Build Your Own Arcade Controls Forum
Main => Woodworking => Topic started by: fjl on March 19, 2007, 02:56:26 am
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All right, I'm planning on getting a circular saw for cutting straight lines. I was planning on getting this one,
http://www.dewalt.com/us/products/tool_detail.asp?productID=8184
But then thought, "it's cordless" meaning it runs on batteries. Is it a wise choice to use a cordless circular saw? I would assume a wall socket powered circular saw would be stronger. But would I really need that much strenght? How tough is MDF? And would a more powerful saw cut straighter? If you have suggestions for a better circular saw please share it.
Mainly the reason I want to get this saw is cause the other power tools I plan to get will also use the same 18Volt XRP DeWalt batteries.
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For what it's worth, I have a set of Makita 18V Cordless tools (Circular, Drill, Recip. Saw), and have never run into a job that they weren't up to. Just make sure you have your batteries charged all the time, and have a minimum of 2 of them (my set came with 2). Nothing worse than having to wait for batteries to charge in order to finish a job.
I do have a corded Circular saw and drill as well, but haven't had them out once since I picked up the cordless stuff several years ago. And for me the convenience of cordless is greater than I ever thought it would be.
I'm sure they have their limitations, but for general use, I haven't run into any problems with them. Only done a little bit of MDF cutting, but I think that the blade on your saw, is just as/more important than the total power of the saw when it comes to any cutting job.
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That circular saw cut pretty straight or did you have to use something to help with the alignment?
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Cordless drills are about as far as I'd go into cordless territory. Main reason being price. A cordless circular saw will cost twice as much or more than a good corded model. Another reason is exactly as you mention, that being power. A cordless model will not likely have the same torque as a corded model. A cordless drill is great to have, I love mine. A circular saw is a tool I feel the cord should be left attached.
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I've heard various things about cordless. One complaint my brother mentioned is the batteries. For his uses, he said the batteries ran out quickly on the heavier power tools and he had to keep extra on hand for his various tools. I decided on corded tools. I figured since I'm just using them in a workshop, the corded ones are probably more reliable.
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Exactly. Cordless is more for the jobsite than workshop use. I do highly recommend a good cordless drill (http://www.amazon.com/Bosch-33614-2G-14-4-Volt-Ni-Cad-Cordless/dp/B000BB0684/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/103-2223005-5317408?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1174313948&sr=8-1) though, as it's now one of the most useful tools in my shop next to the router.
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Damn you, NiteWalker. You're single-handedly blowing my budget for power tools. :P
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;D ;D ;D
Glad to help. ;D :cheers:
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I was reading some Amazon reviews where people were going on about loving their cordless jigsaw. Didn't seem like it was worth all the extra cost to me - I'm glad to hear some confirmation here.
Chris
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That circular saw cut pretty straight or did you have to use something to help with the alignment?
For small cuts, I never have problems keeping the cut straight, when working large pieces though, you owe it to yourself to take the time and get a sawboard. If you haven't already, check out Drew's how to, at the top of the woodworking threads.
I think NiteWalker, makes a strong case for a corded saw, cost & power being chief among them. I guess for me, never having a dedicated shop area, is another reason I love the cordless stuff. I can pretty much set up anywhere and get to work.
And I wholeheartedly agree, if you never get another cordless tool, an 18v cordless drill is a must have. It is without question my most used power tool.
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If all you're going to do is make cuts in 3/4" sheet goods, a cordless saw probably has all the power necessary. Until the batteries run dry... I, personally, wouldn't own a cordless saw. I like the dependibility of corded circular and jigsaws; every time you pull the trigger you know the saw is going to run at full power!
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corded it is. thx guys.
Now which one to buy... ???
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I bought this one (http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=240247-79992-FS1300CSL&lpage=none). Not top of the line by any means, but I really like it. It's a little heavy but feels really solid and smooth.
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Here's a few good ones to look at. All will do their job well. It's just a matter of preference.
Hitachi C7BD2 (http://www.amazon.com/Hitachi-C7BD2-15-Amp-4-Inch-Circular/dp/B000090PLL/ref=sr_1_7/103-2223005-5317408?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1174348511&sr=1-7)
Milwaukee 6390-20 (http://www.amazon.com/Milwaukee-6390-20-Tilt-Lok-Circular-Tilting/dp/B000022472/ref=sr_1_14/103-2223005-5317408?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1174348511&sr=1-14)
Porter Cable 325MAG (http://www.amazon.com/Porter-Cable-325MAG-4-Inch-Circular-Blade/dp/B0001GUEH2/ref=sr_1_15/103-2223005-5317408?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1174348511&sr=1-15)
Bosch CS20 (http://www.amazon.com/Bosch-4-Inch-Circular-Direct-Connect/dp/B000A1E48I/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/103-2223005-5317408?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1174348822&sr=1-1)
Porter Cable 423MAG (http://www.amazon.com/Porter-Cable-423MAG-4-Inch-Circular-Blade/dp/B0001GUEKY/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/103-2223005-5317408?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1174348872&sr=1-1)
Of those I'd probably go for the last Porter Cable mentioned or the Bosch. All are good saws though.
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I've got 2 corded and 1 cordless circ saw. Nice to have for small projects, but not something I'd count on for a cab, and you can find a reasonably priced corded circ saw for a WHOLE lot less than a cordless model.
If you can find and afford a worm gear, they seem to last forever AND a day.
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I have a 29.99 Craftsman and it works just fine for me. I can't imagine there being a huge difference upgrading to a 150.00 one.
Disclaimer: I also have a tablesaw, router, bandsaw if I won't want to use the skil. I don't actually use mine all that much. And I only seem to cut plywood, hardboard and MDF with it.
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I have a consumer level Black and Decker corded... can't remember the amp rating. I have had it stop in 2x4s on a humid day. Not so cool. Granted, that's with a dull blade, but still, pine is hella soft.
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I have a 29.99 Craftsman and it works just fine for me. I can't imagine there being a huge difference upgrading to a 150.00 one.
Brushes, motors, gears, switches, etc. The difference in the products used is generally internal, although external differences such as a metal blade guard or shoe on your saw also add to it (although I don't know that there are plastic shoes on any saws commonly sold). The difference between those products used almost universally translates to longer life, better durability, ease and cost of repairs (when considered as a whole), and ease of use and/or safety.
That $130 may not seem like that big a difference, but let's use carpenters for an example. If the motor burns out on your $30 saw, the odds are that it'll be cheaper in the long run to simply buy a new saw. Given the probability that his $150 saw is made with better materials, it SHOULD last AT LEAST twice as long as yours, and quite possibly 3-4 times as long. Given that he'd be buying new saws with the $30 version, just that factor alone can quickly add up to the $150 saw being a better value in the long run. Now add in other things like him being able to change the brushes/contacts easily and cheaply instead of having to buy a new saw (which then nets him longer use out of that same saw), more power (again, generally) of his $150 saw which helps him in ease/speed to get his work completed.....and so on, and so on.
This formula isn't set in stone, but it's true more times than not, meaning in tools, you often get what you pay for, and in the long run, you get more value for your money by purchasing a better tool.
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^ What he said. ;)
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So, if you're not a contractor, get the cheap saw? I've had mine for 6 years now, no problems. I say go for the cheap. Or stick with the orginal 18V idea to match the other tools.
Now if you ask about tablesaws I'd have a different answer.
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I'd still go with the more expensive tool. Something to pass down to your grandkids, or your kids will get good use out of it when you're gone, or heck, resale value for you/kids/grandkids.
See the comments on fixing stuff.
If you're talking about buying a saw for over $200, I'd think it's not worth it, but you can find AWESOME tools at HD when they take 'em off display for cheap (picked up a DeWalt circ saw for $85, normally $130) or NiteWalker's favorite "dollar store", Amazon ;) then go that route. In the end, things just tend to work better.
I was just using the carpenter as an example of how much faster you'd go through tools when in daily use. In homeowner use, you're not gonna go through it as quickly, but I wouldn't be looking at bargain-basement stuff either.
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So, if you're not a contractor, get the cheap saw?
You have to factor in how much you're going to use the saw and how much you're willing to fight with the tool. A more expensive saw might feature things like: more power, better dust collection, easier blade changes, less run-out in the arbor (= cleaner cuts with less burning), better safety features (e.g. electronic blade brake), easier/more accurate blade adjustments, longer cord, better stock blade, better durability, and better customer support.
If you don't care about these things, by all means buy the cheap saw. For myself, I've grown tired of fighting with cheap crappy tools. I'd rather spend a bit more money and get a tool that I know is going to get the job done whenever I pick it up.
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I'm the type of person that has to have the best or at least come close to the best when making purchases. So even though I will probably only use the circular saw once every long while. I still plan to buy the more expensive industrial strong type saw. That's just me cause I won't feel comfortable knowing I got some cheapy type tool just to try and save a few bucks.
I've had it happen to me in the past where a power tool dies on me half-way through a job. Chuck that to my father trying to save money by buying off the discount rack. I have always been more constructive than he ever was so I used his tools many more times than he ever did and I've broken many of his tools which in turn had me go through many toungue lashings. But it could have been prevented by simply buying better tools. All the tools I buy now for work and such, have never broken on me. They certainly show their wear and tear which only makes them look all the more rugged and cool since they still work perfectly after so many beatings. And the only times I've had to buy new tools was to replace any that where lost or stolen.
Bottom line for me when making purchases is to, buy the better one.
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From my experience, and yes I have work with both cord and cordless circular saws for a while, it comes down to a few things. If you just need to do some cuts here and there, just grab something like the cheap black and decker or skill for 30 to 40 bucks, at the same purchase, grab one of those carbit blade and ditch the crappy blade it comes with. That should work for most.
As for cheap cordless, there's plenty, but you will lose on the battery most of the time. And what I mean is battery life, no matter if it's 18 or 24 v, they die fast, but that's not quite true for the more expensive stuff. The cheaper one also don't have much cutting power as their rpm spin very slowwwwwww....
After using both cord and cordless for a long time, I now use mainly cordless as they have improved enough even for a whole day job. I would recommend getting either the Home Depot Rigid cordless one if you want to save a few bucks. I got a set on sale for $99 with 2 battery and lifetime warranty which covers everything including the battery about a year ago. Suprisingly they are good as the Dewalt in my book, both in battery life and power compare to the XRP. If you got extra, got with the Dewalt XRP as they are one of the best I have seen and used.
Why corless, just use it a few times and you will know instantly why...
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I'm the type of person that has to have the best or at least come close to the best when making purchases. So even though I will probably only use the circular saw once every long while. I still plan to buy the more expensive industrial strong type saw. That's just me cause I won't feel comfortable knowing I got some cheapy type tool just to try and save a few bucks.
Never had to work within a tight or insufficient budget, eh?
For homeowner's use, I'd say consider the amount of use it will get. You don't need the contractor quality tool Drew mentions, but if you can find it cheap, get it. Your time is valuable too and good tools save time. If you can't find it cheap, look at midrange tools. It's not like you go straight from "cheap Walmart crap" to "chrome plated greatness". If there's a garbage model at $30, and a high end model at $200, you can bet there's a model that does a quality job in infrequent use for $75-100.
In my experience, it's hard to get a project finished in a reasonable budget buying all top quality tools. At the same time, if you buy all the cheapest out there, you're going to spend a lot of time fighting the tools and possibly get subpar results. I know, don't blame the tools, but a novice doesn't have the skill to make up for a really crappy tool, either.
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I am in a tight budget which is why I'm taking my time on this and scouring the internet for the best deals. It ultimately always leads back to Ebay. I already bought a new cordless drill for about $200 bucks that normally MSRP's for $299 at retail stores. Saved me about one hundred bucks right there already. A drill is something I will definitely need for work, so buying one of the better ones is definitely worth it.
I also just aquired a dewalt circular saw for About $70 bucks that sells for about $160 at stores. It's slighty used as the auctions says but for the price, its alright.
Thank god for Ebay, I've gotten many good deals from it. :notworthy:
I'll continue to keep looking for good deals on tools. Then finally I can start buying the arcade parts. It's gonna take some serious cash but It's not like I'm trying to buy everything once. I'll get stuff as I save enough money for it. Next on my list is either the jigsaw or the router.
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I have half a dozen circular saws, two of which I regularly use. The one that I use the most is a 6" Porter-Cable 345 Boss, the other is a 7 1/4" Makita Hypoid saw. The 6" saw will cut just about anything including 45 angles on 2x boards, and it's lighter and easier to use when you've got a lot of cutting to do. The Makita is basically a worm drive saw without the weight of a Skilsaw and I use it when cutting a lot of treated wood.
For occasional use you don't need to spend a lot on the saw, though it'll live longer if you don't skimp on the blade for it. Typically the blades that come with low buck saws are useful for making clocks out of, not for cutting with. ;)
Cordless drills are great, cordless jigsaws are quite handy, a cordless circular IMHO saw needs at least 24 volts to be useful for anything more than paneling. If you don't use it all the time, stick with corded circular saws.
I haven't seen Drew's sawboard thread, typically I use either a level or an aluminum ruler for a straightedge when cutting panels with a circular saw.
If you don't mind used tools, check the pawn shops in your area. You can get quality tools for considerably less than they cost new that way.
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Another option for cheaper tools is to go for reconditioned. A lot of people buy nothing but reconditioned tools and have great results. From what I've heard, reconditioned tools are inspected more thoroughly than brand new tools (since they were returns in the first place) so the quality control is a bit better.
I personally avoid used tools, especially cordless ones. When buying used cordless you have no idea how old the battery is (they don't last forever) and in the case of ebay you could be buying sight unseen. Corded tools are less of a risk, but most corded tools have what's called brushes in them. Basically small blocks of carbon. In most cases these are replaceable, but not all the time. So if you get a drill and the brushes are done you may have to fork out $60+ for a new motor thus eliminating the savings from buying used.
Only new tools for me. ;)
efjayel; what cordless drill did you get? I have This one (http://www.amazon.com/Bosch-33614-2G-14-4-Volt-Ni-Cad-Cordless/dp/B000BB0684/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/103-2223005-5317408?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1174649341&sr=8-1) and it's great. IMHO unless it uses lithium ion batteries, anything more than 12 or 14.4 volt is overly heavy for prolonged use. The drill I got is normally $199. I got it for $155.95.
:cheers:
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I got this drill...
http://www.dewalt.com/us/products/tool_detail.asp?productID=15127
I got this one for various reasons. It had to be 18 volts and up only. It also had to have the hammer drill option. I didn't want just a drill/driver. This one comes with a self tightening chuck and various speed settings. And it comes with a carrying case. If you look here, http://www.dewalt.com/us/products/tool_detail_listing.asp?categoryID=98
You'll notice that most drills where under 500 watts of max power. But I got the one that was over 500. There are stronger drills like the 24v and 36v but they are big and bulky. Pretty much undesirable. 14.4v should already be good enough for just about all your drilling needs and its a good size as well but I insisted on 18v. Besides, a lot of the other better DeWalt cordless tools run on 18v anyways. Really cool drill. Have yet to receive it though.
I work at a construction site and it seems DeWalt are the drills of choice by all the other construction workers. They treat them badly, drop them, knock them around, banged them up something good. They're pretty much worn and beaten. I've even seen one that had a cracked shell but yet they it still worked perfectly fine. That's the kind of reliability I want. Strange thing is that most of them where using the lesser drills like the 14.4v and even 7 volt. And I've seen them used for various things even cutting through masonry. If the 14.4v and 7v are good enough, the 18volt should do pretty damn well. :notworthy:
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The reasoning behind a lot of people using 14.4 volt and under is because at 18 volts they become too cumbersome to handle. If I needed the power of an 18 volt drill I'd much rather just use my corded dewalt. Much lighter and more power. I'm not saying there's not a place for 18 volt drills, just not for general purpose use. Even my 14.4 volt Bosch is kind of big, but tolerable.
Makita's new LXT 18 volt lithium ion drills are nice though. 18 volt power at 12 volt weight. :notworthy:
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Ha, I had forgotten about the 12v option. But they aren't listed cause hammer drills are 14.4v and up. Well like Tim Allen used to say on the show, Home Improvement; "More Power!"
As for being cumbersome, perhaps so in size but not so in control since it has many speed options.