Build Your Own Arcade Controls Forum
Main => Main Forum => Topic started by: mcseforsale on April 02, 2012, 02:30:56 pm
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In my past CP, I used the .250 female disconnects from HD. They were just a bit big and clumsy.
I'm wondering where your sources are for the .187 (3/16) ones....is it a local supplier? Do you get them from internet retailers? Or, do you just use the ones at HD?
Thanks!
AJ
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I prefer this style (center) with clear insulation sleeves, but they require special crimpers. Got mine from Paradise Arcade Shop.
(http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=103207.0;attach=171132)
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To be perfectly honest, I'd prefer those. I don't have the tool, though. If I did more 'lectric on the car, I'd def. be down for those. All of the molex use those, too, right? Hmmm.
AJ
I prefer this style (center) with clear insulation sleeves, but they require special crimpers. Got mine from Paradise Arcade Shop.
(http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=103207.0;attach=171132)
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For the "standard" Molex connectors you see in most arcade machines, yes the crimpers used to crimp those quick disconnects also work for those Molex pins. For smaller Molex and JST pins I have another die set for the crimpers as well as another set of smaller crimpers for the really small pins. Here the small die set is installed in the crimpers and the die set that came with the crimpers are on the table (the label says Molex pins for the small die set because I was crimping Molex Micro-fit pins from the previous pic):
(http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=103207.0;attach=171134)
You should be able to find a set of those crimpers for around $30 that come with the larger die set. You can get the smaller die set (part# HT-236-2C4-DIE) for around $8 online.
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Interesting...
I wonder if that die set would fit in this:
http://www.harborfreight.com/ratcheting-crimping-tool-97420.html (http://www.harborfreight.com/ratcheting-crimping-tool-97420.html)
How much cheaper are those terminals?
I'm seeing the HD .250" 50 for $4.70.
AJ
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Yea, looks like the dies would fit in those crimpers. You'd have to track down the larger die set, I don't have a part number for those since they came with my crimpers. I don't recall the price of terminals, they're not listed on Paradise's site. I've purchased them twice, ask Bryan or Susan about them and they'll be able to hook you up.
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What do you use for insulation? Heat shrink?
AJ
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Interesting...
I wonder if that die set would fit in this:
http://www.harborfreight.com/ratcheting-crimping-tool-97420.html (http://www.harborfreight.com/ratcheting-crimping-tool-97420.html)
How much cheaper are those terminals?
I'm seeing the HD .250" 50 for $4.70.
If you are just interested in crimping .187" connectors (or any other standard insulated connectors) for your switches, that type of crimper is fine. You'd be able to buy several sets of these for the cost of one set of specialized dies, so I wouldn't put too much weight on interchangeability. I use one that is very similar, but the die is shaped a little differently. If you have a Harbor Freight store nearby, it's well worth investigating as that is a good price for a ratcheting crimper. The .187" connectors on the GGG store (http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69&products_id=211) are already fully insulated, and should work fine with it.
I don't think HD offers .187" connectors, but it's been a while since I looked for them there.
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Usually get my terminals off fleabay in bags of 100.
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What do you use for insulation? Heat shrink?
No, clear insulation sleeves. Another reason why I prefer this style of quick disconnect. I hate the look of red plastic quick disconnects. You can get the sleeves from Paradise as well. I don't have a pic of just the sleeves, but in this pic you can make them out (easiest to see on the joystick terminals):
(http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=103207.0;attach=170626)
You'd be able to buy several sets of these for the cost of one set of specialized dies, so I wouldn't put too much weight on interchangeability.
False. You just have to know where to look. Like I said before, around $8 for a die set. I found a set that will work for this style of quick disconnect as well... http://www.pimfg.com/Product-Detail/HT-236-2C-DIE (http://www.pimfg.com/Product-Detail/HT-236-2C-DIE)
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False. You just have to know where to look. Like I said before, around $8 for a die set. I found a set that will work for this style of quick disconnect as well... http://www.pimfg.com/Product-Detail/HT-236-2C-DIE (http://www.pimfg.com/Product-Detail/HT-236-2C-DIE)
I thought you only bought Molex original parts ;). Still, that's almost the same price as the whole crimper shown above, so I wouldn't sweat interchangeability on an $8 ratcheting crimper. Good link for future reference though, as they seem to have quite a few options which look like they will fit these types of bodies.
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Good link for future reference though, as they seem to have quite a few options which look like they will fit these types of bodies.
Yup, I spent a while looking for an affordable solution to crimp those Molex Micro-fit terminal pins. Since I already owned a pair of ratcheting crimpers, I figured dies would be the best way to preserve the valuable real estate inside my toolbox. That site was the cheapest I was able to find at the time...
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To stray slightly off-topic:
I'm looking for some pins that I can use to plug wires into a CPS1 kick harness (22-01-2087 (http://www.molex.com/molex/products/datasheet.jsp?part=active/0022012087_CRIMP_HOUSINGS.xml&channel=Products&Lang=en-US) housing with 08-52-0101 (http://www.molex.com/molex/products/datasheet.jsp?part=active/0008520101_CRIMP_TERMINALS.xml) crimp terminals).
The headers in the KK series look like they're solely designed for mounting on a PCB, but I'd like to make an extension. What do I need?
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I use terminals and sleeves from polevolt.com in the UK and I use the Hozan P-706 crimp tool.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v325/Francoberasi/Crimpz002.jpg)
The P-706 has a range of anvils on it and I use it for Molex, Mini Molex, AMP UP, a range of JSTs, Hirose etc etc.
To stray slightly off-topic:
I'm looking for some pins that I can use to plug wires into a CPS1 kick harness (22-01-2087 (http://www.molex.com/molex/products/datasheet.jsp?part=active/0022012087_CRIMP_HOUSINGS.xml&channel=Products&Lang=en-US) housing with 08-52-0101 (http://www.molex.com/molex/products/datasheet.jsp?part=active/0008520101_CRIMP_TERMINALS.xml) crimp terminals).
The headers in the KK series look like they're solely designed for mounting on a PCB, but I'd like to make an extension. What do I need?
CPS1 uses a 10 pin JST NH housing which connects to a JST B10P-SHF-1AA header. You can use Molex KK series but the JST header is the 'correct' one to use.
This is a CPS1 breakout adapter I made for someone to connect their CPS1 wired cab to a JPAC.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v325/Francoberasi/CPS1breakout-1.jpg)
You could make something similar just with another 10 pin JST NH housing on the end.
I just tin the wires, tin the header pins, solder together and then use heat shrink to insulate.
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Usually get my terminals off fleabay in bags of 100.
That's where I do mine, and I use http://www.restockit.com/journeyman-crimping-cutting-tool-non-insulated-insulated-terminals-(klej1005).html?source=IDx20111014x00001a&utm_source=IDx20111014x00001a&utm_medium=free&utm_campaign=comparison&utm_term=KLEJ1005&bvar7=google&bvar10=google&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=KLEJ1005 (http://www.restockit.com/journeyman-crimping-cutting-tool-non-insulated-insulated-terminals-(klej1005).html?source=IDx20111014x00001a&utm_source=IDx20111014x00001a&utm_medium=free&utm_campaign=comparison&utm_term=KLEJ1005&bvar7=google&bvar10=google&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=KLEJ1005) for crimping them. I hate ratchet crimpers because most don't have enough force for a good crimp.
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I am a mouseraholic, use them for almost all my electrical projects.
Mouser.com
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I hate the look of red plastic quick disconnects.
I agree. as soon as you crimp em, they look like they have been gnawed on by a rat. I would rather just have sleeveless crimps at that point.
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I use these:
(http://www.molex.com/pdm_docs/iso/1625-9C-Rec_ISO.gif)(http://www.molex.com/pdm_docs/iso/1625-9C-Plug_ISO.gif)
with these:
(http://www.molex.com/pdm_docs/iso/1561_ISO.jpg)(http://www.molex.com/pdm_docs/iso/standard062_ISO.jpg)
and I get them from here: http://www.digikey.com/ (http://www.digikey.com/), Make sure you buy in bulk though... For the pins I buy 500 at a time and the receptacles at least 50 at a time...
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I ---smurfing--- hate that type of Molex housing.
AMP UP or JST housings ftw.
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I ---smurfing--- hate that type of Molex housing.
+1. They're too big and are a pain to disconnect. I'm partial to the Molex Micro-fit family when it comes to building my own harnesses. A few projects I have worked on for other members of BYOAC and KLOV have exposed me to JST and I have found those to be quite nice to work with.
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I ---smurfing--- hate that type of Molex housing.
AMP UP or JST housings ftw.
I don't have a lot of experience with the AMP UP series as they're essentially impossible to buy in the USA (unless you know of a stocking disty). The JST YL series (which is what I presume you're referring to) isn't bad. I don't like the latching mechanism - it's too difficult to disconnect - but the panel lock is really good, and I like most other aspects of the connector. The JST XL series fixes the latching mechanism but isn't as popular. The YL series is also really tough to get in the US. Oddly, Digi-Key stocks the larger VL series.
I do love the JST XH and VH series for wire-to-board connections. The older NH series isn't bad, but I like the shroud on the XH, and the NH series is not readily available in the USA. The EH series is also nice, and it's got a very small footprint for a 2.5mm/0.1" pitch connector, but the tradeoff is that it's a bit fragile. I like the Molex 2.5mm SPOX series better.
JST does have a really good online catalog, and they are starting to sell small volume directly via their website, though the prices can be a bit high. AMP and Molex have terrible online catalogs.
I personally like the AMP Universal Mate-n-Lok series for wire-to-wire multi-circuit connections. It's a bit big, but it's a tough beast with pretty good characteristics. The Molex Mini-Fit Jr. / AMP PE 4.2mm (used by the ATX power connection on PC motherboards) also works pretty well.
Yes, I have some unusually strong opinions on connectors :) Most engineers seem to.
And yeah, screw the old 0.093" pin/socket connectors. I still use them occasionally, mostly because you can buy them almost anywhere (even Radio Shack sells them!) and they're crossed by everyone. The 0.062" at least is a more reasonable size, but it still has all the problems of the 0.093" series.
As to where to buy connectors, I usually just buy 'em from Digi-Key/Mouser/Allied/Jameco/etc. Not always the cheapest, but they're very reliable, and I'm often making some sort of order anyway, so I don't have to pay extra shipping. For some of the more esoteric connectors, you have to go hunting. They're not the best for terminal style connectors though. I actually buy most of those at Fry's, of all places.
On this topic, anyone know where you can get the JST 0.156" crimp style edge connectors (aka "JAMMA connectors")? I like them quite a bit better than the Molex version, and I could at least use a few contacts to patch a few extra wires onto some existing wiring harnesses I have in some Japanese cabinets.
Oh, and if you want a nice crimper that'll crimp almost anything, I have an Engineer PA-21 from Japan (they can be had on Amazon). For the tiny stuff like JST EH, PH, etc. series, I have a PA-09.
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I've not had too much experience with the YL's. I have some two pin ones for Egret 2 kick adapters but I haven't tried mating them with the opposite gender. I have plenty of the VL's though and then can be a little tricky to disconnect but I guess they are not meant for continuous connection/disconnection.
I've not had experience with the XH series but I do like the VHs and I make a couple of things with them.
Yes, it's great that you can buy smaller amounts from JST now although like you said it can be expensive for small amounts as the unit price is generally 10x the full box unit price. If you need a certain amount it's often cheaper to buy a whole box/reel. I needed about thirty 8pin male/female VLs but it was cheaper to buy two 100 packs of VL's and two 4000 pin reels of crimps. Luckily I qualified for free shipping otherwise the shipping on the reels would have been a killer!
AMP UP probably are my favourite connectors for wire to wire connections. They are nice and compact, they connect/disconnect nicely, the pins are easy to remove if needs be and they are available in a decent amount of poles and configurations, as long as you can find them.
There is a data sheet for them [here (http://wiki.arcadeotaku.com/w/AMP_Universal_Power)] if it helps. I get most of mine from [RS Components (http://uk.rs-online.com/web/home.html)] in the UK. It's a bit hit and miss which ones they have in as they in stock and the prices can seem to vary wildly. They are generally a discontinued series but they do seem to order some in from time to time. I have managed to find a couple of them available at Mouser (that wasn't available at RS). I guess the best thing to do is to look at the part numbers in the data sheet and search for them at your usual places. To be honest if you need a connector for a new project you are probably better of looking at a different manufacturer/series due to the availability but I need to source them for looms for candy cabs etc that use AMP UPs. If you did need some AMP UPs I would be more than happy to reship some for you if you couldn't get them.
I've not seen the JST crimp style edge connectors. I would be very interested in seeing them if anyone has a source for them. Hirose make a [high quality edge connector (http://www.arcadeshop.de/product_info.php?item_number=899&products_id=899&language=en)] but it is a solder version and fairly spendy at that.
I must say I do love my P-706, it crimps most things I have come across, even down to the tiny JST PHD crimps.
Whilst we are talking about housings etc. Does anyone have a source for these?
(http://upload.ecvv.com/upload/Product/200801/2006316174633104733_TJC1_Bar_Connector.jpg)
I think they are commonly known as TJC1 connectors. The description 'pressure welding bar connector' often seem to me mentioned in relation to them. I'm looking for a four pole one as shown along with the crimps and also the PCB header. They have a 8mm common pitch but the last pin is set 10mm out.
JST have them as LV connectors but they only sell them in boxes of 500. I have found no end of suppliers in HK though Alibaba but they want minimum orders or 1000+. The one company that would supply them in 100's won't reply to me.
Mouser stock a [molex version (http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Molex/35183-0417/?qs=ZlMU7IUseCuV6M1DEGqefw%3d%3d)] of them but they only have 2 in stock.
They seem to be a very common connector but I can't for the life of me seem to find a stockist of them where I can purchase 30 sets or so. :-\
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I could definitely use some 12 position female housings and corresponding pins (about 3 sets worth). They were used in the Japanese "BEMANI" titles (DDR, drummania, Guitar Freaks, etc.) for connecting to the monitor, and when I replace the monitors (as they're dying about now), I'd prefer to not have to modify the cabinet. I also have a friend who is in need of two 12 position (both genders) and a 10 (also both genders) for a Sega candy.
I've been looking at my usual suspects for those sizes, and nobody seems to have them in stock in the US. One of the two big usual suspects (Digi-Key/Mouser, I don't remember which one) seems to be stocking the contacts, but not most of the housings (they have some, but nowhere near all sizes). They may have them because they mate with another product they sell. Digi-Key, for example, stocks JST NH series contacts and 3 position housings, but no other sizes, because it mates with some other product they sell.
As for those connectors you pictured, I'm also not aware of where to get them or what they're commonly called. I know they were used on my KT-2914 monitors for power and other stuff. They seem to be commonly used for yokes on CRT monitors. To make power work, I just took a couple of AMP Universal Mate-n-Lok sockets, mangled them down smaller with some pliers until they fit snugly, crimped 'em onto an AC cord, and covered them entirely with heat shrink. No housing to hold it, but it works well enough for my purposes.
Looks like Mouser does consider that a stocking item. If you can stomach the 11 week lead time (minimum, probably), they'll order them from the factory for you, even if you only want a few.
And yeah, that Hirose edge connector is spendy, especially with the exchange rate and US shipping. There's a guy local to me that sells old school Amphenol brand edge connectors in that size. Much nicer than the cheap ones I get online these days, and he only asks maybe $3 for them. I think I might have bought him out, though. It's all NOS, so he doesn't replenish.
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I'll shoot you a PM about those AMP UPs, it shouldn't be a problem at all. :)
Yes, as you guessed I need those connectors for a yoke. Actually I need them to make some yoke flip kits for the Nanao MS8. I made [a flip kit for the Nanao MS9 (http://www.emphatic.se/?p=1025)] and I was also struggling for parts but because the polarity of the connectors was not important, I could just use the bare crimps and insulate them. However the polarity of the wires needs to stay the same for the MS8. If I was just making a kit for me I would just use individual crimps again but as they are for other people I need to try and find the right connectors to make installation as easy as possible.
Thanks for the input though, I'll keep looking :)
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http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/category/196450/Crimp-Terminals/Quick-Disconnect-Female-3/16/1.html (http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/category/196450/Crimp-Terminals/Quick-Disconnect-Female-3/16/1.html)
100 for $5.50. Then I proceed to buy 40 other things.
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I hate ratchet crimpers because most don't have enough force for a good crimp.
Ratcheting crimpers have a tension adjustment. The ratcheting action, and the geometry of the parts, is what can actually provide more crimp force at the jaws than what you exert at the handles. FWIW, I have several professional crimpers which run about $300 per. They all ratchet.
Those who don't like the look of a crimped insulated connection need to keep in mind that it's always a matter of the correct tool of the job. Inexpensive crimper, or incorrect dies, will give a substandard result. But as long as there is a strong hold on the wire, looks are a secondary concern. Unless you spend more time admiring your wiring job than actually using the panel ;).
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Those who don't like the look of a crimped insulated connection need to keep in mind that it's always a matter of the correct tool of the job. Inexpensive crimper, or incorrect dies, will give a substandard result. But as long as there is a strong hold on the wire, looks are are a secondary concern. Unless you spend more time admiring your wiring job than actually using the panel ;).
Crush type crimps (like what's used with insulated quick disconnects, butt splices, bullet connectors) always look like ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---, even when using the right tool for this particular job. It's all about pride in one's own work... If one doesn't have pride in his/her work, then one should put the ---smurfing--- tools down.
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Crush type crimps (like what's used with insulated quick disconnects, butt splices, bullet connectors) always look like ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---, even when using the right tool for this particular job. It's all about pride in one's own work... If one doesn't have pride in his/her work, then one should put the ---smurfing--- tools down.
Yet they are used in nearly every industry, and sold in every electrical and home store. Again, they are functional items, not decorative.
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Crush type crimps (like what's used with insulated quick disconnects, butt splices, bullet connectors) always look like ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---, even when using the right tool for this particular job. It's all about pride in one's own work... If one doesn't have pride in his/her work, then one should put the ---smurfing--- tools down.
Yet they are used in nearly every industry, and sold in every electrical and home store. Again, they are functional items, not decorative.
Then you should be selling and promoting scotch-locks and wire nuts as well… :P
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No matter how good the crimping tool, nothing can make those hard-insulated crimp connects look good. I don't ever see those used commercially either. They always seem to come naked or with insulation that was put on after crimping.
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Then you should be selling and promoting scotch-locks and wire nuts as well… :P
Seen plenty of wire nuts in real arcade machines. They do the job they were designed to do....and well.
If a solid and fully functional crimp like this one in the photo below has an appearance which ruins your day, then don't use them. But it looks fine to me.
No matter how good the crimping tool, nothing can make those hard-insulated crimp connects look good. I don't ever see those used commercially either. They always seem to come naked or with insulation that was put on after crimping.
Don't tell Molex that. I have a pneumatic, tape fed machine here with very similar hard crimp connectors used in the automotive and industrial machinery industries. You can also check out the photo below (sorry about the quality) of my real arcade machine panel, as shipped from the factory. Same type of connectors.
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No matter how good the crimping tool, nothing can make those hard-insulated crimp connects look good. I don't ever see those used commercially either. They always seem to come naked or with insulation that was put on after crimping.
That's because commercial crimping machines use large rolled chains of uninsulated terminals because they are cheaper and about 10 times faster to install. But, as stated above, you can get commercial solutions for insulated terminals but those are much more rare.
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If a solid and fully functional crimp like this one in the photo below has an appearance which ruins your day, then don't use them. But it looks fine to me.
Exactly why I don't use them. And yes, that crimp looks like ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---.
Now this... This is a sexy looking crimp...
(http://i922.photobucket.com/albums/ad66/jdm714_bucket/22524bd9.png)
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That's because commercial crimping machines use large rolled chains of uninsulated terminals because they are cheaper and about 10 times faster to install. But, as stated above, you can get commercial solutions for insulated terminals but those are much more rare.
The connectors on my Molex machine can be installed at the same pace, and are fully insulated. But they cost about 5x as much as the non insulated ones.
Now this... This is a sexy looking crimp...
:) Connector pron.... The hard shell still provides a better grip and aids in installation. It's also functional (insulation). Again, looks aren't everything.
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i work for verizon and our guys cry when they cant get scotch-locks, dont be a hater >:D
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This has got to be one of the more ridiculous arguments on this forum... :dizzy:
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This has got to be one of the more ridiculous arguments on this forum... :dizzy:
Have you checked PH? :duckhunt
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This has got to be one of the more ridiculous arguments on this forum... :dizzy:
Have you checked PH? :duckhunt
All the time... ;D
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This has got to be one of the more ridiculous arguments on this forum... :dizzy:
Wait until comic books get involved.
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I hate ratchet crimpers because most don't have enough force for a good crimp.
Ratcheting crimpers have a tension adjustment. The ratcheting action, and the geometry of the parts, is what can actually provide more crimp force at the jaws than what you exert at the handles. FWIW, I have several professional crimpers which run about $300 per. They all ratchet.
^ This. I have an expensive set that forms the sleeves on the connector. Love them. Bad thing is, if you set the connector in wrong, you waste it -- can't back the ratchet off.
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Bad thing is, if you set the connector in wrong, you waste it -- can't back the ratchet off.
Hmmm...that's odd. I have about 5 different ratcheting crimpers and all of them have a little lever between the grips, next to the first pivot. Pushing forward on the lever releases the ratchet. Do your's not have this?
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Now this... This is a sexy looking crimp...
:) Connector pron.... The hard shell still provides a better grip and aids in installation. It's also functional (insulation). Again, looks aren't everything.
*cough*
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v325/Francoberasi/Crimpz002.jpg)
*cough*
Performance first, aesthetics second. Although sometimes you can have it all 8)