Arcade Collecting > Pinball

Jokerz! System 11 flipper not working

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zero_koop:
I'm really stumped on this one.  I'm not a pinball repair expert but I am an electrical engineer so I'm fairly familiar with what I'm looking at under the hood.  That said, I cannot figure out what is wrong with my left flipper.

How it broke: The left flipper always had a problem with sticking in the up position.  Not because a solenoid was engaging, it just stuck because of dirt, etc.  So I took the solenoid off to clean it.  This usually fixes the problem until it becomes dirty again.  But this time when I was reconnecting the wires to the solenoid I put them on wrong.  When I realized my mistake I put them on right, but the flipper never worked again.

What I have done so far: In trying to determine if the problem was the solenoid itself or something else I switched the left and right flipper solenoids.  Still, only the left flipper didn't work.  In other words, the solenoid that was originally not working in the left flipper position did work in the right flipper position so I know the problem is not with the solenoid but with the circuit.

My buddy thinks I may have broke a transistor.  He pointed me to a guide that would tell me how to test transistors and the solenoid itself.
http://hansbalk.home.xs4all.nl/rep/sys11/index2.htm#flip0
I don't know if the person who wrote it guide is wrong or I am, but I can't get anything he says to try to work.  First, he says I should read 50-80V on the flipper.  I can't get any voltage reading on any solenoid.  All of my solenoids (except the left flipper) work during gameplay.  For some reason I can't  get a voltage reading off any of them.  I checked my DMM and it works.  It can accurately read 1.5V off of a AA battery for example.

Then the guide says I can attach an alligator clip to the metal side rail and touch the ground prong of a solenoid to fire it.
http://hansbalk.home.xs4all.nl/rep/sys11/index2.htm#trans
I can't get this to work either.  I am trying this on both the working solenoids and the broken left flipper solenoid.  Neither work!

I have no idea what I am doing wrong, does anyone have a clue?  Thanks.  :)

ed12:
there should be a tip36c transistor on your driver pcb
also there will be a fuse for each flipper
first what is needed is this set of answer's
dose your unit have a >eos< switch?
that is end of stroke
if not then it is a flippertronic style
now here is what u did
when u reversed the wire's
on the coil
u shot 48vdc up through the transistor
thus shorting it to ground
now if it is a flippertronic the driver will be a mosfet
next replace the plastic bushing :p-j: was talking about
to stop the sticking,u c when they stick they haul current
and more often then not after a few stick's the coil sleve give's up the ghost
because of heat...so well u are in there do yourself a fav
order 2 rebuild kit's and do them both
fix driver board and poff problem ios gone and u are happey pinball trucking
and do not forget the fuse

ed

smartbomb2084:
Why did you need to remove the coil wires to clean the mechanical flipper parts?  That seems unnecessary at best.

Did you discover your wiring mismatch before or after you powered up the flipper?

Check for +50V or more at F6 on the Auixiliary Power Driver board.

There are NO transisitors for turn on in this flipper design just a relay on the CPU board to enable flipper ground and an OPTO Isolator on the Backbox Interconnect board for each flipper for Lane Change function.

zero_koop:
Thanks, I'll go through all your suggestions carefully.  Unfortunatly it'll have to be this weekend at the earliest (work is killing me this week  :banghead:).  But just to answer your questions: I did power up the flippers before discovering that I wired it wrong, so it's definitely possible I shorted something there.  Yes, there is an EOS switch.  I think the mushrooming of the coil stop may be what was causing most of my sticking.  It's not sever mushrooming, but I think it could be the culprit.  But first I need to get it working again.  I'll report back when I get a chance and let you know how it goes.  Thanks.

zero_koop:
Ok, I'm getting back to work on this.  When I left off in January I ended up deciding to build my arcade cabinet instead of fixing this problem  ;D.  Check my signature for photos!  Now I need to fix this gosh-darn pinball machine so I can invite people over of a pinball and arcade night  :cheers:.

First, if anyone new to this topic has a suggestion please let me know.  All help is appreciated.

@pinballjim: Thanks, I will check the playfield bushing and sand the coil stop to attempt to fix the sticking problem.  But first I need to get the circuit working.

@ed12: When you talk specifics like a tip36c transistor are you talking specifically about Jokerz or a Sys 11?  I only ask because you suggested that yet you didn't know if my Jokerz has an EOS or not.  This lead me to believe that you might not be familiar with Sys 11 and I don't want to confuse myself by looking for a transistor that may or may not exist on my machine.  Any advice on how I fix the driver board as you suggested?

@smartbomb2084: as I mentioned previously, I did power on the machine before I discovered the wiring mismatch.  If you don't mind (since I've had so much trouble with simple things like this in the past), tell me exactly how I check for 50V at F6.  Where do I get the 50V side and where do you suggest I touch for ground?  If I don't get 50V, what is the problem?

Thanks everyone.

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