i5-2500K-based PC, m350 Universal Case! It works!

[RyoriNoTetsujin]

I’ve been meaning to do this for some time now, and finally put the parts together. Based on the separate reviews I’ve been reading, I had a good feeling that these parts would work well together, and so far I have not been disappointed. Good news for folks who want a full-power bartop or have a specialty design, I think…

Old bits
CPU: i5-2500K (stock 3.3ghz)
Mobo: ASRock H67M-ITX
RAM: 4GB G-Skill Ripjaws
Samsung 64GB SSD
Samsung 2TB “Green” 3.5” HDD
Win 7 x64 Home Edition

New bits
M350 Universal Enclosure
PicoPSU 150w

Noctua NH-L9i Heatsink

eSATA enclosure (for 2TB HDD)

Power
Idle: ~25w
Load: ~115w
** Measured at wall with a Kill-a-Watt meter. This does not include 2TB drive (now powered separately.)

Temps
Idle: Currently 40°C in a relatively warm 25.5° room.
Load: Maxed out at 76°C (room temp was ~23°C at the time.)
** Load test was simultaneous windowed running of mame64 (NFL Blitz) and PCSX2 (Soul Calibur 2) for 100% CPU usage, for 10 minutes.
SSD: Idle ~38°C, got up to ~45°C during load test.

Pros
* Tiny. I could throw this in my backpack and not think twice about carrying it around.
* System is much more modular now. (Some folks will care less about this, but I like it.)
* Noctua fan is very quiet, especially @ 7v or less (~1500rpms.)  Any ambient noise, especially gaming, is going to drown this out.
* picoPSU provides plenty of completely silent power. No buzzing at all from either the unit or the power brick.
* 2 USB ports hidden behind front fascia are PERFECT for wireless keyboard/wifi/bluetooth dongles.
* m350 case is built solid. Some times too much so. (See cautions.)

Cons
* Very tight inside the case: The SSD is touching the heatsink fan. Thankfully, it’s not exerting any pressure on the fan, or blocking airflow, but it is definitely touching. This may make some folks nervous. 
* On a related note: temps with the case lid off were, on average, 5-to-10°C cooler.
* Routing cables was a genuine pain in the ass.  I had to build an extension just to get the power switch to the mobo header on the opposite side of the board. However, you should only have to do this once.
* Power brick is large, gets warm.
   
Cautions
* You do lose the PCI-e slot, at least for a discreet GPU. (Not because of the heatsink, for a change! The heatsink clears everything brilliantly.) 
* Be prepared to make tiny modifications to the case to get everything working right. Not only did I have to make a wire extension, but the two holes that hold the PSU plug in place were too small for the provided screws. I had to open them up a tiny bit with a drill/driver.

Of course, I'm thinking with an Ivy Bridge processor (like a 3770T, despite it's massive expense) you could get even more power and even better temps. As it is, this system is definitely able to run the "benchmark" titles that are playable in Mame. 

If anyone has questions, feel free to ask. 

[RyoriNoTetsujin]

one of these days I'll learn to write long posts in Word first... ugh. Took me 3 tries to get the above posted. 

[PL1]

one of these days I'll learn to write long posts in Word first... ugh. Took me 3 tries to get the above posted. 

Just hit "preview" every 5-10 minutes and it won't time out on you.   


Scott

[RyoriNoTetsujin]

Just hit "preview" every 5-10 minutes and it won't time out on you.   

Wasn't that. I kept accidentally hitting Alt-Left Arrow on the wrong tab and losing what I'd written.

Not to mention I posted this in the wrong section. I thought I was posting in Main. Already asked a mod to move it... maybe this should go to Reviews, now that I think about it... 

It's going to be one of those days.

[Jumpman64]

Thanks for the info... what is the ballpark cost on this setup?

[RyoriNoTetsujin]

Thanks for the info... what is the ballpark cost on this setup?

Buying brand new?  You'd have to sub in a different mobo (like the H77M-ITX, or similar) but, for everything I listed, quick math says about $800.

* -$100 if you already have an OS (or work with Linux)
* You could easily leave out the 2TB drive part of the setup and/or swap in a larger SSD or laptop HDD.  (I've been playing with the idea of romsets on MicroSD cards...)
* If you wanted to drop another $100 or so, and you have no desire to play NFL Blitz or the other resource hogs, you could easily buy a less powerful CPU and still have 98% of mame. Even the latest Celerons can likely handle that.

The main purpose of this was to show that the Noctua heatsink can actually handle the 2500k (a 95w TDP processor - some reviews have even overclocked this same CPU/heatsink combo!) while also fitting in the m350 case.

[Bender]

This is pretty much what I'm looking for with maybe a few tweaks
I've never built a PC before, so any help is very much appreciated

If it's inside a cab, is there a reason for the case?
I know this sounds dumb but where does the heat sink attach?
why does the HDD now have separate power?
and if no case could you recommend a small light Power supply

any pics of the inside of your setup?

The MB you used is no longer available how's this one look
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157311
any avantage to an i7 not that much more expensive
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116502

[RyoriNoTetsujin]

If it's inside a cab, is there a reason for the case?

Portability, essentially.  I can take the whole PC out and take it over to my buddy's place, or whenever I travel. Took it home with me to my parent's house over the holidays - they had a spare monitor, so I didn't miss a beat. I have a couple of USB SNES pads that are a nice substitute for when I'm not at the cabinet.

I know this sounds dumb but where does the heat sink attach?

It's for the CPU, in this case the i5-2500K. It's designed to fit any LGA 1155 motherboard (basically any of your Sandy Bridge/Ivy Bridge Intel Core processors.)  Speaking of which, that 3770 you're looking at is top of the line, but it you're really trying to go big guns, I think you should try to find the 3770T, if you can (and can afford it!)  The lower TDP rating on the T version generally means it generates less heat, and therefore is easier to keep cool and happy.  Mini-ITX, especially in a very small case such as this, can be tricky to keep within proper thermal range.  That's the only big advantage the 3770T has over the 2500K (aside from raw power) since the 2500K already runs everything playable that Mame can throw at it. 

why does the HDD now have separate power?
and if no case could you recommend a small light Power supply

Remember, there are 2 hard drives: one internal (the SSD that has the OS) and one external (my 2TB backup drive). The one in the external enclosure runs on its own power supply (thereby removing that small burden from the motherboard's power supply) and is, technically, completely optional in my setup. (I'm running the roms off a microSD card in an adapter inside the m350 case!) 

The SSD is powered by the motherboard, which has the 150w picoPSU attached.  I imagine that same picoPSU could run a 3770 too in this kind of setup, but I'd want to test it with a normal PSU first.  You're certainly not going to be able to power a discreet graphics card in a full setup like this with a picoPSU; the highest they go is 160 watts, I believe.  You're definitely limited to the GPU of whichever CPU you buy.  Not a terrible limitation if you're only playing MAME and console emulators.

any pics of the inside of your setup?

The MB you used is no longer available how's this one look
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157311

I'll take it out and take a few more detailed pics once I'm done with this post, and put them up later. 

As for the mobo, it's basically the updated version of the one I am currently using.  Same board layout, same back panel, but the chipset allows for Sandy Bridge AND Ivy Bridge CPUs (like your 3770 and 3770T.) Mine only does Sandy Bridge.

[Bender]

Thanks so much for the quick response!
so much helpful info. I'm starting to feel a bit more confident that I'll be able to put it all together

2 more questions and they're kinda related

I will only be running mame and a couple other emu's
but I might want to do HLSL lcd filter in mame and I have no clue if the onboard video processor Intel HD4000 I believe
can handle that, any ideas?

and could you help me find a picoPSU, or if i need a graphics card for the HLSL, a PSU that will be able to power that too

Thanks again

[RyoriNoTetsujin]

The HD3000 in my 2500K handles HLSL just fine. I can run NFL Blitz in Mame .145 with HLSL on.  The HD4000 should have NO problem.  Hell, even the Ivy Bridge HD2500 on-board is an incremental improvement over Sandy's HD3000 according to benchmarks around the net.

I've noticed certain games freak out when HLSL is turned on (Galaga, Strider 2, OpWolf, possibly others) but I think that's a MAME issue, not the gpu.

picoPSU kits are on mini-box.com (they manufacture the part themselves.)

I've included the pics I promised. Let me know if they need any explanation. I'm curious to see what you do with this! 

[Bender]

Wow those are great pics! Thanks
It's amazing how powerful a computer can fit in such a small package
as far as the PSU I don't think I'm going with the case so I need a stand alone Pico PSU
any suggestions?

ahh I see the same company makes the case and the stand alone picoPSU

also thanks for the HLSL info that makes my decisions easier
I definitely don't need a Graphics card

the i5 3570k is the same price as the i5 2500k but has ivy bridge and the HD4000 graphics, what do you think of that one?

I have a nifty little idea I want to use this for, I'll keep up to date when I've work through a few more issues

[RyoriNoTetsujin]

The 3570k should be just fine, it's the Ivy Bridge step up from the 2500K: More raw processing power, better graphics performance, lower overall TDP, plus being an "unlocked" CPU you can overclock (or underclock, if you want to save power, I suppose.)

I'd be careful of overclocking if you use the NH-L9i heatsink, but I've read it can be done...  looking forward to your project thread! 

[MyNameIsRu]

I must comment on your choice of cooler. Noctua is fantastic... I use the NH-D14 in my gaming rig and it's simply awesome.

Anyway, I'm trying to figure out a build for my own cab project, but I hadn't estimated having to get another i5 for it! I've read elsewhere that the i3-2120 will play Blitz just fine, but I'm eager to hear your opinion on it.

[RyoriNoTetsujin]

I must comment on your choice of cooler. Noctua is fantastic... I use the NH-D14 in my gaming rig and it's simply awesome.

Anyway, I'm trying to figure out a build for my own cab project, but I hadn't estimated having to get another i5 for it! I've read elsewhere that the i3-2120 will play Blitz just fine, but I'm eager to hear your opinion on it.

Here's what I know (take this for what it's worth, I'm no "expert" nor would I claim to be.)  As I remember (i'm also not at my computer at the moment...) NFL Blitz, with HLSL active, runs on my 2500K and generally ranges around 70%-80% CPU use.  Using HWmonitor, it appears that usage is consistent across all 4 cores. Unthrottled, I think Blitz only runs about 125-130% of regular speed on my cpu, so I think it's a pretty tight margin.

I'm thinking a 2-core processor of the same speed (3.3ghz, right?) isn't going to be able to do it, but again, I'm not an expert, nor have I read the articles you have. Maybe it runs with just a little sound stutter here and there. All I know is that the 2500K is enough to be able to do it, and to have a little overhead available while it does.

It's funny... I don't even like Blitz that much. 

[MyNameIsRu]

Here's what I know (take this for what it's worth, I'm no "expert" nor would I claim to be.)  As I remember (i'm also not at my computer at the moment...) NFL Blitz, with HLSL active, runs on my 2500K and generally ranges around 70%-80% CPU use.  Using HWmonitor, it appears that usage is consistent across all 4 cores. Unthrottled, I think Blitz only runs about 125-130% of regular speed on my cpu, so I think it's a pretty tight margin.

I'm thinking a 2-core processor of the same speed (3.3ghz, right?) isn't going to be able to do it, but again, I'm not an expert, nor have I read the articles you have. Maybe it runs with just a little sound stutter here and there. All I know is that the 2500K is enough to be able to do it, and to have a little overhead available while it does.

It's funny... I don't even like Blitz that much. 

I don't care for it that much either! I'm just using it as the standard for a high-demand game. I honestly despise sports games but I know a few buddies whose jaws will drop when they see I have Blitz working on my cabinet.

I figure the extra $100 is well worth it for the extra headroom, and I can turn it into a backup gaming machine if I ever want to throw a video card and another hard drive into it. Thanks a bunch for your feedback, it means a lot!

[BobA]

Great work putting the i5 in an m350 case.  I would not have guessed it could be done.