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Main => Main Forum => Topic started by: 1UP on March 19, 2003, 04:54:10 am

Title: Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: 1UP on March 19, 2003, 04:54:10 am: I have been wondering for some time how to add dedicated add-coin switches to my cab, so my guests wouldn't be bothered remembering the I-PAC shift key for inserting coins, etc. I really hate the idea of adding extra buttons for MAME functions onto my control panel, so I wanted them to be logical and inconspicuous. Then it dawned on me that there are 2 buttons on almost every cabinet that go unused as inputs -- the coin reject butons! Hmmm.... 8)

(http://1uparcade.hypermart.net/images/coin-reject-close.jpg)
A quick fumble thru the spare-parts bin turned up 2 small microswitches with roller levers. I cut off two small chunks of wood to be used as spacers (about 1.5" x 3/4" x 1/4") and screwed the switches securely in place on the wood. Then I placed double-sided tape on the backs of the wood, and pressed them into place on the upper coin chutes, so that the switch actuators would be in contact with the plastic wedges that get pushed down by the red reject buttons.

(http://1uparcade.hypermart.net/images/coin-reject-back.jpg)
Then I wired across the common terminals of both switches, and ran this wire to the coin door's "test" switch, with another wire running from the switch down to the ground wire on the original coin mech switch. This allows me to "cut" the ground that runs to the reject button microswitches, so that tokens must be used to play games if I desire. Otherwise, I can get credits by either pressing the reject switches, or inserting tokens in the coin slots.

The two reject microswitches have wires connected from the NC terminal, to the NO terminal on the corresponding coin mech switches. This means that the reject switches are held open by the plastic wedges, and become closed when the wedge moves downward as the coin reject buttons are pressed, and the microswitch actuator arms are released. The reject buttons only need to be pressed in about 1/8" before the switch is closed, so a large amount of credits can be quickly racked up!

Obviously, I am using the reject buttons as the 5 and 6 buttons in MAME, but you could wire them to act as any two buttons. They could be secret shift or shazam! buttons for example... ;)
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: jets on March 19, 2003, 09:44:51 am: Thats pretty wierd. I was just thinking of doing that!! Ideas do float around...good job. My nephews are savages and I had to come up with a button for shifting that wasn't on the moon.
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: shmokes on March 19, 2003, 09:54:50 am: Those switches are held on with just double-sided tape? Wow. How does it hold up?
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: BombProofPlane on March 19, 2003, 10:38:36 am: i see a screw
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Rocky on March 19, 2003, 01:34:20 pm: I use the coin reject buttons for an easy coin up. I just use double sided tape to hold the microswitch in place. It has been holding up well for the few months I've been using it. I figure if it gives out, I'll just put a new piece of tape on it.

Rocky
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: 1UP on March 19, 2003, 02:09:04 pm: Quote from: shmokes on March 19, 2003, 09:54:50 am
Those switches are held on with just double-sided tape? Wow. How does it hold up?

Somebody didn't read... ;)

The switches are screwed into the wood, and the entire back side of the wood is held in place with the tape. You can still pull it off by force, but since the pressure of the switch actuators is minimal, there's no chance of it getting knocked off by accident.
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: ErikRuud on March 19, 2003, 02:16:09 pm: Nice Job 1Up!

I have a copy of Nults and Volts magazine that has a detailed write up on a stand-alone control panel. The author used coin reject buttons for the coin 1 & 2 buttons. He fabricated a simple switch bracket from some thick aluminum.
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: 1UP on March 19, 2003, 02:22:20 pm: Wow, I thought the idea was pretty unique! Amazing how so many people think alike. HowardC had the exact same idea on the chatboard last night! But I'm the first with pics! ;D
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Mameham on March 19, 2003, 02:47:39 pm: And I did this already with Mamehac -

(http://www.arcadepinball.com/basement/images/mamehac/coins.jpg)

Man that's a bad picture! Basically I did the same thing except I used leaf switches. :)

Glad someone else feels like me though and hates to put extra buttons on their cabinet... :)

- Eric
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Brax on March 19, 2003, 03:18:28 pm: The Roswell cab used this as well.

Its still a good idea, I was planning to use it myself ever since i saw the Roswell example.
http://www.arcadecontrols.com/arcade_roswell.html

Hey 1UP, think everyone has used this idea EXCEPT you! hehe Glad to see you on the bandwagon! ;)

(http://www.arcadecontrols.com/images/Roswell_CoinDoorMicroswitch.jpg)
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Brad Lee on March 19, 2003, 04:19:02 pm: Quote from: Mameham on March 19, 2003, 02:47:39 pm
Man that's a bad picture! Basically I did the same thing except I used leaf switches. :)

Glad someone else feels like me though and hates to put extra buttons on their cabinet... :)

- Eric

I had thought of this also, but got flustered with trying to mount microswitches. Reading this post right here reminded me that I've got a couple leaf's not doing anything... Maybe I'll have better luck with those

If you have any clearer pics, I wouldn't mind taking a peek
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: shmokes on March 19, 2003, 05:21:16 pm: I misspoke rather than misread :) Asside from the description I could clearly see in the pic that the switch was screwed into the wood. I guess I meant the "switch assembly" was held on with just double-sided tape. Nice job. I had planned on putting a button on the top of my cab for coin-up where only NBA players could see it, but this is a much better idea.
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Zinfari on March 19, 2003, 06:43:32 pm: Anyone see any issues with over use? Even an arcade isn't going to see this many pushes of the coin reject button! ;D

Hehe that being said... It'll be on my cab!

-Zinfari
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Sasquatch! on March 19, 2003, 06:43:55 pm: I waffle on whether I want to do this or not. YOU WANNA PLAY, YOU GOTTA PAY, BABY.

(I swapped out my mechs with token mechs and I have a little bucket of tokens handy, but still...)
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: shmokes on March 19, 2003, 09:08:35 pm: I don't think I've ever heard the word "waffle" used quite like that... :)
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Brax on March 19, 2003, 11:39:22 pm: I've only ever waffled on waffles myself.
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Howard_Casto on March 19, 2003, 11:47:38 pm: Quote from: Zinfari on March 19, 2003, 06:43:32 pm
Anyone see any issues with over use? Even an arcade isn't going to see this many pushes of the coin reject button! ;D

Hehe that being said... It'll be on my cab!

-Zinfari

Nah, coin reject buttons don't have anything to break.... it's just a plastic coin slot with a spring. The spring might wear out but that's a whole 50 cents to replace.
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Chris on March 20, 2003, 02:01:19 pm: My coin reject buttons are also wired to be the coin buttons. I also have a cutoff switch to disable this function.

Here's how mine are set up:

(http://mywebpages.comcast.net/celamantia/mamecab/images/New_Coin_Switches.jpg)

The circled additional switches are Happ coin switches with the actuators bent in such a way that they are triggered by the coin reject assembly.
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Chris on March 20, 2003, 02:03:47 pm: Quote from: 1UP on March 19, 2003, 02:22:20 pm
Wow, I thought the idea was pretty unique! Amazing how so many people think alike. HowardC had the exact same idea on the chatboard last night! But I'm the first with pics! ;D
My pics have been on my site for six months.. and I'm almost certain I've posted them here before... :)

--Chris
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: djsting on March 20, 2003, 03:17:55 pm: Chris,

I looked at your site and have a question about the cut off switch. You say this is part of a really old AT case which means that the two buttons are probably something like turbo and reset and what appears to be a key lock is the old way we used to lock the console. Are the two buttons set as the coin up bottons also? Is the key lock the cut off switch you talk about? If this is the case can you please tell me more about how you wired this? This is exactly what I have been thinking about doing (having a key lock act as the on/off switch for the coin up button).
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Chris on March 20, 2003, 03:37:51 pm: Exactly! The key lock was replaced with a dual-pole toggle switch, and the two buttons are in parallel with the coin switches, mapped to keys 5 and 6. One of these buttons is the original reset button from the AT case; the other is a Radio Shack momentary contact button to replace the Turbo on/off button.

So each coin entry has three switches in parallel: the actual coin switch and the credit button, which are always active, and the switches on the coin reject assemblies, which can be interrupted by the toggle switch. I use the toggle switch when I want to limit playing time: my daughter will pick a game, I'll open the coin door, turn off the free play, and use the credit buttons to add the number of credits I want her to have.

--Chris
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: djsting on March 20, 2003, 03:43:23 pm: Instead of using the dual-throw toggle switch can this be done with the key lock? What I would like is to be able to have the key lock on the outside of the cabinet and just turn the key to shut off the free play. Also, how did you wire this so that one toggle switch shuts off both coin switches?
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Chris on March 20, 2003, 04:00:51 pm: Taking your questions out of order...

Quote from: djsting on March 20, 2003, 03:43:23 pm
Also, how did you wire this so that one toggle switch shuts off both coin switches?
You need a dual-pole switch A dual-pole switch (I accidentally said dual-throw originally in my last post, but I've corrected it) is essentially two switches in one case.
Quote
Instead of using the dual-pole toggle switch can this be done with the key lock?
No, because it's not dual-pole... You'll need to find a dual-pole keyswitch, but I don't see any in the Mouser catalog...

--Chris
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: djsting on March 20, 2003, 04:04:40 pm: Ok, thank you. PLAN B: hide the toggle switch inside the coin door like everyone else does.
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Chris on March 20, 2003, 04:09:11 pm: Quote from: djsting on March 20, 2003, 04:04:40 pm
Ok, thank you. PLAN B: hide the toggle switch inside the coin door like everyone else does.
It would be more like an arcade game that way, and that's one less key you need...
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Brad Lee on March 21, 2003, 12:15:58 am: RE: the key lock as a toggle.. what about putting the keylock switch inline on the ground circuit for the coin rejects

GND----------keylock----------reject 1----------reject 2
COIN1------------------------------+ |
COIN 2-------------------------------------------------+

I would think that with the keylock in the open position it would break the ground so neither would work, and with it closed it'd function as normal
(is this correct?)
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: 1UP on March 21, 2003, 01:19:37 am: Quote from: Brad Lee on March 21, 2003, 12:15:58 am
RE: the key lock as a toggle.. what about putting the keylock switch inline on the ground circuit for the coin rejects

GND----------keylock----------reject 1----------reject 2
COIN1------------------------------+ |
COIN 2-------------------------------------------------+

I would think that with the keylock in the open position it would break the ground so neither would work, and with it closed it'd function as normal
(is this correct?)

Yep, I was just going to mention this. There is no need even for a DPDT switch, when you only need to interrupt one wire--the ground! My cutoff switch is just the old test switch that came with the coin door. It is basically a SPST switch that cuts the ground wire for the reject button switches. The coin mech switches are not affected by the cutoff, since the reject buttons are "downstream" in the circuit from the coin mechs. But the coin mechs and the reject switches are wired in parallel, just like the other example.

But I would think that you would want to keep the switches and locks separate, so that you can have the switches on or off, or the coin door locked or unlocked, in any combination. Say you have guests over. You want them to have free play, and therefore allow them to use the reject buttons for credits. But you don't want the kids climbing inside the cab, so you lock the coin door...
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Chris on March 21, 2003, 01:33:29 am: Ground will work if they're common. On my keyboard hack, 5 and 6 don't share common lines...

This also presumes you have an AT keyswitch for which you can actually find the key! :)

--Chris
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: 1UP on March 21, 2003, 01:38:45 am: Quote from: Chris on March 21, 2003, 01:33:29 am
Ground will work if they're common. On my keyboard hack, 5 and 6 don't share common lines...

This also presumes you have an AT keyswitch for which you can actually find the key! :)

--Chris

You also don't HAVE to use 5 and 6. Mame does allow remapping keys. You can even do a global remamp very easily in the TAB menu, so all games use some other buttons as coin 1 and 2. Then just find two keys that share a common wire, and use them for the coins.
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: SirPoonga on March 21, 2003, 01:56:20 am: Quote from: 1UP on March 21, 2003, 01:38:45 am
Quote from: Chris on March 21, 2003, 01:33:29 am
Ground will work if they're common. On my keyboard hack, 5 and 6 don't share common lines...

This also presumes you have an AT keyswitch for which you can actually find the key! :)

--Chris

You also don't HAVE to use 5 and 6. Mame does allow remapping keys. You can even do a global remamp very easily in the TAB menu, so all games use some other buttons as coin 1 and 2. Then just find two keys that share a common wire, and use them for the coins.

using ctrlr files to do mappings is better though....
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: djsting on March 21, 2003, 09:05:05 am: On related topic I have a question about the MAME coin up buttons. Are 5 and 6 the only ones? This would be player 1 and 2 but what about players 3 and 4 coin up buttons? FYI: I will be using the iPac4 if this makes any difference. But I do still want to know the keyboard keys for this.
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Brad Lee on March 21, 2003, 09:14:22 am: 5/6/7/8 are p1-4 coins
1/2/3/4 are p1-4 start

most games you can use any coin in any slot, but some like Gauntlet tie the coin slot to the player

back on topic I got my leaf switches and some small plastic brackets that should work for mounting.. I need to rearrange some wiring anyway so Im gonna give it a shot. If it works I'll get some pics
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Chris on March 21, 2003, 11:48:17 am: Quote from: djsting on March 21, 2003, 09:05:05 am
On related topic I have a question about the MAME coin up buttons. Are 5 and 6 the only ones? This would be player 1 and 2 but what about players 3 and 4 coin up buttons? FYI: I will be using the iPac4 if this makes any difference. But I do still want to know the keyboard keys for this.
I have a "Function" key on my CP that I use as a shift key, and when it's held down the Start buttons are Start 3 and Start 4 (useful for Track and Field and Trivial Pursuit) and the coins are Coin 3 and Coin 4 (pretty useless on my 2 player cab, but there just in case.)

And I know I could remap the buttons, but for non-play buttons like coins and start where there is little worry of ghosting, I just stuck with the regular keys. It was only one extra wire to my coin door...

--Chris
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Elkor on March 21, 2003, 02:43:33 pm: I also did this, to mount the switches I used plain old krazy glue. works great.
to make the coin reject buttons move smoothly just take out the coin mech. works like a champ.
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Brax on March 21, 2003, 03:15:02 pm: whoa! Alot of people really have done this! sheesh! hehe
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: Brad Lee on March 21, 2003, 05:53:19 pm: Quote from: Elkor on March 21, 2003, 02:43:33 pm
I also did this, to mount the switches I used plain old krazy glue. works great.
to make the coin reject buttons move smoothly just take out the coin mech. works like a champ.

But with the coin mechs out, how do you make sure that coins dropped thru the slots A)registers as a credit, and B)goes into the coin box or whatever you have setup to collect coins?

The 1st is semi-sarcastic, but I had a problem with the second since without the mechs, quarters just kinda dropped wherever they wanted
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: 1UP on March 22, 2003, 02:56:26 pm: Quote from: Brad Lee on March 21, 2003, 05:53:19 pm
Quote from: Elkor on March 21, 2003, 02:43:33 pm
I also did this, to mount the switches I used plain old krazy glue. works great.
to make the coin reject buttons move smoothly just take out the coin mech. works like a champ.

But with the coin mechs out, how do you make sure that coins dropped thru the slots A)registers as a credit, and B)goes into the coin box or whatever you have setup to collect coins?

The 1st is semi-sarcastic, but I had a problem with the second since without the mechs, quarters just kinda dropped wherever they wanted

Yeah, some people actually want to USE their coin mechs! I'd rather keep everything as functional as possible, otherwise the coin door is just window dressing. Its also a good way to limit kids play time, or even your own (if you find yourself playing when it's time to go to work... ;) )

Besides, you can set up the switches so that you only have to push the buttons a fraction of an inch to get credits, without having to fight the coin mech. Simple.
Title: Re:Coin reject buttons as input in MAME!
Post by: MrArcade on March 22, 2003, 03:08:07 pm: I wired my rejects as coin switches around 3 years ago. It was on the Mark I cab. I doubt that I was THE first one to do it, but I was one of the first. I did a lot of brainstorming on that cab and thought it was awesome when it was done....now it still seems neat since it was a mini....but with so few controls it does not rate awesome anymore...
I had a lot more pics of the cab up...but storage got tight....so many had to go...including the coin switch pc....but the roswell cab is very similar. As I recall I used one existing hole and had to drill the other. very easy actually.

http://home.woh.rr.com/ultimatearcade/marki/marki.htm (http://home.woh.rr.com/ultimatearcade/marki/marki.htm)