F911

[Floyd10]

lol. Thats funny that they should talk about that...

[allroy1975]

ugh...
I just have a few things to say and I'll try to get them out quick before I forget them.  

On how Moore must know that no one can sign up their kids...
Of course you can't sign other people up for the army.  IMMEDIATLY after that bit, he made his point VERY clear.  That the poor people in this country who are constantly $hit on are the first to sign up to defend it, while the people who make billions running it into the ground get to sit in their homes and watch it on TV.

On not paying him to make more movies.....
Seeing his movie cost me $8 per ticket.  Plus I had a soda..so lets see...it was me and my girlfriend and we split a medium soda.... 8+8+3.5 =$19.50  I'm not too good at math so someone might want to check me on that.  Oh, and how much is this war costing me?  can I stop paying the government to make more mistakes?  I'd rather give Moore $20 every year and be done with it.

I also thought BFC was much better than F911.  Of course...I'm a big fan of Canada (you know...for inventing hockey and that totally sweet accent, eh?).  Maybe because it didn't really answer anything.  Just asked a lot of really thought provoking questions.  

in Bowling for Columbine when he deliberately misrepresented himself to gain access to Charlton Heston's home only to start showing him pictures of dead kids and say, "What do you have to say about this?"  

uhh...didn't he go up to the house, state his name, and what he does for a living?  he said he was a member of the NRA.  "Mr. heston?  this is Michael Moore, the film maker"  goes on to say he's a member of the NRA and he's making a documentery on the "whole gun issue".  Damn liar!  that's not what he was doing at all, how dare he misrepresent himself like that!  He did go in and talk about gun issues.  He asked the same questions of Heston that he asked of everyone else in the movie.  Heston looked like a horses ass.  It's nice to see someone who can get to someone like Heston to say "WHY THE F*** WOULD YOU DO THIS???" and have them basicly say "because I'm a horse's ass" not by what they say, but by how they act.  I mean seriously...do you feel sorry for Dick Clark?  all he had to do was say "I'm not familliar with the situation that happened there, allow me to do some research and I'll get back to you."  Instead he acted like the biggest ---tallywhacker--- on the planet.  But let's blame Moore.

And the whole thing about people bashing him and saying he's "Un-American".....something tells me they don't think Rush Limbaugh is Un-American.  what about the whole Ken Star thing?  jesus christ..the guy (Clinton) got a blow job.  Good for him.  I've had them too, and to this day I have a hard time turning them down.  Don't tell anyone, but sometime I'll actually request it.  

Sure clinton cheated on his wife and lied about it..blah blah blah...Go Lakers....whatever hypocrites.

Allroy

BTW, I know nothing.  I don't claim to know anything.  Especially about politics.  This is just what is left after the jedi mind tricks.

[Magnet_Eye]

Nice post allroy.. it's funny. today a bunch of my friends came for a BBQ (being the 4th and all) and sure enough the F911 thing came up. Some of my friends are democrats, and some republicans. The republicans all tend to be conservative and the demos liberal.

Anyway, sure enough the republican/conservatives start bashing the film, saying it's packed full of lies and all that. Then we say, OK. have you actually SEEN the movie? LMAO, of course only one guy out of the bunch actually saw it! Man, some people need to STFU! these foolish republican conservative morons just constantly bash everything free and good without ever even seeing or understanding it! WTF is that about!? At least we "liberals" go and watch movies and read books and research before we start judging things we know little about. ARGH! It pisses me off!

Hey, I am an atheist but I own a King James bible. a copy of the Qur'an, the Tanakh (judaism),  the Rig Veda (hinduism), the Dhammapada (buddhism), and a whole list of others. I do not go making claims or talk any crap about someones religion before first comprehending it myself.

Sorry.  

[DrewKaree]

Hey, I am an atheist but I own a King James bible. a copy of the Qur'an, the Tanakh (judaism),  the Rig Veda (hinduism), the Dhammapada (buddhism), and a whole list of others. I do not go making claims or talk any crap about someones religion before first comprehending it myself.

so, to clarify, you are saying a political view is (or equates to) a religion    or was that thrown in there for the "comprehending it myself" point.  If that's the case, I think you should reconsider your point, as anyone who believes in those religions would tell you it will take a lifetime to truly comprehend.  What you are referring to is a basic comprehension of the tenets, which is akin to saying "I understand how a refrigerator works because when I plug it in, it gets cold".  

Just asking, because it seems to come out of left field relating to the point of The Movie

[SirPeale]

He's saying that he doesn't believe in these things, and has read the books to have his opinion.

[DrewKaree]

well, it isn't exactly brainwashing. no one was forced to watch it, and it does bring up interesting arguments. If you watched someone play a video game, and it looked cool, are they brainwashing you? no.

To quote from Webster's New World Dictionary

Brainwash: to teach a set of ideas to so thoroughly as to change a person's beliefs and attitudes completely.

doesn't seem to me that the definition of the word brings up the "forced to watch" idea at all.  I wasn't privy to every minute of their club activities, but it didn't seem to me that Jonestown, Waco, or the Heaven's Gate people were forced to do anything, right?  Convincing, engaging, personable people don't need to force someone to do or believe what they want them to...it happens every day on both sides of the aisle as well as the side alleys splitting off the main aisles.

[DrewKaree]

He's saying that he doesn't believe in these things, and has read the books to have his opinion.

I'll leave it to him to clarify, but if, as you state it, that's what he means, that's fine.  That being said, it's what others are referring to here as his slant and misrepresentation of both facts and truth.

If an atheist would read such books to form an opinion, would the opinion not be that all religions are wrong?  That is, by definition, what an atheist believes, correct?  Therefore, the opinion would have to be based around the basic premise that anyone believing in a religion are putting faith in something that doesn't exist.

All this talk has made me further want to accidentally walk into his movie...I may do so today.

And for the record, if you don't like the movie and what it stands for but haven't seen it, it doesn't disqaulify you from commenting on it, it just makes your opinion slanted and void to some, and good reading to others.

[blue]

If an atheist would read such books to form an opinion, would the opinion not be that all religions are wrong?  That is, by definition, what an atheist believes, correct?  Therefore, the opinion would have to be based around the basic premise that anyone believing in a religion are putting faith in something that doesn't exist.

I believe an atheist is someone who denies the existence of a God, not someone who things Religion is wrong. Two different things.

And one can believe in the basis of a religion but not believe in its God. i.e: the ten commandments. You can follow them and thing they are common sense but not believe in 'The Load All Mighty" Therefore if someone believes in a Religion they are putting faith in a God that doesn't exist.

[DrewKaree]

I believe an atheist is someone who denies the existence of a God, not someone who things Religion is wrong. Two different things.

if someone denies the existence of a God, then how could any religion be right?  To worship a higher power would make that higher power a God.

As for the movie, I've now seen it.  If you are a fan of Mr Moore's, then you will undoubtedly find this movie to be entertaining and thought-provoking.  If you are not a fan of Mr Moore's, then you will undoubtedly find this movie to be an utter waste of a few hours of your life, money, and energy needed to view it.  My only response to it is to not wish to say anything more on it to want someone else to see what all the hubbub is about.

A documentary, this is not, but entertainment, it is, just as Rush Limbaugh is listened to for entertainment purposes....either you believe him and cheer at your radio or you despise him and hurl things at your radio.

[Floyd10]

DrewKaree-Wild tangent man.

Lol, jk, but What I meant was, no one was guilted into seeing it. MM didn't go to every town calling himself 'Bo' and said, you can come and you may enjoy it, then tell everyone, if you go tell us why. I dunno if that's what heaven's gate did, but it was on the simpsons. And that definition of Brainwashing seems to be a synonym with Propoganda... similair? yes... the same? no

[blue]

I believe an atheist is someone who denies the existence of a God, not someone who things Religion is wrong. Two different things.

if someone denies the existence of a God, then how could any religion be right?  To worship a higher power would make that higher power a God.

Could someone not believe in a Religion's ideology but not the "God" for which it is supposedly created under?
As per something like the Ten Commandments, like is stated before: Don't kill, don't lie, don't cheat

[DrewKaree]

but this is far from the topic of this thread...

yeah, but political threads here are often far off topic.  I've seen that it makes no difference if you are the one trying to keep it on track or the one taking it off track.  It's just us here making comments and having discussion that might be taboo in "polite society" nowadays...things we might think our friends would look at us differently if we said them aloud....meh.

Could someone not believe in a Religion's ideology but not the "God" for which it is supposedly created under?
As per something like the Ten Commandments, like is stated before: Don't kill, don't lie, don't cheat

[tep0583]

I had my choice of fiction to watch over the weekend and I decided on Spiderman 2.

I have no regrets whatsoever about my decision.

[blue]

I had my choice of fiction to watch over the weekend and I decided on Spiderman 2.
I have no regrets whatsoever about my decision.

Oh please no... thats a whole other 2 page thread....

[DrewKaree]

2 pages...pheh, you underestimate us  

Let's start with....is Spideman worthy of being called a super-hero, and defend your answer.

And....what's the deal with his web-slinging apparatus?  Where is the web-goo reservoir? (DON"T tell me it's in his pants! )

and....where can I find a girlfriend that dumb (see also, Lois Lane) who doesn't realize her man is leading a double life performing heroic feats around the city?

How's that for a start?

[Sasquatch!]

Some of my friends are democrats, and some republicans. The republicans all tend to be conservative and the demos liberal.

My goodness, you don't say!!

[Dartful Dodger]

DrewKaree, are you really Michael Moore?  Besides being a fat guy in glasses, your telling lies that are influencing the people who are to lazy to look up the real facts.
 

And....what's the deal with his web-slinging apparatus?  Where is the web-goo reservoir? (DON"T tell me it's in his pants! )

In the movie the webs are shooting out of wrists naturally, not from a web slinger.

and....where can I find a girlfriend that dumb (see also, Lois Lane) who doesn't realize her man is leading a double life performing heroic feats around the city?

In the movie she does suspect he's Spiderman.
In the comic book she knows he's Spiderman, marries him and has his baby.

[blue]

In the movie she does suspect he's Spiderman.
In the comic book she knows he's Spiderman, marries him and has his baby.

Do you collect the comics?
Whatever happened to this kid? Is it a mutant?
I use to collect but then comics got way too$$$$and stopped just before their kid was introduced.
And now build arcade CP's... and that not expensive

[SirPeale]

They did a spin off series set in the near future, called "Spider-Girl" or something like that.  In it she has his powers.

[Chris]

say, anyone here see Wag the dog?

Yeah wasn't that later renamed "The Bill Clinton Story" ?

And I was going to stay out of this....

The conservatives claimed that Clinton's missile strike against bin Laden in Afghanistan was a "wag the dog" to distract the nation from Monica.  Later, they blamed him for not going further with it and letting him get away.  I understand they all hate the man, but pick something and stick to it....

[Floyd10]

welcome to my world

[DrewKaree]

And I was going to stay out of this....

The conservatives claimed that Clinton's missile strike against bin Laden in Afghanistan was a "wag the dog" to distract the nation from Monica.  Later, they blamed him for not going further with it and letting him get away.  I understand they all hate the man, but pick something and stick to it....

Funny...your last line, pick something and stick to it...spiderman related AND political!  Bravo!

As for pick something and stick to it, are you referring to Bush being a bumbling idiot or the mastermind behind this war?  At least, those are the terms bandied about to describe the man.  

I wonder why, since "Gore won every recount", (as stated in Moore's movie), Gore wasn't in office to not lead us into war.  The NY Times and Washington Post paid for recounts, as did others, and in the millions of times the votes were recounted, Gore continually lost, again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and ag(pauses to throw gasoline onto the fire)ain, and again....

Dartful Dodger, for those that don't want to believe that there's another explanation out there, do you really think they'll do any looking into the facts?  I bet they like the "web-goo reservoir in his pants" idea!

[Floyd10]

lol. Damned Liberal Media

[DrewKaree]

lol. Damned Liberal Media

I believe you listen to the media that favors your bias, and if you look for it, all media has some sort of bias, some are just more overt about it than others.  Pay attention "James"

Dodger, just for you, I took all the hard work out of looking for information on this movie *snicker* and posted it -->HERE<--
so everyone can just click a link and moo....kinda like standing in line to see this "docu-ganda"...or is that "propa-mentary"? I've made my own "documentary" thread  

[Floyd10]

I was kidding... god. and btw, nice touch with the "James"
Really enjoyed that  

[DrewKaree]

I know you were

Glad you liked the "james-ing".  I think I shall take to calling you that as often as possible, so as to confuse as many people as possible...perhaps I'll change my sig to your thread about MY NAME ISN'T... so as to really throw a monkey wrench into the mix!  

Can I be SlimWhitman, James?

[shmokes]

I wonder why you believe in these things if there is no "god".  Where  does that sense of right and wrong come from if there is no God?  I can see how you would believe in such things as the 10 Commandments, but I can't take that leap of faith (pardon the pun) that by doing so, you still see no connection to some higher power that spoke of these things and gave you the conscience to believe that such things are right and just to believe and strive for.  I also am wont to believe that atheism itself is a religion, since it takes faith to believe that there isn't a God as well, thus making me my own personal god, since I'm responsible for me.

Drew, I do not believe that there is a 1,000,000,000 carot diamond buried in my backyard.  I however, have not actually dug up my entire backyard to verify this.  Is my disbelief based on faith, then?  Is my religion a disbelief in giant diamonds randomly being buried in my back yard?  

Is your religion a disbelief in the tooth fairy?  Santa Clause?  Leprechauns?  

No?  Well, presumably you can prove that they do not exist.  Otherwise your lack of belief in these things would constitute a religion, right?

You cheapen what faith is and what your religion is, by misdefining the word to apply to atheists.  

I simply don't believe there is a god, because I have been given no credible evidence to suggest that there is.  It is the same standard I try to apply to every aspect of my life (such as giant diamonds, tooth fairies, etc.).

But the golden rule is pretty self-executing.  I don't kill, lie, cheat, steal, etc. because I live in a society and those things are not in my best interest.  Do you have such a low opinion of human intellect that you think a person could not have come up with the idea of making a rule that nobody should kill anybody else?  Don't you think there's a pretty instinctual desire not to be killed?  

[mmmPeanutButter]

[ 'The Load All Mighty"

well said.

[Chris]

As for pick something and stick to it, are you referring to Bush being a bumbling idiot or the mastermind behind this war?  At least, those are the terms bandied about to describe the man.  

That's easy. Illegitimate President Bush is the bumbling idiot, and Shadow Presidents Rove and Cheney are the masterminds behind the war.

[DrewKaree]

WHEW!  For a minute there, Chris, I thought you believed in the tooth fairy shmokes is talking about!  Thank goodness the bumbling idiot stumbled upon those two to run the country....so "Enemy of the State" is another one of those "documentaries" in your mind...gotcha  

[Dartful Dodger]

The Blair Witch Project should have won best documentary.