were trying to nurture declining populations of geese before they made their annual migrations south.  People from outside the state were appalled; locals shrugged their shoulders and moved on.

St. Tammany Parish (Mandeville, Covington, Slidell) has a large population of folks from outside the state who felt the same way.  I have been asked several times whether I miss south Louisiana and to them my answer has been no.  I have learned never to say never but it is unlikely that I'd ever go back. I have friends who essentially said the same and believe (like me) that it would be a mistake for our federal government to rebuild NO as it was.  Something will have to be rebuilt but why would anyone invest billions of dollars in a hole next to the Gulf of Mexico?

The city's motto is let the good times roll.  Don't worry about or plan for the future, don't build a strong education system and certainly don't help yourself.  Go ahead and drain more marshes and build more subdivisions at or below sea level.  Cut channels directly from the Gulf of Mexico into the heart of the very marshes that buffer the cities from the Gulf which permits salt water incursion to kill the marsh.  Don't let the Mississippi River replenish the marshes with silt and natural build-up because it might flood some of those subdivisions that don't belong in a flood plain.  Then, when the worst of the inevitable happens, cry, and chant "we need help" and let blowhards like Sharpton and Jackson rave about the injustice of the "system".

Thanks for letting me vent!

Didn't NO have one of the most corrupt PD's?

I could understand why fox and other news agencies can't start handing stuff out.  They would simpley run out of supplies and at worst start a riot within 30min.  I have seen on fox and abc them help out.  the guy from the studio b show his crew gave ice and water to a few people that would come up and those in desperate need.  On ABC they where driving around town and came across two men that had two elderly people in boats and begged ABC to take them to a place where they would get picked up.

I watched part of the Black caucas try and turn the lack of relief in to a prejudice issue against elderly, poor and blacks.  That is just sad.

[billf]

I watched part of the Black caucas try and turn the lack of relief in to a prejudice issue against elderly, poor and blacks.

[Stingray]

Didn't NO have one of the most corrupt PD's?

I do believe they have that reputaion, but how much basis that has in fact I have no idea. I did hear one news report about police officers going to a supply room in the PD where disaster relief supplies were supposed to have been stored. There was nothing there. Apparantly everything had been either taken or sold by police officials before the hurricane ever happened.

-S

[fredster]

I'm sure we'll see a lot of stories in the next few weeks.  This will be studied for years to come.

But right now we have got to remember we are the United States of America. We hold together in a crisis.  We have got to be unified behind the people comming in to help these people.

We'll have to decide if NO will be rebuilt later.  We have to make sure that we help those US citizens to the fullest extent we can and Soon.

It's a national disgrace what's happening there.  The local government, state government, and federal government seem overwhelmed by it.  There's no "nerve" center being setup. Fingers are being pointed so early in the game.  It's unreal.

We don't have time to worry about the scum.  I say save 100 scum if only one of them is worth saving.  We need to make sure that this disaster is addressed NOW.  Call your law makers, give to the red cross, ask your boss if he'll help somehow.

Band together and judge these people later.  It's not their fault.  Not a single one of these people were alive in 1718 when they started that city.  Not a single one of them contributed to the engineering of the levees.  None of them wrote the hurricane relief plans we see in "action" now.

[Stingray]

Fredster, I never thought I'd say this, but I agree with every word in your last post.

-S

[fredster]

Then there is hope for you yet 

[Stingray]

Then there is hope for you yet 

Funny, I was just thinking the same about you.

-S

[TheVengeance]

This one just ran through the office wire, some of you might enjoy it. Just thought I'd share.

[fredster]

And he's in Indiana....

[JackTucky]

And he's in Indiana....

No, but I am....

[JCL]

Don't be an ---auto-censored---. Noone is defending rapists here. This is just a huge strawman. Have you stopped beating your wife yet?

Are you sure no one here is defending rapists?

[mr.Curmudgeon]

This goes back to my original post asking for Mr C. to blame the looters.  He wouldn't.

JackTucky,

As JCL mentioned, you obviously haven't read what I wrote. Go back and try again.



mrC

[Dexter]

Fredster, I never thought I'd say this, but I agree with every word in your last post.

-S

Yeah, I know wha you mean stingray. Scary isn't it?

Well said Fredster. Hit nail on head

[Grasshopper]

Fredster, I never thought I'd say this, but I agree with every word in your last post.

-S

That's weird, so do I.

Strange times indeed.

[JCL]

Things are way worse than admitted here. Apparently the people in the Superdome AREN'T EVEN ALLOWED TO WALK AWAY!

And people are being turned back WHEN THEY TRY TO LEAVE THE AREA!

All you people who say "I'd walk out" are just ignorant of the facts on the ground. This is from Fox News: http://s30.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=1VGIKB6GMH0670TVAQ6ELSB3LI.


And Relief Organizations aren't allowed into the city to do their job: http://www.redcross.org/faq/0,1096,0_682_4524,00.html#4524.

And the local authorities asked for help even before the storm: http://gov.louisiana.gov/Disaster%20Relief%20Request.pdf

And yes, the poor are helped last as people of means jump the queue for evacuation: http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050903/ap_on_re_us/katrina_superdome_hk1

This is sick and all you people blaming the victims are seriously deluded.