Build Your Own Arcade Controls Forum
Main => Main Forum => Topic started by: SlikStik-Christian on April 19, 2003, 11:46:08 am
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Everyone,
We are releasing a new Tornado Spinner -Top- which has been in development for a while. Solid Aluminum Skirted knob. We have made improvements and added a special shape to it for added playability.
(http://www.slikstik.com/top.jpg)
As you can see in the picture the knurling goes down only half way and then dips in and then back out to the skirt, this basically provides a small resting/sensitivity area when spinning it.
Also, we incorporated a small dome to the top which provides an excellent feel on your palm.
It will be available on our site with in the next week.
Any comments are welcome.
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Are the oscar and these knobs interchangable?
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Good question. DOT spinner + this new knob would make a brilliant combination.
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Good question. DOT spinner + this new knob would make a brilliant combination.
Possibly, as long as it doesn't hamper the push action, meaning that the skirt doesn't contact the control panel before the leaf switch contact is made. Obviously this knob was not taken into consideration in my DOT design, but if Christian would be nice enough to send me some info on the knob, specifically the distance from the bottom of the skirt to the set screw location, I can check that out.
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Looks nice.
What is the diameter? Also shaft size it accepts? And the height? Ummm... How much is it?
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I am consistantly impressed with you Oscar.
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Well, I see Christian posted here about the new knob as well as emailing me a pic! (So much for my scoop! :P )
So many cool knobs (and spinners) coming out, and only one spinner on my arcade cab! It's not fair, I tell you!
Kevin
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So many cool knobs (and spinners) coming out, and only one spinner on my arcade cab! It's not fair, I tell you!
Well, there is a simple solution to that! Just think Warlords is your justification ;D
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All,
We are just putting the final touches on the new top and we will post all the info regarding size, depth of the set screw and so on with in the next few days.
Oscar, besides the new top being able to be used in any spinner game, it actually has the capability of being used as a DOT knob due to the design. Specifically, where the knurling begins to cut in towards the center gives a very comfortable space for it to be gripped with fingers and pulled up and down.
The exact depth of the shaft hole is still being determined but I am sure it will be able to be mounted in a position on your DOT spinner shaft allowing for it to be pushed down, up is already a given.
We have a few more nice features coming out to both our knobs which has already been said, both knobs will be available in some very cool anodized colors, mainly Blue, Red and Purple.
Ultimately instead of trying to reproduce an old technology, we tend to basically just use the functionality of it in producing our original current and future products.
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The exact depth of the shaft hole is still being determined but I am sure it will be able to be mounted in a position on your DOT spinner shaft allowing for it to be pushed down, up is already a given.
Okay. I'm glad you are sure, because when I was testing the DOT spinner with various different knobs (I have filing cabinet drawer full of different styles) I did find a couple that caused the problem I mentioned. That's why I brought it up in the first place.
Ultimately instead of trying to reproduce an old technology, we tend to basically just use the functionality of it in producing our original current and future products.
LOL! I guess if by recreating the original controls that these games were designed to be played with is "old technology", then I'm guilty of that. :)
My interests lie in alternatives, not competition. Anyone that thinks I consider SlikStik my competition doesn't know me very well. I'm a gamer and BYOAC'er, man! The more alternatives that are available, the better it is for everyone, myself included.
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The exact depth of the shaft hole is still being determined but I am sure it will be able to be mounted in a position on your DOT spinner shaft allowing for it to be pushed down, up is already a given.
Okay. I'm glad you are sure, because when I was testing the DOT spinner with various different knobs (I have filing cabinet drawer full of different styles) I did find a couple that caused the problem I mentioned. That's why I brought it up in the first place.
Ultimately instead of trying to reproduce an old technology, we tend to basically just use the functionality of it in producing our original current and future products.
LOL! I guess if by recreating the original controls that these games were designed to be played with is "old technology", then I'm guilty of that. :)
My interests lie in alternatives, not competition. Anyone that thinks I consider SlikStik my competition doesn't know me very well. I'm a gamer and BYOAC'er, man! The more alternatives that are available, the better it is for everyone, myself included.
Oscar,
I think it
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The reason I stated to you in my previous reply that I thought our new spinner top would be compatible with the up & down motion of your DOT spinner is because the set screws will be very close to the bottom of the knob, allowing for it to be mounted a little higher on the shaft and giving it space to be pushed down.
That was all I was asking about the first time, but your reply didn't address it other that saying you were sure it was okay. I was just looking for some clarification.
Who knows what the future holds, I just may have to adapt up & down moments into the Tornado as well...
I don't doubt it. ;)
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Possibly, as long as it doesn't hamper the push action, meaning that the skirt doesn't contact the control panel before the leaf switch contact is made.
Does the skirt spin with the knob? I like the idea of the skirt having permanent contact with the control panel and the knob spinning independantly of it. Ideally the knob would also have an updown motion independant of the skirt which would, once again, remain stationary -- flush with the CP.
Looking at the picture I assumed this was how it worked (well not necessarily the up/down bit, but the rest of it).
Am I making sense?
edit: added quote from Oscar
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Maybe its just me, but it would seem kind of overkill to design a separate spinner for just ONE game. Unless there are some other games out there that use the up and down motion of a spinner ? I would think that unless your a DIEHARD discs of tron fan a normal spinner MORE then works for me and would find it hard to justify adding another spinner just for DOT.
Whats the thought out there on this one? Does the majority of players want this up and down motion in a spinner if it means an extra $120.00 or so roughly ?
Just some food for thought....... :)
"Don't kill the messenger trinity" -cipher - the matrix - lol
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Discs of Tron is one of those freaky games that people go nuts over. There are plenty of games with funky controls that people wouldn't think twice of trying to replicate, but Discs of Tron is different. People really DO want that for their cabinet. That is the same reason that so many people want Tron sticks, while totally ignoring other weird controls like ...
Xybots sticks. Heavy 4-ways that rotate left and right slightly. (Game seems to support 8-ways, and plays great with them in MAME, but I played a real Xybots a while back, and those dudes were 4-ways).
Vindicators sticks - Tank controls, twin up down sticks with fire buttons.
Assault sticks - Twin 4-ways with fire buttons.
Breakout/Pong/Avalanche spinner - Pot based instead of encoder based, different feel, and mildly different function.
Street Fighter 1 buttons - Those ones that you bash as hard as you can to do different punches/ kicks.
Paperboy yoke - Bike handles (Or any of the various motorcycle handle yokes from various games).
Lunar Lander controller - Analog up/down handle. Surprised I haven't seen one of these yet.
Major Havoc roller - Like a spinner, but a roller, would work for most spinner games if you rotated it 90 degrees.
49 way optical sticks - Sinistar, some football game, and a few others.
Hall effect joystick - Road Runner, I-Robot, Escape from the Planet of the Robot Monsters.
Wizard of Wor 9-way - 4 way stick with 2 positions in each direction.
I am probably missing a ton of other weird controllers (Top Skater skateboard!!!!!).
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Answering two quotes: GroovyTuesday - The reason so many people want a DOT spinner is there basically is no authentic way to play the later levels otherwise. The game used an up/down spinner and a Trigger joystick with trigger and thumb switch. The easiest way to replicate this other than authentic controls is a standard spinner with two buttons nearby (up/down) and a trigger/thumb switch joystick, or a standard spinner with a PC joystick with 4 buttons, but you would still have to either take your hand off the spinner or off the fire button to press the up/down, so you can't play as well as in the original game.
PaigeOliver - Nice list! as someone who wants every arcade game playable (and on a low budget), I thought I would go through your list and point out alternatives, and add a couple myself -
Tron/Zaxxon Stick (not mentioned) - Happ Super with Raider Pro handle.
Ikari Warriors/SNK/Caliber .50 rotary joystick games - Authentic controls are available, but can also be played with Tron stick (above) and standard spinner, or Standard joystick and DOT spinner.
Xybots sticks. Heavy 4-ways that rotate left and right slightly. (Game seems to support 8-ways, and plays great with them in MAME, but I played a real Xybots a while back, and those dudes were 4-ways).
KLOV lists this as 8-way with two buttons each, use a standard joystick (with OSCAR's restrictors if you need 4-way) and assign two buttons for rotate/left rotate/right (4 buttons used total), not arcade authentic, but it works. Or a Tron stick with two buttons for rotate right and rotate left, or possible actual rotary joysticks.
Vindicators sticks - Tank controls, twin up down sticks with fire buttons.
Uses the Tron stick hack above, but you need 4 of them for 2-player games.
Assault sticks - Twin 4-ways with fire buttons.
Two of the Tron stick hacks above.
Breakout/Pong/Avalanche spinner - Pot based instead of encoder based, different feel, and mildly different function.
Didn't realize this was pot-based, but games play fine with a standard spinner.
Street Fighter 1 buttons - Those ones that you bash >as hard as you can to do different punches/ kicks.
Assume you mean the Convex Happ Competition buttons, don't think these are really required, although some authenticity is lost.
StarWars/Jedi/ESB/StunRunner/Hydra/Roadblaster yoke (I know RB is optical) (not mentioned) - Hack an original, or the Tron Hack would work, or a standard joystick with two buttons for Trigger and thumb functions.
Paperboy yoke - Bike handles (Or any of the various motorcycle handle yokes from various games).
Star Wars yoke works well or any of the hacks mentioned for it.
Lunar Lander controller - Analog up/down handle. Surprised I haven't seen one of these yet.
Standard joystick will work, but not arcade accurate.
Major Havoc roller - Like a spinner, but a roller, would work for most spinner games if you rotated it 90 degrees.
A spinner would work.
49 way optical sticks - Sinistar, some football game, and a few others.
Arch Rivals also, I think Pigskin was the football game. can basically use an analog joystick and advance MAME, but you really need Xiaou2's mod for the progressive centering.
Hall effect joystick - Road Runner, I-Robot, Escape from the Planet of the Robot Monsters.
Assume these are like the P360's and a standard joystick will work fine.
Wizard of Wor 9-way - 4 way stick with 2 positions in each direction.
According to KLOV, it had two contacts, one if held briefly in one direction and one if pressed further. I assume MAME uses a time delay to emulate this, or you could use two standard joysticks. Haven't ever played the game, so not sure.
720 degrees (not mentioned) spinner with a handle and calibration wheels - can be played using a standard spinner or standard 8-way depending on MAME build.
Frontline (not mentioned) - basically an 8-way with one direction constantly selected. I assume a standard 8-way can be used.
I am probably missing a ton of other weird controllers (Top Skater skateboard!!!!!).
and . . .
Prop Cycle - bicycle controller (pedals and gears)
Alpine Ski - hack a nordic track anyone?
Dance Dance Revolution - ummm?
that fire fighting game with the hoses and the 50" screen (not in MAME yet) thankfully :-).
And . . . a ton of others that I missed.
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Street Fighter 1 buttons - Those ones that you bash >as hard as you can to do different punches/ kicks.
Assume you mean the Convex Happ Competition buttons, don't think these are really required, although some authenticity is lost.
Hey tiger-heli ... originally on the first street fighter there were only 2 BIG buttons that you'd mash (it was raised and had a rubbery texture - kinda like something you'd hit with a mallet for an electronic strength test if you know what I mean).
The buttons were pressure sensitve so... A light hit on the punch button would be a jab... a medium hit a medium, and a hard hit a fierce (and the equivalent action on the kick button)... As neat as this was... the buttons always broke down and weren't common on other games so operators/further revisions of the game featured the now infamous 6 regular button spread.
*shrug* sorry to nitpick, just a clarification =P
rampy
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Street Fighter 1 buttons - Those ones that you bash >as hard as you can to do different punches/ kicks.
Assume you mean the Convex Happ Competition buttons, don't think these are really required, although some authenticity is lost.
Hey tiger-heli ... originally on the first street fighter there were only 2 BIG buttons that you'd mash (it was raised and had a rubbery texture - kinda like something you'd hit with a mallet for an electronic strength test if you know what I mean).
The buttons were pressure sensitve so... A light hit on the punch button would be a jab... a medium hit a medium, and a hard hit a fierce (and the equivalent action on the kick button)... As neat as this was... the buttons always broke down and weren't common on other games so operators/further revisions of the game featured the now infamous 6 regular button spread.
*shrug* sorry to nitpick, just a clarification =P
rampy
Ah, thanks for the clarification, Never was much of a street fighter type myself!!! Thanks!
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Whats the thought out there on this one? Does the majority of players want this up and down motion in a spinner if it means an extra $120.00 or so roughly ?
"Death to the messenger." -pack of wild mame wienerdogs...
Actually, I don't think anyone is looking at the DOT spinner this way. I think I speak for most of the people you are referring to when I say that the up/down does not negatively affect other games. So... should you spend $80 on a spinner, or $100 on a DOT spinner. I must have DOT on my cab, so I will spend the extra $20. I do not see a need to have a standard spinner in addition to an Oscar DOT piece of art, I mean spinner.
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Whats the thought out there on this one? Does the majority of players want this up and down motion in a spinner if it means an extra $120.00 or so roughly ?
"Death to the messenger." -pack of wild mame wienerdogs...
Actually, I don't think anyone is looking at the DOT spinner this way. I think I speak for most of the people you are referring to when I say that the up/down does not negatively affect other games. So... should you spend $80 on a spinner, or $100 on a DOT spinner. I must have DOT on my cab, so I will spend the extra $20. I do not see a need to have a standard spinner in addition to an Oscar DOT piece of art, I mean spinner.
I was going to make the same point, most people want some spinner, so it's not an extra $120.00. (Compared to the Model 3, it is an extra $58, but you have to weigh out what being able to play one game with authentic controls is worth.)
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Hall effect joystick - Road Runner, I-Robot, Escape from the Planet of the Robot Monsters.
Assume these are like the P360's and a standard joystick will work fine.
A standard joy will work, but an analog joystick will work much better.
Hall Effect tm joysticks are analog joysticks that use magnets instead of mechanical POTs.
720 degrees (not mentioned) spinner with a handle and calibration wheels - can be played using a standard spinner or standard 8-way depending on MAME build.
Or an analog joystick in analog+. Better than with an 8-way any day of the week. (BTW, you can dl the analog+ source and just use src/drivers/atarisy2.c if you want to compile your own mame with this 720 feature and not all the other analog+ stuff.)