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ArcadeVGA with PC monitor (and running DOS)

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Anubis_au:
Hi

I've just been reading the Ultimarc website where it says about the ArcadeVGA, "TRY CLASSIC GAMES IN THEIR NATIVE RESOLUTIONS ON A PC SVGA MONITOR IN WINDOWS!"

I was under the impression the only way you can get native resolutions is by outputting at 15kHz, ideally to an arcade monitor, then second best is to television via SCART RGB, then component , then s-video etc etc.

So, am I understanding the Ultimarc website correctly? Is the ArcadeVGA able to output native arcade resolutions to a 31kHz PC monitor?

And, if it can, is this something it does only in Windows, or can the same be done in DOS?

After looking at various front ends, I'm still loving none as much as my old DOS advmenu/advmame that I used to run in my cab. The ArcadeVGA would seem ideal for a new build if I could connect it to a 15kHz screen (arcade monitor or tv).

But, since everyone likes keeping their options open, if I could run DOS advmenu/advmame, using an ArcadeVGA card, outputting native resolutions, to either a 15kHz monitor OR a 31kHz monitor, then that would be awesome (since I have a spare 19" CRT at home which could be put in a cab).

So, can the ArcadeVGA output native res in DOS to a 31kHz PC monitor? I think I may have gone wrong somewhere, but if it can I'll be buying one!!! (which I may yet do if I locate a cheap enough SCART 51cm TV). Any Aussies know where to score one in Sydney?

Silver:
No, it can not.

It is in no way physically possible to display a 15Khz signal on a 31Khz monitor without modifying the signal (e.g. line-doubling or similar).

The Avga output has been tweaked (I believe) to make 15Khz games "look better" on a PC monitor. This has come up in other threads and believe the results are apparantly quite subjective.

I think ultimarc's products and the Avga are superb bits of kit, but I have to disagree with that piece of advertising.

I am also not that impressed with the picture comparision on that page (http://www.ultimarc.com/avgainf.html). The pics have completely different mame settings (D3d vs Ddraw etc..) which is going to make a difference on any card so is not very useful. What I'd like to see is a side by side of a AVGA at 31Khz vs a standard gfx card at 31Khz with identical mame settings.

AndyWarne:
All the resolutions available on the card are available in DOS and Windows.
The point is, when using a PC monitor, there is no need to use hardware stretch nor D3D for all games which have a suitable resolution. So the picture comparisons are valid. The picture with the ordinary card shows the best way of displaying the game on that card in normal usage (ie without manually creating modelines in AdvMame etc), ie with D3D stretch enabled. I am not sure how this can be misleading since there is no comparison which is more favourable to the standard card unless you create modelines.   
I have tried to be as accurate as possible in the description of the use of a PC monitor and avoid stating that it gives a picture which is the same as an arcade monitor as it does not. What it does do though, which is particularly noticeable on older games is give a sharp, crisp picture owing to no re-sampling.
On the original game there would have been one monitor scan line per pixel. On a normal card in normal usage there are an arbitrary number of scanlines per pixel, 1.3, 1.4 , whatever.
The ability to do this on the card uses an in-built double-scan feature of the ATI chip.
Incidentally Powerstrip cannot use this feature which is why you cannot set up a resolution of, say, 256 X 256 in Powerstrip at 31Khz.
Another benefit is the ArcadeVGA cards locking to 60Hz vertical which reduces or eliminates tearing on horizontal scrollers.
Andy

Anubis_au:
So, the ArcadeVGA does all the necessary tricks to upres, as it were,
the native resolutions of arcade games to output to 31kHz. And it does
it in both DOS and Windows.

Another question, if you happen to know the answer: what do you tell
advmenu/advmame the monitor device is? Do you tell the software you
have a 15kHz output, but connect to the 31kHz port (the DVI port, from
memory)? I guess where I am coming from is, the card can output
'native res' at 31kHz, but how would you program the software to get
this output?

Silver:

--- Quote from: AndyWarne on April 02, 2007, 04:14:57 am ---The point is, when using a PC monitor, there is no need to use hardware stretch nor D3D for all games which have a suitable resolution. So the picture comparisons are valid. The picture with the ordinary card shows the best way of displaying the game on that card in normal usage (ie without manually creating modelines in AdvMame etc), ie with D3D stretch enabled. I am not sure how this can be misleading since there is no comparison which is more favourable to the standard card unless you create modelines.   
I have tried to be as accurate as possible in the description of the use of a PC monitor and avoid stating that it gives a picture which is the same as an arcade monitor as it does not. What it does do though, which is particularly noticeable on older games is give a sharp, crisp picture owing to no re-sampling.
On the original game there would have been one monitor scan line per pixel. On a normal card in normal usage there are an arbitrary number of scanlines per pixel, 1.3, 1.4 , whatever.
The ability to do this on the card uses an in-built double-scan feature of the ATI chip.
Incidentally Powerstrip cannot use this feature which is why you cannot set up a resolution of, say, 256 X 256 in Powerstrip at 31Khz.
Another benefit is the ArcadeVGA cards locking to 60Hz vertical which reduces or eliminates tearing on horizontal scrollers.
Andy

--- End quote ---

Andy, thanks for that, as it makes it clearer to me whats going on with the card.

I think the problem for me is that "best settings for a standard card" is quite subjective.

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