Build Your Own Arcade Controls Forum
Main => Main Forum => Topic started by: emb on February 02, 2007, 10:59:27 am
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Does anyone have any tips for making an efficient control panel design when you have a narrow arcade cabinet (or at least to allow more elbow room)? My goal is to make it as tight, comfortable, and efficient as possible.
I recently received an arcade cabinet. It is 23.75" wide. It is somewhat narrow. I want to play fighter games on it, but when I have drawn it out to scale there is not enough elbow room, (only about 5 inches from player 1 buttons to the player 2 joystick.
On the panel I will have:
P1, P2 = (start buttons)
J4 = 4-directional joystick
J8 = 8-directional joystick x 2
B = button
-----------------22.25"----------------
P1 P2
J4
J8 B B B ------5"----J8 B B B
B B B B B B B B
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I was thinking about making the control panel wider than the cabinet, but I do not want it too wide so you have trouble viewing the 19" arcade monitor.
I was also thinking about angling the joystick and buttons, but I am having troubles determining an efficient angle.
Any tips or pointers are greatly appreciated.
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My advice? Drop the 4-way joystick. You will never be happy with all that, no matter what you do. I have a 23" CP (that's the standard Galaga cab width) with two sticks and 3 buttons per player (you could fit 6 per, it'd be a little more crowded, but not substantially) and it's not ideal for 2 people, just livable. Stick another joystick in the middle and it would suck.
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My first cabinet had a 22.5" cp on it. There is just no way to put a fighter layout on it and be comfortable. We couldn't even play Joust/Mario Bros on it for very long. I eventually gave up trying to make it work and converted it to a vertical 4 way arcade.
Minimum for a 2 player cabinet is 24". And even then, you'll want skinny friends.
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Get rid of the 8th button and use the top row plus the first button on the bottom row for the 4th button in Neo Geo games. It's not ideal, but it will give you ~4" more space to work with.
I don't really agree that you have to get rid of the 4-way, but it will be cramped. Set up a test panel using some strong cardboard or a scrap piece of wood, and give it a go. Try playing for 30 minutes next to a buddy and see how it is. If you don't like it, and need the two player fighting setup, just extend your control panel by 6" or so to either side, you'll still be able to see the monitor just fine but you'll have more room.
Good luck,
John
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make the cp wider... thats my plan for my unit.
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I had the same issue (23.75") and agree that you're going to be very hard pressed to find a way to get that many buttons in. I had to alter the regular layout of just four buttons to make my CP remotely playable.
And this layout has been proven (at least at my house) to work well for two players.
Here is a pic:
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I had the same issue (23.75") and agree that you're going to be very hard pressed to find a way to get that many buttons in. I had to alter the regular layout of just four buttons to make my CP remotely playable.
And this layout has been proven (at least at my house) to work well for two players.
Here is a pic:
Hey, you stole my socks. ;D
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I had a similar issue with my cab, so I modified it to house a 2 player by bringing the control panel forward out of the cabinet to allow room for the other player. Trackball and spinner in the back of the CP (towards the monitor) and, yep a USB Arcade Stick to play DOT.
If your CP is metal you will have to replace it with a wooden one. It won't look out of place and will suit your needs. Be wary of advice to make it a simple player CP, as you decide what goes on it, and not somebody else.
Besides Joust, Fighting Games and Robotron wouldn't be playable on my cab, if I didn't take the plunge and make it 2 player. Buttons? 4 or 6 each. I made my CP extension out of softwood but standard 2x2s would suffice.
Please take pictures and ask away if you are not sure about woodwork. Odds are somebody has done it before you. ;D
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Be wary of advice to make it a simple player CP, as you decide what goes on it, and not somebody else.
This is true - it's your cabinet. I don't think you should be "wary" of anyone giving you advice after you ask for it. It's just an opinion. Definitely do with it what you will.
Odds are somebody has done it before you. ;D
Exactly. We've both built narrow arcade machines. My result was that it wasn't for me - it cost me money and time. The difference is I wouldn't suggest he take your advice any less serious than mine.
No harm no foul... :)
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When I mean wary I mean to take it as it is intended, but not as gospel, as a good idea can turn out like a real bad one. I think I am a victim of this. I was given some advice on this board for my cab, but it turned out expensive to replace as it wasn't a good idea for me, in my situation.
But I think you nailed it on the head there Leap! :cheers:
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I took all your suggestions into consideration (it was a huge help). I liked the suggestion to make the control panel just slightly wider than the cabinet itself (only by a few inches, thanks johnperkins21 and steveh). There is a perfect amount of elbow room now. I will upload my measurements sometime this week. While it still has a few cosmetic changes, it has been quite popular when we have company.
The top left joystick is the 4-way joystick. The top 3 buttons are for the 4 way joystick and trackball (not yet installed). It is positioned far enough away from the trackball so nobody not bashes their fingers when playing bowling.
The 2 red joysticks are 8-way. I used 7 buttons because I wanted a similar feel for when playing the neo-geo games.
My only regret was placing the Player 1 and Player 2 start buttons so close to each other. I initially did this to keep the control panel looking clean. But on default, MAME exits when you press both these buttons simultaneously. When you are really into the game, and you slam on the buttons, your fingers will accidentally hit both buttons if you are not paying any attention. To work around this I am going to reconfigure mame to exit on a different button combination.
On the sides, I have easy access coin insert buttons.
There is still a lot of work that needs to be done with the cabinet:
1) Trackball (golden tee and bowling games)
2) Marquee (Fiance' is a graphic design major, and is coming up designs), the marquee that came with the cabinet just doesn't cut it
3) Sides (Fiance' is coming up with some graphics here as well, will be red and black)
4) T-Molding around edges and control panel
5) Black Textured Vinyl Laminate on the control panel (or some scratch resistant plexi-glass)
6) Those T-Brackets are pretty ugly there. Those are just temporary for support. I will add more support and remove those when the time is ready.
I'll post more as development progresses. Thanks for all your ideas!
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One concern I'd have with building the CP out that far...stability. You might want to add a "foot" or some type of extension onto the bottom edge. You don't want to get in a heated game and have the cabinet rocking or topple.
My frogger-style MAME cabinet has a 24" CP. I could have fit a trackball and had 6 buttons per player but it would've been cramped. In the end I dropped the trackball and just went with 8-way joys and the "standard" 7-button layout. It's tighter than it could be with 2 players, but it's not uncomfortable. It helped that Frogger has the start buttons on the front edge. I can still play 95% of the games in MAME. I also have a spare panel for this cab that I thought about making into an "analog panel"-- Trackball, spinner, and 3 buttons. Attached is my final layout.
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One concern I'd have with building the CP out that far...stability. You might want to add a "foot" or some type of extension onto the bottom edge. You don't want to get in a heated game and have the cabinet rocking or topple.
Actually I did not have any issues with stability. The cabinet is very heavy. For enhanced support I have two long boards inside the control panel going into the cabinet, and it is locked securely in place.
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oh god, that control panel is ridiculous. (poor centipede!) Why would you want players standing on either SIDE of the monitor and then craning their necks to see? What's the point? Homophobic? Don't want your shoulder rubbing against your guy friends? :P
I too have a Frogger style cab liek Crowquil (24" wide). I set up 2 players with 4 buttons each. Its fine to play 2 players. A little tight, but no one's gotten pregnant playing so I guess we're not THAT close together.
I don't see a problem with a an extended panel, but look at all that empty space in between!
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I don't see a problem with a an extended panel, but look at all that empty space in between!
I think that's for the trackball, spinner, tron stick, star wars yoke, 270 wheel, and light guns. ;D
I think the thing that's a little weird is that after asking for input about the control panel and saying you only want to make it a few inches wider than the cab, you build it a foot out from the front without asking for input. I'm not against building larger control panels to go on classic cabs, but I'd definitely say there's a better way to implement it.
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That's funny that you guys think 24" is too small for two players. I have a two player, six button setup running on one of modular panels for my 22" wide bartop.
Just personal preference, I guess.
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That's funny that you guys think 24" is too small for two players. I have a two player, six button setup running on one of modular panels for my 22" wide bartop.
Just personal preference, I guess.
You have skinnier friends. If you saw some of my friends you'd want a 80" control panel
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The game that pretty much started it all, "Street Fighter II: The World Warrior", was a kit intended for 19" monitor cabinets, usually Dynamo's, which had a 23 5/8" wide control panel (add about 1 3/4" for overall cabinet width including side panels). That other classic 2 player fighting game, "Karate Champ Player VS. Player" was in a 19" monitor Data East cabinet with the same dimensions as the aforementioned Dynamo's.
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oh god, that control panel is ridiculous. (poor centipede!) Why would you want players standing on either SIDE of the monitor and then craning their necks to see? What's the point? Homophobic? Don't want your shoulder rubbing against your guy friends? :P
I don't see a problem with a an extended panel, but look at all that empty space in between!
That empty space is for a track ball which I have not yet mounted. There is only a couple inch overhang, and when you put 2 people side by side, you don't even end up touching elbows. Also, the panel is extended out far enough so that you do not have to bend your head or twist your body to see the monitor inside the cabinet. It all feels natural to the players when I asked them.
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Looking at it the way it is now, I'd be more concerned with the depth than the width. That 4-way is going to be tough to use for serious gaming.
The game that pretty much started it all, "Street Fighter II: The World Warrior", was a kit intended for 19" monitor cabinets, usually Dynamo's, which had a 23 5/8" wide control panel (add about 1 3/4" for overall cabinet width including side panels). That other classic 2 player fighting game, "Karate Champ Player VS. Player" was in a 19" monitor Data East cabinet with the same dimensions as the aforementioned Dynamo's.
In the end most of those worth playing ended up in Dynamo cut-corner cabs. By moving the CP out farther from the monitor and main cabinet, it gives a little more elbow room. Most of the SFII coversions I played besides these were kind of cramped and I think that's partially why many had weird button layouts.
The Primal Rage cabinet I have uses the same design philosophy. The players stand back away from the monitor a bit giving them more room. It's CP is only 24" wide. Also, note the "foot" on the front.
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That's funny that you guys think 24" is too small for two players. I have a two player, six button setup running on one of modular panels for my 22" wide bartop.
Just personal preference, I guess.
You have skinnier friends. If you saw some of my friends you'd want a 80" control panel
I can't even imagine that. Please tell your friends to lay off the corn syrup.
A simple way to do that is to replace soda with decent beer. :cheers:
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Looking at it the way it is now, I'd be more concerned with the depth than the width. That 4-way is going to be tough to use for serious gaming.
I see where you are coming from. This has been tried and tested by about 25 different people who used my cabinet. Most of them used the 4-way, and they had no issues with reach. All who used it said it was very comfortable, and no issues with performance.
Also for the 2 player action. There is a 21" flatscreen CRT monitor. Nobody who used the system had any complaints on comfort.
Hopefully I will have time to upload the dimensions over the weekeend (been a little hard with finals coming up around the corner)
I will admit that I was pretty skeptical and worried myself when I drew the dimensions. But after a lot of manipulation with visio (and many pieces of cardboard later), This layout does work well for everyone who has used the cabinet so far.
I would like to have a wider cabinet, but my lack of funding from being in school is a major issue.