Build Your Own Arcade Controls Forum

Main => Main Forum => Topic started by: NAH on March 10, 2004, 04:55:34 pm

Title: School Desk Controls
Post by: NAH on March 10, 2004, 04:55:34 pm: I have a school desk cocktail cabinet, yet I have never played on a schooldesk arcade cabinet. The way the controls are usually mounted are so the joysticks point at the player instead of up to the ceiling. I was wondering who has played many schooldesk cabinets and if the controls are uncomfortable. And if they are uncomfortable, do they warrent making a custom CP with a more comfortable angle.
These pictures stolen from:
Ultimate Arcade Machine Mark III
The Cocktail Lounge
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: NAH on March 10, 2004, 04:57:22 pm: .
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: Trenchbroom on March 10, 2004, 06:12:05 pm: I haven't used one in years, but they never seemed to be a big deal to me--perfectly comfortable. Keep in mind that I haven't used a "school desk" cocktail on 8-way games or games that used multiple fire buttons.

I seem to remember a "popeye" style white-topped Nintendo cocktail was very common for all types of games when I was growing up (I remember playing Space Invaders, Donkey Kong, and Pleaides on that type of cab): it had one Nintendo 4-way and one fire button on each side and that's it. Worked fine for the games of the time.
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: Trenchbroom on March 10, 2004, 06:15:34 pm: KLOV's Donkey Kong entry has the table type I remember (black top instead of white though):

http://www.klov.com/game_detail.php?letter=D&game_id=7610
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: Minwah on March 10, 2004, 06:46:49 pm: I have a Galaga cocktail very similar to the Ms PacMan table pictured.

I have to say that even tho it just uses left/right + fire, it is pretty uncomfortable after a while. The left/right is fine, but hitting a button rapidly is tricky - I never know whether to use my thumb or finger...in some quick-fire moments like the bonus levels I actually stand up, rotate sideways and use my forefinger to hit the button.

I think for a 2 or 4-way stick (ie classic games) the directions will be ok, for an 8-way and buttons (especially if >1 is required) it could be a bit uncomfortable/tricky to use.

Personally I do like the look of these type of cocktails tho, including the controls. I don't think the controls would look right the American horizontal way on this type of table (used mainly in Japan + UK I think).
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: NoOne=NBA= on March 10, 2004, 07:11:29 pm: They are a case of carpal tunnel sydrome waiting to happen as far as I'm concerned.
The angle you have to put your wrists at to play them is very uncomfortable.
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: paigeoliver on March 11, 2004, 05:15:05 am: Playing on school desk cocktails is no problem, PROVIDED you play games with one or two buttons. You would kill yourself trying to play Streetfighter on one of them.

Also, if shopping around for one, sometimes you can find them (Centuri style), with a more traditional control panel angle. My Time Pilot is like that.

I also (oddly enough) have an upright that has the whole "vertical control panel with joystick poking out towards you" thing going on.
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: crashwg on March 11, 2004, 06:37:17 am: Joystick pointing outwards... sounds dangerous. I'd be carefull when picking up things on the floor when arround that type of cocktail if I were you :o
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: ButeLegz on March 11, 2004, 07:41:42 am: Ha ha! I looove this style of cab, mostly because we've got heaps of 'em here in OZ... I scored one a while back with plans to change the vertical controls to a more wrist friendly angle. I've done most of the major structural stuff... the new control boxes are also detachable so player 2 can jump round to player 1's side & kick his ass at Street Fighter!

(http://homepages.ihug.com.au/~simons3/Cab1Upload.gif)
(http://homepages.ihug.com.au/~simons3/Cab2Upload.gif)
(http://homepages.ihug.com.au/~simons3/Cab3Upload.gif)
(http://homepages.ihug.com.au/~simons3/Cab4Upload.gif)

I put a slightly larger screen in too. As well as dominating my memories of arcade machines, this style takes up less room than other types of cocktails I have seen... but that also means less room for all the computer parts you've gotta fit. Unless you've got a particular affinity to 'em there's probably easier options...
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: paigeoliver on March 11, 2004, 07:46:04 am: How in the heck did you manage to get a 19" display in that thing? On my school desk cocktails the 13" displays are nearly bumping the bottom of the cabinet.
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: ButeLegz on March 11, 2004, 09:05:05 am: It's actually a 20"! It was always gonna be a tight fit but I had to extend the wood base by 7cm/3" to give it ample clearance. Part of the restoration including re-laminating the base so the join is totally hidden, you can see in the last photo where I haven't fully attached the black laminate yet. Once I figure out how to get verticals to play full screen top to bottom as possible, they'll be pretty much as big as they were with the original 31cm vertically mounted. It looks cool with the smoked plexi... you can't tell how big it is till you power the sucker up!
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: RetroBorg on March 11, 2004, 04:04:26 pm: Personally, I don't like cocktail cabinets that have the controls pointing at the player rather than the ceiling, my favourite cocktail cabinet design is the Australian Leisure & Allied designed tables that look similar to this one that you can purchase at OzStick.

(http://home.iprimus.com.au/ozstick/cab01_sm.jpg)

(http://home.iprimus.com.au/ozstick/cab04_sm.jpg)
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: Minwah on March 11, 2004, 04:16:27 pm: Quote from: ButeLegz on March 11, 2004, 07:41:42 am
Ha ha! I looove this style of cab, mostly because we've got heaps of 'em here in OZ... I scored one a while back with plans to change the vertical controls to a more wrist friendly angle. I've done most of the major structural stuff... the new control boxes are also detachable so player 2 can jump round to player 1's side & kick his ass at Street Fighter!

I put a slightly larger screen in too. As well as dominating my memories of arcade machines, this style takes up less room than other types of cocktails I have seen... but that also means less room for all the computer parts you've gotta fit. Unless you've got a particular affinity to 'em there's probably easier options...

That looks great :) I wasn't sure how the control panels would turn out (I've looked on your site before) but you've done a great job there, looks really as if it was 'made' that way :)
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: Mickey Juice on March 12, 2004, 11:37:14 am: Yeah those controls look great Mr Feldman ;)
Are you going to update with the plans anytime soon? I need some ideas as i'm up to the same stage with my MAME project and it's proving to be the hardest part!
I've got a *very* similar cab to yours, got it on eBay from Adelaide...
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: Edgedamage on March 12, 2004, 12:24:41 pm: Here's what I have to work with.
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: Stingray on March 12, 2004, 12:59:58 pm: That two player start graphic looks like something out of the Kama Sutra. ;)

-S
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: Edgedamage on March 12, 2004, 01:03:16 pm: Heh kinda looks like that. I would love to gat a 4 way stick for the cab that fits without too much trouble.
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: Stingray on March 12, 2004, 01:19:22 pm: Does the current stick (two-way I assume?) use the standard wico pattern?

-S
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: Wade on March 12, 2004, 03:46:03 pm: All the Nintendo cabs and Taito cabs were like this as far as I know. Plus some other less popular brands.

I have one of these Taito cabs with a mame setup.

It is a little strange at first, it takes some getting used to. It isn't hard on the wrists at all, as long as you aren't trying to grip the stick the same way you would with a horizontal panel. You basically just hold the ball the same way you would for a horz panel but you move the ball in a vertical plane instead of a horizontal plane.

If you've never played a game with these controls it will feel odd at first. I definitely wouldn't consider trying to play games with a lot of buttons or really difficult controls. I'd stick to 4 or 8 way classic games with a button or two.

Mine has a 4-way and 1 button, vertical monitor and the dozen games that can be played properly with this config.

Wade
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: Edgedamage on March 13, 2004, 10:54:32 am: Quote from: Stingray on March 12, 2004, 01:19:22 pm
Does the current stick (two-way I assume?) use the standard wico pattern?

-S

No it's a oddball one but it looks like it could be made 4 way.
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: ButeLegz on March 14, 2004, 08:37:37 pm: Cool, not often you see something made out of actual wood these days. Is that one of the earlier style school desk cabs? Just like Wade said I'd make it cab for the 1 & 2 button classics... with a super retro generic-ish theme. Looking at all the sd-cocktails pictured on flyers & all the ones I saw when I was hunting mine down, there doesn't seem to be a standard set of plans companies were using. Here's two Taitos, Feild Goal & Ball Park, both with different feet.

(http://homepages.ihug.com.au/~simons3/Legs1.gif)
(http://homepages.ihug.com.au/~simons3/Legs2.gif)

And mine's different again. I wonder it that was that a deliberate decision to give 'em a little variety or just some other boring economic type reason... hmmm, I need to get out more or better yet finish my cab & quit theorising over the inconsistencies of school desk cocktail manufacture, I would be interested to know, though.

Cheers for the positive feedback MinWah, all your hard work with MameWah has helped in a massive way to achieving the total package I was after for my cab, so a big thanks. Mickey Juice, are you planning on putting together a site with progress pics & stuff? I'd love to see what someone else does with pretty much the exact same type of cab. When I get a little spare time & catch up on some sleep i'll prolly put together some plans & more pics up on my site. If you want info or photos of particular stuff or whatever just email me. Goodluck!
Title: Re:School Desk Controls
Post by: paigeoliver on March 15, 2004, 01:56:36 am: Re, Astro fighter cocktail.

I used to have one of those sega cocktails. If you take the metal overlays off, then it SHOULD reveal a circle cutout, and you should be able to install a Wico stick in there. Although you WILL have to drill new holes in either the stick base or the panel.

I recall making a few slight mods on mine, but I did get a wico microleaf in there eventually.

At least mine was like that.