Build Your Own Arcade Controls Forum
Main => Main Forum => Topic started by: ElKootcho on March 13, 2007, 07:46:56 pm
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I recently picked up the x-arcade BYO arcade kit and when it arrived it was fairly obvious that it's not what I wanted. The main issue that I have is the pain-in-the-ass chore of switching from 4-way to 8-way (which will likely happen frequently). The programming of the board seems to be a bit of a pain as well but once done, should stay done so I can deal with that if needed. The board will handle 28 inputs.
Why'd I buy x-arcade? lifetime warranty and 30-day return policy (which I may be taking advantage of soon). price is a consideration as well. Their kit was a bit cheaper.
Soooo, Mac users: what do you recommend? I see these as my options (but please steer me in another direction if you have a better idea):
1: return all x-arcade products and start over with ipac2 (does MacIPAC application work well?) or is there another well respected MAC-compatible encoder?
2: keep x-arcade product and add dedicated 4-way stick
3: keep x-arcade encoder and upgrade to mag-stick for easy switching from 4 to 8-way
4: do you have another idea?
I'm probably just over thinking this whole thing.
Thank you for any help.
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Any encoder that will read as a standard USB keyboard or mouse should work fine. The programming part is probably the trickiest.
I think Ultimarc is the only one who offers a mac programming utility. All of the encoders I know of come pre-programmed to the MAME/MacMAME defaults anyway.
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Hi can you explain to me what is involved in the 4 way 8 way changeover. As far as I know the X-arcade units only had 8 way joysticks.
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It involves removing a c-clip and flipping a part on the bottom of the stick. http://www.x-arcade.com/service/open.shtml
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Not that I've seen or used one, but the general design of the x-arcade stick seems very similar to the Happ Super http://www.happcontrols.com/joysticks/super_joy_e.htm
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Ok thanks, I sort of remember that manouver but I can not remember anyone being happy doing it. You move the actuator but there is no restrictor to change the feel of the stick. I thought it might have changed but that sounds like sthe same old same old. X-arcade joys as far as I have tried do not work well in 4 way. I have a couple of ultimarc 4/8 ways that do what I want now. Just have to work out an adapter to put them in since their mounts are slightly different.
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The OS X IPac app works great. In fact I have an old IPac that I couldn't program under Windows no matter what I tried, hooked it up to my PowerBook and I was golden.
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Not a mac user, but - - -
The primary advantage of the X-Arcade encoder is the ability to use it with consoles (PS2/Xbox/SNES) etc. It is not as good of an encoder (lag and ghosting/blocking) as other offerings - based on what others have said.
>1: return all x-arcade products and start over with ipac2 (does MacIPAC application work well?) or is there >another well respected MAC-compatible encoder?
I-PAC/2 is a good option for a keyboard based encoder. The MiniPac or I-PAC VE would also work, AFAIK. The GGG GP-Wiz would also likely work (at least for MAME), but it is a gamepad rather than keyboard encoder.
>2: keep x-arcade product and add dedicated 4-way stick
That is an option.
>3: keep x-arcade encoder and upgrade to mag-stick for easy switching from 4 to 8-way
Or GGG Prodigy joystick, or Ultimarc J-Stick, Happ Universal (Ultimarc E-Stick), etc. You have quite a few options here.
>I'm probably just over thinking this whole thing.
Nothing wrong with that.
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As Tiger-Heli mentioned - you might want to consider a GPWiz from GroovyGameGear - which the Mac should recognize as a USB gamepad; and you can probably find some software to remap the extra buttons to do whatever you want; Griffin Proxi might do the trick. http://proxi.griffintechnology.com/wiki/index.php/Proxi
And for Joysticks - GGG has their OmniStik Prodigy joystick that has a top mounted switch. Sounds like it could be a good solution for you.
http://groovygamegear.com
I am a dedicated Mac user, but decided a PC would be a better/cheaper option in a dedicated cabinet.
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I am a dedicated Mac user, but decided a PC would be a better/cheaper option in a dedicated cabinet.
Thanks, everyone, for your input. I agree that PC might be easier but I'm going with Mac simply because I have an old Blue & White G3 (450 mhz/ 1 GB ram) sittin' around doing nothin' but looking pretty along with a 19" monitor so I figure that I'll put them to use.
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I miss my blue-and-white.
I had a 400mHz that ran games at full speed that putter along on the 1.4mHz Celeron that's in my MAME cab. I think the OpenGL accelleration helped dramatically. The weakest link was finding a viable front-end/launcher. It also kind of sucks that MacMAME doesn't include any way to pick games and options without using a mouse. I know that IS the Mac interface guideline, but it really limited my options for a seamless game machine that didn't feel like you were messing with a computer. I could never get AdvanceMAME/AdvanceMenu to work right.
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IS there a working frontend/launcher for Mac? My plan (for the moment) is to use an ADB Glidepoint touchpad that I hope to integrate into the control panel.
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I'm using an iPac with my G3/300 B&W.
The GGG gamepad encoder would probably work, but I'd worry that you may run into software limitations on the number of buttons supported.
If you're really into vector games, I'd look into using v.30-v.33 for the vector games.
The vector emulation back in those versions was alot better than the newer versions for some reason.
The other notable jumps in quality/speed are around v.60, and around v.77.
Just prior to v.58 (IIRC), and somewhere after v.60a there were controller problems, and speed issues, for the older comps.
Somewhere around v.77 they switched to OSX only, IIRC.
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Will you be running OS-X on your B&W? If so check out Jukebox; a pretty cool mame FE from the looks of it; http://www.c3images.com/jukebox/
I remember seeing another Mac FE for mame but I can't find the link at the moment...
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IS there a working frontend/launcher for Mac? My plan (for the moment) is to use an ADB Glidepoint touchpad that I hope to integrate into the control panel.
I first read about EmuLaunch about a week after I gave away my B&W G3. I've not tried it but it looks promising.
http://emulaunch.com/
I still have a spare glidepoint that I bought for that purpose too. I started to give up on the G3 when I realized my frogger-style control panel couldn't comfortably fit 2 6-button layouts plus a trackball. I could have squeezed the glidepoint in, but I wanted something a bit more seamless that didn't ruin the illusion of using a normal-looking control panel. Besides having 7 buttons per player, you wouldn't know by looking at the CP that it's a MAME cab. There are no admin buttons at all. I originally did this because I only had a 7x24 control panel to fit all of the controls, but I don't regret doing it at all.
Any HID-compliant USB gamepad will work fine in OS X without drivers. You can use USB Overdrive and Gamepad Companion to do some configuration. Without a dedicated driver you'll lose some features though. For instance, my Sidewinder steering wheel works fine for game control, but none of the force feedback stuff works. I also found that the gameport-->USB adapters at RadioShack are pretty handy. Last month when I was in a store they were clearanced to like $6, so I'm not sure how much longer they'll be around. It worked fine with every gamepad and steering wheel I tried with it.
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Will you be running OS-X on your B&W? If so check out Jukebox; a pretty cool mame FE from the looks of it; http://www.c3images.com/jukebox/
Yes, running 10.3.5. That FE looks cool. I'll definately keep an eye on it. Thanks for the link.
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I first read about EmuLaunch about a week after I gave away my B&W G3. I've not tried it but it looks promising.
http://emulaunch.com/
I still have a spare glidepoint that I bought for that purpose too. I started to give up on the G3 when I realized my frogger-style control panel couldn't comfortably fit 2 6-button layouts plus a trackball. I could have squeezed the glidepoint in, but I wanted something a bit more seamless that didn't ruin the illusion of using a normal-looking control panel.
I'll be checking emulaunch as well. Thank you.
Regarding glidepoint: it works well with my mac (tracks flawlessly and tap works). Do you know if there is any way to program the buttons under OS X? Right now all 3 function as a single mouse click.
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The primary advantage of the X-Arcade encoder is the ability to use it with consoles (PS2/Xbox/SNES) etc. It is not as good of an encoder (lag and ghosting/blocking) as other offerings - based on what others have said.
I've been puzzling over that for a while. From the looks of the design, the X-Arcade serializes the controls (CD40100?) then the modules do all the heavy lifting. Is there controller PCB design so crappy that they have ghosting?!
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Regarding glidepoint: it works well with my mac (tracks flawlessly and tap works). Do you know if there is any way to program the buttons under OS X? Right now all 3 function as a single mouse click.
With the old ADB one I have I couldn't get anything but basic one-click mouse behavior. Since there aren't any drivers for OS X I doubt there will ever be any support for the extra buttons. I think that the blue-and-whites are the only machines that officially support OS X and have a built-in ADB port. ADB support will always be in OS X though since pretty much all the iBooks and Powerbooks keyboards and trackpads are really ADB (which is also why they're the only ones left with a power key). I'm not sure if it's compatible or not, but you might try to download SideTrack or uControl with it. I don't think I could live without SideTrack on my iBook. It adds scrolling to the edges and lets you assign corner taps to do most any click or keystroke. I'm guessing your glidepoint is ADB as that's all I've ever seen for mac.
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Is there controller PCB design so crappy that they have ghosting?!
Not sure if the problems are ghosting (unpressed keys showing up) or blocking (some keys not registering when more than two were pressed). What I've read was more on the blocking level, but I am only going on 3rd-party reports from other users and they may have just "thought" it did this. Reports were fairly scattered on this, and I would think a Fighter stick such as the X-Arcade would have had more reviews and testing pointing this out if it were a real issue.
Then again, the only encoders that I truly have first hand experience with are a prototype KeyWiz and the original TOKN KB16, and the KB16 exhibited extreme ghosting and yet got fairly positive reviews until I tested it. (The latest version now includes diodes on the PCB which should have solved this problem.)
One other possible concern is that I am pretty sure the board is either active lo or hi - i.e. - where the Hagstrom, Ultimarc, and GGG encoders all use a common ground for switches and feed +5V through the switch when pressed, I believe the X-Arcade uses a common +5V line and feeds a GND through the switch when pressed. The only practical consideration of this is it makes it VERY difficult to use it with Perfect 360 or similar (Suzo Inductive) joysticks. FWIW.
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I see these as my options (but please steer me in another direction if you have a better idea):
1: return all x-arcade products and start over with ipac2 (does MacIPAC application work well?) or is there another well respected MAC-compatible encoder?
I'm still over thinking this whole thing, but after much consideration, your advice and a few PMs with divemaster, I've decided to return the x-arcade product and go with ipac2 and higher quality joysticks (maybe Mag-Stick Plus).
I realized that in trying to keep costs down, I'm really doing it in the wrong area. (I'll save money somewhere else.) Thank you for all of your kind posts. So glad I found this forum!!