TheShanMan's Defender restoration - New repro wiring harnesses!!!

[beerbarrel]

One more thing, I looked at my PS under a magnifying glass and just about all the solder pads that are around the connector pins and bad. You might want to take a close look at yours.

Tracy

[TheShanMan]

I don't see any jumper. Everything looks kosher on the board except for the missing rectifier. I'll have a closer look, but on first glance the board appears to be in excellent condition.

[beerbarrel]

I don't know that the jumper really matters. It just shorts across the 2 ohm resistor. My supply came out of a cock tail version. Looking at the schematic it shows a jumper and there is a note that says the jumper is not used on the CT version. Mine is there but it is cut in the middle.

Tracy

[TheShanMan]

Interesting. I'll have to look at the schematic when I work on it. Sounds like you're saying it should have the jumper for the uprights. Thanks for raising the issue. BTW, I'd be interested in seeing a pic of yours, since as far as I could tell, there was no evidence of a jumper being on the board, and I'd like to see what it looks like, even if yours is cut. You could post it in your thread if you prefer since of course I'm following your restoration too.

[beerbarrel]

Here ya go! My big cap is removed. Can you see the jumper?

[TheShanMan]

Yep. I see it. Thanks!

[RetroACTIVE]

I don't know that the jumper really matters. It just shorts across the 2 ohm resistor. My supply came out of a cock tail version. Looking at the schematic it shows a jumper and there is a note that says the jumper is not used on the CT version. Mine is there but it is cut in the middle.

Tracy

If I had to venture a guess as to the need for the jumper it would be due to the fact that the cocktail version has more "general illumination" (lamps under the buttons etc...).  With the jumper in, more load is expected (more lamps).  In the upright case there are only the coin door lamps, so adding the load resistor keeps the voltage level at the appropriate level...

[TheShanMan]

Got my package from Bob as well as my fiberglass pencil. Hooked up the new switcher, and while it doesn't make the loud noise that the old one did, it doesn't change what happens when I power on the unit.

So this weekend I will be cleaning contacts with the fiberglass pencil!

[RetroACTIVE]

Got my package from Bob as well as my fiberglass pencil. Hooked up the new switcher, and while it doesn't make the loud noise that the old one did, it doesn't change what happens when I power on the unit.

So this weekend I will be cleaning contacts with the fiberglass pencil!

Now you don't have to be concerned with the PSU... an can just focus on other issues. 

[TheShanMan]

So I've started working on the connector pins and chip pins with the fiberglass pencil. How do you know if you've rubbed the pins enough? I was assuming that it was abrasive enough that the pins would get shiny, almost like new. But that doesn't seem to be happening, so I wonder if what I'm doing is effective or if I'm not doing it long enough or something. Peale (or anyone else), could you perhaps describe in some detail how you use the pencil, how long you do it for, how you know that you've finished the job, or anything else that might help a noob?

[SirPeale]

They'll never be shiny-shiny.  If they're black, do it until they're clean.  If they're super-dull, do it until they're not so dull anymore.  But be careful.

Now that you've replaced your PS, feel the RAM chips.  Are any of them hot?  Like *really* hot?  Might take a few seconds.

How about the lights on the ROM board, what are they doing?

[beerbarrel]

Peale,

Do folks not use stuff like deoxit to clean contacts?

They'll never be shiny-shiny.  If they're black, do it until they're clean.  If they're super-dull, do it until they're not so dull anymore.  But be careful.

Now that you've replaced your PS, feel the RAM chips.  Are any of them hot?  Like *really* hot?  Might take a few seconds.

How about the lights on the ROM board, what are they doing?

[SirPeale]

*shrug* depends on the application.  I don't have any personally, and the pencil has worked really well for me.  Plus it's cheap.

[beerbarrel]

Shanman..

After looking at the schematic again, that jumper is supposed to be cut on the upright not on the cocktail. Mine came from a cocktail and it was cut....go figure!

[TheShanMan]

They'll never be shiny-shiny.  If they're black, do it until they're clean.  If they're super-dull, do it until they're not so dull anymore.  But be careful.

It's actually hard to tell if any change occurs after using the pencil, but I spent about 20 minutes going over all the socketed chips except the RAM (since I'll be replacing it very soon anyway). I also did the connector pins.

Now that you've replaced your PS, feel the RAM chips.  Are any of them hot?  Like *really* hot?  Might take a few seconds.

None of them are hot.

How about the lights on the ROM board, what are they doing?

Still all remain on.

Next I need to use the pencil on the ROM chips. Solder joints all look fine on the main board, including connector solder joints.

I still wonder if I have a bad clock - maybe the somewhat rusty crystal is bad? Unless I can find a reasonably priced scope soon, it will be hard to check this, so I might be running out of things I can try before shipping the boards off to Retro.

[gloogun]

Just a thought, but I have that same switching power supply in a Defender cab I picked up last week. In mine the original PS is still in place and hooked up to the transformer assembly via the 4JI connector. The new SPS is just installed right next to it and hooked up to the transformer with a couple of new blue wires. The guy that sold it to me told me it needed to be that way otherwise you'd have problems with the video. I didn't argue, but maybe someone on this board knows better....

[beerbarrel]

Mine currently has a switcher and works great. I'm planning on putting the linear back in though.

Tracy

[TheShanMan]

I got my joystick rebuild kit today. The joystick shaft doesn't fit as tightly as I'd like, but that's not the fault of the rebuild kit since it doesn't come with the shaft. I wrapped it with a little teflon tape to make it a tighter fit - not sure if that will last long term, but at least for now it fits tightly. Other than that, the slop is gone. Very expensive ($35 + $9 shipping - man, has shipping gotten expensive or what?!), but for me it was worth it. The slop was bad before.

Hopefully tonight I'll get a chance to clean up the rom board.

Hey Peale, when do you think I should expect my ram adapter to arrive? I got my ram yesterday, so I'm looking forward to trying that out in the off chance that the ram is causing problems for me.

[SirPeale]

Sorry...I ran into a little "problem" over the weekend.  I'll have your adapter out tomorrow.

[TheShanMan]

Sorry...I ran into a little "problem" over the weekend.  I'll have your adapter out tomorrow.

Bummer. I though it would be here by now. Thanks for getting that taken care of!

I got the ROM board all cleaned up today and I was kind of hopeful that it would do better on power up due to some corrosion I found, but no such luck. So I'll wait for Peale's adapter and try my new RAM as my last resort.

[SirPeale]

The adapter is on its way.  Make sure you get the empty key pin in the correct position.  It may fit a bit snugly.

If you have any other questions, let me know.

[TheShanMan]

Thankfully USPS got your adapter here in a hurry Peale! In time for me to try out the ram over the weekend. Thanks Peale!

Also, yesterday I got a marquee from quarterarcade.com. Mine looks great when not backlit, but it definitely won't look good backlit, hence buying one from QA. They rated it 4 out of 5 stars, and it definitely is a 4 - very nice! Expensive (I think it was $38 shipped), but what are you gonna do?

So I might sell my old marquee to someone who wants to frame it or something. It had a fair amount of cracking in the red areas particularly, which was made worse when I stupidly tried to gently clean the back side! I "repaired" it by filling in all areas with paint. Now it looks great, but since the thickness of my paint doesn't equal the thickness of the silkscreen paint, my paint globs stand out like a sore thumb when backlit! So anyway, I might get around to posting it in BST. But feel free to contact me if you're interested in it - I'll let it go for cheap since it can't be backlit.

[Level42]

I received my RAMs yesterday. That was a great deal. I even got some spares I think (weren't they sold by the 25 ?). I bought 3 sets.

Great guy to deal with, even paid back 5 bucks because shipping it here was less expensive than he'd thought..... I appreciate honest people like that, thankfully the vast majority of people in this hobby are like that. Will takes some time until I can install them on my friend's Defender and Sinistar. I guess I'll just do the board mod. It's so simple.

[TheShanMan]

I didn't get a chance over the weekend to install my 4164 ram chips and peale's power adapter due to my wife's 40th b-day, but I did tonight, and as I figured it made no difference with startup. So I'm officially out of things I think I'm capable of doing to diagnose based on the suggestions I've received thus far.

And that means... Retro, are you still willing to have a crack at my boards? If so, could you please PM me your address and any specific details you want to make sure I handle? I figure I'll send you my cpu/video board and rom board, and maybe include my old 4116's if you want??? I could include my sound and input boards, but I would think the odds of one of those boards causing my problems is extremely low (the sound board's diagnostic mode does work).

I've done everything I can think of to minimize the work you might have to deal with (so you don't say "why the heck couldn't he have done this before sending it to me?!"). Hopefully you can figure it out with minimal effort!

[SirPeale]

All the LEDs on the ROM board still remain lit?

[TheShanMan]

Yes.

[RetroACTIVE]

PM sent

Send all your boards if you can 

[beerbarrel]

Do you mind updating us through the thread as to what you do to fix it?

thanks,
Tracy

[RetroACTIVE]

Do you mind updating us through the thread as to what you do to fix it?

thanks,
Tracy

Absolutely!

[SirPeale]

Great, because I have a spare Defender boardset that I cobbled together that doesn't work, that also has all four LEDs lit.

[Neverending Project]

So I'm officially out of things I think I'm capable of doing to diagnose based on the suggestions I've received thus far.

Did you try adjusting the flux capacitor? Is it fluxing?

[beerbarrel]

Did u get your boards sent off? I hope so! It's disappointing not reading the daily responses to this thread. 

[TheShanMan]

In the mail. I can't get this thing working soon enough, so believe me, waiting around is hard for me too!

[RetroACTIVE]

I'll get working on them as soon as they arrive.

[TheShanMan]

I don't mean to make you feel rushed! You're doing me a favor so I'm at your mercy. I'm excited to get it back so I can start playing my first dedicated cab, but I know you've got a life outside of my boards.

[RetroACTIVE]

I don't mean to make you feel rushed! You're doing me a favor so I'm at your mercy. I'm excited to get it back so I can start playing my first dedicated cab, but I know you've got a life outside of my boards.

I don't feel rushed at all and you never made me feel that way... so no sweat at all!  Usually I can get these things turned around in a week or so... (if they aren't totally boogered up  ).  I'm excited too... I like getting these things fixed!

[DP Louie]

Sorry, posted in wrong topic! 

[RetroACTIVE]

Received boards today... done some preliminaries... will let you know more on Sunday.

[TheShanMan]

Thanks Retro! I'd be curious to know what you think generally about the condition of the boards too.

Looking forward to Sunday.

And on another note, got my T-molding yesterday.

[RetroACTIVE]

Ok... There are a couple of issues... So far we have:

1. Bad ROM(s)... I have not isolated the exact one.  I checked the ROM board with a known good ROM set and a good CPU.. and had no problems. The ROMs are very fragile as the are heavily corroded and should be replaced regardless.

2. IC 5O (LS393) on the CPU is fried... All the outputs are low and its smoking hot.  I'm going to replace it and retest.