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Main => Everything Else => Topic started by: shmokes on October 29, 2004, 09:07:58 pm
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I wonder if this will have any effect. I'm sure you all know by now that Osama bin Laden has released a new video tape (http://www.reuters.co.uk/newsPackageArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=612321§ion=news), presumably hoping to affect the outcome of the election.
Here's an excerpt that could be important:
"We had agreed with the (the September 11) overall commander Mohammed Atta, may God rest his soul, to carry out all operations in 20 minutes before Bush and his administration take notice.
"It never occurred to us that the commander in chief of the American forces (Bush) would leave 50,000 citizens in the two towers to face those horrors alone at a time when they most needed him because he thought listening to a child discussing her goat and its ramming was more important than the planes and their ramming of the skyscrapers. This had given us three times the time needed to carry out the operations, thanks be to God...
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I'm sorry, I am not sure how that excerpt will have any importance whatsoever.
Could you please elaborate on your point?
Are you implying that because Bush didn't drop the child's book and run, you agree that he somehow enabled the terrorists? If yes, the fact that you are lapping up this stuff like a kitten to milk is truly alarming.
This video was a taunt, a signal for the cells to engage, or possibly an attempt to negotiate. In either case it helps W.
edit:grammar
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I don't think that Shmokes is agreeing with what Bin Laden is saying, but that is what Bin Laden is trying to say. The tape has no relevance to anything, Osama is just trying to make voters freak out before the election over nothing.
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I honestly don't think it will help or harm either candidate.
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I honestly don't think it will help or harm either candidate.
Agreed. It's just there to intimidate.
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lapping up this stuff like a kitten to milk is truly alarming.
Someone give Santoro a tranquilizer. I don't think the phrase, "I wonder if this will have any effect," is really all that threatening. But the news is very significant and the portion quoted was a pointed attack in the video at a candidate in our election. Whether it will or won't be significant with regards to the outcome of the election has little to do with whether it should or shouldn't be.
My personal prediction is that this news will affect different demographics differently and will depend largely on how it is portrayed by the bulk of the mainstream press over the next few days.
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I wonder if this will have any effect. I'm sure you all know by now that Osama bin Laden has released a new video tape (http://www.reuters.co.uk/newsPackageArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=612321§ion=news), presumably hoping to affect the outcome of the election.
Here's an excerpt that could be important:
"We had agreed with the (the September 11) overall commander Mohammed Atta, may God rest his soul, to carry out all operations in 20 minutes before Bush and his administration take notice.
"It never occurred to us that the commander in chief of the American forces (Bush) would leave 50,000 citizens in the two towers to face those horrors alone at a time when they most needed him because he thought listening to a child discussing her goat and its ramming was more important than the planes and their ramming of the skyscrapers. This had given us three times the time needed to carry out the operations, thanks be to God...
You get that from a john kerry website?
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Here's a still I captured, for those of you who haven't seen the video yet... :P
(http://s90378193.onlinehome.us/images/binbushie.jpg)
-mrC
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Someone give Santoro a tranquilizer.
Dude, you said that the quoted excerpt could be important. How? Really, I will be glad if I misunderstood what you said. Did I?
Edit - I re-read your post. It is an attack on one of our candidates, but a really lame, transparent on at best. Hardly 'important' by any interpretation.
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I wonder if this will have any effect.
Personally, I have no idea what effect this video will have on the election. My instincts say it's just red meat for either side. Each will see what it wants to see...as for the mythical "undecided"...no idea.
One thing I find very interesting though is the fact that the State Department tried to suppress the video, so it appears they (possibly) feel it's detrimental to Bush:
"The State Department on Friday urged the government of Qatar, which finances Al-Jazeera, not to broadcast a videotaped speech by Osama bin Laden (news - web sites), a senior State Department official said." (http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20041029/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/state_bin_laden_1)
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Imagine you work in the State Dept. and are trying to decide whether or not to let it out:
If you publish it, it would be interpreted by many as an attempt to boost Bush because National Security is 'his issue. ' They might have tried to hide it a few days until the election is over just to avoid bad appearances.
I actually think that they won't raise the terror level to 'Orange" for the same reason. Were it not for the upcoming election, I think they would be talking about raising the level after these two recent tapes. (Remember Bin Laden speaks before a lot of Al Queda attacks.)
The tape could be a signal from Bin Laden to the cells to move on some plan. I would seriously consider burying it for a while for that reason also.
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I really don't think it's going to influence the election. I think the news analysts at ABC might be correct. Osama released this now because he knows it will get lots of air time.
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The tape could be a signal from Bin Laden to the cells to move on some plan. I would seriously consider burying it for a while for that reason also.
This brings up another interesting point. Now that the tape is out, what happens if it truly does signal an attack? Does another 9/11 scale attack on America mean Bush has failed to protect us or does it mean he should get another four years to try?
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I would argue that 3 1/2 years is not an awful lot of time to wipe out global terrorism, and that GWB should be given the 4 extra years.
But that's just me. :-)
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Santoro,
Well, here's the scoop from those that'd claim to protect you...
"We want people to think 'terrorism' for the last four days," said a Bush-Cheney campaign official. "And anything that raises the issue in people's minds is good for us."
A senior GOP strategist added, "anything that makes people nervous about their personal safety helps Bush."
He called it "a little gift (http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/247753p-212149c.html)," saying it helps the President but doesn't guarantee his reelection.
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They consider it a "gift" that Osama is still alive. How would you feel is Kerry called Osama's continued existence a "gift"?
Yeah, like these clowns in office deserve four more years to help terrorism become the gift that keeps on giving. Too bad for you they end up saying things like this. I can only hope this gets played on the news 24-7 until election day, right after the OBL tape.
- mrC
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It makes sense that Bin Laden wants Bush in power. His actions create so many new followers for Bin laden.
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Well, here's the scoop from those that'd claim to protect you...
"We want people to think 'terrorism' for the last four days," said a Bush-Cheney campaign official. "And anything that raises the issue in people's minds is good for us."
A senior GOP strategist added, "anything that makes people nervous about their personal safety helps Bush."
He called it "a little gift (http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/247753p-212149c.html)," saying it helps the President but doesn't guarantee his reelection.
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They consider it a "gift" that Osama is still alive. How would you feel is Kerry called Osama's continued existence a "gift"?
I really do not believe that he was implying that OBL being alive was the gift, but rather the fact that he chose to speak at this particular time.
Certainly saying that out loud was cynical and in poor taste. But anyone running on a strong terror defense platform would think the same thing.
Trust me, there is more than enough cynicism on both sides of this election.
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It makes sense that Bin Laden wants Bush in power. His actions create so many new followers for Bin laden.
Yep.
Funny how they caught Saddam while Enemy No#1 is still at large. It seems they both need each other.
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Certainly saying that out loud was cynical and in poor taste. But anyone running on a strong terror defense platform would think the same thing.
No. No they wouldn't. I don't believe we'd hear anyone from the Kerry camp say anything close to this. The right-wing would never let them get away with it.
Trust me, there is more than enough cynicism on both sides of this election.
You seem like a sensible enough person, and on the above I'd agree with you. However, that being said, cynicism it one thing, disgustingly craven behavior is quite another.
Osama's last gift was 3000+ dead U.S. citizens. It's obvious through this gleeful quote that Bush isn't running on a defense platform, but rather a terror platform. He *needs* you to be scared, and he definitely needs you to feel unsafe. How else can you explain the "OBL tape does wonders for Bush campaign" theory? Shouldn't it be the other way around?
Quote: "We want people to think 'terrorism' for the last four days"...
This is not a world I'd want my kids to grow up in. A world without hope, steeped in fear. Terrorists *are* out there, but they shouldn't control our lives. I can't wait until Tues. to take my country back from fear.
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Santoro,
Well, here's the scoop from those that'd claim to protect you...
"We want people to think 'terrorism' for the last four days," said a Bush-Cheney campaign official. "And anything that raises the issue in people's minds is good for us."
A senior GOP strategist added, "anything that makes people nervous about their personal safety helps Bush."
He called it "a little gift (http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/247753p-212149c.html)," saying it helps the President but doesn't guarantee his reelection.
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They consider it a "gift" that Osama is still alive. How would you feel is Kerry called Osama's continued existence a "gift"?
I'd feel about the same as I felt after hearing Kerry refer to getting terrorism on a level of "a nuisance". something similar to prostitution.
Simply stunning to me, you give us a story claiming reports of some mysterious "high ranking GOP officials", yet hearsay in any other form that would refute your claims, you'd be crying bloody murder that there is no real source other than Bush's lying henchmen planting stories.
What an utterly surprising "scoop" ::) you've given us. I noticed you didn't think it important to quote the biased reporter's implication "But the new tape - which is so nakedly political that it should end with the words "I'm Osama Bin Laden and I approved this message"
The guy implies that Osama's out there stumping for Bush, and we're SERIOUSLY supposed to swallow what you have to say about this "Pulitzer-worthy" bird cage liner material?
I'm afraid to see what you have for us next, as I may be eating while reading, and I'd hate to puke all over my favorite keyboard.
I think Santoro said it best about you when he said :-X
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I guess I'm the only BYOACer that thinks this tape is a fake. Rove HAS been busy, whaever blood money they're paying him, he earned it.
Dexter
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Hmm what I got from the message was: Let us live in peace (Muslums)
and we will let you live in peace (Americans).
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I initially thought it would help Bush out (all terrorist talk seems to help his numbers). but then when I heard that he was mocking and even thanking Bush for being so bad at president that it help them in their mission... I'm pretty sure it wont help bush.
I thought it was interesting how he was saying that they are fighting for freedom, they aren't afraid or hate freedom. And how they didn't start a war against Sweden.
I wish we would start looking at what creates terroriest (bad foreign policy) as much as we spend time trying to find ways to kill them.
Terrorist are created by pure hatred. And when we have a foreign policy that causes their government to hate, we go to war. When our foreingn policy causes their people to hate, it causes terrorism.
And don't take this as an anti-bush or kerry.... Terrorists aren't born in 4 years either. Sure we have made more people hate us in the world in the last few years... but there where already a bunch who did hate us at that point.
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I initially thought it would help Bush out (all terrorist talk seems to help his numbers). but then when I heard that he was mocking and even thanking Bush for being so bad at president that it help them in their mission... I'm pretty sure it wont help bush.
I thought it was interesting how he was saying that they are fighting for freedom, they aren't afraid or hate freedom. And how they didn't start a war against Sweden.
I wish we would start looking at what creates terroriest (bad foreign policy) as much as we spend time trying to find ways to kill them.
Terrorist are created by pure hatred. And when we have a foreign policy that causes their government to hate, we go to war. When our foreingn policy causes their people to hate, it causes terrorism.
And don't take this as an anti-bush or kerry.... Terrorists aren't born in 4 years either. Sure we have made more people hate us in the world in the last few years... but there where already a bunch who did hate us at that point.
Hits nail on the head.
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And don't take this as an anti-bush or kerry.... Terrorists aren't born in 4 years either. Sure we have made more people hate us in the world in the last few years... but there where already a bunch who did hate us at that point.
Nicely put. Thanks for that.
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I guess I'm the only BYOACer that thinks this tape is a fake. Rove HAS been busy, whaever blood money they're paying him, he earned it.
Dexter
Your views, as well as your assertions are so disgusting, you make MrC look well reasoned.
I'm willing to go out on a limb and state that, yes, you ARE the only person who believes in such an inane conspiracy theory as Karl Rove is responsible for that video, as everyone else takes their medication in a timely fashion, just as the doctor prescribed.
I believe it's time for you to take the blue pill now.
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So, according to this link heah, we get to see how bin Laden wants to cotnrol our election, threatening each individual state.
At least it's nice to know CA, NY, MA, and IL won't be attacked....unless of course, bin Laden surprises us and shows that he was lying....would he really lie to us? ::) (http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=41211)
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What the left should ask themselves following the Osama tape: "How did I become so reflexively partisan, so blinded by rage...that my own arguments are being echoed by a man who planned and enjoyed the mass murder of Americans?
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And in other news of the caliber of the links Drew likes to give us (http://www.weeklyworldnews.com/features/aliens/61245).
I know exactly what you mean, Drew. All this time I've thought that Bush reacted very poorly. I thought, "Man, when I was at work and somebody told me that the country was under attack I stopped what I was doing, which was actually important work. If I was the President of that country and somebody told me that my country was under attack, especially if I was just doing a photo op, I'd sure as hell stop what I was doing."
Now that I see that bin Laden thinks that I've totally changed my mind. Now I just hope I don't find out that he takes showers or brushes his teeth or anything.
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I know exactly what you mean, Drew. All this time I've thought that Bush reacted very poorly. I thought, "Man, when I was at work and somebody told me that the country was under attack I stopped what I was doing, which was actually important work. If I was the President of that country and somebody told me that my country was under attack, especially if I was just doing a photo op, I'd sure as hell stop what I was doing."
OMG shmokes! ME TOO! DUDE! WE AGREE ON SOMETHING!
Only I've seen what the film maker/mouthpiece supporting "Anybody But Bush" put out. He happens to state that Bush did exactly that - "stop what he was doing" - for seven minutes. I guess that doesn't fit with his new "Osama for President" film.
I'm off to the polls. Shmokes, should I cast a ballot for you too, or are you confident Kerry will win your state this year ;D
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I know exactly what you mean, Drew. All this time I've thought that Bush reacted very poorly. I thought, "Man, when I was at work and somebody told me that the country was under attack I stopped what I was doing, which was actually important work. If I was the President of that country and somebody told me that my country was under attack, especially if I was just doing a photo op, I'd sure as hell stop what I was doing."
OMG shmokes! ME TOO! DUDE! WE AGREE ON SOMETHING!
Only I've seen what the film maker/mouthpiece supporting "Anybody But Bush" put out. He happens to state that Bush did exactly that - "stop what he was doing" - for seven minutes.
Didn't he enter the school at about the time when the second plane hit? He must have known of the first plane when he was in his car.
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I can't believe that I (ME, OF ALL PEOPLE!!!) have seen the film and Moore's inane narrative throughout, and have been misled by him! Whodathunk that Michael Moore, of all the people up for sainthood ::) would tell the story inaccurately....it just boggles the mind :o
The first plane hit when Bush walked into the classroom - he wasn't told about it. According to Moore. The facts indeed may differ, and you might be correct, patrick. I'm just giving the patron st (don't wanna demean saint's nickname ;) ) of left-wing activism a voice, as it seems he's sorely underreported here in America ::) :-X
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I can't believe that I (ME, OF ALL PEOPLE!!!) have seen the film and Moore's inane narrative throughout, and have been misled by him! Whodathunk that Michael Moore, of all the people up for sainthood ::) would tell the story inaccurately....it just boggles the mind :o
The first plane hit when Bush walked into the classroom - he wasn't told about it. According to Moore. The facts indeed may differ, and you might be correct, patrick. I'm just giving the patron st (don't wanna demean saint's nickname ;) ) of left-wing activism a voice, as it seems he's sorely underreported here in America ::) :-X
He, he, well I didn't see Moore's "bashumentary" (I like neither rightwing nor leftwing biased reports)