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Some may have noticed that the Electric ICE™ Trackball products have been out of stock for a few weeks. Here's why;
Our supply of the first version balls had dwindled to nothing and I set out to see if we could kick things up a notch. I worked with a vendor over the course of 4 months, evaluating samples and scraping up enough capital to meet the large investment required for the custom project. After one false start (which almost resulted in the demise of the project) we were finally able to get these made. Check out the pics.
(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/EIV2_Unlit.jpg) (http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/EIV2_Unlit800.jpg)..(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/EIV2_litBlue.jpg) (http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/EIV2_litBlue800.jpg)
[click on the pictures for a larger view]
First the good news: The ball is polished like a gem. Perfect diffusion of the light and the exact same size and weight as the stock, opaque white ball that is the arcade standard. Ultra-high scratch resistance and excellent tracking make this the best illuminated trackball money can buy...bar none.
And now the bad news: It's going to add $7 more to the price of the previous units.
Look for the store to be updated with the new version by the end of today.
Once again, I want to sincerely thank everyone who purchases their project parts through GGG. This was another very expensive project that might otherwise not have been were it not for your support :cheers:
RandyT
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Randy, your shop is like the sirens dragging me to my rocky arcade doom.
Looks amazing.
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Some may have noticed that the Electric ICE™ Trackball products have been out of stock for a few weeks. Here's why;
Oh Hell!! Now I have to replace the ball in my trackball again! To get this super wizzy polished gem......
Well done Randy! That looks really nice!
Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)
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Yeah. I never thought I'd say it, but your blue balls are quite attractive! :-*
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Wow, Looking pretty shiny! ;D
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Nice work Randy!
Wiil these be available in both 3" and 2 1/4" versions?
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Can one just buy the ball as a replacement?
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Yeah. I never thought I'd say it, but your blue balls are quite attractive! :-*
I'm going to start telling my wife she needs to help me relieve my "Electric ICE Ver 2 Trackballs". :laugh2:
Seriously, those look much better than the frosted ones IMO. Nice work.
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Doh! PM sent...
On a separate note: can we just start some kind of subscription to you, and keep getting these new goodies you come up with?
:D
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The "frosted" ball is what kept me wanting to go to happ for the translucent tb. Now I'll be getting this one for sure. I know the customer service is 1000x better going with Randy than Happ, after all, he made the damn thing.
Randy, you have now held back my progress on completing my cab in order to gather the funds for this thing, and for that I say....
Thank you.
It's awesome that you can continue to develop these fantastic parts for the community. You are a valuable piece to this crazy puzzle we call the home arcade scene.
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Nice to see an improvement to the original Ice-T ball. I bought the upgrade kit to get the ball to match my Ice buttons. The original ball in my opinion was nothing to brag about. It marked easy and was 'sticky' making it spin a good percentage less than a stock Happs. This was very noticeable on any of the Golden Tee games. But I was happy with the glow and was unable to replace it with the better Happs unit. Any chance previous returning customers might score a price break with this ball? ;)
Cornchip.
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Any chance previous returning customers might score a price break with this ball? ;)
Cornchip.
What he said...
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Any chance previous returning customers might score a price break with this ball? ;)
This is the single most difficult situation that comes about from improving a product. I would love to swap them all out, but it's just not feasible to do it.
But I certainly understand, and feel the same way when I buy something that goes obsolete. So here's what I can offer;
Anyone in the US who has purchased an Electric ICE-T Trackball, or Electric ICE Trackball upgrade kit, can buy one of these new balls for $17 shipped. Non-US customers will need to have the shipping costs calculated. I wish I could do better, but I'm afraid that is the best I can offer in this situation. As a point of reference, HAPP lists their translucent 3" replacements at around $36 each and clear at $60, plus shipping. Neither can hold a candle to this one for lighting / color changing purposes.
For anyone else, the upgrade kits will still be available and I had both 3" and 2.25" versions manufactured. A single color version using the NovaGem light source is coming at a lower cost than the RGB version, and I will consider making only the ball available as well, albeit with a premium attached.
RandyT
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Anyone in the US who has purchased an Electric ICE-T Trackball, or Electric ICE Trackball upgrade kit, can buy one of these new balls for $17 shipped.
that sounds reasonable. how can we take advantage of this?
thanks,
John
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Anyone in the US who has purchased an Electric ICE-T Trackball, or Electric ICE Trackball upgrade kit, can buy one of these new balls for $17 shipped. Non-US customers will need to have the shipping costs calculated.
I tell you what Randy!! That's still a damned fine price even with paying the shipping on top. Especially now that the US Dollar is worth diddly squat on the world markets and we get two of them for a British Pound!!! >:D ;D
You got a deal!! I'll be ordering in a couple of weeks to replace the one in my upgrade kit.
Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)
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Anyone in the US who has purchased an Electric ICE-T Trackball, or Electric ICE Trackball upgrade kit, can buy one of these new balls for $17 shipped.
that sounds reasonable. how can we take advantage of this?
thanks,
John
Agreed, count me in on this as well.
-csa
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I will be ordering one soon as well. Any progress on the ball top? Will it be frosted as well or nice and smooth?
~ D
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I'm speechless Randy. That's a very generous offer indeed. When I order the new ball, I'll make sure I get a new interface (LedWiz+GP) and other odds and ends at the same time.
Cornchip.
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I am in for the new ball as well.
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Randy, this maybe a stupid question but are these new trackballs compatible if you already have a Happ. I only see it in the Suzo on your site and just want to make sure it is the same size for a Happ base.
Thanks
By the way they look great, Nice job! :cheers:
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Randy, this maybe a stupid question but are these new trackballs compatible if you already have a Happ. I only see it in the Suzo on your site and just want to make sure it is the same size for a Happ base.
Actually, they are an Imperial model, not Suzo. But Yes, the balls and lighting units will indeed work in a HAPP trackball just fine. We include extra RGB-Overdrive mounting spacers for them in the lighting upgrade kits. The Suzos are reportedly not so simple by virtue of the non-standard housing. But it can be done if you make your own mounting plate, as one user has for his.
Thanks everyone for the words of encouragement (and your patience.) All of the Electric ICE trackball products are updated and available again. The upgrade for purchasers of V1.0 (http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=74&products_id=312) is up as well. I'll be looking at the monochromatic option shortly, for those who might be interested.
RandyT
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Even the 3" Happ (Highball type) ?
:)
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Randy, this maybe a stupid question but are these new trackballs compatible if you already have a Happ. I only see it in the Suzo on your site and just want to make sure it is the same size for a Happ base.
Actually, they are an Imperial model, not Suzo. But Yes, the balls and lighting units will indeed work in a HAPP trackball just fine. We include extra RGB-Overdrive mounting spacers for them in the lighting upgrade kits. The Suzos are reportedly not so simple by virtue of the non-standard housing. But it can be done if you make your own mounting plate, as one user has for his.
Thanks everyone for the words of encouragement (and your patience.) All of the Electric ICE trackball products are updated and available again. The upgrade for purchasers of V1.0 (http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=74&products_id=312) is up as well. I'll be looking at the monochromatic option shortly, for those who might be interested.
RandyT
Randy, you did it again. Good job. Your keeping my piggy bank empty, :-). I do believe that I am that user you were talking about. I will upload a picture attached to this thread soon as to show what type of mounting plate I had to make in order for my Suzo trackball to allow for a correct mount of the trackball RGB board. It's not the best idea but hey, it works and does the job pretty good actually. I have not even finished the wiring on my CP and you already have me interested in replacing the ball that I just bought a week ago. Shame on you. I would to be interested in a replacement. That is once I get approval from the lady of the house which may be harder than one might assume due to spending close to $500.00 on Randy's top quality products. By the way Randy, that replacement spinner tokentop is awesome. A 100 percent improvement from what I had. Thanks, Shane
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I placed my order (#5206) just as these last four posts went up. I missed that link for the upgrade for past users (I jumped the gun a little). We'll have to get that fixed. Sorry.
Cornchip.
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OMG! Just got my v1 maybe 2 weeks ago as part of a larger order. Overall - extremely happy (GGG rocks!); the ball - meh - in a dark room with the ball lit, the imperfections fade and it's a beautiful thing, but it a well lit room, holding that thing in hand....
Dude - thanks for taking the risk on this product - I have a few other trackballs that need lighting (and the booster kit, which is great). I will definitely been placing another order (once all the visa bills get paid for the last round of parts).
Thanks!
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So....... anyone looking for a v1 trackball? :)
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does the version two ice ball have the same weird smell as the version one ball...?
yes...i smelled my ball...
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does the version two ice ball have the same weird smell as the version one ball...?
yes...i smelled my ball...
Dude - you need help....
And with that, I'm going to smell mine now...
Damn you!
:angry:
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Hey Randy - I just tried to order (trackball by itself) but there are no shipping options for us in Canada so I can't get past Step 1. If I combine it with another item the shipping options come up. I just placed an order so I just want to order the trackball now.
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Hey Randy - I just tried to order (trackball by itself) but there are no shipping options for us in Canada so I can't get past Step 1. If I combine it with another item the shipping options come up. I just placed an order so I just want to order the trackball now.
Why not e-mail him directly? You will probably get a quicker response as to posting it here for all to see.
Edit: I didn't mean to be abrasive with the above statement. I was just trying to avoid off topic responses that will clutter the forum. This sounded more like "tech support" rather than an "Announcement" related response to me. Didn't mean to offend. I apologize if this was taken the wrong way, as that was not my intention.
~ DeLuSioNaL
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nice, I will be getting an upgrade very soon. thanks randy.
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Hey Randy - I just tried to order (trackball by itself) but there are no shipping options for us in Canada so I can't get past Step 1. If I combine it with another item the shipping options come up. I just placed an order so I just want to order the trackball now.
Why not e-mail him directly? You will probably get a quicker response as to posting it here for all to see.
Hey dude - thanks for posting a really helpful response here "for all to see" :dizzy:
Did you ever think there may be others here having the same issue.... move along now.
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Ok, I think I have this figured out. The store doesn't have a great way of handling this, so we'll do it manually. The description of the upgrade item has been changed to indicate how things will work, and now addresses orders including additional items. Tell me if the method doesn't make sense to anyone.
RandyT
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That works - thanks Randy.
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randy...
my question was actually legitimate...
does the v2 ball have the same weird smell as the v1 ball...?
thanks...
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randy...
my question was actually legitimate...
does the v2 ball have the same weird smell as the v1 ball...?
Uhhh, it's odorless? But so were the other ones ( I can't believe you made me sniff my balls ).
But the earlier parts were made of a material that is a tiny bit absorptive, which means that it is theoretically possible to pick up odors depending on the surroundings.
I hesitate to ask, but what does it smell like? Plastic? Something else :dunno
The new balls are completely different. They are literally the same as the stock white balls that normally come with a trackball (not the lighter, less dense material like you see with a lot of the translucents out there) but the color and translucency has been formulated to my specifications. I stress tested a ball made of this material once on a concrete floor. It bounced off the floor, hit a 15 ft ceiling, bounced around a bit more and had only a tiny pock mark because the concrete was rough. If you are disappointed by these, you want to be.
RandyT
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it smells kind of like a mixture of weed killer and bug spray... :dunno
anyone else's smell like that...?
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Mine is working just fine, so I'm going to refrain from sniffing it. Thanks.
;D
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Very very nice !
This would be especially great for applications where the original trackball was white, but where you want to add a twist, like with Centipede :) Combine it with an ICE button and you got the perfect match....nice and original looking when off, some extra spice in looks when turned on :D
So, is there an option to buy the ball only ? (2.25")
And I'd appreciate a picture when lit red :)
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it smells kind of like a mixture of weed killer and bug spray... :dunno
anyone else's smell like that...?
Ball sniffer!
Just checked mine out, and it's odorless. Fortunately, nobody witnessed me sniffing my big 3 inch ball...
;D
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So, is there an option to buy the ball only ? (2.25")
The store has been updated to offer a Ball Only Item (http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=74&products_id=273) for those who just want to kick their existing units up a notch.
I also updated the 1.0 Upgrade item with the 2.25" option for those folks.
And I'd appreciate a picture when lit red :)
Give me a day or so. Celebrating my mom's birthday later today, so a bit short on time. But I'll make it a point to do it (and maybe some other colors as well.)
RandyT
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Congrats !
Glad there's a ball-only option :)
And if I'm not too much of a pain, could you take about the same pics as the V1 were (with trackball cover on) :)
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And if I'm not too much of a pain, could you take about the same pics as the V1 were (with trackball cover on) :)
Sure.
Ok, this is the last time I move things around, I promise!
The ball only option is now listed under the normal Electric ICE™ lighting upgrade (http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=74&products_id=273) listing. If anyone just wants the ball, select "none" as the lighting option. This just made a lot more sense and got rid of the clutter. It also allowed me to add some monochromatic lighting options.
RandyT
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Sorry if this was answered elsewhere - how long will you be offering the upgrade?
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Sorry if this was answered elsewhere - how long will you be offering the upgrade?
Lets see....today is Sunday, so, 1, 2, 3...Oh, screw it. As long as it takes ;D
Seriously, I know it can take some time for folks to come up with the extra money for one of these, especially nowadays, and I want everyone who supported us with their purchase of V1.0 to have the opportunity to get the new one without paying the full price.
RandyT
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Randy, I have to ask:
Is there _any_ chance of seeing an Electric ICE button for leaf switches ?
I guess not, since you are also selling the micro-leaf but I had to ask.... :D
So if not, would the "leaf switches that fit ms-buttons" that Ponyboy sold work on the Electric Ice, while still being able to light it with a LED ?
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Is there _any_ chance of seeing an Electric ICE button for leaf switches ?
I guess not, since you are also selling the micro-leaf but I had to ask.... :D
So if not, would the "leaf switches that fit ms-buttons" that Ponyboy sold work on the Electric Ice, while still being able to light it with a LED ?
Honestly, if I could find an inexpensive source for decent and authentic pushbutton leaf switches, I would consider working on an adapter of my own. But I have not been able to.
But I think if you do a search, you might find that someone did modify those adapters to work with an EI button and RGB-Drive. IIRC, it involved dremeling off the upper portion of the adapter to allow for clearance of the circuit board. I had some concern about stability due to one of the structures of the adapter being removed but it apparently didn't affect it's operation.
RandyT
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Thanks Randy. Shame about the leaf buttons, but I already thought it would be something like that.
My plan with the IE button was to simply put a led in the bottom of it, just like with a regular translucent MS button. Simply drill a hole for the LED, shift it in and ready. There's virtually no height required for that.
I wouldn't use the RGB drive because I only need one color: red.
I want to use this on my Centipede cab because the V2.0 EI trackball and button would look pretty much original in power-off, and look very fancy when lit. This would look a _lot_ better in power off then the orange looking trackball (when unlit) I've got now, and the red translucent button.
So I just want a steady red, no color cycling, so no RGB board required.
So you think one (of your) LED is enough to light up the trackball and the button (one each of course :) )
I've got one LED under my current red translucent trackball, and I'm happy with the shine. I don't want it to be overly bright when playing the game....
Here's some pics:
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=63654.msg776121#msg776121
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So you think one (of your) LED is enough to light up the trackball and the button (one each of course :) )
I've got one LED under my current red translucent trackball, and I'm happy with the shine. I don't want it to be overly bright when playing the game....
The Electric ICE Trackballs require a little more light. They scatter everything that goes into them causing the whole ball to light very evenly, whereas your current ball acts much like a lens, allowing you to see the light source pretty clearly (and blast you in the eyes when you look down into it.) In your current situation, reduced light may be beneficial because most of it is exiting the ball.
However, the more light you give an Electric ICE ball, the more vivid and uniform the color will be. If you look at the product listing for the Lighting Upgrade Kit, you will notice the NovaGem Lighting options. These are the only single LEDs which I would suggest using. Other standard 20ma "superbrights" will work, but I would say that a minimum of 4 to 5 of them in a group will be necessary to get the best results.
The photo in the first post was taken using the RGB-Overdrive light unit, which has 4 RGB LED's on it. In that photo, only the Blue parts of each were lit, so it is the equivalent of 4 superbright Blue LED's.
I'll try to get to those photos of other colors soon.
RandyT
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Ok, as promised....
(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/EIRED.jpg)(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/EIGREEN.jpg)
(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/EIBLUE.jpg)(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/EIYELLOW.jpg)
(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/EIPURPLE.jpg)(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/EIWHITE.jpg)
(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/EIORANGE.jpg)(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/EICYAN.jpg)
The camera can't pick up some of the really subtle colors, like the awesome turquoise and hot-pink I was able to make, but it should give an idea as to the quality.
RandyT
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Randy - I love your new balls. ;) Nice job.
Are these balls heavier than the original Electric Ice ball?
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thats a great question edge. I too am wondering if these are heavier than the previous version? Randy, do tell.
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He mentioned the weight in his first posting:
First the good news: The ball is polished like a gem. Perfect diffusion of the light and the exact same size and weight as the stock white ball that is normally used. Ultra-high scratch resistance and excellent tracking make this the best illuminated trackball money can buy...bar none.
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i thought about that...but then realised that it never says what weight that is...
i have no idea if it's lighter or heavier than the v1 ball...do you...?
:dunno
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Do these balls show any color when lit during the day?
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Are these balls heavier than the original Electric Ice ball?
Yes. They are the same weight as the stock, opaque white ball, which is heavier than V1. The version 1 ball weighed about the same as a stock translucent.
Performance is identical to the stock, opaque white ball
Do these balls show any color when lit during the day?
Absolutely. See the first post. As I'm sure you know, taking a photo of a light source is extremely tricky. The darkening of the surroundings was done by the camera, which needed to have the light sensitivity adjusted down to keep the ball from overpowering the sensor. That makes the areas surrounding it appear darker than they were.
These are the best balls you will find for this application. I am not overstating this :)
RandyT
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These are the best balls you will find for this application. I am not overstating this :)
:laugh2:
You so should have constructed your product announcement like this (minus the semi-NSFW stuff):
http://www.theonion.com/content/node/33772
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...can someone post a comparison of the old ball vs the new?
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...can someone post a comparison of the old ball vs the new?
Yes, please do :) They should be be in the hands of quite a few folks at this point.
I also would like to make a comment regarding a somewhat derisive post made in reference to V1 in a different thread, by patrickl.
V1, like version 1 of anything, was the best product it could be at the time, given the circumstances surrounding the development of a new "niche" product. It was the first of it's kind ever, so we had to take a huge chance on our investment in the product. I searched very hard for a ball made of a material that could be tweaked a bit in manufacturing to provide good functionality, but also one that didn't require us to spend many thousands of dollars on a product for an untested market. I heard "impossible" or got huge price quotes from so many manufacturers that we were fortunate to be able to provide what we could. Based on the majority of positive comments and the quantity we have provided, it's difficult not to think that V1 was a great success. Even so, I never stopped looking to improve it. Now that we have a solid indicator that the market is ready for such a product, we found a reliable manufacturer and have invested those thousands of dollars, making the product even better. It also comes as no surprise that our lead is once again being followed after doing such.
The fact that we were finally able to source these superb new items from a high quality U.S. manufacturer is just icing on the cake. High profit for GGG on the balls isn't as important as the ability to establish a relationship with the manufacturer in the way of more orders, which helps to keep them and their employees around for the next time. Something that is not "a given" considering the current state of factory jobs in the U.S.
These are the reasons why it is important to me that the V2 upgrade to be affordable to all who purchased V1. V2 is the version I would have liked to have offered from the start, but it just was not possible at that time.
On another note, about 4 weeks ago I developed a new trackball mounting method, during the design phase of an upcoming control panel product that we hope to bring to market soon. It is a "high-ball" installation for a 3/4" panel that requires only a few pieces of special hardware and a template (no mounting plate). If you have a router, a drill and the the most rudimentary of skills with them, you will be able to install your EI trackball cleanly and with no big, ugly mounting plates or carriage bolts. Only a small round bezel (in your choice of color) around the ball itself.
The kit will be inexpensive and will be available as soon as I can finish the prototypes.
RandyT
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Randy, good that you responded to that. I think Patrick should have mentioned that in this thread and not in the one about Andy's new balls. But I figure he thought you'd read it anyway there....
If you buy a product, there often is a mention in the manual that the manufacturer reserves the right to change or improve the product. If I buy a certain product now, I can bet that there will be an improved version in the near future. That gives the buyer no right to anything. This is just how it works in real-life.
Instead, Randy offers a very fair deal on the replacement for V1 buyers and I think that's a great thing. Shows how he thinks about customer satisfaction etc.
I hope we can keep this thread to talking about the product however !!!!!!
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Randy, what is the Novagem light-source ?
And does it fit an original Atari trackball ?
O, and thanks for the pictures. Is that Red the same color on the Novagem light-source ?
I am asking this because many super-bright LED's that are being sold now look more orange than red to me. And I want red. Not orange :D (The red on the pictures looks great)
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What is the Novagem light-source ?
It is a very high output LED, equivalent to the luminous flux of about 5 of the normal "superbright" variety.
Just a quick note here as well: LED output is measured by luminous flux not MCD. You can have 2 LED's with the exact same light output, even though one is rated at 5000mcd and the other at 2500mcd.
And does it fit an original Atari trackball ?
I don't have an Atari, but I do have an original WICO, which I understand to be the same. Essentially, if it has large hole in the bottom, and next to the large hole is a small hole intended for a lighting assembly, yes, it will work.
RandyT
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Well, this is the underside of my Atari trackball:
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0413/web.jpg)
There seems to be only one small hole....I put the LED in there (just an experimental set-up).
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There seems to be only one small hole....I put the LED in there (just an experimental set-up).
Yes, the 2.25 inch has a small hole, but you can drill it out to make it larger easily enough.
The 3 inch version has a much larger hole.
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I have the 3" WICO, so they aren't the same. Yes, you would probably need to drill that one out a bit for best effect (good suggestion.) And as long as you have the drill handy, it won't take much to put a small screw hole next to it.
RandyT
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Thank, sounds easy enough.
Randy, thanks for all your prompt responses. I will place the order within the hour :D
[Edit] Order placed
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I also would like to make a comment regarding a somewhat derisive post made in reference to V1 in a different thread, by patrickl.
Haven't read it - not interested in whiners. I was a bit disappointed to hear of a newer, better ball so soon after getting a v1, but this is a fact of life - I got exactly what I bought, nothing to complain about (not even sure if this is what the other post was about). Newer stuff comes out all the time (think: computers). The fact that you are offering an upgrade is great; an offer I will accept as soon as money and the boss allow.
On another note, about 4 weeks ago I developed a new trackball mounting method...
The kit will be inexpensive and will be available as soon as I can finish the prototypes.
Can't wait - I suspect this is just what I've been looking for - a way to mount the ball higher than stock (pull the top off), and not worry about it smacking into the 3" hole I cut for it to stick out of the CP (being mounted below). Again, when money and boss permit, .... You're really killing my finances (but it's not all bad)
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Wait, so this upgrade means i will pay $17 dollars just for the ball so I can exchange it with the old not as glossy trackball?
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Wait, so this upgrade means i will pay $17 dollars just for the ball so I can exchange it with the old not as glossy trackball?
If you are in the U.S. it's $17 shipped. $14 + shipping for users outside of the U.S.
V2 offers better looks, performance and durability. If you are happy with V1, there's no need to upgrade. The path was simply made available to those who wished to.
RandyT
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Awesome, I'll upgrade mines then ;D
So as someone previously mentioned, how about a newsletter to promote your new hardware incase I miss it at these forums.
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...can someone post a comparison of the old ball vs the new?
Just got mine today! (Thanks RandyT)
There is no doubt in my mind that V2 is worth every penny. I just dropped it in and played my first game of Centipede. It feels right, and looks as good as if not better than the old ball as far as illumination goes, with this one of course having that "shine"in addition.. It has, as one might expect, a harder surface than v1, and it rolls better and longer in my old wico TB casing than the v1 ball did. Tracking seems to me to be slightly better, and My 4 year old daughter just doubled her previous high score..
A Special thanks to RandyT for offering the discount for buyers of V1.
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A question was asked earlier about single LED lighting and I said it would work. I figured I should back that up with a photo (unmodified), so here it is thrown on top of a single 49 cent Red ButtonBlaster LED (http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=83&products_id=264);
(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/1_ButtonBlaster.jpg)
You can see the room lights reflected on the glossy surface of the ball, and the fact that you can easily make out the PCB and the wires shows that there is a reasonable amount of ambient light. If your gaming area has it's lighting subdued at all, or the panel is shaded, this setup will probably be sufficient. But in direct lighting, the NovaGem and RGB-Overdrive light sources will perform far better and overpower any reasonable ambient lighting to really make it "pop".
Hopefully this will better demonstrate the lighting characteristics of the ball.
RandyT
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Can't wait - I suspect this is just what I've been looking for - a way to mount the ball higher than stock (pull the top off), and not worry about it smacking into the 3" hole I cut for it to stick out of the CP (being mounted below).
Finally got a chance to prototype the kit. This is a bit of an improvement on that method, through the use of some specialized items. If everything is done as shown in the documentation, then it all goes together with very little precision required at the router step. In fact, it can be pretty sloppy and everything will still look great.
I felt a bit silly using a hand-router to do this on the table of my 4'x8' CNC, but I guess it was necessary to demonstrate how easily it can be done by hand. It also gave me chance to show just how imprecise the router work can be without it negatively affecting this mounting method.
The camera never seems to do the lighting justice, but here's a pic (you can click it to make it larger);
(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/hiballmount639.jpg) (http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/hiballmount1024.jpg)
This result is a true High-ball, with the apex of the ball sitting a full inch above the panel surface and no bolt heads.
The kit with have a price of $6.95 and include 1card-stock template, 1 finishing plate, 3 finishing plate screws, 4 threaded inserts, 4 trackball mounting machine screws, a 5mm Hex Key and full instructions. It should be available in a few days.
RandyT
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The camera never seems to do the lighting justice, but here's a pic (you can click it to make it larger);
(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/hiballmount639.jpg) (http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/hiballmount1024.jpg)
That looks real nice. :applaud:
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It should be available in a few days.
I think I shall be placing an order in a few days ;D
Looks great, just what I need - thanks!
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A question was asked earlier about single LED lighting and I said it would work.
Yep, that was my question. Well, I decided to go with the Novagem lighting module. We'll see how it turns out :)
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I hate you Randy. :hissy:
I have a trackball I'm perfectly happy with (A Happs 3" I got a great deal on off of E-Bay), but now I want to buy one of yours. Plus, I want to buy 80 other things on your website. You make grown men cry........................
Thank you government for the tax rebate check. :cheers: ;D
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Randy, this maybe a stupid question but are these new trackballs compatible if you already have a Happ. I only see it in the Suzo on your site and just want to make sure it is the same size for a Happ base.
Actually, they are an Imperial model, not Suzo. But Yes, the balls and lighting units will indeed work in a HAPP trackball just fine. We include extra RGB-Overdrive mounting spacers for them in the lighting upgrade kits. The Suzos are reportedly not so simple by virtue of the non-standard housing. But it can be done if you make your own mounting plate, as one user has for his.
Thanks everyone for the words of encouragement (and your patience.) All of the Electric ICE trackball products are updated and available again. The upgrade for purchasers of V1.0 (http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=74&products_id=312) is up as well. I'll be looking at the monochromatic option shortly, for those who might be interested.
RandyT
Pictures as promised Randy and BYOAC members. Still not sure what type of trackball I have. Besides the GGG hardware, the only other companies that I ordered from were happcontrols and ultimarc. I think the trackball may be an older model Suzo. Anyway, I had no way to mount Randy's RGB trackball board so I used an exacto nife and etched out the appropriate diminsions for the RGB board. This was a very time consuming process. The plastic mount came from a CD cover which I found is very easy to break. I have a couple music cd's that no longer have covers, ;D. No laughing here, :laugh: but the mount did the trick. It's not the best looking mount by far but I do believe will work. The screw holes were already predrilled on the trackball so not much work to be done there. I had to drill out the holes a little to match the screws I had but besides that, I think everything worked out awesome.
The other pictures attached are to just show possible ways of routing the cables and how I went about mounting the LedWiz devices and running the appropriate cables for those controllers. The only ledwiz that I have done is the one shown. Three more to finish. Still need to run 5V to the Opti-Pac, ledwiz controllers (4). Other than that, I think I have it pretty well knocked out.
Look at the screw heads on the ledwiz controller. Do you think I will need to replace the screws due to the heads being really close to the circuitry and or am I in the clear? They are the screws that came with the ledwiz controllers.
Can't wait to see all the buttons and trackball light up the way they should!! Thanks to Randy for his great products. You can see that I have the spinner kit from Randy as well. I am very impressed with the spinner knob. Thanks, Shane
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Look at the screw heads on the ledwiz controller. Do you think I will need to replace the screws due to the heads being really close to the circuitry and or am I in the clear? They are the screws that came with the ledwiz controllers.
Nahh, those screw heads are a mile away from anything ;)
Nice job on the adapter for the RGB-OverDrive unit. Looks like it worked out fine. Good looking wiring job there as well!
RandyT
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Holy smokes !
I just got home and my neighbor rings at the door, she has a package for me
It's from the US so it must be.......yes it's the GGG stuff Ice ball and button and some lighting stuff.
Looks very nice, and incredibly fast delivery !!!! I ordered it 7 days ago, and I chose the cheapest shipping method !
Expect some pictures of the mounted stuff here soon.....
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OK, I just dropped in the ball, with the same LED I already had in there:
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0095/web.jpg)
Obviously, the single LED is not enough to properly light this one up...however, as Randy mentioned, the light coming from the ball is MUCH more even than that of the "orange/red" ball I had before. It's a really nice glow, and even when spinning the ball you don't see any changes.
Here's an "unlit" shot. It is dark over here now, so I can't take any daylight pics....this one is without flashlight.,,,
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0096/web.jpg)
To compare with the original (dirty and yellowed) ball:
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF1687/web.jpg)
This ball feels heavier (in playing) that the orange/red ball I had before, and it plays a LOT nicer because of that !!!!! Not only is control more precise, when I give it a good swing it keeps rolling longer because of the bigger mass.....I really really like that !
Sadly I have other things to do tonight, so I can't wire up the other lighting stuff yet (nor the button), but I'm sure happy how it looks so far....
OK, it will never be the 100% original look. The ball is a bit milky white while Centipede originaly had an off-white ball. So it will always be a compromise. But I like it 100 times better than that orange/white thing I had before !:
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0063/web.jpg)
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Randy, are the Led's resistor meant for +5V ?
And that Nova -LED assembly ?
O and thanks about my "special request" :cheers:
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Randy, are the Led's resistor meant for +5V ?
And that Nova -LED assembly ?
Yes to both. Just hook the Red wire to +5v DC and the Black to GROUND.
And don't look straight into the Nova-LED ;D
RandyT
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No kidding ! These are VERY bright !
I just installed the Nova-Led on the trackball. Yes there is a lot more light coming from the ball now, exacly like I want it ! :cheers: :cheers: :applaud: :applaud: It is not TOO bright, but a nice, very even red glow.
I also hooked up the ICE button.
First a "naked" compare to a "real" white leaf button. Of course the ICE is a little milkier looking, still close enough !
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0099/web.jpg)
Then the button installed with one of the LED's, what are they called button blaster LEDs I guess.....:D
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0104/web.jpg)
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0105/web.jpg)
Looks very nice. The spread of light is not as even as with the ball however. When you look on top, you can clearly make out the LED. But overall, the effect of this is very nice, and being it white when turned off is the real bonus and goal for me.
It would be great if the same even look could also be accomplished with the button (material ?) but it's fine as it is. It looks a lot better than the red-translucent leaf button that was in there before, with regards to the same "look" as the ball.
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0106/web.jpg)
The overall feeling of the button is fine. However, the spring inside seems to be "loose" or something, or too light, I don't know, but it is resonating like hell. That really has to be fixed. I hope it's just my button. I will give some other springs a try tomorrow.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUXfS-Csl_U[/youtube]
I also ordered the much discussed micro-leaf switch, which still is a micro-switch. First: the people who claim that the click is almost unhearable are either lying or deaf. Maybe it's because it's on a metal panel, but I can clearly hear the clicks when playing. They are not the loud clicks of some of the cheap MicroSwitches, they are more civilized, but they are there, of course, because it's still a micro-switch :D
The feeling is very very good. Yes you can feel the click, but it is very very light. I _MIGHT_ consider keeping it in, if it wasn't for the click sound.
Let's call this the "best micro-switch for feeling and sound" and not the micro-leaf :)
I will try one of ponyboy's real leaf buttons tomorrow, and I guess I will settle for that.
In all honesty, I think the Midway leaf switches are the nicest I've ever played with (the one's on my Galaxian). A MS button with Ponyboy's leafs are nice, but not coming close to the feeling,mostly because of the sheer mass of the leafs on the Midway's....
But I'm running away..... I'm very very pleased with the results. Needs a bit of tweaking but we'll work that out tomorrow....
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I said I could hear the click when I'm playing. That is not really true, I meant I could here it when it was silent. Of course game sounds, and other surrounding sounds will mask the click sound. Bottom line is that a leaf is still quiter.
One excellent thing about the ICE ball (V2.0):
When I look at the machine where my eye is at (or about) the same level as the CP, I can clearly see the nice, even red glow coming from it. With the orange/red translucent (happ) ball I had before, the lighting was hardly noticeable, because of the lens-effect that Randy already explained.
You can cleary see this in the reflection of the ball in the bezel on this pic:
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0104/web.jpg)
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Looking back at those pictures I think they don't do the ball and button justice. What seems overly bright (almost white) light, is a very nice red even glow....it is very hard to make a picture that shows the real look of it.
Anyway, here are some daylight shots. Keep in mind that the Centi is now in my kitchen, not far from a window and it was a very bright day today here, and it's winter so the sun is at a low position, directly letting light fall on the machine:
Unlit:
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0108/web.jpg)
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0109/web.jpg)
Lit. Again the picture is not like the real thing. The light from the ball and button is better than it looks here. But of course direct sunlight is overwhelming. It was hard to see the game picture on the monitor, that's how bright it was:
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0111/web.jpg)
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0112/web.jpg)
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0113/web.jpg)
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0114/web.jpg)
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0115/web.jpg)
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(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0126/web.jpg)
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Looks perfect in all of those pictures, and it's clear that you're very pleased with it. I really must get round to ordering my replacement ball some time this week.
Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)
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Thanks for the review - and also may I be the first for thanking you for restoring that control panel and getting rid of those horrid buttons that were there previously!
:cheers:
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Doesn't it make more sense to get a translucent red ball and translucent leaf switches (like on your mame cab) when you want them all to look red?
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Doesn't it make more sense to get a translucent red ball and translucent leaf switches (like on your mame cab) when you want them all to look red?
the ice balls spread light evenly...a translucent ball does not...
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Doesn't it make more sense to get a translucent red ball and translucent leaf switches (like on your mame cab) when you want them all to look red?
I think it boils down to preference: translucent looks better unlit, electric ice looks better lit. Personally, I would go the looks better lit route myself...
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Doesn't it make more sense to get a translucent red ball and translucent leaf switches (like on your mame cab) when you want them all to look red?
Uh, dat staat toch precies allemaal in mijn laatste berichten hier:
1) Onverlicht: witte knop, witte bal
2) Verlicht: mooi verdeeld, gelijkmatig rood licht. De Happ heeft een lens-werking. Als je er bijvoorbeeld haaks tegen aankijkt zie je zowat geen licht. De ICE strooit het licht alle kanten op ipv het te bundelen in het midden....
Daarnaast speelt de ICE bal een stuk beter dan de HAPP translucent vanwege het correcte gewicht.
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I'm mostly talking about the translucent red leaf switches on your other cab which I think look better. On the other hand, the ball also seems to look a bit pink instead of red when the picture isn't taken in the dark.
Anyway, I agree with Havok, it's probably more a matter of preference. Although the correct weight and handling of the ball would indeed be more important than looks.
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I have a blue Novagem LED from RandyT lighting a blue translucent ball (not his) and I think it lights it extremely well. The light is even across the ball. It looks good in the day or night with the Novagem lighting it up. I don't think it has much to do with the ball itself; rather, the Novagem is great.
Uh, dat staat toch precies allemaal in mijn laatste berichten hier:
1) Onverlicht: witte knop, witte bal
2) Verlicht: mooi verdeeld, gelijkmatig rood licht. De Happ heeft een lens-werking. Als je er bijvoorbeeld haaks tegen aankijkt zie je zowat geen licht. De ICE strooit het licht alle kanten op ipv het te bundelen in het midden....
Daarnaast speelt de ICE bal een stuk beter dan de HAPP translucent vanwege het correcte gewicht.
:o
Can we get a translation please? :)
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Uh, dat staat toch precies allemaal in mijn laatste berichten hier:
1) Onverlicht: witte knop, witte bal
2) Verlicht: mooi verdeeld, gelijkmatig rood licht. De Happ heeft een lens-werking. Als je er bijvoorbeeld haaks tegen aankijkt zie je zowat geen licht. De ICE strooit het licht alle kanten op ipv het te bundelen in het midden....
Daarnaast speelt de ICE bal een stuk beter dan de HAPP translucent vanwege het correcte gewicht.
:o
Can we get a translation please? :)
Sure, here you go:
Hi Patrickl, I'd love to get it on with your man meat
1) You'll love my one big white ball - I shave it regularly
2) I am double jointed so I can make you feel like the woman you are. How about we meet at the Blue Oyster Bar tonight? I'll be the one wearing the three inch heels and diamond studded dog collar.
Can't wait to see you!
;D
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Uh, dat staat toch precies allemaal in mijn laatste berichten hier:
1) Onverlicht: witte knop, witte bal
2) Verlicht: mooi verdeeld, gelijkmatig rood licht. De Happ heeft een lens-werking. Als je er bijvoorbeeld haaks tegen aankijkt zie je zowat geen licht. De ICE strooit het licht alle kanten op ipv het te bundelen in het midden....
Daarnaast speelt de ICE bal een stuk beter dan de HAPP translucent vanwege het correcte gewicht.
This is what babel.altavista.com makes of it :angel: :
Uh, which stand nevertheless exact all in my last bulletins here:
1) Unlit: white bud, white ball
2) lighted: nicely divided, even rood lifts. Lens-werking have the Happ. If you look at see for example haaks you zowat none slightly. THE ICE scatter it slightly all sides on ipv it to join in the middle....
Moreover the ICE play ball a piece improve then the HAPP translucent because of the correct weight.
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Waaay off...
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The Happ translucent wasn't a deep red looking thing either:
(http://gallery.mac.com/andre.huijts/100081/DSCF0420/web.jpg)
You can clearly see that the button is red, and the ball is orange. This is LIT.
You can se the lens effect pretty well here:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlfezwBHn7U[/youtube]
Compare it to the even glow of the ICE.
Patrick, I guess you gotta see it in real life, you're welcome to come and check it out :)
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Uh, dat staat toch precies allemaal in mijn laatste berichten hier:
1) Onverlicht: witte knop, witte bal
2) Verlicht: mooi verdeeld, gelijkmatig rood licht. De Happ heeft een lens-werking. Als je er bijvoorbeeld haaks tegen aankijkt zie je zowat geen licht. De ICE strooit het licht alle kanten op ipv het te bundelen in het midden....
Daarnaast speelt de ICE bal een stuk beter dan de HAPP translucent vanwege het correcte gewicht.
:o
Can we get a translation please? :)
Sure, here you go:
Hi Patrickl, I'd love to get it on with your man meat
1) You'll love my one big white ball - I shave it regularly
2) I am double jointed so I can make you feel like the woman you are. How about we meet at the Blue Oyster Bar tonight? I'll be the one wearing the three inch heels and diamond studded dog collar.
Can't wait to see you!
;D
:laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:
Stupid Babelfish doesn't even translate rood to red :dunno
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I just ordered my v2 trackball, along w/ 50ft of t molding.
Couple of quick questions (I'm really not trying to get OT here, but to save another new thread)...
I don't have any type of lighting controller, I understand you just connect the color you want to the ground? So in this case, I want the ball to glow red, I wire the red control wire to the Ground? Also - mouse buttons....can I use existing buttons for mouse buttons or do I need to add additional? I'd like to use this in windows, I have a keywiz currently, that I've yet to wire. I'd like to re-use buttons.
Thanks all!
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As to give a clue about the weight of the ball being important:
I just improved my personal record with over 12000 points ! This was my first serious try to improve it after I installed the ball. I can do this seriously only when wife and kid are not around.....
67344 is my new record now... :laugh:
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On the other hand, the ball also seems to look a bit pink instead of red when the picture isn't taken in the dark.
Patrick, please read what he wrote:
Looking back at those pictures I think they don't do the ball and button justice. What seems overly bright (almost white) light, is a very nice red even glow....it is very hard to make a picture that shows the real look of it.
It was hard to see the game picture on the monitor, that's how bright it was:
The ball isn't "pink" and you don't need to be "in the dark" for it to be red. It is just the camera's way of "making sense" of the overall image. Most cameras don't do well with pictures of light sources. The automatic exposure settings drop like crazy when metered on the light source, which shows the light source well, but makes everything else in the frame look pitch black.
And if the light on the cab is so intense that one can barely see the screen of the CRT (washout) then obviously that same intense light will affect the appearance of the diffuser (trackball). They haven't made a transmissive material that transmits visible light in only one direction. The laws of physics state that you can't. :)
RandyT
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I read what he wrote and I saw the pictures. He took the picture in an unlit kitchen and it burned out the image of the ball losing color. Indeed that could be seen as a metering issue, but I wasn't talking about that situation.
I'm talking about the situation where the room is properly lit. Ambient light will always overpower the LED to some extent and bring back the white depending on the ratio of ambient light versus the LED. As the sun lit images show, given enough ambient light the ball turns almost completely white. That's not a metering issue. That's simply the laws of physics.
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To an extend, patrick is right.
I do think it's not 100% possible to give a very deep red (like the red that comes from coin entry buttons) with a LED light source. A white incadescent light source has almost a full range of visible light frequencies. A LED is very limited. Most ultra-bright "RED" LED's look a bit orange-ish to me. The Nova-led, is much better in that way. However, yes the white material tends to "shift" the light a bit towards a lighter-red (SURELY not pink) in bright light. The darker it gets, the less this seems to be the case.
Now, I personaly think that an arcade cab should never be in a very bright environment. Arcades were pretty dark, and there were reasons for that (CRT brightness, the effect of lights on pins etc.) My to-be-built "arcade" will be properly "lit". I KNOW it's going to look great, whatever the weather or time of day.
I think the only way of getting an evern deeper/darker red is by using a red translucent ball. But I don't want a red ball for the reasons I already mentioned.
If things go well, I will be able to do a comparison between the balls of Randy and Andy in the near future.
I am very satisfied with the ICE ball. The improvement over the Happ orange/red ball is dramatic both in looks and in feel.
The look is very,very attrative and I really think it spices up the Centipede's CPO AND the machine as a whole.
[Edit] I think the picure that only shows the button, ball and part of the screen is the best match to the real look. Note that I did NOT take that picture in the dark ! It _was_ at night, but I had the usual lights on in the kitchen.
My camera is pretty good , especialy in color (Fujifilm S6500fd).
(http://www.photokina-show.com/news_images/0097_fujifilm_finepix_s6500fd.jpg)
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Indeed in a game room the lights normally aren't that bright.
BTW I have seen pictures of translucent balls that do light up evenly. See Knievels work and HooPZ mentioned his ball lights up evenly too.
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Indeed in a game room the lights normally aren't that bright.
BTW I have seen pictures of translucent balls that do light up evenly. See Knievels work and HooPZ mentioned his ball lights up evenly too.
/me thinks 37 years of frustration while waiting for someone to ask to see a picture of his ball may be ending soon!
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Indeed in a game room the lights normally aren't that bright.
BTW I have seen pictures of translucent balls that do light up evenly. See Knievels work and HooPZ mentioned his ball lights up evenly too.
/me thinks 37 years of frustration while waiting for someone to ask to see a picture of his ball may be ending soon!
I was wondering if there were some revealing pictures of your ball around, but I thought asking for it might be inappropriate :P
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Knievl's ball in the Neon Mame looks to be a regular 3" blue translucent (Happ) ball. You can see the lens effect happening on his pics too (outside of the ball is darker then the center). Not sure how Knievel illuminated it, with a single LED or several. Also, a blue ball is still blue unlit. There were once translucent red balls that were also (more) red unlit (instead of orange):
(http://homearcade.org/BBBB/chred.jpg)
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The pictures of those "red" balls look pretty bad :o
Knievl's ball in the Neon Mame looks to be a regular 3" blue translucent (Happ) ball. You can see the lens effect happening on his pics too (outside of the ball is darker then the center).
Sure there is a minor lens effect, but it's not like there is "virtually no light visible" if you look at the ball from the side.
(http://www.knievelkustoms.com/arcadeus.jpg) (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=48079.msg512633#msg512633)
That one seems to use 3 leds through the hole in the bottom. *snicker*
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Well, I only used 1 LED on both balls, so that's not fair ;)
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BTW I have seen pictures of translucent balls that do light up evenly. See Knievels work and HooPZ mentioned his ball lights up evenly too.
Patrick, There's "evenly" and there's evenly. You really should actually see one of the V2 ICE balls before attempting to talk to the differences. Frankly, without having a proper frame of reference to do so, as Level42 does, it's just meaningless banter that does little more than to confuse those who might actually be interested in the product.
RandyT
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He will see it on his next visit here :)
I replaced the spring with one from a translucent red MS button I had around. Springy sound problem gone.
I also installed the leaf switch from Ponyboy. I have done some extensive modding of it, to get it to fit with the LED and to make it feel like I want it to.
In all honesty.......... I might switch back to Randy's micro-leaf switch......not sure yet, but it could be that for Centipede this is the way to go. The nature of Centipede's firing (holding, and somtimes aiming single shots) is different from f.i. a game like 1942 or Galaxian.
The sound of the leaf in there now is actualy louder clicking than Randy's Micro-Leaf, and the resistance a bit too much for my taste, feels pretty firm to press down. I may be able to tweak it a bit more, but returning the Micro-Leaf is definitely a possibility.
Expect pictures in my Centipede thread about all this soon...
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Well I thought I had the right to ask some obvious questions. There are some advantages and disadvantages to ICE (vs translucent) and indeed I'd like to be able to make an informed decision before shelling out a lot of money just to see it in person. Also I'm not going to take the word of a salesperson who only speaks in superlatives/buzz words and never sees a downside to anything he sells (even though he sells both options).
Anyway, I got my answers from Level42. Thanks for that :cheers: Indeed I hope to see your Centipede sometime. It looks like another impressive restoration.
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Also I'm not going to take the word of a salesperson who only speaks in superlatives/buzz words and never sees a downside to anything he sells (even though he sells both options).
Regardless of your mis-characterizations, the folks who ask me for advice and get straight, no-nonsense answers to questions relating their specific needs know better.
There are always "downsides" and "upsides" to everything, and in most cases the thing that qualifies them either way is purely the needs of the individual. Case in point: A heavier, arcade standard ball performs better than a lighter ball, which still perform well. Before now, heavier, arcade standard balls were opaque and/or could not be evenly illuminated so as to change their color, pulse, etc, so the "upside" of an opaque ball really doesn't matter if the trackball on a panel is expected to light and change colors. The right product depends on the priorities of the individual, so it would make no sense for me not to offer options or disparage one or the other without knowing the application for which it is destined.
I replaced the spring with one from a translucent red MS button I had around. Springy sound problem gone.
Something else you can do if a spring is a little "twingy" is take the spring out and give it a little stretch to increase the length slightly. This will ensure a more solid contact with the insides of the button when it is fully extended, and remove any rattle. This will work for any button, not just the EI variety.
RandyT
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Just ordered my upgrade ball - can't wait to get it!
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Also I'm not going to take the word of a salesperson who only speaks in superlatives/buzz words and never sees a downside to anything he sells (even though he sells both options).
Regardless of your mis-characterizations, the folks who ask me for advice and get straight, no-nonsense answers to questions relating their specific needs know better.
Well I asked about the color in a lighted room and all I got was a story about metering problems in a dark (or poorly lit) room.
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Just installed the new "replacement" ball and what a difference - silky smooth and looks great. Big improvement over the original electric ice ball. :applaud:
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They haven't made a transmissive material that transmits visible light in only one direction.
I think they have or are close, though you'll find it in an expensive optics lab.
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They haven't made a transmissive material that transmits visible light in only one direction.
I think they have or are close, though you'll find it in an expensive optics lab.
Link please. Keep in mind that such at thing would be similar to a wall that you can walk through from one direction but is physically solid from the other...at the same time. ;)
RandyT
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just ordered my 3" ICE ball on Friday! :) Quick question though.. The general consensus seem to be that people prefer Happ's TBs of Wico/Betson/Imperial.. but why? what is it that makes the two different? better bearings? difference in the ball material/density? I can't imagine that the housing makes a difference! :) In my case I also ordered new rollers and bearing from RandyT so basically I'll have a brand new Betson with an Electric Ice ball. I'm just curiously about how its going to perform vs a Happ.
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I ordered the entire 3" Electric Ice T Trackball unit from GGG. It is actually a 3" Betson Imperial trackball that has been upgraded with the Trackball booster kit. I love it, although keep in mind that it needs to be broken in for about 1 month. I did this by playing 1 trackball game a day for 30 days. Now it works great!
http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=74&products_id=283
So to answer your question. I think your trackball will work just fine.
~ DeLuSioNaL
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They haven't made a transmissive material that transmits visible light in only one direction.
I think they have or are close, though you'll find it in an expensive optics lab.
Link please. Keep in mind that such at thing would be similar to a wall that you can walk through from one direction but is physically solid from the other...at the same time. ;)
Like a polarizer.
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I ordered the entire 3" Electric Ice T Trackball unit from GGG. It is actually a 3" Betson Imperial trackball that has been upgraded with the Trackball booster kit. I love it, although keep in mind that it needs to be broken in for about 1 month. I did this by playing 1 trackball game a day for 30 days. Now it works great!
http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=74&products_id=283
So to answer your question. I think your trackball will work just fine.
~ DeLuSioNaL
ahh ok.. at one point I thought he was using the Happs housing for a base.. well that's good news :) I guess I could always break the bearing in with a drill at high speed like Bob Roberts does :D
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Like a polarizer.
Polarizers change the lights polarization. "Polarized" material only allows light to pass which is in the same orientation as the material. But it does this in both directions and unprocessed light is not polarized. ;)
RandyT
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Like a polarizer.
Polarizers change the lights polarization. "Polarized" material only allows light to pass which is in the same orientation as the material. But it does this in both directions and unprocessed light is not polarized. ;)
Indeed. I misunderstood the use of the phrase "in only one direction" to mean acessable going North & South but not East & West.
How about mirrored tint? :)
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I just got my v2 setup on saturday. Even though it took me about 3 hours to get it all mounted (I'm worthless with this kind of stuff...) It took literally all of 30 seconds to plug this thing in and it's working!!! I need to adjust the sensitivity and wire up the light, but I'm very impressed with the ball surface/weight. I'm very happy I chose this trackball. I will post pictures of the ball once I wire up the light.
Thanks again Randy!
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Link please. Keep in mind that such at thing would be similar to a wall that you can walk through from one direction but is physically solid from the other...at the same time. ;)
RandyT
Aren't one-way mirrors getting along that route? As well, there's electron tunneling; electrons are convertible to photons. However, I'm thinking along the lines of metamaterials.
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I think one way mirrors are only one-way because one room is dark and the other is lit :D
PS this has what to do with trackballs again? :D
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(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/hiballmount639.jpg) (http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/hiballmount1024.jpg)
This result is a true High-ball, with the apex of the ball sitting a full inch above the panel surface and no bolt heads.
The kit with have a price of $6.95 and include 1card-stock template, 1 finishing plate, 3 finishing plate screws, 4 threaded inserts, 4 trackball mounting machine screws, a 5mm Hex Key and full instructions. It should be available in a few days.
RandyT
This still a work in progress? By my reckoning of days..... :dunno
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I am wondering about the above also. sent an email but never got a response.
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I've held off submitting my order for a bunch of stuff (to save shipping$) ...well, since Feb 10 it seems. But I guess that's the pace of this hobby. I thought I'd have a cab built in a day, but when it came time to making specific decisions...
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(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/hiballmount639.jpg) (http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/hiballmount1024.jpg)
This result is a true High-ball, with the apex of the ball sitting a full inch above the panel surface and no bolt heads.
The kit with have a price of $6.95 and include 1card-stock template, 1 finishing plate, 3 finishing plate screws, 4 threaded inserts, 4 trackball mounting machine screws, a 5mm Hex Key and full instructions. It should be available in a few days.
RandyT
This still a work in progress? By my reckoning of days..... :dunno
wow.. how did I miss that! That's one "sexy" trackball :P
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<crickets chirp>
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He's waiting until I THINK I have my cabinet completed... Then he'll announce a new product and I'll have to tear my control panel apart again... sneaky Wizard!
"He walks here and there they say, as an old man hooded and cloaked...His spies slip through every net."
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lmao - sorry, something about that which caused me to unload my bladder - it was precious
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lol... glad you liked it :)
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Can't wait - I suspect this is just what I've been looking for - a way to mount the ball higher than stock (pull the top off), and not worry about it smacking into the 3" hole I cut for it to stick out of the CP (being mounted below).
Finally got a chance to prototype the kit. This is a bit of an improvement on that method, through the use of some specialized items. If everything is done as shown in the documentation, then it all goes together with very little precision required at the router step. In fact, it can be pretty sloppy and everything will still look great.
I felt a bit silly using a hand-router to do this on the table of my 4'x8' CNC, but I guess it was necessary to demonstrate how easily it can be done by hand. It also gave me chance to show just how imprecise the router work can be without it negatively affecting this mounting method.
The camera never seems to do the lighting justice, but here's a pic (you can click it to make it larger);
(http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/hiballmount639.jpg) (http://www.groovygamegear.com/Store_Images/hiballmount1024.jpg)
This result is a true High-ball, with the apex of the ball sitting a full inch above the panel surface and no bolt heads.
The kit with have a price of $6.95 and include 1card-stock template, 1 finishing plate, 3 finishing plate screws, 4 threaded inserts, 4 trackball mounting machine screws, a 5mm Hex Key and full instructions. It should be available in a few days.
RandyT
Why don't I see this product on the website?
Am I missing it?
I would love to order the new mount with the new trackball.
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It's not on the website because it isn't finished yet (my guess). I'm hoping it wasn't canceled, given that the mounting kit is a recent addition. My understanding of things is that Randy is a busy guy, and doesn't release a product until it is ready for us enthusiasts to install and take a beating to. I've been hoping for an update, but it seems no comments on this product have come forth recently :'(
I don't want the traditional mounting kit, I want a real high-ball option! RAAAAAANDEEEEEEEE!!!
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I don't want the traditional mounting kit, I want a real high-ball option! RAAAAAANDEEEEEEEE!!!
My apologies for the delay. I have all of the pictures for the write up, but haven't actually found the time to do the rest.
I will really try to get this ready over the weekend.
RandyT
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I missed it by almost another whole weekend, but the high-ball Install kit (http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=74&products_id=315) was added to the store yesterday. EI-Trackball purchaser, past and present, will get it for $5.95. All others looking to mount an Imperial TB, the price is $8.95.
Again, I apologize for it taking so long. The documentation was the holdup, and as I wanted to be very thorough, it ended up being 23 photos and ~2100 words! It could have been much shorter, but I wanted to make sure every possible detail would be covered. It's very "step-by-step".
It took less time for me to do the actual original installation than it will probably take some to read the instructions :) But at least the extra info is there for those who might need it.
RandyT
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I'm guessing this replaces part of the case on the Betson right? I can't think of any other way it could work... ???
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That's one great TB mod Randy. :applaud:
I wonder how that would look with a 1/2 CP and no underside router work. ???
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I'm guessing this replaces part of the case on the Betson right? I can't think of any other way it could work... ???
That's correct. The top of the case is not used.
I wonder how that would look with a 1/2 CP and no underside router work. ???
Some router work (and some spacers) would still be necessary on a thinner panel.
RandyT
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Hi all,
Just got my new v2 TB installed. I have not owned a TB before and the last time I played with one was in the arcades many many years ago so wasn't sure what to expect. My findings are thus;
- Trackball seems to spin nicely in most directions for about 1-2 secs.
- Spinning in a North Easterly direction is not smooth but the spin still lasts, it sounds like there is something in the bearing, more of a gritty sound than a smooth spin soon - if you get what I mean.
- Spinning in the easterly direction is also not smooth, in fact an aggressive spin the ball actually lifts from the rollers very briefly. Only seems to do this in this direction though.
- Spinning South has the least spin time but still > 1 sec.
Having read a post above, I see that I need to let the TB wear in for a month or so, am therefore hoping this all sounds normal for out of the box??
Read somewhere that you can soak some bearings in WD40, not sure if this is a generic approach - any experiences for the best way to run the v2 in?
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Read somewhere that you can soak some bearings in WD40, not sure if this is a generic approach - any experiences for the best way to run the v2 in?
1) NEVER use WD40 to lubricate the bearings..... Clean any heavy grease out of them with it if you want, but never lubricate with it. It dries out FAST.
2) After cleaning the bearings out, lubricate with a few drops of very light machine oil.
3) Use the ball every day.
4) Re-lubricate every 3 or 4 days for about a month.
Track ball should now be run in.
After that you can lubricate it about every six months.
Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)
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1) NEVER use WD40 to lubricate the bearings..... Clean any heavy grease out of them with it if you want, but never lubricate with it. It dries out FAST.
2) After cleaning the bearings out, lubricate with a few drops of very light machine oil.
3) Use the ball every day.
4) Re-lubricate every 3 or 4 days for about a month.
Track ball should now be run in.
After that you can lubricate it about every six months.
Hey Julian, thanks for this. I assume when I take the TB apart the bearings simply slide off the end of the rollers so I don't need to worry about keeping the rollers clean? Secondly, since I have WD40 I will use this to clean the bearings, once used though, how do remove the wd40 from the bearing before applying the light oil? Can it just be blown out with an off the shelf air duster can?
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Hey Julian, thanks for this. I assume when I take the TB apart the bearings simply slide off the end of the rollers so I don't need to worry about keeping the rollers clean?
YUP!!!
Secondly, since I have WD40 I will use this to clean the bearings, once used though, how do remove the wd40 from the bearing before applying the light oil? Can it just be blown out with an off the shelf air duster can?
Just dry the bearing with a soft lint free cloth, most of the WD40 will soak into the cloth. Then apply the oil. You don't need to remove every trace of the WD40.
Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)
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1) NEVER use WD40 to lubricate the bearings..... Clean any heavy grease out of them with it if you want, but never lubricate with it. It dries out FAST.
2) After cleaning the bearings out, lubricate with a few drops of very light machine oil.
3) Use the ball every day.
4) Re-lubricate every 3 or 4 days for about a month.
Track ball should now be run in.
After that you can lubricate it about every six months.
OK, so I did all that, even added a touch of Bob Roberts suggestion to spin the bearing in a drill (I stuck a pencil in the drill and this seemed to work quite well).
I found that after soaking in wd40 for five minutes and then cleaning, the bearings were spinning very freely, but after adding 3 drops of 3 in 1 this did slow it down quite a bit. I still have one bearing of the five that is not quite as free so I took it all apart again and did the process again this time with just 1 drop of oil. Seems to spin better now.
I did forget to mention this is a 2.25" ball so maybe the spin time will not be as good as 3" balls? Is striving for a 7 day spin time as mentioned in a recent post too much to ask? Seriously though, some of the problems from my original post have gone which I am pleased about. Now just a case of some regular oiling and hopefully can add another day! Cheers Julian :cheers:
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Just use the damn thing and it will work itself out! I never have been a big fan of artificially breaking in mechanical devices, in some instances you are doing more harm than good and reducing the lifespan of the item...
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Just use the damn thing and it will work itself out!
Sorry, but have to disagree in my case. Re my point below...
- Spinning in the easterly direction is also not smooth, in fact an aggressive spin the ball actually lifts from the rollers very briefly. Only seems to do this in this direction though.
After taking it apart and cleaning the ball up, i believe the cause of the problem was down to a glob of dried grease I found under the mini roller from the fifth bearing (the one on its own). Since this is not a moving part I am not convinced this problem would have ever gone away. However re bearings use you are probably right but I am too impatient for that ;D
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It doesn't make much sense to suffer a poorly working trackbal for months if you can simply break it in and enjoy the thing right away.
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Yes, it is worth mentioning that the the smaller trackball will have a different feel and spin time. Less weight will have less momentum and allow for more vibration to be transmitted from the bearings and rollers. Even so, breaking in the bearings is going to be important. If you want to accelerate that part artificially, that is up to you.
Also keep in mind that bearings used in trackballs are pretty much the same as those used in electric motors and other, far more demanding applications. So they tend to get "broken in" or seated into their races much more quickly than they would in a trackball. Regardless, the rollers are the items in a trackball that you really don't want to accelerate the wear on, and that's pretty much impossible to do by hand.
RandyT