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SpectraLite vs. Ultralux vs. Paradise Arcade Illuminated Buttons

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gamepimp:
Some photos of the actual buttons would be awesome. And so the stock lights that come w/ the buttons can be dimmed with an LED controller?

armi0024:
A few quick comments...
1) For inserts the biggest pain is cutting them out, which is why we charge a bit more for insert buttons, but we do have over 100 different inserts on the website.  However, doing these yourself is not a bad idea and works quite well if you take the time to cut them out carefully.
http://www.paradisearcadeshop.com/en/27-led-buttons?p=2

2) You need to be really careful when comparing LED buttons based on website images.  Ultralux is a product exclusive to Ultimarc and there for under their tight control.  Everyone else is subject to their supply chain.  We order these by the 1000's and our supplier knows that if they do not match our specifications exactly, they will be paying to ship 1000's back.  We shared this in this video here:


3) We also have an RGB solution for these that works quite well.  The biggest benefit is that we sell these pads separately so you can retrofit old builds and update them to RGB pads.
http://www.paradisearcadeshop.com/en/arcade-pinball-leds/92-tropical-mood-light-rgb-5vdc-led.html

4) Every button we tested was a 12V LED had about 20 mA of current at 12V.  Our buttons will light up at 2.5V, and are about 5 mA with decent lighting at 5V.  I can say with confidence that I think this will be almost identical for every seller in the US, I have not done this testing with Ultimarc's buttons.  Also please note that it's not the voltage that determines the brightness of the LED, it's typically correlated to the amperage, which is usually controlled by resistance.  5V 20mA lights just have lower resistors, than 12V 20mA lights.  Any one of these buttons can be converted if you want to swap out the resistors, it's actually quite easy.  Of note, our super brights are 30-40mA.

4) It is true that light follows the inverse square law, however, this is applicable over a specified area.  Since you are trying to light the entire button top, it is critical to match the distance with even distribution over the diffuser.  Markronz shows this difference with the Ultralux and our video posted by blind_dado, shows this with our buttons.  By placing the led closer to the button top you don't really get a more light reaching the top, you just focus the light on one part of the top, as shown by Markronz's pictures.

RandyT:

--- Quote from: armi0024 on July 14, 2011, 05:24:19 am ---We shared this in this video here:

--- End quote ---

It's unfortunate, however, that the video is so full of inaccuracies, which I am assuming is based on an improper understanding of physics and a desire to elevate one's own products.  

The parts you call "brittle" are actually an improved version of the parts you simply prefer over them.  Harder plastic is, by it's very nature, more brittle.  It has the advantage of being less able to be deformed, which can cause sloppy switch positioning.  Had you left the part you squeezed in the camera frame for a little longer, the ability to deform the parts to the point of poor performance would have been obvious to your viewers.  Of course "squeezing" isn't the direction of the force normally applied to a switch holder, rather spreading the parts.  Also, the parts you are condemning are more precise and fit together with the rest of the assembly, and the switch, more easily.

The "gussets" on the softer parts are necessary to add strength to the softer material.  Were they not there, that part would deform even more easily, making it even more susceptible to thermal changes and to simple manual deformation.  The lack of these gussets on the harder plastic holders is absolutely necessary to allow them to flex for switch insertion.  The presence of gussets on the harder plastic holders would simply make switch installation more difficult, but would do nothing to stop a ham-handed attempt of a vendor trying to break them with more force than is ever actually required to install a switch.  Showing something like this, with the implication that the parts are inferior, looks like an attempt to mislead.  It's equally possible to break the other types, given enough intent to do so (I can post a photo of one I just broke, if you'd like).  The fact is, however, both work fine when treated with the respect due them, in normal use, and my customers haven't had the issues you claim exist.  If they did, I would have a very different opinion on the subject.

What you also failed to mention in your video, most likely because it is inconvenient to your goal, is that the opposite orientation of the switch holders on the more flexible parts presents nearly insurmountable challenges when attempting to use those parts with anything but normal microswitches.  The leaf switch adapters (even the ones you offer) do not fit these backward switch holders.  They don't fit our ChromaLite buttons either, as the switch holders are the same parts you seem to like better.  Due to this, we have to physically modify the ChromaLite buttons and our Micro-leaf assemblies for those who order this combination, which we have been doing at no charge.  The adapter-type switches do, however, fit in the SpectraLite switch holders.  The only reason we offer both types is that the chrome version is not available with the better switch holder.


--- Quote ---4) Every button we tested was a 12V LED had about 20 mA of current at 12V.  Our buttons will light up at 2.5V, and are about 5 mA with decent lighting at 5V.  I can say with confidence that I think this will be almost identical for every seller in the US, I have not done this testing with Ultimarc's buttons.  Also please note that it's not the voltage that determines the brightness of the LED, it's typically correlated to the amperage, which is usually controlled by resistance.  5V 20mA lights just have lower resistors, than 12V 20mA lights.  Any one of these buttons can be converted if you want to swap out the resistors, it's actually quite easy.  Of note, our super brights are 30-40mA.

4) It is true that light follows the inverse square law, however, this is applicable over a specified area.  Since you are trying to light the entire button top, it is critical to match the distance with even distribution over the diffuser.  Markronz shows this difference with the Ultralux and our video posted by blind_dado, shows this with our buttons.  By placing the led closer to the button top you don't really get a more light reaching the top, you just focus the light on one part of the top, as shown by Markronz's pictures.

--- End quote ---

You don't seem to understand "inverse square law", as your "applicable over a specified area" is a bit of a redundant statement.  For folks interested in knowing what it means, this is a good explanation.  Light emanates from the emitter in a spherical pattern.  Think of a ball with many pins inserted in-line with the radius of the sphere.  The pins represent rays of light. The closer one is to the sphere (emitter) the more dense (shorter distance between) the pins (rays) are.  Obviously, one cannot insert enough pins to represent the number of actual rays of light, but the result is identical.  Twice the distance, 4 times the loss.  Reflectors will produce a cone (with losses based on the quality of the reflectors, which are typically not the highest of quality) to attempt to guide more of the light to the area of interest.  But as much of that area is physically blocked by the panel in which a button is installed, this can actually work against the goal in this application.  A button with more diffusive or refractive qualities, coupled with a very wide angle emitter, close to the area of interest, will always be the better solution.  It's simple physics, and regardless of reflectors, cone shapes, etc., the inverse square law still applies.

But it's simple to see for yourself.  Use the same stock 12v LED assembly in both types of buttons and power it at 5v.  The difference in performance will be be obvious.  And as Donkbaca stated, it doesn't matter what the button looks like when depressed with your finger.  Unless you have transparent fingertips ;).


--- Quote ---I won't speak specifically to any of the other people supplying these but I can say that I would stick with a supplier that can provide consistent quality and is able to provide the product that is shown on their website.

--- End quote ---

Let me be the one to say that the photo shown in the video was taken from our site.  It was not a nefarious attempt to mislead, rather the fact that the photos of the individual SpectraLites were taken directly after the photos of the ChromaLites, and the switch holder from the ChromaLite was left in the photo layout in error.  An error we have just recently been made aware of.  Simply looking at the main SpectraLite photo in the description, with the switch holders installed, would make it obvious to anyone who wasn't playing a game of "gotcha" that the better (in my educated opinion) switch holder comes with those parts.  Were it not for the fact that we are currently moving to a new, much larger facility (right across from a Post Office ;)) to better serve our customers, and that our photo room has been broken down and boxed, this would have been remedied already.

While I'm typing, I might as well address a point of contention in the other video posted here.  The size of the plunger legs is important, but has no bearing on stability or durability. What is important is the overall design, what the designer is attempting to accomplish, and how well they accomplish it.  One of the complaints about the design with the heavier legs has been a "tougher" plunger feel, and eventual "squeaking" of the buttons due to heavier friction and wear.  The more streamlined plunger leg is obviously an attempt to improve that situation, which it does very well, with no impact upon durability.  Again, the attempt to paint the different design as a "flaw" is suspect at best.

Careful where you get your info, folks.  You might be getting only part of the story.

RandyT

Nephasth:
 :hissy

I can feel the flames of post hell from here...

Donkbaca:
OKay.... so baiscally all you really need to know is that the ultralux buttons are probably nicer, and built to a better standard since Andy controls his own supply chain.  The other buttons that look like it are basically chinese knockoffs.  I have the paradise arcade ones.  They work fine.  I am sure Randy's work just fine.  Buttons are cheap, if you really want to know, spend 20 bucks and order a couple from each vendor and decide for yourself.  Things like inverse square laws don't mean squat to me.  All I want to know, and I am sure most people care to know, is this: I know there is a difference in price, what is the difference in quality that makes up that difference in price, and is it worth the premium for that quality?  I bought the Paradise Arcade buttons because they were the cheapest, are other buttons better?  Maybe yes, maybe no, but I am satisfied with how they look both lit and unlit, and I have gotten compliments on them.

Buttons are cheap, and there are SOOOO many different varieties, concave, convex, japanese style, leaf swith type, lit, unlit, translucent... etc.  Buttons are also fairly simple devices, its 2 or three molded pieces of plastic and a spring.  That's it, no complicated bits to it.  Also I have bought from Randy/Andy/Bryan none of what they sell is garbage, in my opinion and they are all active members on this board so they can't sell garbage or they would get flamed around here.  Figure out what type of button you want, then just try some out.  If you hate them you are out a couple of bucks, not a big deal.  Probably a better idea to find out what you like and what matters to you than to get opinions form others, especially when we are talking about 2 dollar buttons.

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