Build Your Own Arcade Controls Forum

Arcade Collecting => Restorations & repair => Topic started by: WhereEaglesDare on January 16, 2011, 09:38:55 am

Title: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on January 16, 2011, 09:38:55 am
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/7a/SG1stargate.jpg/250px-SG1stargate.jpg)

Oh I meant to say:
(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-22-paint-striping/1-stargate-strip.jpg)

Okay I picked up this cabinet yesterday.  It is a converted Stargate.  The game seems to have some rom corruption or is dirty.  It plays but has lines and sometime random characters on it.  The video doesn't have any blue in it, which may be the rom acting up.  

(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-08-rough-ranger/rough-ranger-full.jpg)

(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-16-rough-ranger/monitor.jpg)

(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-16-rough-ranger/monitor-model.jpg)
WG 19K4901 Monitor - October 1983

(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-16-rough-ranger/old-controls.jpg)
I've never seen controls like this before.  The joystick looks like it could an 8-way but it looks like it acts like a 4-way.  What do you think?

(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-16-rough-ranger/jamma-board.jpg)
Here is the game board.

(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-16-rough-ranger/power-boards.jpg)
This looks like the power supply, why does it have two boards?  Are these original to the cabinet you think?

Can anyone tell me what they think is original to the cabinet so I can keep it when I make it StarGate again.

More pics at: http://www.puttheglasseson.com/projects/stargate-rr-cabinet/ (http://www.puttheglasseson.com/projects/stargate-rr-cabinet/)
Title: Re: My StarGate Restoration - Raw Rough Ranger Cabinet
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on January 16, 2011, 12:26:03 pm
Reseated all the ROMs and now it plays with no corruption, the colors are still off a bit and there is no sound, could be unrelated to the board.

http://www.puttheglasseson.com/projects/reseating-roms/ (http://www.puttheglasseson.com/projects/reseating-roms/)

Im off to strip some paint!
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: RayB on January 17, 2011, 02:42:25 pm
You will regret the day you get a Rough Ranger fully working.
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on January 17, 2011, 02:53:53 pm
Quote from: RayB on January 17, 2011, 02:42:25 pm
You will regret the day you get a Rough Ranger fully working.

Why is that?
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: RayB on January 17, 2011, 03:00:36 pm
Quote from: WhereEaglesDare on January 17, 2011, 02:53:53 pm
Quote from: RayB on January 17, 2011, 02:42:25 pm
You will regret the day you get a Rough Ranger fully working.

Why is that?
WORST
GAME
EVER.


Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on January 17, 2011, 03:15:18 pm
Quote from: RayB on January 17, 2011, 03:00:36 pm
Quote from: WhereEaglesDare on January 17, 2011, 02:53:53 pm
Quote from: RayB on January 17, 2011, 02:42:25 pm
You will regret the day you get a Rough Ranger fully working.

Why is that?
WORST
GAME
EVER.




Ive noticed, I tried it on MAME.

I think I'll try Soft15k in order to test the monitor.  I dont know if the monitor is any good, I imagine this may be the best way to test it.
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on January 18, 2011, 09:15:56 pm
COIN DOOR:

Both coin mechs work. The lights power on, but need to be replaced with a new bulb becuase they are really dim. One of the return slots have been kicked in. The coin mechs are plastic. I'm not sure if these are original to the StarGate cabinet or not because my Data East cabinet that is ten years newer has metal coin mechs. The coin counter has been disconnected, but it shows that the machine made at least 3500 bucks in its life. Coin door also has a tilt sensor.

(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-18-stargate-coin-door/broken-return-slot.jpg)
Anyone got a replacement return slot and door they can sell me?

(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-18-stargate-coin-door/coin-counter.jpg)
Too bad it's disconnected, we will never know how much it made in it's life.

(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-18-stargate-coin-door/tilt-sensor.jpg)
Did this have a real function?  It isn't connected to anything.

(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-18-stargate-coin-door/coin-mech.jpg)
Are these the kind of coin mechs that would have came with the machine as a StarGate?
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: RayB on January 19, 2011, 04:10:35 pm
You've never seen a slam-tilt before?  If someone kicks the coin door it resets the machine (even if you were mid-game!) It's punishment for hitting the door. Thing is, I would totally expect someone to kick it again and again if they "lost their quarter" this way.

Most ops disconnected them since doors would get loose and the slam-tilt would activate with the slightest jostle of the door.
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on January 19, 2011, 04:25:17 pm
Well, that would explain how the return slot was broken.  Nice.

I am having a hard time finding complete StarGate Board sets or a JROK Multi Williams set so........ :dunno
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on January 20, 2011, 09:59:09 pm
Okay, I think I may have come to the conclusion that this may not be a true restoration...  not all the way there yet.

I can't find working StarGate board sets at a reasonable price (I don't care enough about the game to pay 200 for the boards).  I can't find any Multi-Williams for sale (right now), what options would I have for this cabinet?

If I do MAME in it I do not want to do a generic run of the mill MAME because I have one of those... 

The panel is too small for fighting games, so a MK or a SF conversion is out of the question.

If I could find a Tetris Grand Master Board Set I'd convert it to that in a heartbeat.

I have half of it stripped down I plan on getting it all pulled apart this weekend, and maybe start priming it this weekend, but what should my end goal be?

Please Help!
Title: Re: StarGate with an IDENTITY CRISIS!!! HELP!!!
Post by: opt2not on January 20, 2011, 11:02:59 pm
A quick search on the klov forums produce these:
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=167408&highlight=Stargate (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=167408&highlight=Stargate)

http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=162577&highlight=Stargate (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=162577&highlight=Stargate)

http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=160868&highlight=Stargate (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=160868&highlight=Stargate)

http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=152585&highlight=Stargate (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=152585&highlight=Stargate)

My advice would be to restore the cabinet's externals, while you look and gather your internals. 'cause I'm sure you'll have a bunch of time before the externals are done.
Title: Re: StarGate with an IDENTITY CRISIS!!! HELP!!!
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on January 20, 2011, 11:08:22 pm
Dont you need three boards for StarGate to work?

You may be right, Id love to have a classic game like StarGate in my game room as I build my collection...  it just gets disheartening when you start adding all the costs up, you know?
Title: Re: StarGate with an IDENTITY CRISIS!!! HELP!!!
Post by: opt2not on January 21, 2011, 12:09:34 am
Quote from: WhereEaglesDare on January 20, 2011, 11:08:22 pm
Dont you need three boards for StarGate to work?

You may be right, Id love to have a classic game like StarGate in my game room as I build my collection...  it just gets disheartening when you start adding all the costs up, you know?
Yep, you need the rom board, the CPU board, and the sound board.  I've seen these for sale between $25-40 when posted. I mean, you can wait and piece it all together for a decent price (probably run you about $100-150), or perhaps if you can find someone with all 3 boards that you can talk him down to a reasonable price.
The klov forums are good for prices, much better than eBay.

Restoring cabs, well this hobby in general isn't cheap. But you don't have to buy everything at once, since you'll have time.
Title: Re: StarGate with an IDENTITY CRISIS!!! HELP!!!
Post by: Spyridon on January 21, 2011, 09:05:21 am
The only thing that looks good in that cab is either Stargate or Multi-Williams.  Since you already have a mame cab, don't be a hurry to get this done.  Work on the cosmetic parts while you keep your eyes out for a StarGate board.  If you aren't planning on spending $200 you are going to be in trouble.  The JROK board has been selling for $175+ and the Stargate boards will probably run you $150 unless you get a deal of maybe piece it together separately.   

Just take your time and this could be a real nice restore.  Worst case, throw mame in running the Williams games until you find a board set. 
Title: Re: StarGate with an IDENTITY CRISIS!!! HELP!!!
Post by: opt2not on January 21, 2011, 10:27:01 am
Quote from: Spyridon on January 21, 2011, 09:05:21 am
The only thing that looks good in that cab is either Stargate or Multi-Williams.  Since you already have a mame cab, don't be a hurry to get this done.  Work on the cosmetic parts while you keep your eyes out for a StarGate board.  If you aren't planning on spending $200 you are going to be in trouble.  The JROK board has been selling for $175+ and the Stargate boards will probably run you $150 unless you get a deal of maybe piece it together separately.    

Just take your time and this could be a real nice restore.  Worst case, throw mame in running the Williams games until you find a board set.  
Yeah! That was more eloquently put than my ramblings. I gotta get used to this waking up at 6am thing... :)
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on January 21, 2011, 10:11:53 pm
I notice that the StarGate CP only uses up and down on the joy stick.

(http://tonysarcade.tripod.com/images/Stargate_CP_small.jpg)

Is there some sort of restrictor on the stick?
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on January 25, 2011, 12:16:03 pm
Found out what is wrong with the monitor.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=108779.0 (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=108779.0)

Going to order the part and the cap kit this week.
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: opt2not on January 25, 2011, 01:37:45 pm
Quote from: WhereEaglesDare on January 21, 2011, 10:11:53 pm
I notice that the StarGate CP only uses up and down on the joy stick.

Is there some sort of restrictor on the stick?

Yup. It's a 2-way joystick (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=107691.0). Joust, Defender, Stargate all use the same assembly, just different balltops:
http://www.mantisamusements.com/joystick1.htm (http://www.mantisamusements.com/joystick1.htm)

Arcadeshop also has a "williams joystick rebuild kit", but it doesn't have the defender/stargate balltop shaft in the kit. I couldn't find the red balltops for those, just the Joust ones (teal, yellow).
But you can see if you can get a Defender/Stargate joystick assembly from Mantis, $30 seems about the going rate.

Also, another piece of advice, if you haven't already -- Whenever you take on a restoration, it's vital to locate and thoroughly read the Manual. You can find schematics and parts lists that would help with a lot of your early questions.
Try to find as much information as possible from these documents, or from online sources.

Here's some links to help jump-start you:
Manual (http://www.robotron-2084.co.uk/manuals/stargate/stargate_upright_instruction_manual.pdf)
Drawing set (http://www.robotron-2084.co.uk/manuals/stargate/stargate_upright_drawing_set.pdf)
Williams hardware identification (http://www.robotron-2084.co.uk/techwilliamshardwareid.html#defender)
KLOV's Stargate page (http://www.arcade-museum.com/game_detail.php?letter=S&game_id=9780)


edit:  Looks like Pengo13 was able to get rid of most of his Stargate stuff on KLOV. He still has his original joystick left over: http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=164283 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=164283)
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on January 25, 2011, 04:27:47 pm
Quote from: opt2not on January 25, 2011, 01:37:45 pm

edit:  Looks like Pengo13 was able to get rid of most of his Stargate stuff on KLOV. He still has his original joystick left over: http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=164283 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=164283)

Yea thanks for the criticism, I did find that thread and already posted that I was looking for the two way stick, he never replied back...  I'm waiting.

Thanks for looking though.
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on January 31, 2011, 05:16:58 pm
Got the sides all stripped down.
(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-31-paint-striping-finale/1-left-side.jpg)
(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-31-paint-striping-finale/1-right-side.jpg)

I'm going to hit it with a sander before I start painting.  I have plenty of time because I need to get a paint gun and wait for it to warm up.

(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-31-paint-striping-finale/2-bottom.jpg)
Here you can see the bottom of the cabinet is jacked up, but not too bad.  I'm going to read some of the tutorials on using Bondo to fix it.

(http://www.puttheglasseson.com/!images/projects/11-01-31-paint-striping-finale/3-top.jpg)
The top of the cab seems to have a little water damage.  What would be best to fix this?  If I use a sander to help smooth it out it starts to fall apart.
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: LeedsFan on May 13, 2011, 06:11:46 pm
I don't know if you are still looking for a two-way Defender/Stargate joystick. I've seen the rebuild kits but they are only good if you have an original unit to restore (i.e. you need the body already)

However Arcadeshop.de in Germany have these.....

http://www.arcadeshop.de/Joysticks-2-Way-Williams-Reprostick_1034.html (http://www.arcadeshop.de/Joysticks-2-Way-Williams-Reprostick_1034.html)


They are not cheap but they are the best thing you can get (new) if you cannot restore an original unit. I bought one for my Defender bartop and it feels and plays great. Sticking a microswitch joystick in there and restricting it's movement to up/down only just doesn't cut it. (Not for me anyway)
Title: Re: I think we may have discovered something from the Ancients.. a StarGate...
Post by: WhereEaglesDare on May 14, 2011, 04:29:37 pm
Thanks for looking out, but I was lucky enough to find this: http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=111354.msg1182982#msg1182982 (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=111354.msg1182982#msg1182982)

NOS Original Defender Stick.  Perfection.  

Sorry I have been AWOL.  Feb 7th my wife left me.  I haven't worked on jack really since, I just paid the lawyer off yesterday.  Since last post I have started rebuilding the power supply and I was almost done, I may finish soon.  

I also have a reproduction bezel for StarGate too, and I have lined up an auto-body guy that will paint it for me for cheap since Im not going to invest in a compressor.  I have also rebuilt the monitor neckboard and capped the chassis.  The monitor works great now, almost like new.