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the state of mame

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Xiaou2:

--- Quote ---1) To properly implement something, yes, developers need the controls
--- End quote ---

 No, they dont.   720 was working without the controller, and it was enabled.
As were many other games that Devs dont have controllers for.

 There ARE cases where there is needed hardware... such as when there are special add-on PCBs, Force feedback motors, or readings that need to be measured.   

 However, in 720's case, its a simple dual Optics set.  Theres no need whatsoever to have the real hardware.  If you have bothered to even look at the device, you would know that.

 It has a tron-esc encoder wheel to read position (72 spoke? spinner), and a 2ndary encoder disc that has a single slot cut out of it, which is a Calibration disc... that keeps the players controls from getting too far out of sync w/ the onscreen position.  It acts as a simple On/Off switch.
 
 As for things like Shifters.  Thats also not needed.  They are simple On/ Off switches, and again, are HACKED to work completely Opposite to the way Arcade machines work.  A operational switch would easily allow dual modes for correct and hacked methods... and its the RIGHT thing to do.



--- Quote ---2) Aaron would like to keep switches down to a minimum, he's stated this in the past.
--- End quote ---

 That is a BS  E X C U S E  for not getting things to work Properly and ACCURATELY!!!!!  Instead of a GIANT HACK JOB like 720 current is.


--- Quote ---3) Again, if you have a special use case, there is nothing preventing you from either changing it yourself, or paying for somebody to change it yourself.  Just don't expect Mamedev to do it for you.  It's a special case, nothing more, nothing less.
--- End quote ---

 Its NOT a Special Case.  Its called ACCURATELY REPRESENTING HARDWARE!

 Mame is SUPPOSED to be about 100% Arcade Accuracy.   AND, every time someone proposes a HACK, Mame Devs will CRY about Accuracy.  Yet what do they do with 720???  HACK THE HELL OUT OF IT.   It NEVER controlled with an analog joystick!  Its completely bastardized.

 Yet, I ask mame to allow for an alternate input method for superhangon's brake, and I get the standard "we dont change the nature of Arcade hardware/ Inputs"

 Its a giant LOAD of Stinking BS.

Introducing unmaintainable, untested code into the project is suicide.

 Adding a frickin Switch to make an Arcade machine emulated 100% accurately isnt Unmaintainable.  Thats more BS for you kids.

 There are far many other Crappy switches and options that are meaningless and worthless... and have continued to be kept in.

 
 The main thing here is that 720 should not have been hacked in the 1st place.
If anything, there should be a "CHEAT" to allow the game to be HACKED with an
analog stick.  The real game does NOT exhibit that nature at all.  And because of that, mame is a bunch of Elitist Hypocrites.

 Who again, dont give two Craps about the USERS, the very people who Support preservation efforts through donations... PCBS, Artwork, and more.

 Quite a slap in the face from these KIDS who wernt even around to play many of these games... and clearly dont understand their value.   To ppl like Haze, 720 is as valuable as a Jap Porn Mahjong game. (maybe less so, due to his technical "puzzle" interest)

 I find it Tragically funny how one who Preaches about Preservation and Accuracy has no gripes whatsoever about Butchering a classic game.

Xiaou2:

--- Quote ---Nothing, actually.  I wasn't actually aware this had occurred, as I'm still pretty new here.
--- End quote ---

 Before you dive your Hatred on someone, get a clear understanding of the situation. Else you look like a fool.


--- Quote ---Quote from: Xiaou2 on December 29, 2010, 03:27:17 PM
Now, what have YOU done for Preservation sake?

Hmm.  Again, nothing.

--- End quote ---

 Well, maybe its time to Start doing more than flapping your lips?  There are many things that need preservation efforts, and many ways you can help keep history from being trashed.

 One immediately Easy thing you can do, is Rally for games to not be Hacked, like in the case of 720.  Real hardware should be easily interfaced to be able to be used and experienced by anyone who has a real controller, builds their own controller...etc...  Without ANY additional programming or jumping thru a hoops.
 


--- Quote ---But, here's where we differ:   I respect those who have contributed to MAME development, and I don't post like a pompous, elitist, self-serving ass who thinks he's entitled to have his opinions on the direction of the development actually heard and followed.  You post like your donations or ideas mean you deserve something in return.
--- End quote ---

 Your poor attitude speaks Volumes about the backing behind it.

 You see, Im a Preservationist, and Classic fan.  I grew up with these games, and played most all the major classics IN-PERSON, on REAL MACHINES.

 I have a RIGHT to be disgruntled about Mames PATHETIC and Hypocritical
excuses, and low standards of Preservation.  Im not the only one.  Im just one who dares (Gasp) open his mouth about it.

  PPL like Haze are trying to touch up a Famous sculptors creation with bubble gum... or fix a famous oil painting with finger paints...  and call it "Good Enough".
I have the Right to be ticked off about that... and so do others.  Others like the very CREATORS of these works, who specifically balanced the entire gameplay around these specially designed controllers.

 The more people that just Kiss the Devs Butts, and dont say a word,.. the more likely valuable things will be Lost forever.

 Ive given plenty of Props and Respect to Devs, and what I got in return, was more Disrespect than anything else.  So, this bad attitude I supposedly have, isnt merely something I presented Immediately.  You have no idea the warm fuzzies I sent to various devs... and the cold and even abusive responses Ive gotten in return.

 So yeah, my respect level with them now, is Definitely pretty poor.  Especially with ppl like Haze, who does not even really value the content.

CheffoJeffo:

--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on December 31, 2010, 01:07:04 pm ---I have a RIGHT to be disgruntled about Mames PATHETIC and Hypocritical excuses, and low standards of Preservation.  Im not the only one.  Im just one who dares (Gasp) open his mouth about it.

--- End quote ---

Actually, you DON'T, anymore than I or anybody else does.

I totally appreciate that you have contributed and really care about the preservation of one of the more important elements of classic games (which is almost always overlooked by those who haven't worked with original hardware) -- the controls.

Sure, for 99.9% of the folks out there, specialty controls for individual games don't matter, but I see value in preserving that aspect. It is one of the reasons that I try not to jump on the bandwagon regarding RAM Controls and their delivery problems.

OTOH, I have no reasonable expectation for anybody else to undertake such burden. A further complication is the various means of interfacing such controls.

I applaud the desire to support original specialty controllers, but you have no more right to expect the MAMEDevs to do what you want than folks who donate to BYOAC have to expect saint to give them access to PostHell (which is really something to see -- your contrributions are exemplary!).

 ;)

Malenko:

--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on December 31, 2010, 01:07:04 pm --- I have a RIGHT to be disgruntled about Mames PATHETIC and Hypocritical
excuses, and low standards of Preservation.  Im not the only one.  Im just one who dares (Gasp) open his mouth about it.

--- End quote ---
You might have the right, but that doesnt make you right.



--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on December 31, 2010, 01:07:04 pm ---PPL like Haze are trying to touch up a Famous sculptors creation with bubble gum... or fix a famous oil painting with finger paints...  and call it "Good Enough". I have the Right to be ticked off about that... and so do others.  Others like the very CREATORS of these works, who specifically balanced the entire gameplay around these specially designed controllers.
--- End quote ---

MAME is open source, code it yourself. Oh, thats right.......
You proclaim Haze is just making it good enough, what exactly are you doing again? I mean other then complaining about MAME and specialty controls.  Why dont you give a buncha money to RAM Controls and make custom controls for specialty games, like bike handles for paperboy and what not. How about making giant frankenpanels and selling them in the BST section.

If you dont like the way MAME handles 720, then play 720 on something else or fix it yourself.

ark_ader:
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