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Main => Main Forum => Topic started by: RetroACTIVE on April 20, 2012, 09:24:00 pm

Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on April 20, 2012, 09:24:00 pm
Here is a little project that shows how you can install the AimTrak light gun module into a Namco Time Crisis II type recoil gun.
 
The Issues at a Glance - Fitting and Conversion:
1. Determine the best fit for the AimTrak itself given the already specific design of the Namco gun plastics and AimTrak.
2. Adapt the solenoid to connect to the AimTrak system seamlessly, no splices, cuts or hacks.
3. Find an alternative conduit for the Namco gun cable hose as it is pretty specific to the Namco cabinet and doesn’t really fit well with a non dedicated shooter cabinet.
 
The Namco Recoil Gun - What you will need
Depending upon your budget or preference, you may just be able to get a non-working gun in decent enough shape from eBay.  You will need
both left, right halves and left and right slides (basically a complete unbroken plastics), along with the trigger, trigger spring, trigger switch
and working solenoid assembly. You will also need the metal bracket that holds the wire hose and gun halves together that is mounted in the gun handle.
The cost of this adds up quick... especially with the Namco parts from Happ.
 
You can make this as easy or as complicated as you like.  I chose complicated because I'm a tinkerer and bit of a neat nick when it comes to wiring and such.
Therefore, I made it a priority to not cut or damage the Namco hardware in anyway. The thought of cutting/grinding and hacking
up a piece of plastic that I spent more on than the actual AimTrak itself was not too appealing to me.  So my rule, no alteration
to the hardware of the gun and no glue, goop, tape or anything crafty... I wanted this to fit as much as if it was meant to be in there in the first place.


The completed gun:
(http://home.comcast.net/~retro-active1/pwpimages/AimTrakNamcoGunConversion.JPG)

The camera fitted into the nose of the gun (I built a special little piece out of ABS for this):
(http://home.comcast.net/~retro-active1/pwpimages/AimTrakNamcoGunNose.JPG)

AimTrak, wrapped in heat shrink tubing with added 2.0mm connector for USB:
(http://home.comcast.net/~retro-active1/pwpimages/AimTrakPCBWrapped.JPG)

TIP102 driver mounted to the solenoid assembly.  You will also need to upgrade your AimTrak firmware (v8.12) so it will drive the solenoid transistor on trigger press.
(http://home.comcast.net/~retro-active1/pwpimages/AimTrakNamcoSolenoidDriver.JPG)

AimTrak, camera removed and extended to fit in the Namco gun:
(http://home.comcast.net/~retro-active1/pwpimages/AimTrakConverted.JPG)

Close up of the camera mount:
(http://home.comcast.net/~retro-active1/pwpimages/AimTrakCamera.JPG)

Wiring harness, built to fit to the existing Namco trigger and solenoid as well as the AimTrak
(http://home.comcast.net/~retro-active1/pwpimages/AimTrakNamcoHarness.JPG)

Here is the hose, cable and gun mount.  Utilizing the 5pos 2.0mm connector to allow for fit in the gun.
(http://home.comcast.net/~retro-active1/pwpimages/AimTrakNamcoHose.JPG)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: BadMouth on April 21, 2012, 10:04:16 am
Thanks for posting this.   :cheers:
I'd tried this method with a 33N10 mosfet, but the 24v overwhelmed it so that the solenoid just stayed on after the first press.  Moved up to a TIP120 and the pulse from the aimtrak was either too weak or too short to get it to trigger.  I'll go pick up some TIP102s and try again.  :lol

Could you give us some more info on the hose and connectors you used?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on April 21, 2012, 10:22:25 am
Thanks for posting this.   :cheers:
I'd tried this method with a 33N10 mosfet, but the 24v overwhelmed it so that the solenoid just stayed on after the first press.  Moved up to a TIP120 and the pulse from the aimtrak was either too weak or too short to get it to trigger.  I'll go pick up some TIP102s and try again.  :lol

Could you give us some more info on the hose and connectors you used?

No prob...  Check the parts list I've attached... It has the info you are looking for. :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Mark Thomas on April 21, 2012, 12:17:06 pm
Can we see the gun in action?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on April 21, 2012, 12:43:43 pm
Can we see the gun in action?

Sure give me a bit I'll post a video.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Mark Thomas on April 21, 2012, 04:50:36 pm
Thanks buddy, Very interested to see how it works with games like Terminator 2 and Operation wolf as well as Point Blank.  :cheers:
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on April 21, 2012, 07:39:21 pm
Thanks buddy, Very interested to see how it works with games like Terminator 2 and Operation wolf as well as Point Blank.  :cheers:

Sure I'll show those... I've an idea for the secondary button that is needed for op wolf and t2, however I've not implemented it yet.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on April 22, 2012, 08:55:17 pm
I put my new plastics on for this video  ;)

AimTrak-Namco Gun (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4H7HP1MeWo#ws)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on April 23, 2012, 08:05:15 pm
I've been playing the living daylights out of this... I am noticing an issue with the first few recoils after the gun sits idle... they are weak.  After a few trigger actuations it recoils fine.

I have a tweak to the circuit I will be testing in the next few days.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Mark Thomas on April 27, 2012, 06:56:27 am
Great stuff, really enjoyed the footage.

Couple of questions if you dont mind?

1. What was your idea for extra button required on Operation wolf/ T2. I could only imagine a remapping to a button on control panel unless you were thinking of altering gun some more.

2. Have you also tried the gun with any other games/ emulators or pc gun games? Like HOTD or virtua Cop

3. How has the project lived up to your expectations of getting that exact arcade feel from a custom gun mod?


Thanks
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on April 27, 2012, 09:09:38 am
Great stuff, really enjoyed the footage.

Couple of questions if you dont mind?

1. What was your idea for extra button required on Operation wolf/ T2. I could only imagine a remapping to a button on control panel unless you were thinking of altering gun some more.

I have a very small SMT button that fits perfectly into the recess of the gun mounting hardware.  I will probably drill a 1/32-1/16 hole for the wires on the inside of the plastic (which will not be visible or corrupt the plastic) and mount the button in the hole with some non-permanent adhesive.

2. Have you also tried the gun with any other games/ emulators or pc gun games? Like HOTD or virtua Cop

Nope... not yet.

3. How has the project lived up to your expectations of getting that exact arcade feel from a custom gun mod?

Thanks
This gun behaves exactly as if it were installed in an Namco cab and recoil action is no different than the arcade experience.  So yes, definitely.


As far as the AimTrak itself...I've read most of the AimTrak threads and it seems that folks have mixed results with the gun...calibration issues and whatnot.
I can honestly say I haven't experienced any of these issues (yet).  When I calibrate this gun I can use the sights to aim and it is accurate.  Now you cant go and shoot from any relative position (up close vs. far away)... this gun calibrates to the angle and distance the gun is from the screen.  That being said, you can somewhat control consistency with the appropriate hose length from the gun to the cabinet.  For a universal gun, i don't think you can get any better than this, I mean I can play Operation Wolf, Terminator 2, Crossbow, Point Blank... These games represent very different implementations of shooter games and all work very well with this product.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: AlanS17 on April 27, 2012, 04:52:29 pm
IMO, Namco makes the very best arcade guns. This project is full of win! Darnnit... Now I wanna go play some Time Crisis...
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Mark Thomas on April 28, 2012, 01:38:27 pm
Really pleased to hear that it all came out well mate, great idea with the added button on the gun unit you really have some great skills :notworthy: any pics of mod?

Did you sort out the issue with the power loss when the gun was left idle and then used again?

And would you consider doing a step by step guide? Or even selling full completed units? I would certainly be interested in getting 2 of these bad boys for my cab.  :cheers:

And finally where did you get your hose from?

Sorry for all the questions






Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on April 29, 2012, 11:16:58 am
I'm in the process of designing a PCB with all the connectors and drive circuitry installed.  So its a possibility to offer a DIY kit.  However, I'm not sure about the camera mount... its pretty specific and hand made... mass producing this would be impossible for me.

My plan is to put together a step-by-step... I just need to work out a few kinks.

Yes I've fixed the recoil problem.  I will update the schematic when I have some time.

I've not finished the aux button mod yet... I'm going to get to that next.

I got the hose off of eBay.

Keep the questions coming :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: lodoss118 on May 03, 2012, 05:59:41 am
I already have 2 namco guns blue and pink, would be cool if you could create the pcb, one thing the guns do lack are extra buttons.
I made a video of using the usb2gun board which didn't work well as it it detects the guns as joysticks.


Would you create some kit specifically for these types of guns i.e namco guns

Where abouts are you located retro?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Mark Thomas on May 03, 2012, 11:42:49 am
I'm in the process of designing a PCB with all the connectors and drive circuitry installed.  So its a possibility to offer a DIY kit.  However, I'm not sure about the camera mount... its pretty specific and hand made... mass producing this would be impossible for me.

My plan is to put together a step-by-step... I just need to work out a few kinks.

Yes I've fixed the recoil problem.  I will update the schematic when I have some time.

I've not finished the aux button mod yet... I'm going to get to that next.

I got the hose off of eBay.

Keep the questions coming :)

Sounds good I must admit I don't understand how it all works or what you have done but I know that it looks amazing. Can you tell me what you mean by camera mount and pcb? Is this the aim track stuff?

And is the hose literally just a tube to contain the USB lead or is it a bit more complex than this?

Sorry for all the questions I'm just trying to get a better understanding of it all :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: drventure on May 03, 2012, 12:32:41 pm
That hose gives me a great idea. I saw a steampunk maker strip the black cover off some climbing rope and use it to wrap the eletrical cord for a build he did.

That'd look great on some USB guns, be tough but very flexible.

Very interesting in this recoil setup BTW!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 03, 2012, 04:32:27 pm
Here is what I'm thinking... not sure if anyone would be interested

I am getting a PCB made to fit in the gun, the PCB will have the drive circuitry and connector.

I could offer the PCB stuffed with driver circuit, connector and companion plug housing w/pigtails as a kit.  This would contain the proper termination for the AimTrak connector, Namco coil as well as the 5' pigtails needed to connect to the external +24V power supply.

You would still have to deal with terminating the USB cable and separating the camera from the AimTrak (this is not for the person with basic soldering skills... you need good equipment and semi-decent skills to do this).

Not sure if its worth it... just throwing it out there.  I figured if I'm getting PCBs made, I might as well see if anyone else is interested.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: lodoss118 on May 05, 2012, 08:21:42 am
 I am interesting but not sure i could do the termination link with the aimtrak, not really that technical.

What i was wondering if you could maybe for people like me who have these already full namco gun sets, could create via
individual order to have the aimtrak and pcb kits and make it as much as possible plug & play lol. Obviously this will include ordering the
aimtrak (do the customization) and your pcb etc..

how much would charge for this personal service lol
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 05, 2012, 09:48:31 am
I am interesting but not sure i could do the termination link with the aimtrak, not really that technical.

What i was wondering if you could maybe for people like me who have these already full namco gun sets, could create via
individual order to have the aimtrak and pcb kits and make it as much as possible plug & play lol. Obviously this will include ordering the
aimtrak (do the customization) and your pcb etc..

how much would charge for this personal service lol

That may be possible... however I don't really want to be in the business of stocking  AimTrak modules... maybe do an exchange or something like that?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: lodoss118 on May 05, 2012, 03:40:33 pm
what I was thinking was paying you upfront for the aimtrak and pcb kit plus any other stuff to make it as easy as possible to do the swap.

I live in the uk so also will need to include delivery charges to the uk :()

Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 05, 2012, 04:55:22 pm
what I was thinking was paying you upfront for the aimtrak and pcb kit plus any other stuff to make it as easy as possible to do the swap.

I live in the uk so also will need to include delivery charges to the uk :()

Ive another gent that has asked the same thing... If I can work out a less labor intensive camera mount I could certainly do the gun as a kit.

However, the other roadblock for a complete DIY kit is the gun conduit/hose.   The USB cable needs to be terminated after its threaded into the hose.  I have some of the conduit I used left, but when its gone ...I won't likely be purchasing anymore.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: mixstyck on May 15, 2012, 10:34:43 pm
any updates on the schematic about the idle "problem"
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 16, 2012, 09:52:52 am
any updates on the schematic about the idle "problem"

Turns out it was a mechanical issue... go figure.

The Namco recoil mechanism has a small piece of rubber that absorbs the impact of the slide when it returns to its forward position.  After one recoil, the rubber would mash up nice and cause the solenoid mechanism to stick a bit... requiring an extra 1 or 2 triggers to get it to free up.  In a rapid fire situation, it would never stick because of the natural rebound effect (keeping it from staying still).  I cleaned the mechanism and all is well!

On a related note, the recoil pulse is 40ms.  Andy (Ultimarc) has done enough testing with this to have a high confidence that its the correct pulse width.  I thought for sure that the  pulse width was not wide enough.  Although, increasing the pulse width would have fixed my issue because it would have caused it to pull longer and free up the mechanism... it would have been the wrong fix.  In reality you really only want the solenoid to be energized for the minimum amount to cause the recoil... any more, you are just heating it up for nothing.  So after all this testing, I am convinced that 40ms is actually perfect.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: mixstyck on May 16, 2012, 10:17:36 am

I bought two namco guns on ebay and i received my aim trak from andy yesterday

Just to make sure : which pin on the aimtrak module is for recoil, I saw a post 1 year ago from andy and he says the p5 but on your diagram is on pin 4.

thanks for you help

Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 16, 2012, 10:20:11 am
Mine is correct.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: mixstyck on May 18, 2012, 10:58:09 am
I tested my namco gun yesterday.
I use your wiring diagram and everything is working!!

Thanks   :cheers:
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 19, 2012, 01:55:17 am
I tested my namco gun yesterday.
I use your wiring diagram and everything is working!!

Thanks   :cheers:

Great!  I'm just about to build a few dozen PCBs with parts and connectors to save a bunch of soldering when building one of these.

I've almost got it to the point where a DIY kit is possible...
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: lodoss118 on May 19, 2012, 06:21:11 pm
cool cant wait :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 20, 2012, 11:27:19 am
cool cant wait :)

Here it is what it is looking like:

- 3' Gun hose with fitting  $25.00 ($2.00 per extra foot)
Includes USB termination at both ends and power lines for the solenoid.
(see follow-up post... pricing changed)

- Trigger/Recoil PCB $25.00.
Driver circuit and connectors with custom trigger harness to the AimTrak.  Makes installation a breeze (no solder).
(see follow-up post... pricing changed)

If you want to install the AimTrak the way I have shown (without modifying the plastics) you may add the following:

- Camera Mount $10.00
This is a hand made item.  Allows the AimTrak camera to fit as close to the end of the barrel and provides an easy no-mod installation into the Namco plastics.
(see follow-up post... pricing changed)

-AimTrak Exchange $10.00
The camera needs to be separated from the main PCB for this.  If you are uncomfortable modifying your AimTrak yourself I will offer an AimTrak exchange and do the mod for you.

I've tweaked the installation and final kit design since I've first posted this.  It's streamlined and fits much neater in the gun.  Full installation instructions would be provided.  None of this includes shipping.

Some have asked for me to do the whole thing.  If you want t do that you will need to send me the Namco gun and an AimTrak, (or upfront deposit for the AimTrak)... I would ask for an additional $20.00 (for my time) to do the job for you.

Of course, absolutely none of this is endorsed my Ultimarc.  This is my mod done my way.   If you are uncomfortable with me performing surgery on the AimTrak, then this isn't the kit for you ;)

I can't make this any cheaper for two reasons... #1.  I don't build crap and #2. My time is ultra limited, and it takes quite some time to terminate and assemble this.  I realize this is a pretty expensive kit and may not make sense to a lot of people.  If there is enough interest I will be able to make this happen.  Right now I'm just floating it out there... and it may just end up being that... a floater ;)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: lodoss118 on May 20, 2012, 05:38:36 pm
sounds good when do you think you will take orders?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 20, 2012, 05:43:57 pm
Some time in June.  I am waiting on USB connectors.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: mytymaus007 on May 20, 2012, 10:52:00 pm
cool cant wait :)

Here it is what it is looking like:

- 3' Gun hose with fitting  $25.00 ($2.00 per extra foot)
Includes USB termination at both ends and power lines for the solenoid.

- Trigger/Recoil PCB $25.00.
Driver circuit and connectors with custom trigger harness to the AimTrak.  Makes installation a breeze (no solder).

If you want to install the AimTrak the way I have shown (without modifying the plastics) you may add the following:

- Camera Mount $10.00
This is a hand made item.  Allows the AimTrak camera to fit as close to the end of the barrel and provides an easy no-mod installation into the Namco plastics.

-AimTrak Exchange $10.00
The camera needs to be separated from the main PCB for this.  If you are uncomfortable modifying your AimTrak yourself I will offer an AimTrak exchange and do the mod for you.

I've tweaked the installation and final kit design since I've first posted this.  It's streamlined and fits much neater in the gun.  Full installation instructions would be provided.  None of this includes shipping.

Some have asked for me to do the whole thing.  If you want t do that you will need to send me the Namco gun and an AimTrak, (or upfront deposit for the AimTrak)... I would ask for an additional $20.00 (for my time) to do the job for you.

Of course, absolutely none of this is endorsed my Ultimarc.  This is my mod done my way.   If you are uncomfortable with me performing surgery on the AimTrak, then this isn't the kit for you ;)

I can't make this any cheaper for two reasons... #1.  I don't build crap and #2. My time is ultra limited, and it takes quite some time to terminate and assemble this.  I realize this is a pretty expensive kit and may not make sense to a lot of people.  If there is enough interest I will be able to make this happen.  Right now I'm just floating it out there... and it may just end up being that... a floater ;)
so roughly it will cost $90 for parts and labor plus the cost of a namco gun and aimtrak which we will provide for you is that correct. Im just putting everything together for the total cost before shipping. Count me in for a completed  Namco Gun! Did you ever think of modding and ALIENS extermintation machine gun WOW that would be awsome! Played it at the local chuckie cheese last week just saying! Nice work keep it up!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: mytymaus007 on May 20, 2012, 10:58:13 pm
Is this the Gun to get for the project do know where i can fina black one!!!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NAMCO-TIME-CRISIS-1-II-Or-POINT-BLANK-REPLACEMENT-OPTIC-RECOIL-GUN-BY-HAPP-/190664031953?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c64763ed1 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/NAMCO-TIME-CRISIS-1-II-Or-POINT-BLANK-REPLACEMENT-OPTIC-RECOIL-GUN-BY-HAPP-/190664031953?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c64763ed1)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 20, 2012, 11:16:49 pm
Is this the Gun to get for the project do know where i can fina black one!!!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NAMCO-TIME-CRISIS-1-II-Or-POINT-BLANK-REPLACEMENT-OPTIC-RECOIL-GUN-BY-HAPP-/190664031953?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c64763ed1 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/NAMCO-TIME-CRISIS-1-II-Or-POINT-BLANK-REPLACEMENT-OPTIC-RECOIL-GUN-BY-HAPP-/190664031953?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c64763ed1)

No that's the Happ gun that is sold as a replacement to the genuine Namco.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 20, 2012, 11:18:43 pm
cool cant wait :)

Here it is what it is looking like:

- 3' Gun hose with fitting  $25.00 ($2.00 per extra foot)
Includes USB termination at both ends and power lines for the solenoid.

- Trigger/Recoil PCB $25.00.
Driver circuit and connectors with custom trigger harness to the AimTrak.  Makes installation a breeze (no solder).

If you want to install the AimTrak the way I have shown (without modifying the plastics) you may add the following:

- Camera Mount $10.00
This is a hand made item.  Allows the AimTrak camera to fit as close to the end of the barrel and provides an easy no-mod installation into the Namco plastics.

-AimTrak Exchange $10.00
The camera needs to be separated from the main PCB for this.  If you are uncomfortable modifying your AimTrak yourself I will offer an AimTrak exchange and do the mod for you.

I've tweaked the installation and final kit design since I've first posted this.  It's streamlined and fits much neater in the gun.  Full installation instructions would be provided.  None of this includes shipping.

Some have asked for me to do the whole thing.  If you want t do that you will need to send me the Namco gun and an AimTrak, (or upfront deposit for the AimTrak)... I would ask for an additional $20.00 (for my time) to do the job for you.

Of course, absolutely none of this is endorsed my Ultimarc.  This is my mod done my way.   If you are uncomfortable with me performing surgery on the AimTrak, then this isn't the kit for you ;)

I can't make this any cheaper for two reasons... #1.  I don't build crap and #2. My time is ultra limited, and it takes quite some time to terminate and assemble this.  I realize this is a pretty expensive kit and may not make sense to a lot of people.  If there is enough interest I will be able to make this happen.  Right now I'm just floating it out there... and it may just end up being that... a floater ;)
so roughly it will cost $90 for parts and labor plus the cost of a namco gun and aimtrak which we will provide for you is that correct. Im just putting everything together for the total cost before shipping. Count me in for a completed  Namco Gun! Did you ever think of modding and ALIENS extermintation machine gun WOW that would be awsome! Played it at the local chuckie cheese last week just saying! Nice work keep it up!

Yep you got it.

I've never looked at the Aliens gun.  A machine gun would require a different circuit though.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: mytymaus007 on May 22, 2012, 03:39:35 pm
is there anyone that sells the Namco gun new, or it only works on the originals. Let me know i would like to get the gun and have it modded if you are willing to do so thanks!!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 22, 2012, 04:00:38 pm
is there anyone that sells the Namco gun new, or it only works on the originals. Let me know i would like to get the gun and have it modded if you are willing to do so thanks!!

http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/shooting_parts/namco_gun_assembly/13200.html (http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/shooting_parts/namco_gun_assembly/13200.html)

...or you can buy all the plastic separately from Happ (see my parts list on first post) and find a solenoid assembly on ebay.

It's pretty pricey no matter how you cut it... although (I think) its awesome having the Namco gun setup, the sheer cost kills it for most... it almost did for me.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 26, 2012, 01:33:29 pm
I've devised a cheaper and easier way to deal with the camera and was able to get the cost of the PCB down some :)

- 3' Gun hose with fitting  $20.00 ($2.00 per extra foot) Includes USB termination at both ends and power lines for the solenoid.

- Trigger/Recoil PCB $15.00.
Driver circuit and connectors with custom trigger harness to the AimTrak.  Makes installation a breeze (no solder).

If you want to install the AimTrak the way I have shown (without modifying the plastics) you may add the following:

- Camera Mount $2.00
This is a hand made item.  Allows the AimTrak camera to fit as close to the end of the barrel and provides an easy no-mod installation into the Namco plastics.

-AimTrak Exchange $10.00
The camera needs to be separated from the main PCB for this.  If you are uncomfortable modifying your AimTrak yourself I will offer an AimTrak exchange and do the mod for you.

Full installation instructions would be provided.  None of this includes shipping.

Some have asked for me to do the whole thing.  If you want t do that you will need to send me the Namco gun and an AimTrak, (or upfront deposit for the AimTrak)... I would ask for $20.00 (for my time) to do the job for you.  Also to clarify, the $10.00 AimTrak mod fee is not necessary if you are going to pay 20.00 for me to do the complete job :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 29, 2012, 06:48:59 pm
Hey folks... I realize this kit isn't for everyone... however I've got 2 maybe 3 interested.  I'm probably not going to do this if there isn't enough interest to do a minimum of 8.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Mark Thomas on May 31, 2012, 05:44:34 am
Have you counted me as one of the interested ones :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on May 31, 2012, 07:08:51 am
Have you counted me as one of the interested ones :)

Yes sir :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: lodoss118 on June 02, 2012, 07:15:19 am
also me :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on June 02, 2012, 07:46:40 am
PM sent to all who have shown interest. :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on June 04, 2012, 12:10:17 pm
I've completed the PCB design for the solenoid driver.  This board can be used with the AimTrak to drive any 24VDC solenoid, not just the Namco solenoid.  This circuit is a bit different from my initial posting.  There is absolutely nothing wrong with the first and much simpler version of this that I posted.  However for the kit, I've designed it as an opto-isolated circuit for greater isolation of the driver circuit from the AimTrak.  I realize this is entirely overkill.

Designing a PCB makes it a snap for installation (no soldering or splicing)... to accomplish this it has been given two connectors...

- A 9Pos .100 connector with connections for the solenoid coil, 24VDC+/-  with pass through of the AimTrak connections Ground, P1, Aux and Trigger.  I decided to do the pass through on the AimTrak lines of Ground, P1, Aux and Trigger to make it easier connecting to external switches.  Doing this affords me the capability of using 20-24AWG wire as the AimTrak connector uses a very light gauge wire that is a bit tricky to use with quick disconnects.  

- A 5Pos 2.00mm connector that will directly connect (with harness of course)  to the AimTrak's P1 1.25mm connector.

In the event the coil you are using does not have the kick-back diode in-line with the connector (like the Namco does), I've included a placeholder on the PCB for installation of that diode.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Mark Thomas on June 05, 2012, 09:57:10 pm
My pea size brain doesn't understand any of this but it sounds good  :cheers: definitely interested in placing an order
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on June 06, 2012, 09:26:48 am
I think this is a cool project.

 However, how about covering more bases?   For example, T2 guns use a solenoid that has a variable fire rate, that the game controls.  Howard C. makes a program "Mamehooker"  that works with  mame, and passes all the force-feedback data from mame, to any FFB device.

 I think a LOT of people would Love to have correct FFB in T2, myself included.   But you just cant simply have an auto-fire option.. It has to be linked to the actual games output.

 There are also many other game which have FFB coils, such as Qbert, Road Riot.  And games like Outrun, which power on the awesome Shaker motor.  As well as the possibility of making a true motion cockpit game (they run on worm gears and motors).  Good powerful Force feedback wheel control is another option that is lacking too.

 Finally, I have already spent good money on the LCD Topguns.  Id prefer not to buy more guns... nor to be locked down on the FFB device... should even better guns come out. (which has happened several times already)   A universal FFB driver kit would be much more optimal in such a case.

 Another great option for FFB, and probably a big seller, would be for virtual Pinball tables.  You could power 2 real flipper coils, a couple of kicker/pop bumper coils, and maybe some effect lights (flasher bulbs). The vibration effect of real coils would make the tables feel more realistic.   The ability to control a bunch of coils, motors, and lights,  could lead to actual physical prototype table creation too... but that may be going too far for your intended market.

Thanks and I agree. I kept this project specific to the AimTrak and what would fit inside the gun case, however I do have some other design considerations for the stuff you've outlined.   I need to do a little more digging into what would make sense for a reasonable FFB kit type project.

Thanks for the input.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: hbk_life on June 12, 2012, 03:31:44 am
Hello!!

I just saw this post and would love to discuss perhaps getting a gun? could you please IM me with some pricing estimates? would be great.

CHeers

Paul
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on June 12, 2012, 01:07:42 pm
Hello!!

I just saw this post and would love to discuss perhaps getting a gun? could you please IM me with some pricing estimates? would be great.

CHeers

Paul

PM sent :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on June 12, 2012, 08:28:16 pm
Solenoid Driver/Interconnect Boards came in today... I stuffed one real quick to give you all a sample.  I've included my first proto board in the photo.

(http://img.tapatalk.com/44305e2a-de36-6894.jpg)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: smalltownguy on June 13, 2012, 10:22:26 am
I'm super interested in this project. Time to find a Namco gun.

Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Mark Thomas on June 20, 2012, 12:44:47 pm
I ordered 2 from arcadespareparts.com not arrived yet bu they have assured me the quality is second to non.

http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/shooting_parts/time_crisis_gun_assembly/13199.html (http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/shooting_parts/time_crisis_gun_assembly/13199.html)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on June 20, 2012, 01:04:45 pm
Quick update... I'm waiting on a couple of things.  I needed to make a change to the camera mount so I need that to come in and I am still waiting on USB connectors...then I can start building these up.

I've not forgot... its just taking a little longer than I expected.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: lodoss118 on June 21, 2012, 05:42:22 am
don't worry take your time on designing and building this, i am sure will all appreciate the effort you are putting into this .
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Mark Thomas on June 26, 2012, 08:48:40 am
don't worry take your time on designing and building this, i am sure will all appreciate the effort you are putting into this .

Yes agreed no need to rush, I would rather have a perfect product than the first version to have issues that then see many revisions to follow to fix it. Your doing great work mate hope you get a lot more interest as I think this is a great addition to any cab.

- UPDATE - My Namco guns from arcade spare parts have arrived in the Uk but are being held till I arrange the payment of the £45 import tax, if anyone is interested I could post pics of the quality of these guns? Let me know.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Mark Thomas on July 11, 2012, 09:24:35 pm
Tax paid guns due for delivery later today pics to follow
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on July 12, 2012, 08:58:27 am
Tax paid guns due for delivery later today pics to follow

Great.  I'm going to be building up the kits towards the end of July.

Each of these kits includes 3 feet/(914mm) of conduit with the USB and power lines extending 1 foot/(304mm) beyond the end of the conduit.  If you need more that... please specify as its an additional $2.00 per foot/(304mm).
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: kmhamel on July 20, 2012, 11:17:03 pm
hello, left a pm about a couple of boards.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on July 21, 2012, 06:57:27 am
hello, left a pm about a couple of boards.

I have not received any PMs recently. :dunno
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Griff08 on July 22, 2012, 11:51:47 pm
Good Day,

I would like to purchase one of your Namco Recoil Gun Aimtrak conversion PCBs.  I would also like the little custom piece for mounting the Camera.

Any chance your device could modified to receive an output from MAMEHOOKER to have authentic recoil feedback?

Perhaps the AimTrak PCB itself could sense this from MAMEHOOKER and then pulse on its pins?

Thanks Much
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: lodoss118 on July 24, 2012, 07:46:43 am
Hi retro I am sure we are all still interested, probably best to keep a mailing list of us. Whats the current status on the kits?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Mark Thomas on August 01, 2012, 05:45:13 am
Well considering I paid a small fortune and was assured that I was recieving genuine Namco replacement guns I am very dissapointed that the guns actually say Named rather than Namco. The truth is they may actually be top notch quality but not use the officially licenced name as they may not have Namco's aproval. They certainly look nice enough and feel very sturdy and like the Namco guns.

(http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg635/Webbo_1979/0e1b6683.jpg)

(http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg635/Webbo_1979/29e3d061.jpg)

(http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg635/Webbo_1979/7556066b.jpg)

(http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg635/Webbo_1979/c9a7b952.jpg)

(http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg635/Webbo_1979/4606799f.jpg)

(http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg635/Webbo_1979/231b3bf5.jpg)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: XtraSmiley on August 02, 2012, 10:00:44 pm
Well to be fair, they DO say Named on that link you posted...

That being said, sorry you got duped, been there myself...
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on August 03, 2012, 02:01:16 pm
Hi retro I am sure we are all still interested, probably best to keep a mailing list of us. Whats the current status on the kits?

Yeah... I have a list.  At this point I am sold out.  You are on the list.

Please hang in there... I've not dropped the ball... my free time is ultra slim. :-[

Thanks
Jim
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on August 03, 2012, 02:03:44 pm
Well considering I paid a small fortune and was assured that I was recieving genuine Namco replacement guns I am very dissapointed that the guns actually say Named rather than Namco. The truth is they may actually be top notch quality but not use the officially licenced name as they may not have Namco's aproval. They certainly look nice enough and feel very sturdy and like the Namco guns.

I'd be pretty surprised if they weren't made by the same manufacturer that produces the Namco gun.  Pretty typical Chinese manufacturer  "one for you Namco and one for me" type tactic... lets change the name to Named and we are good to pirate the product!

If it bugs you... you could buy Namco slides ;)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: mooseman1 on August 21, 2012, 06:16:25 pm
I'd be interested in one of these, if you're still doing this project.
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on August 21, 2012, 06:27:34 pm
I'd be interested in one of these, if you're still doing this project.

Still here still doing this... Thanks for everyone's patience.

At this point they are all spoken for... I have 2 I'm keeping for myself ... however I might end up selling them and if I do I'll let you know.

Thanks Again
Jim
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: mooseman1 on August 21, 2012, 07:03:22 pm
Ah ok. Well yeah, if you do please let me know, or if more people registered interest would you maybe do another run? I think most of it is way beyond my technical skill level, so would probably be most interested in a complete gun.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Mark Thomas on August 22, 2012, 10:09:13 am
Think you guys are spot on as the quality feels very good as far as I can tell.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on September 10, 2012, 12:24:39 pm
I'm interested in the whole thing, still doing this? If so, do you have any camera mounts left?

Thanks!
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on September 10, 2012, 12:41:22 pm
I'm interested in the whole thing, still doing this? If so, do you have any camera mounts left?

Thanks!

I am still doing this (although it may look as if I dropped the ball) :(

My free time is very limited in the summer due to work demands. 

Sorry about the delay folks.

Thanks
Jim
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on September 25, 2012, 06:47:05 pm
I'm looking to extend the gun hose that is on an original namco gun. looks like it's from a shower... anyways... it's WAY too short. What can I use? I tried to seperate the hose from the fitting and look for something in the diy store but I couldn't remove the fitting. It seems to be held with too little screws but getting them out did nothing. Any ideas?
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on September 25, 2012, 06:56:36 pm
I'm looking to extend the gun hose that is on an original namco gun. looks like it's from a shower... anyways... it's WAY too short. What can I use? I tried to seperate the hose from the fitting and look for something in the diy store but I couldn't remove the fitting. It seems to be held with too little screws but getting them out did nothing. Any ideas?

There are different versions of the hose... got a pic?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on September 26, 2012, 10:48:08 am
It's the same as Mark Thomas.
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on September 26, 2012, 10:51:14 am
It's the same as Mark Thomas.

Sure... I've not seen that type in person.  There may be a split pin in there or something that needs to be punched out.  Detailed pic would help figure that out.  Marks photos don't show the hose mount up close and removed from the plastics.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on September 27, 2012, 03:08:53 pm
Got it off... now I need to find a replacement :)
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on September 27, 2012, 03:14:51 pm
Got it off... now I need to find a replacement :)

I have a replacement... Not sure if you are interested.  It's black plastic conduit.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on September 28, 2012, 04:13:28 pm
Went to the diy market and got a 5 feet metal shower hose... because that seems to be what they actually used. it was a little too big for the fitting but with some crafting I got it working... looks like the original one but longer. awesome :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 01, 2012, 07:52:39 pm
btw... do you know about any good replacement for the solenoid that's not $120!?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: kmhamel on October 01, 2012, 08:23:30 pm
btw... do you know about any good replacement for the solenoid that's not $120!?

these work great, you just need to cut the shaft to length and cut a slot for the e-clip. Use the spring that comes with the gun and washers to fit since the solenoid is smaller than the one in the gun.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Spring-Return-Pull-Type-Electric-Solenoid-24V-3-7-lbs-Pull-24V-Solenoid-/140633863703?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20be6e7617 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Spring-Return-Pull-Type-Electric-Solenoid-24V-3-7-lbs-Pull-24V-Solenoid-/140633863703?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20be6e7617)
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 01, 2012, 10:17:20 pm
FYI... Just got half of the PCBs stuffed and have begun putting the kits together.

There are a crap-ton of crimps in this rig... so it takes a bit to get through :/
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 02, 2012, 04:25:22 pm
thanks kmhamel!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 12, 2012, 07:08:10 am
Before I asked here for a replacement solenoid I allready ordered this one: http://www.ebay.de/itm/350594884681?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649#ht_1536wt_1163 (http://www.ebay.de/itm/350594884681?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649#ht_1536wt_1163)

It wasn't supposed to be in the namco but in a carnevil shotgun. Fact is: This one is a perfectly fitting replacement for the namco gun. Just to let you guys know :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on October 14, 2012, 10:46:14 am
Man, this project is freakin' awesome!!  :notworthy:

I'm very intrested in your mod but I guess I just missed the train!  :hissy:
If you ever will go for a second run, count me in!

Cheers!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 14, 2012, 05:42:49 pm
Can someone help me with hooking up this power supply: http://www.ebay.de/itm/400321344408?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649#ht_3499wt_1365 (http://www.ebay.de/itm/400321344408?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649#ht_3499wt_1365)

I can't seem to make it work with my second namco gun. for the first I'm using a prewired power supply from a laptop.

It has connections for L, N (AC), G , V-, V+. I hooked my Euroconnector to L and N. Indicationlamp will light. Where do I have to connect the two wires for the gun to? I thought ground and v+ but that's not giving me 24v. v- and v+ will either short or make the solenoid hum.
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 14, 2012, 05:50:08 pm
Can someone help me with hooking up this power supply: http://www.ebay.de/itm/400321344408?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649#ht_3499wt_1365 (http://www.ebay.de/itm/400321344408?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649#ht_3499wt_1365)

I can't seem to make it work with my second namco gun. for the first I'm using a prewired power supply from a laptop.

It has connections for L, N (AC), G , V-, V+. I hooked my Euroconnector to L and N. Indicationlamp will light. Where do I have to connect the two wires for the gun to? I thought ground and v+ but that's not giving me 24v. v- and v+ will either short or make the solenoid hum.

Should be V+ and V-
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 14, 2012, 06:10:44 pm
Tried that. One way I get a hum from the solenoid and it's not triggering. The other way around I get a short on the connector (coaxial).  The solenoid IS working with the other power supply though.
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 14, 2012, 06:25:43 pm
Tried that. One way I get a hum from the solenoid and it's not triggering. The other way around I get a short on the connector (coaxial).  The solenoid IS working with the other power supply though.

What is the capacity of the other power supply?  This one is rated at 2A and could be over spec'd... and it may be too weak... or perhaps faulty.
Title: AW: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 15, 2012, 02:40:17 am
the other one has 24v and 1.8a. i thought that 24v with 2a are original specs that you gave in the pdf?

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Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 15, 2012, 07:25:19 am
the other one has 24v and 1.8a. i thought that 24v with 2a are original specs that you gave in the pdf?

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Yes 2A is correct... I'm just wondering if there is something wrong with that power supply... either mis-represented or defective.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 17, 2012, 11:48:04 am
I just got 2 new power supplys... each at 24v 2a... still hum from both guns when using those. my old power supply works with both guns (24v, 1.8 a)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 17, 2012, 02:19:11 pm
I measured the output of all the power supplys. the one that works has a pretty steady 23,7v and 2.2A. The new ones are around 22-24 with jumps into 25-26v and between 2.0 and 2.6A.

I couldn't get a tip102 but got a BDX53C Darlington from the seller. He said it's the same spec. Is it possible that this is the problem? If so... why is one power supply working and the others are not!? Here... that's the darlington I'm using: http://pdf1.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/view/2594/MOSPEC/BDX53C.html (http://pdf1.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/view/2594/MOSPEC/BDX53C.html)
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 17, 2012, 10:19:30 pm
That part should be fine... I don't get it. 

I had a similar problem but it turned out to be a mechanical issue.  One of my solenoids would stick.. when I used a cheap power supply it couldn't drive the solenoid hard enough given the pulse duration provided by the AimTrak... so it took a few triggers to get it going.

Have you tried just connecting the solenoid directly across the power supply to see if it works outside the circuit?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 18, 2012, 07:24:04 am
No I didn't. But before I put everything back together I cleaned everything so nothing is sticking. Also, the hum is constant when I connect the power supply and not only when trying to shoot. It's on all my guns like that. Namco blue, Namco pink and my Midway Carnevil with 24v 2A solenoid (that's the perfect match for a Namco).  I just don't want to waste any more money on power supplies that don't seem to work :(
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 18, 2012, 07:27:22 am
Is the working supply the same brand\type as the others?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 18, 2012, 07:39:20 am
No, it's an LG and I guess it was for a Laptop... got it from a second hand from a spare parts box. This is the other: http://www.ebay.de/itm/24V-Uni-Trafo-Netzteil-fur-LED-Strip-24-Volt-2A-48-Watt-/370515867560?pt=DE_M%C3%B6bel_Wohnen_Lampen_Lichtzubeh%C3%B6r&hash=item56447777a8#ht_3514wt_1139 (http://www.ebay.de/itm/24V-Uni-Trafo-Netzteil-fur-LED-Strip-24-Volt-2A-48-Watt-/370515867560?pt=DE_M%C3%B6bel_Wohnen_Lampen_Lichtzubeh%C3%B6r&hash=item56447777a8#ht_3514wt_1139)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: kmhamel on October 18, 2012, 12:46:40 pm
When you put the components on the boards, will you install the kick-back diode for those of us that need it? Also, how do you connect the tubing that the wires go through to the gun. I'm thinking that if it attaches firmly, the tubing would be a good strain relief for the usb and power cables.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 18, 2012, 02:32:40 pm
When you put the components on the boards, will you install the kick-back diode for those of us that need it? Also, how do you connect the tubing that the wires go through to the gun. I'm thinking that if it attaches firmly, the tubing would be a good strain relief for the usb and power cables.

Yes... I will be putting them on all boards... if you don't need it... just cut it out... or leave it in.

There is a fitting that the tubing connects to and there is a nut on the inside that attaches to that fitting.  In between the metal bracket and the fitting is a nylon washer that is tapered which gives it a real tight fit.... its really very sturdy.
Title: AW: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 18, 2012, 02:56:22 pm
whats the diode doing? I didnt install one in my shotgun. everything working though.. .except for the power supplies.

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Title: Re: AW: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 18, 2012, 03:07:09 pm
whats the diode doing? I didnt install one in my shotgun. everything working though.. .except for the power supplies.

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mmm... you kind of need that diode ... It will prevent the current from rushing back into the transistor when the voltage is removed from the solenoid and damaging the circuit.  Also it must be installed in the proper direction to work (per the schematic).

I would go back and double check all of your circuit wiring to be sure your diodes are in and the polarity of them is correct.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 18, 2012, 03:20:31 pm
They are in the namco guns and everything is correct. It's not in my shotgun though - it wasn't made for a solenoid in the first place. So you say I should install one? What specs will I need?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 18, 2012, 03:35:33 pm
They are in the namco guns and everything is correct. It's not in my shotgun though - it wasn't made for a solenoid in the first place. So you say I should install one? What specs will I need?

Any general purpose rectifier diode would work... 1N4001-1N4007: http://www.vishay.com/docs/88503/1n4001.pdf (http://www.vishay.com/docs/88503/1n4001.pdf)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 18, 2012, 03:42:58 pm
okay thanks... will go get one and install it... in the meanwhile: any idea about my power supply problem? what could be driving the solenoid and make it hum with one power supply attached but not with the other?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 18, 2012, 04:15:25 pm
Well I'm close to give up. I don't know what's the problem and I can't imagine that 3 different power supplies wont work. I don't have enough knowledge of electrics and I'm lost. I don't know which part is actually the problem in the chain... maybe its the transistor or the diode or the power supply or whatever... :(
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 18, 2012, 04:33:40 pm
Well I'm close to give up. I don't know what's the problem and I can't imagine that 3 different power supplies wont work. I don't have enough knowledge of electrics and I'm lost. I don't know which part is actually the problem in the chain... maybe its the transistor or the diode or the power supply or whatever... :(

Hey now... No need to give up just yet.  I would double check your wiring on all guns before giving up.

As far as the power supply... Please check the solenoid alone... without the circuitry. It should engage and not hum. If it hums then your power supply(s) are bad.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 18, 2012, 04:50:42 pm
Okay, opened up the guns and checked the direction of the diode and it seems as it was wrong. I don't know how this could work with the other power supply but that doesn't matter. So... now the solenoid doesn't hum. BUT it stays engaged. It won't let go.
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 18, 2012, 05:02:40 pm
If you just connect the solenoid across the power supply momentarily it should engage and let go when you remove it.

Now if its staying engaged in circuit (with transistor and diode connected) without the AimTrak connected... its likely you have blown the transistor... or it's wired wrong.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 18, 2012, 05:14:06 pm
Okay. The other gun is still humming. Doublechecked everything. It's huming louder when I touch the solenoid. I didn't install the ground wire - just because it worked without it. Is it necessary?
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 18, 2012, 05:25:25 pm
Okay. The other gun is still humming. Doublechecked everything. It's huming louder when I touch the solenoid. I didn't install the ground wire - just because it worked without it. Is it necessary?

Well ground "should" be common so that's why it works without it... The ground line of the pc should be the same as your power supply.... depending upon the design of the power supply it may not be... This can cause weirdness.

That aside, can I get a picture of your wiring?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 18, 2012, 05:32:18 pm
Here's what I will do...

I will get new transistors tomorrow. My wiring was exactly like in your description - only without ground wire and I may didn't take a closer look on the diode. I will redo everything from ground up. I just checked both guns solenoids connected directly to the power supply. Both work. Then I checked both guns connected to the transistor. Blue didn't do anything but hum (even more when I connected the aimtrak) when I touched it, pink one would stay back. Does that make any sense to you?

Are you sure that the transistor I used is okay for this use? it's the bdx53c. The guy in the shop said it's identical to the tip102 - I really don't know anything about that stuff :(
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 18, 2012, 05:54:44 pm
Here's what I will do...

I will get new transistors tomorrow. My wiring was exactly like in your description - only without ground wire and I may didn't take a closer look on the diode. I will redo everything from ground up. I just checked both guns solenoids connected directly to the power supply. Both work. Then I checked both guns connected to the transistor. Blue didn't do anything but hum (even more when I connected the aimtrak) when I touched it, pink one would stay back. Does that make any sense to you?

Are you sure that the transistor I used is okay for this use? it's the bdx53c. The guy in the shop said it's identical to the tip102 - I really don't know anything about that stuff :(

Ok sounds good...

The BDX53C is an acceptable substitute for the TIP102 and you may also use the FQP33N10 as well.  If you use the 33N10 MOSFET be sure to mind your pin-outs (as it is different).  Be sure you don't allow any of the device to short against metal in the gun. ;)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 18, 2012, 06:00:30 pm
I'll get a couple of BDX53C, new resistors and see what will happen. This is driving me nuts as it's the 5th time I'm redoing it. Well at least I learned a lot...

Do you think this power supply should work for two guns, or is it better to connect each gun to it's own power supply? http://www.ebay.de/itm/LED-Strip-Netzteil-Netzgerat-230V-24V-4A-100W-DC-Trafo-/271080223917?pt=DE_M%C3%B6bel_Wohnen_Leuchtmittel&hash=item3f1da3f4ad (http://www.ebay.de/itm/LED-Strip-Netzteil-Netzgerat-230V-24V-4A-100W-DC-Trafo-/271080223917?pt=DE_M%C3%B6bel_Wohnen_Leuchtmittel&hash=item3f1da3f4ad)
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 18, 2012, 06:10:19 pm
Yes it's fine, you need 2A per gun.  The Namco design used a single 4A power supply for 2 guns... and this is what I have done on my test rig.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 18, 2012, 07:19:10 pm
I'll get all the parts tomorrow and report back. The BDX53C has the exact same pin outs as the tip102 as far as I can see, right?
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 18, 2012, 07:25:33 pm
I'll get all the parts tomorrow and report back. The BDX53C has the exact same pin outs as the tip102 as far as I can see, right?

Except I think the collector is also connected to the tab of the package... so this should be insulated.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 18, 2012, 07:33:17 pm
So  it's better to put the whole transistor into shrink tubing?
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 18, 2012, 07:56:08 pm
So  it's better to put the whole transistor into shrink tubing?

I would do that.  As long as the leads don't pinch together inside the shrink tubing.

The way I did it was I trimmed the leads down, soldered wires to them and put heat shrink tubing on each lead, just to be sure nothing would short.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 19, 2012, 05:25:37 am
Yeah I used shrink tubing all over the place :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 19, 2012, 06:28:02 am
redid everything today. new transistor, new resistor. the humming from the gun starts as soon as I connect the aimtrak.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 19, 2012, 07:28:23 am
so now the AimTrak is not beeing recognized when the power supply is on. The transistor will get hot pretty fast and there is no hum from the solenoid. Connecting the solenoid without the transistor and diode to the power supply works. Connecting the power supply with the transistor and the diode does nothing (no hum, no kickback). Aimtrak works without the power supply connected, but wont be recognized with the power supply attached (transistor will heat up).

here are pictures... maybe you find something.

Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 19, 2012, 07:54:19 am
Connect everything up... Except the AimTrak to the recoil circuit.  Measure the voltage @ the resistor where it would connect to the AimTrak.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 19, 2012, 08:33:54 am
I get the 24 (23,55v) from the power supply. I also tried something: Holding com at the drain and touching the resistor with + (dmm is on continuity) will make the kickback work.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 19, 2012, 09:12:42 am
I get the 24 (23,55v) from the power supply. I also tried something: Holding com at the drain and touching the resistor with + (dmm is on continuity) will make the kickback work.

You should not be getting 24V from the power supply on that pin of the transistor.  It should be zero volts. The AimTrak should be allowed to drive that pin high (to +5V) to bias the transistor.  If you have 24V on that, you will mess up your AimTrak, hence why its causing the AimTrak to not work when connected.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 19, 2012, 09:15:39 am
So why am I getting 24v? Maybe I measured wrong: Com at drain, V at the resistor.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 19, 2012, 09:25:20 am
So why am I getting 24v? Maybe I measured wrong: Com at drain, V at the resistor.

I'm not sure... you should put your meter V lead on the 1K resistor that is connected to pin 1 (base) and your common lead onto pin 3 (emitter) of the transistor.  The base should be isolated from +V, it should not read 24V
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 19, 2012, 09:33:38 am
Okay, measured as you said and I'm getting 0.001 mv.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 19, 2012, 09:42:49 am
Okay, measured as you said and I'm getting 0.001 mv.

Ok that sounds better.

How are you connected to your AimTrak?  Are you using a connector housing or did you solder directly to the board?

Thanks
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 19, 2012, 09:50:12 am
I use the white connector. I removed the cable for button 1 from the connector and put it on the insert next to ground. Before I did that I had it soldered directly to the board. I double checked and there is no splatter or connection between the points that's not supposed to be. pin 4 gets contact to the board and the wire.

edit: just to be sure that one AimTrak is faulty, I checked with two different AimTraks with the different results when connecting:

The transistor will heat up. One AimTrak disconnects... the other will not. This is getting stranger every minute.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 19, 2012, 11:01:02 am
You know... everything worked. Both guns. Just a different power supply. Maybe it's not me doing something wrong. Problem is... the power supply that actually worked with the guns had a short while I wanted to get it out of the cabinet (touched some metal part) and now I cant test it.

The power supply I'm using now is the one in the picture and will work for the solenoid as mentioned. Just not in connection with the aimtrak. I can adjust the voltage from the power supply. right now it's running at 23,7V with 2,2A.
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 19, 2012, 11:17:13 am
Maybe there is something wrong with the grounding of those supplies that don't work.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 19, 2012, 11:22:54 am
okay, as long as the the aimtrak is still beeing recognized, I didn't destroy it and it can't be the aimtrak?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 19, 2012, 11:49:49 am
okay, as long as the the aimtrak is still beeing recognized, I didn't destroy it and it can't be the aimtrak?

If it still works then you are probably ok.. I am a bit concerned that when you connect it up it causes that weird behavior.  Its almost as if its driving the transistor partially on. 
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 19, 2012, 12:01:33 pm
Yeah but it was doing that weird stuff on 3 guns when I connected the power supplys that didn't work.... everything was fine with the other one. maybe really just the ground?
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 19, 2012, 12:12:51 pm
Yeah but it was doing that weird stuff on 3 guns when I connected the power supplys that didn't work.... everything was fine with the other one. maybe really just the ground?

Yes could be...

PM sent ;)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on October 21, 2012, 07:01:13 pm
For those of you encountering the same problem I had (hum from the solenoid etc., read the thread):

You have to connect the ground wire from the AimTrak to the E (3rd) pin of the tranistor. This will solve the problem.

Thanks again for all the help.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on October 21, 2012, 07:48:27 pm
For those of you encountering the same problem I had (hum from the solenoid etc., read the thread):

You have to connect the ground wire from the AimTrak to the E (3rd) pin of the tranistor. This will solve the problem.

Thanks again for all the help.

I've updated my first schematic to include this connection :)

Also if you are copying my second design (the one that I've built my boards from) you would not experience grounding issue that Endprodukt had... because I've isolated the power supplies from each other with my second design.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on November 05, 2012, 05:42:35 pm
Hi'ya guys! Thought I might bprrow t he thread as it is a NAMCO gun + AimTrak convertion.
Only think is that I've used the ReCoil kit too.

Have connect it like the image but the solenoid stays constantly on and the MOSFET get hot as hell.
I have measured over the S1, S2 to the Solenoid and they have constant 24v

http://bayimg.com/GAfoiaAej (http://bayimg.com/GAfoiaAej)

Have I connect something wrong here?
Seems pretty straight forward in setting it up, but maybe I missed the trigger setup as the NAMCO gun only have one button (trigger)  :dunno

The gun seems to work as I can move the red dot in the config section and the trigger works with the left mouse button.

Any help appreciated.  :angry:


Regards!

/Gustav
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on November 05, 2012, 07:26:57 pm
Looks as if your trigger is mis-wired.  You need to run the trigger line (pin 1 of the AimTrak connector) to the recoil PCB not the trigger switch as shown in your pic.

The button on the recoil PCB is the trigger button.

Maybe I'm misreading your diagram ?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on November 06, 2012, 06:18:11 pm
Thanks for the swift reply pal.

I've connected it right this time and the button on the recoil PCB works.  :laugh:

T to Trigger(PIN1)
R to Recoil(PIN4)
G to Ground(PIN5)

AUX(PIN2) & P1(PIN3) is un-used

Still, when I connect the power supply I get the solenoid to constant ON...!  :-[

Measured T - G = 5V, S1 - S2 = 24  :cry:

I can't see what I've done wrong here. Maybe some conponent is faulty, MOSFET or something?

Any help/pointer much appreciated


Regards

(http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll47/gstav80/my_connection2.jpg)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on November 07, 2012, 07:43:31 am
Maybe if someone missed the text I had under the picture, I moved it above it.

The problem remains as the solenoid still is CONSTANT ON event when I connected the gear as the picture shows  :timebomb:

HEEEELP!  :hissy:
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on November 07, 2012, 07:54:14 am
Maybe if someone missed the text I had under the picture, I moved it above it.

The problem remains as the solenoid still is CONSTANT ON event when I connected the gear as the picture shows  :timebomb:

HEEEELP!  :hissy:

It all looks like its connected properly. 

If you disconnect from the AimTrak does the solenoid remain energized?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: ZeroPoint on November 07, 2012, 08:19:32 am
First off all, have you installed the recoil firmware (with correct version for you Aim-Trak board) ? And also make sure it is contact between "R" and "pin 4".

If so, try to disconnect the header from the Aim-Trak board and use a 5 volt DC source to test the solenoid alone by putting GND "G" to GND and touch "R" to 5 volts to energize and quickly put "R" to GND (don`t energize the solenoid for too long !!!). If it doesn´t deenergize when putting "R" to ground, remove 24 V power source quickly.

If this works you can measure if there is 5V constant on "R" from the Aim-Trak board. This should read 0 volts.

Another thing... I would recommend to go beyond 30 volts for a much better kick from the solenoid.  ;D
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on November 07, 2012, 09:23:57 am
It all looks like its connected properly. 

If you disconnect from the AimTrak does the solenoid remain energized?

Yes, even when the USB is unplugged from the Aimtrak the solenoid remain active  :embarassed:

First off all, have you installed the recoil firmware (with correct version for you Aim-Trak board) ? And also make sure it is contact between "R" and "pin 4".

If so, try to disconnect the header from the Aim-Trak board and use a 5 volt DC source to test the solenoid alone by putting GND "G" to GND and touch "R" to 5 volts to energize and quickly put "R" to GND (don`t energize the solenoid for too long !!!). If it doesn´t deenergize when putting "R" to ground, remove 24 V power source quickly.

If this works you can measure if there is 5V constant on "R" from the Aim-Trak board. This should read 0 volts.

Another thing... I would recommend to go beyond 30 volts for a much better kick from the solenoid.  ;D

I have tha Aimtrack version V1.9 with Firmware 8.15

Sadly have not the time to test the 5V to solenoid G to R thing today. I'll get back tomrrow with a test result.

Thanks for the replies guys!  :notworthy:
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on November 08, 2012, 07:14:46 am
The problem was a faulty MOSFET. Replaced it today and now the solenoid fires just fine as i should  :banghead: *lol*

Thanks for all the help guys (and Andy of course) Maybe I need a 36v power supply now! hehe!
I get back with some footage/video when I get it working looking lik a arcade gun as it's all gutted up at the moment!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on November 10, 2012, 09:46:50 am
Hi again guys!  ;D
Problemo 2:

The solenoid is fully pulled when connected to the power supply directly, but barely moved when connected to my Amimtrak w. recoil PCB setup(!)
Tried to measure the voltage, but I guess it's to quick pulse to catch, only get lik  a couple of V.  :censored:

What could be the problem? Have the recol level maxed to the right in the Aimtrak setup tool.

Cheers!
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on November 10, 2012, 10:45:08 am
The recoil action will not occur unless the gun is pointed to the sensor.  Also, with the new AimTrak software, the recoil pulse duration is configurable.. 40ms should be fine.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on November 11, 2012, 08:57:41 am
The recoil action will not occur unless the gun is pointed to the sensor.  Also, with the new AimTrak software, the recoil pulse duration is configurable.. 40ms should be fine.

Yes, I'm pointing the gun correctly to the display and the solenoid do fires, but nowere near 24v as it just cklicks, and the spring is barely moved.
Connected to the power supply directly it's pulled all the way perfectly as it should.

Maybe the pulse time is too short then?

Don't understand where to set the recoil pulse duration, only have one recoil slider on my Aimtrak config util. V9.15. and it's maxed.
Here's how it looks...

(http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll47/gstav80/blandade%20bilder/Aimtrak-cal1.jpg)

Which version do you have. Maybe you can send it to me?  :angel:

Thanks!
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on November 11, 2012, 10:49:44 am
You would have to ask Ultimarc what each tick of the slider represents.  I believe the default is 40ms.

Either way your showing that its maxed out so this isn't your issue.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on November 11, 2012, 01:14:36 pm
Hm.. ok. I thought the slider represented the coil strenght / voltage given.
Have mailed Andy at Ultimarc, but he have not replied yet.

What can cause this volt leakage? :'(
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on November 11, 2012, 01:55:50 pm
Hm.. ok. I thought the slider represented the coil strenght / voltage given.
Have mailed Andy at Ultimarc, but he have not replied yet.

What can cause this volt leakage? :'(

What replacement MOSFET did you use...was it the same as what was included in the kit?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on November 11, 2012, 02:05:04 pm
Yes. I bought a replacement PCB with components, ex. solenoid so it's the same.
Maybe I should re-solder it and see if that's the problem? Don't know where to start really...  :cry:
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on November 11, 2012, 02:11:09 pm
Yes. I bought a replacement PCB with components, ex. solenoid so it's the same.
Maybe I should re-solder it and see if that's the problem? Don't know where to start really...  :cry:

It's strange... It's a really simple circuit, one MOSFET, a resistor and a diode.

Unless a component is bad... it should just work.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on November 11, 2012, 03:10:18 pm
Yes, pulling my hair here???
I might try to resolder and change to the other recoil PCB and see if the problem remains.  :-\
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on November 13, 2012, 09:19:24 pm
Could it be that I've burned the MOSFET using too high of a temp when soldering it to the PCB board?

Used max of 450+ celcius on the soldering pen and as the data sheet spec max 300+ for the component?  :P *lol*
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on November 13, 2012, 09:36:38 pm
Could it be that I've burned the MOSFET using too high of a temp when soldering it to the PCB board?

Used max of 450+ celcius on the soldering pen and as the data sheet spec max 300+ for the component?  :P *lol*

lol +1
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: PL1 on November 13, 2012, 10:02:02 pm
A heat sink clip (http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103242) might come in handy.

(http://rsk.imageg.net/graphics/product_images/pRS1C-2265735w345.jpg)


Scott
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on December 23, 2012, 02:24:56 pm
i again guys!

I want to go a different and thought you guys could help me.

What I want to do is to wire the solenoid separately to the trigger directly.
When the trigger is HOLD I want to pulse the 24V ON/OFF for like 5 times/sec to get more of a full auto burst.  >:D

I understand that I need som kind of timer (555?) and a switch part, (N-MOSFET)?

Is this possible? Would be the prefect x-mas gift if someone could help me with a diagram + parts for this!  :angel:


Thanks in advance!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: lodoss118 on December 30, 2012, 03:13:56 pm
Hi i was wondering if u r still providing this service to converting a namco gun to aimtrak, i think the namco guns are missing/need more buttons?
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on December 30, 2012, 05:09:45 pm
Hi i was wondering if u r still providing this service to converting a namco gun to aimtrak, i think the namco guns are missing/need more buttons?

My apologies but my availability to do this is on hold at the moment due to health care needs of my family.  I don't mean to sound like a downer but I just don't have the time at the moment. 

As far as buttons go you are correct.  The Namco hardware doesn't provide for extra buttons.  There are a couple of ways around this.

1.  Augment the gun to enable the addition of buttons.
2.  Add a foot pedal and hook it to the keyboard encoder.

I did both of these when I was working on this.  I put an additional button in one of the screw holes of the gun (I used an SMT style button) it fit perfect and is very discrete.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: darthgus on January 02, 2013, 01:32:02 am
If you ever are doing another run I would be dead keen for a couple of them!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: lodoss118 on January 10, 2013, 08:01:07 am
Hi gstav can you show pics of inside your namco gun with the recoil kit installed i am thinking of doing the same with my namco gun?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: lodoss118 on January 18, 2013, 04:12:22 am
 no one?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: KnightofTruth on February 14, 2013, 02:05:56 pm
Sorry to hear about health issues, praying the best for your family!

If you're ever back into doing this, I'd definitely be willing to purchase 2 of the full conversions.  I'm probably months away from needing them, so feel free to PM me if/when you get back to it. Thanks for sharing!

Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on February 14, 2013, 06:03:07 pm
Thanks... my wife was diagnosed with breast cancer (again).  This time it had to be a bilateral mastectomy and she is about to start chemo in a couple of weeks.

We'll see how it goes... I may get back to this in a few months... (fingers crossed).  Unfortunately I just can't commit and don't want to be taking anyone's money at this point.

Sincerely sorry about it.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: chopperthedog on February 14, 2013, 06:12:58 pm
Shame on you for being sorry.... 

Please take good care of the family and yourself.



good day.
Title: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on February 14, 2013, 06:18:17 pm
Shame on you for being sorry.... 

Please take good care of the family and yourself.



good day.

Well I'm am sorry ...I kinda had some folks queued up but hey... such is life.

Rest assured I'm not losing sleep over it ;)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on July 30, 2013, 02:55:52 pm
Hi Lodoss!

Sorry for my late reply! Have recently started to try this Namco mod again.
Will sen you some pic when i get it up workin'!  :D
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on August 03, 2013, 09:29:59 am
Took some quick photos of the working Aimtrak. managed to squeeze the recoil-chip in the bottom. The only change made were the chip which I
connected with some wires instead so I could put it away. Otherewise its straight forward, o, I hade to cut the usb cable too so I could fit it in my shower hose.  :angel:


(http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll47/gstav80/NAMCO%20GUN%20AimTrak%20MOD/IMG_8738_zps35cd0c52.jpg) (http://s285.photobucket.com/user/gstav80/media/NAMCO%20GUN%20AimTrak%20MOD/IMG_8738_zps35cd0c52.jpg.html)

(http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll47/gstav80/NAMCO%20GUN%20AimTrak%20MOD/IMG_8737_zps45662736.jpg) (http://s285.photobucket.com/user/gstav80/media/NAMCO%20GUN%20AimTrak%20MOD/IMG_8737_zps45662736.jpg.html)

(http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll47/gstav80/NAMCO%20GUN%20AimTrak%20MOD/IMG_8736_zpsec0a0585.jpg) (http://s285.photobucket.com/user/gstav80/media/NAMCO%20GUN%20AimTrak%20MOD/IMG_8736_zpsec0a0585.jpg.html)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: charlieram on August 03, 2013, 07:43:21 pm
Does your recoil fire realistically? by that I mean does it take the outputs from mame/mame hooker? I am trying this method using the aimtrak recoils with a parallel port output but it just doesnt keep up, any chance you can post a video showing pulse response. ie shots per second please?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on August 04, 2013, 09:56:03 am
I can fire just as fast as I can pull the trigger ;D
And it sure is realistic with a decent snap. Use a 24V powersupply.
This video shows how fast you can shoot, but the sound is a bit thin compared to the real IRL experience.

heres a link to the video
instagram.com/p/chze3VIdMb/embed (http://instagram.com/p/chze3VIdMb/embed)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Runadumb on August 04, 2013, 01:14:06 pm
I love this mod.  Shame its so expensive and not exactly easy. 

I hope someone can put together an easy to follow how to in the future  :cheers:
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on August 07, 2013, 11:46:47 am
Maybe i can do a step-by-step kinda guide. Just followed the recoil kit schematics from andy at ultimarc as this build using his recoil board (so kinda OT hehe).
i just skipped his solenoid and his gun halvs which you buy seperately.

here's another video of me laing a bit of House of the Dead 2 (Sega Naomi)

www.youtube.com/embed/NfTh8OZvhXc (http://www.youtube.com/embed/NfTh8OZvhXc)  :angel:
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Runadumb on August 07, 2013, 12:05:14 pm
 :drool

A step-by-step guide would certainly be helpful, at the very least it would help price everything up.
So I would need a gun from here http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/shooting_parts/time_crisis_gun_assembly/13199.html (http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/shooting_parts/time_crisis_gun_assembly/13199.html)
Andy's recoil kit circuit board
Some kind of powersupply
and... a whole lot of patience and luck?

This is still a pie in the sky option for me and I'm just not sure I could justify the cost but I'm sure plenty of people would appreciate and benefit from a good how-to guide in what went into making this thing work.  If you were willing.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Dr. Willy on September 11, 2013, 11:15:56 am
have to bring back an old thread, but I am starting to do this and have a few questions hopefully someone can answer.

I understand the gun needs 24v and 2a, I mistakenly bought a 24v and 4a laptop power supply is there anything I can wire in to brake down the amprage to 2 amps?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: PL1 on September 11, 2013, 11:38:10 am
Don't worry about it.

The power supply you bought should work just fine.

The amperage rating reflects how many amps it is capable of supplying, not how many will actually be drawn by the devices.

In plumbing terms, you got the right water pressure (24v) and a pipe that can carry 4 gallons (4 amps) in a given time frame for a faucet that puts out a little less than 2 gallons in that time frame when it's wide open -- no problem.


Scott
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Dr. Willy on September 11, 2013, 12:03:25 pm
okay thats great info thanks! i actually bought 2 of them, should i run both guns on one or use one for each gun?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: peteski on January 27, 2014, 05:45:27 am
Hi Guys!

Hey I just found this thread and was contemplating setting something up like this, but some of the steps seem like they might be kinda beyond my knowledge.
Just wondering have many of you had much luck getting it to work? I can understand replacing the built in system with the aim track but the recoil bit is where I'm stuck. What triggers that? Mame? Could you not just set up some kind of simple system that just triggers the solenoid every time you hit the microswitch?

Thanks,
Pete
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on March 03, 2014, 01:42:00 pm
I guess you could set up the trigger to fire the solenoid via a timer chip of some sort (timer 555 chip?) as you want to have the gun solenoid released even while the trigger
is still pulled from your first shot. Thought of taking this road at first, but as aimtracks solenoid mod just works this way it's way easier.
Also, the solenoid only fires when the gun is pointed at the screen  :angel:

I could do a setp-by-step guid. but as the time has passed I no longer remeber exactly how I did.
I do, how ever, have another NAMCO gun who needs a mod so I should really order up a new mod kit from http://ultimarc.com/recoil.html (http://ultimarc.com/recoil.html)

I did't do much more than followed the instructions on his site, document here --> http://ultimarc.com/Recoil_kit.pdf (http://ultimarc.com/Recoil_kit.pdf)

If someone needs it, I made a extremely basic schematic here to "follow"  :)

(http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll47/gstav80/NAMCO%20GUN%20AimTrak%20MOD/my_connection2_zpsd1148832.jpg)
here's the whole album with other pics --> http://s285.photobucket.com/user/gstav80/library/NAMCO%20GUN%20AimTrak%20MOD?sort=6&page=1 (http://s285.photobucket.com/user/gstav80/library/NAMCO%20GUN%20AimTrak%20MOD?sort=6&page=1)

For powersupply I bought a 24V on ebay.

The black button will serve as triggerbutton, so you can link thisswitch to the guns microswitch as I did directly.

!!!PLEASE BE CAREFUL NOT TO PUT 24V ON THE 12V CIRCUITS!!!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on March 03, 2014, 01:42:27 pm
[delete]
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Gamemaster86 on March 04, 2014, 07:12:48 am
Thanks for this a few questions though.

1. Did you have to cut away any of the plastic the get the camera to mount properly?
2. For the trigger microswitch am I correct in saying that you solder trigger wire (red) to pin 1 (from the aimtrak) and then solder to the microswitch. Then the same for the ground wire (white) to pin 5 (of the aimtrak) and then to the microswitch? I ask as when I look at your completed pics I only see 2 single wires going to the microswitch?

3. Does the camera stick out of the end of the gun as it looks like it does?
4. Sorry last question for now. It looks like you haven't fitted the glass lens does this cause any problems?

Thanks for your help
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Gamemaster86 on March 08, 2014, 02:55:09 pm
Ok I decided to just try it and see how it went.

I wired everything up as you've shown but I don't have any recoil. I check all my solder joints and they are good. The weird thing it after checking which wire from my PSU was V+ (brown) and V- (Blue) when I first plugged the power in the aimtrak lost connection to the pc and my screen started to flicker. I then swapped the wires over and everything seemed fine. The trigger works as does the aimtrak just not the recoil. Any help?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Gamemaster86 on March 13, 2014, 10:26:21 am
I'm now stuck and at a point where I don't know what else I can try.

Basically everything is working EXCEPT the recoil. I have wired everything up and the trigger works, even both side buttons work but I get no recoil whatsover. I know the PSU and solenoid are find as I wired them up separate to the recoil board and the solenoid kicks just like it should. I have also tried two different recoil kits and double checked my soldering. Anybody have any advice or help?

TIA
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on April 06, 2014, 10:14:15 am

I'm now stuck and at a point where I don't know what else I can try.

Basically everything is working EXCEPT the recoil. I have wired everything up and the trigger works, even both side buttons work but I get no recoil whatsover. I know the PSU and solenoid are find as I wired them up separate to the recoil board and the solenoid kicks just like it should. I have also tried two different recoil kits and double checked my soldering. Anybody have any advice or help?

TIA

Do you have the proper version of firmware installed into your aimtrak module?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: M4stah on July 12, 2014, 04:44:41 pm
Sorry for reviving a dead thread, but i'm very interested in doing this myself.

If i am correct i will need
An aimtrak OEM kit
an aimtrak recoil kit
A 24V power supply
A namco arcade gun

Whats a good place to buy the arcade gun? I live in the NL
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on July 12, 2014, 11:56:06 pm

Sorry for reviving a dead thread, but i'm very interested in doing this myself.

If i am correct i will need
An aimtrak OEM kit
an aimtrak recoil kit
A 24V power supply
A namco arcade gun

Whats a good place to buy the arcade gun? I live in the NL

Yes you have it.  The Namco gun can be picked up on eBay as they pop up from time to time ... You can get the gun parts from Suzo/HAPP (http://eu.suzohapp.com)... but they are very costly.

To convert the Namco gun, you need to use the solenoid of the gun with the driver circuit of the Aimtrak recoil kit.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: M4stah on August 04, 2014, 03:58:23 pm
Alright, got my namco gun and opened it up. Some small questions:

Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on August 04, 2014, 11:09:18 pm
Ultimarc has a very good PDF on how to...

http://www.ultimarc.com/Recoil_kit.pdf

The PDF covers power supply requirements.  It also shows you where to connect the recoil wire of the recoil PCB to the AimTrak module connector housing.

Because the Namco gun has no extra buttons (like the ones on the side of the AimTrak gun housing) you will have to connect ground directly from the AimTrak module.  see the PDF for location of ground pin.

One terminal of trigger switch will connect to ground and the other connects to "Trigger" on AimTrak module (not the recoil PCB)

Connect the two red wires from the Namco solenoid to S1 and S2 of the recoil PCB.   You don't need the diode that is wired into the Namco solenoid, the recoil board provides that for you.

The only thing you need from the Namco gun is the solenoid, trigger switch and plastics... nothing else.

It's been a while and I'm replying on my phone... so proceed with caution :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: M4stah on August 31, 2014, 03:15:22 pm
Alright, operation succesful. I ordered two kits, one of the MOSFETs was faulty or we broke it, but luckily i had two. If anyone is interested in doing i can help
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Gamemaster86 on September 01, 2014, 08:09:24 am
Alright, operation succesful. I ordered two kits, one of the MOSFETs was faulty or we broke it, but luckily i had two. If anyone is interested in doing i can help

If you could offer some help I'd appreciate it, as I never managed to get this working :-(

An album of pictures would be great, along with a guide if possible. Would really help me out.

TIA
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gamer83 on September 01, 2014, 08:49:41 am
Hey retroactive,great job on this project man,looks great.I have a question about removing the aimtrak camera board.what method did you use to remove the solder from the camera board,solder sucker or wick?or did you use a heatgun?Not sure how much heat the camera can take if I use a heatgun.But the top solder points look really difficult to desolder with wick or a sucker.I will be doing this mod as soon as I find those namco guns for reasonable price.Im running two happ guns with traks in an area 51 mame cab currently.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: RetroACTIVE on September 01, 2014, 09:11:36 am
Solder wick... carefully.  I add a little solder to help it wick if it's stubborn.  I also use very good equipment...  and a clean well tinned tip is key.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: jokerlouis on October 09, 2014, 07:42:29 pm
Does Anyone Sell These Guns Completely modded with Aimtrak????
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on December 27, 2014, 05:25:23 am
I am very interested in having this mod done.

it is my understanding that Retroactive added a button to his namco gun with his personal DIY kit, could the same thing be done again with aimtraks recoil kit?.

Would I be able to take a Namco gun, aimtrak recoil kit along with the PDF and bring it in to an electrical shop and say 'Just followed the recoil kit schematics and use this solenoid instead' or is there more to it than that?

also Epic Fatigue, you mentioned you have both a 'named' gun and 'namco' gun, are they really both similar? no cut backs being made in order to reduce the price by near half!, I only ask because the named version is the only way to get the gun in black like the original arcades, and I may prefer black colour to pink/blue.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 06, 2015, 11:52:36 am
just thought i'd ask for an update on this after 6+ months of silence.

would really like to have one of these, any advice would be very much appreciated.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Lord_onion on March 13, 2015, 05:00:32 pm
Came across this forum and particular post as i was searching for this very conversion.

Im currently throwing my money at the screen in order to obtain one of these converted objects of glory.

If the chap in question is still making these conversions to order il take two as soon as possible.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Victorian on March 13, 2015, 06:03:28 pm
I guess you could set up the trigger to fire the solenoid via a timer chip of some sort (timer 555 chip?) as you want to have the gun solenoid released even while the trigger
is still pulled from your first shot. Thought of taking this road at first, but as aimtracks solenoid mod just works this way it's way easier.
Also, the solenoid only fires when the gun is pointed at the screen  :angel:

I could do a setp-by-step guid. but as the time has passed I no longer remeber exactly how I did.
I do, how ever, have another NAMCO gun who needs a mod so I should really order up a new mod kit from http://ultimarc.com/recoil.html (http://ultimarc.com/recoil.html)

I did't do much more than followed the instructions on his site, document here --> http://ultimarc.com/Recoil_kit.pdf (http://ultimarc.com/Recoil_kit.pdf)

If someone needs it, I made a extremely basic schematic here to "follow"  :)

(http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll47/gstav80/NAMCO%20GUN%20AimTrak%20MOD/my_connection2_zpsd1148832.jpg)
here's the whole album with other pics --> http://s285.photobucket.com/user/gstav80/library/NAMCO%20GUN%20AimTrak%20MOD?sort=6&page=1 (http://s285.photobucket.com/user/gstav80/library/NAMCO%20GUN%20AimTrak%20MOD?sort=6&page=1)

For powersupply I bought a 24V on ebay.

The black button will serve as triggerbutton, so you can link thisswitch to the guns microswitch as I did directly.

!!!PLEASE BE CAREFUL NOT TO PUT 24V ON THE 12V CIRCUITS!!!

Is there any reason the wires from the pcb to the solenoid is that much thicker than the powersupply wires to the pcb?

Awesome posts and guide btw :)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 19, 2015, 12:24:30 pm
yes I would like this as well, shame I don't see anyone else making them, I'd assume there would be quite a demand for them.

andy from ultimarc may be able to make them, people in this thread are using his recoil kit, so I'm sure it wont be too hard for him to do an extra solder job on the side.

let's hope someone comes through with a solution for this.

Once someone starts making them it's likely I will be buying the 'named' gun from the website,

http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/shooting_parts/gun_assembly_for/13629.html (http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/shooting_parts/gun_assembly_for/13629.html)

mainly because I would prefer to have the gun in black like the original japanese arcade, I can only get the official guns in pink/blue.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gamer83 on March 26, 2015, 03:37:35 am
Hey guys,there is cheaper solution to buying the namco gun,if you can get your hands a pelican 'the real arcade' gun for ps1/dreamcast,I say go for it instead of the namco gun,its alot cheaper and almost identical to the namco gun,but has two buttons already built into the shell that can be wired to the aimtrak.perfect for mame use.

I made a video of 1 in action on my machine.Its a crappy video just demonstrating the pelican gun.heres the link. http://youtu.be/cqH79ZiqLkU.you (http://youtu.be/cqH79ZiqLkU.you) will notice in the video the gun recoils when I reload,that is because I used the most basic circuit possible with a simple 5v relay.the only downside is if you hold the trigger the recoil stays on,now thats not a problem unless you play a game like T2,but for that reason I have a switch to turn it off completely so I can hold down the trigger without burning out the solenoid.I used method because I didnt have the right firmware to enable recoil from the aimtrak module,and didnt think I would be able to find it seeing as the ultimarc links are down,but andy sent me the right one after a few emails.

I have two more real arcade guns I will be selling with ultimarc solenoids and  recoil pcb.you need to add your own aimtrak,power supply,and diy skills.one is gray and one is black.they will work like the circuit in this thread,no recoil shooting off screen,and holding the trigger wont keep the solenoid on.The aimtrak solenoids are a great replacement for burntout namco/pelican solenoids.I attached a few pics.

Also for anyone who cant get the ultimarc schematics to work,I can help you setup an easier circuit with the relay I used.I could even offer a service to do all this for you if you send me the guns.I can do either method,aimtrak recoil(mosfet),or 5v relay recoil.the relay will be cheaper.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 26, 2015, 05:46:24 pm
that's a pretty smart idea to stick an aimtrak inside a pelican real arcade gun.

do you have any comparison to the real world namco recoil guns, if so would you say the recoil is similar to that of the pelican

you said 'I have two more real arcade guns I will be selling with ultimarc solenoids and  recoil pcb'

are you saying you are selling the ulimarc solenoid, i thought you would be using the pelican solenoid with ultimarcs recoil PCB.

but what say you about using the real namco gun with aimtrak and ultimarc recoil kit, its not just about the recoil of the gun, but the build qauilty as well, I hear they are built like tanks.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gamer83 on March 26, 2015, 06:46:17 pm
The build quality of the pelican vs namco gun is the same.they are both built like tanks.Some minor changes to the pelican shell to accommodate two buttons and two switches used for the ps1/dreamcast.The original pelican solenoid feels identical to the namco gun,when fed the same 24v current.You wont notice a difference.but the two pelicans that I am modding have bad solenoids,I have two ultimarc solenoid kits that I am using as replacements,the reason I say they are great replacements is because they are alot cheaper than the namco/pelican solenoids,and the aimtrak has a really good recoil effect when,again fed 24v.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Gamemaster86 on March 26, 2015, 07:44:24 pm
Pm'd you gamer83 :-)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 26, 2015, 08:52:09 pm
sounds like a near perfect solution, I also like the camoflage design.

however they are hard to get a hold of, are you saying you would retrofit the pelican gun with an aimtrak for a price.

would you say the recoil adds a lot to the experience, or is it something you turn off after a while and see it as a gimmick.

I realise time crisis had recoil in the arcades, but HOTD didn't so it made me think maybe it wasn't as great a feature.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gamer83 on March 27, 2015, 03:40:56 pm
I could retrofit the aimtrak solenoid inside it or use the original solenoid,wired using the schematic in this thread or using a 5v relay.The camo guns in video have the original solenoids in them.

It does add to the expetience,after using happ guns for a while then switching to these,I must say im happy i did because they are great,but i do sometimes turn it off.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 27, 2015, 05:20:57 pm
hmm, interesting to hear that you turn it off at times.

since those guns are no longer made I will have to focus on trying to get the original namco guns working with aimtrak, but I will keep this in mind and pick one up on eBay UK if it ever turns up, just to at least see what the recoil is like, if I buy this gun could I test the recoil without having a playstation, in other words could i just plug it into the wall and feel the recoil?

also note I am from the UK so buying a US pelican/jolt gun may not be the best option for me.

when you say 'I could retrofit the aimtrak solenoid inside it or use the original solenoid' are you referring to the ultimarc solenoid, as aimtrak never had a solenoid.

i know you said ultimarc solenoid can be as good as namco/pelican, but I ask how can this be when there is not full kick back, the namco solenoids are super expensive to buy in parts and looking with the naked eye the differences between the two they are pretty different in size and power.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on March 27, 2015, 08:04:13 pm
I looked around on ebay for those "real arcade guns" for a while. They are hard to come by, and I never saw them appear even once. I ended up buying a black pair of those "Named" Nacmo knock-offs a few weeks ago, and they finally arrived today. They are actually pretty nice and feel near identical to the official Namco guns. The flex tubing that houses the cables seem a bit lighter though, which I don't mind at all.

I cracked one open to look at the goodies and there is an additional rumble motor in the handle which I was not expecting. It probably takes next to nothing in power,. I will see if I can get some kind of switcher so that I can hook it up to the solenoid circuit. I know zilch about electronics though, so I will be doing a lot of googling beforehand.

(http://oi60.tinypic.com/2ajnf5d.jpg)

Has anyone else de-soldered the camera on the aimtrak? I know the OP did, but I don't think he is around anymore. I want to extend the camera, and it looks like just 6 pins are used even though there are 8 soldering points? ...Is that correct?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 27, 2015, 08:22:01 pm
there are some on eBay however I don't see them on eBay UK.

anyway I was planning to buy a named one as well because i think it looks awesome in black, its either that or get official blue one here, price is about the same as it will be used, if you had to choose, which would you pick?

so they really feel the same as the official namco ones? did you test the recoil yet to see if it's similar, if so that's great news,

odd about the rotating motor, maybe that's engaged when you are using the machine gun in time crisis 2? I always wondered what the guns in time crisis 2 when it comes to the mahcine gun sections, I think crisis zone used a rotating motor so...
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on March 28, 2015, 12:53:59 am
I haven't had a chance to test out the kickback, but the solenoid looks to be about the same size and takes the same amount of power. They are just magnetized coils, so it will probably be near identical. It may be a few days before I will have it powered to test.

I mentioned this a bit in my last post, but the only downside that I can see between these and a Namco is the "Named" on the side. The metal hose seems a bit lighter as well. The hose is attached to a metal mount in the Namco gun, but not in these "Named" guns. I don't mind because a rumble motor is there instead, and I also don't expect people to try and steal the gun off my cab. The only noticeable difference in shape is at the bottom of the handle. The gun's plastics feel the same and has the same brushed look to it. The quality difference is practically insignificant.

I am sure that I could nitpick somewhere if I had a Namco in my other hand. First party hardware will always be better, even if it is marginal. If I could get a pair of used Namco guns for the same price as these, it would be a tough choice. An official gun is very expensive new, as in, 4 times as much as a "Named" gun. If I bought them used, I could probably get my money back if I ever sold them. It wouldn't be a question of quality, it would be a question of brand and market value. Would you rather have a pair of real official Namco guns, or knockoffs? Would you rather have beaten+painted guns, or a perfect pair of newly dyed guns?

I personally would only buy the Namco guns if they were 25% cheaper. The quality of these "Named" guns are so close, that I would rather have them new than have used Namcos. Again, that is my personal preference, based on what used Namco guns usually look like LOL.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 28, 2015, 02:05:44 am
okay I will await your review for when you can test the kickback, it may be that they skimped out a bit on the durability of the solenoid, who knows, there must be something to it given the price difference.

the named thing is an issue depending on the buyer, but you can buy namco slides seperately, even in black, but the main positive is getting the named guns in black, i can't get the namco guns in black, and black is the better colour and it is what they have in japanese arcades.

i think the price difference is about £100

http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/shooting_parts.html (http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/shooting_parts.html)   £170  (includes import tax)
http://www.happmart.com/Pro_Details.aspx?id=264&px=9&sid=71 (http://www.happmart.com/Pro_Details.aspx?id=264&px=9&sid=71)   £270

typical used price for namco gun in good condision is about £120.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on March 28, 2015, 09:46:24 am
Here is an official replacement offered from Suzo-happ. It is somewhere around £600 if you convert it. I am not sure if they carry them on the UK site though.
http://na.suzohapp.com/amusement_products/arcade_game_parts/PB03-03141-00 (http://na.suzohapp.com/amusement_products/arcade_game_parts/PB03-03141-00)

I would be a bit weary of the Happmart stuff, but that is an insane deal if they are official. They carry black "Named" replacement cases, but only offer the Time Crisis 1/2 guns that you had linked. That is just a bit odd to me.

If you are happy with the used Namco guns, then go for it. My choice was more or less about condition. It is rare to find one in decent condition here in the states. Actually, it is rare to find a set at all.

I am having trouble removing the camera from the aimtrak, but as soon as I do then I can put the gun together and test it.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 28, 2015, 10:42:28 am
actually if you are in the UK you can buy them direct from UK, official and brand new for £270 here
http://leisureservices.biz/namco.html (http://leisureservices.biz/namco.html)
I called them up and that was the total price including delivery and VAT.

yes i noticed the replacement cases
http://www.happmart.com/Pro_Details.aspx?id=256&px=1&sid=71 (http://www.happmart.com/Pro_Details.aspx?id=256&px=1&sid=71)
however the price is most certainly wrong, makes me think the site is dodgy or incorrect somehow.

I think it's quite common to spray the guns to make them like in new condition, something to keep in mind in case anyone pixcks up a used one in poor condition, not that I would.

so am I right in saying you plan to put an aimtrak into a NAMED gun, are you planning on using the ultimarc recoil kit to trigger the solenoid?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gamer83 on March 28, 2015, 02:45:42 pm
Heres some pics to use for comparison,the solenoids and brackets all look very similar if not identical.Namco vs named vs pelican.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 28, 2015, 02:58:20 pm
that's soo strange though, the pelican was a 3rd party gun used in the PS1 era for home console market use only, it wasn't priced very high as well.

yet the namco guns are 5x the price and are built for arcades, why would Namco charge 5x the price for the same item that can be made at a significantly cheaper price, why would arcade vendors even buy it from namco.

just mentioning the oddity in the situation, I also agree they look the same, although i can only see the last two jpegs, the first two don't show up on my PC even when I download them locally.

do you think it would be easy to change the pelican gun to allow for a UK power supply, do you also think it would be easy to move one of the buttons down to below the trigger button like the http://www.arcadeguns.com/ (http://www.arcadeguns.com/)  has?

hmmm, seems arcadeguns.com are releasing a new model that will allow for recoil, not much details are been shown but they will allow it to be mains powered.

* New electronics inside the gun will have a Modular Add-On port to easily add new features such as a Force Feedback Module (Recoil and Vibrate).

* New screw terminals options inside gun allows for separate external power input that can be used to add additional power to recoil.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gamer83 on March 28, 2015, 03:13:12 pm
I guess i cant repost pics,they are just two photos already posted,the op's gun ,and the second is tapeworms pic.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on March 29, 2015, 09:05:52 pm
Well, I spent all day and got everything hooked up, but the solenoid recoil only moved maybe 1/8 inch (~3mm). It worked fine hooked directly to the PSU. I was playing around trying to see if the correct power was getting pushed out of the recoil kit, and I killed my aimtrak. I touched the MOSFET pins with my finger on accident, and now my aimtrak heats up when it is plugged into the USB just by itself.

I wish that I had read that the utility defaulted the recoil strength to 0. I did not change that setting, so I am betting that this was the issue. I didn't realize that it was even a setting until I tried to see if the utility could detect my dead aimtrak.

I will hook up my second aimtrak tomorrow to see if that was the issue. If so, then I will go ahead and order up a replacement. Sort of bummed about that.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 30, 2015, 12:52:30 am
sorry to hear, seems a lot of people are going to great effort for recoil, should be worth it though.

I sent an E-mail to arcadeguns asking for more information about their new gun which features recoil, I asked if it would be the same solenoid that is in namco/pelican gun, who knows they may be using the same type of solenoid as it does offer mains power.

it may be that the best option is to wait until they start selling the new gun and pick up that one for recoil.

I wonder if ultimarc will respond to arcadeguns new model with their own a pre-build gun with recoil.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: abkaz on March 30, 2015, 11:01:59 am
I have access to a couple of original time crisis guns and I'm considering adding them to a current build. The namco recoil effect makes such a big difference that we'll leave the guns off the project if we can't get them to work. I really appreciate everyone's information and details about their trials and errors!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 30, 2015, 09:16:41 pm
okay just got back from eric at arcadeguns, hes said this about his solenoid

Our recoil will come in 2 flavors. Our first release is more of a low power force feedback module. It isn't designed for a high powered solenoid and is usb powered. Our second option will use an external power supply and medium sized solenoid. Since our light gun doesn't weigh much, a medium sized solenoid offers more a good amount of force.

so maybe that means the first option is like a rotating motor found in an xbox controller?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on March 31, 2015, 12:14:31 am
I extended the camera off of my second aimtrak and fitted it into the gun. My recoil problem was in-fact the software setting. After cranking it up, everything was great. I put it together before grabbing any pictures though. Sometime later this week I will open it again and take some snapshots. Everything was a really tight fit. The recoil is perfect and I am very happy with the hardware. I guess next would be to get the rumble motor to work, but it will take a bit of research to do that.

However, I am having a lot of trouble calibrating the aimtrak. I have a 36" screen, and I am testing about 6" away. The edges of the screen are barely within range. I don't really want to stand back even further, and any closer puts the IR sensors out of range. I'll test on my 19" screen tomorrow and see if it is better.

Also, TimeCrisis, I noticed that the picture on the arcadeguns website is a solid molding for the half. If that is the gun being offered, then I think the recoil will only be similar to Ultimarc's. You are probably right about the rumble motor option.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 31, 2015, 12:25:34 am
I did ask him if the solenoid would be the same or better than ultimarcs recoil kit, he didn't quite directly answer that but he said the gun is quite light weight and the solenoid provides a strong enough force due to the guns low weight.

also would it really matter if the gun itself slides back and forth when firing, isn't that mostly for looks, as couldn't the same force feedback be done without the gun sliding.

do you feel that the named gun you have is a bit too heavy to hold up after a while, i watched a video review on the pelican and he noted that the gun was very heavy to hold up for extended periods of time.

on screen distance calibration: are you saying you are calibrating 6 inches away from a 36" screen, or 72 inches away from 36" screen?

The closest I can calibrate is 45” away from the screen(this is eye to screen distance), this allows at least 26” between the gun barrel and the IR bar, I do not have my arms crutched up nor full out.

I'd like to sit closer, as currently this means I have to use a 20" 4:3 screen, I would prefer to use a 15" screen but I can't as my viewing distance would be 3x the distance, i'd rather the 2.2x distance of the 20" screen.

TapeWormInYourGut what is the likelyhood of adding a button below the trigger at the same place that arcadeguns has their button (it's where your ring finger naturally rests), I use that as my reload button a lot in games and its the only way I can see myself using a lightgun in my games, i hate the side buttons that were on the guncons as you had to hold the gun with two hands all the time.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 31, 2015, 05:19:38 am
new information regarding the arcadeguns solenoid

All of the guns will have the same modular port to add recoil inside the gun. When we begin selling the recoil addons, we will offer guns either with or without recoil modules pre installed, and the modules themselves for people who want to add it later.

The recoil electronics modules will be the same for all guns which is an electronics board with a processor and vibrating motor attached. That module can either take a usb powered small solenoid (actual solenoid), or an externally powered larger solenoid. The catch is that the larger solenoid will also require a modified gun shell, different cable (instead of the standard usb cable), an external power supply and separate electronics board outside the gun to connect the power supply and usb cable. The cost goes up with the larger solenoid due to all the the extras that are needed as you can imagine.

To begin with, we will only offer the usb powered option because we do not have all of the parts for the larger solenoid yet. We aren't finished with the smaller recoil at the moment, but are getting closer now that we have our new add on port in our new guns.

The modified gun shells for the larger solenoid won't be bigger in size. We are modifying the existing shells to accommodate the larger cable that is needed for the power recoil. It will be the same gun shells with a larger cutout for the thicker cable.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on March 31, 2015, 01:07:24 pm
have you thought on using the EMS LCD topgun and fitting it with an aimtrack, that gun has  a great recoil system, I found it to be pretty powerful and it even has slide kickback, it also uses batteries and I found rechargeable high end batteries to work really well with it.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on March 31, 2015, 06:15:31 pm
The blow-back effect at the top of the guns is aesthetic only, you are right in that respect. I guess that it is about preference. If you just want the feel of the recoil, then an internal recoil is all that is needed. The gun does get a bit heavy due to the large solenoid and mounting bracket, and you are dealing a bit with the gun bouncing a bit from the recoil. A 45 minute game might be a workout on your arm lol. The gun is my guess 1.5 lb with the metal cable hanging. The only place that you can mount a button is within the first inch of the barrel, or on the handle below the trigger (if you take out the rumble motor).

I was 6 feet away from my tv, 72". Sorry, I put the wrong unit mark in my post. I tested it out on a 22" display and it worked perfectly, far better than my TV. I was about 3' away. I played a bit of HotD and it was awesome lol.

I tried to take a video of the recoil with my phone, but the recoil is too quick to capture. I will try to record at a lower resolution, or on a proper camera.

I thought about using the ems topgun, but I definitely wanted something closer to the arcade gun feel.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on March 31, 2015, 06:43:55 pm
Here is an mage of my completed mod. As you can see, you would have to mod out the rumble motor if you wanted to put a small button in there. Frankly, I would sooner add a pedal to my cabinet similar to Time Crisis, except a bit smaller.

I took a thin round peace of plastic and cut a hole in it for the aimtrak's camera to peak through. It is then angled up a bit when I mount it.

(http://oi57.tinypic.com/4t661f.jpg)

Here is a vidya of it. It is louder than it does in the video.
http://youtu.be/1tkL2fzngSA (http://youtu.be/1tkL2fzngSA)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 01, 2015, 01:44:27 am
oh okay great and I see that when you reload off the screen the recoil does not fire?

as far as the button goes, yeah its mostly for reloading, I don't like shooting outside the screen to reload, I'd much rather press a button or move gun outside screen, but not move gun and then shoot outside screen, see the wii version of HOTD 2 where you just move gun outside screen to reload(it apparently does it this way in the arcades),

'It includes an auto-reload feature that allows players to point their guns off-screen to reload their weapons without pulling the trigger' - wikipedia

that is my perfect solution for it, sadly can't be done with all games, and in that case I just use the button.

so what recoil kit are you using, is it ultimarcs, or your own, I'm not referring to the solenoid, just the electronics.

yeah time crisis 3 is 45 minuets LOL, I prefer to sit while playing light gun games, there were a few sit down cabs made, HOTD 2, confidential mission etc. but yeah for long play sessions sit down is a must I find, so that makes the pedal less desirable, the button below the trigger is perfect as your duck button in time crisis.

I'd rather have the blow back effect but it is just that you mentioned previously that because the arcadeguns.com light gun didn't have a blow back effect that is would not be as powerful as the namco recoil, but in fact we can agree that that is not an accurate assessment as the namco gun can have the same solenoid yet have no blow back effect.

when you describe your viewing distance of 36" away, are you refering to eye level, or your gun barrel level, as i said i can't get closer than 45" away from the screen, (this is eye level with my gun NOT held far out with my hands) this is a real issue for me as I can't use a smaller monitor which is what I want, any advice on sitting closer would be appreciated.

I have another thing to add which I think will make a huge difference in replicating the arcade experience.

Is there is any way to control the number of times the solenoid will fire until the reload button is pressed, so in the case of house of the dead 2 you can set it to 6 bullets, that means for the first 6 bullets the solenoid will fire, after that the solenoid will not trigger when you press the trigger button, once you press the reload button it will reset the counter and you will get 6 more solenoid fire shots.

in the case of time crisis you can make it so that when the reload button is held it allows the solenoid to be fired, otherwise the solenoid will not fire, this would be identical to the arcade (the gun does not recoil when in cover)
 
it would be ideal if it could be user configurable on the software level via a similar interface that is used in the ArcadeGunsProUtility program, if it can’t then maybe it can be done at the hardware level, how to make it user configurable would have to be thought out.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: abkaz on April 01, 2015, 06:35:50 pm
Here is an mage of my completed mod. As you can see, you would have to mod out the rumble motor if you wanted to put a small button in there. Frankly, I would sooner add a pedal to my cabinet similar to Time Crisis, except a bit smaller.
That looks great! Thanks for the picture. We're working on a couple pedals for our cab. There are a few Time Crisis pedals on ebay, but the shipping is usually as much as the pedal - or more. A leaf switch, torsion spring, and a couple pieces of metal should do the trick... or maybe a cheap bass drum pedal.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 01, 2015, 06:44:42 pm
I would guess general usb pedals will do the job better than an actual arcade pedal, the arcade pedals are likely built like tanks designed to last years with people with heavy shoes on, not something you would have indoors with people that use socks, I'm guessing it will be too hard to press down on it with socks.

Usually costs about £50 for a time crisis pedal over here,

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NAMCO-TIME-CRISIS-1-or-2-PEDAL-UNIT-USED-WORKING-/160974435239?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item257ad2f3a7 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NAMCO-TIME-CRISIS-1-or-2-PEDAL-UNIT-USED-WORKING-/160974435239?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item257ad2f3a7)

I can only assume you could mod the innards of a usb pedal for pc and put it inside the time crisis pedal.

please note my post here is merely a guess, I don't own the official time crisis pedal, so I would have to give that a go first, which I may do at one point to see how it goes.

TapeWormInYourGut have you thought about trying to get your named/namco gun to work with the guncon3 sensor, that way you could get time crisis 4 working!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: h0tw1r3 on April 02, 2015, 03:41:53 pm
I got really lucky this weekend. Found 2 NOS Joytech Real Arcade guns on amazon (retail box with pedal). $53 shipped.
Came today. Aimtrak modules should be here tomorrow. Will do a work log thing.

http://imgur.com/a/NAtOu#0 (http://imgur.com/a/NAtOu#0)

FYI, I did not buy the ultimarc recoil kit. Will be making my own circuit.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: abkaz on April 02, 2015, 04:13:33 pm
Nice find. How strong is the recoil? It looks like it came with a 12V power supply. Don't the Namcos run off of 24V?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 02, 2015, 04:30:30 pm
still unsure whether to go down the namco or joytech/pelican 'real arcade light gun' route, is there really next to no difference between them? maybe something outside of the recoil, there is a huge price difference between them which makes me wonder.

h0tw1r3 will you be providing details on how to make my own circuit or will you be selling them seperately, along with basic soldering insturctions so I can then add it to a real arcade light gun?

also what do you think of my guncon 3 idea, maybe you can place the sensor beside the aimtrak sensor.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: abkaz on April 02, 2015, 04:58:28 pm
still unsure whether to go down the namco or joytech/pelican 'real arcade light gun' route, is there really next to no difference between them? maybe something outside of the recoil, there is a huge price difference between them which makes me wonder.

I'm curious as well. The only thing that really matters to me is the recoil because the electronics are all going to be AimTrak anyway regardless of whether I start with a namco gun, a Named gun, or a pelican/joytech. So the question is: how much do I want to spend on the recoil? I suspect that the joytech/pelican is weaker since it looks like it only comes with a 12V power supply vs Namco's 24V (and some people have used 36V!). Is the extra recoil strength worth the price premium?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 02, 2015, 05:15:58 pm
well I'm guessing it's more the feel and maybe weight of the gun as well, as it has been said namco charge arcade vendors here in the UK £270 for a new namco gun, I can only guess the pelican/joytech gun sold for about £40 back in its day in 1997 or so, so honestly I don't see how they can both offer something even remotely similar based on price, however there is strong evidence to the contrary.

but good find on the voltage, that's at least one thing, but apparently you can feed the pelican gun a 24v voltage?

To quote gamer83

The build quality of the pelican vs namco gun is the same.they are both built like tanks.Some minor changes to the pelican shell to accommodate two buttons and two switches used for the ps1/dreamcast.The original pelican solenoid feels identical to the namco gun,when fed the same 24v current.You wont notice a difference.but the two pelicans that I am modding have bad solenoids,I have two ultimarc solenoid kits that I am using as replacements,the reason I say they are great replacements is because they are alot cheaper than the namco/pelican solenoids,and the aimtrak has a really good recoil effect when,again fed 24v.

seems by that quote that some pelican guns can have bad solenoids, maybe its the fail rate of the solenoids that makes them cheaper than namco guns.

some close ups of the gun

http://www.blood-is-red.de/mw/index.php/Joytech_Real_Arcade_Light_Gun (http://www.blood-is-red.de/mw/index.php/Joytech_Real_Arcade_Light_Gun)


I'd say my priorities are

recoil - mains powered, strong and preferably with kickback.
feel - gun feels as great as can be, as good as the arcade ones.
looks - gun looks good, either in black or in that grey/black that the real arcade lgiht gun offers, camo also looks cool, don't like and wont accept the pink/blue that non japanenes namco guns offer.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on April 02, 2015, 07:51:02 pm
That looks great! Thanks for the picture. We're working on a couple pedals for our cab. There are a few Time Crisis pedals on ebay, but the shipping is usually as much as the pedal - or more. A leaf switch, torsion spring, and a couple pieces of metal should do the trick... or maybe a cheap bass drum pedal.
Honestly, I think custom is the best way to go. That way you can build a really solid pedal without spending a fortune.

I got really lucky this weekend. Found 2 NOS Joytech Real Arcade guns on amazon (retail box with pedal). $53 shipped.
Came today. Aimtrak modules should be here tomorrow. Will do a work log thing.
Man, that is a nice find and an insane price. I could never find even 1 of those on ebay, let alone 2. Good luck on rolling your own circuit, I honestly had no clue what the OP was talking about so I ended up buying Ultimarc's kit. I am just not tech savy enough. I wish I was though, because I really wanted to hook up the rumble motor to go with the solenoid in my guns.

TimeCrisis, I am not sure what you mean about the guncon 3 sensor. I don't own a ps2/3 if you were referring to those, and the aimtrak should work with any emulator.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 02, 2015, 08:00:28 pm
the guncon 3 is a gun that only works with time crisis 4 on the PS3, my meaning was to put the guts of the guncon 3 into the namco/named/pelican gun so you get recoil and can play time crisis 4 on the PS3 with an awesome gun, you will not be using aimtrak at all, its more about using a recoil gun.

TapeWormInYourGut would you be able to offer a simple guide to using the ultimarc kit on an existing pelican or named gun, some other posters here tried to use the ultimarc kit on an namco gun but they had a really hard time, I don't mind taking the job to a shop as well.

so I take it I buy this item and don't use the solenoid, if so did you ask him if they sell them without the solenoid.
http://www.ultimarc.com/recoil.html (http://www.ultimarc.com/recoil.html)

for the pedals did you not see my link for only £50 you get the real deal!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: h0tw1r3 on April 02, 2015, 10:29:17 pm
h0tw1r3 will you be providing details on how to make my own circuit or will you be selling them seperately, along with basic soldering insturctions so I can then add it to a real arcade light gun?

I will definitely share details on the circuit. Once I'm happy with the recoil performance I'll likely use https://oshpark.com/ to have a "real" board fabricated. If there's interest at that time, I'll have a bunch made. Not looking to make any money so it'll be whatever cost is.

Nice find. How strong is the recoil? It looks like it came with a 12V power supply. Don't the Namcos run off of 24V?

Not sure about the recoil yet. They don't power up without a playstation connected (which I do not have).
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 02, 2015, 10:36:47 pm
okay great, I look forward to buying your board, so would I use that board instead of the ultimarc board, or should I just buy the ultimarc board anyway, not sure which is best.

I can only assume I will need some soldering work to fit your board, It's likely I will be taking this to someone to get done as i don't have the equipment nor skills.

on recoil not working without playstation: that's a shame, I was hoping to buy one and see how well the recoil worked without having to have a playstation.

is there not anyway to test the recoil without the playstation, other than fitting your board of course.

As mentioned previously another poster is using a 24v with the pelican and he says its working identically, I don't know what increasing the voltage requires.

does anyone have any advise on using a UK mains power cord with the named gun, would I not have to switch out some inner parts so it will work with my UK voltages, I can only assume the named gun is setup for US mains power since the price is in USD.

so far my choices are the £50 pelican or the £170 named, hmmm.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 04, 2015, 01:27:22 am
okay seems I'm in luck, someone just listed a real arcade light gun for £31, i checked with him to make sure its a UK 3 pin power lead for the recoil, he said it was so I bought it.

any advice on getting this to work with aimtrak would be much appreciated, I have 2 arcadeguns.com guns so I don't mind taking apart one of them to donate the innards to the real arcade light gun.

woudl also like more information about the voltage, how do I upgrade it to 24v's

time crisis 4 also allows you to plug a second controller to simulate the pedal button,
was thinking on having a guitar hero drum kit with the pedal plugged in as my second controller, then using that pedal as the reload pedal, once tested I was going to take the innards of that pedal and put it in the real time crisis arcade pedal.

but if anyone has any other advice on any mods to make the controller like a pedal that would be helpful, maybe modding some ps3 controller circuit and hooking that up to a pedal, some racing pedal set, or maybe even a standard usb pedal for pc could work.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on April 04, 2015, 08:30:53 am
You are going to need to hook it up similar to the image on page #5 (reply #177). You have to take everything out except the solenoid and replace it with the aimtrak and a recoil board.

If you want 24v, then you will need to get a power supply that outputs 24v at 2 amps. You might be able to find a laptop brick on ebay for cheap.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 04, 2015, 08:41:06 am
okay, and should I buy the ultimarc recoil kit board or buy one from h0tw1r3, I'm still not sure the difference, I don't think I can make one myself.

so would any search on eBay for '24V AC DC 2A psu' produce the correct PSU I should buy.
for example

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/24V-2A-AC-DC-Adapter-Power-Supply-PSU-2-1mm-x-5-5mm-Jack-lead-2000ma-/321512550121?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item4adba42ee9 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/24V-2A-AC-DC-Adapter-Power-Supply-PSU-2-1mm-x-5-5mm-Jack-lead-2000ma-/321512550121?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item4adba42ee9)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on April 04, 2015, 09:47:50 am
Yes, that PSU should work. If you know the power socket size of the arcade gun, then you can get a PSU with the same size plug. Otherwise you might need to do some modifications. That one is 5.5mm x 2.5mm, I don't know the gun's socket takes.

You are going to have to ask h0tw1r3 if you want to use his board, or if he still plans on making+selling a few... It won't matter where you get it, as long as it works.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 04, 2015, 09:57:30 am
okay I will measure the gun socket to make sure it will fit before purchasing.

I'll be sure to purchase the ultimarc recoil board as well then, I may contact him and ask him to not include the solenoid as I will not need it, would you agree?

do you think it would be possible to fit the aimtrak and guncon 3 sensor in the one gun, along with trigger and an assigneable button that works for both aimtrak and guncon 3, so in that case when you shoot the gun its like it is using both aimtrak and guncon 3 at the same time, that way whichever I use it (aimtrak or ps3 ) it will always work with the one I am using.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on April 04, 2015, 10:14:14 am
You won't need the solenoids, so if Andy is willing to sell at a cheaper price without them, then go for it. I would keep the wires and everything else that is in the kit though.

I doubt that there will be room for both the aimtrak and guncon 3 sensor.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 04, 2015, 10:51:01 am
looks like I will end up having to buy 2 real arcade light guns then, its only for time crisis 4 at the moment, but maybe time crisis 5 will be out on ps4 one day and that will likely use guncon 3 technology.

if anyone has time crisis 4 could you set it to run in 480p mode, so that the original aspect ratio is maintained and it shows in 4:3, I want to check that it fills the frame of a 4:3 monitor, even if you can check that it sends 640x480 to the monitor that would be great.

it's just that it may do some wonky 4:3 in a 16:9 frame type thing which would ruin the experince on a true 4:3 monitor.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gamer83 on April 04, 2015, 08:37:49 pm
Nice find hotwire! Welcome to camo club  :cheers:.you wont be disappointed with these guns.timecrisis I made a video of the ultimarc solenoid in action inside a pelican gun,I left one half of the shell off to show you the solenoid inside.that little solenoid is quite impressive.Im feeding it 30v in the vid.if you look closely you can see the little nut fall off for the screw holding the shell half on,Lol,what was it again,righty tighty lefty loosey? :tool:
I also show in the video the camo gun using the circuit from the ultimarc recoil kit.that gun has the original pelican solenoid in it and is using 24v.After a few days of tinkering about,I managed to get the circuit working using the original pcb that comes with the pelican gun eliminating the need for a 2nd pcb inside the gun.I like using the switch on the pelican pcb to cut power to the solenoid if I wish,and it fills the gaps on the shell if you dont use it.Hotwire, please send me the board layout your designing,when your done, I might be interested in using it as i could see it cleaning things up significantly.Ill have a look at that website also,see what I can cook up.

Also,timecrisis for the pedal,if you do end up going the pelican route,there is a small attachment underneath the shell you could easily hook up to any pedal you want.ideally would be if you got the pedal that comes with the pelican like inside hotwires kits.that way,you only have to wire the connection inside the gun to the aimtrak,and just plug the pedal in.ive attached some pics and a vid,let me know what you guys think.   https://youtu.be/b2AwhVBbnv0
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 05, 2015, 06:43:38 am
seems like a company called innovation released a gun identical to the real arcade light gun expect....its in black!

here are some links, seems to be even rarer than the pelican/joytech one.

http://www.goldenshop.com.hk/AI-trad/psx/p_joltgun.htm (http://www.goldenshop.com.hk/AI-trad/psx/p_joltgun.htm)

that's a cool idea using the ultimarc solenoid, do you find it closely resembles the pelican when fed 30v.

you are using the original PCB, does that mean you are not even using the ultimarc recoil pcb, or are you using that as well, does the pelican offer some sort of autofire recoil, if so what is it like, is it fast enough to make you feel like it's a machine gun, I would guess not.

yes I did notice about the pedal, if you attach it it's basically a duplicatation of one of the buttons on the gun, but I'd prefer the wire coming from the pc to pedal, instead of the wire coming from the gun to the pedal, but this may be necessary for time crisis 4, but I belive my guitar hero drumkit thing will work,as I hear pressing any button on the 2nd controller port acts like a duck button.

remember I plan to replace innards and put in official time crisis pedal, we would need to look inside the pelican foot switch and the guitar hero one to see how easy it would be to do that, and also look see if I can actually open up the time crisis pedal.

on USB pedals the INFINITY USB FOOT PEDAL has been the only one that seems large and heavy duty, I think using the smaller ones is less than ideal, but then again the time crisis 5 pedals are quite small so maybe I'm wrong in that regard

the absolute best pedal would likely be the redoctane pedal which isn't made anymore and imposible to find so we can scratch that off the list.

'This incredibly heavy-duty pedal is made of thick metal and is topped with a sheet of industrial diamond plate, just like the pedal in the arcade. The RedOctane Reload Pedal weighs in at over 4 pounds, and has the exact dimensions of the arcade pedal'


I would focus on trying to get the official time crisis pedal, only £50, however the main thing I worry about is condition, most appear to be in not very good condition, I don't think there is anything that can be done to clean it up, I will call up a few places and ask if they stock new time crisis pedals, would really like time crisis 4 pedal as its in silver, i have called up http://leisureservices.biz/namco.html (http://leisureservices.biz/namco.html) and they said they would sell the time crisis pedal new, but I will have to wait until tuesday to find out the price.

does anyone know what Time crisis 2-4 did in the arcade for it's machine gun recoil, was there a recoil system at all, or was it just a rotating motor, any advise would be appreciated, I thought maybe it used the same recoil in crisis zones gun, but after seeing you can only fit one recoil in a gun, im not sure now, im sure crisis zone actually used a recoil based on thir review quote.

'The arcade gun shakes with incredibly cool internal recoil that neatly simulates a real automatic action'

Interestingly, I saw a video of time crisis 5 and there appears to be no blow-back effect on the new guns, apparently this is to save on cost and increase accuracy, according to one video.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: h0tw1r3 on April 05, 2015, 04:25:27 pm
okay I will measure the gun socket to make sure it will fit before purchasing.

I'll be sure to purchase the ultimarc recoil board as well then, I may contact him and ask him to not include the solenoid as I will not need it, would you agree?

do you think it would be possible to fit the aimtrak and guncon 3 sensor in the one gun, along with trigger and an assigneable button that works for both aimtrak and guncon 3, so in that case when you shoot the gun its like it is using both aimtrak and guncon 3 at the same time, that way whichever I use it (aimtrak or ps3 ) it will always work with the one I am using.
I don't think you'll need an aimtrak recoil kit at all. If it's like mine, all the necessary circuitry is included.

I am going to put together a vlog of my progress, but for now I'll just post the uncut video I have so far.  Stay tuned...

Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 05, 2015, 04:35:45 pm
really...wow that's great news, this makes this the best gun option out there, better than even namco/named.

and yeah they are all the same, whether its pelican, joytech or innovation, it's all the same gun, they all say 'real arcade light gun' on the side of the gun, regardless if the product states 'super jolt gun' or not, i think pelican is US, and joytech is UK, not sure on innovation 's origins.

there is one other pedal option by innovations, it MAY be larger than the typical pedals you get with these guns, it may be a decent plug and play solution for the real arcade light gun, in this case you would plug it into the gun.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Innovations-Playstation-1-Guncon-Foot-Pedal-738012202098-/301545781110?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4635877776 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Innovations-Playstation-1-Guncon-Foot-Pedal-738012202098-/301545781110?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4635877776)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PS1-One-PS2-Guncon-Namco-Foot-Pedal-Sony-Playstation-Time-Crisis-2-/181404210438?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a3c889506 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PS1-One-PS2-Guncon-Namco-Foot-Pedal-Sony-Playstation-Time-Crisis-2-/181404210438?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a3c889506)

if it isn't any larger then it's a waste of time, can't figure it out by looking at pictures, my main option is to buy the real namco arcade pedal, however that will need some heavy mod work to work with the gun, will let you know on tuesday how much it will cost new, I can get it in silver, red or black.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: h0tw1r3 on April 05, 2015, 04:56:43 pm
Please keep in mind this is all "uncut" video.  Mostly just babbling :blah: and thinking outloud :dizzy:

FYI, when I say mosfet you say ...  bipolar junction transistor (NPN).


http://youtu.be/QLYd95N1ovQ (http://youtu.be/QLYd95N1ovQ)
http://youtu.be/ZwXvgpiczAo (http://youtu.be/ZwXvgpiczAo)
http://youtu.be/thJaldS4fiE (http://youtu.be/thJaldS4fiE)
http://youtu.be/vsF87Rp7EDs (http://youtu.be/vsF87Rp7EDs)
http://youtu.be/_y6Tv4vkVLo (http://youtu.be/_y6Tv4vkVLo)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 05, 2015, 05:46:38 pm
amazing stuff, and all with the original board as well, this is a fantastic discovery, it makes me wonder why this wasn't mentioned much earlier when this thread was started.

have you thought on making a guncon 3 one, surely you want to play time crisis 4 with recoil, and time crisis 5 when it comes out on ps4 (this is very likely).

but yes I very much look forward to your more detailed guide.

was there any room below the trigger for a button to be placed, at the same area where your ring finger rests? I was a bit worried as I saw a PCB board in that same area where I like my reload button (for use in games like HOTD), I don't like to shoot outside the screen, I prefer button press.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: h0tw1r3 on April 05, 2015, 05:54:12 pm
Haven't considered doing any other guns as I will only be doing PC games/emulation.

Not sure what you mean by "underneath the trigger", but you're right... There's not much room.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 05, 2015, 06:07:01 pm
here is a screenshot of the inside of the guns, hopefully you can tell by looking at them if you can fit it in, dosen't seem too big.

(http://www.arcadeguns.com/images/products/G-500-HKB.jpg)

I love that button, works wonders for reloading in Hotd 1, ghost squad kinda needs an 'action' button as well for rescuing people and disabling bombs, its pretty much the only button placement that works while holding the gun with one hand.

hey check this other gun with blowback, it's for the dreamcast, it's called

cybergun Desert Eagle .50AE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZKBelNcVSo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZKBelNcVSo)

uses 6v, has button below trigger, AND it's in black, looks pretty awesome kinda like the time crisis 5 guns.

it's incredibly rare though, looks like i will be searching 'dreamcast light gun' on ebay every week and waiting for it to show up.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: h0tw1r3 on April 05, 2015, 06:47:10 pm
I see. Probably could make it work, but would be tight.

I actually prefer the one on the side.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 05, 2015, 06:54:32 pm
yeah i noticed that one, but honestly imagine just squessing your hand to reload instead, with the button below the trigger there is absolutely no accidenal presses and you don't have to move your fingers at all.

I will try that other button though, maybe it is a comfortable place for your thumb to rest permanently, I don't know yet my gun arrives in about 7 days.

what do you think of that dreamcast gun, I didn't even know it existed I just found it by accident today, even though it does only 6v, do you think you could feed it something like 24v, is it overall safe to do this?

managed to find one here

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009BY3WXI/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me= (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009BY3WXI/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me=)

looks like they made one for ps1

another gun i found, the hais

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/251902448769?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/251902448769?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)

I am currently researching other guns with blowback capabilities, I take it ones that are battery or USB powered are not strong enough in comparison to mains powered, when I say usb powered I mean it is designed to use the usb port in the ps2, i think that is what a lot of these other blow back guns have.

I think the reason why namco asks for soo much money on there arcade parts is because its like a licenese they have, and they know you are going to make money out of them, so they need to charge 3x the price to make up for that, proof of concept sega charge £250 for their HOTD 2 light gun, which is a very basic gun with no recoil.

oh wait, how cool that sega light gun is actually based of an airsoft gun.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myVMd5y6OHI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myVMd5y6OHI)

have to say the recoil looks pretty awesome there, is there anyway to add an aimtrak to that, after reading a review it said you only get 2 magazines worth per cylindar, maybe we can find some other gun that lets you play a full time crisis game without having to change mags.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on April 06, 2015, 10:53:06 am
That HongKong link you had for the "black Real Arcade Gun" doesn't have a power socket. I am guessing that it just moves the slide with a spring hooked to the trigger. I think that you need to do more research or pay closer attention to the guns you are posting. That HAIS GUNCON doesn't even look like it has moving parts, so it probably doesn't recoil at all. I don't see any mention of recoil on the page either.

Desert Eagles are real guns made by the US/Israel. The toy manufacturers just license the name and design. CO2 guns would be impractical for an aimtrak mod, because they would be very expensive to keep buying CO2 cartridges. There are electric Desert Eagles and other airsoft guns, but airsoft guns are just too small. I cracked open mine and the aimtrak is too big to fit inside the barrel. I would ignore airsoft guns for this reason. The only way you will find one that is big enough, is if you actually buy it and try, and the chances are slim.

I think your options are pretty clear if you want to be safe. Either stick with the real arcade gun, use a namco arcade gun (or generic), or use a gun without moving parts and no blow-back. Anything else, you are pretty much on your own to see what will or won't fit an aimtrak. Everything is a tight fit, so pictures alone might not help if the difference between fitting or not is just a few mm.

The official guns are more expensive due to being a brand item. That is true for nearly any product in every market. We don't know manufacturing costs either. If they were made in Taiwan over China, for example, it will cost more to manufacturer. They might offer different warranties as well. My named gun has a 30 day warranty, but I am guessing that OEMs offer a longer one. I voided it the moment that the gun was opened.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 06, 2015, 11:29:35 am
sorry wrong hais gun, this is the one i meant

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sony-PS-1-PLAY-STATION-ONE-Hais-V-Light-Gun-Pedal-Controller-shooting-SURVIVOR-/271617341250?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f3da7b742 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sony-PS-1-PLAY-STATION-ONE-Hais-V-Light-Gun-Pedal-Controller-shooting-SURVIVOR-/271617341250?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f3da7b742)

It does say Ac powored recoil, but I am checking with the sellers buy asking them questions to see if the guns are mains powered.

is it me, or does that desert eagle recoil seem really weak when he preses the trigger in that video near the start, maybe this can be solved by using more voltage?

on airsoft guns, I take it each canister can only hold a small amount of kickback force, in other words you'd have to reload your catridge every 30 or so bullets, if that's so then that's very impractical.

yes I have chosen the real arcade gun, I just want to keep my options open in case it fails, so I have knowledge on what other ones could do the job.

i contacted the seller of this gun

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Nu-Gen-Assassin-Light-Gun-and-Pedal-for-PlayStation-1-Complete-and-Working-/151640062830?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2047675.l2557&nma=true&si=eyPcRNuBrxycmDkvrrEDURZIYrc%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Nu-Gen-Assassin-Light-Gun-and-Pedal-for-PlayStation-1-Complete-and-Working-/151640062830?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2047675.l2557&nma=true&si=eyPcRNuBrxycmDkvrrEDURZIYrc%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc)

he said the gun is mains powored for recoil, looks pretty small, its only £10 so I don't mind checking it out, maybe its simply a smaller solenoid.

On the Namco gun pricing, well, I'm not sure exactly why its that price, what you say may be partially true, but they charge almost £200 for a time crisis 3 disc drive, those prices are no where near normal.
http://leisureservices.biz/namco.html (http://leisureservices.biz/namco.html)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Gamemaster86 on April 06, 2015, 02:57:58 pm
Great posts hotwire!! I look forward to seeing the completed vids as I'd like to replicate what your doing with your pelican. Can't wait for the next batch! Keep up the great work :-)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Gamemaster86 on April 06, 2015, 02:58:10 pm
Great posts hotwire!! I look forward to seeing the completed vids as I'd like to replicate what your doing with your pelican. Can't wait for the next batch! Keep up the great work :-)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 06, 2015, 03:52:59 pm
just bought another real arcade light gun for £18, the auction title didn't even say real arcade light gun, just 'light gun for playstation', so when searching just try using 'light gun', you will have about 300 searches but its the only way to find this gun.

why buy two? for repairs and in case i screw up this mod somehow.

Overall, I'd say after all my searching, the only gun i see that is mains powered, that would likely hold the same type of solenoid size as the namco ones is the real arcade light gun, the other 5 or so that have recoil are mostly usb powered, or if they are mains it's likely to be a smaller recoil anyway (the desert eagle gun particually seems very weak).

the avenger pro looks to be the same though

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVCy9XGct8A (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVCy9XGct8A)


yeah the time crisis pedals are £375 new from brent electronics, so i think we will be going down the second hand route of £50

another gun, looks good, has recoil and laser, currently resarching whether its mains powered or not, seems very powerful, he shows rapid fire with crisis zone using it, can only assume its on a real ps2 as crisis zone's rapid fire doesn't work on pcsx2 due to fog bug.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pI87V7Wg_g (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pI87V7Wg_g)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 09, 2015, 11:58:47 am
okay gun arrived, its very heavy, especially at the front, sad that I can't test the recoil without a playstation, i will most likely put the button that is behind the gun  (it appears unlabeled) and have it under the trigger instead, then wire the B button where the unlabeled  button was originally.

I will look into these guides and try and get an aimtrak installed into one of them, if someone can make a step-by-step bullet pointed post on the exact thigns to do that would help, will begin openening up the gun soon...

okay I have dismantled the gun, I think the next step would be testing the solenoid, so how exactly do I do that, in otherwosds how do I setup something like what you have in your 5th video, I don't have a separate power supply 5v 'grounded' like you do.

can I just proceed anyway, and what would you suggest is the safest way to remove the playstation av cables on the PCB, there is about 15 of them.

for the 8 pin connector you mentioned, am I to buy the '8 pin and plug' connector set from this auction.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-Pin-Plugs-Chassis-Sockets-Audio-CNC-Aviation-Ham-Radio-CB-A-/121496249774?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&var=420431396091&hash=item1c49bda5ae (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-Pin-Plugs-Chassis-Sockets-Audio-CNC-Aviation-Ham-Radio-CB-A-/121496249774?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&var=420431396091&hash=item1c49bda5ae)

I also take it that the pedal is useless, or could i somehow hook that up to the aimtrak?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: abkaz on April 09, 2015, 06:21:13 pm
I also take it that the pedal is useless, or could i somehow hook that up to the aimtrak?
The pedal is actually very easy to hack/use if it's like the one I got with my real arcade gun. Mine has an RJ11 plug in the back (the same wire/plug that a telephone uses). It only uses the center two wires (again, same as a phone cord). So you should be able to plug a regular phone cord into it. On the other end you can solder the two wires to the Aim Trak pcb inside the gun (it has spots for extra buttons). Or you could even wire it directly your cabinet's control board (iPac, etc...).

I bought a couple of original Time Crisis pedals for my cab, but now I'm thinking the Real Arcade pedal isn't half bad. But it is plastic, so its durability is questionable.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 09, 2015, 06:34:16 pm
yes my one uses the same cord, the biggest issue i had with the pedal is its travel distance is pretty poor, you have to press it down about 80% before it sends its click, and it does feel quite bad.

but what about the time crisis pedals, what are they like, I was maybe thinking on buying them, is the travel distance much shorter, have you opened it up and found it to be easily modable to work as a USB pc pedal.

but yeah the only case I can think of is time crisis 4 with guncon 3 in the case of the 2nd controller port 'trick' not working, as if i wanted to use aimtrak I would just have another pedal plugged in from PC to to the pedal.

also I'm still having trouble trying to figure out if this 24v PSU will fit into the plug or not.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321512550121?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321512550121?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)

I just don't know what parts to measure to make sure the jack will fit, to me it seems that the jack is 4mm in diameter, and 10mm tall, but looking at that listing it just doens't add up.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: abkaz on April 14, 2015, 04:33:12 pm
Here's a picture of the Namco Time Crisis pedal next to the Pelican/Joytech pedal. As you can see, the Namco pedal's travel is very small - maybe a few degrees. It is also 100% metal, so it's far more durable and much less susceptible to sliding or movement. It has L-brackets for easy mounting to a cab if you want it to be totally secure.

It should be very easy to "hack" since I'm fairly certain that it contains a simple NC or NO switch. But I'm not 100% sure on that because the cable has three leads instead of the normal 2 that I was expecting. As you can see from the picture, this pedal needs some refurbishing (stripping, painting, etc...) and it's fairly low priority so I probably won't tear into it for another month or two.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 15, 2015, 11:54:48 am
can you check to see if you can remove the L bracket and just have the pedal on its own, I think that would look smarter on the floor, that is the way the RedOctane reload pedal was as well.

also to re ask is this the correct connector, and am i meant to select 8 pin male and female plug set.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-Pin-Plugs-Chassis-Sockets-Audio-CNC-Aviation-Ham-Radio-CB-A-/121496249774?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&var=420431396091&hash=item1c49bda5ae (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-Pin-Plugs-Chassis-Sockets-Audio-CNC-Aviation-Ham-Radio-CB-A-/121496249774?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&var=420431396091&hash=item1c49bda5ae)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 25, 2015, 04:43:13 pm
I just bought yet another light gun with powered recoil.

http://www.blood-is-red.de/mw/index.php/Game_Source_Virtual_Pistol_PS-612 (http://www.blood-is-red.de/mw/index.php/Game_Source_Virtual_Pistol_PS-612)

I haven't been able to try out the recoil as you need a playstation, but the gun is much lighter than the real arcade light gun and I much prefer the weight,size and the look of the gun, I hope the recoil is decent enough, it is mains powered after all, the pedal that came with it is way better than the real arcade light gun, as the travel distance is much smaller.


also if anyone has a more complete guide on how to mod my real arcade light guns to work with aimtrak, please post and also if you can answer my questions from before that would be much appreciated.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: delt31 on April 25, 2015, 07:11:39 pm
PM me if anyone is interested in building a gun like the one in the first post for me and I will paypal.  thanks.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 25, 2015, 07:27:56 pm
there is no point in buying a real namco gun from an arcade machine, if you buy 'the real arcade gun' which was sold for Playstaion 1, you have a near identical gun and it also includes all the wiring you need to get it working with aimtrack, see the build videos above for more information.

In addition, it is in a much better, more color than blue/pink.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on April 25, 2015, 08:41:13 pm
Some people want blue and pink, the steel cable and all that. Some people also want the Namco brand on their gun as well. I wouldn't say that there is no point just because there are alternatives that you prefer.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 25, 2015, 09:00:26 pm
well what i mean is they are both identical guns, only difference is that the shell is different.

i guess in that respect both are as good as each other, but given the price difference there isn't much comparison, in addition the real arcade gun has the wiring to allow a conversion, the namco one doens't, also the real arcade gun has some holes already in place for buttons, and the buttons are also in place, it also has the option for a pedal to come from the gun already in place.

trying to find a good condition namco gun used is also quite hard, most have been abused in arcades for years.

with that being said someone is selling 2 namco guns and 2 pedals on ebay UK for £120 to you can pick up a bargain there.

I got a real arcade gun for about £20 so i see no point, but i was also thinking on that auction as i wanted to check the differences between the namco and the real arcade for myself.

also keep in mind the original intended colour is black, they are black in japanese arcade mahines, they only changed the colours because they were forced to by law, holding a black gun feels cool, why would anyone want a blue one, it screams 'toy' when using it.


anyway here is a comparison in size of the real arcade gun and the new gun I just got, I really like the new guns size and weight, I also think it's the best looking light gun I have seen, mostly because its all black with no obvious 'gamey' buttons on it.

let's hope the recoil is decent.
(http://s12.postimg.org/4tkscti3h/gun_compairons.jpg)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: abkaz on April 27, 2015, 01:17:52 pm
Have you popped open the new gun yet? It doesn't look like there's very much room inside for the AimTrak board / sensor and a separate board for the solenoid.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on April 27, 2015, 07:25:54 pm
I havent yet, to be honest I'd prefer to find some way to test the solenoid in the gun first before taking it apart due to fear of breaking the gun somehow, since no one is advising me on how to test the solenoid of the real arcade lgiht gun I may be forced to buy a playstation just to see how well the solenoid works between these two guns so I can then make a judement call and continue from there, do you have to hook up a playstation to a CRT tv in order to test the recoil?

if the recoil on this gun is half way decent I will rather use this gun, its significantly lighter and smaller, I much prefer it to the namco gun design.

do you know if it is easy to mod a gun that uses USB power to then use mains power, to make the recoil a little better, there are a few more light guns I'd like to try, but they are all USB powered, but they may be the answer to the better gun for myself.

More importantly, I've ordered a wide angled lens for an iphone so I can move in closer.

Hopefully with this I can use a 15" instead of a 20" 4:3 screen, as they are my only 4:3 monitor size options.

Update: okay tried to open it, seems there are no screws to open it up at all, the screws on the side of the gun are just for a piece of plastic, seems there is no way to get into the gun, shame as it seems like a great gun.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on May 05, 2015, 09:17:26 am
good news, seems that wide angle lens allowed me to calibrate much closer in, so should be able to stick with a 15" 4:3 monitor, this is big news as the 20" 4:3 monitors weigh a lot and are horribly large.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Toasty833 on May 08, 2015, 09:30:53 am
there is no point in buying a real namco gun from an arcade machine, if you buy 'the real arcade gun' which was sold for Playstaion 1, you have a near identical gun and it also includes all the wiring you need to get it working with aimtrack, see the build videos above for more information.

In addition, it is in a much better, more color than blue/pink.

Had to make an account just to reply to this, the "real arcade gun" is really shoddy. Mine makes a ton of noise whenever you move it around, I think it's either the ball bearings or some parts of the solonoid spring that shake for no reason. The plastic is of a far lower quality, the top sight doesn't even have a slot cut in it. The weighting is extremely top heavy because of the lack of mounting bracket, making it feel absolutely awful if you tilt it even a few degrees to either side.

The solonoid is poor quality, and rated for 12V, half of the real thing. Because they tried copying the design of the Namco gun, this means it's way too weak to move the slide fast enough for enjoyable recoil.

The trigger is a microswitch, which is a very nice addition in a home gun, but the Namco gun uses a roller to provide much smoother action. This leaves you with a very awkward detectable hump in the real arcade gun because it just uses a lever, and the switch is also much louder.

If you have the money, a Namco gun is head and shoulders over everything else. Mine was only 50 quid. If you don't have the money, I'd recommend the original GunCon. It feels stunning in the hand, has a couple of buttons, and I think there are ways to screw in an Aimtrak recoil kit. It's not going to be as fun as having the moving slide, but I'd take a more comfortable hand placement and far less shoddy build quality over that.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on May 08, 2015, 04:40:31 pm
there is no point in buying a real namco gun from an arcade machine, if you buy 'the real arcade gun' which was sold for Playstaion 1, you have a near identical gun and it also includes all the wiring you need to get it working with aimtrack, see the build videos above for more information.

In addition, it is in a much better, more color than blue/pink.

Had to make an account just to reply to this, the "real arcade gun" is really shoddy. Mine makes a ton of noise whenever you move it around, I think it's either the ball bearings or some parts of the solonoid spring that shake for no reason. The plastic is of a far lower quality, the top sight doesn't even have a slot cut in it. The weighting is extremely top heavy because of the lack of mounting bracket, making it feel absolutely awful if you tilt it even a few degrees to either side.

The solonoid is poor quality, and rated for 12V, half of the real thing. Because they tried copying the design of the Namco gun, this means it's way too weak to move the slide fast enough for enjoyable recoil.

The trigger is a microswitch, which is a very nice addition in a home gun, but the Namco gun uses a roller to provide much smoother action. This leaves you with a very awkward detectable hump in the real arcade gun because it just uses a lever, and the switch is also much louder.

If you have the money, a Namco gun is head and shoulders over everything else. Mine was only 50 quid. If you don't have the money, I'd recommend the original GunCon. It feels stunning in the hand, has a couple of buttons, and I think there are ways to screw in an Aimtrak recoil kit. It's not going to be as fun as having the moving slide, but I'd take a more comfortable hand placement and far less shoddy build quality over that.


Owning both, original Namco and "the real arcade gun" I can double what Toasty said. The difference is quite big in weight and quality. They DO NOT feel the same. The Namco feels like a tank in comparison. Same goes for the recoil, it's a joke on the "real arcade gun"... in comparison at least.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gamer83 on May 08, 2015, 06:58:12 pm
I have to disagree with the above comments about,the real arcade guns recoil,Ive used the namco and real arcade gun side by side,and when they are both being fed 24v,yes the kickback does feel the same.of course it will feel weaker with a 12v supply compared to the namco 24v.I feed the RAG 24v steady with no heat issues at all.not sure whats going in your gun with the solenoid mounting brackets toasty,but the real arcade guns do have the same mounting brackets as the namco guns for the solenoid.mine dont shake around inside the gun shell when you tilt it.As for the shells,the namco guns are made of a harder plastic,meant to be beat around a commercial environment,the real arcade guns plastic is a lighter less dense plastic,for home use,dont beat the sh*t out of them,and they will be fine.theres no doubt the namco guns are built like tanks,the RAG is still a well built gun also,better than EMS guns and alot of others.I opted for the real arcade gun for 2 reasons,one is the price.cant go wrong for a blowback gun,and two is the fact they already have 2 nice buttons integrated into the shell,making them perfect for a mame cab without pedals.The RAGs are a good choice if your running a mame setup,I wouldnt reccomend using them as replacement for dedicated cabs.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on May 09, 2015, 09:48:11 am
Is the weight between the two much different, the RAG for me weighs a lot and is out weighted at the front, but I was under the impression the namco gun was the same.

yeah the top sight has no cut, i thought that was weird, also my gun makes no noise when I move it.

I don't know about the microswitch thing, would that make a difference gamer83?

I can't even test the recoil since there has been no updated guide to help me build one.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on May 09, 2015, 11:29:51 am
Is the weight between the two much different, the RAG for me weighs a lot and is out weighted at the front, but I was under the impression the namco gun was the same.

yeah the top sight has no cut, i thought that was weird, also my gun makes no noise when I move it.

I don't know about the microswitch thing, would that make a difference gamer83?

I can't even test the recoil since there has been no updated guide to help me build one.

You have a better rebound for very fast shooting in games like Point Blank and much higher durability. 
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on May 09, 2015, 11:51:40 am
but most of the weight is in the solenoid, so can I assume the Namco gun is heavier all round to balance out the weight.

tbh I don't like the weight and size of these guns, but I am yet to experience the recoil so I can't fully judge, I love the size/weight of the smaller black gun I got, but I can only assume the recoil will be bad given its size and weight.

arcadeguns.com are now selling their new gun which will support recoil with a module bought later.

http://www.arcadeguns.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=48_49&products_id=278&zenid=mata34n4vltglej64abvibu3r5 (http://www.arcadeguns.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=48_49&products_id=278&zenid=mata34n4vltglej64abvibu3r5)

not sure what people think of that, but I love the weight/size of these guns.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on May 09, 2015, 11:54:30 am
but most of the weight is in the solenoid, so can I assume the Namco gun is heavier all round to balance out the weight.

tbh I don't like the weight and size of these guns, but I am yet to experience the recoil so I can't fully judge, I love the size/weight of the smaller black gun I got, but I can only assume the recoil will be bad given its size and weight.

Namco guns are heavy after a while. Not denying that. Especially because mine have the metal "cable" (sorry, forgot the correct term). You do feel like a badass though. :D
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on May 09, 2015, 12:07:39 pm
yeah okay but do they weigh more than the RAG, you said the RAG was very different in weight, another poster said the RAG was top heavy on weight, but I don't see how the namco could be any different, because as i said most of the weight is at the top due to the solenoid.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on May 09, 2015, 04:59:47 pm
The Namco gun has metal parts like the hose - so it's not as top heavy... if I understand what you mean.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on May 09, 2015, 10:02:47 pm
Well, no, if you hold the gun without trying to balance it, does it not tilt forward due to weight.

that's what the RAG does, but that's due to solenoid.

I'd probably get the named gun anyway beccause I want black, I don't know if it ihas a roller or a microswitch.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Endprodukt on May 10, 2015, 03:47:41 am
The Namco gun will not tilt forward.

Havn't seen the "named" gun in black. Happmart has them in pink and blue.

Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on May 10, 2015, 05:37:02 am
If you look further back in the thread you can see pictures of it.

here is the link

http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/shooting_parts/gun_assembly_for/13629.html (http://www.arcadespareparts.com/arcade_parts/shooting_parts/gun_assembly_for/13629.html)

I really don't like the pink/blue colour scheme so it's more likely id' get the one in black.

if anyone wants to offer a service to convert a namco gun into an aimtrak one please let me know.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: abkaz on May 10, 2015, 10:11:45 am
The only way to get a 100% true Time Crisis experience is by purchasing the actual Namco arcade guns. Unfortunately, they are either very expensive (new) or hard to come by (used). The real arcade guns (RAG) can be hard to find too, but they're typically under $40. Usually when I see a used Namco gun it is 2 - 4 times that much.

I think you can get pretty close to the same experience with the RAG.
So I think the RAG is a very good alternative to the Namco gun. As with all arcade builds, original parts aren't always a viable option.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on May 14, 2015, 07:19:17 pm
don't forget with the RAG you have the ability to use the existing board to drive the aimtrak with the recoil.

if only someone could develop a full guide with that, we'd have the perfect out of the box solution for arcade style recoil.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: h0tw1r3 on May 17, 2015, 04:13:51 pm
Sorry for not replying sooner, been distracted with too many projects.

So I had problems with using the built-in recoil circuit. It needs to be isolated from the aimtrak usb.

I ordered a bunch of different opto-couplers and got sidetracked. :(

I bought a couple of these TinkerKit mosfet relays for cheap from an MCM sale.
Normally they are a bit expensive for what they really are, but still much cheaper than ordering the recoil kit from Ultimarc (unless he starts selling just the circuit).

(http://static.rapidonline.com/catalogueimages/Product/S73-4680P01WL.jpg)

On the left connector, the pins (top to bottom) +5v, pulse signal, Gnd. 5v and gnd come from the usb which you can either splice up a usb cable, or just solder to the pads on the aimtrak module.
On the right connector, (I desoldered the connector). pins (top to bottom) Power GND, Power +V (up to 24), Solenoid +, Solenoid -.

I benched it a week ago. Worked great. Nice a powerful.

Will post final product when (if) I ever get around to finishing it.  Right now I'm trying to get a CRT light gun (usb2gun) system up and running.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on May 17, 2015, 07:02:04 pm
wow that's great news.

but isn't the gun part of it now finished?

and If you could write up a full tutorial in layman's terms that would be very much appreciated.

I really want to get my gun built it's just been sitting there for weeks now, i even bought 2 of them just in case i screw up the first one.

I think you should look into the other smaller gun that i bought, it is mains powered recoil and the gun feels way better than the RAG as its much lighter and such like.

sadly i can't test the recoil, it may be decent though, who knows, can i just buy a playstaion 1 to test the guns recoil or do i need to find a crt tv and a gun game to try out the recoil.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gamer83 on May 17, 2015, 10:51:21 pm
What sort of issues did you have while using the rag board hotwire?i got one up and running using idea it works fine.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on May 18, 2015, 04:26:52 am
if you can help that would be great.

-) Buying the 8 pin

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GX16-2-Pin-to-9-Pin-Plugs-Chassis-Sockets-Audio-CNC-Aviation-Ham-Radio-CB-/121517646759?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&var=420454692703&hash=item1c4b0423a7 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GX16-2-Pin-to-9-Pin-Plugs-Chassis-Sockets-Audio-CNC-Aviation-Ham-Radio-CB-/121517646759?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&var=420454692703&hash=item1c4b0423a7)

is this the item i should be buying, along with '8 pin plug and socket set' selected.

-)  remove wires

I don't know how to safe remove the Video wires from the PCB, is there some basic tips you can give me, can I simply use tweezers? I also noticed you removed the pedal port, is that necessary in order to make this mod work, normally i think it wouldn't matter, but if it didn't then I wonder why you removed it.

http://i.imgur.com/O34JgnG.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/O34JgnG.jpg)

-) black wires

the 3 black wires that are attached to the bottom of the pcb, were they attached via soldering, and what exact wires am i meant to use for that part, the camera only showed it for a split second, you did mention the word 'jumper' though.

http://i.imgur.com/YghrvR2.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/YghrvR2.jpg)


-) 5v power supply for testing.

I don't have that 'seperate power supply 5v grounded' machine you do to test the solenoid, is there some other way to test the solenoid, i take it i can skip that?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on May 23, 2015, 01:24:14 pm
lol what's with the radio silence.

Honestly, if these questions get answered, I will be up and running with arcade level recoil.

Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: graan on September 08, 2015, 09:37:19 am
Is it possible to make these guns wireless? How would one go about doing so?  I have an aimtrack and real arcade gun on the way, so I will be tinkering with it in a few days.

hotwire: Do you have circuit boards for this project?

kind regards, graan
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on November 11, 2015, 01:53:07 am
news just in...arcadeguns.com will be selling it's recoil kit in the next few months.

a picture has just been put up.

http://www.arcadeguns.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=322 (http://www.arcadeguns.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=322)

would you say it is on the same level as the ultimarc recoil kit, do you think it could compete with the namco or real arcade gun's recoil?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: mattfl on March 17, 2016, 11:56:43 am
Sorry for not replying sooner, been distracted with too many projects.

So I had problems with using the built-in recoil circuit. It needs to be isolated from the aimtrak usb.

I ordered a bunch of different opto-couplers and got sidetracked. :(

I bought a couple of these TinkerKit mosfet relays for cheap from an MCM sale.
Normally they are a bit expensive for what they really are, but still much cheaper than ordering the recoil kit from Ultimarc (unless he starts selling just the circuit).

(http://static.rapidonline.com/catalogueimages/Product/S73-4680P01WL.jpg)

On the left connector, the pins (top to bottom) +5v, pulse signal, Gnd. 5v and gnd come from the usb which you can either splice up a usb cable, or just solder to the pads on the aimtrak module.
On the right connector, (I desoldered the connector). pins (top to bottom) Power GND, Power +V (up to 24), Solenoid +, Solenoid -.

I benched it a week ago. Worked great. Nice a powerful.

Will post final product when (if) I ever get around to finishing it.  Right now I'm trying to get a CRT light gun (usb2gun) system up and running.

Sorry to bring up an almost dead topic, but how did this work out? I'm considering picking up one of the RAG guns and wiring it up.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Az on May 29, 2016, 05:57:59 am
Well, I spent all day and got everything hooked up, but the solenoid recoil only moved maybe 1/8 inch (~3mm).

Sorry to bump such an old thread, but I'm pulling my hair out here and was hoping someone would be gracious enough to help me out.

I purchased an Aimtrak gun with recoil to use primarily as a Guncon 2 on a PS2 I have in an arcade cab due to me removing the CRT and putting a LCD monitor in it. I bought one of those prepackaged guns in the Guncon 1 shells sold by Ultimark that already has everything setup and ready to go, including the recoil kit. My plan was to transfer the guts over to a Real Arcade Gun/Jolt Gun, like others had mentioned in this thread.

When the gun first arrived I tested it out on my PS2 using the 24v power adapter that the Real Arcade Gun uses. The solenoid in the Aimtrak gun worked fine, got a nice thump as expected and everything worked good with the PS2 setup as a Guncon 2.

Transferred the Aimtrak internals over tonight to my Real Arcade Gun. The only changes at all I did to the setup (besides some wire splicing) was using the original RAG solenoid and doing away with the small PCB used for A and B buttons by running wires directly to the buttons on the RAG.

Got everything together and everything works except for the recoil. It just barely moves. It recoils when it's supposed to where it only recoils if you shoot onscreen (not offscreen) but it's just a tiny bit, barely enough to even move. I know you can adjust the recoil in software, but I've never even hooked this to a PC at any time, and prior to transferring the internals over the recoil with the original Aimtrak solenoid worked fine. I wouldn't think that would be the issue.....

I checked the voltage on my PSU and I'm getting 24v at the connector and also at the +/- terminals on the little recoil Aimtrak PCB. I tried to get a reading on the S1 & S2 connection where the voltage goes out to the solenoid, but I'm barely even getting 1 volt. When pulling the trigger with the gun aimed off screen I get 0 (as expected) but I get around .3 volt when it does activate. Granted I'm twisted like an octopus trying to aim the gun and hold the multimeter tips, plus I don't exactly have the fanciest meter in the world, but it's obviously not getting anywhere near the 24v it should.

Any ideas at all are appreciated!

Edit...

Looks like the recoil setting was my problem. Apparently pulling all the connections from the board reset everything to default, including the recoil to 0. After hooking to a PC and running the Aimtrak utility to change the recoil value everything seems to work alright.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on May 29, 2016, 07:57:18 pm
Yeah, the recoil was set all the way down by default, or at least on my 3 aimtraks it was. Glad you got it sorted. I didn't see this sooner to reply.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Fydo on June 19, 2016, 02:42:13 pm
Hi guys, I'm just in the early planning stages of my cab and had a quick question for anyone more knowledgeable about lightguns than me.

I saw these on happmart, and they appear to be just the plastic shells of the Namco (or Named) lightguns: http://www.happmart.com/Pro_Details.aspx?id=256&px=1&sid=71 (http://www.happmart.com/Pro_Details.aspx?id=256&px=1&sid=71)

I'm just wondering if it would be possible to transplant the Aimtrak internals into these shells with minimal modification. Thanks in advance!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on June 20, 2016, 12:20:45 pm
I wanted to do the same thing and had asked about getting 4 of them. Final price was like $150 or something crazy like that for a $48 item. Shipping was twice the cost of the actual shells, and I think it was going to take 2-3 weeks to get it to me.

In any case, it isn't worth it. You won't have the mounting hardware that slides the top and holds the solenoid. You'd have to fabricate that and get it to fit into the shells. Then you'd have to get a hose for the gun, and build something to mount the hose on the inside so that it doesn't yank out when you pull on it. If you have skills doing that then go for it, you'll save maybe $100 after shipping costs and buying material to do it yourself.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Fydo on June 24, 2016, 02:49:26 pm
Yikes, that's pretty scary pricing for the shipping.  :timebomb:

Thanks for the heads up and the info. I think I'll just keep an eye out for a "The Real Arcade" gun.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on June 24, 2016, 03:44:40 pm
I was able to get my hands on (2) all black super jolt / the real arcade guns with foot pedal. I figured out how to power the original gun controller board via the AimTrak so that in theory I did not have to use the AimTrak recoil board. After some testing, everything worked just fine - even the foot pedal. The only problem I have now is that the foot pedal is mapped to P2 on the AimTrak board & I cannot figure out how to use it in MAME but the PC does recognize the press when I press it. I guess the only downside to this is since the AimTrak is not controlling the recoil, anytime you press the trigger it recoils - even on off screen shots (to my understanding, if you have the AimTrak recoil board, it will not fire when off screen). With that said, I do not know if the AimTrak recoil has auto-fire but this original gun board does ;D

Here is a quick video of it working:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFCVvIDXm-w (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFCVvIDXm-w)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: argonlefou on June 24, 2016, 04:10:30 pm
I guess the only downside to this is since the AimTrak is not controlling the recoil, anytime you press the trigger it recoils - even on off screen shots (to my understanding, if you have the AimTrak recoil board, it will not fire when off screen). With that said, I do not know if the AimTrak recoil has auto-fire but this original gun board does ;D

It's not just the because of the recoil board that the aimtrak will not make the recoil work when shooting off screen, it's the aimtrak itself which is generating the signal pulse
I have myself 2 JoltGuns too, and I kept their original recoil board. I just soldered the aimtrak recoil wire where it need to be in order to activate the original control board (just a little bit of soldering and 2-3 cuts on the PCB were enough) instead of the original trigger.

Those guns rock, cheap, heavy and very fun to play with  ;D
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on June 24, 2016, 04:15:05 pm
I guess the only downside to this is since the AimTrak is not controlling the recoil, anytime you press the trigger it recoils - even on off screen shots (to my understanding, if you have the AimTrak recoil board, it will not fire when off screen). With that said, I do not know if the AimTrak recoil has auto-fire but this original gun board does ;D

It's not just the because of the recoil board that the aimtrak will not make the recoil work when shooting off screen, it's the aimtrak itself which is generating the signal pulse
I have myself 2 JoltGuns too, and I kept their original recoil board. I just soldered the aimtrak recoil wire where it need to be in order to activate the original control board (just a little bit of soldering and 2-3 cuts on the PCB were enough) instead of the original trigger.

Those guns rock, cheap, heavy and very fun to play with  ;D

Could you point me where to solder the recoil wire & cut on the PCB? I had no clue what the recoil wire actually did so I left it alone.

Edit: Since you soldered in the AimTrak recoil wire, do you still have the auto-fire working? Or did it bypass that PCB entirely?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: argonlefou on June 24, 2016, 05:19:50 pm

Could you point me where to solder the recoil wire & cut on the PCB? I had no clue what the recoil wire actually did so I left it alone.

Edit: Since you soldered in the AimTrak recoil wire, do you still have the auto-fire working? Or did it bypass that PCB entirely?

I have no more autofire, I'm just having recoil when the aimtrak want's me too.
Well, and when I want too, I rewired the Joytech NORMAL/GUNCON switch to ON/OFF my recoil (I have to play silently sometimes  ;D)

As for the control board, it's a bit old for me to remember excatly what's the minimum to do for it. As I say I hacked many things in the PCB
I think I started by cutting and unsoldering every wires comming to the PCB : (attachment 02.JPG)

Then I removed the big circuit on the top (red square with a cross) and the pin to control the bottom-recoil-circuit is marked with the red arrow.
(attachment 03.JPG)

Every other hacks I made, I think it's for other purposes

By the way, back in the days I found everything I needed here in this thread, 2 pages ahead : http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,119610.msg1505433.html#msg1505433 (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,119610.msg1505433.html#msg1505433)
Nice videos, and pictures !
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on June 24, 2016, 06:38:47 pm

Could you point me where to solder the recoil wire & cut on the PCB? I had no clue what the recoil wire actually did so I left it alone.

Edit: Since you soldered in the AimTrak recoil wire, do you still have the auto-fire working? Or did it bypass that PCB entirely?

I have no more autofire, I'm just having recoil when the aimtrak want's me too.
Well, and when I want too, I rewired the Joytech NORMAL/GUNCON switch to ON/OFF my recoil (I have to play silently sometimes  ;D)

As for the control board, it's a bit old for me to remember excatly what's the minimum to do for it. As I say I hacked many things in the PCB
I think I started by cutting and unsoldering every wires comming to the PCB : (attachment 02.JPG)

Then I removed the big circuit on the top (red square with a cross) and the pin to control the bottom-recoil-circuit is marked with the red arrow.
(attachment 03.JPG)

Every other hacks I made, I think it's for other purposes

By the way, back in the days I found everything I needed here in this thread, 2 pages ahead : http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,119610.msg1505433.html#msg1505433 (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,119610.msg1505433.html#msg1505433)
Nice videos, and pictures !

Thanks for the help. I was able to solder the recoil wire to that bottom pin in the picture and it seemed to work fine (recoil when on screen and no recoil when off screen) except for when I put the gun in auto-fire mode - it acted as if it was still in normal (single recoil) mode when the trigger was held. I think I will try to somehow use the recoil wire when the gun is in normal mode and then disconnect the wire connection when put in auto fire mode. I think the problem has to possibly do with the AimTrak not having any auto fire feature? Anyways, thanks again.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on July 03, 2016, 02:38:16 pm
I've never seen an all black real arcade gun, i have the grey ones atm.

SlyBlueFox could you make a step by step guide with pictures on how to power the whole thing with aimtrack and real arcade gun, im still suck as i mentioned earilier in the thread.

realarcardeguns are close to making their recoil gun

http://www.arcadeguns.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=322&zenid=4g54tfejkqtkm4ksnvm8m9q5v1 (http://www.arcadeguns.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=322&zenid=4g54tfejkqtkm4ksnvm8m9q5v1)

would like to know what people think of the solenoid in that one, time crisis 5 appears to not have a blowback solonoid solution as well, maybe its just easier.

SlyBlueFox what do you think of the recoil, is it worth it, does it make the experience better, i think you need to use a more powerful power supply to make it more like the arcade.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: argonlefou on July 05, 2016, 03:26:29 am
I've never seen an all black real arcade gun, i have the grey ones atm.

SlyBlueFox could you make a step by step guide with pictures on how to power the whole thing with aimtrack and real arcade gun, im still suck as i mentioned earilier in the thread.
Where are you stuck exactly ? I took some picture when I installed my aimtrak, maybe it can be helpfull


SlyBlueFox what do you think of the recoil, is it worth it, does it make the experience better, i think you need to use a more powerful power supply to make it more like the arcade.
Yeah the original power supply for the recoil is not powerfull enough to have the same effects as a real Time Crisis arcade recoil.
I used an old laptop power supply (20V) to boost (mostly because it was plug and play with the gun power cable) it and it's really similar now in terms of recoil
As for a better experience, I guess it depends...some people don"t like recoil at all, some like it
 
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on July 08, 2016, 12:57:51 pm
I agree with argonlefou about the original power supply & the experience in general. The original power supply recoil is fine to me - its not bad but could be better. In general, I think that recoil is cool & makes for a "neater" experience. Now on to the guide.



There are a few options you can do for the gun assuming it is brand new & have not removed the chip yet in the gun as was the case previoulsy in this thread. If you have removed the chip, Option #2 is pretty much the same thing.

Option #1
Do not utilize the AimTrak recoil wire & use the RealArcade gun as is. You will retain the normal single fire option & be able to turn on the autofire as well. When you shoot off screen, the gun will recoil.

Option #2
Utilize the AimTrak recoil wire & use the RealArcade gun as is. You will retain the normal single fire option & the autofire will no longer work when switched on. When you shoot off screen, the gun will not recoil.

Option #3
Utilize the AimTrak recoil wire via switch & use the RealArcade gun as is. You will retain the normal single fire option & the autofire will work when switched on but only when the AimTrak recoil wire is disconnected. When you shoot off screen, the gun will not recoil only when AimTrak recoil wire is connected.



For all options, here are the steps I used (you can either directly solder to the switch mentioned or t-tap to the switch wire). All extra wire I used came from inside the old PS1 cord that was cut off. Gun needs to be in NorGun mode to function correctly. Disclaimer, you will most likely need to do some testing to the gun to confirm all wire colors I mention correlate. For the +5V & ground wires, go to here: PS1 Controller (http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/playstation3.htm) & confirm the pin 4 & 5 wire colors at the actual gun (open the old PS1 controller connector & follow thw colors to the gun). For the button wires, you will need to test which connection at each button is +5V & ground with a multimeter (the second gun I did was opposite wires of this gun). Read all following steps before doing anything.

1) Open up the gun
(http://i.imgur.com/kv0nbkU.jpg)

2) Disconnect all wire connectors from the main PS1 board that can be disconnected

3a) It is better space wise to cut the micro USB cable end off & solder the wires directly to the AimTrak board (similar to if you were to buy an AimTrak gun from Ultimarc).
(http://i.imgur.com/cwGdYJo.jpg)

3b) If you do not want to solder the wires, remove the black rubber casing from end of micro USB cable - this allows space for the switch board. Use a knife to split along the line on the side & gradually pull apart. Then remove the metal casing that houses the old CRT LED located on the switch board - start in the back since that part is not soldered then bend/cut to eventually remove it - just be careful not to damage anything.
(http://i.imgur.com/F2d4yO4.jpg)

4) Cut all wires where the PS1 cable connects to the board but leave the black & red wires as long as you can

5) Solder a wire between the PS1 red wire & AimTrak +5V

6 ) Solder a wire between the PS1 black wire & AimTrak ground

7) Solder/t-tap a wire between the PS1 trigger NO black wire & AimTrak trigger

8 ) Solder/t-tap a wire between the PS1 side button top yellow wire & AimTrak aux

9) Solder/t-tap a wire between the PS1 back button bottom yellow wire & AimTrak P1

10) Solder/t-tap a wire between the PS1 foot pedal green wire & AimTrak P2

11) Cut all plastic neccesary to fit AimTrak board & wires

12) Hot glue AimTrak board into place

13) Install IR filter (if you have one; I had one but was getting a better signal with it off so I removed mine)

Option #1
14) Close gun up & enjoy

Option #2
14) Solder a wire between the PS1 board point & AimTrak recoil - do not remove the chip as shown in the picture
(http://i.imgur.com/ZYf1nXZ.jpg)

15) Close gun up & enjoy

Option #3
14) Remove NorGun/GunCon switch legs from the board & try to utilize this switch. If you cannot, just desolder/remove the old switch totally & use a new switch (my NorGun/GunCon switch legs were brittle & broke off so I had to use a new switch - got mine from RadioShack)

15) Solder jumper wire between #1 & #2 where this switch used to be
(http://i.imgur.com/bMEd29u.jpg)

16) Solder a wire between the PS1 board point & #2 on NorGun/GunCon switch/new switch
(http://i.imgur.com/4anEFdA.jpg)

17) Solder a wire between #1 on NorGun/GunCon switch/new switch & AimTrak recoil

18) If using a new switch, attach new switch to board - you will need size #2 screws, lock washers, & nuts (HomeDepot). Drill out holes on switch to make big enough for screws. Drill out holes on board to make big enough for screws. Attach new switch to board but insulate with electrical tape otherwise it will ground out & not work at all (took a while to figure that one out). Example picture - board goes inbetween lock washers.

19) Close gun up & enjoy


I hope this helps. Also, here is the completed gun with Option #3.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJ3qK863Kto (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJ3qK863Kto)

Edit: Step numbering was off & added step clarifications
Edit2: Someone was asking about this so I went back & made a few grammatical changes to clarify a few things
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on July 12, 2016, 03:51:56 am
Thanks so much for the guide, I'll take a look at it much later on when i go back to the project, pictures would help alot as well.

I still can't find real arcade gun in black, it would be perfect if i could as my other alternative was to buy that named gun just to get it in black.

are you based in UK? would you consider selling the one you have or making another one, another forum user was going to sell something similar as well but it kind of fizzed out.

I like the arcade level hose btw.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on July 13, 2016, 11:39:10 am
Thanks so much for the guide, I'll take a look at it much later on when i go back to the project, pictures would help alot as well.

I still can't find real arcade gun in black, it would be perfect if i could as my other alternative was to buy that named gun just to get it in black.

are you based in UK? would you consider selling the one you have or making another one, another forum user was going to sell something similar as well but it kind of fizzed out.

I like the arcade level hose btw.

No problem on the guide. I was planning on writing one up anyway just in case anyone was interested.

I am in the US & found them on eBay. Also, not planning on selling any - only have (2) guns which is what I need for my cab.

The hose is actually a shower hose I picked up on Amazon.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: adambull on July 28, 2016, 05:07:26 pm
Hey All,

I've been following this thread on and off for about a year now and thought that I would take the plunge and obtain one of The Real Arcade Guns, I bought mine for £16 without any power supply, but quickly found out it needs a 12V 1.2A supply. Not a problem.

I thought I'd try and take this one step further and am having imported a Time Crisis foot pedal to see what more can be done for a nice arcade setup.

I've built my own retropi arcade, utilizing Xinmo and Raspberry Pi 3. It is a very nice build and, figure the perfect way to complete the setup is with time crisis pedal + gun with recoil.

I've been looking over the last generous contribution documenting each steps and 3 different options to proceed with this mod, and I was wondering if I can clarify with the OP , is there supposed to be a step 4 or 5 that I am missing? The steps jump to 6 :D

(http://i.imgur.com/lGqO64s.jpg)

I also include picture of the power supply for anyone that gets one of these without and doesn't know what voltage/current requirements. I measured the power pin and in case anybody is wondering it appears to be a 5.5mm. Please someone correct me if this is wrong.  I'm wondering if I used a slightly beefier power supply whether the thing would draw a bit more than it does vanilla and give a bit more of a recoil.

I read previously in this thread that other person who had obtained genuine Namco pedal from arcade had also noted the unit has 3 pins, this seems odd unless there is separate signal for reload and cover, and it is just sent to the machine on separate channel + ground. It's either that or the unit might require some kind of power, but that seems silly, since it's ultimately only needing to be a microswitch. I will let you know once I investigate further.

Cheers &

Best wishes,
Adam
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: adambull on July 30, 2016, 01:54:05 pm
I converted my The Real Arcade gun last night, it took about 8 hours to make all the necessary considerations and soldering, mainly because I was following this guide and wanted to make absolutely sure I made no mistakes! I took lots of pictures along the way because I see that one of the guys was asking about more pictures on the steps. It was not so hard, the key is not rushing and having a nice dremel tool and gluegun to make life a bit easier on you.

I followed the trace as well, and I think that I've missed something for the recoil. Everything except the recoil works.  The aimtrak gun is nice. I've taken like about 24 pictures of the process and would be fairly happy to show how to wire the trigger in. I didn't connect all the other periphery buttons because that is easy thing to do just signal and ground... I am mostly interested in the recoil, and it was kind of a shame after doing the MOD this still did not work.

(http://[url=http://i.imgur.com/yCe1hhu.jpg]http://i.imgur.com/yCe1hhu.jpg[/url])

(http://i.imgur.com/LR0pOKJ.jpg)

However, I wonder if the USB 5v 2A to 12V 1A won't necessarily be powerful enough. I'm using an anker USB hub which has 5V 4A and I thought it would be enough to step to 12V. Should have just got myself a standard 12V 2A supply for the Gun. The only shame about picking up this gun for 16 quid was that it didn't come with the original, so I'm not sure if it's something I've done wrong or not. I did essentially "option 2" which was described in the last 2 updates on the forum, do I need to actually desolder the chip as well for that to work?

(http://i.imgur.com/RQx0UcV.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/j9WrNFg.jpg)
Jump wire/solder point for solenoid. Does this look right? What am I missing!!?

Would someone be so kind to assist me in clarifying exactly what I need wired for the recoil? As at this stage am not sure if the issue is the power supply, how about just connecting up directly to test solenoid? It's 12V 1A right? I will upload more pictures of the process to do this mod, since I was really thorough in showing each step I think others wanting to do this might benefit from it. If anyone can help me though with the recoil I'd appreciate it :D I've lots of studying to do and I am guessing this is a REALLY simple issue to fix and I've missed something basic. Maybe I just need to turn it on? I used the ultimarc tool and tried 'recoil test', nothing, I think I might be missing a wire or proper PSU.

Any ideas? :D

Hell, I uploaded a ton of pics too to make this easier for others. The only thing (sadly) that didn't work is recoil, and I'm guessing it's just one wire or bad psu... am just repeating myself now.. hehe

(http://i.imgur.com/nPx7ayG.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/xPZEytg.jpg)
Not, too untidy.eh?

http://imgur.com/a/uePWZ (http://imgur.com/a/uePWZ)

Best wishes,
Adam
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on August 02, 2016, 01:09:22 pm
adambull,

Your interior gun wiring colors look a little different than mine, so I will try to help the best I can.

1) The step numbering was off. Accidentally skipped steps 4 & 5 when numbering but all steps are there.

2) The original power supply for my guns is 12V 1.2A - I have read in this thread of someone using a higher output power supply that provided more recoil. As far as if this is ok for the solenoid/gun internal parts, I have no clue.

3) Does your gun red LED light up when you press the trigger? Make sure the gun is in NorGun mode before plugging in the USB. The gun chip needs to receive +5V power in order for it to work without that big chip being removed (as far as I understand).

4) Make sure you soldered the correct +5V & ground wires on the gun chip to the AimTrak. Go to this link: PS1 Controller (http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/playstation3.htm), scroll down & confirm that the points you have soldered to are pin 5 (+5V) & pin 4 (ground). Open the end of the original PS1 controller connection & just match it up then follow the correct wire colors. Mine were red & black.

5) Make sure in the AimTrak utility that you have the recoil power all the way up. Some people have said that was causing their recoil to not work.

I am in the process of doing my other gun & I will upload an interior picture of it completed. Probably will try to finish it later this week when I have time - I am probably about 75% done.


Edit: Here are the pins on my gun board using your picture (assuming they are the same). Just confirm like I mentioned above.
(http://imgur.com/iFMk3WE.jpg)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: jking3 on August 05, 2016, 09:31:27 am
I see some have removed the big chip, others have not. What are the pro's con's to that? I assume to remove it since its not providing any service?

Also, I see one person suggested replacing one of the slide switches with a radio shack one, why not just use the existing one?

Thanks.

Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on August 05, 2016, 10:00:28 am
I see some have removed the big chip, others have not. What are the pro's con's to that? I assume to remove it since its not providing any service?

Also, I see one person suggested replacing one of the slide switches with a radio shack one, why not just use the existing one?

Thanks.


From what I understand, you need to remove the big chip in order to use the recoil if you are not providing +5V to the gun. The only real function the big chip provides is the ability to do the auto-fire, otherwise, it is just there. The original gun also has a programming mode for auto-reload but I would not think that would be applicable for this since it is not a PS1 - although I have not tested it.

I only replaced the slide switch so that I can use it to activate/deactivate the recoil wire in order to use the auto-fire. The switch on the board is very fragile & long story short, it was easier to simply replace it since I had to solder wires to the switch.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: adambull on August 05, 2016, 06:28:40 pm
Hi SlyBlueFox,

Thank you for reaching out to me, concerning my questions with this I really appreciate it. So, tonight I have had another go at it.

I found actually that the black wire and the red wire I had chosen were at different pins. So followed your instructions breaking apart PS1 control and checking colours of cables with pinouts.

Should have done this from the start. And can now confirm that the vcc5+ and ground appear correctly connected (green and yellow cable) instead of red and black.

I can report that now the LED does light up in norcon mode, however the trigger is no longer working, and, as before, solenoid is not firing.

I have connected the solenoid up to +12V 1.1A and it is firing fine. So I'm guessing something wrong here with my wiring configuration. Maybe my recoil wire is bad?

Please find video attached.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDIDOjFP4Lo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDIDOjFP4Lo)


Best wishes,
Adam
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: adambull on August 05, 2016, 07:19:57 pm
OK! Trigger is working now and registering in software. So It's left clicking on trigger.

The red led is flashing now. But the solenoid is not firing.

It's connected to a 12V 1.2A power supply, and Aimtrak +5V as suggested. I think I'm missing something silly now..

Thanks for all the great tips.. pretty much should have figured out the correct connections myself by checking wiring diagram and connector properly, so others attempting this please do be sure to do this.

I'm tempted if this continues to look at ways to do this with the original board... but I've come this far... so close, but no recoil cigar ;)) yet. If anyone has any ideas please hit me up! cheers &

Best wishes,
Adam
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: adambull on August 05, 2016, 08:41:21 pm
WIRES ON the Time Crisis Arcade pedal, pictured in previous postings.

GREEN - CHASSIS GROUND (seemingly)
PURPLE + BLACK = GROUND + SIGNAL PAIR FOR MICROSWITCH.

My gun now, everything working, trigger, LED, tracking etc, except recoil.

Best wishes,
Adam
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on August 06, 2016, 08:43:39 am
WIRES ON the Time Crisis Arcade pedal, pictured in previous postings.

GREEN - CHASSIS GROUND (seemingly)
PURPLE + BLACK = GROUND + SIGNAL PAIR FOR MICROSWITCH.

My gun now, everything working, trigger, LED, tracking etc, except recoil.

Best wishes,
Adam

1) Have you adjusted the recoil setting in the AimTrak utility on the computer? Make sure it is turned all the way up.

2) If you have a multimeter, check to see if you have 12V on the board where the recoil power wires connect.

3) Check to see if you can get the gun to recoil without the recoil wire connected to the AimTrak.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: adambull on August 06, 2016, 03:23:38 pm
Hey man :D

Thanks for writing back, I appreciate it!

1) Yes, aimtrak recoil is up to maximum.

2) I'm guessing I wouldn't be seeing 12V at the solenoid wires, since I test directly with a power supply there and it works, yet with wired solenoid doesn't. Power supply is tested so sure it's not that.

3) Before, the ground and VCC5 was in the wrong place, there was no LED flashing. Now the LED flashes, but still no recoil.

I'm wondering if I might just take away the existing PCB and create my own for the recoil since it's getting frustrating now, I've taken this apart like 3 times.. I think what it is I am missing must be fairly simple, maybe my soldering is bad. But I don't thinkso, I just took the whole thing apart and re-soldered it all, and had the same problem.

Would it be easy to replace the existing PCB with a new one? I see some others have done this. Maybe I can take off the component on PCB used for controlling it and make my own circuit, I might do this if it continues to be problematic.


Best wishes,
Adam
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on August 06, 2016, 07:25:22 pm
Hey man :D

Thanks for writing back, I appreciate it!

1) Yes, aimtrak recoil is up to maximum.

2) I'm guessing I wouldn't be seeing 12V at the solenoid wires, since I test directly with a power supply there and it works, yet with wired solenoid doesn't. Power supply is tested so sure it's not that.

3) Before, the ground and VCC5 was in the wrong place, there was no LED flashing. Now the LED flashes, but still no recoil.

I'm wondering if I might just take away the existing PCB and create my own for the recoil since it's getting frustrating now, I've taken this apart like 3 times.. I think what it is I am missing must be fairly simple, maybe my soldering is bad. But I don't thinkso, I just took the whole thing apart and re-soldered it all, and had the same problem.

Would it be easy to replace the existing PCB with a new one? I see some others have done this. Maybe I can take off the component on PCB used for controlling it and make my own circuit, I might do this if it continues to be problematic.


Best wishes,
Adam

If the AimTrak recoil wire is not connected to either the AimTrak board or the pin on the gun board, the gun should function correctly as if it were connected to a PS1. Maybe try to make sure the recoil works in that matter to confirm the gun board is functioning correctly? The gun needs to be in NorGun mode and the other switch can just be in Normal mode. You can do all this testing with the gun opened up so you can try a few different things. It's a pain opening and closing it up; did that multiple times while I was originally working on this. Let me know what you come up with.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TapeWormInYourGut on August 25, 2016, 01:42:03 pm
Recoil did work for me on the "Named" namco knockoffs until I grounded the solenoid's mounting plate. I am not sure why....

If you look at my post here (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,119610.msg1504589.html#msg1504589), there is a small screw under the metal bracket that the solenoid is attached to. There is wire attached from that screw to a ground on the aimtrak. It's worth noting that it was grounded o the original optical board as well. Maybe your gun has something similar?

Also I didn't put my guns together until I verified that the electronics were working... You will probably save yourself some headaches by doing the same.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: khoubash on August 26, 2016, 11:24:20 am
Hi, first thank you very much for all the information, i don't understand the point 7 (Solder/t-tap a wire between the PS1 trigger NO black wire & AimTrak trigger)
Where can i solder the cable on the PS1? Please see the picture.

I followed all the steps but when i connect the gun to pc, first aimtrak utility it detects the gun but the cursor doesn't move and sometimes the gun fires automatically without stopping and without squeezing the trigger. Please any idea about this? Thank you

(http://fotos.subefotos.com/9460fd4eaf271d93449306eff87a04a8o.jpg)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on August 26, 2016, 07:22:49 pm
khoubash,

If you look on the actual trigger, there is a marking that says "NO" on it. Just follow that wire to the board. Before you solder to it, confirm that that wire is actually supplying +5V. I have performed this mod on another gun and all the +5V/ground wires were oppositely wired for all the buttons from the one I used for the guide.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: jking3 on September 11, 2016, 10:52:23 pm
Okay, I'm almost done.

After tackling one red jolt gun, I think the main board was bad. Overall this gun NOS (New old stock) must have been baking in a wharehouse somehwere. IT was in bad shape, it would smolder when I plugged the powersupply in for the recoil.

anyhow, I'm to a point where my other blue jolt gun is working.

I'm trying to fully understand option #3, which is what I was trying to get going.

Option #3
Utilize the AimTrak recoil wire via switch & use the RealArcade gun as is. You will retain the normal single fire option & the autofire will work when switched on but only when the AimTrak recoil wire is disconnected. When you shoot off screen, the gun will not recoil only when AimTrak recoil wire is connected.


I had to remove the trigger switch from the jolt PCB gun to work, thus loosing 'auto recoil' when holding down the trigger.
 What works in this mode :

I can use the small switch to break the recoil connection from the aimtrak, turning off recoil mode.
Shooting on screen makes the recoil work
Shooting off screen does not make the recoil work.
Test recoil button works just fine in aimtrak config utility.
Nothing happens with the big side switch, moving to auto, normal, etc. No change.
                             

When I have the trigger plugged into the the main jolt PCB and tied into aimtrak trigger - like all of the above suggest, the gun works like this:

No matter what I do with the small switch, recoil happens when pulling the trigger on or off screen.
Auto mode works
Normal works as expected

So I guess, I'm either missing something easy, I've re stepped through this a dozen times, or option #3 always does recoil no matter what happens?
Maybe I messed up on jumping pins 1 & 2 on the small switch. Couldn't really figure out which pins 1&2 where, so the ones I have the jumper on are +5v. I did try the other pins too.

Here are some pics, thanks for any suggestions.



Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on September 12, 2016, 11:17:23 am
jking3,

My gun would never work in GunCon mode, only in NorGun mode which is the reason I installed that jumper wire. I would test that switch to make sure it is making a good connection as well - I know when I originally tried to use that switch, it was pretty brittle. Can you post a picture of the big board? Have you confirmed that you connected the AimTrak trigger wire to the correct trigger joint? The one you connect to needs be the +5V (if I remember correctly). The second gun I wired up was opposite of my guide as far as all the trigger/button connections thus grounding out everything.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: jking3 on September 12, 2016, 10:12:30 pm
@skybluefox,

Here are more pictures of the main board.

I'll confirm the trigger wire, but I'm pretty sure its correct. When it was wrong, the trigger was getting grounded out, causing calibration mode.

The switch is good, because I can switch the recoil wire off/on with the switch with success.

I just can't figure it out, when I have the tigger tied into the main board, the recoil triggers on or off screen, with or without the aimtrak recoil connected.

I'm wondering If I should try and tie the switch into the tigger onto the main pcb at the same time.

Thanks for the help, I may just settle for not having auto mode, and just leave the trigger off the PCB.

J
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on September 13, 2016, 10:36:01 pm
jking3,

The only thing I did different was I t-tapped the trigger wire but theoretically that shouldn't make a difference I wouldn't think. Everything else looks like how I did it so not sure what else to say. I'll go over the pictures again and try to glance at one of my guns and see if anything else catches my eye.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: adambull on September 22, 2016, 03:02:13 pm
Hey guys,

Just to clarify, I also had the grounding out issue, and thought it might have been an issue with the aimtrak calibration from holding down button too long. So I increased calibration duration to 60 and it seems to be OK.

I guess I should try one of the other two pins on the trigger switch now.

I've been thinking about removing the circuit, or connecting up the LED portion of the circuit, you might note with Skyblue's excellent instructions the LED has a nice clean signal that comes thru on each of the modes, I'm guessing that it might be easy enough to get some kind of relay switch circuit that is small enough, and throw it in between the LED wires on the board. I mean after all it would be simply the case of a switch that once receiving a signal controlled the two wires of the solenoid and shorted them for only a short time, lets say 1s max duration, and then off again until trigger is released, and then pressed again, which sends signal to LED pins, and starts the whole process off again. Does anyone know what that kind of switch is called? I don't know what it's called and it's making it harder for me to solve this in an alternative way. There are many ways to do this mod after some thought and reading through all peoples contributions.

I'm kind of bummed out because I can't figure out why the solenoid isn't firing in either of my guns, I got the right pins on the solenoid, it looks like there are subtle differences on the real arcade machine guns we've all had, the PCB is obviously being revised over time, and I dunno why they all have different colours in them, but its damnright tricky sometimes to figure it out. Sometimes better to look on the PCB than follow instructions blindly.

I work with a ton of qualified technicians, hundreds, there is no doubt in my mind that one of them could solve this, and so I will subscribe them into this adventure on the understanding that the arcade machine for the entire company relies on super awesome recoil, and possibly a way to disable it.

So, I forgot to say, I've modded two guns now. More pictures of second round coming soon. As for my potential ground problem, well it's actually not a problem seemingly, although the gun bears the annoying absurdity of pressing click down, but not mouse click release, quite infuriating since you cant double click with the gun!, i take it this the ground causing this, actually I think I untick the calibration in aimtrak utility to hide the ground problem, without realising it.

Well, this is a bit rushed, but I hope that everyone can look forward to a potential alternative circuit for the solenoid. For most people with little electronic experience I can see why this could be hard, and maybe we are all over complicating it a little bit, we only need the trigger, second switch sitting on trigger, that has a relay for the solenoid power supply, so bypass the pcb board & naturally wire the theaimtrak circuit as before, the rest (apart from maybe the norgun switch, should go). Do we really need a 555? I guess, but if we're going to use it we want to get autofire working, right?

more from me soon, and maybe a more coherent update too  :cheers: :afro:

Best wishes,
Adam
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on January 28, 2017, 01:53:38 pm
Has anyone got any ideas for doing an 'automatic rapid fire mode' whereby you just hold the trigger and the gun automatically rapid fires, and when you just pull the trigger single shot wise it just does single shot, maybe their might be a delay to make the rapide fire work but it should be possible, this is to work seemlessly in time crisis II and 3 in the machine gun setting.

if anyone could chime in on taking the guts out of a guncon 3 and putting it in a NAMED gun as well with recoil that would be cool, this is just for time crisis 4.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on June 04, 2017, 08:12:04 am
Looks like arcadeguns.com is releasing a recoil dongle

http://www.arcadeguns.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=322 (http://www.arcadeguns.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=322)

not sure if that will help anyone that is making these guns but it's useful information.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on June 08, 2017, 01:36:09 pm
Looks like arcadeguns.com is releasing a recoil dongle

http://www.arcadeguns.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=322 (http://www.arcadeguns.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=322)

not sure if that will help anyone that is making these guns but it's useful information.

Looks pretty cool but seems kind of expensive to me. Browsed around their site & did not see where they had any info on their own recoil module. Did they abandon that or was this the project all along?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: TimeCrisis on June 14, 2017, 12:20:35 pm
pretty sure they will sell it soon, they created space for it in their V2 gun.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Moksi on August 07, 2018, 06:12:30 am
I really like to have my aimtrak gun into the Playstation jolt gun.

I know someone can solder it but he needs a diagram to do it

I like to have the entire aimtrak setup into the jolt gun ( also the aimtrak i have, doesnt have the usb wire to the camera inside of the aimtrak) is it needed or not into the joltgun?

I like the aintrak module with recoil in the joltgun , with no recoil offscreen just how the aimtrak works in general [holding trigger autofire]
& if possible the switch to turn recoil off.

I hope someone can give me a Diagram so i can show it to the person that can do the solder for me

Thanks
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on August 27, 2018, 03:49:45 pm
If you want the gun not to fire the recoil when pointing outside the screen need the recoil kit + some own adruino module for the auto fire.
Have a real NAMCO gun working for single shooters just like the real gun does here:

https://youtu.be/wBXQOB5hHk0

also, check this project out which I did for full auto games, but also works with single shooters + burst mode via selectable fire mode switch

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=157861.0
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on November 14, 2018, 10:28:08 am
Can I ask those that have done this.

How's the aiming on the real arcade gun with aimtrak?
I had a real arcade gun when I was younger and I seen to remember running into issues because the lens was in the lower compartment and not in the barrel. Probably a design issue with the recoil.
However thinking about it technically, perhaps i only had issues with games that allowed enemies to be at the bottom of the screen? (did diehard trilogy have that maybe?).
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: gstav on November 15, 2018, 09:15:48 am
I can take out anything on the screen. it is all about calibrating correctly and have the proper space between the gun and IR-light to be visible  :angel:
I do run with crosshair, but you can have some fair aiming with a larger screen I suppose. Have a 25" LCD my self
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on November 15, 2018, 09:21:10 am
Ah cool.
I thought about it some more and hit you tube to find that die hard didn't have any in game calibration. So I think that was probably what was an issue when I was younger.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on December 03, 2018, 10:38:09 am
Hey,
What power supply are you using with the real arcade gun? Mine just arrived (£13 delivered) from ebay but didn't have a power supply. I tried a 24v 1.75a one but the recoil is super weak. Hopefully that's just a lack of amps.

Cheers
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on December 03, 2018, 11:38:30 am
 Actually, watching YouTube its probably about the same. I think i misremembered how strong arcade recoil is.
Next question. Can it take 24v long term? What about 36v? Does that give a sizable power boost to the recoil strength?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on December 04, 2018, 03:28:16 am
Ok. Played with it a bit more this morning. The recoil seems to skip/miss some shots when the trigger is pressed quickly in succession. If I switch it to auto fire I'll get 4 maybe 5 recoils and then it'll miss 2 or so. Then do another 4.
Again. Had anyone had any experience of this? Is it the power supply being incorrect etc?

Cheers
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on December 04, 2018, 09:38:00 am
Ah-ha! Turns out the auto fire issue is because of the auto reload functionality. I don't have a manual. Can someone explain how auto fire /program mode works?

It still struggles if you press the fire button too quickly but I seem to recall that was an issue when I had one as a kid. Something the namco arcade ones don't (or at least I don't recall them having). Probably a better solenoid?

Pod
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on December 04, 2018, 03:58:41 pm
Ah-ha! Turns out the auto fire issue is because of the auto reload functionality. I don't have a manual. Can someone explain how auto fire /program mode works?

It still struggles if you press the fire button too quickly but I seem to recall that was an issue when I had one as a kid. Something the namco arcade ones don't (or at least I don't recall them having). Probably a better solenoid?

Pod

Are you using this gun with an AimTrak or using it with a PS1?

I had a brand new one when I bought one so I have the original manual and power supply. I post what I can find out.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on December 04, 2018, 04:37:40 pm
At the moment I'm running it in Ps1 mode via a Ps1 to USB converter plugged into a pc.
I wanted to check it all worked before I began converting it to use an aimtrak.

If yours is to hand can you see what happens if you try and pull the trigger as fast as possible. Perhaps using the old left hand grip with straight finger waggle made famous for point blank :)

Cheers
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: SlyBlueFox on December 04, 2018, 07:59:40 pm
At the moment I'm running it in Ps1 mode via a Ps1 to USB converter plugged into a pc.
I wanted to check it all worked before I began converting it to use an aimtrak.

If yours is to hand can you see what happens if you try and pull the trigger as fast as possible. Perhaps using the old left hand grip with straight finger waggle made famous for point blank :)

Cheers

Here is the power supply mine came with (US version):

(http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=149895.0;attach=373333)

Here are the instructions about the auto reload stuff:

(http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=149895.0;attach=373335)

(http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=149895.0;attach=373337)
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on December 05, 2018, 05:13:21 am
Cool. Cheers for that. Shame there's no dedicated autofire.
I had figured program probably worked that way. Seems very Flakey though. I tried setting it to 6 shots and it does 2,pause (the offscreen shot I guess), 6, pause, 6. Not so bad but it restarts back on 2 on each trigger press.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: FrenchGamer on December 22, 2018, 10:06:05 am
I agree with argonlefou about the original power supply & the experience in general. The original power supply recoil is fine to me - its not bad but could be better. In general, I think that recoil is cool & makes for a "neater" experience. Now on to the guide.



There are a few options you can do for the gun assuming it is brand new & have not removed the chip yet in the gun as was the case previoulsy in this thread. If you have removed the chip, Option #2 is pretty much the same thing.

Option #1
Do not utilize the AimTrak recoil wire & use the RealArcade gun as is. You will retain the normal single fire option & be able to turn on the autofire as well. When you shoot off screen, the gun will recoil.

Option #2
Utilize the AimTrak recoil wire & use the RealArcade gun as is. You will retain the normal single fire option & the autofire will no longer work when switched on. When you shoot off screen, the gun will not recoil.

Option #3
Utilize the AimTrak recoil wire via switch & use the RealArcade gun as is. You will retain the normal single fire option & the autofire will work when switched on but only when the AimTrak recoil wire is disconnected. When you shoot off screen, the gun will not recoil only when AimTrak recoil wire is connected.



For all options, here are the steps I used (you can either directly solder to the switch mentioned or t-tap to the switch wire). All extra wire I used came from inside the old PS1 cord that was cut off. Gun needs to be in NorGun mode to function correctly. Disclaimer, you will most likely need to do some testing to the gun to confirm all wire colors I mention correlate. For the +5V & ground wires, go to here: PS1 Controller (http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/playstation3.htm) & confirm the pin 4 & 5 wire colors at the actual gun (open the old PS1 controller connector & follow thw colors to the gun). For the button wires, you will need to test which connection at each button is +5V & ground with a multimeter (the second gun I did was opposite wires of this gun). Read all following steps before doing anything.

1) Open up the gun
(http://i.imgur.com/kv0nbkU.jpg)

2) Disconnect all wire connectors from the main PS1 board that can be disconnected

3a) It is better space wise to cut the micro USB cable end off & solder the wires directly to the AimTrak board (similar to if you were to buy an AimTrak gun from Ultimarc).
(http://i.imgur.com/cwGdYJo.jpg)

3b) If you do not want to solder the wires, remove the black rubber casing from end of micro USB cable - this allows space for the switch board. Use a knife to split along the line on the side & gradually pull apart. Then remove the metal casing that houses the old CRT LED located on the switch board - start in the back since that part is not soldered then bend/cut to eventually remove it - just be careful not to damage anything.
(http://i.imgur.com/F2d4yO4.jpg)

4) Cut all wires where the PS1 cable connects to the board but leave the black & red wires as long as you can

5) Solder a wire between the PS1 red wire & AimTrak +5V

6 ) Solder a wire between the PS1 black wire & AimTrak ground

7) Solder/t-tap a wire between the PS1 trigger NO black wire & AimTrak trigger

8 ) Solder/t-tap a wire between the PS1 side button top yellow wire & AimTrak aux

9) Solder/t-tap a wire between the PS1 back button bottom yellow wire & AimTrak P1

10) Solder/t-tap a wire between the PS1 foot pedal green wire & AimTrak P2

11) Cut all plastic neccesary to fit AimTrak board & wires

12) Hot glue AimTrak board into place

13) Install IR filter (if you have one; I had one but was getting a better signal with it off so I removed mine)

Option #1
14) Close gun up & enjoy

Option #2
14) Solder a wire between the PS1 board point & AimTrak recoil - do not remove the chip as shown in the picture
(http://i.imgur.com/ZYf1nXZ.jpg)

15) Close gun up & enjoy

Option #3
14) Remove NorGun/GunCon switch legs from the board & try to utilize this switch. If you cannot, just desolder/remove the old switch totally & use a new switch (my NorGun/GunCon switch legs were brittle & broke off so I had to use a new switch - got mine from RadioShack)

15) Solder jumper wire between #1 & #2 where this switch used to be
(http://i.imgur.com/bMEd29u.jpg)

16) Solder a wire between the PS1 board point & #2 on NorGun/GunCon switch/new switch
(http://i.imgur.com/4anEFdA.jpg)

17) Solder a wire between #1 on NorGun/GunCon switch/new switch & AimTrak recoil

18) If using a new switch, attach new switch to board - you will need size #2 screws, lock washers, & nuts (HomeDepot). Drill out holes on switch to make big enough for screws. Drill out holes on board to make big enough for screws. Attach new switch to board but insulate with electrical tape otherwise it will ground out & not work at all (took a while to figure that one out). Example picture - board goes inbetween lock washers.

19) Close gun up & enjoy


I hope this helps. Also, here is the completed gun with Option #3.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJ3qK863Kto (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJ3qK863Kto)

Edit: Step numbering was off & added step clarifications
Edit2: Someone was asking about this so I went back & made a few grammatical changes to clarify a few things

Hello Everybody, Hello SlyBlueFox!

First, Sorry for my english, it's not my native language  :).

Thank you so much for your tutorial and your videos in Youtube, I would like exactly the same Gun for my PC/TV (option 3)! :cry:

I hope you can help me to make my dream real!

I have some questions please:

1) I have a Super Jolt Gun (boxed. So with pedal etc), but what I have to buy in Ultimarc website? Just this I think, wright?

http://www.ultimarc.com/aimtrak_module.html (http://www.ultimarc.com/aimtrak_module.html)

2) I need something else? (apart from the soldering iron of course  :D). Please can you detailed what I need:

a)Super Jolt Gun
b)aimtrak modul (?)
c) power supply (?)

etc...



I read very slowly your tutorial, I hope to succeed!

Thank you!

Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: FrenchGamer on December 25, 2018, 09:41:34 am
Hello! Nobody can help me  :-[?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Titchgamer on December 25, 2018, 06:44:46 pm
Hello! Nobody can help me  :-[?

You will need the kit that you linked to (the camera module, sensor bar and trigger buttons)

You will not need a PSU unless you want to have recoil, If you want recoil you will need the recoil solenoid and a PSU.

As for installing it in your gun I have no idea sorry.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: FrenchGamer on December 26, 2018, 04:38:06 am
Hello! Nobody can help me  :-[?

You will need the kit that you linked to (the camera module, sensor bar and trigger buttons)

You will not need a PSU unless you want to have recoil, If you want recoil you will need the recoil solenoid and a PSU.

As for installing it in your gun I have no idea sorry.
Thanks you, but I think I Can use the solenoid and the PSU of my Jolt Gun and not buy another? That I understood  :-\
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on December 27, 2018, 03:57:46 pm
Hello! Nobody can help me  :-[?

You will need the kit that you linked to (the camera module, sensor bar and trigger buttons)

You will not need a PSU unless you want to have recoil, If you want recoil you will need the recoil solenoid and a PSU.

As for installing it in your gun I have no idea sorry.
Thanks you, but I think I Can use the solenoid and the PSU of my Jolt Gun and not buy another? That I understood  :-\

Yeah that's right. I just did this last night with my jolt gun using the instructions on page 8 of this thread.
I'll do a proper write up in a day or so but some points of note.

I used option 1 and took route 3b. It took me 4 hours with 2 of us.
There was more plastic cutting than I expected but we managed to cut it to hold the board without the need for glue!
Everything is a really tight fit!
The soldering on the board is very tiny. you'll want some experience and a steady hand.
My PS1 cable colours didn't match any of the other people in this thread but the positions of the +ve and Ground wires was the same on the PS board.

Pod

P.s Cheers to everyone in this thread!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on January 01, 2019, 05:18:42 pm
Hey everyone,

Further update. So I wasnt able to test the gun until today.
The back button is wired the wrong way so its registering as always held. I soldered the bottom (nearest the butt of the handle) wire as per the instructions but On mine it must be the top one. No biggie. I can redo that.

The foot pedal input isn't working though. At this point I dont know if I made a mistake in connecting it to the board (unlikely, it was a pretty nice joint), used the wrong wire (I used the green wire but see point above), a hardware issue (maybe the gun's port/pedal is faulty) or its software at fault. I say the latter because in the ultimarc aimtrak config utility the gun is showing only 3 buttons (trig, side and back). I did get it to show them all at one point with the proper names (trig, aux, p1 etc) but now I cant replicate.

Anyone able to shed light on the software issue?

Cheers

Pod
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on January 02, 2019, 09:10:23 am
Ah ha!

Andy has informed me I need specific firmware to use p2-5. So problem identified and hopefully fix incoming when he's able to send it over
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Zebra on January 02, 2019, 07:23:29 pm
For the people here who own jolt guns, please can you tell me what size power supply came with it?

I think mine might have come with a non-original psu. It is 12v 14.4a which seems to be too much for the purpose. I.e. It kicks too hard.

Also, has anyone here managed to fix the accuracy issues when using them with a PS1  or PS2? The real Namco guns are super accurate. These jolt guns have the teleporting crosshairs found on every single 3rd party home light gun ever made.

BTW, I got an Aimforce dongle last week. It you plan to use an Aimtrak, they solve some of the issues people described here as they allow you to set up the type of recoil needed on a game by game basis. It sucks that they only work with Aimtrak guns though.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on January 03, 2019, 02:24:09 am
Is 12v 1.2a but the gun should only take as many amps as it needs so if its too strong then your solenoid is just a powerful one.
Given you've got a custom supply maybe someone's replaced the solenoid? How powerful is it exactly? Post a video perhaps?

Pod
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Zebra on January 03, 2019, 07:17:16 pm
Is 12v 1.2a but the gun should only take as many amps as it needs so if its too strong then your solenoid is just a powerful one.
Given you've got a custom supply maybe someone's replaced the solenoid? How powerful is it exactly? Post a video perhaps?

Pod

The extra amps definately increase the power of a solenoid. When I tested it with a 12v 2a PSU, the recoil was very weak.

I am no expert on electronics but my understanding is that the stated voltage on solenoids is nominal and power  or speed is increased or decreased by varying volts and amps. Come to think of it, that is the same as most electric motors unless you add a drive to control current.

I have come to realize that there is such a thing as too much recoil. I have been testing an Aimforce dongle with my Aimtrak and the noise is horrific when the recoil is set too high. The solenoid was cracking bits of plastic off the gun shell too.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Zebra on January 04, 2019, 09:02:33 pm
Is anyone here using the jolt gun as is for PS1 or PS2 games?

The main issue I am facing with this gun is poor accuracy compared to real Namco guns. These jolt guns have teleporting crosshairs like every other 3rd party light gun. Does anyone know what makes the Namco guns more accurate and can these jolt guns accuracy be fixed?

I was going to try replacing the sensor with one I have from a real time crisis arcade gun but the jolt gun uses 2 legs for the sensor while Namco guns use 3 leg sensors.

The Namco sensor pins are signal, 3.3v and ground. I assume the two legs on the jolt gun are 3.3v and sensor with no ground. Is this right? And, if so, could this be the reason for the unstable crosshairs? If I wanted to replace the jolt sensor with the 3-leg Namco sensor, where would I connect the 3rd(ground) leg on the jolt gun PCB?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on January 09, 2019, 06:05:42 pm
Is 12v 1.2a but the gun should only take as many amps as it needs so if its too strong then your solenoid is just a powerful one.
Given you've got a custom supply maybe someone's replaced the solenoid? How powerful is it exactly? Post a video perhaps?

Pod

The extra amps definately increase the power of a solenoid. When I tested it with a 12v 2a PSU, the recoil was very weak.

I am no expert on electronics but my understanding is that the stated voltage on solenoids is nominal and power  or speed is increased or decreased by varying volts and amps. Come to think of it, that is the same as most electric motors unless you add a drive to control current.

I have come to realize that there is such a thing as too much recoil. I have been testing an Aimforce dongle with my Aimtrak and the noise is horrific when the recoil is set too high. The solenoid was cracking bits of plastic off the gun shell too.

Interesting, I've only just been able to give my gun a good test and I've found the same thing using the stock power (12v 1.2a).it's so weak. It can hardly do a full recoil.
Now I owned one of these as a kid and I don't recall it being that bad so I'm assuming that's down to its age. Both gun and supply are 20 years old. So one or both of the solenoid or supply might be knackered.
Using a 24v 1.8a supply did improve things but it still occasionally misfires. I'd be interested in knowing if it'd be better using a stronger supply or if I'd risk harming it.

I see some other people just replaced theirs with a 36v solenoid that's the same as found in the aimtrack guns. So that might be an option. Last resort I guess.

Anyone able to give some advice on this?

Pod

P. S I had a guncon and a real arcade back in the day. I found both to be as accurate as each other as far as I can remember.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on January 10, 2019, 09:24:11 am
Oh dear.

So a word of warning. 24v 1.8a is to much for the stock real arcade gun solenoid. Had a cracking 30mins with decent recoil only for it to lock on. Disconnect and reconnect instantly locked it on again and I could smell burning.
Left it unplugged for 5 mins. First trigger press locked it back on. Left it unplugged for 15 mins and now it's not working at all.

Bugger.

So now I really do need recommendations on a replacement.
Who here replaced theirs and where did you get it from etc? I should just be able to simply wire it the same way right (via the Ps1 control board)?

Cheers

Pod
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Zebra on January 10, 2019, 11:17:33 am
Solenoids usually have a nominal rated voltage which means you can vary the volts and amps a little but it's not a good idea to use a 24v or 36v PSU with a 12v solenoid...

The solenoid used in Aimtrak recoil guns can not be used for full auto. I tried it with an Aimforce dongle and it didn't last one game before melting.

You can buy replacement solenoids for Terminator Salvation arcade guns for a little over $30. They are 12v and ideal for this purpose.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on January 10, 2019, 12:02:09 pm
Id seen others say that they'd run the RAG with 24v but I guess probably with less current. Of course it's possible I fried something on the Ps1 board instead and the solenoid might still be ok. So I'll probably just replace the lot with ultimarcs to be safe. It's only £25 Inc shipping and it shouldn't take too much to fit as at least one person on a previous page had done it. (bonus is I can adjust the strength via the config app)

out of curiosity. Did you properly melt the ultimarc one you tried to use in autofire mode? Andy told me it has a thermal cutout to protect it so people who try to use it on autofire would find it cut out until it cooled down!

Pod

P.s did you try a terminator solenoid in a RAG then? How's it feel?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Zebra on January 10, 2019, 01:41:08 pm
Id seen others say that they'd run the RAG with 24v but I guess probably with less current. Of course it's possible I fried something on the Ps1 board instead and the solenoid might still be ok. So I'll probably just replace the lot with ultimarcs to be safe. It's only £25 Inc shipping and it shouldn't take too much to fit as at least one person on a previous page had done it. (bonus is I can adjust the strength via the config app)

out of curiosity. Did you properly melt the ultimarc one you tried to use in autofire mode? Andy told me it has a thermal cutout to protect it so people who try to use it on autofire would find it cut out until it cooled down!

Pod

P.s did you try a terminator solenoid in a RAG then? How's it feel?

Do not put the Ultimarc solenoid in that gun. They absolutely can not survive full auto recoil. They are very low quality.

I haven't tried the Terminator Salvation solenoid in my RAG. I have felt the recoil with them on the Terminator Salvation arcade though and it handles full auto well.

I have decided to go a different route for my mame guns. I just took delivery of some arcade guns from LA Machine guns. They deliver full auto recoil with a gear motor. It's far less problematic than trying to get reliable full auto recoil with a solenoid.

The constant on off switching with solenoids seems to destroy mosfets, relays and even the connecting wires very quickly. If you can't invest in high quality components, it's not worth investing at all.
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Podbod on January 10, 2019, 01:49:19 pm
But I'm not planning on hooking up full auto. I never even used the built in RAG auto fire because of the wierd reload stuff it comes with.
Unless you're saying don't use the ultimarc solenoid because the RAG would tear itself apart under the stress?
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: FrenchGamer on January 11, 2019, 11:48:17 am
Hello! Nobody can help me  :-[?

You will need the kit that you linked to (the camera module, sensor bar and trigger buttons)

You will not need a PSU unless you want to have recoil, If you want recoil you will need the recoil solenoid and a PSU.

As for installing it in your gun I have no idea sorry.
Thanks you, but I think I Can use the solenoid and the PSU of my Jolt Gun and not buy another? That I understood  :-\

Yeah that's right. I just did this last night with my jolt gun using the instructions on page 8 of this thread.
I'll do a proper write up in a day or so but some points of note.

I used option 1 and took route 3b. It took me 4 hours with 2 of us.
There was more plastic cutting than I expected but we managed to cut it to hold the board without the need for glue!
Everything is a really tight fit!
The soldering on the board is very tiny. you'll want some experience and a steady hand.
My PS1 cable colours didn't match any of the other people in this thread but the positions of the +ve and Ground wires was the same on the PS board.

Pod

P.s Cheers to everyone in this thread!

Hi Podbod!

Thank you, I hope you will soon offer us your proper write up, I would surely find answers to my questions in it.

Now I have the complet box Jolt Gun, and the aimtrak pack

https://www.ultimarc.com/aimtrak_module.html (https://www.ultimarc.com/aimtrak_module.html)

And if you can make some pictures of your custom Jolt gun, it will be so nice! thank you for all!




Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: Bojo5150 on April 27, 2019, 09:58:21 am
Question for the group...

I have 2 AimTrak recoil guns on my cabinet and I recently picked up a “named” Namco knockoff in hopes to convert it to an  AimTrak with the Namco solenoid. I’ve read this entire thread and it seems like it’s a rather difficult conversion for someone with no knowledge of DC circuitry.

My question is, can I not simply disconnect the AimTrak solenoid wires to the Namco solenoid wires and the AimTrak trigger wires to the Namco trigger?

All help is very much appreciated!
Title: Re: AimTrak-Converting a Namco Recoil Gun
Post by: mangueboy on August 30, 2019, 11:58:39 am
Ah-ha! Turns out the auto fire issue is because of the auto reload functionality. I don't have a manual. Can someone explain how auto fire /program mode works?

It still struggles if you press the fire button too quickly but I seem to recall that was an issue when I had one as a kid. Something the namco arcade ones don't (or at least I don't recall them having). Probably a better solenoid?

P

Are you using this gun with an AimTrak or using it wit PS1?

I had a brand new one when I bought one so I have the original manual and power supply. I post what I can find out.

Hello, SlyblueFox. First, thanks for the great mod project. I bought two jolt guns  and  completed the mod  of one them with (Option #1) normal single fire and  autofire enable. Now, I need your opinion on a possible solution to retain autofire and not off screen recoil, using a aimtrak recoil PCB, like schematic below. I did a test with recoil signal and  and measured standard 0v by default. Then i wire one 12v power supply to V+, V and S1, S2 output of Aimtrak recoil PCB to Jolt Gun 12V  supply connections points. Then i ground G point and  supply 5v to R (recoil) point in Aimtrak recoil PCB. Nothing happened with S1 and S2 points that continued to measure 12v. I think that supply 5v  to point with block s1 an s2 any voltage, since i see this power when G points was disconnect. Please, what type of signal the recoil connection of a Aimtrak Gun PCB will gives when you tries fire off screen? What your opinion about schematic below? Will this solution work?

Update: Finally i assembly in Jolt Gun one Recoil PCB, but not have time to test yet if the RAG wiil not  recoil offscreen. I  suffered with bed solding of V+ e V- and S1 and S2. Make sure you will do a really good solding of this points or 12V output will fail several times. I use Replacement USB/Power Cable (http://www.ultimarc.com/store/section.php?xSec=7), but inside of RAG i use part of original power wire of Jolt Gun, because it is more thin.