Super Mario Galaxy 2 and Metroid: Other M get moved up release dates

[RTSDaddy2]

SMG2 will be out May 23 (I will be one of the first in line), and Metroid: Other M is due out in June as I recall.  According to Nintendo, the dates were moved up so that not all the heavy hitters would be coming out around the holidays...then apparently they threw mention of the new Zelda out as a potential for Christmas 2010.

Mario Galaxy follow up, new Metroid, and a new Link in one year? If it happens, and none of them suck, Wow. I worry about the release dates  being moved up, but I also doubt SMG2 would even see an early release if they felt it wouldn't be ready (likewise Metroid).

(I was going to open up an old can of worms here but changed my mind - never mind).

[danny_galaga]

Hmmm. I  have super mario galaxy still in the wrapper. Came with the console. Maybe it's time to unwrap and play it BEFORE the new one comes out...

[hypernova]

It would be a fantastic idea, danny, considering the greatness of it.

Metroid moved up...hopefully that means more opportunities for sequence breaking!!  Prime 2 and 3 just made it harder and harder to get good breaks in.  Nothing like the ones possible in the first Prime (not the Player's Choice or Wii remakes).

[SavannahLion]

Metroid moved up...hopefully that means more opportunities for sequence breaking!!  Prime 2 and 3 just made it harder and harder to get good breaks in.  Nothing like the ones possible in the first Prime (not the Player's Choice or Wii remakes).

Having only ever played the original Metroid (I'm not even sure if I own the Wii version), you'll have to run that by me again.

[Blanka]

and play it BEFORE the new one comes out...

Only try it if you're finding a way to map the spin-jump to a regular wii-classic-controller button.
Otherwise line up for wanker RSI therapy.

[hypernova]

Having only ever played the original Metroid (I'm not even sure if I own the Wii version), you'll have to run that by me again.

Super Metroid and the first non-player's choice Prime were chock full of breaks (those are the only two I've played from previous consoles.)  Breaks are where you can get an item before you're supposed to.  Example:  In Prime, you're not supposed to get the Space Jump boots until about 1/3 of the game is completed, but there's an option through some decent skills to get them as the first item in the game.  There were plenty of these opportunities throughout those games.  Many supposed required items were found to be not required as well.
Prime 2 and 3 had some breaks, but they were limited, and not as big, plus they needed alot of manipulation of secret worlds.

I'm hoping that since they're moving Other M up, they won't necessarily test out everything, and there will be more opportunities for breaks.

good source for sequence breaking

[Frigo]

I'm so stoked about these titles. SMG was by far the best game I've played in years (although GTA IV came close), and I've had nothing but love for the Prime series. Can't wait.

[Howard_Casto]

Having only ever played the original Metroid (I'm not even sure if I own the Wii version), you'll have to run that by me again.

Super Metroid and the first non-player's choice Prime were chock full of breaks (those are the only two I've played from previous consoles.)  Breaks are where you can get an item before you're supposed to.  Example:  In Prime, you're not supposed to get the Space Jump boots until about 1/3 of the game is completed, but there's an option through some decent skills to get them as the first item in the game.  There were plenty of these opportunities throughout those games.  Many supposed required items were found to be not required as well.
Prime 2 and 3 had some breaks, but they were limited, and not as big, plus they needed alot of manipulation of secret worlds.

I'm hoping that since they're moving Other M up, they won't necessarily test out everything, and there will be more opportunities for breaks.

good source for sequence breaking

ROTFLMAO   

So hold up, you are complaining that there are too FEW bugs in a game and that they need to add MORE?

Crazy kids and their lame cheating techniques. 


I want other M to be a good game, but quite frankly, considering it was made by team ninja (strike one) and that the exploration has been reduced to 2d (strike two) and this akward "if you want to aim while you shoot, you have to change perspective, oh and you can't move while you shoot" (strike three) I doubt it will be nearly as good as the prime series.  I think they got the perspective changing gimmick backwards.  The game should be in 3d, like prime most of the time, but when a complicated set of platforming comes up it should switch to a psuedo-2d view with a fixed camera, so it's easier to jump.  Prime's gameplay was FLAWLESS, with the one exception being that tricker jumps were hard to judge due to the camera. 

Galaxy was better than Sunshine, but that isn't ecactly saying much.  It was a solid Mario title, but not a ground-breaking one.  That being said what's with the spin-jump comment?? Spin jump worked just fine, if you had problems then you were doing it wrong.  Quite frankly it was a very solid game motion control wise.  My only complaints were about regular jumps, which ironically were with a digital button.  They seemed sluggish and with the ground rotating below you it made it hard to aim your landing.  Personally I HATED the whole planetoid idea because it screws up the platforming.  Loved the rest of it though.

[SavannahLion]

Personally I HATED the whole planetoid idea because it screws up the platforming.

I found Galaxy's planetoid idea to be a better execution than SM64 which is considered a ground breaking title for its time. I can't tell you how many ---smurfing--- times I fell off a platform because SM64's camera decides to move on it's own even if you force "fixed" location. To this day, I still believe that whole Koopa-in-a-cloud nonsense was their way to hide bad camera code.

[AtomSmasher]

Personally I HATED the whole planetoid idea because it screws up the platforming.

I found Galaxy's planetoid idea to be a better execution than SM64 which is considered a ground breaking title for its time. I can't tell you how many ---smurfing--- times I fell off a platform because SM64's camera decides to move on it's own even if you force "fixed" location. To this day, I still believe that whole Koopa-in-a-cloud nonsense was their way to hide bad camera code.

Did you play any 3D platformer's that came out before SM64?  If you did, then you would know that SM64's camera was a huge improvement over everything else before it.  It definitely had it's flaws, but it was ground breaking when it came out.

[SavannahLion]

Personally I HATED the whole planetoid idea because it screws up the platforming.

I found Galaxy's planetoid idea to be a better execution than SM64 which is considered a ground breaking title for its time. I can't tell you how many ---smurfing--- times I fell off a platform because SM64's camera decides to move on it's own even if you force "fixed" location. To this day, I still believe that whole Koopa-in-a-cloud nonsense was their way to hide bad camera code.

Did you play any 3D platformer's that came out before SM64?  If you did, then you would know that SM64's camera was a huge improvement over everything else before it.  It definitely had it's flaws, but it was ground breaking when it came out.

TBH, I don't recall. 

[Ginsu Victim]

Man, I can't name a single 3D platformer I'd played before Mario64 either.

[versapak]

Man, I can't name a single 3D platformer I'd played before Mario64 either.

I didn't know there was a such thing as a 3D platformer before Mario 64.

[hypernova]

ROTFLMAO  

So hold up, you are complaining that there are too FEW bugs in a game and that they need to add MORE?

Crazy kids and their lame cheating techniques.

Who here has played Super Metroid?  Now how many of you play it the exact same way every single time, getting every item in particular order, never deviating?  There's so many damn breaks in that game, I don't even have the slightest clue as to what the intended order is anymore

Alot of these breaks in the Primes (mainly 1) and especially SM aren't even bugs.  Just skillful manipulation of things to jump on.  The secret worlds are bugs...basically getting out of bounds by going up and over the current room's walls.  Traversing those is...not fun at all.  Tons of opportunities to go into freefall from the board or get stuck somewhere.  I've never actually fully gotten an item using one.  It's not easy, nor fun.

Now, are you telling me you like having things set in stone for you, so you don't have to make decisions for yourself on where you want to go?  How boring are you?

ROTFLMAO  

Did you ever bother playing around with Game Sharks and the like?  Oh the fun that could be had playing an RPG and using enemy spells like Flare Star in FF9.  As you are a programmer, I'm somewhat amused at your...comment.  Sequence breaking/game sharks/"cheating" in general can breathe new life into a tired old game that's been played the same way over and over.

but when a complicated set of platforming comes up it should switch to a psuedo-2d view with a fixed camera, so it's easier to jump.  Prime's gameplay was FLAWLESS, with the one exception being that tricker jumps were hard to judge due to the camera.

If you were having trouble with the landing, all you had to do was lock your view downwards.  But nothing was downright "tricky" to warrant doing so.

[Howard_Casto]

ROTFLMAO  

So hold up, you are complaining that there are too FEW bugs in a game and that they need to add MORE?

Crazy kids and their lame cheating techniques.

Who here has played Super Metroid?  Now how many of you play it the exact same way every single time, getting every item in particular order, never deviating?  There's so many damn breaks in that game, I don't even have the slightest clue as to what the intended order is anymore

Alot of these breaks in the Primes (mainly 1) and especially SM aren't even bugs.  Just skillful manipulation of things to jump on.  The secret worlds are bugs...basically getting out of bounds by going up and over the current room's walls.  Traversing those is...not fun at all.  Tons of opportunities to go into freefall from the board or get stuck somewhere.  I've never actually fully gotten an item using one.  It's not easy, nor fun.

Now, are you telling me you like having things set in stone for you, so you don't have to make decisions for yourself on where you want to go?  How boring are you?

ROTFLMAO  

Did you ever bother playing around with Game Sharks and the like?  Oh the fun that could be had playing an RPG and using enemy spells like Flare Star in FF9.  As you are a programmer, I'm somewhat amused at your...comment.  Sequence breaking/game sharks/"cheating" in general can breathe new life into a tired old game that's been played the same way over and over.

but when a complicated set of platforming comes up it should switch to a psuedo-2d view with a fixed camera, so it's easier to jump.  Prime's gameplay was FLAWLESS, with the one exception being that tricker jumps were hard to judge due to the camera.

If you were having trouble with the landing, all you had to do was lock your view downwards.  But nothing was downright "tricky" to warrant doing so.

That's the dumbest argument I've ever heard.  Metroid is an exploritory game... NOTHING is set in stone.  The whole point of metroid is you can go the wrong way if you want, only to discover you've went the wrong way halfway into a room, die and have to explore even more to find the item you need to progress.  This legthens the game naturally, as opposed to the artifical back-tracking you see in some games today.  Being able to get something before you are supposed to ruins the game in that respect.  And rest assured it IS a bug, either from poor level design, lack of testing, ect.....

Your gameshark comment doesn't hold water either.  Gameshark codes take a BUG FREE game and re-introduce bugs into it.  It is fun, but think how many times using a special gs code ruins the game by locking it up, getting you stuck in a room you aren't supposed to be in yet, ect.  We live with that because we know we are essentially breaking the game by using the codes, BUT if we remove the gs the game plays normally and bug free.  What you are saying is having a game were bugs are already present and you can get stuck in a room you aren't supposed to be in yet and have to start your frikkin game save over is acceptable to you.  This is only "fun" to a small percentage of people... it is frustrating and confusing to everyone else, making the game look poorly designed.  Some of prime 1's "breaks" (is that what you called them?) are so horrible that I did a few by accident my first run, got stuck and had to start over.   It's down-right infuriating to be in a room because you thought you were supposed to be able to be in that room, only to find out you shouldn't be in that room and now you need to start over or do some incredibly impossible sequence of glitching to get back out.

And if you find it suprising that a programmer  doesn't find a bugs in a game acceptable than you certianly don't understand the programmers mindset.


I never had trouble with a landing, but the fact of the matter is locking your view downwards felt unnatural and akward, it would have been much nicer and more fluid with a fixed camera in certain areas.  Also it is obvious to anyone who's played the prime series that the platforming was significantly dumbed-down to compensate for this akwardness.  We could have enjoyed the tricky "end of metroid 1" platformining if a better camera system was introduced. 

[hypernova]

That's the dumbest argument I've ever heard.  Metroid is an exploritory game... NOTHING is set in stone.  The whole point of metroid is you can go the wrong way if you want, only to discover you've went the wrong way halfway into a room, die and have to explore even more to find the item you need to progress.  

Wow, except for the first sentence, you didn't sound like a total condescending ass this time.

Other than the first playthrough, you shouldn't be stumbling into the wrong room.  You definitely shouldn't be dying.  Metroid isn't exactly difficult except for some of the bosses, which aren't difficult after a few plays either.  Hence, after a few playthroughs, sequence breaks are a great way to play it differently.  I didn't start the term "breaks," that's what they've been dubbed by others.  It's been a term in use for a loooooooong time.

Some of prime 1's "breaks" are so horrible that I did a few by accident my first run, got stuck and had to start over.

I'd love to hear your tales of how you did a few by "accident" and got stuck, because there's not much way to get stuck other than going into secret worlds.  And those are difficult to even get into, let alone traverse.

And if you find it suprising that a programmer  doesn't find a bugs in a game acceptable than you certianly don't understand the programmers mindset.

Yes, but finding them, and understanding why are always interesting and fun.

Your gameshark comment doesn't hold water either.  Gameshark codes take a BUG FREE game and re-introduce bugs into it.  It is fun, but think how many times using a special gs code ruins the game by locking it up, getting you stuck in a room you aren't supposed to be in yet, ect.

Okay...so I said it adds fun, then you said that comment doesn't hold water.  Then you agreed and said it is fun.  Choose something.
Creating the codes=not much fun.
Using fully tested codes that have little/no side effects=fun.

The only bit of effort I remember regarding GS codes was FFIX, when I basically used documents to make my own spells.  You couldn't have too much active while loading/saving.  All you needed to do was cut down, or turn the GS off while doing those tasks.  If you didn't, it simply failed to load.  No big deal.

Only an idiot with a high amount of patience would use highly unstable codes.  You seem to have this skewed view that a huge majority of these things will literally crash the game.  Tested codes (which a large majority of them were) from the previous console generations, as well as most, if not all breaks in the Metroid series (that don't involve secret worlds) are stable/safe to use with nothing to worry about.

I know of a bug in MP2 that'll cause you to be unable to progress.  It involves saving the game while in one of the rooms of the Sanctuary (I think the one with the caretaker drone.)  It only happens after you get the echo visor, and the echo point are still active.  That's a game crashing bug.  THAT would suck.  Especially as it's close to the end of the game.  I assume they fixed it in the Wii remake.

Once again, I contend that these techniques/codes make these games fun again.  Fighting Thardus with the plasma beam in MP1.  Sweet.  I've always been a sucker for playing games again and again.  Going abcdefgh in sequence gets old after awhile.

[shmokes]

Man, I can't name a single 3D platformer I'd played before Mario64 either.

I didn't know there was a such thing as a 3D platformer before Mario 64.

Tomb Raider came before Mario 64

[versapak]

Man, I can't name a single 3D platformer I'd played before Mario64 either.

I didn't know there was a such thing as a 3D platformer before Mario 64.

Tomb Raider came before Mario 64

Interesting...

I had no recollection that Tomb Raider came first. I know I played the heck out of it when it came out, but for some reason Mario 64 seems older in my mind.

heh

[versapak]

Two seconds on google:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpha_Waves

For less obscure stuff, here's a couple of reasonably popular games pre-Tomb Raider:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fade_to_Black_%28video_game%29

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bug!

Ummmm...

Okay

[shmokes]

Interesting...

I had no recollection that Tomb Raider came first. I know I played the heck out of it when it came out, but for some reason Mario 64 seems older in my mind.

I feel the same way.  I think most people do and I can think of two likely reasons for it.  One is that you maybe got a Nintendo 64 first, so even though Tomb Raider predated Mario, you didn't play them in chronological order cos you didn't get a Playstation till later. 

The other thing, though, is that while Tomb Raider was a pretty awesome game, Super Mario 64 was a perfect game.  Super Mario 64 was a game that within thirty seconds of picking up the controller you knew intuitively that gaming was never going to be the same.  And, of course, Tomb Raider was a 3D platformer but it was played with a d-pad, while Mario gave you an analog stick and camera control buttons so you were able to interact with the 3D world in a far more intuitive and effective way.  Pick up Mario 64 and the original Tomb Raider today and it is astounding how little the former has aged compared with the latter.  Tomb Raider beat Mario to market, but Mario invented the 3D platformer as it should be.

For me I think it is both of those things because I got an N64 a couple years before I got a Playstation.  But the second thing is probably true for just about everyone.

[versapak]

Actually...

According to wikipedia Mario 64 did come out first.

Mario 64 came out:

JP - June 1996
NA - September 1996
EU - March 1997



Tomb Raider came out:

Sega Saturn EU - October 1996

All other platforms EU & US - November 1996

JP - 1997




Being that I am in the US, it seems like Mario 64 came out first, because it actually did.


Granted, wikipedia could be wrong, but it usually isn't.

[SavannahLion]

Two seconds on google:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpha_Waves

For less obscure stuff, here's a couple of reasonably popular games pre-Tomb Raider:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fade_to_Black_%28video_game%29

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bug!

Note that for those particular games, one is an obscure game, one is a game that uses an OtS cam and the last is, while technically 3D and a platformer, more akin to a 2D platformer than a true 3D platformer.

I was already aware of numerous 3D games that were released prior to SM64. The very subtle point I was not really making is this. SM64 is like a ---goshdarn--- flare shot into a dark theater packed to the gills with patrons. People are going to remember that flare going off in that theater for the rest of their lives. Most games play like most people eat breakfast. Some you'll forget by that afternoon, others you'll forget by next month. A few you'll forget in six months. Play it again and you'll recognize the flavor, that's about all. I'm not going to even guess on how many games I own, played, then completely forgot about as I buy that 2nd or 3rd title thinking I don't own it. Then I take it home to file away in my collection and.. oh ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---.. there's the title! There's no chance in Hell I'll ever buy SM64 again thinking I don't own it.

[shmokes]

Actually...

According to wikipedia Mario 64 did come out first.

Hmm . . . maybe that's a 3rd reason for people feeling this way.