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The current status of Ram Controls:

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scofthe7seas:
(Warning! Gratuitous use of the phrase “Screwing” ahead! Not for the faint of heart.)
I recognize that I am fairly new here, so my post will mostly be devalued or dismissed because I can’t have an opinion without having been here for years and years. But I had to say something. Having read this thread in its entirety, I disagree with a lot of what’s being said here.
It will be said that I wasn’t here, I didn’t personally experience it blah blah, but I’m pretty sure I get the gist of it. This dude (Dave), from this company name (Ram controls) took a lot of money, and delivered little/no product, right? Lies, stealing, lawsuits and all that?
I don’t need a deep background in arcade building/dealing to be able to understand financial screwery (you like that word?) It’s done in every form of business possible, so the people who were screwed here are not exclusive as far as screwing goes.
So, the situation as I see it, is
Dave/ram controls screwed you all out of money.
Dave/ram controls screwed Dan out of money.
Dan gets Ram controls as restitution for his personal screwing.
At this point, Dan doesn’t owe anybody anything. He didn’t steal from you, he doesn’t owe you anything. He got his piece of the pie back from Dave, and technically all the others who were stolen from are still owed by Dave.
Dan has options here; let’s look at the options and consequences of each.
Dan scuttles the ship, sells it off in auction, doesn’t actually make his restitution back and is still out of money from Dave. (remember, this business is HIS payment for a 25K dept. Selling it like this is NOT going to get him 25k back.) (everyone else who was owed gets nothing.)
Dan changes the name of Ram Controls to Dan Controls. Is this really an option? He was INSTANTLY (and still is, after being confirmed as a different person) accused of still being Dave. If he started selling Ram stock, would ANYBODY really believe he was Dan of Dan Controls, and not just Dave changing his business name? As vehemently as people on here are campaigning against Dan now, it would be 10 times worse if he tried to sneak by with the same stock under a new name. NOBODY would trust this action. Again, everyone else owed gets nothing
Dan sells his stuff independently, not as a shop, on ebay. He would make a decent amount of money this way, probably even his debt amount back. People might suspect the ebay name was in fact Dave, but it would be hard to argue that when his feedback is consistently good as items were continuously being sold and shipped. Again, people who were robbed get nothing.
These were all options people suggested, and they all result in either profit to none, or only profit to Dan. With the amount of grief he is getting, these options don’t even sound so terrible.
But Dan took a higher route, and decided to try and make things right. He’s coming out, open and honest, and I’ve seen no actual negative feedback from his efforts thus far. We technically have no reason to distrust a person who has been proven to be different from the one that robbed you.
He kept the name, and that seems to be a huge point of contention. I get that, you distrust the very concept of Ram Controls, and that’s understandable. But what are his options? The ones above. Keeping the name is assuming the responsibility and problems that come with it. He did this understanding this fact.
People say he should make no money until everything is paid back. This is absurd. If Dave screwed you out of tons of money, and screwed Dan out of tons of money, doesn’t that make him you? If you all want your piece of the pie back, where is Dan’s piece of the pie? Is he really expected to inherit the business only to turn around and even go into complete debt himself to fix the problem Dave created? That doesn’t seem fair, or sensical to me.
The road he is taking is the ONLY choice that could be made to A: Get Dan what he is owed. And B: Get the people who were screwed what they are owed. To me, it looks like he is trying. Maybe he will be proven to be a thief and a liar himself, I’m not going to say this is impossible. And sure, you don’t have to trust him… yet, but he is really doing the only thing he can possibly do to make things right for EVERYBODY (himself included).
This is a very precarious situation, for all parties involved. I’m not saying go all in, but at least give him a fair shake. Ram controls was once a decent company that offered a lot of custom rare products. People still want those products, they just don’t like the brand.
Why hasn’t he stepped up on KLOV? Are you reading the responses here? Let him test the piranhas of the Nile before braving the great whites of the Pacific. (It’s no hotdogs/trampoline but a decent enough metaphor, right?)

GibsonRiddler:
 :applaud:

Ragtag83:
Hmmmm, a logical statement.  :applaud:

stan2323:
 :applaud: :applaud: :applaud: :applaud: :applaud:

Now I got to put my 2 cents in.
 
You can take it for what it is worth because I am owed nothing by RAM Controls, bought nothing from Dan or Dave, but I do want some products DAN sells and I will get them when I feel the time is right. 

So far Dan is doing well.  He is shipping what people buy and making good to others that got shafted.  He may be a crook in sheep’s clothing but we have no proof yet and a crook would not have taken on the task of making good to others that got shafted.  I ask has anyone been shafted by DAN yet?  If so tell us I want to know before I buy something from him.  The way I see it he owes the others that got shafted nothing.  He is trying to help them and save a niche business.  That shows he has the moral courage to take the high road.  The community needs more people like him and this niche business. 

People who are owed nothing need to sit back, wait, and reserve judgment.  People who are against doing business with him until everyone is paid back go ahead and sit on your high horse, buy nothing from him.  Problem solved.
   
Too many people get too upset about what other people do when they are not involved.  Everyone needs to make up their own mind and decide what they feel is the right thing to do, then do it.  Let others do what they feel is the right thing to do.  We live in a country that allows people to make their own decisions.   

Stan     

bheineck:

--- Quote from: scofthe7seas on June 18, 2011, 09:09:10 pm ---(Warning! Gratuitous use of the phrase “Screwing” ahead! Not for the faint of heart.)
--- End quote ---

I think what you said was well laid out. Those who have seen the screwing before and swear it will happen again with Dan, do not believe Dan got screwed out of any money and is just a friend or hired gun of Dave to make the "scam" work this time. They could in the end be right, but I personally don't think that makes any sense. Dan has stopped all stupid business practices that reek of scam, yet those are the ones that allow one enough time to screw a lot of people out of money before running for the hills. Things like prepay for products not yet completed or store credit sales, stuff like that. Then again, I am fairly new to collecting and just got my license to post here and have been on KLOV for a few months so as you said some think I am not even entitled to an opinion. I think people should obviously be careful, but I think it is beneficial to be open minded. The alternative is Dan goes away and those owed are never repaid unless they proceed with legal action that will likely cost them more than they are owed.

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