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Reading MAME as technical reference and historical document: 720 controller

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BadMouth:

--- Quote from: Paul Olson on January 12, 2011, 01:33:07 am ---...that funky second encoder wheel shouldn't work without specific code to handle it.

--- End quote ---

That's the way I see it, but it's all just speculation without a special controller to test it (or being able to tell from looking at the code, which is beyond my ability).
For all the ranting about the mame not working with the original controls, there sure doesn't seem to be anyone with the original controls stepping forward to test it.  :timebomb:

Thanks for taking an interest in it Paul.  :cheers:

According to the article I linked to earlier, if the code is there, it should move the skater dude to the 12 o'clock position when it crosses those slots.  This should be easy enough to test with an old rollerball mouse; the guy should reset to the 12 o'clock position whenever the Y axis is moved at all since the orginal encoder wheel only had slots at 12 o'clock.

If this is how it works, a more authentic control scheme for someone with a regular spinner might be to have a button press simulate the calibration wheel passing the 12 o'clock position.  (Just mapping a key to that axis might work without changing anything) That way, if you have an indentation or dot on one side of your spinner, you could move that to 12'oclock, press a button to align it, and your skater punk dude should always face the direction of the indentation on the spinner from then on.  Hell, you could even make a 720 handle for a TurboTwist.  If the game resets the center point every time you crash though, like pole position does, it would be too much of a hassle to realign after every crash.

newmanfamilyvlogs:

--- Quote from: abaraba on January 12, 2011, 10:48:53 am ---Still, no need for "instead", it should be "also".

--- End quote ---

That's a rather ambiguous statement itself. You cannot directly substitute 'also' for 'instead' in that sentence without rewriting the rest of it to accommodate the change. I'm under the impression that English is not your first language, so perhaps the nuance is lost on you, leading to your original confusion.

Xiaou2:
I have not fired up 720 for a long time after the change..  so just did so with MameUIFX32, and noted the changes.

 Currently, you can NOT move the guy in a complete circle with a single optical axis.
Meaning... if you want to aim the guy with a spinner... it will only aim him 1/2 or less of his full travel.

 Why is this?

 Because they changed the games optical inputs to act more like a Trackball instead.  You need x & y to make the guy move in a full circle... which leaves out the calibration disc/switch altogether.

 Because of this, its Impossible to make the game control with a spinner, let alone get the guy to calibrate with a stick mounted spinner.

 Ill have to double check official mame to make sure its the same... but Im guessing it is.

BadMouth:
From that other thread:


--- Quote from: abaraba on January 12, 2011, 06:46:53 pm ---
--- Quote from: Derrick Renaud ---Make a system that is handled by the Core UI; Input; Input Port code that can select between real and fake controls. 

--- End quote ---

Seriously, start MAME and have a look, it's all already there.

There is no need for "real" and "fake", one is simply mapping of input to analog stick and the other is mapping to mouse, just like with all the other games. Piece of code handling input via analog port has nothing to do with keyboard and mouse handling code.



--- Quote ---Then change the Input port code in the drivers to use it.  The UI would allow you to select the real control or a fake control that would call a driver function to modify the data.

--- End quote ---

It's all already there, except it's called "mouse" and "analog", not "real" and "fake".


--- End quote ---

What control setup did you us to test this?

Just tried this w/v.140 and it doesn't work. 
(I took the ball out of an old mouse and spun the encoder wheels independently by hand)
The guy will not rotate when you only map the x axis, he will only flip back and forth between facing left and right.
If you map both, he will kinda rotate, but only from about 4 t0 8 o'clock.

If you move the mouse in a circular motion, you can control the guy, but you're just substituting mouse x/y input for analogue joystick x/y input at that point.
That has nothing to do with the way the original controller functioned.

I downloaded the mame v.110 build that was recompiled to work with the original controller, but I haven't tried it yet.
I'm not sure if/when I'll bother with it.

abaraba:

--- Quote from: BadMouth ---What control setup did you us to test this?

Just tried this w/v.140 and it doesn't work.  
(I took the ball out of an old mouse and spun the encoder wheels independently by hand)

--- End quote ---

My ROM does not work with latest mame so I only could try it with up to mame 131.

Please you try 131 so we can find some common grounds and start from there.



--- Quote from: BadMouth ---The guy will not rotate when you only map the x axis, he will only flip back and forth between facing left and right.
If you map both, he will kinda rotate, but only from about 4 t0 8 o'clock.

If you move the mouse in a circular motion, you can control the guy, but you're just substituting mouse x/y input for analogue joystick x/y input at that point.

That has nothing to do with the way the original controller functioned.

--- End quote ---

I think you found it. It's just that it is not the same problem Xiaou started complaining 8 years ago, this is something new. What you describe clearly tells us what they did there, they made analog hack and then implemented mouse on top of it, instead of separately.

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