WOW New LightGUN Info !!! Woot!!! :)

[Fozzy The Bear]

Guys! in answer to a question asked on here!

THE SOCKET ON THE BOTTOM OF THE GUN IS NOT FOR A RELOAD PEDAL!! Be careful what you try and plug in there!

Here's the reply about it that I got from EMS.

****************************
Dear Julian,

We heard that the GunCon2PC Driver works very well, we would improve our
driver as soon as possible. Please wait for the new driver release in our
website.
The socket at the bottom is for the power source of the vibration function
for the gun. Please note that there are two socket for the power source (for
vibration function), one is at the bottom of the gun, another one is at the
end of the cable. Use either one is ok.

Thank you for your support to us.
Please keep to your eyes to look our website.

Thanks
Melody
www.hkems.com
********************************

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[jelwell]

Ok I am done. Tried for 4 hours to get these things to work.

If anyone wants them, one open one not open, you can have them for what I paid plus shipping. That comes to 2 LCD TopGun
Compatible with PlayStation2, Xbox, Windows PC  59.80
 
Sub-Total 59.80
 Shipping (UPS) 34.40
 
Total 94.20
All values USD

Plus what I have to pay to ship them to you. If noone wants them I will return them to playasia.

Thx for all the help but these things are just not what I thought they would be.

Mark

It's cheaper for everyone (you included) if you just return them and everyone buy 2 guns from the-console-corner.com for only $93.98 shipped.
Joseph Elwell.

[Minwah]

MinWah, does lethal enforcer workk well to you (I've only read about offscreen reload in your post) ?

This is one (and Lethal Enforcers 2) which seems to track fine, but the crosshair is offset in both X and Y by some considerable amount...it seems Silver has verified this occurs with MAME v0.103 too.

[Minwah]

Minwah, I think I verify that all the "bugs" you spotted are present in mame 0.103.

That's a bit of a shame then, I hoped a few things would have been fixed.

My C is not up to much I'm afraid. I also noticed undrfire (which seems to work well) has more legible code (to me) on the gun inputs and is also partially documented in the source about what its doing, which may help someone....

Hmm mine either...I will try to have a look through the source tho, but I probably won't come up with anything more than you have.  At least the Lethal Enf. driver suggests the author knows something could be wrong, so that's a start...

[Silver]

At least the Lethal Enf. driver suggests the author knows something could be wrong, so that's a start...

Lethal enforcers 2 does not have info (its in the Konamai GX driver). It does have:

PORT_BIT( 0xff, 0x00, IPT_LIGHTGUN_X ) PORT_MINMAX(0,0xff) PORT_SENSITIVITY(35) PORT_KEYDELTA(15) PORT_PLAYER(1)

which does have this different offset (0x00, not 0x80) to start, so I suppose it is worth trying recompiling with the four similar above lines changed..... Anyone got a compile environment ready to go? I haven't compiled since 0.92....

It also has:

static READ32_HANDLER( le2_gun_H_r )
{
   int p1x = readinputport(9)*287/0xff+22;
   int p2x = readinputport(11)*287/0xff+22;

   return (p1x<<16)|p2x;
}

static READ32_HANDLER( le2_gun_V_r )
{
   int p1y = readinputport(10)*223/0xff+1;
   int p2y = readinputport(12)*223/0xff+1;

   return (p1y<<16)|p2y;
}
Presumably the horizontal and vertical gun reads. I presume the 223/0xff+1 are just scale factors but maybe someone else can comment?

[Smog]

@Silver
I am a C coder but sadly I don't know much of the mame source (it's a ALL-macro based code, you just have to spend eons in trying understanding it) however I am quite sure you're on the right way.
Normal mouses use relative coordinates system, this means that offsets are really not important ... they come into the game when using an absolute coordinate device (such as lightgun is) offsetting the values sent by the gun. You probably can try to fix it using the centering options in my driver but it is a dirty way to do it.

You can create two profiles, one bound to normal mame.exe (maybe the default one) and another one for mame-lethal-enforcer.exe (just rename the mame.exe executable). In the second profile, change the centering values to match the offset in lethal enforcer and use the "alternative named" mame to lunch that game.
The GunCon2Flasher will detect in a few seconds that another profile needs to be loaded and will change on the fly the settings for your gun.
This mechanism has not been tested extensively (I guess none used it before) but it could work.

@mark6437
Sad you gave up. I can understand your frustration in this moment but I can say by my experience that when it will work it will be worth it all.

[Minwah]

Anyone got a compile environment ready to go? I haven't compiled since 0.92....

I've just set one up...compiling now with the 'IPT_LIGHTGUN' line changes as suggested in lethal.c and konamigx.c.

I don't have a lightgun here tho (& I can't test it until next week at the earliest) so I could do with someone to test it...download it here: http://mamewah.mameworld.net/mametest.zip (PASTE INTO BROWSER, DON'T CLICK!)

Silver: did you get the same offset problem with Operation Wolf 3?  Just curious as I do, but the possible driver lines in question look OK.


Edit: compiled...see above

[darthbane2k]

Anyone got a compile environment ready to go? I haven't compiled since 0.92....

I've just set one up...compiling now with the 'IPT_LIGHTGUN' line changes as suggested in lethal.c and konamigx.c.

I don't have a lightgun here tho (& I can't test it until next week at the earliest) so I could do with someone to test it...please PM me asap if you want to test it, as I'm going away after work today.

Silver: did you get the same offset problem with Operation Wolf 3?  Just curious as I do, but the possible driver lines in question look OK.

why are you guys fiddling with code again?...

[Minwah]

why are you guys fiddling with code again?...

To try to fix the games that don't work properly with the gun - see the above posts.

[Smog]

why are you guys fiddling with code again?

Probably because mame support for lightguns has been cut ad-hoc for Actlabs (that, actually is the worst lightgun system possible) with hacks and tricks to make it work at the best.
Routines used in the core by Advance and Analog will probably never be implemented because of portability issues, and moreover I feel like core-devolper are not active on the topic.
I think someone out of mame-team succeeding in fixing those issues (even from a driver point view, not core source) is the quickiest  way to see it work and luckily it will be add in future mame releases.

[Silver]

Silver: did you get the same offset problem with Operation Wolf 3?  Just curious as I do, but the possible driver lines in question look OK.

Edit: compiled...I forgot how big mame is now so I'll try to FTP it somewhere (watch this space...)

Yes it was offset - but also I seem to recall calibrated in the top right of the screen (like zombraid but correct at a different point).

I only think the offset trick *might* work for games where the error is linear all over the screen, but I'm not that hopeful.

RE: mame size - you need to compress it with UPX (compresser for exe's) to get it to the same size as mame is distributed.  I can test it tonight after work no problem. If you upx or even just rar it you can email it to me, or I'll download it.

Also, I've updated http://www.silverfoxy.f2s.com/Topgun.html with a few bits and pieces and started a "current issues" log at the bottom describing issues with any games, so let me know any other problems. I'm sure I've missed a bunch of stuff.....

[Minwah]

I only think the offset trick *might* work for games where the error is linear all over the screen, but I'm not that hopeful.

I'm not too hopeful either, but worth a shot.

RE: mame size - you need to compress it with UPX (compresser for exe's) to get it to the same size as mame is distributed.  I can test it tonight after work no problem. If you upx or even just rar it you can email it to me, or I'll download it.

I haven't bothered with UPX...zipping it effectively compresses it down nearly as small for distribution purposes....see my above reply (#566) for the download link

Also, I've updated http://www.silverfoxy.f2s.com/Topgun.html with a few bits and pieces and started a "current issues" log at the bottom describing issues with any games, so let me know any other problems. I'm sure I've missed a bunch of stuff.....

I'll check it out...

[Lilwolf]

whooohooo mine was shipped... can't wait to get them...

Nothing to add yet... just excited!

[Fozzy The Bear]

Also, I've updated http://www.silverfoxy.f2s.com/Topgun.html with a few bits and pieces and started a "current issues" log at the bottom describing issues with any games, so let me know any other problems. I'm sure I've missed a bunch of stuff.....

Yeah! Silver good work.... could you also add the note above about the bottom socket please.... http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=48982.msg481491#msg481491

Otherwise somebody is going to try and stick a pedal in it and fry their gun.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[rdmustang]

How does this gun compare to the guncon2?

[aljupy]

I have a Question that maybe it sounds like silly:  

One of the steps to follow to callibrate the "LCD Top Gun " Is to "SHOOT IN THE CENTER OF THE SCREEN"........so....How did you that? did you calculate it "by your own eye" ??  Did you  a mark in the exact center of TV (This one sounds silly,)?  

On a side note: Wich Step is better to Reach the MAXIMUM accuracy in a PS2 or Xbox?

1) Turn ON Xbox/PS2, connect your "LCD TOP GUN" and then you  do the "LCD TOP GUN HARDWARE CALIBRATION". After that you use the Calibration screen of your favourite game, and you start your New Game.

2)Turn ON Xbox/Ps2, SKIP the "in game software callibration", then you start the game, then you pause it and you do the "LCD TOP GUN HARDWARE CALIBRATION" then you continue your game. (Notice that this Step has avoid the "in game Software callibration"


Many Thanks for HELP!!!!

[Fozzy The Bear]

How does this gun compare to the guncon2?

It's guncon2 compatible and a damned sight more accurate. Nuf said! try reading the thread.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[Fozzy The Bear]

One of the steps to follow to callibrate the "LCD Top Gun " Is to "SHOOT IN THE CENTER OF THE SCREEN"........so....How did you that?

You shoot at what looks to you like roughly the centre of the screen...

2)Turn ON Xbox/Ps2, SKIP the "in game software callibration", then you start the game, then you pause it and you do the "LCD TOP GUN HARDWARE CALIBRATION" then you continue your game. (Notice that this Step has avoid the "in game Software callibration"

NO!! The software calibration has absolutely nothing to do with the hardware calibration of the gun itself.... The hardware calibration is entirely so that the gun itself understands what the boundaries of your screen are.

The hardware calibration MUST be done first... Followed by calibrating the software in the game so that the game understands the behaviour of the gun.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[aljupy]

How does this gun compare to the guncon2?

Tomorrow I think I

[darthbane2k]

MinWah, does lethal enforcer workk well to you (I've only read about offscreen reload in your post) ?

This is one (and Lethal Enforcers 2) which seems to track fine, but the crosshair is offset in both X and Y by some considerable amount...it seems Silver has verified this occurs with MAME v0.103 too.

Does  this mean if you aim and fire it IS accurate, only the tracking crosshair is off... in which case, can you switch off the cross hair?

[aljupy]

NO!! The software calibration has absolutely nothing to do with the hardware calibration of the gun itself.... The hardware calibration is entirely so that the gun itself understands what the boundaries of your screen are.

The hardware calibration MUST be done first... Followed by calibrating the software in the game so that the game understands the behaviour of the gun.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

THANK YOU!!!!

I Asked that because my RGT-G1 has a button to Skip the "In game Software callibration". RGT also Higly recommend you to skip it.

So First:  I

[Silver]

I haven't bothered with UPX...zipping it effectively compresses it down nearly as small for distribution purposes....see my above reply (#566) for the download link
..

Minwah I get rejected from your link "Off-network linking to images and downloads is not permitted."

and mesage about linking to the main page not downloads.....

[Silver]

Yeah! Silver good work.... could you also add the note above about the bottom socket please....

Will do....

[Silver]

Does  this mean if you aim and fire it IS accurate, only the tracking crosshair is off... in which case, can you switch off the cross hair?

No - I had hoped that was the case when you recalibrated in game, but no the gun fires exactly where the crosshair is, not where you point the gun.

[Minwah]

Minwah I get rejected from your link "Off-network linking to images and downloads is not permitted."

and mesage about linking to the main page not downloads.....

Sorry I should have said...paste it into your browser - don't click!

[Minwah]

No - I had hoped that was the case when you recalibrated in game, but no the gun fires exactly where the crosshair is, not where you point the gun.

So you can play the game with the crosshair on...but the gun's aim does not line up with the crosshair, basically.

[darthbane2k]

Does  this mean if you aim and fire it IS accurate, only the tracking crosshair is off... in which case, can you switch off the cross hair?

No - I had hoped that was the case when you recalibrated in game, but no the gun fires exactly where the crosshair is, not where you point the gun.

Whats the technical reason for this occuring.. poor emulation?

[Silver]

Whats the technical reason for this occuring.. poor emulation?

Dont know.

Could be incomplete emulation (I suspect this is the case with BeastBusters, as its never worked with any lightgun).

Could an issue to do with the way the control are implimented in mame for those games.

Could be something else!


What would be very handy is confirming that the games with issues also have issues with other lightguns - such as actlabs or guncons.

I've found a post confirming this for beastbusters.

Could someone with other lightguns test Lethal enforcers 1 & 2, zombie raid, and opwolf 3?

[JoyMonkey]

Just a heads up for people still considering buying these...
You can buy them from www.the-console-corner.com and use the coupon code "oldskewl" to get 15% off, so it'll cost you $82.63 for two guns shipped USPS Priority mail within the US.
I don't know how good the-console-corner.com is though, they don't have any recent reviews on reseller-ratings, but all their old ones are pretty bad.

[Sinner]

I have House of the Dead 1, 2 and 3...I've loved these games in the arcade, and never play them at home, because I have an Act-Labs gun I can't get working...

Has anyone tried 2 player on any of the HOTD series and gotten it working with the TOPGUNs? 

Were you successfull?

[darthbane2k]

I have House of the Dead 1, 2 and 3...I've loved these games in the arcade, and never play them at home, because I have an Act-Labs gun I can't get working...

Has anyone tried 2 player on any of the HOTD series and gotten it working with the TOPGUNs? 

Were you successfull?

look earlier in the thread. there are people who have recorded video of them sucessfully playing HOTD2 and 3.

All three (including both virtua cop games) should work with this gun.

[ErikRuud]

To be a little more specific Silver was able to play the PC HOTD2 with two guns.

Update:

I have now played HOTD2 in 2 player - works well. I had to reconfigure the troubleshooter - you must select ActLabs TV lightguns, not PC USB lightguns. Then I had to put player2 button2 to mouse1button4 in Wingun.

This does not track the guns permanently, only when you fire, but this has no impact on this game at all (same as arcade).

[Sinner]

To be a little more specific Silver was able to play the PC HOTD2 with two guns.

Update:

I have now played HOTD2 in 2 player - works well. I had to reconfigure the troubleshooter - you must select ActLabs TV lightguns, not PC USB lightguns. Then I had to put player2 button2 to mouse1button4 in Wingun.

This does not track the guns permanently, only when you fire, but this has no impact on this game at all (same as arcade).

2 gun support was what I was wondering about...Thanks...

[emerica]

Just a heads up for people still considering buying these...
You can buy them from www.the-console-corner.com and use the coupon code "oldskewl" to get 15% off, so it'll cost you $82.63 for two guns shipped USPS Priority mail within the US.
I don't know how good the-console-corner.com is though, they don't have any recent reviews on reseller-ratings, but all their old ones are pretty bad.

I had a pretty bad experience with them a couple of years ago.  I think anyone ordering these guns would be better off dealing with lik-sang or playasia. They seem to more reputable than the-console-corner.

[Level42]

Man can't believe the way EMS is handling their communications, BIG compliments for them ! I got another E-mail from Henry at EMS about the LED's lifetime (even though I already indicated to him that I understood and was going to order anyway !

Anyway: more IR-Led info, Randy your notes seem te get confirmed here:

QUOTE:
....
By the way, lifetime of intrared LED is different from normal LED. For the
latest 6th generation normal LED (which is very expensive), the lifetime is
100,000 hours. For the best infrared LED at this moment (that's what we are
currently using), it's lifetime is around 10,000 - 20,000 hours, it's
brightness would be decreased by 20% after used for 1000 hours. Therefore,
the expected lifetime of our LED stands would be around 3-4 years, consider
the stand would works for 2 hours each day, 365 days in a year.
...
UNQUOTE

Don't know about you, but I bet no-one will play 2 hours a day 365 per year. So expect about 10 years or so of normal usage from these. And if you bought two sets...well guess you can do the math

On the other hand, DO NOT let these baby's run 24h/day !!! ALSO DO NOT POWER THEM UP TOGETHER WITH YOUR CAB'S POWER.  Else they'll burn out while you're playing Pac Man and stuff..... OK we need an output to switch the LED's on and off as soon as we launch a lightgun game

Well if the LED's eventualy stop being bright enough......replace them. I bet they got 100.000 hour lasting versions in a year or 4......

[Tiger-Heli]

OK we need an output to switch the LED's on and off as soon as we launch a lightgun game

Could probably eventually be done with an LED-Wiz and a relay, put the programming side might need MikeQ's custom build or sth.

[darthbane2k]

ALSO DO NOT POWER THEM UP TOGETHER WITH YOUR CAB'S POWER.  Else they'll burn out while you're playing Pac Man and stuff..... OK we need an output to switch the LED's on and off as soon as we launch a lightgun game

Well if the LED's eventualy stop being bright enough......replace them. I bet they got 100.000 hour lasting versions in a year or 4......

Well, how do we overcome this?

[ErikRuud]

Well, how do we overcome this?

There are several options.

1.  Don't worry about it.  It will take a while for it to be a problem and replacing the LED's would be easy.  There is nothing particullary special about the electronics in the stands.

2.  A simple on off switch.  Probably best to use an external power supply with this option instead of hacking the USB power plug.

3.  As mentioned the LED-Wiz and a relay could be used.

4.  Any other computer controlled switch setup could be used.

[JoyMonkey]

Don't the guns take 5v?
If so you could just hook them up to an LEDWiz and have them power on when a gun game is selected in your front-end; no need for a relay at all since the LEDWiz outputs 5v.

Edit: Wait... do the stands use the power adapter, or take power from a USB port?

[Santoro]

USB port.