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Author Topic: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork  (Read 3839 times)

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opt2not

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #40 on: October 16, 2015, 05:26:26 pm »
Ok, I see your point. Nevertheless, I don't think there's much you can do about it other than not helping out. I also do believe that many new members are struggling with the artwork. I struggled myself during my first build (I'll link to a pic of my first build, then you'll understand).

I actually kinda like that cabinet. The artwork is plain, simple and tasteful. Not a sensory overload of a mismatch of characters and styles.

But it's understandable, not everyone is artistic.  Which is part of the reason why we have an artwork forum of BYOAC. There have been many discussions of people asking for advice, or critique on their artwork. And there are guys like me and Malenko who try to post tutorials and tips in photoshop for people new to the software.  That's the point of the Artwork forum...

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #41 on: October 16, 2015, 05:30:58 pm »
I actually kinda like that cabinet. The artwork is plain, simple and tasteful. Not a sensory overload of a mismatch of characters and styles.
It's a generic artwork from GoG!

Quote
But it's understandable, not everyone is artistic.  Which is part of the reason why we have an artwork forum of BYOAC. There have been many discussions of people asking for advice, or critique on their artwork. And there are guys like me and Malenko who try to post tutorials and tips in photoshop for people new to the software.  That's the point of the Artwork forum...
And that's the way it should be. Trying to prevent newcomers from getting help is NOT the solution. We just have to deal with the fact that we're not living in a perfect world and that stealing DO occur.

opt2not

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #42 on: October 16, 2015, 05:49:27 pm »
And that's the way it should be. Trying to prevent newcomers from getting help is NOT the solution. We just have to deal with the fact that we're not living in a perfect world and that stealing DO occur.
Asking for help is not the same as asking for hand-outs.

johnrt

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #43 on: October 16, 2015, 05:50:58 pm »
And that's the way it should be. Trying to prevent newcomers from getting help is NOT the solution. We just have to deal with the fact that we're not living in a perfect world and that stealing DO occur.
Asking for help is not the same as asking for hand-outs.
How can you tell the difference?

opt2not

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #44 on: October 16, 2015, 05:53:25 pm »
How can you tell the difference?

How can you not?

"hi, I'm new. I'm working on a project and am stuck on artwork. Can you critique my side art?"

"hi, I'm new. I'm working on a project...can you give me free art for it?"

Seems pretty clear what is what.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2015, 05:56:06 pm by opt2not »

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #45 on: October 16, 2015, 06:02:17 pm »

Opt, are you saying that its art piracy if newbies come here to find original arcade artwork, but it isn't art piracy if they are established contributing members?
Yes, that's part of it.

I'm no copyright lawyer, but I don't think that will hold up.

Nothing anyone does here can establish their legal use of artwork they do not own or have permission to use. In other words, n00bs have as much right (none) to use someone else's art as saint has.

I get that it's annoying when someone's first post is a request for art, but you used the term piracy and that really is irrelevant here. Yes, it is inconsistent that BYOAC has a policy of no ROMs, yet turns an blind eye to artwork. In reality neither is likely to result in any sort of legal trouble for the home user.




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johnrt

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #46 on: October 16, 2015, 06:09:21 pm »
I get that it's annoying when someone's first post is a request for art, but you used the term piracy and that really is irrelevant here. Yes, it is inconsistent that BYOAC has a policy of no ROMs, yet turns an blind eye to artwork. In reality neither is likely to result in any sort of legal trouble for the home user.
I totally agree. And why fight it? I have also been a newcomer and my biggest concern back then was the artwork. Everything else I managed to google. Don't be surprised if a users first post is about artwork. Do NOT forget that you self once was a newcomer too!

opt2not

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #47 on: October 16, 2015, 06:14:30 pm »
Where are the mods in all this?  You guys running this place want to chime in?

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #48 on: October 16, 2015, 06:20:57 pm »
Everyone has seen the sticky thread Vector WIP .....right?

It's been viewed over 75,000 times.
If you can read this, it means Photobucket's money grab ruined my signature photos.

johnrt

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #49 on: October 16, 2015, 06:43:34 pm »
Btw: Look at MY first post ever in this forum. Guess what: It's artwork-related!

Edit: I've been a member for over 2 years now!
« Last Edit: October 16, 2015, 06:51:31 pm by johnrt »

yotsuya

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #50 on: October 16, 2015, 07:05:57 pm »
I get what Opt is saying: making an account to simply ask for artwork made for someone else's project seems wrong. Introduce yourself first, at least.
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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #51 on: October 16, 2015, 11:18:34 pm »
Some forums I have been on require all new members post on an "introduce yourself" thread before you can start any new threads. I think it was both an anti spam measure and a way to promote members to be more comfortable with being a member and not just an outsider asking questions.

Would that sort of function be a benefit here?

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #52 on: October 17, 2015, 05:53:50 am »
for lack of better judgment i feel i'd like to weigh in here. (i have a feeling I'm going to regret typing this, but i just want to make a point)...


Why does this really matter Opt?  You seem intent on jumping into this and fighting an internet battle here:

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,147778.0.html

The guy comes in, asks a question, and the first post is you kinda kicking dirt in his face. And by the end of it you tell him to take a hike off to KLOV. Why couldn't you have just done what the rest of us who saw it did and clicked the "Back" button on your browser?  It's kinda along the lines of:  "if you don't have anything nice to say..."

doesn't make for an inviting place, hell, the guy apologizes to you in his own thread third post in. Even if he was lying through his teeth, so what if he's going to take it and sell it? we can't police the internet.  I would have just ignored the thread and moved on.  (like i should be doing here)......


Better question: Why is the BYOAC turning into Reddit?!



Ok:  ROMs, sure, companies want to make sure they could still make a profit off of a playable chunk of customer entertaining IP. Hell, they could release it on a "Best of" Anthology on XBoxLive, or something. TOTALY get that.

Artwork... i mean, i don't see Konami sending out the law team to flip desks over a set of repro Turtles In Time art. Lets be honest, Arcades and arcade cabs are NOT coming back in any capacity that they enjoyed back in the day. Is it still violating a copyright, YES. Is it policed? No, not really. The worst you'd see is a cease and desist to Saint asking for the removal of the offending art.

« Last Edit: October 17, 2015, 05:55:38 am by ChanceKJ »

CheffoJeffo

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #53 on: October 17, 2015, 10:22:48 am »
for lack of better judgment i feel i'd like to weigh in here. (i have a feeling I'm going to regret typing this, but i just want to make a point)...

Is that like the accidental rudeness that the kids find so unavoidable?

Why does this really matter Opt? 

You know, I understand his frustration -- stick around long enough and something like this will happen for you too. Stuff like this is one of thee reasons even active old-timers leave (we all hang out together in a sort of purgatorial back alley, swigging beers, watching garbage trucks and griping about the ungrateful kids and their entitlement issues).

You are also right in what you say, although your balance of judging Opt vs judging the art leech is kinda tilted. And KLOV is actually where I would go to find scans of original artwork, if I didn't know all the secret stashes.

Better question: Why is the BYOAC turning into Reddit?!

See above re: Lack of Judgment, Regret and Accidental Rudeness  :dunno

Seriously, it's always been like that -- Xiaou2's been riding this particular horse since before I got here -- it goes in waves.

Ok:  ROMs, sure, companies want to make sure they could still make a profit off of a playable chunk of customer entertaining IP. Hell, they could release it on a "Best of" Anthology on XBoxLive, or something. TOTALY get that.

Artwork... i mean, i don't see Konami sending out the law team to flip desks over a set of repro Turtles In Time art. Lets be honest, Arcades and arcade cabs are NOT coming back in any capacity that they enjoyed back in the day. Is it still violating a copyright, YES. Is it policed? No, not really. The worst you'd see is a cease and desist to Saint asking for the removal of the offending art.

I agree intellectually with this (always have), but the real measure is what is worth it and what isn't. And you know what, we don't get to decide that. Last I checked this place doesn't make any money and it's Saint's BBQ. If I had to guess, I would think that the legal exposure of this place is much more than we might think (Hell, I got a takedown notice for arcade artwork on my old personal site). Sadly legal costs are real and don't succumb to having a good argument or even being right.

Whatever Saint's comfortable with is fine by me and you buncha whippersnappers should be damned grateful for it!  :oldman
« Last Edit: October 17, 2015, 02:55:35 pm by CheffoJeffo »
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JDFan

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #54 on: October 17, 2015, 11:33:00 am »
Why does this really matter Opt?  You seem intent on jumping into this and fighting an internet battle here:

Did you ever think it might matter to him more because he is trying to make some $$ selling original artwork ??  Figure everyone of those users that use existing work is one less paying customer for him and rather than lower his prices to compete, he'd rather not have the existing work available for free, so that his work could be charged more in line with his expectations of what it is worth and he wouldn't have to deal with so many "YOU WANT HOW MUCH FOR JUST SOME ARTWORK" -- the more art that is out there to download for free or next to it, the less he can charge before the customers complain about the cost - so understandable that it would be upsetting to someone that is trying to make some $ selling his work.


Ok:  ROMs, sure, companies want to make sure they could still make a profit off of a playable chunk of customer entertaining IP. Hell, they could release it on a "Best of" Anthology on XBoxLive, or something. TOTALY get that.

Artwork... i mean, i don't see Konami sending out the law team to flip desks over a set of repro Turtles In Time art. Lets be honest, Arcades and arcade cabs are NOT coming back in any capacity that they enjoyed back in the day. Is it still violating a copyright, YES. Is it policed? No, not really. The worst you'd see is a cease and desist to Saint asking for the removal of the offending art.

Figure the end user isn't going to see a lawyer knocking down their door for either the Roms or the Artwork for their home use as most of these corporations have been bought and sold so many times that most of them are unaware of what specific content they own and what other legal uses have been sold and to what companies.  So like you say they may send out a cease and disist but they aren't going to try and enforce it if you do not comply.

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #55 on: October 17, 2015, 03:02:02 pm »
Meh,  I was in a similar situation as a designer in the paintball industry a few years ago. I was good at it, made some decent money, and had a bit of acclaim. After 8 years the climate changed, few things started to stress me out about it, and it wasn't my main source of income so I said "meh" and walked away. I still do the odd project for a team if requested but I don't stress over it.

If something in life like this stresses you out, my advice is to just move on.  Focus on what really matters in life and find something enjoyable. 

Just like this thread, it bores me so, meh. I'm out. :)

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #56 on: October 17, 2015, 03:11:28 pm »
If something in life like this stresses you out, my advice is to just move on.  Focus on what really matters in life and find something enjoyable. 

Says the guy who, in the brief time I have been back, has felt stressed enough to post rants (one all in bold even  :woot) targeting specific people before proclaiming that the discussion bores him. ::)

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #57 on: October 17, 2015, 03:20:46 pm »
As I posted in the Star Castle artwork thread, there is a ton of work that goes into some of these projects (Star Castle sideart is actually a really good example of that) and the "I can haz free filez" approach will generate some pushback.

Some of that can be alleviated by making reasonable requests and taking the time to explain what you have done so far, what you are looking for, etc.

Quote
My friend has been trying to find sideart for a Star-Castle-themed cabinet he is building. We've looked at all the usual spots (vectorlib, coinopart, etc.), but haven't found anything. Does anybody know if there is a scan or vector out there?

If you can't be bothered to ask nicely, it's unreasonable to expect that people will reply nicely.
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yotsuya

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #58 on: October 17, 2015, 03:47:06 pm »
Well said, Cheffo. All of it.
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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #59 on: October 18, 2015, 01:05:38 pm »
I <3 Cheffo.


Ignoring the posts is fine, and I tend to do that. However, that doesn't stop the log jam of free art requests in the section. I have to side with Opt2Not that ignoring the problem doesn't make it go away. I will do my best to stay positive and try to make a few more tutorials to post up in that section, I saw Opt posted one and I'd like to keep the trend going.

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #60 on: October 19, 2015, 07:13:14 am »
I wish I knew of this site when I built my monstrosity of a cabinet back in the sidewinder hack days. God awful. 1 day I will fix it all but have really moved more onto original games now for the most part.

But back to the point at hand. I am not sure what can really be done other than locking attachment downloads until a certain # of posts. Or dont post the final attachments and have people have PM to get them, although I am sure a lot of great artwork would get lost that way as peoples interest come and go on site.

I will say its nice when people acknowledge your work, and respect its rights. I am currently finishing a Crystal Castles redraw of the CP and I really dread putting it out there, as someone will take it and sell it on EBAY. Crazy isnt it. I am not looking to make money on it, but damn if I want some dumb arse to make money on it, lol.

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #61 on: October 19, 2015, 09:45:04 am »
It's happened to me a few times, but it's always been stuff I did for myself and shared with others.  I figure I'm better off for having the artwork and, hey, maybe they'll make a higher quality copy available cheap.  It is funny how impossible it can be for some to say "thanks, dude!" or "I started selling these on e-bay and would like to give you one free." 

Some day.... some day....


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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #62 on: October 20, 2015, 05:11:26 pm »
Well said, Cheffo. All of it.

Give me a few weeks -- I'll be a ruthless, obnoxious bastard again.
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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #63 on: October 22, 2015, 06:14:37 pm »
Why does this really matter Opt?  You seem intent on jumping into this and fighting an internet battle here:

Did you ever think it might matter to him more because he is trying to make some $$ selling original artwork ??  Figure everyone of those users that use existing work is one less paying customer for him and rather than lower his prices to compete, he'd rather not have the existing work available for free, so that his work could be charged more in line with his expectations of what it is worth and he wouldn't have to deal with so many "YOU WANT HOW MUCH FOR JUST SOME ARTWORK" -- the more art that is out there to download for free or next to it, the less he can charge before the customers complain about the cost - so understandable that it would be upsetting to someone that is trying to make some $ selling his work.

That's not it at all. As of recently, I am no longer making artwork for BYOAC members.
I don't want to make a big stink about this, but I offered my services to help out the community, at the same time of making a little hobby spending cash. But the community isn't the same, and I don't feel like offering my art-skills to this new generation of members. Too much trouble, too much ignorance, too many ego's.

My main beef is the influx of new member who make accounts here to reap the free-art benefits without contributing anything back. That's the basis of it. The rest of the hate comes from the attitudes around how artwork and artists are regarded in general... which is an age-old battle that I don't think I can do anything about. Hence, I'm opting out of creating new artwork for the random members, and going to concentrate on doing artwork for my friends and I. I'm still going to finish up the ones I have on task right now. After that, it's me time.

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #64 on: October 22, 2015, 06:17:20 pm »
Well said.
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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #65 on: October 22, 2015, 06:48:08 pm »
Don't be that grumpy folks. Right now you're making it look like you oldtimers are the only ones who can create arcade artwork. There will come new members with unbelievable skills, I promise you. You have to have faith in the next generation of arcaders.

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #66 on: October 22, 2015, 06:56:23 pm »
I'm commending him for speaking his mind as an artist. I've seen too many times for people ask for help, and then  balking when presented a price for paying for anybody's time and talent. And Opt is not a guy who simply cuts and pastes clipart you can find on the internet. So I tend to sympathize with him when he says he's done with creating custom artwork. There's plenty of guys out there who can cut and paste stuff for cheap / free.

We've had a couple guys over the last year so come through with custom drawn artwork, but those are extremely far and few in between.
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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #67 on: October 22, 2015, 07:03:27 pm »
Don't be that grumpy folks. Right now you're making it look like you oldtimers are the only ones who can create arcade artwork. There will come new members with unbelievable skills, I promise you. You have to have faith in the next generation of arcaders.
I'm not sure where you're pulling that from.
This thread is about giving away free artwork, not whether people can successfully make good arcade art.  If you want to discuss that specifically, I suggest you make a separate thread to discuss that and keep this one on-topic.

Besides, I'm not an old-timer per se.  I've only been here for 8 years.  Nor am I the only one that can do arcade artwork, there are plenty of guys here that can do custom art.  Guys like SNAAKE, Gbeef, and Mike Boss. Even Ond is in the mix.
Refer to the Retail Vendor's sticky list.  There's a lot of options for members to choose from if they're looking for someone to do their artwork for them.  SNAAKE specifically has been doing it for a while now, and I always recommend him to people.

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #68 on: October 23, 2015, 07:02:51 am »
I see your point (I think), but whining about it all the time doesn't help the community either. Why this drama every time?

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #69 on: October 24, 2015, 05:02:55 am »
Here is a more simpler idea.

Get a a jam jar and put it on your desk.

Every time you pinch someones artwork, or ROM, stick a dollar bill in there.

When full (in about an hour) give the jar to some homeless person on the street.

You will feel good.  The homeless person will feel good.  Excellent Karma all round.
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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #70 on: October 29, 2015, 08:33:23 pm »
People coming to an arcade hobbiest forum asking for arcade art? Doesn't sound too far fetched to me.

So what if it's the first question they ask? If they don't get abused, it might even be the precursor to an interesting build thread!

And if a piece of art is provided here in full res for the masses to use, then who is going to buy it off ebay? The market sorts that out. People trying to sell something that can be readily acquired for free is a non-existent problem in the long run.

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Re: BYOAC - your one-stop shop for free artwork
« Reply #71 on: November 02, 2015, 01:48:23 am »
    I would wonder why klove would bother to send anyone here,  My guess is the A/A library (or lack of) has sent people on a migration pattern looking for art, clips or anything they can use.... However, not unlike Roms, It is C/W content, (read the FAQ page noobies) and most likely why they lived in distant galaxy and not here at the byoac.

  
 

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