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Two Mame32 questions......

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modessitt:
I don't understand why the ROMs would change.  Aren't they simply a program that is run by the emulator?

This would be like playing solitaire on XP and then upgrading to Vista and finding out you need to D/L a new version to play solitaire again.  Since this isn't the case, I find it interesting that MAME32 can't be updated without screwing everything up.  If 10-Yard Fight works with version .077, I can't imagine the game code itself has changed to not make it work with the new version.  Or is it MAME devs trying to change access coding to improve performance, thus breaking the ROM files up into different size chunks than were previously used???

Maybe I should read this FAQ on Wiki.  I originally got the update because I thought it would be necessary  in order to add new games that aren't listed on my version.  Or is it possible to use ClrMamePro to add a newer game to an older version?

ahofle:
The game code itself doesn't change of course, it's the ROM dumps that change.  Apparently dumping ROMs is not as easy a task as one would think.  There are frequently 'bad dumps' or ROMs that were erroneously skipped during the original dump only to be discovered later (and the other reasons listed in the wiki).  So really the dumps become more 'accurate' over time until they theoretically represent the original PCB.

Tiger-Heli:

--- Quote from: modessitt on April 23, 2007, 01:57:41 pm ---I don't understand why the ROMs would change.  Aren't they simply a program that is run by the emulator?
--- End quote ---

Typically it is the names that are changed.  For example - (not necessarily a real example).

Tigerh is the main game for Tiger-Heli in MAME.  MameDev learns that the version that they previously used is a bootleg, and the real game has a couple more chips in it.  What happens is:

Tigerh gets renamed as tigerhbl, and the new rom becomes tigerh.

This ensures that tigherh is the most current version of the game, and makes it easy to tell the games from the rom names.  It also means that neither previous version works in the new MAME.  (Technically - tigerhbl might work in the new version, b/c MAME usually searches all the roms and would find the right ones in the tigerh set - I think).

What MAMEdev could do instead is:

tigerh rom stays the same, but mames description changes to "Tiger-Heli Bootleg".  New rom becomes tigerhof (official) and description becomes "Tiger-Heli (official)".

Advantage - tigerh works in all versions, but it will confuse people since the new game description is way different than the old one.


--- Quote ---This would be like playing solitaire on XP and then upgrading to Vista and finding out you need to D/L a new version to play solitaire again.  Since this isn't the case, I find it interesting that MAME32 can't be updated without screwing everything up. 
--- End quote ---


Apples and oranges.


--- Quote ---If 10-Yard Fight works with version .077, I can't imagine the game code itself has changed to not make it work with the new version.
--- End quote ---

Different roms are what keeps it from working, not the game code changes.


--- Quote --- Or is it MAME devs trying to change access coding to improve performance, thus breaking the ROM files up into different size chunks than were previously used???
--- End quote ---

No.


--- Quote ---Maybe I should read this FAQ on Wiki. 
--- End quote ---

Yep.


--- Quote ---I originally got the update because I thought it would be necessary  in order to add new games that aren't listed on my version.  Or is it possible to use ClrMamePro to add a newer game to an older version?
--- End quote ---

Nope, you need the update and the new roms to play the newer games.

Tiger-Heli:

--- Quote from: ahofle on April 23, 2007, 02:18:04 pm ---The game code itself doesn't change of course, it's the ROM dumps that change.  Apparently dumping ROMs is not as easy a task as one would think.  There are frequently 'bad dumps' or ROMs that were erroneously skipped during the original dump only to be discovered later (and the other reasons listed in the wiki).

--- End quote ---

True, but it's more complicated than you make it sound - Your explanation reads like "Oops, we forgot to dump the 5th rom chip out of 27 on the board, let's get another board from www.arcadeboardsrus.com and re-dump it".

Remember, the boards are 30 some years old now - and they don't have the PCB's labelled as CPU, Game Memory, Video Memory, etc.  In fact, sometimes the roms are encased in Epoxy, either to keep them protected or to prevent reverse-engineering them when the games were just going on location.

Here's an example from mameinfo.dat regarding Fire One:


--- Quote ---Here is a (real) story what true emulator freaks can do to help preserving old arcade games, and to document the arcade games' history. The fellow who dumped the roms of Fire One had to drive 5 hours (each way) to get the board from a leaky garage which had been used by cats as a litter box. Half of the eproms had corroded pins and the smell was probably very disgusting (Maybe he should mail the board to IDSA *evil grin* - http://www.idsa.org/. He got the roms dumped, and then the newest addition to MAME team, Olivier Galibert, started furiously working on the game. As a nice side effect, Star Fire also works much better (with trails though). Still no sound in either of these games, and it seems very unlikely that the samples could be extracted from that non-functioning board...
--- End quote ---

ahofle:
Hmmm, not sure how:

--- Quote ---dumping ROMs is not as easy a task as one would think.
--- End quote ---

translates into 'Oh, we forgot a rom, let's get another at www.arcadeboardsrus.com' but OK.  :)

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