A new Galaga!

[RetroGreg]

I'm 34 and remember the original in the arcades. I still love it, but I am excited for this new game as well. It will probably be only $10.00 so I don't really know what you all expect. Pac Man CE rocked and this looks like it will be pretty fun.

[jardine]

Rubbish...

What was Galaga: Destination Earth? Was it not a sequel? It sucked too, just like this will...

Heres some ideas I give them for free, and it could be better.

How about a multiplayer mode where it's split screen with my ship in the middle back to back with another players ship. Keeping the same left right movement, but giving you a feeling of being surrounded by the enemy. I've attached a picture to illustrate.

Or how about a multiplayer mode where your on opposite sides and the enemy in the middle, where you can shoot at the enemies and the other player? Still keeping the left right movement, but introducing a multiplayer aspect.

How about a good story line with an end goal, power ups, or multiple paths?

I mean, I'm fine with updated graphics, but the game play shouldn't change too much because it will  alienate their biggest fans.

Looks impressive Leapinlew...i like...maby you should send some of this stuff of to microsoft...see if they are listening to there fans???

As for this whole debate on Galaga....i say stay with the classics.....You will never be able to emulate original feel...shiiittt, we all played these games at the penny arcade wasting quarters or 20c coins as soon as we got outta school, slaming the glass screen and cursing at the bullet that we are sure we missed.

Now its coming out on Xbox live....it will never be the same my friends, so why worry about playability this, feel that, graphics this..it is probably just XBox trying to cash in on this wonderful thing we all call a hobbie!!!

[isucamper]

Gah!  Did arcadecontrols turn into neogaf all of a sudden?  What's with passing judgement based on one blurry video of an incomplete game that you've never played?

About the only thing you can judge the game on at this point is who the developer is... and it's the same team that did the incredible Pac-man Championship Edition.  If you've never played that game, as a retro gamer, you owe it to yourself to try it out.  It's safe to say that the Galaga franchise is in good hands.

http://www.gamevideos.com/video/id/17620

Seriously, you don't have to like modern games, but they're not going to delete your classics off your hard drive.  There's no reason to be threatened by them.

[leapinlew]

Seriously, you don't have to like modern games, but they're not going to delete your classics off your hard drive.  There's no reason to be threatened by them.

The only "threat" is diluting of a quality product with a sequel that doesn't have the same qualities which brought the original to legendary status.

You've never been bothered when they release a sequel to the original? Examples: Anything George Lucas has done with Star Wars since the originals were released, Star Trek: Enterprise, etc.

It's cool if you don't have passion for anything, but without having a deep attachment to a franchise - you can't really understand what we are talking about. If you do have attachment to any franchise, you should understand the concern.

[isucamper]

I understand exactly what you're saying.  But I can gaurentee this game will not be Galaga:  Episode 1.  Just because George Lucas can't get it right is no reason to be so gaurded.  Like I said, Pac-man CE did the exact opposite of what your talking about.  It brought Pac-man to a new generation and an entirely new setting (Xbox Live).

Now granted, there have been plenty of atrocious updates of classic games (anything with Frogger or Pong in the title) and you all have every reason to be reluctant to give this one a serious look, but we've got a very talented group of people making this Galaga game, and I'm pretty thankful for that.  It's not going to play like the classic Galaga... don't expect it to.  But it's not being designed to play in an arcade for 25 cents a pop.  Now that audience is sitting on their couches looking for a slightly different experience.  Something a little less hardcore challenge-wise and something a little more deep progression-wise.  That doesn't mean you can't have fun with it no matter how much you love the original (and believe me, I do).

[leapinlew]

It brought Pac-man to a new generation and an entirely new setting (Xbox Live).

To me, the new version stayed faithful to the original. It's pretty obvious by watching the video - it's pacman.

It's not going to play like the classic Galaga... don't expect it to. 

Well, I guess thats where we differ. I do expect them to keep some similarities between the old game and new game. It should be similar in controls. Not just some sound samples and similarities in ship design and enemies.

That doesn't mean you can't have fun with it no matter how much you love the original (and believe me, I do).

This is true, but by using the Galaga name - they are setting expectations high. No different than the remake of Star Wars. The enhanced versions sucked. Classic Star Wars was better, unless you like Greedo shooting first... 

Of course people are going to have expectations. There is nothing wrong with that.

[Level42]

Let's not forget that Galaga was already a lot worse than it's original.

I dunno, I couldn't play galaxian anymore after playing galaga.

I didn't like the awkward way the aliens move in Galaga. It doesn't make sense. In Galaxian they moved natural. And the sound. Those sounds were fine on Pac Man, but they are so gay on a shooter .....
I know I'm almost the only one that prefers Galaxian over Galaga, but then, so be it

[leapinlew]

I know I'm almost the only one that prefers Galaxian over Galaga, but then, so be it

To me, the genre got better and better and peaked at Galaga.

Galaxian > Space Invaders
Galaga > Galaxian

I think my brother prefers Galaxian too. It's a good game. I also enjoyed Astro Blasters, Phoenix, and Gorf. Although Gorf is a bit of an oddball in that mix - I liked it.

[Xiaou2]

 From the Video, one can tell that this so called new galaga is ultra crap.

 
 Long ago,  someone made an update to Tempest.   Tempest 2000,  was simply
tempest with all kinda of pixel effects and cycling colors.   It seems kinda
cool at first..  but it wears thin very quickly.. as you cant really make out
what they heck is happening with all that useless garbage all over the screen.

 This is the same thing... but even worse.   Theres lines, blobs, and other
crap all over the place,  and all you can make out is explosions!   There is
no Updated graphics besides the player ship.  Everything else is a downgrade...
where its some ridiculous glowing blob without any details at all.

 The gameplay is crap too.   They give the player way too much firepower, and
thus have to send a zillion enemies out to even create any sense of panic.  Thus
then you have a zillion explosions,  and cant see anything.   

 How the hell do these people get into the game design field?!!!

 This isnt worth $10.  Its not even worth $1!    There are tons of freeware shooters
on the net that kick the crap out of this.

 
 Btw - If you want to play a great shooter.. Check out  Battle Squadron  for the
Amiga.   2 players simultainious action,  highly detailed graphics,  challenging and
excellent gameplay, catchy soundtrack, good sound fx too.   10 billion times
more fun than this new Turd.


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4LnzE8Ea3g&feature=related[/youtube]

[RayB]

Long ago,  someone made an update to Tempest.   Tempest 2000,  was simply
tempest with all kinda of pixel effects and cycling colors.   It seems kinda
cool at first..  but it wears thin very quickly.. as you cant really make out
what they heck is happening with all that useless garbage all over the screen.

What?! Yet again, your opinion runs completely contrary to everyone else, critics and gamers alike.

First of all, that "someone" was the legendary Jeff Minter. (Perhaps a tad over-rated, but many love his frantic shoot'em ups and music visualizations.)

Tempest 2000 LOOKED like what you say on the surface, but playing it is a different matter entirely. It's a BLAST! I loved it, as did most people. Maybe the "too much going on" problem is unique to you and your spacial-cognitive abilities.

[isucamper]

Tempest 2000 LOOKED like what you say on the surface, but playing it is a different matter entirely.

This needs to be repeated.  You can't really judge a game until you play it...

Unless your FOX News or Jack Thompson.

http://arstechnica.com/journals/thumbs.ars/2008/01/23/fox-news-follows-mass-effect-bashing-with-some-of-its-own

[Xiaou2]

 First of all,  I DID play it.

 Tempest  ISNT   Tempest  if there is no  SPINNER CONTROL.

 Sorry, but It Sucks compared to the Real deal.

  And just as I said... the visuals became annoying after a certain amount of time.


 Legendary?   Pfff.

 There are zillions of Legendary coders out there who have better games
under their belts than him.

 
 Are you really saying you Like the new Galaga look?!   Its absolutely pathetic.

 As for my spatial ability... Im a high level martial artist.  I have no problem
with quick reaction times,  judging distances,  timing..etc.   However, I do not
like to see a screen filled 90% of the time, with 90% explosions and
useless effects.   It does Nothing but create annoyance and limit visibility...
as well as obscuring artwork...  of course... here there is NO artwork.   Its
a pile of Dog Poo.

[Singapura]

First of all, that "someone" was the legendary Jeff Minter. (Perhaps a tad over-rated, but many love his frantic shoot'em ups and music visualizations.)

Speaking of Minter, the llama llover just made an update of his Robotron clone Gridrunner. I wish he would write something original but as far as I know he never did.

Legendary?   Pfff.

 There are zillions of Legendary coders out there who have better games
under their belts than him.

Being able to write a good game doesn't make one legendary just as being able to make war doesn't make one a warrior. You should know that as a high level martial artist.

[RandyT]

Grid Wars is definitely a cool game.  I'm not so sure about Gridlaga.

It looks more like a technology demo than anything Galaga related.  It might be fun, but the name is like a "stick in the eye"...I can't see it.

RandyT

[Ummon]

My point being, we didn't have to be in high school when the classics came out to appreciate them or have valid experiences playing them. 

Sure, but apparently not common.

 
 Btw - If you want to play a great shooter.. Check out  Battle Squadron  for the
Amiga.   2 players simultainious action,  highly detailed graphics,  challenging and
excellent gameplay, catchy soundtrack...


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4LnzE8Ea3g&feature=related[/youtube]

Only if you're a sucker for techno. Scary.

What?! Yet again, your opinion runs completely contrary to everyone else, critics and gamers alike.

First of all, that "someone" was the legendary Jeff Minter. (Perhaps a tad over-rated, but many love his frantic shoot'em ups and music visualizations.)

Tempest 2000 LOOKED like what you say on the surface, but playing it is a different matter entirely. It's a BLAST! I loved it, as did most people. Maybe the "too much going on" problem is unique to you and your spacial-cognitive abilities.

Um, maybe, but I think it's more a matter of 'glitz factor'. 'Frantic shoot'em ups and music visualizations' could explain it.

 First of all,  I DID play it.

 Tempest  ISNT   Tempest  if there is no  SPINNER CONTROL.

 Sorry, but It Sucks compared to the Real deal.

Yeah. What he said.

Gah!  Did arcadecontrols turn into neogaf all of a sudden?  What's with passing judgement based on one blurry video of an incomplete game that you've never played?

It's not a matter of what you say. Think of it like music. Why has there been no original (let alone decent) music since perhaps 2000? Because they don't know how to create it. It's all rehash rip-off. Same in games that try to take off from the original in some DDR visual style. It's  matters of quality and class.

[isucamper]

It's not a matter of what you say. Think of it like music. Why has there been no original (let alone decent) music since perhaps 2000? Because they don't know how to create it.

I'm not even sure how to reply to this... other than I've got to wonder how much new music you've given a solid chance to in the last 10 years.  It's irrelevant to this discussion... but I can't help putting my face in my palm and saying "you're wrong... wrong, wrong, wrong"

It's all rehash rip-off. Same in games that try to take off from the original in some DDR visual style. It's  matters of quality and class.

This thread started off with people complaining that Legions differed too much from the original.  Your you're saying it's rehash?  What's going to make you guys happy??  This discussion is devolving to the point of people just stating opinions for the sake of it without putting any real thought into them.

[Xiaou2]

 I think hes generalizing.   Maybe better to say that the Majority of music today
is crap.    A greater percentage than the past as well.

This thread started off with people complaining that Legions differed too much from the original.  Your you're saying it's rehash?

 I believe he said that MUSIC is rehash.   But the basic thing here is that
todays game makers have almost no clue how to make a good game.
(much like most of todays music)

 Its fine to remake a classic... but,  you should retain the feel of the original.
The mechanics and play should be relatively the same.

 Here we see that is not the case.   All traces of what made Galaga
a true classic... are gone.    If they wanted to release this as  "Trippy-Fighter 1"
then fine... but its the Furthest thing to Galaga,  and does not deserve to
be named as such.

 Its the equivalent of replacing the Dave Mustain of MegaDeth,  with
Garth Brooks and still calling it Megadeth (playing metal?!)   
Completely  FUBAR.


 Btw - I agree... the Music in that shooter is not the greatest (Its no  Ghouls and Ghost).. yet it still fits the game well.   

 My fav shooter is actually  Thunderforce II.   (on sega genesis or  X68000 )   In addition to awesome play and challenge... The Soundtrack to that
game is incredible.  Very original and unique.     

 Some found the Top view levels to be annoying in that game.  Ill admit, it needed
some tweaking.. but it did add some variance.  The side view levels rocked
beyond belief.  (better than any of the sequals  IMOP)

[Singapura]

[Its the equivalent of replacing the Dave Mustain of MegaDeth,  with
Garth Brooks and still calling it Megadeth (playing metal?!)   

I've got a few CD's that do that. One is a bunch of metal bands playing Abba (pretty cool), the others are from the Kronos Quartet playing anything from Slayer to Tool on 4 cello's. But for gaming I agree, the flavour of the original should be retained or the game should be called something else. With Space Invaders on the PSP they managed  to capture the "feel" of the original. With this new Galaga, I'm not so sure. I still want it anyway 

[isucamper]

But the basic thing here is that todays game makers have almost no clue how to make a good game.

I'm sorry, but I've got to take great exception to this.  Much like music, there is more quality in games being produced today than any one person has time to identify or consume.  In fact, I would go as far to say that the best of the best games being produced today are pushing the medium to true art. 

It's not my job to convince any close minded people of this.  I've got to be done with this thread because it's like arguing about what color the sky is with someone who has never been outside.  If you truly believe "that today’s game makers have almost no clue how to make a good game", go play Bioshock, Super Mario Galaxy, Shadow of the Colossus, Portal or anything developed by a little Japanese developer called Clover Studios.  Great, great things are being done in games.  It's your own loss of you're too stubborn to give them a chance.

If these games are too broad in scope for you and you prefer the more focused gameplay experience of your classic arcade games, then you'll be glad to hear that the "Arcade" as we knew it 10-20 years ago is currently enjoying a similar renaissance.  Small experience games are enjoying new life in the form of downloadable content on Xbox Live, Playstation Network, and you're home PC.  Go give Puzzle Quest a download, or Everyday Shooter, or the previously mentioned Pac-man Championship Edition... or the upcoming Galaga Legions.  In fact, as big budget games get more and more expensive to produce, expect the depth in quality of these smaller games to continue to grow. 

The arcade is dead... and that sucks.  Fortunately we've got a great community here dedicated to keeping its memory alive.  But to say that there are no good games (or music) being produced is completely aggravating. 

[leapinlew]

It's not my job to convince any close minded people of this. 

Part of your problem isucamper is saying dumb things like this and insulting nearly everyone. I assume your frustration is specific to a few people, but I can't help but feel insulted.

How about we wait for it to come out and then we'll see how it goes, eh? Until then, I would think it wise for you to not argue about a new "Galaga" on a website dedicated to classic gaming.

[isucamper]

Until then, I would think it wise for you to not argue about a new "Galaga" on a website dedicated to classic gaming.

I didn't bring it up!!

but, point taken

you've all been really helpful to me, I don't want to insult anyone

i just can't keep from speaking my mind when when I see broad sweeping statements being made that I vehemently disagree with

i'll button it up

[leapinlew]

i'll button it up

You don't have to do that, just don't include me in your broad sweeping statements. I didn't take it as such, but this is how flame wars start.

Let's see how this game does, and we can revisit. I know your not staking your reputation on the success or failure of this game.

We good. 

[Xiaou2]

I'm sorry, but I've got to take great exception to this.  Much like music, there is more quality in games being produced today than any one person has time to identify or consume.  In fact, I would go as far to say that the best of the best games being produced today are pushing the medium to true art.


 LoL.   You really are off your rocker.


Bioshock:  Sucks.  Just one of a million FPS games that play just about all the same way. They have been making the same FPS game for the last 15 years on pc.   The
only real change is the graphics and levels of details.   FPS games are boring
and not very challenging.   A game of Robotron is much more exciting and fun.

Super Mario Galaxy - The 2d Marios are much more challenging and more fun.

Portal - Ohh look... ANOTHER FPS!  What a surprise   

 
 Ohh, and the Classics  Never died.   The only thing that happened was that
some money men started to Finally realize that not everyone in the universe
enjoys playing crappy FPS games.

 Tons of players who grew up on older computer systems games,  2d console
games,  as well as the old Arcades ..etc..  all love the classic games.   They
are much more difficult and challenging... are more fun and have higher replay
value.

 
 However... the remakes are pathetic.    The people who made the Original
Spy Hunter were intending to add the ability to let you fly a helicopter...
however... they ran out of resources.   Instead of remaking the game as it
was intended.. and Adding such a feature...  they butchered it and made it
into a generic fps type race game.   Half the fun of Spy Hunter was the ability
to see the other cars wreck from your Oil.   However..   now you cant see the
damage that you are doing with 2 of your rear weapons.

 In fact, it not only sucked the fun out of the game... but also sucked the
challenge out too


 I can site numerous examples where remakes are worse than the original
counterpart - by Miles.   Taking games to a higher art?!  Not hardly.


 If you want me to conceed that 3d graphic details have exceeded the
past... sure.   But that does not make a fun/good game.   In fact, many 3d games
that were revolitionary only 2 yrs ago,  are unplayable to the people who bought
them at that time - mererly because the graphic look is so much better now that
they can not stand to play them.

 However, that does not change the fact that the underlying game still is basically
the exact same.  Crap.

 
 As for game Music..

  Back in the day... They used to use custom synths and invented some of the
most awesome sounding electronic instrumentation.    However, today... they
mostly jsut use the same exact samples that everyone else uses.  Which is
why almost all the groups sound exactly the same.

 Very similar in game music and sound effects.   They actually used to
use custom built synths and haphazardly poke them until they came out
with something that sounded great.    The warm organ-ish sounds from the
game Pole Position are just phenomenal...  and thats only a tiny example.
Todays games mostly use preexisting samples...  and they are usually
boring, unoriginal and flat sounding.

 As for Composition... thats even worse.   They usually just hire some Techno-Mixer
to make some crap that any 6yr old could throw together.  (or hire
some bland group to mix some dull sounding crap)  There is no feeling
or emotion.   No story to tell.  No flair or originality.
 
 Compare this to music in games like Ghouls and Ghost, Strider, Willow, Marble Madness,  and many more.   

 Then go back even further... and listen to the amazing compositions from the C-64
computer.    They are still remaking these great compositions to this very day..
because they last the test of time.  They actually have real substance. 
 

 It would seem to me,  that you are a surface lover.   You fall in love with the
look of the game... rather than the depth of play.   Like many today... you
probably dont even know what it means to work up an adrenalized sweat
such as gotten from a game like Robotron, which puts you to the test
every nanosecond.   

 You probably prefer games that play like walk around movies.   You roam
and roam and roam... and do a little of this and that here and there.

 But to the classic fans... this isnt what we call a good game.   Not even close.


 And Btw - Im far from being a closed minded person.   I listen to almost anything
and can appreciate it for what it is.  I play old games, and have tried a good
deal of the new.  It just makes me even more of a critic, because Ive experienced
so many types and ages of games. 

 Im also a martial artist.. and I can tell you a little secret...   A punch has not
changed in thousands of years.   No new generation can claim to have either
invented it... nor to have made it much any different than the last.   New
or old... games can be good or bad... and that is determined by certain
factors that are beyond generational release date.

[AtomSmasher]

Until then, I would think it wise for you to not argue about a new "Galaga" on a website dedicated to classic gaming.

I didn't bring it up!!

but, point taken

you've all been really helpful to me, I don't want to insult anyone

i just can't keep from speaking my mind when when I see broad sweeping statements being made that I vehemently disagree with

i'll button it up

You should know that there have been many debates with Xiaou2 about newer games and it's pretty clear there is no changing his mind on the subject.  My advice is that after he goes off on a rant (as he just did), the best reaction is to nod your head politely and back away.  When someone says that Portal is just another FPS, then it should be clear that there is no chance of convincing them there are some great modern games.

Back to the topic at hand, I enjoy lot of modern games, but I would have to agree that the new Galaga does not look like a new Galaga and should be named something else.  Remakes and sequels should capture the spirit of the original, while expanding on the gameplay.  Just recently I've been hearing a lot about Fallout 3 and the new bionic commando games, and the best thing I've heard about them is that even though the game are very different from the originals, the gameplay and graphics still actually feel a lot like their predecessors.  This new Galaga just doesn't appear to do that from what can be seen in the video.

I'll agree to wait and see since the developers do have a good track record, but I'm not very optimistic about this one.

[leapinlew]

Back to the topic at hand, I enjoy lot of modern games, but I would have to agree that the new Galaga does not look like a new Galaga and should be named something else.  Remakes and sequels should capture the spirit of the original, while expanding on the gameplay.  Just recently I've been hearing a lot about Fallout 3 and the new bionic commando games, and the best thing I've heard about them is that even though the game are very different from the originals, the gameplay and graphics still actually feel a lot like their predecessors.  This new Galaga just doesn't appear to do that from what can be seen in the video.

I'll agree to wait and see since the developers do have a good track record, but I'm not very optimistic about this one.

well said dude. 

[Ummon]

I've got a few CD's that do that. One is a bunch of metal bands playing Abba (pretty cool), the others are from the Kronos Quartet playing anything from Slayer to Tool on 4 cello's.

Blech. Any time I hear Kronos play some stuff like that, I give a rating of 1, as there's nothing lower. They're awesome players, but they have WEIRD sentiments. For that matter, if they're going to 'arrange' these things, they should add parts. Make 'em better. And I think the four cello group is somebody else. They also did a bunch of Metallica. (Still not into it.) Kronos does a lot of Trent Reznor.

Back to the topic at hand, I enjoy lot of modern games, but I would have to agree that the new Galaga does not look like a new Galaga and should be named something else.  Remakes and sequels should capture the spirit of the original, while expanding on the gameplay.  Just recently I've been hearing a lot about Fallout 3 and the new bionic commando games, and the best thing I've heard about them is that even though the game are very different from the originals, the gameplay and graphics still actually feel a lot like their predecessors.  This new Galaga just doesn't appear to do that from what can be seen in the video.

Yeah, that's what I'm saying, too. I didn't say there weren't any good games out there. Really, I don't keep up with new games. They're not the same thing. But they are new experiences. With music, it's really a story of what their influences are and how they ape them. I've heard some exceptions to this, but they're few and far between, and still not remarkable. 'Why' is a long discussion.

[Singapura]

Xiaou2, I'd love to agree with you and I do partly. It's just that I don't think Bioshock and Portal are crappy. And Portal certainly isn't an FPS. I think the added value for old school players is "feeling". When I play Pooyan or Pacman, play a cool game and I get the same feeling I got in the arcades when I was 16. That's better then just the "I play a cool game" feeling I get when I play Bioshock or Portal or any other new game. It's like drinking wine instead of grapejuice.    I used to be an avid C64 fan (member of one of the biggest cracking groups of that time) but the C64 games don't hold the same interest for me. Maybe they might in the future 

It doesn't mean that new games are crap. The marketing people don't bring out old school games because they realised they are better. They just know that the current affluent group is the same 30-40 somethings that used to play the arcade games. The same happens with music. All the old bands are being dug up again to go on tour because the marketeers know it will sell well.

And I think the four cello group is somebody else.

You're right, it's Apocalyptica

[AE35]

Well, what I don't like about all these new games(that goes for Geometry Wars
as well) is that particle-effect look. I'm SOOOOO tired of it. I remember playing
PC in the late 90es (mostly Red Alert and Rogue Spear) and I think it was about
that time those particle-effects took off. I think it's a lousy gimmick and it's used
on everything. EVERYTHING.

Thanks:)

[vputz]

Speaking of Minter, the llama llover just made an update of his Robotron clone Gridrunner. I wish he would write something original but as far as I know he never did.

Whoa, what?  I thought Gridrunner++ was good trippy fun (albeit no Linux port, stiff) but that does look new.  I don't see any mention on the llamasoft site.  What's up?

[RayB]

I agree! Everything new sucks! Everything that's a sequel or based off previous innovations sucks!  In fact, Xiau2 SUCKS! Nothing will ever compare to the original Xiau !

[patrickl]

I agree! Everything new sucks! Everything that's a sequel or based off previous innovations sucks!  In fact, Xiau2 SUCKS! Nothing will ever compare to the original Xiau !

[erictrumpet]

Two issues with Xingiouoiaisio2's diatribe above:

1. sounds composed in the 60s/70s with analog synths were not created by "haphazard poking" -- they were created by carefully and purposefully modifying waveforms through specific patches on a wave generator. I have used some of this gear and believe me you don't get very far just goofing around. You learn the way a sawtooth sounds and what altering specific parameters will do to it, then you carefully compose accordingly.

2. game music composers are as talented and trained as ever, perhaps more than ever, but like in any profession there are those who are good and those who are mediocre/bad. I know two people who make their living composing game music and they do very well and their output is interesting and enjoyable. They put a lot of thought into their music and take it very seriously.

Eric.

[kayoteq]

We've tolerated years of Donkey Kong games that have nothing to do with barrels and ladders..
yet came back with D2K anyway as the 'true sequel'...

Some geek coders could possibly take the same approach with the stuff already in there..


Agalag?

That's just a graphics prom hack. But the wings flap on the start screen , and the text was just an experiment.


All you'd have to do, in theory, is to point the graphics load to another area each designated level.
New enemies each 4th level, same gameplay.

[TOK]

We've tolerated years of Donkey Kong games that have nothing to do with barrels and ladders..
yet came back with D2K anyway as the 'true sequel'...

Some geek coders could possibly take the same approach with the stuff already in there..


Agalag?

That's just a graphics prom hack. But the wings flap on the start screen , and the text was just an experiment.


All you'd have to do, in theory, is to point the graphics load to another area each designated level.
New enemies each 4th level, same gameplay.

I think putting new graphics on top of an existing ROM is what the designer of Mechatron did. Its Robotron with new graphics.
It also has the neat feature of saving the top 40 scores for all to see on both your cab and the net.
http://norrish.force9.co.uk/robotron/

[Tithis]

Portal - Ohh look... ANOTHER FPS!  What a surprise   

Have you even played Portal? Cause if you had I really doubt you would call it 'another FPS'. Its closer to a first person puzzle game then a first person shooter. There is barely any fighting, if making a portal to drop a block on a turret could be called fighting.

[erictrumpet]

Portal is the one game in the last 5 years that has made me say, wow there are still new things to be done out there. It is a brilliant game!

Eric.

[Ummon]

Two issues with Xingiouoiaisio2's diatribe above:

1. sounds composed in the 60s/70s with analog synths were not created by "haphazard poking" -- they were created by carefully and purposefully modifying waveforms through specific patches on a wave generator. I have used some of this gear and believe me you don't get very far just goofing around. You learn the way a sawtooth sounds and what altering specific parameters will do to it, then you carefully compose accordingly.

2. game music composers are as talented and trained as ever, perhaps more than ever, but like in any profession there are those who are good and those who are mediocre/bad. I know two people who make their living composing game music and they do very well and their output is interesting and enjoyable. They put a lot of thought into their music and take it very seriously.

Eric.

1. I think it depends on the composers one's talking about. If you consider people like Vangelis composers, then X is right. Also, it seems many of those involved in game music before, say, the 90s, had a similar level of music instruction.

2. Perhaps trained - although I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of them are Berklee folks and such, which kinda doesn't count. I know there are some real composers out there doing pop art stuff, though I think many more either 'stay in school' or aren't working.

[Loafmeister]

Everyone is allowed their opinion but calling Portal "another FPS" really indicates the poster didn't try it.  Just because it has a 3d first person perspective doesn't make it "another FPS. To each is own...

Speaking of personal opinion, I like the new galaga.  For those who haven't checked out the vids, please do so. You will note it's very faithful to something galaga brought to the forefront:  enemy wave design.  In an interesting twist, you get a preview of the enemy wave's flight path which compensates for the sensory overload and in turn it seems to add to the gameplay.  Check it out to see for yourselves.   I haven't tried the new Galaga, but I have played a bit of the Pacman Championship Edition and it's quality I feel has ensured the team deserves people try the new game minus the preconceived opinion that "it must sucks".  Pacman CE is that good that respect has been earned imho.

[erictrumpet]

Because of this thread, I fired up the Xbox360 last night and downloaded the demo of Pac Man: Championship Edition. It's not bad, I guess, but after playing it for a few minutes all I wanted to do was play the real thing on my cab. The Xbox is for games like Gears of War and Ninja Gaiden while laying sprawled out on my couch with 5.1 surround sound roaring. Pac Man belongs on a stand up cab!

Eric.

[Xiaou2]

 I could write up a long post about the details... but dont have too much time.
Maybe later.

 However,  the most basic answer is that a first or 3rd person perspective
severely limits playability and originality.

 Out of all the new big commercial games in the last 10+ yrs for pc... its almost
always been FPS type of games.   There has been very little originality at all.

 Just because someone makes a Puzzle out of an FPS, means very little.  Its
still a FPS, and plays the same as an FPS.. while also being even slower.
Personally, I like fast action that keeps you on your toes every
second... so FPS games pretty much put me to sleep.

 I dont mind 1st and 3rd person Racing games..  as that is completely different.
Its very fast moving - and always forwards motion.   

 Most FPS games move slow.. and they are programmed to be easy on you,  because they truely cant have tons of enemies come from behind you.  Its simply woulnt be fair due to controllability,  response times, and lack of the physical senses..  +  no preferial vision that comes with  real eyesight.

 
 No matter how one dresses up Chess.. On a piece of paper... or a
highly detailed wood carved board with inlaid gems and gold...
it will always still be Chess.   That is the "game engine".  The entire
structure of playability.

 2D games generally have greater difficulty,  in that with 3D,  one can simply
take a simple sidestep in Any direction to evade.  However, with 2d, your options
are much more limited, and force you to need quicker reaction times,  and
put you to a much greater test of skill.

 
 As for the New pacman... it looks trippy..  but not really anything special.
Namco had already done a Remake version long ago in their collection series
that beats Microcraps version.   

 Personally, I always prefered the Speedup version of Ms Pacman.. and or a
game of Super Pacman.   The original is too slow for my tastes.   Also, one
cant play Pacman very well without a true 4 way (Physically limited) stick.