New Product: 49-Way USB Interface - The GP-Wiz49 with DRS Technology (TM)

[1UP]

Wow this really is a great innovation... very cool indeed!

[dema]

Thank you NoOne and Poonga. I appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions.

When I saw that MameAnalog+ was being described in a couple places I began to wonder what domino effect it would have on my plans going forward.

Thank you for the answers.

I'm looking forward to their release, so sign me up for a couple, Randy.

[NoOne=NBA=]

That's my vision of it as well.
Most people will guide the stick to SOMEWHERE within the correct zone, but it won't guide itself, like it would with a 4-way restrictor on it.

I don't know if Randy found it necessary to go to the next step with the logic circuits for this, or not.
The next step would be to have the logic chips HOLD the current state through the dead zones, until the stick reaches the zone for the next direction.
Based on what I've heard him say, that was probably not necessary for proper functioning.

As 1UP said, the biggest problem with the software restricted 8-way is not that it TRAVELS into the diagonals, but that it doesn't send any usable data while it's there.
Simply reducing the size of that dead spot, which should be very possible with a 49-way may have taken care of that.

[1UP]

Well, using logic to keep the "switch" held down would not be authentic, because all 4-ways have some kind of dead zone.  On most microswitch sticks, there is several degrees of travel between one switch clicking off, and the next clicking on.

[NoOne=NBA=]

Thus my questioning as to whether he found it necessary to go to that extreme for proper functionality.

[u_rebelscum]

Just a heads up, Randy: the happs/midway/atari 49-way grid is a little different spaced than the older williams 49-way.  They're pretty close distance-wise, but as Xiaou2 has said, the feel is very different (call it feel-distance, or muscle-distance).  Your grids set up for the different modes based on the happs 49-way will probably be fine, but it might not match as well as with the happs 49-way.  That's why you're testing, right?   I'd like to hear the results.

For anyone who cares, sounds like an alternative way to connect 49-way joysticks is through the wiz's buttons.  Why?  How about to compare movement (with analog+) 49-way direct input with the GP-Wiz49 analog modes.  Or if you're weird (like some of us are ), how about use official mame and ctrlr file your own grid maps for 49->8-way, 49->4way, ect convertions.  Note that mame has a limited number of AND's and OR's per game direction, so you probably won't be able to match GP-Wiz49's grids exactly.  Again, you have to be a little wacko to do that if you actually have the GP-Wiz49, but it is an option if you have GP-Wiz, or one GP-Wiz49 and two 49-ways (and don't mind only one will be "analog").

My personal view on hardware vs software (vs OS driverware): [shrug]    GP-Wiz49 and SJC 49-way to analog interfaces are great.  I just have a misgiving about the possibility of stuff being lost in translation (49-way 8 pins -> USB analog ("raw", "Progressive", "linear", "exponential") -> mame internal analog -> gamedriver 49-way 8 pins).  Not saying that stuff is anyways lost, just that it can be in these three games in mame.  And until a driver is written to do the raw 8 pin to 2 axis analog translations, the hardware interfaces are way more versatile in all other cases.

I'll have to see how the GP-Wiz49 compairs in action.  That will have to wait until ... (when is this coming out, Randy?).

Keep the great hardware rolling, Randy! 

[spidermonkey]

Just in case anyone needs replacement spiders for their Sinistar or Arch Rival sticks...http://www.wizzesworkshop.com/cart/product.asp?intProdID=20

[Flinkly]

randy...aren't you selling them already?  but you'll also be updating them alot within the next couple weeks, right?  so you could buy one now, like alot of people are saying they will, but there might be some significant changes in function soon, if ever, right? 

i'm just asking for clarity, i'm waiting till all tweaking is complete to get mine. 

[RandyT]

Just a heads up, Randy: the happs/midway/atari 49-way grid is a little different spaced than the older williams 49-way.  They're pretty close distance-wise, but as Xiaou2 has said, the feel is very different (call it feel-distance, or muscle-distance).  Your grids set up for the different modes based on the happs 49-way will probably be fine, but it might not match as well as with the happs 49-way.  That's why you're testing, right?   I'd like to hear the results.

Thanks for the heads up, but it was unnecessary .  That's the thing I keep trying to get some folks here to understand is that the pretty  grid designs don't  dictate the "feel" of the stick, but rather the hardware mechanisms themselves.  As you expected, this is exactly why I need to test the Williams thoroughly.  One of a number of scenarios await me there.  It could work just like the Midway version, but "feel" different .  It could  be just different enough to require special set of definitions just for it (also not a big deal, but time consuming).  Or worst case, the electronic restriction might not work well at all based on the characteristics of the hardware.  I'll just have to wait until  I have one in my hands (any day now) to get a better idea as to where that stands.

For anyone who cares, sounds like an alternative way to connect 49-way joysticks is through the wiz's buttons.  Why?  How about to compare movement (with analog+) 49-way direct input with the GP-Wiz49 analog modes.  Or if you're weird (like some of us are ), how about use official mame and ctrlr file your own grid maps for 49->8-way, 49->4way, ect convertions.  Note that mame has a limited number of AND's and OR's per game direction, so you probably won't be able to match GP-Wiz49's grids exactly.  Again, you have to be a little wacko to do that if you actually have the GP-Wiz49, but it is an option if you have GP-Wiz, or one GP-Wiz49 and two 49-ways (and don't mind only one will be "analog").

That's a great point.

My personal view on hardware vs software (vs OS driverware): [shrug]    GP-Wiz49 and SJC 49-way to analog interfaces are great.  I just have a misgiving about the possibility of stuff being lost in translation (49-way 8 pins -> USB analog ("raw", "Progressive", "linear", "exponential") -> mame internal analog -> gamedriver 49-way 8 pins).  Not saying that stuff is anyways lost, just that it can be in these three games in mame.  And until a driver is written to do the raw 8 pin to 2 axis analog translations, the hardware interfaces are way more versatile in all other cases.

Actually, the hardware removes one level of translation.  But I think what you may be questioning is whether the Raw and Progressive output is the "correct" output for the software to translate from.  The two 49-way datasets should pretty much  cover the future possibilities, but interestingly enough, both of them are seen as three  separate levels of force by the software.  So Progressive mode really only helps on true analog applications and may also provide some "future-proofing" for revised translations.

I'll have to see how the GP-Wiz49 compairs in action.  That will have to wait until ... (when is this coming out, Randy?).
Keep the great hardware rolling, Randy! 

Thanks for the support.  SirP made me change some stuff (Hehe) so I'm putting the lid on that this evening.  As for ETA, it depends on whether the Williams support is needed.  If not, the pre-release version will be available starting Thursday.  Hopefully I'll have a Williams in my hands for testing over the weekend (thanks again, Kremmit!) and the fully dual-compatible version may be ready as early as Monday or Tuesday of next week.


I also want to take  a minute to thank NoOne=NBA=, 1UP,  and the others that "get it" and have helped to keep this thread "on-track".  This would have been more crazy than it already is without your help.

RandyT

[RandyT]

randy...aren't you selling them already?  but you'll also be updating them alot within the next couple weeks, right?  so you could buy one now, like alot of people are saying they will, but there might be some significant changes in function soon, if ever, right? 

i'm just asking for clarity, i'm waiting till all tweaking is complete to get mine. 

See the last post.  None of them have shipped yet.  If you own a HAPP/MIDWAY/ATARI version, updated code for the Williams won't matter, but as you have the other variety, it's going to be a little bit before it's ready.

RandyT

[RandyT]

The main problem for me is that it's USB only. I realise that USB is the future but I'm not yet ready to commit to a USB only solution because I still occasionally use DOS. It would be nice to have a ps/2 mode like the Ipacs, even if analogue wasn't available in that mode.

This is an analog game device, not a keyboard encoder.  Wrong page, wrong book.  Unless you are looking for a legacy gameport device.....

Also, what about game consoles? A lot of people want to interface their console to arcade controls but cannot do so because some games require an analogue joystick. This board might provide a solution if it could emulate a playstation gamepad (no need to emulate gamepads for other consoles as converters are available). Ok, I know a 49 way stick isn't true analogue but it might be good enough for many games.

Well, it can't cut curly fries either, but that also wasn't in the in the design scope of the product.

I'd also like to reiterate what others have already said. There needs to be a way of changing the joystick's mode through software as well as by pressing buttons. And programmable customised grids would also be very useful.

I felt this type of extra baggage had the possibility of jeopardizing cross-platform HID compliance.  It also de-simplifies the use of the device by requiring software to use it.
In some instances it would be good, but not so good in others.

Here's a little insight into software and encoders:  Less than 20% (if even that many) bother using it.  The rest happily take the simple route of using defaults.

One final thing. I agree with Paige. It's a bit silly of you to say the 7*7 grids you have used are proprietary and thus secret. It's not us, the ordinary customers, you need to worry about but your competitors. They will reverse engineer your boards whether you like it or not. And somehow I suspect your threat to stop producing any new products if anyone spills the beans will not deter them.

No, but the paperwork I am in the midst of filing probably will. 

Hiding legitimate (and easily obtainable) information from potential customers is poor marketing IMHO. It's also poor marketing to ask for 'constructive comments' and then complain when you get them.

Some of the comments made in this thread were less than "constructive", and incidentally, made by some of the "usual suspects".  As far as my marketing skills go, when you have a few successful products under your belt, come see me.  Otherwise, I'm not sure what qualifies your opinion of them.  And unlike some, I don't hang out here just to do "marketing".  I've been a contributing member here for a long time and for better or worse, people see the real me.  I don't let people twist my lemons just so I can make a sale, and I don't do things I see as inappropriate because of "mob rule". 

BTW, when was the last time you called up HP and expected them to tell you the engineering principles behind their new ink cartridges.  I'll bet you just bought it and were happy when it worked well, didn't you?  How is this so different?

RandyT

[Magnet_Eye]

Looks cool, but how do we play rotating games like Ikari Warriors, Time Soldiers and Heavy Barrel with a 49 stick?

[Grasshopper]

One final thing. I agree with Paige. It's a bit silly of you to say the 7*7 grids you have used are proprietary and thus secret. It's not us, the ordinary customers, you need to worry about but your competitors. They will reverse engineer your boards whether you like it or not. And somehow I suspect your threat to stop producing any new products if anyone spills the beans will not deter them.

No, but the paperwork I am in the midst of filing probably will. 

RandyT

If you're thinking in patenting/copyrighting this idea, I should point out that I (and probably others here) thought of it first.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,18826.msg149936.html#msg149936

But don't worry I'm releasing the idea into the public domain, so I won't be charging you royalties.

[paigeoliver]

I posted the way I would interpret such grids in another thread. I didn't post them here because I didn't want this thread to go off track into an arguement about how to interpret the grids. I am already ashamed that there is arguing going on in this thread. Whenever a vendor releases a new product for us it is a good thing, period. I don't care if it is a doohicky that makes a Namco gun function as a 2 way joystick, it would still be a good thing.

[Grasshopper]

The main problem for me is that it's USB only. I realise that USB is the future but I'm not yet ready to commit to a USB only solution because I still occasionally use DOS. It would be nice to have a ps/2 mode like the Ipacs, even if analogue wasn't available in that mode.

This is an analog game device, not a keyboard encoder.  Wrong page, wrong book.  Unless you are looking for a legacy gameport device.....

You couldn't use the raw and progressive modes with a ps/2 interface as they are pseudo analogue. But I don't see why the DRS modes couldn't be converted to simulated keypresses.

Also bear in mind there are ps/2 to console converters available. I used one to interface my Ipac to my Dreamcast.

Just a few 'constructive' thoughts. It's your product after all....

[Grasshopper]

I posted the way I would interpret such grids in another thread. I didn't post them here because I didn't want this thread to go off track into an arguement about how to interpret the grids. I am already ashamed that there is arguing going on in this thread. Whenever a vendor releases a new product for us it is a good thing, period. I don't care if it is a doohicky that makes a Namco gun function as a 2 way joystick, it would still be a good thing.

I agree, but I think Randy sometimes misinterprets what are nothing more than suggestions for improvements.

[Lilwolf]

Cool to see you will support any products that come out!

I am selling some conversion kits to make maming true classics better!

MsPacman cocktail -> SF2 kit.

[paigeoliver]

More products are still good things, granted I don't think there would be much of a market for any of those you described (other than the Ms. Pac-Man cocktail to SF2, judging from newbie posts you could sell those all day long).

[NoOne=NBA=]

I also want to take  a minute to thank NoOne=NBA=, 1UP,  and the others that "get it" and have helped to keep this thread "on-track".  This would have been more crazy than it already is without your help.

No Problem.

I saw trouble coming from the get-go on this because YOU were the only one who had actually TESTED anything.

Being the only guy with knowledge/experience in an environment like this (where everyone WANTS to know everything, and THINKS they know how things will work in real life) is not a position I envy you.

I've got alot of friends who are bench techs and such, and have run afoul of "engineers" who INSISTED that the circuit they designed would work flawlessly--despite it failing miserably in real-life TESTS, with full documentation to PROVE that it DIDN'T work.

That's pretty much the same situation you're in here.

[SirPoonga]

I also want to take

[NoOne=NBA=]

That is exactly what I was saying.
What works on paper is not necessarily what works in real-life applications.

A good case in point for this application is whether the 1st level inputs even need to be used.
How much of a dead zone is created around center by eliminating them from the picture?
How does that compare to a 4-way leaf?
How does it compare to a 4-way micro?
These are things that can't be PROVEN on paper.
They have to be FELT.

With this setup, you can't tweak anything in the field.
Testing it at the source is the only way to tweak anything.

Could Randy have sent it off for Beta testing after HE was satisfied with it?
Yes, but it would have delayed availability of the product.

SHOULD he have?
I don't think so.

He's backing up HIS opinions (subjective as they are) with a money-back guarantee, so I'm guessing he's fairly confident with the results.
Basically the product will soon enter the Beta testing phase.
People will buy it, and post how THEY think it feels.

[sWampy]

That is exactly what I was saying.
What works on paper is not necessarily what works in real-life applications.

A good case in point for this application is whether the 1st level inputs even need to be used.
How much of a dead zone is created around center by eliminating them from the picture?
How does that compare to a 4-way leaf?
How does it compare to a 4-way micro?
These are things that can't be PROVEN on paper.
They have to be FELT.

With this setup, you can't tweak anything in the field.
Testing it at the source is the only way to tweak anything.

Could Randy have sent it off for Beta testing after HE was satisfied with it?
Yes, but it would have delayed availability of the product.

SHOULD he have?
I don't think so.

He's backing up HIS opinions (subjective as they are) with a money-back guarantee, so I'm guessing he's fairly confident with the results.
Basically the product will soon enter the Beta testing phase.
People will buy it, and post how THEY think it feels.

What would have been super nice is if the patterns could be updated in the driver, and if the modes could have been switched in software.

[RandyT]

I totally understand what you are saying.  Things may not work out like they do on paper.
However, I wouldn't leave it up to one guy to determine what should feel right to everyone because one person is more likely to NOT think of all possibilities.  So we have to challenge RandyT to make sure he is giving us a good product.  Example, me coming up with the shift key idea because I can see this as a replacement for the keywiz for some people.  RandyT didn't think of that.  Which make me tend to think RandyT didn't beta test this with anyone but himself.  What he thinks may not be what most of his customers think and you need to cater to the customer, not yourself.

You don't give me enough credit.

I did consider the shifted buttons at the beginning of this, but I didn't know 2 things:

1: Whether such a feature was necessary when there are scads of buttons available, especially in a panel where there are 2 of these boards present (46 extra buttons is a lot for anyone)  or 1 GP-Wiz49 + 1 KeyWiz (IPAC, whathaveyou) where the Keyboard encoder already has this feature.  And there is also the fact that with applications like MAME, ANY button can be a "shift" button.  You just dedicate it as such and it works.  So when you brought it up, I looked at in the light of "it was important enough to one person, so there may be others.  And if I can add it without detriment to the rest of the product, I will try."  I am still not convinced that the testamant of one user deems that feature as a necessity that should hold up it's release,  considering the rest of what the product offers.

and

2: Whether there was a way to implement a shifted gamepad button that makes sense and won't screw up cross-platform HID compatibility.  I still don't know the answer to this one as I now am battling fussy HID report structures again.

So, it's not that I didn't think of a simple addition of a shift function.  There were just a lot more issues at play than you are aware of in its implementation.



And, I will repeat this one more time.  "Feel" has nothing to do with this product.  You cannot make it feel any different by messing with the definitions.  What you can do, however, is screw it up royally so that it doesn't work as it should.  The feel of the stick is governed entirely by the mechanical operation and one must correct for what it does by it's inherent nature.

This is one area where Xiaou2 and I see "eye-to-eye", and when I get few free moments, I'll respond to that book he wrote .

And the product was tested.  I mean, I like you guys a lot, but there are other people on the planet.  Some of them that will even give you fresh viewpoints not clouded by years of what they are "used to".  I even had a chance to watch what happened when they used it.   We are talking people who don't play video games for a living, but average Joes, who when asked "how does the control feel?  Did it ever seem to make you go someplace you didn't intend to go?" replied in every case, paraphrased, "No.  It worked really well and I felt like I was always in control."

And you know the funny thing?  They never asked what the grids looked like....not even once.

RandyT

[SirPoonga]

You don't give me enough credit.

2: Whether there was a way to implement a shifted gamepad button that makes sense and won't screw up cross-platform HID compatibility.

[RandyT]

What would have been super nice is if the patterns could be updated in the driver, and if the modes could have been switched in software.

If this is of interest to you, take urebelscum's advice and use the software approach to develop your own solutions.  This product was not designed for you, rather the person that just wants things to work without fiddling with stuff that might confuse the hooey out of them.

RandyT

[SirPoonga]

What would have been super nice is if the patterns could be updated in the driver, and if the modes could have been switched in software.

If this is of interest to you, take urebelscum's advice and use the software approach to develop your own solutions.

[RandyT]

How is the shift different than the keywiz?  The keywiz is usb, is it not?  It should be HID then.

The KeyWiz is not USB.  And even if it was, HID reports for Keyboards and Gamepads are very different birds.

RandyT

[SirPoonga]

How is the shift different than the keywiz?

[SirPoonga]

Out of curiosity, how would I have this output digital up/down/left/right for those PC games that don't use an analog joystick.

I know in mame you can do this.  But there may be PC games that are only expecting the digital input.  Or does the analog input send the digital direction too in the windows HUD?

[NoOne=NBA=]

"Feel" has nothing to do with this product.  You cannot make it feel any different by messing with the definitions.

"Feel", in the context used, is not the MECHANICAL feel of the stick, but rather the OPERATIONAL feel of the stick.
(i.e. does it have dead spots like a software restricted 8-way)

A software restricted 8-way will stop sending data when a diagonal is hit, until you get it back to a cardinal direction--and that FEELS bad while you are playing a game.

If you made the stick ONLY respond to the 2nd level of the cardinal directions, I'm betting the people who tested it would tell you that it FELT like they weren't in control.
Actually, they would probably throw in some choice cuss words, so that you'd know how they REALLY felt about it, but....

[SirPoonga]

Exactly, you have to think in terms of a gamer playing a game than a hardware guy making hardware.

When a gamer says the controls don't "feel" right it's because the resopnse the controls have and the feedback from the game are not in sync with how the gamer thinks they should work.

By changing the definitions, even one grid point like changing a diagonal bias on a 4way restriciton, will feel different to a gamer.

Actually, it could mean the physical feel is not right either, like there's too much tension in the joystick spring, etc... but depending on how the gamer describes the "feeling" you will know if he is talking about how the hardware is phyically versus how the software is interpetting the hardware.  They will usually say something specificly related to the hardware, like my wrist is getting strained or the joystick feels loose (weak spring).

But the feel most of us are talking about here is the interaction between the 49way and ultimately the game.

[tetsujin]

I'd also like to reiterate what others have already said. There needs to be a way of changing the joystick's mode through software as well as by pressing buttons. And programmable customised grids would also be very useful.

I felt this type of extra baggage had the possibility of jeopardizing cross-platform HID compliance.  It also de-simplifies the use of the device by requiring software to use it.
In some instances it would be good, but not so good in others.

Thanks for providing an answer to my question.  Personally, though, I feel that putting that control over the device's behavior on the PC side (where it belongs) is very important, as I want to build my cabinet without assuming the people playing it will know things like the button layouts for a game, the type of joystick it uses, etc. beforehand.  Where possible the 8-way/4-way/2-way/49-way selection should be taken care of for them.  (I say "where possible" because I don't have a way to do that with T-Stick+'s because I have no way to control the mechanical slider with software - but as this is a problem of controlling software behavior it seems very possible)

If you decide you would like to add that kind of support without complicating the encoder firmware, one way to approach it would be to make it easier for an outside circuit to set the encoder's mode.  That way the mode switch could be done with parallel port interfacing, or with something like a general-purpose I/O board connected to USB.  That's possible already, of course, except that operation of the game buttons can interfere with that unless there's some kind of external cut-off inserted.  (It'd cost an extra three I/O lines from the microcontroller to provide this kind of control without using the button lines...)

Anyway, it's just a thought.  For now I'll just assume that you're right about the complications involved in controlling this feature through USB HID, which would otherwise seem the most straightforward way of controlling the feature through software.

[SirPoonga]

I'd also like to reiterate what others have already said. There needs to be a way of changing the joystick's mode through software as well as by pressing buttons. And programmable customised grids would also be very useful.

I felt this type of extra baggage had the possibility of jeopardizing cross-platform HID compliance.

[RandyT]

Exactly, you have to think in terms of a gamer playing a game than a hardware guy making hardware.

But the feel most of us are talking about here is the interaction between the 49way and ultimately the game.

I know this is hard for you guys to believe, but I know these things already.  I'm not just "some hardware guy".  I lived in the arcades in my youth, and converted a real arcade cabinet for use with computers and consoles before some of the crowd here were even born.  I am a pioneer in this hobby, not a "johnny come lately" (self proclaimed, of course )

But the hardware guy in me says this:

The only other "feel" you can achieve is the "feel" that it sucks. 

There isn't the wiggle room with this as some of you folks think.  It really goes: "Works well" to "What a stupid idea" with little if anything inbetween.  These sticks just do not have the resolution to have the flexibility you are thinking they possess.

And I would need my head examined if I left non-strategic dead spots in the definitions. 

RandyT

[RandyT]

I'm with you on this one.  There would have to be some sort of flash memeory on the encoder that can be programmed via PC software the how the ipac is programmed.  Then the software in the wiz49's IC would have to read from that flash memory the config for handling the 49way's pins to analog value.

This should be doable would definately take time and programming.

The hard part would be coming up with software that is cross platform, not the hardware.  Right now, I program my ipac via the windows utility (is there  alinux) then put the ipac on the linux arcade.  There's nothing that says that can't be done here unless HID is disallowing a way to program the hardware.

Edit:  I just realized you were talking about changing modes.  simular thing applies however the software to program the hardware or change the mode would have to have an API (be it commandline or whatever) that a FE can use.  It wouldj be the FE's responsibility to change the mode.

And then it would cost $50 because of all the extra hardware and software development, hardware, custom boards, etc.. and I would burn through half of my market because the device suddenly looks too complicated to the people that just want a simple solution, and too expensive for anyone to consider.

Right at this moment, we have people that think it's the greatest thing in the world to be able to blindly lift and twist on the stick to go from 4 to 8 ways, but somehow pressing a couple of buttons is suddenly "too inconvenient".

You should spend a day in my shoes.

BTW, hows that controls.dat project coming that you guys started years ago?  See?  It's easy for someone on the outside to decide what should and shouldn't be possible.   In my mind, you guys should have had not only the data collection side ready, but a full blown 3D interface with all the trimmings by now.  But I'm not close enough to the project to understand your thought process or what is ultimately impeding your progress, nor will I tell anyone that I am.

And just so there's no confusion, the above is not a "dig", just an example SirP might be able to relate to.  I personally could care less what the status of that project is (although I do believe it to be a worthy cause.)

RandyT

[Hoagie_one]

I would think that a command line switch would be great, like /49A or /49B, etc etc.

I'll shut up now

[SirPoonga]

There isn't the wiggle room with this as some of you folks think.

[SirPoonga]

I would think that a command line switch would be great, like /49A or /49B, etc etc.

RandyT will have to look into it to see if it is possible.

Well, I am a believer that anything is possible.

[sWampy]

What would have been super nice is if the patterns could be updated in the driver, and if the modes could have been switched in software.

If this is of interest to you, take urebelscum's advice and use the software approach to develop your own solutions.  This product was not designed for you, rather the person that just wants things to work without fiddling with stuff that might confuse the hooey out of them.

RandyT

A controller for a 49 way joystick with the ability to emulate other joysticks is a great idea.  I just know none of the people who play on my cabinets want to have to think oh gee, pac-man used a 4 way, let's see  I have to hold down the purple button while hitting the red button.  Then they switch to something like stargate they aren't going to know to hold down the purple button while pressing the green button.  Having to push the buttons is hookey as ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---.  A way to set the hardware in software would be a thousand times better.   I understand you most likely can't do this with out a driver for the device and you want to stick to a HID device that requires no driver, but why?   Macs make less than 5% of the market place and less than that of the emulation market place, and surely nobody is going to want to hook this up to their xbox/dreamcast/ipaq so why stick with HID.   I guess there is a small linux market, but release the specs and someone will write a driver for that.   A windows utility that let people swap layouts would be something anyone could understand, and a command line program or api would then let frontends change the sticks on the fly where the end user wouldn't have to do anything at all.

While it sounds like a neat idea to me, I most likely won't purchase it, cause I don't want my wife calling me at work complaining that pacman won't let her go left and right cause I was playing stargate last night and forgot to reset it. 

[SirPoonga]

BTW, hows that controls.dat project coming that you guys started years ago?