Cheapest Keyboard Encoder

[CoryBee]

Cheapest keyboard encoder option. I mean cheapest, no keyboard hacks though.

DIY options, commercial option I am curious what is the cheapest way. Need about 10 of them for several projects and tired of hacking up gamepads and messing with joytokey.

A decent DIY keyboard encoder using an IC would be nice, if someone has a relatively cheap board layout I can make that would suffice.

Cheers!

[Unstupid]

Xin-mo 1 player from paradise arcade shop?  $18

http://www.paradisearcadeshop.com/en/mame-arcade-parts/229-xin-mo-1-player-arcade-controller-to-usb-pc-or-ps3-0855742002290.html

[CoryBee]

Xin-mo 1 player from paradise arcade shop?  $18

http://www.paradisearcadeshop.com/en/mame-arcade-parts/229-xin-mo-1-player-arcade-controller-to-usb-pc-or-ps3-0855742002290.html

Forgot to mention it needs to be 2-Player, or at least 22 inputs

[UFO]

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=120362.0

[PL1]

Xin-Mo is a gamepad encoder, not a keyboard encoder.

Buy an AVR here or here and do one of the following:

1. Load the current KADE firmware (20 dedicated inputs), connect two buttons to HWB and another input for shifted functions using diodes like the right side of the diagram here.
Pros: Easy to load/customize.  Cons: Uses 4 diodes. (Not much of a Con IMHO but )

2. Load the older AVR encoder extended firmware from here -- Group B or Group D on the Full Key Mapping Table.
Extended Mode Wiring diagram is also there.
Pros: No diodes.  Cons: Harder to load, can't customize the key map.

Related PM sent.


Scott

[BobA]

Any other sources?   Modchip is out of stock and Foundry says in stock but has no add to cart button so must also be out of stock.  Thanks

[CoryBee]

Yes another link would be nice, the price is nice.

[yotsuya]

Would this be the same thing:

http://www.foundmy.com/oscom/minimus-avr-usb-32k-instock-p-402.html

[BadMouth]

Foundry says in stock but has no add to cart button so must also be out of stock.  Thanks

It's there.  It's just located in the bar at the bottom on the right.

I ordered mine from there (for $6 IIRC  ).  Not much communication, but they showed up in the mail after a couple weeks.

[CoryBee]

Foundry says in stock but has no add to cart button so must also be out of stock.  Thanks

It's there.  It's just located in the bar at the bottom on the right.

I ordered mine from there (for $6 IIRC  ).  Not much communication, but they showed up in the mail after a couple weeks.

Couple weeks? Damn!

[PL1]

Would this be the same thing:

http://www.foundmy.com/oscom/minimus-avr-usb-32k-instock-p-402.html

The 32k AVR will work just as well as the 16k version I linked earlier.

KADE loader has been tested with both.

No advantage at this time to the 32k over the 16k since the KADE firmware is smaller than 16k.


Scott

[CoryBee]

So here is my dilemma, I need 4 encoders and am tired of hacking so many gamepads. Groovy game has the eco-wiz for 25 but that puts me at 100 bucks before shipping which I don't like the sound of......

There aren't enough inputs for one of these guys or I would go with that. If I understand correctly it has 21 inputs? Degenatron's video says it has 22 but that is probably a typo. 22 is enough, 24 is preferable. 21 is not enough so ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---....

[BadMouth]

Foundry says in stock but has no add to cart button so must also be out of stock.  Thanks

It's there.  It's just located in the bar at the bottom on the right.

I ordered mine from there (for $6 IIRC  ).  Not much communication, but they showed up in the mail after a couple weeks.

Couple weeks? Damn!

Yup, probably faster if you're in Canananada (I say it that way in real life).

The checkout process is shady too because of the CC companies not wanting to process payments for places that sell stuff to jailbreak consoles.T
(something tells me Sony is involved).  When I checked out, it said that I'd receive a phone call to give them my CC info, but after placing the order I received an email with a link to pay.  It all felt shady, but I got my parts and never had any unauthorized charges on my card.

I searched everywhere for a source that had a more traditional checkout and found none.

Given the extra hassle of ordering & setting up the AVR, I'd just fork over the money for the eco-wiz (as long as your PCs have PS2 inputs).
A few more points though:
If you use the MAME default keys, you'll still need workarounds for some emulators since they don't support the use of keys like CTRL & ALT.
If you change the key mappings on the key-wiz, it doesn't retain changes when powered down.  It requires a program to be installed that re-uploads them every time windows starts.  People have had issues with this program on some PCs.
It has enough inputs, that I leave it on the default and just don't use the CRTL, ALT, etc inputs.  It's easy to globally remap the controls in MAME and it saves a lot of headaches with other emulators.

[404]

Yup, probably faster if you're in Canananada (I say it that way in real life).

The checkout process is shady too because of the CC companies not wanting to process payments for places that sell stuff to jailbreak consoles.T
(something tells me Sony is involved).  When I checked out, it said that I'd receive a phone call to give them my CC info, but after placing the order I received an email with a link to pay.  It all felt shady, but I got my parts and never had any unauthorized charges on my card.

I searched everywhere for a source that had a more traditional checkout and found none.

Yup, I know the owner of foundmy personally and that's exactly why. He is legit though.

both MS and Sony have cracked down on payment gateways offering their services to mod shops.

He last told me he had a stash of minimus units in the US but he must have run out.

[CoryBee]

hmmm, $130 for 4 ecowiz or $30 for 8 gamepads to hack.........

$100 can buy a lot of beer......

Only wish the minimus was 22 inputs...I can make due with that. But 21?! You are just messing with me now

[PL1]

So here is my dilemma, I need 4 encoders and am tired of hacking so many gamepads. Groovy game has the eco-wiz for 25 but that puts me at 100 bucks before shipping which I don't like the sound of......

There aren't enough inputs for one of these guys or I would go with that. If I understand correctly it has 21 inputs? Degenatron's video says it has 22 but that is probably a typo. 22 is enough, 24 is preferable. 21 is not enough so ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---....

You're going to solder either way, only difference is the size of the pad.

The AVR video is from his earliest prototype before he changed a few things around for greater versatility IIRC.

Newer AVR Encoder and KADE firmwares are configured like this.

24 Pins
--------
20 Dedicated inputs (all of which are usable as shifted functions)
1 Hardware Button (HWB) input for "shifted" functions (like P1 Start on IPac or the Shazaaam! on KeyWiz)
1 Reset
1 5v supply
1 Ground

To make 22 inputs (20 dedicated, 2 shifted) with the current KADE firmware:
- Wire 18 dedicated inputs straight from button to input
- Wire the other two inputs (19, 20) "backward" with the COM terminal connected to the encoder input, the NO connected to ground and the NC terminal going to buttons 21 and 22.
- For Button 21 (shifted 19), connect the wires from the NC terminal on 19 and HWB using one diode on each line as shown in the diagram linked above.
- For Button 22 (shifted 20), connect the wires from the NC terminal on 20 and HWB using one diode on each line as shown in the diagram linked above.
NOTE: If you leave out the diodes, pressing button 21 will also give you 22 because they are both tied to HWB

To make 25 inputs using the older AVR firmware, wire the 8 joystick inputs like this and wire the other 12 inputs direct:


One easy way to make a removable harness like the Xin-Mo is to solder on two 12 pin headers and buy 6 of these 4-pin pre-crimped .187" harnesses from Paradise along with a daisy chain.
 

Only wish the minimus was 22 inputs...I can make due with that. But 21?! You are just messing with me now

You can have up to 40 inputs (20 dedicated, 20 shifted) with current KADE firmware.

You can have 25 inputs using the older AVR firmware if the joysticks are wired like above.

Nobody's messing with you -- follow the directions I posted and it will work.

LMK if you have any questions.


Scott

EDIT: Since other links to AVR sources were requested, try here or here.

[yotsuya]

I'd love a low-cost encoder that only did like 5 keystrokes for specific uses. Maybe I need to hack a 10-key pad.

[PL1]

I'd love a low-cost encoder that only did like 5 keystrokes for specific uses. Maybe I need to hack a 10-key pad.

Scott

[CoryBee]

To PL1, Ow....That hurt my head....and I have designed some tricky PCB designs before.....

Can I request one of your fancy pants diagrams to show how I can get the 22 inputs I need?

Cheers and as always thanks!

[BadMouth]

To PL1, Ow....That hurt my head....and I have designed some tricky PCB designs before.....

Can I request one of your fancy pants diagrams to show how I can get the 22 inputs I need?

Cheers and as always thanks!

If I understand correctly, the third switch registers as both the other switches being pressed.
Both switches aren't going to be tripped under any other circumstances because they are opposite directions on the same joystick.
(when you press P1 start, both UP and Down would register)

I guess the KADE firmware translates that into a different input, but you could also do this with any encoder and map it as a combo in MAME.
That would work for your purposes if the coin buttons were only going to be used in MAME.

The extra switch on the end (ESC) makes it more confusing, ignore it until you understand...then add it back.

[PL1]

To PL1, Ow....That hurt my head....and I have designed some tricky PCB designs before.....

Can I request one of your fancy pants diagrams to show how I can get the 22 inputs I need?

Cheers and as always thanks!

RandyT did the original great diagram that I've modified below.   

For 22 inputs, the first 18 are wired like normal.

Orange dot = connection, no dot = no connection

Shazaaam! = HWB on AVR

19 is wired like X below. (Upper left)  Button 19 not pushed = encoder input 19 passed to switch 21.

20 is wired like Y below. (Lower left)  Button 20 not pushed = encoder input 20 passed to switch 22.

21 (shifted 19) is wired like Shazaaam! + X. (Upper right)

22 (shifted 20) is wired like Shazaaam! + Y. (Lower right)

You can add up to 18 more shifted buttons using this same method.


Scott

[Maximus]

Is this any good? - 30 Inputs... $35 inc shipping

http://www.ebay.com/itm/USB-30-input-keyboard-Emulator-Encoder-/171075235552?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27d4e0eee0

[yotsuya]

I'd love a low-cost encoder that only did like 5 keystrokes for specific uses. Maybe I need to hack a 10-key pad.

Scott

Why wouldn't I be serious? I'm working on a project that would benefit from a keyboard encoder but I really don't need OMG 22, no 44 KEYSTROKEZZZZZ!!!!11!!! for $50 shipped when all I need is four total.

[BadMouth]

Why wouldn't I be serious? I'm working on a project that would benefit from a keyboard encoder but I really don't need OMG 22, no 44 KEYSTROKEZZZZZ!!!!11!!! for $50 shipped when all I need is four total.

This is where the AVR would be great if it could be found as cheaply as it once was.
Once upon a time there was a UK dealer selling them for $4.

I think I paid around $20 for two of them from foundmy by the time shipping was added.
I plan to use them for the start, coin, view, exit, & radio buttons on my twin driving cab build.
I wanted something that would register as a keyboard for those few buttons because it makes navigating PC games easier.

There are probably other AVRs running the same chip that would work just as well as the minimus.
Someone else just needs to figure out what they are and test it. 

[PL1]

To PL1, Ow....That hurt my head....and I have designed some tricky PCB designs before.....

Can I request one of your fancy pants diagrams to show how I can get the 22 inputs I need?

Cheers and as always thanks!

If I understand correctly, the third switch registers as both the other switches being pressed.
Both switches aren't going to be tripped under any other circumstances because they are opposite directions on the same joystick.
(when you press P1 start, both UP and Down would register)

I guess the KADE firmware translates that into a different input, but you could also do this with any encoder and map it as a combo in MAME.
That would work for your purposes if the coin buttons were only going to be used in MAME.

The extra switch on the end (ESC) makes it more confusing, ignore it until you understand...then add it back.

You've got the idea behind the "impossible" combinations.

At this time    . . . the current release of the KADE firmware doesn't support them, only the older AVR firmware does.

Pressing the P1 Start button applies ground to both P1 Up and P1 Down which the firmware translates into a keystroke of "1".

Pressing the Cancel button applies ground to P1 Up, P1 Down, P2 Up, and P2 Down which the firmware translates into a keystroke of "Esc".


Scott

[JDFan]

Why wouldn't I be serious? I'm working on a project that would benefit from a keyboard encoder but I really don't need OMG 22, no 44 KEYSTROKEZZZZZ!!!!11!!! for $50 shipped when all I need is four total.

For something like that a keyboard hack would probably be easiest as you only need to trace 4 or 5 inputs not the entire keyboard so would only take a few minutes to trace them and solder the connections needed for just those. -- though if you don't mind it being a gamepad device instead of keyboard you really can't go wrong with the Zero Delay type boards for $11 shipped including the USB cable and wiring for the 16 inputs it handles. This is the one I used for my 1 player bartop and it only took about 10 days to receive ( http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-No-Delay-Arcade-USB-Encoder-PC-to-Joystick-For-2pin-Happ-Type-Push-buttons/251293017139?_trksid=p2047675.m1850&_trkparms=aid%3D222002%26algo%3DSIC.FIT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D17116%26meid%3D453753586924836097%26pid%3D100011%26prg%3D8016%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D5%26sd%3D251241379915%26 )

[PL1]

Why wouldn't I be serious? I'm working on a project that would benefit from a keyboard encoder but I really don't need OMG 22, no 44 KEYSTROKEZZZZZ!!!!11!!! for $50 shipped when all I need is four total.

I thought you were kidding about not noticing the 100's of posts about the AVR Encoder/KADE in the last 15 months.   


Scott

[yotsuya]

Why wouldn't I be serious? I'm working on a project that would benefit from a keyboard encoder but I really don't need OMG 22, no 44 KEYSTROKEZZZZZ!!!!11!!! for $50 shipped when all I need is four total.

This is where the AVR would be great if it could be found as cheaply as it once was.
Once upon a time there was a UK dealer selling them for $4.

I think I paid around $20 for two of them from foundmy by the time shipping was added.
I plan to use them for the start, coin, view, exit, & radio buttons on my twin driving cab build.
I wanted something that would register as a keyboard for those few buttons because it makes navigating PC games easier.

There are probably other AVRs running the same chip that would work just as well as the minimus.
Someone else just needs to figure out what they are and test it. 

Exactly. I need 4 keystrokes for my console emulator. Joy2Key and Hyperspin are having  when I use them together with InstallSheller and a Vigo Special. A KADE, KeyWiz and I-Pac2 are all overkill.

[ark_ader]

KADE is awesome.  It should be BYOAC supported by default!   

[404]

hmmm, $130 for 4 ecowiz or $30 for 8 gamepads to hack.........

$100 can buy a lot of beer......

Only wish the minimus was 22 inputs...I can make due with that. But 21?! You are just messing with me now

Depending on your OS, just build an lpt switch based encoder. diodes are dirt cheap and you can yank a printer port connector off of any old cable.
http://www.arcadebr.com.br/lpt-switch/

[McHale]

Any reason you want a keyboard encoder instead of a USB joystick encoder?  I'd never go keyboard encoder again. 

2 Joysticks, 22 buttons - $25.00



http://www.ebay.com/itm/MAME-Arcade-Controls-USB-Adapter-PC-and-PS3-/140882707785?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20cd438549

[michelevit]

you can purchase that inexpensive joystick controller and use joy2key or xpadder programs to translate them into key presses, mouse movements or even macros. easily remapable too as opposed to a keyboard encoder.

i built several cabs with keyboard hacks - there is always that route. keyboards are practically free...

[yotsuya]

Again, like Cory said, sometimes you just need a keyboard for everything to play nicer.

[Unstupid]

Only wish the minimus was 22 inputs...I can make due with that. But 21?! You are just messing with me now


Well the minimus(kade) encoder does have a shift key so that you can assign different functions to each button when the shift is enabled

Nevermind...  It has been covered!

[CoryBee]

Like I said I have been using gamepads for a while now and when I get the ecowiz it is always the gamepad version. Keyboard encoder seems to be the easiest route. Configuring exit in games through mala is not possible when using joytokey for keyboard inputs. Like Yotusula said, everything plays nicer and there is less things to go wrong when there is nothing in between the encoder and the system. I really haven't had any issues with my gamepad hacks, but now that I have been building in a higher volume I am attempting to streamline it. Making sure that everything is solid and reducing time it takes to setup the programs is essential.

Thanks for all the input fellas.

[AndyWarne]

Our I-PAC VE is $39 shipped. 32 inputs with screws, also supports sleep/wake/volume up-down and mouse buttons.

The standard VE board does not retain any custom settings after power off/on but on request I can supply a version which does (as in the I-PAC 2) for no extra cost.