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Some overpriced tables, good for copying
mvsfan:
a sheet of high grade plywood here is $21 bucks.
in Fort lauderdale its double that and during hurricane season its triple or four times if they make an annoucement that most stores are sold out, if you can find any.
hurricane season all the vultures start coming out.
they will buy lowes and home depot completely out of plywood then you see them on the side of the road selling it for $100 a board.
same thing with gas there.
main reason the gas stations run out is twofold.
everyone fills up naturally,
and some folks fill a whole trailer full of 55 gallon drums of gas hoping it runs out.
RayB:
What brand LCD monitor is in these things? I can understand the cost of low-run items, but still...
WITHOUT a PC it still costs $4,980.25 usd.
Seriously.
protokatie:
I am going to have to agree with RayB on this one. If it was a oneshot custom made thing for one and only one order, then 6 grand sounds about right for the complete system, but 4+ grand for the table and CP (even if that included the screen) is a bit steep. I have no problem with ST, it is fully in his rights to make these and sell them at this price point, but it still seems like a very steep price point for what it is. One of my friends is a master woodworker and charges an arm an a leg to do custom work; I will ask him how much it would cost for him to make a similar table using high quality wood. For all I know, he will say something like 5000 bucks... If that is the case, then so be it.
Turnarcades:
I can understand how those overseas look at the price once 'exchange rated' and see it this way - four figures is a lot on most people's budget. Remember though that we all have the advantage of being part of this scene and have built cabinets ourselves from scratch, so this also swings our opinion somewhat - to the lay man this hobby and the value of the technology in an arcade machine is viewed very differently.
Again, being on the Brit side of things I've gotta defend this. So let's break it down...
A 'retro-fit' table is £2499
£375 is lost in VAT
Assuming a brand new 19" regular aspect monitor £100 (regular aspect is now hard to come by new and I know from speaking to ST before that they have to have a certain brand with a large vertical viewing angle)
Assuming a control panel parts cost of around £180 (Yes parts are pricey here and I'm assuming a neat, crimped, EU-approved wiring job)
Misc cables for power, monitor etc. of £30
Tempered tinted glass at around £50
Speakers, connectivity ports and wiring - £80
CNC-cut metal control panel - £50
CNC-cut, sanded, lacquered wood - £100
Misc custom bolts, screws, hinges, catches, drawer and panel mechanism, feet - £50
Labour £7 @ 30 hours - £210
Workshop running costs for 20 hours (including premises rates) - £30
Packaging - £10
Software, licencing - £50
Advertising - £5
Misc business running costs - £20 (touch-ups, tool wear, glues+adhesives, solder - yes all have to be factored in!)
This lot alone brings it down to £1100, and I'm probably forgetting a lot of points here which need to be factored in. Couple this with the relatively low output of sales compared to a 'expendable goods' industry like the clothing industry, and a sub- £1000 figure doesn't go too far. Money has to go back into research, buying new parts for trial and development, designers, web hosting.... Who knows what other aspects go into ST's business plan?
The only reason we can bring our cabinets at the price we do is because we are a relatively small-scale operation and still hand-build our machines, and we are aiming at a different demographic. I'd say a reasonable profit margin in this business is 20-25% but even that can be tough to work to and not as much as it sounds when you consider the low production rates. We average 2-3 full machines a month, plus a few kits, so it's not aways as profitable as the retail price sounds. The exchange rate cost to the dollar is irrelevant as it's the cost of production in this country that has to determine the price.
I'm sure ST will echo these points.
surface tension:
I feel like I have to defend my product pricing now :(
I'm not going to break it all down, but I'll touch on a few aspects...
--- Quote from: RayB on September 14, 2009, 07:25:59 pm ---What brand LCD monitor is in these things? I can understand the cost of low-run items, but still...
WITHOUT a PC it still costs $4,980.25 usd.
Seriously.
--- End quote ---
The cost of a unit WITHOUT a PC is actually $4125.
I use Samsung LCDs. Wide viewing angle (PVA). These are nearly £300 (which equates to nearly $500) plus the VAT.
--- Quote from: protokatie on September 14, 2009, 07:41:08 pm ---I am going to have to agree with RayB on this one. If it was a oneshot custom made thing for one and only one order, then 6 grand sounds about right for the complete system, but 4+ grand for the table and CP (even if that included the screen) is a bit steep. I have no problem with ST, it is fully in his rights to make these and sell them at this price point, but it still seems like a very steep price point for what it is. One of my friends is a master woodworker and charges an arm an a leg to do custom work; I will ask him how much it would cost for him to make a similar table using high quality wood. For all I know, he will say something like 5000 bucks... If that is the case, then so be it.
--- End quote ---
As I have mentioned, I'm not high volume, so I build to order in small quantities. The drawer mechanics took a a fair amount of time and money to perfect.
The screen IS included as putting in your own PC is one thing, but fitting the screen would be much more involved.
---------------
Craig's pricing isn't a million miles out.
The screen I have mentioned. The sound-system is more than double. I don't CNC my own table components, they are built by a cabinet maker which far exceeds £100.
Anyway, that's just an idea of what goes into it. Any more isn't really for the public domain.
If you have the skills, sure you can build one of these for yourself much cheaper... but that's the same with most things.
I've always been happy to offer advise to people on the board and will continue to do so.
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