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Finally Pics of Tron hit the web
Xiaou2:
Very disappointing. This definitely isnt the machine to save Pinball. And isnt the Tron that should have been made.
- The artwork is Dull and Boring. It represents the 2nd movie in many ways though, which isnt a good thing. A Tron based on the Original would be so much better...
- At first I got excited to see what Looked like a classic Steve Ritchie lightning quick "double loop", from the right ramp leading back to the 3rd flipper as a feed-back into more loops. However, then I realized the ramps just fed back to the flippers. Snore.
- All the work to open the center target.. and what do you get? A cheesy center spinning disc. Whoop T doo. The only place this really worked well on was Whirlwind. It makes no sense on this machine, nor POTC. Its not exciting nor fun.
- The Pop bumpers by the ramps/main pathway ... is stupid Imop. Always has been.
- Theres a few interesting thing about the layout.. but overall, I just dont see it being that good.
This cant be a Steve Ritchie game. It has more hallmarks to a Pat Lawlor game.
Very sad indeed.
--- Quote ---If it works it works!
--- End quote ---
It didnt work too good. We had a local woman pay BooKoo bucks for a restored Funhouse. (Im guessing based on theme / look) She had it less than a month, and sold it at a loss, just to get rid of it. Bored her to tears. Her other pins: Williams IJ, Creature from the Black Lagoon, Theatre of Magic, Twilight Zone. She also briefly had a perfect condition Revenge from Mars and also sold that one in a few months time as well. Again, boring snorefest.
RandyT:
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on April 30, 2011, 06:20:47 pm ---Very disappointing. This definitely isnt the machine to save Pinball.
--- End quote ---
I don't think there are any machines which can save pinball at this point. I really enjoy it, but I fear those who do are in the vast minority nowadays.
I think you should be a little more open minded about the design, though. It's so hard to tell how the game will play from a static image like this. It has enough going on to be interesting, and your comment about the spinning disc being out of place doesn't make sense. What classic pinball device would you have used to showcase the "identity disc", which is the focal point of the story? Seems like a good match to me. Also, ramps which feed back to the flippers are a useful element for setting up shots, especially under tight time constraints. Have to see how it plays to judge the design.
Spacejack:
"I guess if any game could transcend that, its Tron because a lot of people just love the theme."
I guess I wasn't being totally fair to Stern there, since with "Iron Man" and "Spider-Man" and nominally "Wheel of Fortune" and "PoTC" he's released some tie-ins that tap into perennial franchises, even if indirectly. Tron also falls into this category.
"I don't think there are any machines which can save pinball at this point."
Not as commercial moneymakers. There is still some potential in the home market, but it's probably in limbo until custom fabrication gets a lot cheaper... maybe there'd be some potential to take the requirement for mass manufacture out of the picture but that's not exactly right around the corner, and there's no telling whether any market could survive that long.
Some things about pinball manufacture have seriously lagged due to there just not being anybody out there but Stern and he's unable to take the financial steps necessary to do innovative tech. For instance (and I'm just skying here so don't deconstruct it too heavily) since one of the principal labor expenses in pinball is the wiring, a large-scale PCB printer might be able to address some of these issues by printing directly onto the undersurface of the playfield board, but that kind of thing is just impossible for a lone wolf company like Stern. It is a damn shame that Williams bailed altogether, since their slots would represent a fertile ground for not only subsidizing some pinball, but also a good bit of emergent tech that would apply to pinball very well. I just saw those translucent reel slots they do now not too long ago, and could not help thinking how well that idea could apply to pins.
Ah, what a world. At least Heckendorn built his custom. Maybe that will serve as inspiration to some... I personally one day hope to build my Zardoz pinball but I think the odds are extremely slim.
Xiaou2:
--- Quote ---I don't think there are any machines which can save pinball at this point. I really enjoy it, but I fear those who do are in the vast minority nowadays.
--- End quote ---
Pinball is gaining a resurgence in popularity. Lots of young guns starting to get into it, from playing with digital tables.
Of course, its more than just on-site sales. Home sales have been keeping Stern alive... and their poor quality has led to less and less sales.
Pinball does have the ability to make money on location... but not in its current iteration. Much more durability and better design have to be in place for that to happen.
--- Quote ---I think you should be a little more open minded about the design, though. It's so hard to tell how the game will play from a static image like this.
--- End quote ---
When you have played enough pins, you get to a point where you can look at a machine and know how shots will flow. Most especially when you have played many tables from the same designer. Theres nothing really revolutionary or exciting about the shots here. Its old hat... and not really the good kind of old hat.
--- Quote --- It has enough going on to be interesting, and your comment about the spinning disc being out of place doesn't make sense. What classic pinball device would you have used to showcase the "identity disc", which is the focal point of the story? Seems like a good match to me.
--- End quote ---
The Disc isnt really the focal point of the Story. Its a part of it, but not the focus. Anyways, the problem isnt so much the disc itself, but that its enclosed. If for example, the disc was in the center of the Playfield, the ball would be shot all over the place, such as on Whirlwind. But even then, its cheese at best.
I could go into a lot of detail about what Could be put in place of it that would far exceed the crappy spin field, but Im not going to bother at this point. Stern doesnt have much experience with building good worthwhile mechanical toys, and doesnt want to pay to have them made. So they simply recycle the same things over and over again on every machine. Its a losing strategy, especially when something like a spinning disc holds no playability or coolness factor in it for the player.
Lets put it this way... whats more fun?
A) Sinking a ball into a tight hole at the correct time
B) Knocking down Drop-Targets
C) Watching a ball roll around in circles while you wait for it to finally pop out
An evil CLU figure that moved back / forth would have been 3000x better than the ball blender.
--- Quote ---Also, ramps which feed back to the flippers are a useful element for setting up shots, especially under tight time constraints. Have to see how it plays to judge the design.
--- End quote ---
If you have ever played BK2K, or a related SR design, you would know that the quick loop feature is a skilled shot event that provides challenge and a lot of fun, to see how many times you can make the loop before you fail to get the timing down. It makes for a fast intense experience, rather than a lullaby of leisurely wait times.
As for ramps to flippers, its obvious why its done, but doesnt mean its always the best ways to do things. As said, I would have been far more excited with a quickloop option.
RandyT:
Still think you are judging it prematurely. I just picked up the new MARS table on PinballFX2, and almost didn't because I thought the layout looked bland. But when I learned the flow of the game, I gained a very different opinion. The last single game I played on it was 2 1/2 hours long, and I was still being challenged to complete the missions offered by the table. I'll reserve judgment until I can watch this one go. Also, this layout looks a lot like the Wolverine table on PFX2, and that one seems pretty solid.
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on April 30, 2011, 09:46:24 pm --- Lets put it this way... whats more fun?
A) Sinking a ball into a tight hole at the correct time
B) Knocking down Drop-Targets
--- End quote ---
Don't you pretty much have to do both of those things before you can even get the ball into the "blender"?
BTW, with a plot as weak as the one in either TRON movie, the identity disk stands out as one of the most notable "devices". It had to be incorporated into the table somehow, and I'm still curious as to how you would have done that.
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