New car advice

[DemonBrew]

I'm selling my current car with the intent to lease a new car for two years, maybe three. My criteria are: manual transmission, good gas mileage, 4 doors. Anything else is "want" versus "need" like a 6 cd changer. I have a toddler, so I need it to be safe and easy to put a car seat in.

I've got it narrowed down to the Mazda 3, Toyota Matrix, Suzuki Forenza, Mitsubishi Lancer.

The Mazda 3 is getting great reviews, but doesn't have as great a crash test rating as the Matrix.

Does anyone already own these cars? Anything else you can suggest?

[Trenchbroom]

Well, you might consider the Scion xB.  Got a lot going for it IF you can get used to the appearance:

Manual tranny gets me 30/35 MPG.  Just enough pep to put a drop of fun in the daily drive--won't give you barrels of laughs like the Mazda3 though.

Pretty loaded as standard equipment--comes with everything you would want from a vehicle for under $15K except cruise and a sunroof.  PS, PL, PW, PM, A/C, 6 speaker Pioneer system w/ MP3, keyless entry. 

Flat rate "no haggle" pricing, just like a Saturn.

MASSIVE headroom--I'm 6'7" and as soon as I sat in the car I was SOLD!  More headroom than a Suburban in fact.  Also a ton of legroom as well, especially in the back seat (go sit in one and you will find out).

Safety--you get ABS standard.  Not only that but you get both traction control AND electronic stability control as standard equipment (no other car on the market that has electronic stability control for under $25K).  As for crash tests...haven't been tested by the NHTSA yet.  But the tests from Japan are all great (vehicle has been for sale in Japan for 6 years now).

Best of all...it's a Toyota.  Which means low lease rates because they hold their value like nothing else.

You get a lot of bang for the buck.  And the look grows on you I swear... 

[DemonBrew]

I was starting to look at the Scion tC, until I realized it was only a 2 door. It sure looks like a 4 door sedan at first.

Yeah, that lunchbox look is tough to swallow. I'm pretty sure I'm going with a Toyota Matrix at this point. Out of the cars I've looked at, had the higest safety rating and best gas mileage.

Thanks for the tip, I'll research it a bit further.

[Stingray]

IMO leasing a car is like tossing money into the toilet, unless you need a business write off. Why would you pay for a car for three years and then give it away?

-S

[Sephroth57]

the best thing to do is buy a 2-3 year old car thats just been sitting on the lot. You can find a nice 2003 that just never got sold with like 5-6K chopped off the price just cause its not BRAND new

[Scott84]

I would go with a used Honda Accord.

We have two at my house and they are fairly good on gas and dont have any problems.

Im sure you can find a used one from 2002-2003 for a fairly great price.

[DemonBrew]

IMO leasing a car is like tossing money into the toilet, unless you need a business write off. Why would you pay for a car for three years and then give it away?

-S

I've thought the same thing for the past 15 years now, and I would normally agree with you. However, my last car I traded in and got $980 for it. Yes it was 6 years old, and served its purpose. I'm about to sell/trade in my 99 Chrylser Concorde now, and all a dealer is going to give me is about $1200. I can sell it myself for at least twice that.

Point is, it's not much of an asset if it doesn't hold its value is it? If I'm going to pay something like $275 - $300 a month on a car, who cares if I'm able to sell it for $980 at the end of the day? I might as well have a car that's always under warrantee (every 3 years), and I have something new every three years. I'm not paying any less.

It only works out if you can get some use out of the car for more than the years you're paying for it. I don't know about you, but I find fewer and fewer cars are economically viable past the 5 year loan. Or maybe it's just because I've been so used to American made cars?

As far as buying used - I got the Concorde used with no warrantee. Since then , the engine has already been replaced, the transmission has been rebuilt (and still has problems), the brakes and rotors are a constant problem. I'm just tired of throwing money away no matter what. Maybe I need to fix my 10 speed? 

Not trying to argue, I'm having a hard time making a decision (hence the 'new car advice' title).

[hyiu]

yes, buying a car is only worth it if you keep it more than 6 yrs...

and that also means, you do need to spend some $$ to maintain the car, but you drive it till it dies... basically not much resale value...

I would say... consider a Japanese car... Honda, Toyota...
(I donno about Mazda...)

they should last quite long... 10+ yrs...
that will make your $$ worth it...

I'm sure there're other strategies other people use...
so, take mine at your own risk...

[Sephroth57]

i dunno what you guys are doing wrong, i have a 95 Eclipse GSX that i could sell for at least 6-7K right now, has 95k miles on it, runs strong as anything. You guys gotta stop buying american cars =p

[Scott84]

I would probably never buy an american car. American cars are trying to be more japanese like with each newer model they put out.

The fact is, you cant beat the quality of Japanese cars.

My friend has a 92 Honda Accord at 560,000 KM. Runs smoothly still!

[CheffoJeffo]

I think the best advice you can get, if you are looking for value for the money, is to buy used and find yourself a really good, trustworthy mechanic.

After buying used while in university, and not getting great value (repair issues ... I didn't do a good job and didn't know much about cars back then), I bought a shiny new Acura Integra SE upon graduation. I loved that car and never had any major problems (finally gave it up for scrap last month after 15 years ... and it had been hit 3 times), but I know I lost about $6-7K of value within the first few months of ownership (and that's a lot of cabs!).

Now I am wiser (and older, but we'll let that pass) and just ask my mechanic to keep an eye out for cars when I am looking to replace. I have bought the last two like that (last one actually belonged to my mechanic), paid cash and have had virtually no problems other than the expected wear and tear.

An alternative is to buy used with warranty, which I did when I bought my Jimmy long ago ... warranty didn't do me much good as the old Jimmy's were solid as heck, but did lend some piece of mind at the time.

Good luck with the purchase / lease.

Cheers.

[quarterback]

I was starting to look at the Scion tC, until I realized it was only a 2 door. It sure looks like a 4 door sedan at first.

Yeah, that lunchbox look is tough to swallow. I'm pretty sure I'm going with a Toyota Matrix at this point.

I just bought a Scion xA.

[rohan]

IMO leasing a car is like tossing money into the toilet, unless you need a business write off. Why would you pay for a car for three years and then give it away?

-S

I've thought the same thing for the past 15 years now, and I would normally agree with you. However, my last car I traded in and got $980 for it. Yes it was 6 years old, and served its purpose. I'm about to sell/trade in my 99 Chrylser Concorde now, and all a dealer is going to give me is about $1200. I can sell it myself for at least twice that.

Point is, it's not much of an asset if it doesn't hold its value is it? If I'm going to pay something like $275 - $300 a month on a car, who cares if I'm able to sell it for $980 at the end of the day? I might as well have a car that's always under warrantee (every 3 years), and I have something new every three years. I'm not paying any less.

It only works out if you can get some use out of the car for more than the years you're paying for it. I don't know about you, but I find fewer and fewer cars are economically viable past the 5 year loan. Or maybe it's just because I've been so used to American made cars?

As far as buying used - I got the Concorde used with no warrantee. Since then , the engine has already been replaced, the transmission has been rebuilt (and still has problems), the brakes and rotors are a constant problem. I'm just tired of throwing money away no matter what. Maybe I need to fix my 10 speed?

Not trying to argue, I'm having a hard time making a decision (hence the 'new car advice' title).

Damn,  you can get a LOT more from the dealer if you just haggle a little.  I traded in my old 81 Volkswagen Rabbit Convertible piece of crap and they said they'd only give me 300 for it.  Buy the end of the transaction I was able to get the guy up to 1500 and to throw in a passive alarm and 6-disc changer...Granted, I did buy a 2k1 Zx2, but it was only 9800 brand new.

[clanggedin]

Most dealerships have 2K-4K profit in a vehicle. Some dealerships will always have a "pack" which is what they can discount the car to and still cover their butt. I you haggle the price then don;t count on them adding any additional accessories in your car. They will usually only do one of the other, not both.

As for leasing... Why make payments for a car you pay neraly MSRP for then are only allowed to drive it a cretain amount of miles per year until your lease is up, then you have to return the car and get another one.

You can buy a used "nearly new" car for thousands less, that can still be under warranty and still trade it in before is goes out of warranty and do the same thing with another car. Don't buy a GM vehicle, they are in trouble and the market is horrible on them right now. Get a Hyundai, or a foreign vehicle that either has a huge warranty or holds the value alot longer like a Toyota, Honda or Nissan.

I work for one of the lragest used car dealerships in Uth and know the biz quite well.

Selling your car on your own will get you the most out it. Don't and sell it for Kelly or NADA retail. You'll be sitting on your car for awhile unless it is an older vehicle that is in good shape with lower miles (95' and older). Sell it for mid-book. The online NADA and Kelly books are updated quarterly online, whereas the NADA prices change monthly. If it's close to the end of the quarter wait and price it at the beginnig so you will know the closest values for your vehicle.

I only keep cars for a year or two before I trade it back in. I never by a new year car becuase there is no used book value on it. I always by a year older car that I know I can get for mid-low book or under.

If I had to choose between the vehicles you picked I would choose the Matrix. In 2003 Suzuki began offering a transferrable 100,000 mile warranty on their vehicles and you can't really go wrong with that choice, but the Toyota holds it value better.

If I had to pick a car in that price range I would get a Hyundai Sonata. JD Powers rates them equal in reliability to Honda and you can get a loaded Sonata LX-V6 for the same price as the others. They also have a 100,000 mile warranty that is transferrable starting in 2004.

Mazda is owned by Ford and uses Ford parts, the only thing that is Japanese it the name. Lancers are good fine, but you don't get the warranty like you get with a Suzuki or Hyundai.

Sorry if it sounds like I jumped on the Hyundai bandwagon. We are selling these 3 more than any other make on our lot and we have about 15 Hyundais out of about 100 sedans on our lot.

[DrewKaree]

I'm certainly against buying an American car.....such as a Honda or a Toyota and would definitely buy a nice foreign car....such as a Chevy or a Cadillac.

Did anyone ragging on "American" cars notice anything in those words up there?  I wonder where Sephroth's "foreign" car was made, or what, specifically, makes a car "American" or "foreign".  When those things can be explained, which would require a look into an effed up way of labeling things, let me know.  I've been wondering this for a while now.

I'll stick to bashing manufacturers, such as Pontiac - We Build Frustration^TM

I dunno, it just seems to me that leasing a car for 6 years vs buying a new car and owning it for 6 years, the lease will end up costing you more over that time span.  You'll have to excuse me though.  I haven't paid more than $2000 for a car in over 8 years, and don't plan to do so for at least another 4-8 years.  I HAVE been given 2 cars that would have definitely gone over that mark, but not by much, and I wouldn't have bought them anyway. 

At those prices, cars are almost disposable, although depending on your area (such as Chad's region) the car you'll get for that amount may not be something you would want.  I loved my Suburban....and if you've seen Paige's pics of it, you'll understand that I don't buy a car for its looks....but if Paige didn't need a car, I'd prolly still own it.  You can judge for yourself if you'd be happy with that car, then judge me

[Sephroth57]

yeah actually my car was made in  IL , japanese in design though =)   the 4g63 engine has been used for over 10-15 years now ever since their first EVOs. great engine I love it

[DemonBrew]

Great info from everyone, thanks. I'm no closer to a decision... but hey! 

I used to have a Plymouth Laser (aka Mitsubishi Eclipse, Eagle Talon). It was 90% made by Mitsubishi, and I got about 140,000 miles on it before I sold it, and at a nice price.

I just want that again - something I don't "feel" is a waste of money. Dropping in a rebuild engine and a rebuilt trans; replacing the rotors every year, etc - not my idea of a good time.

[Sephroth57]

did you check out WRXs?   i hate to say it but for "normal" people, a good honda is great and they have high resale value. like an accord or civic

[Stingray]

I dunno, it just seems to me that leasing a car for 6 years vs buying a new car and owning it for 6 years, the lease will end up costing you more over that time span.  You'll have to excuse me though.  I haven't paid more than $2000 for a car in over 8 years, and don't plan to do so for at least another 4-8 years.  I HAVE been given 2 cars that would have definitely gone over that mark, but not by much, and I wouldn't have bought them anyway. 

Yes indeed. As a matter of fact, almost every car I've ever owned was worth significantly more when I sold it than when I bought it. Classic cars are where it's at. They only go up in value, and they're simple enough that nearly anyone with a little mechanical know how can do the maintenance and upkeep on them.  I've only ever bought one car new, and that was a 1998 Explorer, and I bought that for my wife. It's been paid off for ages, still runs like new, still looks great and I expect I could sell it for $5000-$6000 if I chose to do so.

Those of you who don't expect a car to last ten years are not taking proper care of your car any car can last ten years with routine maintenance. Most will last 20 years or longer if properly taken care of. If you don't take care of your car you deserve to own a POS.

-S

[slayj]

I echo the remakes made by most here, however, if you are looking for new I have a Mazda 3 about a year old and love it.  Probably one of my favorite owned cars...........

[DemonBrew]

Those of you who don't expect a car to last ten years are not taking proper care of your car any car can last ten years with routine maintenance. Most will last 20 years or longer if properly taken care of. If you don't take care of your car you deserve to own a POS.

-S

I agree - but that's not my case. My dad owns an auto body shop, I've been fixing cars since I was 13 years old (20 years now). I change my own oil, tires, spark plugs, belts, brakes, rotors.. you name it, I've done it. I think I've just had a run of bad luck, especially with this Concorde. My dad and I did all the labor on the rebuilt engine replacement. I am fanatical about taking car of cars, I guess that's why I am so peeved that I have to do something about my current POS.

I have a 1 year old, so I have a lot less free time. I need a reliable car with a warranty that gets good gas mileage.

[Stingray]

Interesting coincidence. My dad also owns an auto body shop and I've also been working on cars since I was about 12 or 13. I'm 35 now, though. I did it professionally for many years, but I finally wised up and got a cushy air conditioned office job.

-S