Lichtknarre: Unmodified Wii remote as a sight accurate Lightgun using 2/4 LEDs

[Fusselkroete]

Does anyone know if PCSX2's latest SDL RAW Input would allow for 2 players via vjoy with lichtknarre?  I don't think so, but looking for confirmation.

Didn't test it, so i dont know. Just want to mention that other connector plugins are still under development: xinput/rawinput hook. But im not sure when this will be ready to release. could take longer time. i hope this works in the end. But if it works this will maybe help to connect to more emulators and make it compatible.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1_hO48IkGl4tYwfkDmiX3Pz3olSzyAhgVJpxdv0QwmsE/edit# << xinput had a test already. (screenshots at bottom)

[RandyT]

One thing I wanted to mention that I find fascinating is that Lichtknarre is probably the only solution for line-of-sight 2 player for Wii games that don't support in-game calibration.

Possibly just as effective, with the author's latest version, and as I understand it, you are able to tweak some calibration offsets from the command line while the program is already running.  Unless the calibration is way off, you should be able to correct some or maybe all of this with a well-crafted command line and an FE which allows for running something before the game launches.

[Howard_Casto]

I hate to be "that guy" but I would like to point out that the two resident evil games on the wii are NOT meant to be line of sight lightgun games.   The gun is verry much used as a cursor in these games which is why when you sweep towards the edges of the screen the camera pans.   So one to one reticule placement isn't really how they are supposed to behave. 

[ZTylerDurden717]

which is why when you sweep towards the edges of the screen the camera pans. 

If what you're saying is true, shouldn't I be able to pan the camera with my cursor hitting the edges?

[Fusselkroete]

which is why when you sweep towards the edges of the screen the camera pans. 

If what you're saying is true, shouldn't I be able to pan the camera with my cursor hitting the edges?

You should do lets plays xD

[a5608498]

You can use hidhide to hide wiimotes from dolphin.

Remember to whitelist lichtknarre on hidhide list.

Still hidhide is not able to properly hide Wiimote in all cases. After a resync they may come back (ask author for some possible fixes). But will be the proper solution.

[Fusselkroete]

You can use hidhide to hide wiimotes from dolphin.

Remember to whitelist lichtknarre on hidhide list.

Still hidhide is not able to properly hide Wiimote in all cases. After a resync they may come back (ask author for some possible fixes). But will be the proper solution.

sounds great!

[RandyT]

You can use hidhide to hide wiimotes from dolphin.

While this may work, it should be mentioned that applications like hidhide should never be installed on a daily driver gaming system which is used for online multiplayer games.  Many anti-cheat programs look specifically for this type of software, and just having it present on the system can result in account/IP/system bans and/or loss of your games, despite the legitimate reasons for using such software.

The cheating problem for online games has become so bad, the game companies don't care how many babies are tossed with the bath water.  So keep this in mind when installing any system-level device software on systems used for this purpose. 

But for dedicated/off-line systems, go wild.

[a5608498]

Hidhide is almost mandatory when using DS4Windows to avoid the double input problem. Been hiding sony controllers since some years ago.

Not sure how bad can this be for online gaming, but never had problems. But I guess it depends on the game, anticheat system, etc.

Doesnt Windows 11 has some permissions settings for BT, webcam, etc for every app?

https://www.digitalcitizen.life/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/app_permissions-7.png

Maybe BT is not on the list.

[RetroRon]

Just learned about the Lichtknarre project so please excuse my ignorance on the topic. It's nice to see that this project will allow people to use existing Wiimotes as a lightgun. I have a few questions:
1. Does the 2 IR LED option support using a single Wii sensor bar?
2. Does the 4 IR LED option support using 2 Wii sensor bars, one on top and one on bottom?
3. Why does the 4 IR LED configuration use the 50/50 top/bottom placement but the sides use a 74/26 placement instead of a 50/50 diamond pattern? Is it to distinguish the lower part of the screen from the top?
With so many lightgun projects popping up lately, each with different IR LED placements, it seems that my monitor is slowly turning into a tanning bed! (I know, wrong end of the light spectrum, maybe I should have said heating pad)

[Fusselkroete]

Hi new version is now available with following features:

version: 0.9.10.20
download: https://geekonarium.de/en/lichtknarre-lightgun/

This version is now compatible with Dolphin 5.
Lookup tutorial for Dolphin 5: https://geekonarium.de/en/vjoy-lightgun-emulator-configuration/#configureDolphin5
This injects a hook into Dolphin 5 and filters out real wii remotes. Many thanks to LuftWaffle aka ZTylerDurden717 and trihy aka a5608498 for all their help with testing. Please give me feedback if something is not working well with the current version.

This version also includes the following fixes: Adjust x,y can now always reach the edges correctly and the windows 10 scaling problem has been fixed again.

[Fusselkroete]

Just learned about the Lichtknarre project so please excuse my ignorance on the topic. It's nice to see that this project will allow people to use existing Wiimotes as a lightgun. I have a few questions:
1. Does the 2 IR LED option support using a single Wii sensor bar?
2. Does the 4 IR LED option support using 2 Wii sensor bars, one on top and one on bottom?
3. Why does the 4 IR LED configuration use the 50/50 top/bottom placement but the sides use a 74/26 placement instead of a 50/50 diamond pattern? Is it to distinguish the lower part of the screen from the top?
With so many lightgun projects popping up lately, each with different IR LED placements, it seems that my monitor is slowly turning into a tanning bed! (I know, wrong end of the light spectrum, maybe I should have said heating pad)

1. yes
2. technically you can use 4 sensor strips with only 1 LED sticking out behind the TV, which respects the placement that is wanted in the calibration. But more advance way is to buy/build your own leds.
3. the exact placement of the LEDs with these ratios helps the software to find out exactly which LED is which in order to always calculate the exact position.

[RandyT]

Howard, did you give up?  I keep wondering how you are making out with your conversion. 

[Howard_Casto]

No I've just been busy.   Haven't really started yet to be honest.   

[Posad]

I first came across this a few days ago and ordered the bits and pieces to make the led harness.  While I wait for it, I am working on integrating the wii remote permanently into a gun shell with proper trigger action.  I have two questions:

1. Does Lichtknarre take advantage of Wii Motion Plus?  That is, do I need Motion Plus or can I use an earlier model without loosing accuracy, response time or any other benefit?  Not sure if there is any other relevant difference between wii remote revisions.
2. Possibly related to the first question, does Lichtknarre rely on the camera only, or does it also read other wii remote sensors? Testing my work in progress gun with the Wii, it seems the camera orientation has to match the remote pcb.  I tried to have the pcb sideways for easier button access while keeping the camera in the normal position as if the buttons were facing up (think TV remote control) and it did not work.  The Wii was confused and the cursor moved erratically.

Thank you for all your work. I cannot wait to set it up and play.

[Fusselkroete]

I first came across this a few days ago and ordered the bits and pieces to make the led harness.  While I wait for it, I am working on integrating the wii remote permanently into a gun shell with proper trigger action.  I have two questions:

1. Does Lichtknarre take advantage of Wii Motion Plus?  That is, do I need Motion Plus or can I use an earlier model without loosing accuracy, response time or any other benefit?  Not sure if there is any other relevant difference between wii remote revisions.
2. Possibly related to the first question, does Lichtknarre rely on the camera only, or does it also read other wii remote sensors? Testing my work in progress gun with the Wii, it seems the camera orientation has to match the remote pcb.  I tried to have the pcb sideways for easier button access while keeping the camera in the normal position as if the buttons were facing up (think TV remote control) and it did not work.  The Wii was confused and the cursor moved erratically.

Thank you for all your work. I cannot wait to set it up and play.

Hi

Lk does not use motion plus but uses the motion sensor. It makes no difference if you use motion plus or not. With the 4 LED tracker it takes about 0.8 seconds to adjust when you tilt the wii with the 4 LED tracker. Not for the 2 LED tracker. So in summary, LK is camera and motion sensor dependent.

LK is currently still in beta status as described in the tutorials and may therefore be incompatible with some emulators. However, other connector plugins are being worked on.

Regarding the side buttons, hopefully a guncradle will be released soon as a 3d print which will hopefully eliminate this problem.

I can't give any timeframe for this, because this is only a hobby project.

[karoloydi]

Can someone show me a screenshot of what it is supposed to look like in retroarch input config when you have set it up correctly?
I managed to get it to work with MAME, but it does not work with Retroarch.

I tried to do:
Analog to Digital Type: Left Analog Forced
Left Analog Y- (Up)    Axis -1
Left Analog Y+ (Up)   Axis +1
Left Analog X- (Up)    Axis -0
Left Analog X+ (Up)   Axis +0

[Fusselkroete]

Can someone show me a screenshot of what it is supposed to look like in retroarch input config when you have set it up correctly?
I managed to get it to work with MAME, but it does not work with Retroarch.

I tried to do:
Analog to Digital Type: Left Analog Forced
Left Analog Y- (Up)    Axis -1
Left Analog Y+ (Up)   Axis +1
Left Analog X- (Up)    Axis -0
Left Analog X+ (Up)   Axis +0

Hello, I think it is not compatible yet. Can you explain what is going wrong with the setup? Do you see vjoy gamepads in retroArch? This will be fixed in future versions for sure. Many things are currently in the works.

I bet it's not compatible because retroarch itself implemented a Wii client and it steals the handle from Lichtknarre. There is a hook in the current version of LK that takes over the Dolphin 5 process and blocks all Bluetooth capabilities so LK can keep the handle. I'll have to try this out on retroArch if retroarch has implemented a Wiiremote client. Steam should have the same problem since it is wiiremote compatible. If the program has implemented the functionality properly and provides an option to disable wiiremote functionality, then it should work with LK, but that was not the case with Dolphin. LK also unhooks the Dolphin 5 process when it is closed. it is just a process hook.

[karoloydi]

It was a nightmare to setup. Every time I was assigning an axis retroarch controls would stop responding, then I had to quit retroarch and come back to do the next Axis. The Y-Up axis was almost impossible to do, but somehow I managed to do it at the end.
When I started I could see the target moving at the bottom of the screen. It appeared that I was kind of affecting it's movement, but I couldn't see any pattern for the movement.

[Fusselkroete]

There is a utility for the axes to calibrate the emulators:

https://geekonarium.de/forumPics/axiscalibrationhelper.png

sry this is still missing in the tutorials.

[karoloydi]

Has anyone managed to play Model 2 and Naomi (Demul) with 2 players? I only managed to play one player, using with mouse plugin.

Also, for supermodel, I could get Ocean Hunt and Lost World to work with 2 players, but LA Machine Guns is not working. Any ideas?
I tried both:
<inputs>
    <input type="common" />
    <input type="gun1" />
    <input type="gun2" />
</inputs>

<inputs>
    <input type="common" />
    <input type="analog_gun1" />
    <input type="analog_gun2" />
</inputs>

[Fusselkroete]

Has anyone managed to play Model 2 and Naomi (Demul) with 2 players? I only managed to play one player, using with mouse plugin.

Also, for supermodel, I could get Ocean Hunt and Lost World to work with 2 players, but LA Machine Guns is not working. Any ideas?
I tried both:
<inputs>
    <input type="common" />
    <input type="gun1" />
    <input type="gun2" />
</inputs>

<inputs>
    <input type="common" />
    <input type="analog_gun1" />
    <input type="analog_gun2" />
</inputs>

sry i have no clue but if you find the answere please share here

[karoloydi]

Has anyone managed to play Model 2 and Naomi (Demul) with 2 players? I only managed to play one player, using with mouse plugin.

Also, for supermodel, I could get Ocean Hunt and Lost World to work with 2 players, but LA Machine Guns is not working. Any ideas?
I tried both:
<inputs>
    <input type="common" />
    <input type="gun1" />
    <input type="gun2" />
</inputs>

<inputs>
    <input type="common" />
    <input type="analog_gun1" />
    <input type="analog_gun2" />
</inputs>

sry i have no clue but if you find the answere please share here

For the LA Machinegun I figured it out. There was something wrong with my NVRAM file. Even when I deleted it, it wouldn't create a proper one. I downloaded another one from Launchbox forums and that fixed the issue:
https://forums.launchbox-app.com/files/file/3857-sega-model-3-supermodel-git-everything-pre-configured-inc-controls-for-pc-controller-mouse-light-guns-test-menus-configured-free-play-all-games-in-english-2-player-mouse-support-audio-adjusted-layout-imagesthe-whole-9-yards/?do=download

[karoloydi]

I got M2 Emulator work with 2 players too, with DemulShooter.
Only Demul left now. I am positive DemulShooter will work with Demul.

[Fusselkroete]

I got M2 Emulator work with 2 players too, with DemulShooter.
Only Demul left now. I am positive DemulShooter will work with Demul.

Maybe you can do tutorial for the ppl here and it can be added on the website if you like. Also other ppl who are interested in doing such things can post here and I put it on the site

https://geekonarium.de/en/vjoy-lightgun-emulator-configuration/#emulatorConfigurations

[karoloydi]

Hi,

If anyone is intrerested how to set up M2 EMulator with 2 players, you can follow this tutorial. Thats' what I used. I think the only difference is that he's using a Dolphin Bar instead of lichtknarre.

[karoloydi]

I can confirm that Demul works with the exact same method I posted above!
The only difference is the script on the bat file.

It looks like this for demul:
Demulshooter.exe -target=demul07a -rom=confmiss

It looks like this for M2 EMulator:
Demulshooter.exe -target=model2 -rom=hotd

target is the emulator. Rom is the name of the rom zip file.

You will need to go in the service/test menu and calibrate the guns, but they very accurate after that.

[ZTylerDurden717]

I can confirm that Demul works with the exact same method I posted above!
The only difference is the script on the bat file.

It looks like this for demul:
Demulshooter.exe -target=demul07a -rom=confmiss

It looks like this for M2 EMulator:
Demulshooter.exe -target=model2 -rom=hotd

target is the emulator. Rom is the name of the rom zip file.

You will need to go in the service/test menu and calibrate the guns, but they very accurate after that.

Also good news is that PS2 emu PCSX2 latest 1.7 versions support two player with lichtknarre using vjoy 

Time Crisis 2 split-screen doesn't work yet however that's due to emulator support rather than the light gun system.

[karoloydi]

I can confirm that Demul works with the exact same method I posted above!
The only difference is the script on the bat file.

It looks like this for demul:
Demulshooter.exe -target=demul07a -rom=confmiss

It looks like this for M2 EMulator:
Demulshooter.exe -target=model2 -rom=hotd

target is the emulator. Rom is the name of the rom zip file.

You will need to go in the service/test menu and calibrate the guns, but they very accurate after that.

Also good news is that PS2 emu PCSX2 latest 1.7 versions support two player with lichtknarre using vjoy 

Time Crisis 2 split-screen doesn't work yet however that's due to emulator support rather than the light gun system.

Cool! Any good PS2 games to try, that I can't find in Arcade emulators?

[karoloydi]

By the way, if someone wants to do a 4 IR LED setup cheaply, and is not good at electrical stuff, there's a USB IR LED you can buy from Ali Express:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004523162882.html
It's about £14 including delivery
It says up to 42", but it fit my 46". I think more than that you'll struggle.
The IR LEDs are more or less as strong as the wii sensorbar.

[karoloydi]

I set up PCSX2 with 2 players too! Time crisis split screen works too.

There are a few things to keep in mind:
In the Controller settings, you need to go to the Global settings and tick "Enable Dinput Input Source"
I also had issues with wiimotes disconnecting. Deselect "Enable SDL Input Source". That will stop PCSX2 trying to take over the wiimotes.
I did a separate instance of PCSX2 for the lightguns, to not mess up with the settings for my other games. (you can just copy and paste the whole installation folder)

Then you need to go and edit the ini file:
If you don't have any custom profiles, then you edit the PCSX2.ini file inside the "inis" folder of PCSX2 installation folder
If you are using custom profiles, I believe that would be inside the "inputprofiles" folder of your PCSX2 installation folder
You will need to copy this to the [USB1] section of the ini file (or overwrite if it already exists):
guncon2_RelativeUp = DInput-0/-Axis1
guncon2_RelativeLeft = DInput-0/-Axis0
guncon2_RelativeRight = DInput-0/+Axis0
guncon2_RelativeDown = DInput-0/+Axis1

and this to your [USB2] section:
guncon2_RelativeUp = DInput-1/-Axis1
guncon2_RelativeLeft = DInput-1/-Axis0
guncon2_RelativeRight = DInput-1/+Axis0
guncon2_RelativeDown = DInput-1/+Axis1

(it's likely it won't allow you to save the file directly. Just save it on your desktop , then copy and paste and overwrite)
There's a chance that It's DInput-2 or DInput-3. (You can try and map some of the buttons and see what it will show you.)

Then map all the buttons.
Make sure to map the "calibration shot" button. You will need that for the first step of calibrating the guns.
The first time it asks you to aim, I press the "calibration shot" button and aim at the target at the same time. Not sure if you have aim at the same time, but I think you do.

I have only one issue. Sometimes after calibration, the aim cursor only goes about 85% down, and the more I calibrate the worse it becomes. Not sure why. But it's not really an issue, cause I'm never aiming that low anyway. I think if you are more or less happy with your first calibration, do't try to calibrate again.
Edit: All you have to do is aim a bit higher or lower than you are supposed to, and it will bring the upper or lower borders up or down

[ZTylerDurden717]

I set up PCSX2 with 2 players too! Time crisis split screen works too.

There are a few things to keep in mind:
In the Controller settings, you need to go to the Global settings and tick "Enable Dinput Input Source"
I also had issues with wiimotes disconnecting. Deselect "Enable SDL Input Source". That will stop PCSX2 trying to take over the wiimotes.
I did a separate instance of PCSX2 for the lightguns, to not mess up with the settings for my other games. (you can just copy and paste the whole installation folder)

Then you need to go and edit the ini file:
If you don't have any custom profiles, then you edit the PCSX2.ini file inside the "inis" folder of PCSX2 installation folder
If you are using custom profiles, I believe that would be inside the "inputprofiles" folder of your PCSX2 installation folder
You will need to copy this to the [USB1] section of the ini file (or overwrite if it already exists):
guncon2_RelativeUp = DInput-0/-Axis1
guncon2_RelativeLeft = DInput-0/-Axis0
guncon2_RelativeRight = DInput-0/+Axis0
guncon2_RelativeDown = DInput-0/+Axis1

and this to your [USB2] section:
guncon2_RelativeUp = DInput-1/-Axis1
guncon2_RelativeLeft = DInput-1/-Axis0
guncon2_RelativeRight = DInput-1/+Axis0
guncon2_RelativeDown = DInput-1/+Axis1

(it's likely it won't allow you to save the file directly. Just save it on your desktop , then copy and paste and overwrite)
There's a chance that It's DInput-2 or DInput-3. (You can try and map some of the buttons and see what it will show you.)

Then map all the buttons.
Make sure to map the "calibration shot" button. You will need that for the first step of calibrating the guns.
The first time it asks you to aim, I press the "calibration shot" button and aim at the target at the same time. Not sure if you have aim at the same time, but I think you do.

I have only one issue. Sometimes after calibration, the aim cursor only goes about 85% down, and the more I calibrate the worse it becomes. Not sure why. But it's not really an issue, cause I'm never aiming that low anyway. I think if you are more or less happy with your first calibration, do't try to calibrate again.
Edit: All you have to do is aim a bit higher or lower than you are supposed to, and it will bring the upper or lower borders up or down

I have it set up that way too in pcsx2.  You'll notice in split-screen if you aim down the sights for player 1 or player 2 it won't be accurate.  It's a bug with the emulator itself.

Also about the aim cursor being 85% down.  Sounds like offset adjustments needed in lichtknarre if you haven't done that yet.

[Fusselkroete]

I set up PCSX2 with 2 players too! Time crisis split screen works too.

There are a few things to keep in mind:
In the Controller settings, you need to go to the Global settings and tick "Enable Dinput Input Source"
I also had issues with wiimotes disconnecting. Deselect "Enable SDL Input Source". That will stop PCSX2 trying to take over the wiimotes.
I did a separate instance of PCSX2 for the lightguns, to not mess up with the settings for my other games. (you can just copy and paste the whole installation folder)

Then you need to go and edit the ini file:
If you don't have any custom profiles, then you edit the PCSX2.ini file inside the "inis" folder of PCSX2 installation folder
If you are using custom profiles, I believe that would be inside the "inputprofiles" folder of your PCSX2 installation folder
You will need to copy this to the [USB1] section of the ini file (or overwrite if it already exists):
guncon2_RelativeUp = DInput-0/-Axis1
guncon2_RelativeLeft = DInput-0/-Axis0
guncon2_RelativeRight = DInput-0/+Axis0
guncon2_RelativeDown = DInput-0/+Axis1

and this to your [USB2] section:
guncon2_RelativeUp = DInput-1/-Axis1
guncon2_RelativeLeft = DInput-1/-Axis0
guncon2_RelativeRight = DInput-1/+Axis0
guncon2_RelativeDown = DInput-1/+Axis1

(it's likely it won't allow you to save the file directly. Just save it on your desktop , then copy and paste and overwrite)
There's a chance that It's DInput-2 or DInput-3. (You can try and map some of the buttons and see what it will show you.)

Then map all the buttons.
Make sure to map the "calibration shot" button. You will need that for the first step of calibrating the guns.
The first time it asks you to aim, I press the "calibration shot" button and aim at the target at the same time. Not sure if you have aim at the same time, but I think you do.

I have only one issue. Sometimes after calibration, the aim cursor only goes about 85% down, and the more I calibrate the worse it becomes. Not sure why. But it's not really an issue, cause I'm never aiming that low anyway. I think if you are more or less happy with your first calibration, do't try to calibrate again.
Edit: All you have to do is aim a bit higher or lower than you are supposed to, and it will bring the upper or lower borders up or down

I have it set up that way too in pcsx2.  You'll notice in split-screen if you aim down the sights for player 1 or player 2 it won't be accurate.  It's a bug with the emulator itself.

Also about the aim cursor being 85% down.  Sounds like offset adjustments needed in lichtknarre if you haven't done that yet.

No its not about IR Offset. Only use adjust axis x,y for this.

You only need IR Offset to tell the programm that there is a gab between the display and the IRs.
You only need Game offset to tell the programm that there is a matte in the game and the curcor only works in these boundarys. ( i hope matte is the right word: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_matte)

https://geekonarium.de/en/what-is-ir-offset-and-why-do-i-need-it/

[karoloydi]

Yeah, I fixed it without offset.
Just aim a bit higher or lower than the centre, and it will bring the lower or upper border up or down.

[Fusselkroete]

Yeah, I fixed it without offset.
Just aim a bit higher or lower than the centre, and it will bring the lower or upper border up or down.

nooo do normal calibration. dont use extra offset. Use Adjust Axis x,y. In your case adjust Axis y. this feature is exactly made for this purpose in "selected connector plugin setting".

https://geekonarium.de/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/multiplayer.png

I use it in mame for lucky and wild. Because the second player was moved to the right with the crosshair in mame.

[karoloydi]

I just got Dark Escape 4D, Deadstorm Pirates and Sailor Zombie working as well, with 2 players!
It's quite fun 

[Fusselkroete]

I just got Dark Escape 4D, Deadstorm Pirates and Sailor Zombie working as well, with 2 players!
It's quite fun 

i dont know these games but glad you like the software

[karoloydi]

I just got Dark Escape 4D, Deadstorm Pirates and Sailor Zombie working as well, with 2 players!
It's quite fun 

i dont know these games but glad you like the software

Deadstorm pirate is like Transformers Human Alliance with pirate zombies
Dark Escape 4D is like House of the Dead
Sailor Zombie is like House of the Dead with Japanese pop-star zombies

[ZTylerDurden717]

I had assumed non button-pressed off-screen reload would only work with dolphin emulator. Turns out i can do it perfectly well with latest pcsx2.  Does anyone have off-screen reload working for them in other emulators? Which ones and how did you do it?

[karoloydi]

I had assumed non button-pressed off-screen reload would only work with dolphin emulator. Turns out i can do it perfectly well with latest pcsx2.  Does anyone have off-screen reload working for them in other emulators? Which ones and how did you do it?

Demul and Technoparrot also suppport this