The NEW Build Your Own Arcade Controls
Arcade Collecting => Restorations & repair => Topic started by: erlsjj on December 16, 2008, 08:40:54 pm
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Sunday, 30 Nov 2008:
A good friend of mine invited me to an arcade auction up in Grandview, MO. He went home with a very nice Spy Hunter (with garbled music - which he fixed by replacing the digital analog converter), and I somehow became the proud new owner of my very own Galaga! I paid $200 for it ($197.75 if you count the 9 quarters I found inside the machine).
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Dec 1 - Dec 12, 2008:
The monitor worked, but no game. I measured the voltage going into the CPU PCB and it was reading 0.398V. Just a tad low. Variable resistor did nothing. After troubleshooting the power supply board, I found a bad 2N3055 transistor on the heat sink. I replaced the bad transistor as well as 4 bad diodes (all 4 were my fault which gave off some impressive blue smoke!), and after finding poor solder contact at the variable resistor (thanks, Jason), the power supply board was producing sufficient voltage (adjusted to +5.18V).
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Friday, 12 Dec 2008:
With the power supply board now producing +5V (and +16V on the other pin - not sure why it's so high. Spec says it should be 13V?), I was hoping this would fix it, but all I see is a diagonal pattern of stars and a high pitched single tone coming out of the speaker (I will post a video once I figure out how).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxgukvPcl1s
Sunday, 14 Dec 2008:
My friend helped me move my Galaga to my house. Boy, was the wife in for a surprise! ha ha! Turns out, she thought it was a pretty cool project to be working on (as did the kids).
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Monday, 15 Dec 2008:
Anyway, I took the CPU and video boards out to clean them. Pretty dusty. I pulled all the socketed chips off one by one and cleaned the legs with a small brass brush. I also checked the ribbon cable. Connectors and cable looked ok. I did notice the 1N chip on the video card was suspiciously missing with a jumper wire not attached to anything. Anyone know if I need this chip? According to the spec, 1N is supposed to be populated by a 07xx Custom IC. Did a little research and the 07xx chip is for the clock divider counter array (whatever that's for).
Tuesday, 16 Dec 2008:
Stuck for now. Started discussion thread to try and solicit any help/advice.
Wednesday, 17 Dec 2008:
I'm contemplating getting a new CPU board and/or video board, but I'd really like to isolate the problem first. Maybe it's that missing 1N chip...
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Regarding your video... you're not supposed to use the "html" embedding code. Just click the little Youtube button when you post here (its right under the "BOLD" button) and then paste in the URL of the video.
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Thanks, RayB. I'll try that.
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Wow. You sure work fast. Great find. My Galaga just died...
May I ask what you paid for that particular machine? (I never know when it is appropriate to ask...)
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No problem. I paid $200 for it (minus the 9 quarters I found inside heh heh!).
I'm really not that fast (but thanks!) - last night's postings were just a brief history going back to Thanksgiving Sunday when I bought the game. I actually only just moved it to my house last weekend. Before that it was at my friend's (that bought the Spy Hunter) warehouse since Thanksgiving so up to that point I was only able to work on the power supply board that I had removed from the machine.
I'm totally new at this, so any help or advise you or anyone else has would be greatly appreciated. I should have paid more attention in electric circuits class...
Sorry to hear your Galaga just died. What happened to it?
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I don't like the looks of those jumper wires. You have a couple choices, start with the replacement 1N located
here: http://mikesarcade.com/cgi-bin/store.pl?sku=07xx (http://mikesarcade.com/cgi-bin/store.pl?sku=07xx)
or get a working board which isn't cheap.
I wouldn't start trouble shooting the board until you replaced 1N.
Also, the rolling screen may just be the monitor is out of sync. You may just need to adjust the sync on the back of the monitor.
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No problem. I paid $200 for it (minus the 9 quarters I found inside heh heh!).
I'm really not that fast (but thanks!) - last night's postings were just a brief history going back to Thanksgiving Sunday when I bought the game. I actually only just moved it to my house last weekend. Before that it was at my friend's (that bought the Spy Hunter) warehouse since Thanksgiving so up to that point I was only able to work on the power supply board that I had removed from the machine.
I'm totally new at this, so any help or advise you or anyone else has would be greatly appreciated. I should have paid more attention in electric circuits class...
Sorry to hear your Galaga just died. What happened to it?
Good deal!
I'm not sure yet. I've been having problems with it blowing out processors every couple weeks. Yesterday I turned it on and it came up with garbage and tones. It actually does something different every time I plug it in. I'm probably going to send it to GLS1 electronics for repair. I don't get anything in return for this, but if you can't get your board working, I highly recommend them. I'll get you a link in a little while. He has a stand alone website, but if you go on eBay you can buy his repair services for (I think) $100 plus shipping. This includes all parts and labor, you would want to let him know of that chip missing first though.
Have you looked at the other Galaga threads on this site to get a feel for the boards? Apparently these were manufactured with low quality chip sockets. I've found that out the hard way.
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If you guys haven't done it yet, you should also look at recapping your PCB and Power Supplies. Unknown Power supply instability is something I prefer not to deal with while trouble shooting.
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Did you get that from the auction in Grandview on November 30? I was there and remember overhearing a guy talking to a friend about the Spy Hunter he won. I was interested in the two Galagas there, but I have too many projects right now to take on another one. I was really more interested in a pin, and they had a good number of them. Unfortunately I had to way to haul anything.
Good luck and nice buy.
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I don't like the looks of those jumper wires. You have a couple choices, start with the replacement 1N located
here: http://mikesarcade.com/cgi-bin/store.pl?sku=07xx (http://mikesarcade.com/cgi-bin/store.pl?sku=07xx)
or get a working board which isn't cheap.
I wouldn't start trouble shooting the board until you replaced 1N.
Also, the rolling screen may just be the monitor is out of sync. You may just need to adjust the sync on the back of the monitor.
Yeah, I don't like the look of those jumper wires either. I take it the 1N chip is essential. I think I'll order that first and possibly the 4H chip (with the other jumper). Thanks for the link, 2600! I'll have a look at the monitor sync as well.
Cheers!
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Good deal!
I'm not sure yet. I've been having problems with it blowing out processors every couple weeks. Yesterday I turned it on and it came up with garbage and tones. It actually does something different every time I plug it in. I'm probably going to send it to GLS1 electronics for repair. I don't get anything in return for this, but if you can't get your board working, I highly recommend them. I'll get you a link in a little while. He has a stand alone website, but if you go on eBay you can buy his repair services for (I think) $100 plus shipping. This includes all parts and labor, you would want to let him know of that chip missing first though.
Have you looked at the other Galaga threads on this site to get a feel for the boards? Apparently these were manufactured with low quality chip sockets. I've found that out the hard way.
I stumbled across GLS1 in my world wide interweb researching, and they seem pretty good. If I can't figure it out, I'll probably utilize their services. But even though I'm pretty new at all this, I kind of enjoy the process of trying to figure out how to fix stuff (the engineer in me, I guess).
I've read through a few of the threads, and definitely gleaned some info from them. Most impressive so far was Galaga: Diary of a Renovation. That posting really inspired me (even though my renovation won't be nearly as good).
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I kind of enjoy the process of trying to figure out how to fix stuff (the engineer in me, I guess).
I'm the same way to a point. I'll work on a board set only until I genuinely consider setting fire to the whole thing. THATS when it is time to let the professionals to step in. ;D
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If you guys haven't done it yet, you should also look at recapping your PCB and Power Supplies. Unknown Power supply instability is something I prefer not to deal with while trouble shooting.
Good point, 2600. I'll put it on the list of things to do for my project. Would a bad capacitor on the power supply board have anything to do with my +V. Audio outputing more voltage than the spec (16-17V versus 13V)?
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Did you get that from the auction in Grandview on November 30? I was there and remember overhearing a guy talking to a friend about the Spy Hunter he won. I was interested in the two Galagas there, but I have too many projects right now to take on another one. I was really more interested in a pin, and they had a good number of them. Unfortunately I had to way to haul anything.
Good luck and nice buy.
Sure did! I said Kansas City in my first posting, but I meant Grandview. That was me talkinig to my friend, Jason, who bid against this guy that bought something like 13 or 14 various games and pinballs. Crazy!
Even though they got the other Galaga to work, I didn't like the condition of the cabinet. This is my first arcade project, so I'm looking forward to learning a lot from other more experienced folks like yourself.
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I'm the same way to a point. I'll work on a board set only until I genuinely consider setting fire to the whole thing. THATS when it is time to let the professionals to step in. ;D
I think I'm going to take 2600's advice and look at replacing the 1N chip as my next step and see what happens.
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good idea
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Thursday, 18 Dec 2008:
Progress! Looking at some other threads, I read that the 07xx chip is used in two places on Galaga boards: 1N on the video board, and 4D on the CPU board. I confirmed this in the schematics. So I moved the 07xx chip from 4D to 1N to see if that would change anything, and it did! Here's a picture of the screen now:
MikesArcade.com is currently out of stock of 07xx chips. Anyone know another reputable place to get 07xx chips?
Also noted that the high pitched tone went away.
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Also, the rolling screen may just be the monitor is out of sync. You may just need to adjust the sync on the back of the monitor.
Where exactly is the sync adjust on the back of the monitor? I didn't want to go poking around aimlessly back there and get zapped. I did find the focus and the brightness adjust knobs.
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GAH!! I HATE TIMEOUTS!!!
Anyway, nice to see that change. Definitely a good sign.
As for the sync, what kind of monitor does it have? If its the stock G07, you can find it here (remember yours will be rotated)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v379/tarzanthellama/DSCF4241-1.jpg)
If you're not sure what kind of monitor you have, post a picture of the chassis (monitor boards) and we'll help you out. If you don't have a G07, the sync adjust may be in a completely different place.
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Thanks, Mauzy. Looks like I do have a G07. The one you have circled corresponds with mine that is labeled V. Hold. The other ones are labeled V. Lin, V. Height, and H. Freq.
And H. Cent doesn't have a control attached to it. Now that I swapped the 4D chip out to 1N, the vertical hold seems to be ok. I assume you just turn them with a screwdriver to adjust.
Any recommendations on where else to get a 07xx chip?
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Thanks, Mauzy. Looks like I do have a G07. The one you have circled corresponds with mine that is labeled V. Hold. The other ones are labeled V. Lin, V. Height, and H. Freq.
And H. Cent doesn't have a control attached to it. Now that I swapped the 4D chip out to 1N, the vertical hold seems to be ok. I assume you just turn them with a screwdriver to adjust.
Any recommendations on where else to get a 07xx chip?
Yes sir you have a G07(or something incredibly close). A screwdriver should be fine. Theres also a little bitty tab on the top you could hit with your thumbnail, but with it mounted vertically I don't know if this would work.
H.Cent is actually changed with a jumper on one of three metal tabs on the board. Honestly, I've never had this control work when I changed the jumper.
BTW, and I'm sure you figured this out but In searching for a 07xx chip, I found the definitions for all the chips. 07xx is indeed a sync generator.
Sadly, the site I always use (mikesarcade.com) is out of the 07xx chip. Turns out they're $30 too! You might want to go to his site and contact him. I know he posts here too, but I'mnot sure of his screen name. I'm sure if you search hard enough you'll find one somewhere.
Oh you already said that. ;D I can't find anywhere but therealbobroberts.net . I've ordered from them before and they're great! Their only drawback is you can only pay through money order so you have to wait for them to receive that, then they ship. On the plus side his 07xx is only $20. I usually only order from them when I have a big list because he has awesome prices, might as well only wait once for everything. Be sure to read his shipping, payment, and ordering faqs if you want to order from him.
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Radio shack has a set of TV tuning tools for around $5.00. They are made out of plastic so you won't get zapped tuning your monitor. You will need it if you have to make an adjustment to your horizontal with coil. Don't use an allen wrench for that, it will bite you good if you do..... trust me!
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Thanks for the info, Mauzy & Orion. My project will be on hold as of next Tuesday as the I'm taking my wife and kids to........Disneyworld!
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Have fun with that. Its been 10 years since I've been to Disneyworld. I wouldn't mind going back.
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I can't find anywhere but therealbobroberts.net . I've ordered from them before and they're great! Their only drawback is you can only pay through money order so you have to wait for them to receive that, then they ship. On the plus side his 07xx is only $20. I usually only order from them when I have a big list because he has awesome prices, might as well only wait once for everything. Be sure to read his shipping, payment, and ordering faqs if you want to order from him.
Great site! Thanks, Mauzy. I emailed Bob this morning with a list of parts I need:
1- .156 right angle header
1- .156 molex connector (5 pin)
1- .156 molex connector (6 pin)
1- 07xx custom chip
2- Galaga gold leaf buttons
Just waiting to hear back from him. Looks like if you are in the USA you can pay by check, bank check or money order. International orders require a bank draft or money order in US funds. I'm going to do a little houscleaning on the cabinet while I wait on that.
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Bummer...Bob Roberts is is fresh out of 07xx chips :'(
Does anyone know anywhere else I can get 07xx chips besides MikesArcade or TheRealBobRoberts?
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Got a lead on a replacement for my 07xx chip from fpgaarcade.com (thanks, 2600!). Waiting to hear back...
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Thursday, Jan 1, 2009:
Just back from Christmas vacation in Florida. Parts arrived from Bob Roberts (minus 07xx chip :-[). Got rid of power supply board hard wiring and replaced with right angle header and Molex connector.
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Friday, Jan 2, 2009:
Ordered a C07 chip for $22 (plus $6 shipping & handling) from fpgaarcade.com to replace my 07xx chip. Should be here sometime next week...
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Jan 4-5, 2009:
Removed the control panel to work on over the weekend. The control panel overlay will need replaced for sure (I guess I'll have to lose the Led Zepplin scratched into it). CPO now on order from Mike's Arcade.
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Missing joystick mounting hardware will need replaced...
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Yucky rust on the joystick! Decided to focus on that for now. Took it apart (I hope I can remember how it all goes back together!).
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CLR is what I used. Works great! I even cleaned my rusted socket set.
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Primer & paint.
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Tuesday, Jan 6, 2009:
Just like new! In hindsight, I probably shouldn't have painted the rotating shaft.
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Back together again.
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Jan 4-5, 2009:
Removed the control panel to work on over the weekend. The control panel overlay will need replaced for sure (I guess I'll have to lose the Led Zepplin scratched into it). CPO now on order from Mike's Arcade.
At least they had good musical taste...
The joystick looks great! Looks a helluva lot better than mine, that's for sure.
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Thanks, Mauzy! The joystick was surprisingly easy to restore. I just need to lube the rotating shaft. What kind of lubricant is generally used in these components?
Now I'm working on removing the control panel overlay. I'm sure there is an easier chemical way to remove it, but I'm just using a painter's spatula and some elbow grease.
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Hmm... I'm not sure about what kind of lube. I've never had to re-lube a joystick so i have no idea.
You may still want to use some chemicals to remove left over adhesive. I used a heat gun and it all came off in one big chunk.
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I ended up using my wife's hairdryer last night. Worked great! After that I used some Goo Gone to clean up the adhesive.
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Thursday, Jan 8, 2009:
Removed most of the rust. Kind of did a half-assed job since I knew I was going to prime & paint.
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Thursday, Jan 8, 2009:
Removed most of the rust. Kind of did a half-assed job
And it shows.
You're on the right track, so don't cut any corners my friend. You have to remove ALL the rust before doing the primer. It will come back on you.
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Duly noted.
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Saturday, Jan 10, 2009:
Installed the Control Panel Overlay from MikesArcade.com. I scored a 1" section at the top of the adhesive backing and used the pushbuttons to align the CPO before pulling the backing off. Very pleased with the result (goodbye Led Zepplin).
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Reassembled :applaud:
I decided to keep the original fire button because the spring action felt better than the new one I got from MikesArcade.com. I guess they don't make them like they used to.
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Sunday, Jan 11, 2009:
Now to work on the coin door. Let's have a look at what I've got...
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What kind of lubricant is generally used in these components?
I happened upon this stuff at lizardlick
http://lizardlick.com/images/for_sale/joysticks/molycoat.jpg
They don't have any and what they had was 30 bucks (It was a very large tube...), but it is used for joystick lubrication. I figured you may be able to get some specs off of the tube and find a close equivalent at a hardware store or auto parts store.
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Thanks, Mauzy! I'll definitely check it out.
Do you know of a good rust remover/paint stripper for metal? I can't seem to find one that does as good a job as the stuff that DarthNuno used in his Galaga restoration. I used CLR for the joystick, but it kind of dulls the metal. Naval Jelly does an ok job removing rust, but not paint.
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I've never found a chemical that removes rust as I would think it should. I just sand and repaint if it is bad enough. I just live with it if its on a joystick shaft. As for paint remover, I've always had good results on wood and metal with Citrus Strip. Nice thing about that stuff is it has VERY limited chemical fumes, so I could use it in the basement without killing as many brain cells...
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I never use chemicals for rust removing either. I agree with Mauzy. Sand it all away. That's the only sure way to know the rust won't just get back very quickly.
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Thanks, Mauzy & Level 42. I sanded the front of the coin door frame last night. It's looking good. Will post pictures when I'm done.
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Still sanding, and sanding, and sanding...I'm going to see if someone at work can sandblast for me.
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Sand blasting is definitely the best way to go about it. If you haven't already, check out Peale's coin door restoration. Fantastic work with a lot of helpful hints.
Edit for link:
http://www.pealefamily.net/tech/newmame/coindoor/
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"I used CLR for the joystick, but it kind of dulls the metal. Naval Jelly does an ok job removing rust, but not paint."
Pick up one of these kits for your dremmel. http://www.amazon.com/Dremel-684-01-Polish-Rotary-Accessory/dp/B00005LEXV/ref=sr_1_9/192-4987556-6026856?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1231940994&sr=1-9 It includes these two gray hard rubber disks that will eat though rust (and also paint) like nobodies business. It's perfect for getting the joystick shaft nice and shinny again. I got my my midway coin door plates on my pac looking brand new with this kit and they were 10 times more rusty than your joystick parts.
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Thanks for the link, Mauzy. Peale did a fantastic job with that coin door. Turns out, my friend that bought the Spyhunter when I bought my Galaga has access to a sandblaster, so I'll probably do that.
Thanks, Orion. I could always use new tools for my workshop.
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Wednesday, Jan 14 2009:
Replacement synch generator chip arrived today from fpgaarcade.com. I plugged it in, and...RAM 1L error message :(. I unplugged it after dinner to show my son, and...IT WORKED! ;D
The vertical hold needed adjustment (it finally clicked in my brain that it is indeed the vertical hold, not horizontal hold, since the monitor is actually mounted sideways). But after a few minutes of warming up, the screen centered correctly on its own.
Naturally, I had to have a game (or 2 or 3 or 4...), so I reinstalled the unfinished coin door temporarily. The control panel felt (and looked) very good. There is a hum from the speaker that I will need to troubleshoot. Oh well...progress! :applaud:
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That's all it took to run? Fantastic! Now the monitor needs to be capped.
As for the hum, I had a hum in mine for quite some time before it bit the dust. I couldn't figure it out, but power was leaking from something in the harness into the speaker connections.
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I blew two amp chips, because of a speaker wire was shorting out. I ended up replaceing the wire harness from:http://www.arcadeshop.com/galaga/galaga.htm
If you need anything else and don't see it on the web sit just call them they have it.
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I need to do another tutorial. That one is good for that particular door, but I recently did an over/under door. The paint is completely different.
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I'd love to see one for a DK coin door... Will that chemical method work or should I seek out a professional to refinish it?
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I would think it would work. Depending on how bad it is I might just clean it up and give it a skim coat to 'brighten' things. If it's REALLY bad I'd see how far sanding/wire wheel got me, and certainly try chem stripper.
Unless I could find someone with a sandblaster that would be willing to do it for cheap.
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Thanks. I'm afraid to do anything to it because they are somewhat rare (at least I don't know of anywhere to buy a new one) and this one isn't dinged or dented at all really. There is just the typical rust and paint chipping... I don't want to mess this up!
EDIT: don't want to hijack someone's project thread! :cheers:
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I blew two amp chips, because of a speaker wire was shorting out. I ended up replaceing the wire harness from:http://www.arcadeshop.com/galaga/galaga.htm
If you need anything else and don't see it on the web sit just call them they have it.
I'll definitely look into that. The hum gets louder with time.
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Saturday, Jan 24, 2009:
Took a little hiatus after I got my Galaga functional to enjoy it for a while. I noticed after playing for a few minutes, sometimes the explosion graphics would turn into big white squares and some of the challenging stage bugs would be other colored squares. A small adjustment to the 5V fixed that (measured 4.99V at the CPU board, adjusted back up to 5.2V).
Worked on the coin door frame today. Paint stripping, sanding and priming:
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Still sanding, and sanding, and sanding...I'm going to see if someone at work can sandblast for me.
I found a business in Raytown that said they would sand blast a piece of metal the size of a coin door for something like $20. I am in Florida for a few months, but if you are interested let me know and I will dig up the contact info.
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I found a business in Raytown that said they would sand blast a piece of metal the size of a coin door for something like $20. I am in Florida for a few months, but if you are interested let me know and I will dig up the contact info.
Thanks, JeepMonkey. Turns out my friend that bought the SpyHunter has access to a sandblaster. Coincidentally, we're planning on sandblasting the coin door after lunch today.
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Coin door frame - before:
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Coin door frame - after:
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Coin door - before sandblasting:
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Coin door - post-sandblasting:
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Looks like you are trying to save the logo plate on the coin door. ThisOldGame (http://www.thisoldgame.com) has reproduction plates available.
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Yeah, that plate you have on there isn't worth messing with considering the repros out there. Seeing the sandblasted door really makes me want to have mine sand blasted. I just need to get off my lazy butt and find a place that will do it.
Too bad the TOG site just got re-launched today and seems to have a pretty big bug right now. I'm sure it is getting fixed soon.
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I'm less concerned with repro plates and more concerned with the "snaps" that hold them in place. They're not rivets. No one has been able to come up with them.
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Indeed a PITA. I do suggest going with ThisOldGame's plates though, they're much closer to the original than the one's from AS.
I carefully drilled off the back of those "rivets" and saved the "tops". This way I was able to glue them back on. Not 100% right, but it looks OK.
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Thanks for the link, Spyridon. I had the same thought as Peale with regards to the "snaps". That's a good suggestion, Level42. I'll probably try that.
Sandblasting was pretty fun - you should try it, Mauzy. I've never done it before. Next time I'll stretch my hand out to prevent the cramping. The machine I used was set up to use glass beads. So I guess theoretically I glass blasted the door. Here are some pics:
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Hey, nice blasting cabinet. Looks much better than my setup.
(http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh244/joeo42/Robotron/Gorf/IMG_4680.jpg)
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I wish I had my own sandblaster cabinet. The one I used was at my friend's airplane parts company. Pretty heavy duty.
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I wish I had my own sandblaster cabinet.
+1 !
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Finished the coin door. I will have to replace the Midway plate (but not today!).
Coin mechs are hit or miss as far as the quarter going through properly.
It's been a while since I had a game, so...
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Nice high score. Did you do it honestly or did you use the cheat to stop them from shooting? Either way I'm impressed.
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No cheat here. I am way too impatient wait 15-20 minutes to try to do the cheat.
I have my dipswitches set to the 3rd level difficulty (which is how I remember playing it as a kid).