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Author Topic: Need to clear this up, do rgb moded tvs, really need groovymame?  (Read 4558 times)

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abispac

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So i was thinking, since a moded rgb tv, is using the jungle tv to output the video thats being feeded, does it really matter to use groovymame to get the resolutions corrected? i mean dont the jungle chip will upscale the image to whatever the tv needs it?
Whet are the best options for an rgb moded tv?
I just adquired a trinitron KV-27S42 im planing to rgb mod as it seems to be stupid free easy, so i would like to build a tekken 3 type cabinet with it.
Thanks for any advice.

Zebidee

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Re: Need to clear this up, do rgb moded tvs, really need groovymame?
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2021, 11:14:19 pm »
So i was thinking, since a moded rgb tv, is using the jungle tv to output the video thats being feeded, does it really matter to use groovymame to get the resolutions corrected? i mean dont the jungle chip will upscale the image to whatever the tv needs it?
Whet are the best options for an rgb moded tv?
I just adquired a trinitron KV-27S42 im planing to rgb mod as it seems to be stupid free easy, so i would like to build a tekken 3 type cabinet with it.
Thanks for any advice.

The short answer is: You do not need Groovymame or CRT_emulator. You can use your TV in a cab with arcade game PCBs.

A properly RGB modded TV (or component TV with GreenAntz, essentially the same thing) will be (almost) an arcade monitor.  There are differences of course. For example arcade RGB+sync levels are too high so you need pots or resistors on the signal line; and it is more difficult to adjust TV image size.

I recently wrote up how I made a basic testbed for arcade game PCBs with a component TV here:
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,165142.0.html
Check out my completed projects!


abispac

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Re: Need to clear this up, do rgb moded tvs, really need groovymame?
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2021, 11:42:12 pm »
So i was thinking, since a moded rgb tv, is using the jungle tv to output the video thats being feeded, does it really matter to use groovymame to get the resolutions corrected? i mean dont the jungle chip will upscale the image to whatever the tv needs it?
Whet are the best options for an rgb moded tv?
I just adquired a trinitron KV-27S42 im planing to rgb mod as it seems to be stupid free easy, so i would like to build a tekken 3 type cabinet with it.
Thanks for any advice.

The short answer is: You do not need Groovymame or CRT_emulator. You can use your TV in a cab with arcade game PCBs.

A properly RGB modded TV (or component TV with GreenAntz, essentially the same thing) will be (almost) an arcade monitor.  There are differences of course. For example arcade RGB+sync levels are too high so you need pots or resistors on the signal line; and it is more difficult to adjust TV image size.

I recently wrote up how I made a basic testbed for arcade game PCBs with a component TV here:
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,165142.0.html
Well actually i think emudrivers are needed as i wont be using any type of converter, and the tv does not have componet video. Last time i did this everything worked just fine, i did use some potentiometers on the sync signal to adjust it to the correct level and it looked nice, the part i really dont understand much is if groovymame makes a diference by using the correct resolutions for each game, or maybe just regular mame would do as the jungle chip does the video decoding.

Zebidee

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Re: Need to clear this up, do rgb moded tvs, really need groovymame?
« Reply #3 on: June 03, 2021, 01:22:25 am »
Are you talking about running a Tekken3 game PCB or a PC?
Check out my completed projects!


abispac

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Re: Need to clear this up, do rgb moded tvs, really need groovymame?
« Reply #4 on: June 03, 2021, 01:29:47 pm »
Are you talking about running a Tekken3 game PCB or a PC?
No not at all.
Im saying is, ive seen this rgb mods on sony trinitron tv and they look stuning,  now since is very hard locally to get a hold of cheap 14 or 13 inch arcade monitors, im hunting this tvs to rgb mod them and use them as arcade monitors. Also like yesterday, i found a 27 inch trinitron that i would love to use on a tekken 3 type arcade cabinet, so the mod on this tv is stupid easy.
My main question is, :
is groovy mame really needed as i consider the jungle chip on the tv handles how it outputs the video image, for example lets say, i use groovymame, and it outputs the game at 320x240 , but in reallity , the jungle chip, outputs the game at 240p or 480p whatever this tv real resolution is, so groovymame aint really need it, as a regular mame would do.
Another question would be, as i would be using rgb mod and nothing else, what would be the best settings for it? 15khz or ntsc tv?

hope i made myself clear.

Zebidee

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Re: Need to clear this up, do rgb moded tvs, really need groovymame?
« Reply #5 on: June 03, 2021, 02:12:33 pm »
Are you talking about running a Tekken3 game PCB or a PC?
No not at all.
...
hope i made myself clear.

Not clear at all and please just answer my question - what are you planning to run your games on? A PC? Windows? Linux? Arcade PCB? Pregnancy tester? Or are you just going to hum along and pretend? :dunno

My main question is, :
is groovy mame really needed as i consider the jungle chip on the tv handles how it outputs the video image, for example lets say, i use groovymame, and it outputs the game at 320x240 , but in reallity , the jungle chip, outputs the game at 240p or 480p whatever this tv real resolution is, so groovymame aint really need it, as a regular mame would do.

It doesn't work that way, jungle chip doesn't do what you think it does. It won't convert or downscale your picture. CRT TVs don't have a "fixed resolution" like an LCD, there is a range of frequencies that they will accept. It will take the video modes you feed it and attempt to display them. If acceptable, you get a picture.

CRT_emulator is the video driver and video mode software tools. That is what you mean and what you need. Groovymame is just MAME optimised for CRT_EMU and switchres.

Quote
Another question would be, as i would be using rgb mod and nothing else, what would be the best settings for it? 15khz or ntsc tv?

"RGB mod and nothing else"? What does that even mean?

Start with Generic 15khz
Check out my completed projects!


abispac

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Re: Need to clear this up, do rgb moded tvs, really need groovymame?
« Reply #6 on: June 03, 2021, 03:30:46 pm »
LOL you are so funny Zebidee, thanks for your patience but you did just answered my questions.

I only do emulation stuff, so its PC runing windows 7 with an amd card on crt emudrivers. Im currently working on a cocktail cab using the same setup  on a 19" arcade monitor with a generic chasis, looks nice.
This tv i just got yesterday im rgb moding it with the mux method.

Quote
It doesn't work that way, jungle chip doesn't do what you think it does. It won't convert or downscale your picture. CRT TVs don't have a "fixed resolution" like an LCD, there is a range of frequencies that they will accept. It will take the video modes you feed it and attempt to display them. If acceptable, you get a picture.

CRT_emulator is the video driver and video mode software tools. That is what you mean and what you need. Groovymame is just MAME optimised for CRT_EMU and switchres.
Thanks for clrearing this up too, si ill just use regular 15kjz setting on emudrivers, thanks
Quote
"RGB mod and nothing else"? What does that even mean?

Start with Generic 15khz
On this particular tv , ill be just using the rgb mod, so ill be using the tv exclusive as an arcade monitor. so 15khz would do.

Thanks again for your help and your patience.


Zebidee

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Re: Need to clear this up, do rgb moded tvs, really need groovymame?
« Reply #7 on: June 04, 2021, 02:30:29 am »
No worries. You're on the right path then, what you're doing is what CRT_emulator & Groovymame is made for.

Pics?
Check out my completed projects!


abispac

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Re: Need to clear this up, do rgb moded tvs, really need groovymame?
« Reply #8 on: June 05, 2021, 02:53:09 pm »
No worries. You're on the right path then, what you're doing is what CRT_emulator & Groovymame is made for.

Pics?
Sorry for the late reply, i was finishing moding the tv, it looks great, my crappy camera wont do justice, ive tested mame and groovymame on it, definitly groovymame wins this crt race. Thanks for everyone involved.
https://imgur.com/gallery/q3nrZkZ Galery

My crappy test setup, an cocktail cab project i allmost finish


and closed up






Zebidee

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Re: Need to clear this up, do rgb moded tvs, really need groovymame?
« Reply #9 on: June 05, 2021, 03:28:48 pm »
Awesome. Another old CRT given a new life and purpose   :cheers:
Check out my completed projects!


abispac

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Re: Need to clear this up, do rgb moded tvs, really need groovymame?
« Reply #10 on: June 05, 2021, 03:51:35 pm »
Awesome. Another old CRT given a new life and purpose   :cheers:
so im now tempted betwen a ultracade type cocktail cab, as this 27 inch screen mimics 2 19 screens when flipped, good size, or the tekken 3 type cabinet, only time will tell.