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Main => Everything Else => Topic started by: jdbailey1206 on October 12, 2014, 10:18:22 pm
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• Holy ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- that was violent. Looks like Ill be sleeping soundly tonight.
• Im excited we get to see Negan. My favorite love to hate fictional character.
• Pretty sure that Carol killed Zombie Andrea in the beginning.
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That wasn't Negan.
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Very good episode!!
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That wasn't Negan.
Yup. Good catch Ginsu. It is supposed to be the guy with the face tattoos in the beginning of the episode. I think someone needs to fire the lighting guy and director of photography. ;D
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Good Episode. Glad they are not spending another season with the groups split up.
Trying to decide if Tyreese punched the guy to death, or just knocked him out and lied to Carol so that she wouldn't go inside and kill him. I suppose if it follows the comics, he punched him to death. Anyone know what NFL team Tyreese played for in the comics? I am hoping it is the Ravens or the Vikings. ;D
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Pretty sure Tyrese beat that dude to death.
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I thought it was a great episode while viewing, but then got let down a little after. There was SUCH a build up to Terminus and within 38 minutes, place is destroyed. Tehn on top of that, the explanation of why is very short, after the episode.
I did like how they "welcomed back" Carol. Pretty sure the dude at the end was the crazy guy from a season ago in town, and the dude who originally "helped" Rick in season 1, but forgot his name.
Kind of wish there was a spoiler tag we could use on the forum. :censored:
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Pretty sure the dude at the end was the crazy guy from a season ago in town, and the dude who originally "helped" Rick in season 1, but forgot his name.
Kind of wish there was a spoiler tag we could use on the forum. :censored:
Morgan Jones and yes it was him. SPOILER: We have spoiler tags
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I was looking for a GUI tag, like the insert quote button, or the subscript button.
I'm an idiot
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like this?
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Yes:
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use SMF Default Theme - Curve instead of the theme you are using?
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Works now! Thanks Malenko! I was using the board default.
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happy to help! :cheers:
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Pretty sure Tyrese beat that dude to death.
On The Talking Dead, they show who died in the episode they are discussing.
He wasn't shown.
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Pretty sure Tyrese beat that dude to death.
On The Talking Dead, they show who died in the episode they are discussing.
He wasn't shown.
But neither were the zombies he killed when he go sent out the door.
Talking dead only recaps kills that you actually see(usually)
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Pretty sure Tyrese beat that dude to death.
On The Talking Dead, they show who died in the episode they are discussing.
He wasn't shown.
Yeah Carol gave the shack a look like "I should make sure that guy is dead because Tyreese acts like a 7 year old girl when it comes to killing."
I have a feeling the dude in the ballcap is gonna come back to haunt the group, end up killing someone and that will send Tyreese over the edge. And Tyreese will kill the guy in turn. Like Upham in Saving Private Ryan with the nazi.
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I thought that the whole Terminus thing was silly. Last episode, they get there and withing 3 minutes have guns out, are captured and thrown in a rail car. It really, REALLY got rushed. Now, one episode in, it's all over already. My predictions were wrong... and since spoiler tags are in:
I thought that Carol wouldn't give the baby back to Rick because I thought she was going to claim the baby for herself after losing ALL THE CHILDREN. Also, I thought that they kept showing Michonne and Carl getting close because the Governor was going to kill Carl in front of her the way she killed Penny. I hate Carl, and wish that did happen.
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I hope they take his eye like they did in the comic.
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I've never seen an episode.
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I've never seen an episode.
I think this was established last year...Too lazy to double check.
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I've never seen an episode.
I think this was established last year...Too lazy to double check.
SPOILERS!!!
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I've never seen an episode.
I think this was established last year...Too lazy to double check.
SPOILERS!!!
Oops. Sorry about that Yotsuya!
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Terminus is not yet done, looks like.
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Looks like Bob doesnt have a leg to stand on! :laugh2:
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I am pretty sure in the end they showed that guy from the shack that Tyreese "Killed".
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I am pretty sure in the end they showed that guy from the shack that Tyreese "Killed".
yeah they did. They mentioned that on talking dead
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Looks like Bob doesnt have a leg to stand on! :laugh2:
If this goes where I think it's going (like what happens to Dale in the comic), it's going to be great.
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Looks like Bob doesnt have a leg to stand on! :laugh2:
If this goes where I think it's going (like what happens to Dale in the comic), it's going to be great.
Bob is rather passive. I hope he has enough gusto to do it like Dale did and not start crying like a girl. I would have loved to see Dale survive in the tv series just so I could see this scene play out with him. I know Jeffrey DeMunn would have done an excellent job. I was excited when they cast him as Dale. It sucked to see him go in the first season.
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Agreed completely. This was Dale's finest hour, and I hope Bob can pull it off.
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We don't need another one legged guy. They just got rid of one.
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We don't need another one legged guy. They just got rid of one.
This made me lol. Well played.
I was disappointed to see the cabin guy alive, but I think this basically makes Tyrese a dead man walking character. Sadly, I think he will kill Carol when the mob turns on him.
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We don't need another one legged guy. They just got rid of one.
Bob's a goner. No worries.
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I'm going to start with a disclaimer: I'm not watching the show.
That being said, two of my buddies are embroiled in a debate about it so I thought I would post it here.
The crux: Would people need to resort to cannibalism in this scenario?
Argument For: yes, it is a viable means of hunting, lure people in and eat them. There just wouldn't be enough game/farming/scavenging available for 100 people.
Argument Against: no, there would be no need. Zombies are slow and not that dangerous. Deer and small game restock fast enough that you can hunt easily for 100 people.
I'm just enjoying the argument, I said they should eat the Zombies...plentiful, easy to kill and it helps solve the problem >:D
So if anyone wants to join that argument I thought I would spread it :laugh:
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I think hunting and farming assumes you have the necessary tools and knowledge to do either. I think the mindset of kill or be killed is different than, hey! lets go cannibal! The group was obviously mentally damaged from the group raping and pillaging they endured.
I guess, for me, if it meant survival versus death from starvation, I'd eat some bitches.
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OK, here is a well thought out answer.
One thing that I got from the show is that the zombies don't just eat humans, but small deer and game. They have shown them chowing on deer or pigs. Not sure how much that impacts the stock, but Being that Darryl, the big hunter of the group, only manages to catch squirrel, I just assumed certain large game have become scarce.
Farming is hindered because all it takes are a group of raiders or a heard of zombies to destroy everything. Zombies herd by the thousands in this show, and trample everything and eat anything living. You would need a farm that is very well secured and room for livestock that can graze. You can't rely on crops alone, because they yield only a short time of the year. I would think the safest bet would be securing a fruit orchard with canning equipment, since this is Georgia, I assume there would be plenty of peach orchards.
But at the same time, I think most people would not resort to eating people, and if they got hungry enough that they needed to, they probably wouldn't have the strength to fight off walkers. I read about that there were a couple cases of cannibalism during the great potato famine in Ireland. They lost about 1 million people to hunger in a few short years. Leads me to believe there would be a few isolated incidents, especially with the lack of any law or authority.
The big thing that I don't believe is that they are so organized about it. The random fellow knifing any survivor they find and grilling them up seems a lot more believable. Those terminus people were pretty much basting people in sweet baby rays and slow cooking them to perfection over a grill large enough to feed 100 people. Then keeping multiple meat storage rooms, Killing 8 people at a time, and storing them without refrigeration systems to feed what looked like only 20 people.
The TL;DR version. Cannibalism = Yes. Organized Cannibalism towns = No.
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Possible spoiler warning...
So my wife had a solid thought. Neither of us has read the comics.
She thinks Bob was originally from terminus. Which explains why he was
An alcoholic last season and why he was alone. He couldn't handle it anymore
So he left terminus. And last episode that dick ---meecrob--- guy was saying something
Along the lines of "it a coincidence it was you" or something of that nature.
And we think he got bit and that is why he went out for a cry.
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And we think he got bit and that is why he went out for a cry.
That's why his death (and those eating him) is going to be so awesome.
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Bob was definitely crying because he was bit. I dont think he was associated with Terminus in any way. I believe he was an alcoholic because of his experience with war. In my opinion his life before the apocolypse was abnormal. He had no one to love, he saw too much violence and his life was general ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---. But now that was turned on its head and now he has recieved some stability. (ie asking Sasha for a second kiss. He knew he would never recieve it again.) And it was completely ruined by one walker. He knew he was going to die soon enough when he went outside. Then Gareth and his band of ---meecrobs--- put the nail in the coffin by taking his leg.
But within the next episode I believe we will see Bob accept his fate. Like Dale in the comic I believe Bob will reveal that he was bitten and a sadistic smile will grow on his face knowing he inivertly saved the group from the Termites.
...Bob will be awesome but I still would have loved to seen Dale do it.
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About cannibalism: just for a side field trip, watch the movie "The Road". Last time I checked it was available on Netflix. Not a movie about zombies, but will make you think about what could happen if the world breaks down.
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About cannibalism: just for a side field trip, watch the movie "The Road". Last time I checked it was available on Netflix. Not a movie about zombies, but will make you think about what could happen if the world breaks down.
I liked that movie.
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About cannibalism: just for a side field trip, watch the movie "The Road". Last time I checked it was available on Netflix. Not a movie about zombies, but will make you think about what could happen if the world breaks down.
I liked that movie.
I liked it, but it was fairly depressing...
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Fairly? My wife saw the movie and she said the book was 10x more graphic.
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So to the point about Bob killing off the other people:
Everyone already has the virus. The guy at the CDC told Rick, who confirmed it with the death of Shane. How does eating someone bitten cause death? Hershel was bitten, had his leg amputated, and survived, right?
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Book was better, but his stuff is hard to read.. many of his books he uses no punctuation, no paragraphs, and ignores just about every rule of the English language. The Road at least has paragraphs, commas, and periods. No quotes though, so you pretty much have to guess when someone is speaking.. I liked that the book took something of a realistic view on how life would be after a major apocalyptic event. But it wasn't much fun because it was so dark and depressing. The best part about a post-apocalyptic story is the hope of rebuilding humanity. Take away hope and you just have a depressing story set in the last hours of humanity's existence.. *yawn*
As for WD (spoilers ahead), at first I thought the thing with Bob was that he was scratched or bit, but then the way the terminus guy was talking to him suggested that maybe he had led the group to terminus (albeit inadvertently) and perhaps had actually been sent out to find groups to lead to terminus. I seem to recall last season he mentioned he had been with more than one group in the past...
I do wish they put more effort into the whole "infected" thing though.. So everyone is infected, but getting a scratch or bite turns you into a zombie right away.. So if they are swimming in a flooded basement full of zombie juice, killing them in the water and filling the water with more infected zombie juices, and they have scratches and cuts all over their body (from the last big fight), wouldn't that be no different than getting scratched or bit by a zombie? It creates a disconnect in the logic, destroys the suspension of disbelief, and makes whether or not Bob was scratched kind of irrelevant to ponder.. Either they will make him infected enough to turn without dying first, or they won't, and you can't use any kind of logic to make an assumption ahead of time because the rules are inconsistent..
So throwing out any logic whatsoever, I am thinking a couple possible story lines with Bob:
1) he is infected and was gonna die anyway, not he is getting eaten too. Poor Bob.
2) he was part of terminus to begin with, met Rick's crew and was supposed to lead them back but decided he didn't like those guys and is now getting eaten by them because he "went rogue"
3) he is infected and now that they are eating his infected flesh, they will all get sick and turn..
I didn't read the stories so I don't know if Bob has any significance there, not that it really matters for the show..
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They showed that in terminus they were carefully separating the meats and had a meticulous system. They either know there is a danger, or are at least scared of the possibility and taking a number of precautions. I'd assume cooking it thoroughly would probably kill the virus off. Were those Bob burgers served medium rare or well-done?
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So to the point about Bob killing off the other people:
Everyone already has the virus. The guy at the CDC told Rick, who confirmed it with the death of Shane. How does eating someone bitten cause death? Hershel was bitten, had his leg amputated, and survived, right?
But Herschel was bitten in the leg and it was swiftly amputaded. We dont know where Bob was bitten and the virus had time to course through his body. Thus infecting everything. Even his peg. Which was then transfered to the termites.
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Maybe I am just not remembering people turning fast from a bite. I just remember people bleeding out quickly from cuts to the throat or hips, near your major arteries, and ending up dead quickly from that. So being bitten by a walker speeds up the death? But no matter how you die, you will turn eventually.
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That's the big hole in the show.. they are already infected, so getting scratched or bit shouldn't matter.. They should have said that everyone is infected with a mutated version that turns you when you die, but the walkers have a different strain that will turn you right away if you get scratched or bitten by them (or something along those lines). But then even that wouldn't explain how they could be swimming in zombie juice with scratches and cuts all over their bodies from recent fights and not get infected with the part that will turn you right away... It just doesn't make sense, and they are patching that hole by just making it up as they go, not explaining anything. You get scratched or bitten and you turn, but get zombie blood, guts, saliva, or anything on an existing cut and you don't...
Once they defined a rule, they need to stick with it or they break the story. I am trying hard to just ignore it and pretty much ignore the zombies because I don't even think they matter much any more. They are the environment, and you just adjust to an environment to survive. This show is more about the struggle of humans in an environment where there is no inherent safety and no law to bring repercussions to those who do evil. Rick said it to his son in the last episode: you just don't get to let your guard down any more, ever, no matter what. That is what the environment has done, it has made it so you need to be vigilant every second of your life or you will die. And the story is about how to survive and make a life in that environment. They could have made it monsters, rabid animals, aliens, or ghosts and the story would not need to change. They are trying too hard to keep the show about zombies and not about the human condition, and they need to either give it up or start defining the specifics.
Just my opinion though, lol..
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Maybe I am just not remembering people turning fast from a bite. I just remember people bleeding out quickly from cuts to the throat or hips, near your major arteries, and ending up dead quickly from that. So being bitten by a walker speeds up the death? But no matter how you die, you will turn eventually.
Yes, basically what they are saying is being bitten or scratched makes you deathly sick and in a matter of hours you die and turn. But since they are already infected, it doesn't make any sense.
In the first two seasons there were a bunch of examples of people getting bitten or scratched and dying from it. Since then, once someone is bit, the rest of the crew either shoots them or just leaves them to be eaten because they are gonna turn even if the bites don't kill them. Hershel made it because they chopped the leg off before it had a chance to get to the rest of his body, but they still watched him to see if he would get the fever and turn.
They don't talk about it anymore because it is just assumed that it is understood. After each fight they ask each other if they are OK, and are really asking "did you get bit or scratched".. No need to take another half of a show to watch someone get a fever and die a few hours later, it is better to just rip necks open, stick knives in their brains, and other crazy gruesome stuff like that..
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Are you serious dKersten. Do you have an idea how much suspense of disbelief you have to give this show for people with the IQ over an egg muffin. We are suppose to believe the whole world was taken over by stupid slow moving…..
Never mind none of that matters.
In Walking Dead
The entire world is only as big as Georgia
Nothing happened before and during the zombie attacks, no news was given and everyone apparently died in like one day; The survivors do not know what’s going on at all. They might as well woken up one morning and the world turned into “The Road”
vehicles are hard to come by, they get lost. They also cannot just run over zombies like bowling pins in a truck, that would make humans overpowered and that would be no fun.
Zombies are dying in droves every day, not that many are being made. They are getting stuck in places or fall over and can't get back up, but there are always an infinite number of them walking around freely and as long as this show is on the air there always will be.
No one needs to drink water, what is dehydration?
Vehicles are a rare unicorn but Bullets are infinite, no matter what you are doing or how long you have been doing it when you go to shoot that gun there will be bullets in it no need to worry about that.
Could go on, Watch your free show and STFU.
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I dont even know where to start with the above post.
So, anyway. I'm pretty confident (having read no books) that Bob was plinked for ties to Terminus, but what i don't understand is how Darryl couldn't find any tracks. When did the Terminus group get ninja-like in anti-spore detection?
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I would think the safest bet would be securing a fruit orchard with canning equipment, since this is Georgia, I assume there would be plenty of peach orchards.
If this were actually Georgia everything everywhere would be wrapped up in 100ft of kudzu by now. The walkers would be completely secured in vines and every building not surrounded by concrete would be unusable. There would be no nice open woodlands for them to walk around in. They would NEVER find an abandoned house surrounded by vegetation. Kudzu overtakes abandoned structures within months in some parts of Georgia.
Of course, Kudzu can be processed into both biofuel and food, so they also wouldn't be completely starving all the time and would have fuel for lanterns and such.
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Hell with it, I will bite:
Are you serious dKersten. Do you have an idea how much suspense of disbelief you have to give this show for people with the IQ over an egg muffin. We are suppose to believe the whole world was taken over by stupid slow moving…..
Never mind none of that matters.
The point of my post wasn't to say that this show is 100% solid, but the rule in story telling is to create a suspension of disbelief by explaining things with things that are plausible, and when you can't do that, either use a plausible explanation that can't be disproved (ie doesn't exist but makes sense if it did), or just leave it alone and pretend that everyone understands that this is just how it is. It is when you try to explain something and then base the story line on that explanation that you get into trouble.
Frankly, if you took the time to explain every detail with only facts that apply to our universe as we know them today (ie reality), you would have a really boring show that was more of a non-fiction "what if" story than an actual fun to watch tv show. If you could even create a story to begin with.
I know what you are getting at with the slow moving zombies, but they didn't mess with how it started or spread so fast. They started AFTER the fact, and you just make some assumptions of the chaos that reigned. The one thing they did reveal was that everyone was infected, which would suggest it is airborne, so when you don't know what is going on, you end up with zombies where you least expect. In the beginning they aren't so slow and easy to kill. And when you don't know how to kill them, or what is going on, you aren't going to be reacting by putting bullets in your wife's head, you are going to seek answers and end up getting eaten by some zombie horde. Is it realistic? Who cares, it happened in this story and this is the setting.
In Walking Dead
The entire world is only as big as Georgia
This is the story of one group of people in one area. If they made this show about every place on earth, they would have to make it about every person on earth. This group has not traveled extensively far because where are they going to go? any major roadway is clogged with cars, no passage there. That leaves back roads and forests that are filled with millions of zombies.
Nothing happened before and during the zombie attacks, no news was given and everyone apparently died in like one day; The survivors do not know what’s going on at all. They might as well woken up one morning and the world turned into “The Road”
As I said above, you don't know the whole story, only a small glimpse as told by one man and the people he meets. One man who was in a coma when it all happened. Any place that made a stand was soon overrun by zombies from the inside because nobody knew to shoot the dead in the head.
vehicles are hard to come by, they get lost. They also cannot just run over zombies like bowling pins in a truck, that would make humans overpowered and that would be no fun.
Every time the cast needs a vehicle they go get one. In the last episode they are in the middle of the forest with no roads around, no towns in sight, and no supplies like gas and batteries. So they say they need to find a car. And they do. But they have a large group, so they need larger transportation. AND they need something that won't get bogged down when plowing through zombies.. Most vehicles might be able to get up to speed and plow through a group of people, possibly 15 or 20 people deep before they run out of momentum and the power to keep going.. Imagine trying to do that with a horde of 10,000 people.. you would get 40 feet in and then be surrounded.. the ones you knocked down are undead and get right back up and now you are surrounded with no way to escape. Brilliant idea, just mow them down.
Zombies are dying in droves every day, not that many are being made. They are getting stuck in places or fall over and can't get back up, but there are always an infinite number of them walking around freely and as long as this show is on the air there always will be.
Say there are 500 people left alive in Georgia, before the zombies there were 10 million. So only 9 million, 999 thousand, 500 people zombies left over. Have you ever seen a crowd of, say, 10,000? Like at a concert or something? There would be 1000 hordes of that many zombies running around. And even if there are only 100 hordes of that size, that would leave thousands of groups of 10-100 zombies, and still have room left for thousands upon thousands of extra zombies running around. I think in the show they have portrayed maybe 1000 zombies total on the actual camera shots, and maybe inferred another few thousand. They might have killed 500 or even 1000 of those. So they have shown off a fraction of a fraction of a percent of the total zombie population JUST IN GEORGIA. Not to mention the other few hundred million undead roaming the rest of the U.S., and the 7 BILLION roaming the world. PLUS, the show can only afford to dress up so many people as zombies. Think of the hordes you saw in World War Z, make them slower but all around the forest you are in the middle of, with huge groups in the towns and massive hordes in the cities. And they are attracted to sound.
No one needs to drink water, what is dehydration?
The last episode showed them collecting water. Just because this isn't done in the style of the reality show "Naked and Afraid" doesn't mean they aren't considering it, just that the show isn't about how to survive, it is about the people and the human condition.
Vehicles are a rare unicorn but Bullets are infinite, no matter what you are doing or how long you have been doing it when you go to shoot that gun there will be bullets in it no need to worry about that.
Have you actually watched this show? Not only do they only use guns as a last resort because the sound attracts zombies, but they have always been hesitant to use their ammo. In the current episode they are very short on guns and ammo. The ONLY thing that has annoyed me here is that Rick's gun uses a rare kind of ammo yet he always has some.
Besides, this is Georgia, and while I don't live there, they are way more redneck there than up here in Montana where everyone I know has at least 500 rounds on hand right now. Heck I think I have a couple boxes of 50 rounds of 9mm in my car under a seat somewhere, lol. Some of my friends (more than I care to admit actually) have over 5000 rounds stocked. Even with the recent shortages in the stores, ammo is not exactly hard to come by if you know the right people. If most of the population died off, I could forage my immediate area for 2 hours and come up with 1000 rounds for my pistol quite easily.
If you are gonna complain about the ammo usage, point out how hard it is to hit the head of a moving target. They did go over that on one episode, but no matter how much you practice, it still takes rock solid skills to shoot a moving target with perfect accuracy.
Could go on, Watch your free show and STFU.
You could, but it might make you look like more of a jackass. The show has holes, no question. The CONCEPT of an apocalypse that wipes out all but a few people has a ton of holes. But this isn't a guide on what could happen and how exactly it would happen, it is an entertaining show set in a post-apocalyptic environment filled with undead and only a few living people who are trying to survive. And the story is more about how people would react in a situation like this than it is about what happened to get them there. If I want to punch more holes I will watch Mythbusters.
It IS a free show, and happens to be the most popular show on TV. And the writers have to keep that up, which isn't easy, especially when the number of holes is growing every episode. Their job is making their fans happy and keeping the ratings up. if they screw it up and piss off enough people by breaking the rules they have established in the story, the show will die. I like it so I don't want that to happen. So no, I won't STFU, I will continue to have conversations here and elsewhere about the show I happen to really enjoy. Why don't you go back to watching CSPAN where you can get your daily dose of reality and leave the fiction shows to those of us who enjoy them.
Have a GREAT day! :cheers:
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I would think the safest bet would be securing a fruit orchard with canning equipment, since this is Georgia, I assume there would be plenty of peach orchards.
If this were actually Georgia everything everywhere would be wrapped up in 100ft of kudzu by now. The walkers would be completely secured in vines and every building not surrounded by concrete would be unusable. There would be no nice open woodlands for them to walk around in. They would NEVER find an abandoned house surrounded by vegetation. Kudzu overtakes abandoned structures within months in some parts of Georgia.
Of course, Kudzu can be processed into both biofuel and food, so they also wouldn't be completely starving all the time and would have fuel for lanterns and such.
I'm pretty sure the zombies are spending their days manicuring lawns and trimming back foliage. There are so many mowed lawns in the show, it is about the only explanation left. I hear zombies even maintain the ice arenas.
(http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130527001801/plantsvszombies/images/5/5c/Zomboni_GOTY_almanac.png)
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I would think the safest bet would be securing a fruit orchard with canning equipment, since this is Georgia, I assume there would be plenty of peach orchards.
If this were actually Georgia everything everywhere would be wrapped up in 100ft of kudzu by now. The walkers would be completely secured in vines and every building not surrounded by concrete would be unusable. There would be no nice open woodlands for them to walk around in. They would NEVER find an abandoned house surrounded by vegetation. Kudzu overtakes abandoned structures within months in some parts of Georgia.
Of course, Kudzu can be processed into both biofuel and food, so they also wouldn't be completely starving all the time and would have fuel for lanterns and such.
:laugh2: best post yet on this thread!
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Actually...best two posts...the Zomboni is just as funny!
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From the Walking Dead wiki... it doesn't explain eating cooked 'Bob' meat, but it explains bites:
The first cases of infection progressed through a state of fever, aches, and internal bleeding, and this illness ultimately was fatal. As seen on the MRI of Candace Jenner, the virus apparently spreads into the brain like meningitis. It apparently infects synapses, mostly concentrating on those in the brain stem. It eventually causes the adrenal glands to hemorrhage and the brain to shutdown, all brain activity would cease, followed by the major organs and the body would be clinically dead: no measurable brain activity, no reflexes, and no respiration or pulse. A variable time later, the pathogen, through some means, would revive synapses it infected and reactivate the brainstem of the dead body, but only the brainstem and not the cerebrum or cerebellum.
Infection
As previously stated, the zombie pathogen itself is not lethal, and zombie "infection" occurs due to high concentrations of antibiotic-resistant bacteria found in zombies, especially in their mouths. In the Walking Dead universe, every human being on the planet is believed to be infected, suggesting the disease is airborne or waterborne. Any time a human dies they will reanimate, bitten or not, unless their brain is destroyed. It is unknown if getting blood or saliva from zombies into human mouths will cause infection, but it is known that any contact zombie fluids make with open wounds, and possibly a human's eyes, will spread their lethal bacteria throughout the host's body.
In response to:
"Negan recently has his guys dirty up weapons in zombie gore for infection attacks. I'm curious if this works due to "Phillip" kissing a zombie and Tyreese and other characters getting bloody all over their face, but nobody changing. This also made me question Dale's "tainted meat" logic back during the Fear the Hunters arc."
Are you explaining that stuff soon or is Negan unaware of that method probably doing no harm? In other words, can zombie blood or spit change you after apparently having no effect on characters previously?
"The weapons would create an open wound, and getting that material in an open wound and have contact in that way would be bad news. Kissing a zombie, getting stuff on you... not so much. It's more like direct contact with the blood stream. Make sense?"
Symptoms of infection
The first form of the infection was the transmission of the pathogen from an undead host to a living body via bites and scratches. The second form is already contained within all living people, and merely requires the death of the host to activate the zombie condition. The pathogen causing reanimation is not independently fatal and lies dormant within a host until the host dies of another cause. In the case of Walker attacks, the cause of death is generally infection by necrotic biological debris and other infectious agents contained in that debris (for example, saliva from a bite).
Symptoms of this massive and multiple infection include:
Dizziness
Weakness
Fever/Delirium/Hallucinations
Chills
Nausea/Vomiting.
Pale skin.
Dilated pupils.
Soreness.[8]
Fluid discharge.
Spontaneous aggression or anger.
Fainting.[9]
Loss of hair and missing scalp pieces.
Dehydration.[10]
Coughing up blood.[11]
Pale yellow sclera (Shown in the Video Game only) [12]
Because of antibiotic resistance or inefficacy, and extremely fast growth rate of said bacteria, immediate amputation of the wounded limb is usually the most effective method of preventing systemic infection that eventually leads to death. Bites to the neck, head, or trunk are invariably fatal and cannot be treated.
If the wound is not properly cauterized, cleaned, and/or wrapped, however, amputation may not be enough to stop the lethal infection without medicine, and even then, survival rates are not easily estimated, as only few individuals have survived the procedure in each medium.
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I would think the safest bet would be securing a fruit orchard with canning equipment, since this is Georgia, I assume there would be plenty of peach orchards.
If this were actually Georgia everything everywhere would be wrapped up in 100ft of kudzu by now. The walkers would be completely secured in vines and every building not surrounded by concrete would be unusable. There would be no nice open woodlands for them to walk around in. They would NEVER find an abandoned house surrounded by vegetation. Kudzu overtakes abandoned structures within months in some parts of Georgia.
Of course, Kudzu can be processed into both biofuel and food, so they also wouldn't be completely starving all the time and would have fuel for lanterns and such.
Well, it is actually filmed in Georgia.
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From the Walking Dead wiki... it doesn't explain eating cooked 'Bob' meat, but it explains bites:
Unfortunately, it doesn't explain swimming in zombie stew with open wounds either.. the more I think about that episode, the more it irritates me. The moment they showed the basement with the water and the zombies in it, I was thinking "that is a cesspool of infection, if they go in there and get that in their open wounds they are dead" and of course they went in there anyway..
If the pathogen is a bacteria, then I imagine cooking Bob would kill it.. If he is infected at all.. Maybe tonight we will learn more..
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So that just happened. I guess we don't get to see Carol and Darrell's adventure? Also I think the secret person Darrell has are people he saved from where Beth was.
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Well, that was somewhat cold and psychopathic.. I am a little torn on the way Rick handled that.. "saving bullets" .. hmm.. not too sure about that. I liked how they lured them in like that and the justice of the first couple that went down, but once you have them disarmed and begging for their lives, it changes from a battle for survival to a question of humanity. I would also agree, however, that these people were a threat and an abomination, and had to die, but to hack and beat them to death instead of a swift bullet in the back of the head... a little too much revenge and not so much about justice. But I guess you gotta ask yourself, is it more civil than lining them up at a trough and hitting them in the back of the head one by one before slitting their throats? Particularly while the others watched it happening, knowing they were next?
I guess the only thing that really bugs me is that I believe that Rick should have taken the high road on this one and executed them a little more honorably. And less psychopathically. You gotta look back at the farm and how Shane wanted to kill the kid, but Rick thought it was wrong.. Looks like he has turned into Shane after all...
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Couple notes.. obviously spoilers, but I think this whole thread is a spoiler, so don't read the thread if you haven't watched the most recent show.. :)
First, tainted meat.. lol
Second, when they discovered Bob, someone shot a zombie in front of Rick. Why would that be the cannibals? I think it is Morgan who shot..
Third, when the shot came from the forest, Rick turns and empties his gun into the forest. But per my last post, when they ambushed them, they claimed to be saving bullets... Lends to the whole psychopathic execution. They could spare a few more bullets to do what had to be done instead of butchering them.. The looks they got from their own friends said a lot about how they felt too..
Now some speculation about next week: Do you think that whoever kidnapped Beth is experimenting on people, looking for a cure?
And do you think that maybe Daryl found Morgan in the forest?
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I feel as though dkersten's response about the human condition, and the breaking thereof, persists here. Back when they were in the prison, would they have hacked these guys for not being peaceful? Probably not, they would have put a bullet in their head. When they were escaping Terminus, Rick wanted to make sure they all died. They deserved to die for what they were doing, which was essentially recruiting cannibals, and slaughtering the rest.
Then they attacked one of their own. And cut off his leg. And ate it in front of him. This was all relayed to the group when Bob was able to talk. That's your breaking point of when the Terminus group stopped being human bullies/"bad people", and became monsters. It was completely eye for an eye, and savage, and for a reason. I dont think it was psychotic, per se, because this was the most real threat they have faced, and the most sinister, since leaving Atlanta, imo.
I happen to think the spoiler tag is fun as ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- and Im going to keep using it. ;D
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Do you think what they did to Bob was the breaking point? I thought it was the trough..
But perhaps the Bob incident would be fuel for that rage that already exists.
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The trough, IMO, broke Rick. He wanted to slaughter everyone there, and make them suffer for who they are.
What they did to Bob was the breaking point for the whole group.
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I don't think that the Terminus survivors got mistreated. They left their humanity behind long ago, and Rick didn't think that they deserved quick clean deaths, and he had a promise to keep.
While I am sad to see him leave the show, Bob nailed this episode perfectly. They capture the essence of the story arc from the comics perfectly here. I don't like them splitting the party, but I get that they had to do this to wait for the others to show up. My predictions, Daryl returns with Beth and at least one new person. I am sure that the next episode will lead right up to where this one left off, so we shall see.
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Good show.
Im saddened that I have to work next sunday night so I will miss that episode so needless to say I will not be reading this thread until after a catch a rerun of next episode.
Rick promised the terminus guy that he would kill him with a machete, and that is what he did (Cabolisdead is relating to this in his last post I think).
I think Rick is loosing it slowly. Look how he acted in prison when he became farmer rick.
But who could blame him?
Aside from the insane world they all live in now, Rick found out his wife was cheating on him when she thought he was dead. He didn't know for sure if the baby was his.
He had to kill his deputy, which could have been from hatred for the guy screwing his wife and also trying to take ricks role as leader from him.
Then he looses his wife.
Then Carl starts getting all bat crap crazy with him.
Then he thinks he lost his baby.
Almost beat to death by the guvner.
I just wonder if Rick is fit to be a leader, and he may give up that role later.
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I forgot about his promise to use the machete to kill him. That puts it more into perspective. Still could have used bullets for the other guys, beating them to death sort of puts the group in the same category as the cannibals.
I look forward to next week, I want to see what the deal with Beth is. This show is awesome but it was in dire need of a new story line.
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I forgot about his promise to use the machete to kill him. That puts it more into perspective. Still could have used bullets for the other guys, beating them to death sort of puts the group in the same category as the cannibals.
I look forward to next week, I want to see what the deal with Beth is. This show is awesome but it was in dire need of a new story line.
I think, with the church basically being an unsecured location, not using bullets was the smart move. How they decided to finish off the group was the less-humane part of it all. I can align with how they handle the situation, and will go as far as to say, from the mental state I could see between Rick, Sasha, and the ginger military guy, Im not surprise and would probably react similarly.
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I forgot about his promise to use the machete to kill him. That puts it more into perspective. Still could have used bullets for the other guys, beating them to death sort of puts the group in the same category as the cannibals.
See this is a perspective I just don't understand. When someone eats your friend, you kill them...HARD! LOL. Seriously, there is no level of torture or kill that would have been too much for these people. They were monsters! I do understand how the writers were obviously trying to foreshadow something and maybe imply that the group is loosing it themselves with the extreme brutality that was used. But from the perspective of the group I just see it as appropriate given the situation.
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(http://25.media.tumblr.com/72388e1d67b1b390552ed152f48883a3/tumblr_n1hhsgTy1v1qkubxlo3_r2_250.gif)
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I forgot about his promise to use the machete to kill him. That puts it more into perspective. Still could have used bullets for the other guys, beating them to death sort of puts the group in the same category as the cannibals.
See this is a perspective I just don't understand. When someone eats your friend, you kill them...HARD! LOL. Seriously, there is no level of torture or kill that would have been too much for these people. They were monsters! I do understand how the writers were obviously trying to foreshadow something and maybe imply that the group is loosing it themselves with the extreme brutality that was used. But from the perspective of the group I just see it as appropriate given the situation.
So, you think this was purely revenge and not because they figured that these people were still a threat? Or just that the way they killed them was revenge, the fact they had to kill them was for their own safety?
Don't get me wrong, I can't even imagine the hatred toward these people and I am happy they got what was coming to them, but even so, when the guns are down and you are having a conversation, chopping someone to pieces like that takes a certain kind of disconnect from humanity. It is one thing to do this in a fight, but to end the fight, cool off, talk things out, and THEN still do this, that is the definition of "cold blooded killing". But I guess revenge is best served cold, huh..
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So, you think this was purely revenge and not because they figured that these people were still a threat? Or just that the way they killed them was revenge, the fact they had to kill them was for their own safety?
I think it was all of the above. I just don't think you can fault them for how they did it given what the termites had done.
Don't get me wrong, I can't even imagine the hatred toward these people and I am happy they got what was coming to them, but even so, when the guns are down and you are having a conversation, chopping someone to pieces like that takes a certain kind of disconnect from humanity. It is one thing to do this in a fight, but to end the fight, cool off, talk things out, and THEN still do this, that is the definition of "cold blooded killing". But I guess revenge is best served cold, huh..
I don't disagree with any of that. But I think its justifiable and doesn't mean they were bad or wrong for doing it the way they did. Thinking so seems like too much Yoda thinking to me. [Yoda] Fear leads to anger; anger leads to hate; hate leads to suffering.[/Yoda]
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I think the "saving bullets" line was just meant to sound cool and shouldn't be taken literally. Besides, they took the termites guns after the slaughter so they had more guns and ammo, and Rick had to keep his promise. In addition to that they buried the bodies, they didn't just leave them out to be zombie food. Even if they did that as to try and not attract Zombies to the church, it still shows some semblance of humanity.
I do think they need to start moving towards a finale or way to end the zombie plague or people, myself included, will lose interest in the show. When they start talking about the contest for the next season's premier it sort of takes away some of the tension of the current season. Of course, they aren't afraid to kill off main characters in this series. :dunno
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If you think that death was brutal. I can't wait for you guys to see Lucille!
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Haven't started watching Season 5 yet. I started losing interest back in Season 4; the pacing of this show has been a chronic issue and they don't seem to be getting any better.
So how is Season 5 thus far compared to prior seasons? Better than 4 at least?
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Well, it is actually filmed in Georgia.
But not in parts of Georgia that have been abandoned for a couple of years.
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Yes the show gets tedious at times. Try reading the comics. Its like William Faulkner wrote a comic. Im starting to head away from the comics. I get bummed when I pay $2.99 and all I read is the group philosiphing or walking through an area for a whole comic.
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Haven't started watching Season 5 yet. I started losing interest back in Season 4; the pacing of this show has been a chronic issue and they don't seem to be getting any better.
So how is Season 5 thus far compared to prior seasons? Better than 4 at least?
Season 4 was pretty good to watch if you watched it as one large chunk off of Netflix. It just isn't a good show to watch week to week, especially in the early seasons. That being said, Season 5 has been a nonstop ride for the most part, and I have really enjoyed it.
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Spoilers!!!
What I don't understand is why did Glen and Maggie still have to leave at the end.
I mean the only reason Abram wanted to leave is because of the threat to Eugenie right?
But they killed the threat and they still had to leave?
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Probably because they just wanted to get going back to DC.
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Spoilers!!!
What I don't understand is why did Glen and Maggie still have to leave at the end.
I mean the only reason Abram wanted to leave is because of the threat to Eugenie right?
But they killed the threat and they still had to leave?
I thought the Glen and Maggie along was kinda forced and wasn't made to make a whole lot of sense but as far as him leaving I think the point was that there are constant threats and sitting still is just waiting for them to come to you. I think all along he's expressed the need to get to Washington ASAP before something happens to Eugene since every day is another chance for something bad to happen.
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Spoilers!!!
What I don't understand is why did Glen and Maggie still have to leave at the end.
I mean the only reason Abram wanted to leave is because of the threat to Eugenie right?
But they killed the threat and they still had to leave?
When you add the fact that Maggie's sister was kidnapped somewhere nearby, and knew Darryl was planning on looking for her, it seems ridiculous that she would just leave her sister behind like that. Great sister...
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This post is mostly a placemarker for me, because I wont be able to watch the episode tonight, due to work, and for that reason I wont be checking this thread until I do get to see it. (Spoiler fright.)
But I was also wondering why Maggie would leave Beth behind, I know she and Glenn agreed to go to Washington to keep Rick and Abraham from fighting, but still.
Im also wondering about the minister.
Other than been a sniveling coward, I think there is something else going on with him.
Seems funny he was getting attacked by zombies just as the team was walking by.
Wondering if maybe he was drawing the team in? Or maybe it was the first time in 2 years that he's been outside the church?
You would think even a man of God wouldnt have a problem with having a weapon to fend off monsters?
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Well I'm pretty sure who the person Darrell had in the bushes last episode.
Its gotta be the dude from everybody hates chris, after he ditched beth.
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Spoilers, don't read if you didn't watch last night's episode yet, in case you are that dense as to think that we wouldn't be talking about it, lol..
So who thinks the "cops" actually found Beth and now Carol in "dire need of help" and who thinks they are just picking out people they come across to ambush and bring in? Clearly the young women are brought in for entertainment for the troops.. and now with Carol being brought in, it is just too convenient that they would come across her injured and about to be killed by walkers when she was actively following the car..
And I agree, after last night's episode, it would only make sense that the person with Daryl is the young guy who limped away..
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It could also be Morgan as well. Morgan was following them to terminus.
(http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/blog_post_349_width/2014/10/the_walking_dead_morgan_embargo.jpg)
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I'm undecided about the cops straight up abducting people. The kid said they intentionally left his dad behind, but that they were in peril. Sounds like either or, to me.
I was a little disappointed the entire episode was about Beth, but thought it was really well done.
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Yeah, I was thinking the same thing about Morgan last week.. But in light of the new guy escaping and Carol showing up right after, I am thinking Limpy will be the one with Darryl (Daryl, Darrel?)
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....will be the one with Darryl (Daryl, Darrel?)
(http://garyfurr.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/larry-darryl1.jpg)
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Ok, Im up to date now.
The episode I missed: I thought the show was calming down a bit. Reminded me of that episode of the guvnor lost in confusion.
Didn't really like it that much, however looks like Chris is all grown up now. (Everybody hates Chris).
The one last night was better.
I have never read the comics, but I figured for quite a while that Eugene was faking it. I wonder if Abraham killed him, but after watching "Talking dead" I don't think so.
Scenes from next week showed Darrel and Carol throwing a sheet wrapped body onto a fire. Please don't let it be Beth. Not ready for her to die yet.
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I think the sneak peek for next week is showing scenes BEFORE Carol shows up in the hospital, so I don't think it is Beth.
It was a good episode, but I don't like this trend of leaving a bunch of hangers at the end of each episode and then waiting a couple weeks or more to resolve them. Sometimes you need an episode that focuses on one part of the story, but if every episode is like that you start to feel like you are watching two (or three) different shows and each week you don't know which of them you get to watch.
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I didn't even consider Eugene to be faking. I guess it was fine to see what Abraham's anger andgeneral state of mind stems from. To take an hour for two minor (I think) plot points took away from the entire episode I thought. The last couple of seasons they would hop back and forth between the storylines, which made it compelling - will they show x or continue with y.
I'd give it a c+.
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Considering the entire future of the series was pretty much dependent on the idea that they had a mission that could end the zombie apocalypse, I would say that makes last night's episode about a little more than "two minor plot points". Don't get me wrong, I want to see more of the story of Rick and his people, but that story had stalled out and merged with this one, so this was important.
Now, I see Beth's abduction as a "minor plot line" that adds some content to the story but doesn't really affect the main plot line (or maybe it will, in which case it won't be a waste of time). My problem isn't with having several plot lines, it is with dragging "minor plots" out and getting into a rut of focusing each week on only one story line (with several tangents along the way), then leaving you hanging for 2-4 weeks before any kind of resolution is reached. I am all for new minor plotlines, but not when it is a complete tangent that isn't going to lead anywhere and entire episodes are dedicated to it. They might as well be spin-off shows, and I am sitting down to see the story of Rick and his crew.
The mid season break is coming, and we don't know who Daryl showed up with, we don't know what is up with Carol, or even what the hospital is really all about, we finally have a reason for Abraham's crew to get back together with Rick and decide on a new overall goal, but they are stalled out on the highway with a horde of millions of zombies in front of them, and Morgan is following the group for some reason and we don't know anything about that. Before the season break I want to resolve most of what is going on and get a direction for the second half of the season. I REALLY don't want to be left hanging on half these plotlines for 3 months. There is certainly something to be said about whetting your appetite so you will return after the break, but something else entirely to just hang all the pieces of the story and expect you to be happy to wait 3 months to continue where you left off.
Did anyone watch the series "Boardwalk Empire" ? Great series, but there was SO much to finish in the last episode and it felt rushed and incomplete. I actually had to go back and watch it again to catch what the significance of things were because they dumped what should have been spread out through 2 or 3 episodes (or at least a 2 hour finale) into just one final episode. I didn't like that. And I don't want to see that for the mid season break either. If they don't start tying up some loose ends quickly they are going to either have to rush the mid season finale or leave too many story lines open. Just too damn annoying.
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I guess I disagree from the onset of your post, but agree with the majority of it. I don't see Eugene, Abraham or their mission as the main plot to the story. IMO, Rick and his group is always the main story line. The show and story has always centered around Rick and his crew, and there have been many, many, side plots that entwine and create a great overall story. Aside from that difference in viewpoint, I agree with you about everything else. I don't want to have entire shows about 1 or 2 characters. I lose interest in that, and in previous episodes where they have done that. Felt the same way about the Beth episode. Rather than have been split across 2 or 3 episodes to compel you to see what happens.
Re: Boardwalk Empire - I thought so too. I really wish they had made it a 10 episode final season, or as you said, made it a 2 hour. I put together who the kid was when I heard me-ma. Everything else felt too rushed.
Oh no, distress! I give up.
Oh no, more distress! I give up!
Was sad to see it wrap up that way, it was a really fascinating story.
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About cannibalism: just for a side field trip, watch the movie "The Road". Last time I checked it was available on Netflix. Not a movie about zombies, but will make you think about what could happen if the world breaks down.
I liked that movie.
I liked it, but it was fairly depressing...
I read the book before seeing the movie, and I gotta say that that book was the most unrelentingly depressing thing I've ever read. I just barely made it through with my own sanity intact.
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I don't see Eugene, Abraham or their mission as the main plot to the story. IMO, Rick and his group is always the main story line. The show and story has always centered around Rick and his crew, and there have been many, many, side plots that entwine and create a great overall story.
So where was Rick and his crew headed after Terminus? What was their overall goal? What was the direction the show was headed after they escaped?
The answer is they had decided to go to DC, and the idea of a cure and an end to the apocalypse seemed like the best direction to go. They finally had a reason to get up each day and push forward, other than just to live to see the next day. Granted, it didn't get very far before it was derailed, but now aside from the side plots, there is no longer a main plot, a main goal for Rick and his crew. They are back to where they were right after the prison was compromised - nowhere to go, no hope of ever being safe, and no long term plans whatsoever, other than to just survive.
At some point, you need a main overall mission or story to keep a series like this going. Surviving for the sake of not being dead is not much of a story. Even the characters in "The Road" had a goal, a reason to get up each day and move forward. There has to be a "light at the end of the tunnel".
Personally, it is that light that makes the Post Apocalyptic genre so appealing to me. The survival, gathering of people, formation of a society of some sort, the goal of finding a place to call home and defend, and the rebuilding of humanity. If the intention is to just roam and survive with no end goal in mind, there just isn't much point to it all. There has to be a higher reason for me, a reason to tune in and watch the drama of trying to get from point A to point B, and being on the edge of my seat waiting to find out if they are going to make it to point B and get one step closer to their goal. Plus, if they don't have a goal at the end, what makes them different from the group Daryl was with last season?
I look at shows like "Falling Skies" and "Revolution". The first seasons of each were awesome because there was a story and an end goal. Falling skies made it two seasons before the main story line hit a brick wall, Revolution lost it's main story line after season one and died a slow death. I tried to watch season 4 of Falling skies but it was so convoluted and unfocused that I just had no desire. I couldn't make it 5 minutes before I was asleep from boredom. Half the reason I am excited for the next 3 episodes of Walking Dead is to find out "what is the new plan".
The irony is, the closer they get to accomplishing their "end goal", the closer the series is to ending. If the prison had worked out and they had finished clearing it, built better walls, and lived happily ever after, it would have been a lame show, and it was headed that way until they brought the governor back. Even the sickness in the prison was just a weak mini-plot.
Imagine the despair you would feel in a situation like that. Unless your idea of a good life is being a marauder who just runs around preying on the weak and taking what you want by force, you would need a reason to get out of bed each morning, to keep fighting for survival. But they touched on it last episode: at this point the only ones left are the strong people. The rest are gone. And Abraham was ready to check out until he had a reason to keep going. Matter of fact, suicide was very prominent in the first 3 seasons. A lot of people just figured "what is the point". And that is the big question now.. what IS the point?
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I don't disagree with most of your wall post there. I agree with it. I have felt from the introduction, that it was a side plot that intertwined with the main story line, which is, Rick and his crew. The crew changes, evolves, dies, ebbs and flows. Your point that the trip to DC was a part of the main line, but once Rick and company stayed back, it stopped, imo. It was, again, a side story. At this point we have no idea if Rick intends to go to DC to meet up with them, or where they will go/do. Maybe they invade the hospital and take it over. Secure everything and live there. Who knows - the only constant in this show is change, and I think that is the beauty of the show.
To some of your other points:
Had they stayed in the prison, there would have been plenty of other enemies/issues/problems that would have arrived. We will never know.
Rick and company ran into a giant OH ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- moment with Terminus, and, like Hershel's farm, the prison, and DC all of those locations were supposed to be "home" and a safe spot to be. But things changed, the situation evolved.
They are back on the same mental game they were in the above situations. Where do we go? Where can we be safe? Where can we live to live? That giant horde of zombies that the DC group ran into proves that there is no fool-proof fortress to answer the previous questions. People died by the 10s, 100s of thousands. Hell, a mob of 500 wrecked one of their strongholds.
To me the questions asked, where, when, how, are what make the series and genre intriguing. The amount of IDK and I wonder if...are what keep me coming back to the show. Im excited for the next 2 episodes.
:cheers:
BTW, I really enjoy the conversation you've given this thread. You explain yourself well.
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Good points, and I enjoy the conversation too.
I get where you are coming from, and when it comes to the concept of surviving the post apocalyptic world, I don't disagree. But for a show, if they settle in and are relatively "safe", it gets boring. Part of the draw of the show is that nobody is safe, including the main characters. You HOPE they live each episode, but you just don't know. It isn't "how are they getting out of this one" it is "who is going to get out of this one". As soon as you think everyone is safe and they have a home where they can "become bored" (like it seemed was happening in the prison), the show loses its appeal, at least to me. The governor coming in with a tank and a couple hostages was probably the best thing that could happen to the show at the time.
I look forward to what happens next.. just not sure there will be enough closure before the 3 month break..
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Really dislike the way they are doing one storyline per episode. The random flashbacks last night were very unimpressive.
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I have to admit I almost wore out my DVR watching Carol get struck by the Family Truckster.
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This season feels like a game where you have 500 sidequests that don't mean anything to the overall storyline but you still have to complete them to get the experience necessary to survive later on. It's all busy work.
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And they are dragging it out, which like I said before was what I didn't want to happen.. Unless next episode sees Abraham and his crew reuniting with Rick's guys, preparation for an assault on the hospital, and carol waking up just in time to fight their way out, it won't get resolved before the mid season break, and we will be waiting 3 months to find out what happened at the end.. And at the pace things have moved the past 4 weeks, I would be surprised if they stuff that many items into one episode and leave one full episode for the assault on the hospital.
Don't get me wrong, I see what they are doing here, setting up a new main story line, especially now that DC is a dead end, but it is dragging. I too was underwhelmed by the episode. If this were a book, I would be OK with it, but we only have so many episodes each season, so they don't have much room for "side quests"..
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Really dislike the way they are doing one storyline per episode. The random flashbacks last night were very unimpressive.
This season feels like a game where you have 500 sidequests that don't mean anything to the overall storyline but you still have to complete them to get the experience necessary to survive later on. It's all busy work.
I kind of agree. Now I wouldn't mind the solo stories if I liked the characters and each character got a couple minutes of an episode and not the entire episode. Despite me liking the governor as a bad guy, his 2 episode arc was supremely boring. I get the need to show how he got more people to follow him so he could attack the prison, but the story was a bit of a stretch (and thats in a universe where Zombie Apocalypse is a real thing). I don't mind somewhat minor flash back montages like they did with Michonne and Abraham , and the Carol and Daryl team up was at least a little interesting (sans the van flip off the bridge).
Beth is an uninteresting character and one of the few survivors I want to see get offed. I'd rather them have 1 legged Hershel over her.
They have already nixed the DC idea for a way to end the series, and I know there is going to be at least 1 more season, but with no "end game" to the apocalypse we're just watching a zombie soap opera.
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but with no "end game" to the apocalypse we're just watching a zombie soap opera.
BINGO, the perfect term.. They NEED an end game or the series is just dwelling in purgatory..
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Dwelling in purgatory is sort of the whole point. They aren't reproducing. There is Carl (STAY BACK) and Judith and that's it. With the rate at which survivors are being picked off by each other pretty soon it will be just Carl until he gets the flu. Then the series is over simply because there is nobody left.
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Now you are back to "the road"... Just keep writing the story until there is nobody to write about, and make the "end game" the extinction of humanity..
The story is boring if it is just about surviving. It should be about figuring out how to adapt and then prosper, ensuring the survival of the human species. The underlying story with WD has always been whether humans will be worth saving by the time they adapt.. It is always the question, as it was in last week's episode (save the guy who stole the weapons and left you for dead, kill him now so he doesn't kill you later, or just leave him to be eaten)..
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Sunday's episode was a tad dull, but honestly, I have been enjoying this season quite a bit. Just compare to season 2 where the whole time was spent searching for Sophia, and she ended up being dead in the barn the whole time. 6 episodes where Darryl is wandering in the woods week after week. As far as pointless side quests go, they were spent on things like getting a zombie out of a well, or going on a run to pick up birth control pills. This season we have dynamic changes that occur just about every episode.
The marvelous thing about this show is that it reinvents itself pretty much every season, changes style, changes focus. This season is focusing one one thing per episode, tying up loose ends and bringing in a new rival group and that is fine by me, because when if they split up the show among multiple storylines, it ends up being weeks until any significant change occurs, then every timeline climaxes at once. I don't mind the character pieces either. Beth, Eugene and Abraham went through huge character developments, and I think they are great characters now.
As far as endgame goes, I'm glad they don't have one. You either have to let the endgame linger forever, or complete it and come up with new endgames and the show delutes itself into nothing. That is how Lost imploded on itself. That is why people stopped caring about Revolution. This is post apocalypse, and I like the realistic take one it. Did Max Max have an endgame?
And that doesn't mean there isn't a goal. The fact that they ran with the cure in Washington and let it fall off a cliff huge in the plot. It means that those last remaining pipe dreams that there is a safe civilization and a way to reverse this mess is just a storybook fantasy. Now, the group has to figure out their purpose. They are pumping up the group into a bunch of hardened survivalists which means they are probably gonna be facing a much larger threat soon. 6 cops in a hospital is just a stepping stone. I got a feeling what comes after will be good.
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Did Max Max have an endgame?
Uh, yeah. Two men enter. One man leave. Duh. :laugh:
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Did Max Max have an endgame?
Uh, yeah. Two men enter. One man leave. Duh. :laugh:
LOL, perfect quote!
I think the group will kill or run off the cops in the hospital and move into it, and start all over in a "the prison" kind of way.
I wonder where the everybody hates chris guy is headed in this series? Will everyone still hate him?
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I never hated Chris. Especially when Terry Crews was involved.
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Having mixed feelings after last nights episode, but I think they need to pick up the pace a bit.
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Just finished the episode. I like this far more than the previous 3 episodes, but agree the pace needs to ramp up. Thought the shoulder charge was kinda cheesey, but I suppose it got the point across.
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I thought that whole thing with the cop and (sasha?) was stupid--the guy is in cuffs but named Bob so his sob story must be true...why would she turn her back on the guy? Cause he knew one of those melted dudes--yeah right...
I was happy to see the end of the preacher (or is it??) his whole "god will protect me" schtick was pretty thin--So the whole world is screwed, the dead are up and walking around, billions of people dead, and he still can't hold a machete? that's not a survival instinct...
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Bye Bye Beth, Bye bye.
Did anyone watch Talking Dead?
That girl crying her eyes out over loosing her job.
She needs to suck it up and Im sure sci-fi or someone will offer her a part in a movie. The name Walking Dead should carry some weight.
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....sci-fi or someone will offer her a part in a movie....
I heard Sharknado 3 is in the works... :lol
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She just had to go stab that ---smurfette---....
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She just had to go stab that ---smurfette---....
Yeah that didn't make much sense, but Beth always was a little off center.
Did I miss something or did they never explain exactly what that lady cop had up her sleeve. (Cant remember her name, the one Beth stabbed.)
They just kept saying "It was all her". ???
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Bye Bye Beth, Bye bye.
Did anyone watch Talking Dead?
That girl crying her eyes out over loosing her job.
She needs to suck it up and Im sure sci-fi or someone will offer her a part in a movie. The name Walking Dead should carry some weight.
I don't think she was necessarily crying about losing her job. Pretty much every interview with any cast member, they talk about how close they are and how they have become a family. So, she is more upset about not being part of that than she is about a pay check. They showed interviews with both Norman Reedus and Lauren Cohan and they were crying as well, and they didn't lose their jobs... yet.
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(Cant remember her name, the one Beth stabbed.)
I think her name was Dawn.
Beth was a weak character in the show until this season. It is good they had a chance to build her up before knocking her down. I'm pretty surprised that only she died that episode. My prediction was that Beth and Carol would both be slaughtered, sending Daryl into a hillbilly rage.
The way I read Dawn was that she set up a system where the strong take advantage of the weak. Everything is a pecking order and Beth and Noah were captured so that everyone could take advantage of them. The minute Dawn saw Beth as a strong person, she was no longer subject to that abuse.
I translated Beth's final act as a Clint Eastwood Gran Torino moment. Beth had to expect she was gonna be shot, but hoped to take Dawn down with her. It was such a weak attack, and I don't think she is that dumb.
I didn't quite catch what she was referring to when she said "I understand now", but figure it was a reference to that the only way to challenge her authority was to kill her. Like Dawn had killed her mentor, or like how that other cop had no option but to fight her to the death since he had challenged her authority.
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What pissed me off was in the commercial break right before, the "Talking Dead" clip said there would be a special cast member guest that we wouldn't want to miss.. That only meant one thing - that a regular cast member was going to die, and that was going to be either Carol or Beth, and from the point on I was expecting it. When it happened, I didn't get the "shock value" because of the expectation, and without that part, it was an incredibly pointless death. When they showed the clip again in "Talking Dead", it again didn't make any sense.
Thing is, I saw Beth at that point as I did my daughter this weekend when we had an argument. She just had to get the last word in, regardless of the consequences. In my case, my daughter lost her car for a few days, in the show Beth lost her life for essentially the same thing. Just stupid in both cases, and childish. It made me see her as the weak character she always was, and also made me see the entire effort to get her back as one colossal waste of time.
And in the end, when they all put down their guns, Rick said anyone who wants to join them can go, and nobody (other than limpy) went with them... So it added nothing to the overall story, imho. Just a waste of effort.
On the other hand, look at Rick in this. He kind of turned into a dick. He runs the guy down for not stopping, then just shoots him in cold blood, and seemingly only because he was annoyed by the guy begging for his life. "Shut up" he mutters as he turns away after shooting the guy. WTF. I do like that in Talking Dead they said how Rick basically turned into Shane, except it just took him longer to get to where Shane was back when Rick killed him. I am not all that happy about this, frankly, because the thing I liked about Rick was that he was different, he thought things through and didn't just act first. Now he just seems to be acting without thinking about it.
Overall a weak note to end the mid season on, and not only do we have to wait nearly 3 months for the next episode, even the new series "Better call Saul" doesn't start until Feb also.. FFS, if you are going to end the one show that people tune in for for three months, at least start another show so people have a reason to turn to your channel.. Who is the brilliant guy at AMC who was thinking "You know, I don't think we need viewers to watch our channel for the next three months, so let's just not have anything new until then.. "
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This whole concept of "Mid-Season Cliffhangers!!!111!!!" just ticks me off. Although I don't watch Walking Dead, I've had to endure the same stupid crap with Mad Men. Patiently waiting for the spring to see the second half of season that should have already been finished last spring.
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This whole concept of "Mid-Season Cliffhangers!!!111!!!" just ticks me off.
+1. Gotham and Sleepy Hollow have taken to doing this ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- also.
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On the other hand, look at Rick in this. He kind of turned into a dick. He runs the guy down for not stopping, then just shoots him in cold blood, and seemingly only because he was annoyed by the guy begging for his life.
I actually laughed when he shot him and said, "Finally, crazy-ass Rick from the comics is here!"
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I was glad to see Beth go. Not a very good actress, and tough to look at. Bullet to her face probably was an improvement. No idea how Maggie, who is smokin hot for a white girl, is supposed to be her sister.
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I was glad to see Beth go. Not a very good actress, and tough to look at. Bullet to her face probably was an improvement. No idea how Maggie, who is smokin hot for a white girl, is supposed to be her sister.
+1 I swear if I had to hear her sing or talk in that dumb voice anymore I was going to stop watching and finally start breaking bad.
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She was too minor of a character to get on my nerves until that awkward episode with Darryl that hinted at statutory rape the whole time.
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She was too minor of a character to get on my nerves until that awkward episode with Darryl that hinted at statutory rape the whole time.
her character is 18 though, and the "actress" is 29
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She was too minor of a character to get on my nerves until that awkward episode with Darryl that hinted at statutory rape the whole time.
her character is 18 though, and the "actress" is 29
I don't know if they ever released her age in the show, but since she is the youngest, and Maggie was still living under Hershel's roof, it seemed to imply that Beth was underage, especially since she pranced around singing like a ssmurf. Darryl seemed to be 30-35, so it still was a very rapey.
(http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/4482/1891/1600/Julie%20is%2016.2.jpg)
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lol, I never saw it that way, but that is some funny ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---.
I didn't read the comics, so I didn't know that Rick was a crazy mofo. He certainly has changed from the first couple seasons. I liked in season 2 (?) when he was at the bar with Hershel and the road gang came in. The moment he thought things were going down he committed and took them out. Yet he still believed in "innocent until proven guilty". Now I see the "judge, jury, and executioner" in his character. It isn't that it is bad, particularly in this setting, just not the same character I saw in the first couple seasons. He started out more of an Ed Stark and ended up more of a Tywin Lannister..
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No idea how Maggie, who is smokin hot....
No idea what you are talking about... (https://www.google.com/search?q=lauren+cohan&espv=2&biw=1366&bih=667&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=oOF9VIWlLMOoyASv6oLQBg&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAQ#tbm=isch&q=lauren+cohan+maxim&imgdii=_)
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I don't know if they ever released her age in the show, but since she is the youngest, and Maggie was still living under Hershel's roof, it seemed to imply that Beth was underage, especially since she pranced around singing like a ssmurf. Darryl seemed to be 30-35, so it still was a very rapey.
http://walkingdead.wikia.com/wiki/Beth_Greene (http://walkingdead.wikia.com/wiki/Beth_Greene)
They implied her age, I think they mentioned learning to drive or something.
Also, its not rape if you yell surprise.
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The whole thing with Rick that you guys seem to be missing is that the guy was basically paralyzed from the impact of the car and hitting the pavement. Shooting that Bob was a mercy kill for Rick, and the Shut UP part was because Bob said that they would die out there.
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Carol mentioned she was 17 when they first got to the prison and that one prisoner was getting fresh with her.
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In the comics, Dale was getting down with Andrea, and comic Andrea was fresh out of college. I kinda figured the Darryl/Beth moments were lightly touching the same topics, pointing out that social norms about age tend to go away when there is no society.
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The whole thing with Rick that you guys seem to be missing is that the guy was basically paralyzed from the impact of the car and hitting the pavement. Shooting that Bob was a mercy kill for Rick, and the Shut UP part was because Bob said that they would die out there.
Meh, a bit weak given that the guy lived in a hospital.. lol
He ran him down to begin with, and he should have been able to just pull up next to the guy and say "I am gonna kill you if you don't stop running", or hell, do what the cops do in real life, get ahead of him then cut in front of him and jam on the brakes, get out, and tackle his ass. Rick ran him down then killed him in cold blood. That's my take on it, and he didn't have any remorse for it either.
:cheers:
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Well, rick is extremely quick to judge because he has been bitten by liars before and friends have died from it. The guy gave no reason to be trusted, only reasons to be cautious, so I am not gonna say there is anything about Ricks past that would lead me to think he is gonna try tackling the guys put himself in a seconds worth of danger over it. There are walkers and potentially other cops around, so I wouldn't put him in the same light as other murderers like Shane or the governor, because those people killed their own allies, or manipulated and killed for personal gain. Rick was still focusing on saving his own group. But, It might be a slope he is slipping down, we will see.
Honestly, I was more shocked rick never picked up that perfectly undamaged bullet proof vest the cop was wearing.
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• Holy ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- that was violent. Looks like Ill be sleeping soundly tonight.
• Im excited we get to see Negan. My favorite love to hate fictional character.
• Pretty sure that Carol killed Zombie Andrea in the beginning.
So I have yet to get into Walking Dead, where is the attention at? I am a blacklist guy myself :cheers:
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For the past few months, I've been getting caught up on all past seasons and avoiding this thread because I didn't want any spoilers.
I finally watch the current episode and can participate.
....and it's the worst episode ever IMO :o
Nothing interesting happened.
Story did not progress.
One person dying stretched out over an hour with some weird pointless dream sequences.
Did they let someone different write or direct this episode? :'(
(I didn't stay up for the talking dead show)
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I think they have quite a few producers for the show as a whole, and so you get some really different perspectives across episodes. To your point though, while I'm sad that character is gone, I think the internal struggle was a potentially good storyline, the episode itself was terrible. I was bored most of the time.
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I chalked that up as not much more than a reunion episode with some of the previously dead characters. Been shouting that the TV for the last few episodes that they should just go to DC anyway, took all this time one one person to finally think that is a good idea.
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I knew it was coming, but I thought he'd go down in a much cooler fashion. A single Urkel zombie snuck up on him. Ugh, bad writing.
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yeah, I wasn't very happy with the season opener.
Hope it gets better quick.
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A single Urkel zombie snuck up on him.
:lol Now I wish it said "Did I do that?" after biting him.
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I just watched it, on demand. Seriously, it felt like 2 minutes of show for every 5 minutes of commercials. And no one can figure out why people download TV shows via torrent/newsgroups.
Sad to see that guy go, I actually was starting to like him. I just dont really get how he went outside a cabin where Judith was, killed like 20 zombies with his bare hands, then gets killed by Urkle. I mean I understand they want to keep the number of black guys the same, but they coulda let the preacher go.
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for some reason, I am getting bored watching ! ! !
I think it's time to put and ENDING (it's getting to long).
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I think it's time to put and ENDING (it's getting to long).
I wouldn't go that far. I think they were pretty clever in past seasons by having dedicated locations like the farm or prison play a role.
Not a lot of sets needed, one controlled shooting location=save money while still making a decent show.
There are many classic zombie movie locations they haven't used yet, like a mall (gotta be an abandoned mall somewhere to shoot in).
Right now, it's nothing but traveling nowhere and fighting. It's like Lord of the Rings! >:D (even the trees in those movies walked)
I just wish they'd stop with all the flashbacks and hallucinations. They feel like time fillers and nothing more.
I do think there were a few good things recently. The canabalism was interesting and them eating the leg of someone who had been bit was pretty good.
Things I would like to see:
Hints about the source of the outbreak and treatments that almost work, but not quite.
A partial zombie - one that didn't turn all the way and can still think and reason at some level. (zombie with a shotgun maybe)
Other species zombified - wolves, boars, etc. A gorilla dies in the zoo because nobody is there to feed him. He escapes, then gets bit and turns. :D
More bearded zombies.
Some overweight zombies.
A family that is resistant - they don't change when they die.
Attempts to repair infrastructure, like radio repeaters or mail delivery.
Receipt of reports from other places on earth - I'd use sparingly and not as a major plot component.
A government bunker where people are subject to daily health exams and the suspected weak are put on watch.
Most of all I want Rick to stop being a confused flustered whiney ---smurfette--- with no sense of direction.
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Just another case of brutha in...
(http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20141103211234/walkingdead/images/archive/d/dc/20141117202649!Season_five_noah.png)
...brutha out.
(http://image-cdn.zap2it.com/images/tyreese-the-walking-dead-amc.jpg)
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Anyone else wondering if Sasha's overanxious knife swing that cut both a zombie and Abraham will cause problems for him?
Also, I just noticed that IMDB shows the cast members for the next several shows, and some people are missing, suggesting they will get killed or leave. Interesting.
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The problem is that some characters have become sacred, and their is less emotional investment. I mean I liked Beth and Tyreese, but I never felt like the series made me seriously emotionally invest in them. In the past they have done a great job with secondary characters. T-Dog's death for example was emotional and meaningful given some of his other important moments (changing Rick's mind about the prisoners, almost succumbing to fever, struggling with Merle's abandonment). But with Beth and Tyreese, I just was like oh well bummer, in stead of holding back tears.
If it had been Carol that died, rather than Beth, I feel like Daryl's reaction would be much more interesting and captivating. As it stands I just don't know how I feel about it. Again I liked Beth enough, but meh I don't know what dynamically changes without her or if I can force myself to believe it.
For that matter Rick and Daryl seem to be untouchable as well, to the point where it's almost as if they're never REALLY in danger. When the show was young you never knew when your favorite might end up dead. I feel like it's at a crossroads. I'm very interested to see what happens to Judith given the diversion from the comic.
The Alexandria and Saviors Story lines have potential to be cool, and maybe if they hold true to Glen's fate some of the feelings of "sacred" characters will dissipate
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The whole ideal of sacred characters really does the series justice. My wife and I are on separate sides of the fence about Carol. This just goes to show you how the characters can really mean to each of us. Which to me is a sign of excellent writing. We become invested in each character differently and become emotional when something happens to said character.
I have read the comics on and off and I read up on each character to see who survives and I get a kick of watching my wife's reaction when something happens to a character. But there are times when you get a Dale when I'm talking to the TV saying, "Hey! He doesn't die yet!" But the writers do well to fill the void the character has left with another character.
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Yeah most of the character changes I've been COMPLETELY on board with Herschel taking on some of Dale's character worked famously in my opinion.
And of course Bob taking Dale's ultimate fate was also very well done. To me it's almost like the TV show gives Kirkman the chance to improve upon the story threads from the comic. Having the Hunters have a deeper story line and intersect with the Savior story line seems like a good example of fleshing out the story and building continuity.
The foreshadowing of the Savior conflict in the "Radio News" that Tyreese is hallucinating is interesting as well. I just hope that we get to some good action soon. The last few episodes have been so slow that putting up with the ENDLESS commercial breaks is almost unbearable.
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I don't know about this folks.
3rd show of the season and Im feeling like if I miss watching an episode, so what?
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I spent the whole episode asking myself who was going to die next. And of course, this place can't end up being what they say it is. How many times will hope have to be crushed before the people turn into animals?
My prediction? The community will be everything they wanted, only some (maybe Rick) won't be allowed to stay. The main guys (everyone sans the kid with the limp and the preacher) will leave with him out of loyalty.
I too am getting to the point where I don't look forward to the next episode. This one was decent, but the last few were so damn boring.
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I too am getting to the point where I don't look forward to the next episode.
I am more excited for a new Grimm than I am to see Walking Dead pop up on the DVR. I was pretty bored most of the last episode.
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I thought last night's episode was better than the last two.
It's still too slow moving compared to previous seasons.
It's progressing as slowly as a daily soap opera, but only airing once a week.
Give me something new and interesting every week paired with a larger story arc.
The first keeps me entertained and the second keeps me coming back.
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My prediction is that the town is legit, but they are brought in as hired guns. The town sounds fortified, but those dudes seem weak and wimpy. Take your pick, Mad Max, 7 Samurai. I bet they are only there to kick some ass.
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If they stick to the comic then the Hilltop community actually brings them into the conflict with the Saviors, not Alexandria itself. Also I'm interested to see how Rick assumes control of Alexandria, and if it differs from the comic.
Moving slow but it should get interesting soon enough....
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My girlfriend looks at me last night and says, "I bet the town is full of gay guys and they need straight people so they can have kids!"
I lol'd
The problem with "new stuff" is they spend all their energy on the zombies. Last night's big things was the flare to the head. Big F'n deal, I don't even care about the zombies. You could take them out of the show completely and it would be better for it.
I have learned through my time on Amazon's publishing forum that the hottest genre is currently zombie erotica. Seriously. Zombies having sex is the genre that sells the most right now. And Amazon sells a billion dollars in books each year.
w
t
f
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Sounds like your sequel is taking place.
Zombie John was aroused, and approached Zombie Jane. Unfortunately, it fell off three paces before they embraced.
You're welcome.
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Now I just need to figure out how to delete your post so I never get caught plagiarizing .... ;)
It reminds me of the old leper jokes.. "What did the leper say to the hooker? Keep the tip!"
(where's that guy with the drums doing the bah dum bum pshhhhh)
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I thought Sunday's episode was the best of the season so far. Obviously there wasn't a lot of violence or killing, but I thought it was well written and decently suspenseful. I thought Rick's closing line was a great snapshot into the pysche of the group.
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I kind of liked it too, but I am afraid they are running out of things to do that aren't repetitive. The best part of a post-apocalyptic story, in my opinion, is the journey toward rebuilding civilization. However, every time they get close, the show gets boring, and then something happens to tear it all down again. It is becoming repetitive, and I find myself wondering which major character they will kill off next to shake things up and keep people's attention.
I did find it interesting that Rick and Carl had a need to go out and kill some zombies, almost as if they are addicted to it.
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I think it played really well into the concept that the people who have successfully barricaded themselves in, have gotten soft. This was entirely evident when they captured a walker to, essentially, torture for killing a friend. Its entirely clear to Rick and company, that if the current town is soft and complacent, they can just take over easy peasy.
Carol alludes to the same thing (or maybe she outright says I dont want to be soft like these people), and it makes you wonder if they will introduce a new outside threat or if a civil war of sorts will start up.
I think we end up seeing some side-boob of the mom of two kids that cut Rick's hair. Then she dies. Her husband is definitely a goner, too.
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I thought Sunday's episode was the best of the season so far. Obviously there wasn't a lot of violence or killing, but I thought it was well written and decently suspenseful. I thought Rick's closing line was a great snapshot into the pysche of the group.
I agree. I made a comment before about being tired of Rick being a frazzled incoherent mess. It's nice to see him at least look more like he has his ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- together.
I still would rather have the more interesting character of Tyreese than the priest or G.I. Ginger.
The last couple batches of new characters really haven't added much.
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Don't worry GI Ginger's number is going to be up soon methinks.
I love how Carol is playing all innocent, junior league indeed.... lol
I am really interested in seeing how they divert from the comic in this storyline, it doesn't appear now that Rick will ever become complacent, but we shall see...
Who took the gun in the blender? Any guesses? Interested to see Alexandria defended from the dead, that will be cool. I always loved how the zombies were just outside the prison.
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I think the blender gun is going to introduce a new character.
I thought Tyrese was getting old and boring, but I agree that the preacher hasnt added anything. GI Ginger is at least borderline psychotic now that his mission has imploded. The chance for a kill-spree are pretty high with him IMO.
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I do like how the girl who came along with G.I. Ginger was dressed just like Fio from Metal Slug for a while.
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whenever these guys come across an "establishment" I always think of the farm and how slooooowwww that season was when they get there and become worried--hopefully it picks up!
Also, why is the town reinforced from the outside? You run a herd against that wall and those wall props won't do diddly unless they are all set in concrete (which would seem like a colossal effort for refugees)...nitpicky i guess...
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I think we end up seeing some side-boob of the mom of two kids that cut Rick's hair.
Mmmm, Alexandra Breckenridge
(http://media.giphy.com/media/bu3S9E5HfsRKo/giphy.gif)
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I want to know what happens with Morgan. They show him at the church not long after the group had left and haven't gone anywhere with it since.
(http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140331055036/walkingdead/images/6/62/MorganCface.jpg)
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Also, why is the town reinforced from the outside? You run a herd against that wall and those wall props won't do diddly unless they are all set in concrete (which would seem like a colossal effort for refugees)...nitpicky i guess...
I dont remember the exact quote, but the congresswoman explains that her husband was an engineer and they all started out there as soon as ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- hit the fan. Entirely plausible, but I thought the same thing.
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I want to know what happens with Morgan. They show him at the church not long after the group had left and haven't gone anywhere with it since.
My thoughts exactly. I still think he is the one who defended Rick at the church. If you recall when they were outside fighting, there was a shot from the woods and the zombie in front of him went down. He looked for the source of the shot, but never went further than that with it. I thought the "friend" was going to be him until the gay dude popped out.
They need some depth here, maybe some new relationships that are deeper than a little sex. Everything is so sterile now, and even GI Ginger isn't "getting ass". Right now Carl and Carol are the only ones really seeming to care that they are in a new place, everyone else is still a friggin zombie. I guess I just feel like every character has become one dimensional.
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Ok, are the team members going The Governor?
Whats up with Carol threatening that little boy? I think she has lost it, as a matter of fact they all act like they are loosing it.
I don't have any idea what is going to happen, but I haven't read the comics.
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I love how Rick is like, I'm gonna have to kill this dude.
He's going to bang that girl, then her husband is going to find out. Rick will end up killing him, Jessie will find out and Rick will kill her too. More people will find out about this and more people will die. That is how this season will go.
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Actually Jessie's fate is MUCH cooler and intense...
Let's just put it this way friends, the Alexandrians are FAR overdue for some fan poop.
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Whats up with Carol threatening that little boy?
That went from zero to wtf in a heartbeat. On Reddit, they're calling her, "The Cookie Monster".
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Haha, I love the direction they went with creepy carol. She is something from a horror movie. >:D
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While I thought it was interesting, the whole carol thing just didn't seem to fit with her character thus far--unless she has totally snapped and is in the process of going around the bend (like sasha)- The other part I thought was stupid was the whole sequence with the horse--so you are telling me that a 850lb animal couldn't outrun a shambling bunch of mindless weak rotting people??? People (living strong healthy people) die from getting kicked, or run over from horses...I thought it was just a useless sequence...
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While I thought it was interesting, the whole carol thing just didn't seem to fit with her character thus far
I disagree - I believe that Carol has grown into this character over time. She's almost coming in-line with Morgan, in regards to her survival abilities. I think that she assessed the situation perfectly and took the only possible path she could. She needed to instill the fear of god into that kid, or else, they were doomed - cookies weren't going to do it, only having him fear for his life would have any chance of working.
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I don't discount her survival abilities--they even planted the tongue in cheek when that guy was asking her if she would like shooting lessons (which I thought was funny) but so far carol has been the most nurturing of the group towards the kids--for her to go all evil clown fits the story and does the job but it still really stuck out as something outside of the person we have seen so far.
I think how they are showing sasha's spindown is pretty good and frankly i'm surprised more of them aren't almost catatonic.
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they even planted the tongue in cheek when that guy was asking her if she would like shooting lessons (which I thought was funny) but so far carol has been the most nurturing of the group towards the kids--for her to go all evil clown fits the story and does the job but it still really stuck out as something outside of the person we have seen so far.
Carol has been "on guard" and playing a different persona since she's arrived. Look at how she handed in her guns at the beginning - handling them like they could go off at any moment, and that she was glad to be rid of them. She's playing a role, and while I don't believe she would actually carry out what she told the kid - she was the one who set the two "soon to turns" on fire at the prison. She's harder than you're giving her credit for.
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I didn't think it was out of character for Carol. It is definitely what she has become over the years. From teaching the kids in the jail how to kill to knowing that she needed to kill the blond girl and doing it.
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Not to mention she blew up Terminus. I have a feeling that if Carol had another week in the hospital to recover, about everyone in the hospital but her and Beth would be dead.
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While I thought it was interesting, the whole carol thing just didn't seem to fit with her character thus far--unless she has totally snapped and is in the process of going around the bend (like sasha)- The other part I thought was stupid was the whole sequence with the horse--so you are telling me that a 850lb animal couldn't outrun a shambling bunch of mindless weak rotting people??? People (living strong healthy people) die from getting kicked, or run over from horses...I thought it was just a useless sequence...
How does it not fit her character? You do remember she shot an un-armed child in the back of the head?
Her character has nothing to do with nurturing children. In her mind she always does what it takes to protect the group... whether that be killing the sick woman at the prison, shooting a kid in the head, blowing up terminus, or threatening a kid... she does what she has to do to ensure the safety of the group.
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I think this episode fell backwards. There was only really one question opened up - What is the significance of the W in the walker's head, one major plot twist in that Scarol (scary Carol per Talking Dead), and most just a lot of fluff.
I think they are beating the level of comfort and how disconnect to reality Alexandria is like a dead horse (see what I did there?). Sasha's melt down wasnt thought provoking or even original for the last 2-3 episodes.
We know that at least one person in Alexandria has been stalking/watching the group, but all but confirm no one else is doing it. No one else has the skillset, and the one other person who may have that skillset, has a broken leg/ankle.
Even though the back and forth with Beth at the hospital was getting old, there were at least some intense moments, a build up, and a situation (at least I didnt) no one saw coming. This setting seems as drawn out as the church, and lacks the external antagonists (cannibals). I get that there is a ton of talk that Rick and company are the antagonists, the potential for Alexandria to get overrun or occupied, but there needs to be something to shake up the story.
Hopefully the amount of backstory they are providing really makes the next 3 episodes edge of your seat worthy.
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Good episode tonight. Sorry to see Noah go.
I think the fax to Cleveland is about to hit the fan.
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My daughter asked what he meant about the fax and I replied, "He has to see a man about a horse." She pretended to know what I was talking about, lol.
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Sucks that Noah's dead. Although now everyone else will be able to get where their going a bit faster without having to wait for him to limp after ;D
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Yeah, I thought they were going to address the fact that the "wonder surgeon" that Noah was promised turned out the be the town drunk.
On the flip side, Noah did in essence get both Beth and Tyreese killed. I liked him but he was a hazard.
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I think the lynch mob that is going to form around the giant wuss that basically killed two people will be the catalyst for hell breaking loose in Alexandria. I would be perfectly ok with the preacher catching a bullet his forehead.
I thought this was a good episode, and Noah was kind of a sucker punch. Asking for a mentor, getting it, then being, literally, ripped apart...that was one quick cycle for him.
Interested to see what happens with Rick and the girl who's side boob we will eventually see.
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Glenn should've shot that guy. Just capped him on the ground and be done with it. Him and Eugene could have said he got bit and turned.
Money says side boob and Rick get it on (with or without the drunk husband dead) then she dies when they flee Alexandria. Lets be honest the only thing that Rick gets to keep are his kids, because without them he'd just let himself die and we'd have no story.
Oh, yeah, and that Priest has gotta go.
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I think the priest will be killed by probably Rick. Maggie overheard him dog talking the group, so it's just a matter of time, until Maggie tells Rick.
Or maybe Glenn will take him out, I think he will take on a more sinister personality now that he watched Noah get ripped apart right in front of him.
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Maybe i'm showing my age but all I could think about when Maggie was listening in to the looney-tunes priest and he lady mayor was "This is going to be a three's company moment"
We'll see if her poker face reading skills trump the incredible grief she is going to feel when she finds out what happened to her boy...
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Maybe i'm showing my age but all I could think about when Maggie was listening in to the looney-tunes priest and he lady mayor was "This is going to be a three's company moment"
(http://stream1.gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs1/4065019_o.gif)
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:laugh2: exactly...
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Maybe i'm showing my age but all I could think about when Maggie was listening in to the looney-tunes priest and he lady mayor was "This is going to be a three's company moment"
(http://stream1.gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs1/4065019_o.gif)
If you don't make an Urkelcade, can we at least get some traction on a Furleycade?
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Money says side boob and Rick get it on (with or without the drunk husband dead) then she dies when they flee Alexandria.
I'm leaning in a bit of a different direction. I don't really think the husband is "the bad guy" - at all. Why? They've set him up too well. First, he had the semi-threatening 'first encounter' with Rick from his front porch. Second, he's overtly alcoholic and people are automatically looking down on him in the community because of it. Third - and this one is the one that convinced me - the kid that wants the gun. He never said he wanted it because his dad was beating his mom... ...and Carol immediately jumped to that conclusion, because of her own past experience.
I personally believe it's the WIFE who is somehow abusing either the husband, the kid, or both. I think it's going to be a whole "SURPRISE!!!" moment - something we all give a sigh of relief when someone kills the husband, and then immediately regret it when something else happens. (Like, the kid starts bawling, and the mom immediately does a 180 and gives some evil psychopath-y, Dexter-ish look, devoid of any emotion.)
Maybe it doesn't happen this way, but I think the writers are too smart to have it be as formulaic as they've laid out.
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On a side note it was asked of the guests what would they have if they only have one single thing during the apocalypse. Of course my answer at first was pretty generic at first. I would only have a 250 gb iPod with my entire music collection on it. But then I realized that there was something better. Much better......
RICK GRIMES DAD JOKES!!!
All right. Continue on.
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RICK GRIMES DAD JOKES!!!
All right. Continue on.
http://youtu.be/1ytCEuuW2_A (http://youtu.be/1ytCEuuW2_A)
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http://youtu.be/1ytCEuuW2_A (http://youtu.be/1ytCEuuW2_A)
(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/Mzc3WDEwMDA=/$(KGrHqV,!ksFB0yf(oQbBQedHEq4Nw~~60_35.JPG)
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What in the literal ---fudgesicle---?!?!?
I knew his death was coming but this wasn't what I expected.
And if they make him survive then they are pressing my suspension of disbelief to the limit.
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What in the literal ---fudgesicle---?!?!?
I knew his death was coming but this wasn't what I expected.
And if they make him survive then they are pressing my suspension of disbelief to the limit.
Who?
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Glenn
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Totally not dead... unless the SFX team have hit an all time low and think guts come from your chest.
We won't find out next week though because the next episode appears to be a Morgan flashback.
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Yeah plus Rick has to have reason to lose his mind and make war on the Saviors, if you lose Glenn here you have to think Daryl or Carol could meet Glenn's comic fate.
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Yeah and they can't kill Daryl because every woman on the planet would stop watching.
Plus that b.s. statement they made on talking dead about him returning in one form or another. I mean other than a pre-Atlanta flashback the only way they could have him return would be on that mediocre Fear the Walking Dead spinoff. With Morgan getting a flashback episode next week, it seems unlikely there would be yet another flashback episode this season.
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It will be a joke if they have Glenn live through that. I don't care if the other clown's body was on top of him. There is no way he would be in the middle of all that screaming his lungs out and not get bitten somehow.
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It will be a joke if they have Glenn live through that. I don't care if the other clown's body was on top of him. There is no way he would be in the middle of all that screaming his lungs out and not get bitten somehow.
TRUTH!
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So I'm kind of beyond zombies at this point, but figured I'd go back and touch base with this trend before the well was completely dry. World War Z was actually a very entertaining book and it's a shame the movie is nothing like it. Given the scale of most of the chapters, it was easily filmed. Oh well.
After I gave up on this show (after about three episodes of me yelling JUST SHOOT HIM at the 'governor'), I decided I'd read the comic books.
What amazes me is how many of the annoyances of the first two seasons is true to the comic book. Surely they'd just shoot the tyrant rather than put up with him for months, right? Nope. Surely there aren't entire issues where absolutely nothing happens, right? Nope. Hilariously, when I caught up on the issues this summer, there was a gigantic twist and cliffhanger that left you wondering how any of it would be resolved. The next issue? Nothing happens. ~146 issues into it and I give up.
Season 2 of the video game was good but nowhere near as good as the first one. I played through with a friend and we made Clem as mean as possible. Didn't budge the plot an inch.
Have the skin walkers made an appearance in the show yet?
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It will be a joke if they have Glenn live through that. I don't care if the other clown's body was on top of him. There is no way he would be in the middle of all that screaming his lungs out and not get bitten somehow.
TRUTH!
Well see the thing is you guys apparently have faith in the writing staff to do things realistically. Remember Dale's death? How out Otis? Hershel? Yeah they aren't good at doing realistic deaths. So based on what we visually saw at the end of that episode, no matter if he lives or dies, either result is b.s. based on what they showed us at least.
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OK, so let me get this straight.. you already have the virus, but you don't turn unless you die. You can get bit and turn, but you can get cut and then get bled on by a zombie and not turn. A zombie can walk for weeks or months with no food, no water, and even no blood moving to feed the muscles with energy to actually do this. If you take away their teeth they can't eat and hence get complacent and don't attack, yet hordes of thousands with no food to keep them going can go on for months and still be aggressive. You can cover yourself with zombie guts and blood and they won't eat you, but hack up a bunch of zombies and get all bloody and they still know to eat you. All this and a hundred other holes and the thing that will lead to breaking your suspension of disbelief is the idea that Glenn could end up being shielded by a body while they eat it and not scurry under the dumpster or something to get away (or slash some legs, get blood on him and be camouflaged)... ?
The story is the story, holes and all. I don't agree with a ton of stuff they did but it's not my story, so I just have to take it for what it is. I was surprised as hell when he went down, and like everyone else I am hoping some kind of miracle will happen. The fact that they have not confirmed it in any way, shape, or form is enough to tell me he isn't dead until they say he is dead and show his dead body. I could look for clues but there are too many holes already, so what's the point? When they say he's dead, he's dead. Chances are he's dead. He's experienced and cool under pressure.. if his guts weren't being ripped out, he wouldn't be screaming like that.
On the one hand, I saw Glenn, Rick, Carl, and Darrell as the "unkillables".. the main characters in the story. You could kill off Michone, Carol, or anyone else and I would be fine with it. On the other hand, Glenn hasn't had much of a part for a while really. He almost ate it, then took on the guy who tried to kill him like he was some kind of mentor.. That is the sum of what he did in the last season and a half. Definitely just B-plot material, not main story line. Killing him, in retrospect, makes sense. They eliminated any importance of him in the story over the past dozen episodes and now it works to kill him. It just happened in such an oddball way that it's disappointing. A survivor doesn't put himself at risk to try to get a loser coward to make a decision under the pressure of life and death. He should have taken charge and just gotten the hell out of there, and instead he trusted some idiot to lead him to a dead end. Hell, get in a car and wait it out.. the horde will move on, leaving a few walkers trying to get in the car, then bust out. DONE. If anything upsets me about the holes in this series, it's how they ignore the obvious and always end up doing something idiotic.
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I think Glen hit his limit over a season ago. He has been honestly pretty lame as a character after the governor episodes.
And I also think this is panning out to be the best season so far. 3 episodes of action from beginning to end. Rick is as crazy as he is awesome. Carol goes Rambo style again. Walkers actually matter. The entire group is actually out doing something.
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I think Glen hit his limit over a season ago. He has been honestly pretty lame as a character after the governor episodes.
And I also think this is panning out to be the best season so far. 3 episodes of action from beginning to end. Rick is as crazy as he is awesome. Carol goes Rambo style again. Walkers actually matter. The entire group is actually out doing something.
I would agree. Last week's episode was probably my favorite since the series began.. a lot of action, a lot of character coming out of people, and intensity. I'm actually bummed that Glenn has been just a passenger in it all.
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But I was so looking forward to Negen killing him. It won't be same if they give that death to a lesser character, therefore I'm starting to worry about Daryl long term.
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But I was so looking forward to Negen killing him. It won't be same if they give that death to a lesser character, therefore I'm starting to worry about Daryl long term.
Like when Bob stole Dale's death?
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friend at work brought up the possibility of Glenn being covered by the suicide guys guts and blood, thus protecting him from the zombies, such as Michone did.
But, Michone used zombie guts and blood, so I don't think this is a possibility, but who knows?
But this season appears to have picked up on the zombie action quite a bit. So far so good.
Also, shouldn't this thread be changed from Season 5 to Season 6?
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But I was so looking forward to Negen killing him. It won't be same if they give that death to a lesser character, therefore I'm starting to worry about Daryl long term.
Yeah that's the problem, Negan. In the books it really gave the series a shot in the arm because nobody you cared about had died in over 5 years. I assumed they would save Glenn on the show for that same impact. It's a bit early to blow that wad. Who's left that if you killed them I would genuinely be surprised.... Daryl, and that's it because they can't kill the title characters of Rick and Carl, Michone's the minority representative and honestly Carol has cheated death so many times it would surprise me if she died from burns taking a casserole out of the oven without mitts.
About the zombie bites.... it doesn't make any sense at all. The idea they based it around is sound... bacteria in the human mouth is nasty and zombie mouth has to be even worse. It's more than enough to kill you from infection if untreated and since every dead person comes back.... there you go. It's the "if left untreated" part that the show runners seem to gloss over. So long as the wounds aren't fatal a buttload of antibiotics or hell, even pouring rubbing alcohol directly into the wound should take care of it. It doesn't though, because reasons. It contradicts the Hershel gimping because if the infection can't be cured via cleaning then lopping off his leg shouldn't have made any difference either. We've also got Rick who just cut himself on a blade in a nasty zombies head. That should be the same, infection wise, as a bite. Pretty sure he won't kick the bucket though. Blood splattering on you is ok because it isn't hitting an open wound.
In the books they don't make these mistakes, but they sure as hell do on the show.
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Glenn is still alive.. He was not shown in the talking dead memorial. Next week's episode will be focused on Morgan and how he got to where he is today. Then Darryl will have his episode so it'll be 2 weeks minimum until we see Glenn escape.
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Well zombies on the show seem kind of distracted when eating, so my theory is while they are chowing down on the other guy he crawls between their legs and uses that convientantly placed fire escape that they didn't use even though Glenn started as a scavenger in Atlanta literally traveling almost exclusively via fire escapes.
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3:18
Don't remember seeing this yet, guess it could be a flashback.
http://youtu.be/Va1UPrFXHKA (http://youtu.be/Va1UPrFXHKA)
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I hear Glenn goes under the dumpster. Plus he still has the flare right?
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Either he'll die or he won't but the fact that they are going to make us wait two weeks, maybe more, to find out his fate is b.s. you don't do a cliffhanger 3 shows in.
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Either he'll die or he won't but the fact that they are going to make us wait two weeks, maybe more, to find out his fate is b.s. you don't do a cliffhanger 3 shows in.
yeah it's retarded. I didn't like that scene. there was 2 really good escape routes 1. the fire escape and 2 the side fence with the woods behind it.
but now they are going to drag on with 3 episodes before they might go any further with it.
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And seriously, what the ---fudgesicle--- Rick?! A "cattle drive"??! You could have just figured out a way to have a MASSIVE bonfire and lit that quarry up. Bonus it would have burnt for a few days and attracted more, and less walkers would be in the area. Seriously the worst ---smurfing--- plan yet.
I couldn't agree more. They talk about how they've "been out there". But they don't act like it. They know that there are groups of bad people "out there" so why would they think that doing all of this work outside of the walls is good idea? You would think that they would understand the value of keeping their heads down instead of building structures, driving around in RV's and motorcyles, let alone shooting off flares FFS.
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See I thought fear kind of sucked. It sucked because it was a prequel and we knew exactly what was going to go down. The military taking over bit has been done in every other zombie movie since dawn of the dead. The character development was slightly better, but other than that.... I think now that they've got the boring origin story out of the way future seasons have more potential to surprise me though.
The one thing I love about walking dead is it's like a comic book movie that skips the origin story. We know how a zombie outbreak goes down, it's been covered in every zombie movie since the 60's. The walking dead takes place after the movie is over and the remaining survivors have to deal.
I mentioned the burning thing in another forum. Ever seen a tire dump where they burn tires? That's what that zombie pit could have been like. Light 'em up! It'll take forever to burn a pile that big, so much so that any other walkers that get attracted and fall into the pit will catch on fire due to the still burning zombies. More fuel for the flames! It'd be a perpetual zombie bbq.... the problem takes care of itself and you just need to check on it every now and again.
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yeah yeah yeah, but too late dudes... As you might remember what caused the plan to go into overdrive was one of the semi's fell off and started to release the hoard.
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And seriously, what the ---fudgesicle--- Rick?! A "cattle drive"??! You could have just figured out a way to have a MASSIVE bonfire and lit that quarry up. Bonus it would have burnt for a few days and attracted more, and less walkers would be in the area. Seriously the worst ---smurfing--- plan yet.
I couldn't agree more. They talk about how they've "been out there". But they don't act like it. They know that there are groups of bad people "out there" so why would they think that doing all of this work outside of the walls is good idea? You would think that they would understand the value of keeping their heads down instead of building structures, driving around in RV's and motorcyles, let alone shooting off flares FFS.
I thought the zombies from walking dead were kinda perpetually a pile of wet rot. I thought it would be like trying to burn wet leaves. You would need an ass ton of gasoline and resources to keep em burning. Not to mention the limited time span in order to do the job. They knew the semi truck was due to fall and unleash the herd. Sure enough it fell before they could even put up a practice plan. The cattle drive makes perfect sense to me.
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yeah yeah yeah, but too late dudes... As you might remember what caused the plan to go into overdrive was one of the semi's fell off and started to release the hoard.
Yep. This.
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And seriously, what the ---fudgesicle--- Rick?! A "cattle drive"??! You could have just figured out a way to have a MASSIVE bonfire and lit that quarry up. Bonus it would have burnt for a few days and attracted more, and less walkers would be in the area. Seriously the worst ---smurfing--- plan yet.
I couldn't agree more. They talk about how they've "been out there". But they don't act like it. They know that there are groups of bad people "out there" so why would they think that doing all of this work outside of the walls is good idea? You would think that they would understand the value of keeping their heads down instead of building structures, driving around in RV's and motorcyles, let alone shooting off flares FFS.
I thought the zombies from walking dead were kinda perpetually a pile of wet rot. I thought it would be like trying to burn wet leaves. You would need an ass ton of gasoline and resources to keep em burning. Not to mention the limited time span in order to do the job. They knew the semi truck was due to fall and unleash the herd. Sure enough it fell before they could even put up a practice plan. The cattle drive makes perfect sense to me.
Yeah, this might have been proven when Daryl and Beth set the old farm house on fire. The dead were burnt black but still got around pretty good.
Also, didnt they set them on fire when they had that pit full of them after the governor did his walk about?
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The fire wouldn't work simply because they don't have enough fuel.. they would need to dump a few hundred tons of napalm in there to do that, and I'm pretty sure they don't have that.
What gets me though is how there are tons of vehicles all over. Just get a few more trucks and go block the path. Then in the months you will have while that holds you can just come in and dig a trench, sealing them off forever. Done.
I liked Fear because it isn't about what's happening, it's about how people reacted to it happening. People love apocalyptic stories, not because they love how things go to hell, but rather how people overcome it. If you were in that situation and didn't know anything more than you KNOW today (ie you KNOW that zombies don't exist and that the world isn't going to go apocalypse tomorrow, so whatever actions you take you will likely end up in front of a judge for in the near future), then how would you react. I find it fascinating to see other people's take on how things would go down. Fear is about the people's reaction to the situation. TWD is about surviving and overcoming.
I didn't watch TWD for the first two seasons. I don't like zombies. I think they are dumb. I don't like the gruesome deaths. I like action, just not explicit maiming of human bodies. So I didn't watch because I thought it was about zombies. Then people were telling me it was more about the human condition - how do people react to the situation. How do they survive and what does it cost them? What do they become? How does the world really change for them? I don't mean in the obvious ways, but how do they live? I mean, face it, someone close to you gets seriously sick and your world stops. You break up or get divorced and your world is upside down. You get sick or injured and your world takes on a whole different meaning. Now imagine all that times a million. Not only are things not OKAY now, they never will be... ever... You will never sleep again without the fear that you could wake up being eaten. You will never be able to have a child without knowing the chances of that child seeing it's first birthday are slim to none. How does that affect a person? THAT is why I watch the show.
Then again, I'm a Post Apocalyptic Fiction author, so I guess you could say I spend a lot of time thinking about this kind of stuff.
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Good episode tonight.
I was worried that this episode was going to go the same route as the guvnors spotlight episode, but it was pretty good.
This shows how morgan morphed from the crazy guy to the good guy.
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It was and it wasn't. It was completely cliché and totally predictable, right up to the ending. I did think the acting was very good. Unfortunately that doesn't fix a bad script.
All the Ninja Turtle references sure were strange, until I realized Donatello did the choreography. What was odd though was the script writer emailing Hardwick on talking dead and basically refuting making any deliberate message, which makes him a liar or the dumbest, most culturally ignorant writer on the planet. My bet is on the latter... the production crew probably threw all the references in and he was too dumb to catch them.
Still....... two of my favorite actors chewing up the scenery for an hour and a half... not to shabby.
Now for the love of cliffhangers can we get back to Glenn?
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The episode was ok, but it does bother me when they start anointing it as "genius" on the talking dead.
It's an interesting back story but it's placement was gimmicky. The Glenn thing still feels like a cheap exploitation of the audience.
Plus the philosophy that Morgan seems to be aspiring too simply does not work in tribal society, and while it touches on the central theme of the show, Humanity vs Survival, it is as starkly out of balance as the philosophy of the wolves and it is hard for me to accept justification for either. I sort of understand the conclusions the Termites came to but are we to believe some trauma was visited upon the wolves? They make no sense to me.
I hate seeing characters be so stupid.
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Hardwick thinks Doctor Who has good writing, so compared to that yeah TWD probably does seem genius.
Well it contradicts itself as well. You've got Eastman preaching that out of 800+ cases he only met one man that was truly evil, and yet... the wolves kind of spit in the face of that theory don't they? Then he's preaching all this non-violence and yet... he watched a man (an admittedly evil man) starve for 47 days. I think if he would have captured the guy but eventually let him go I would have bought it, but watching someone slowly starve to death and then go "ok no more killing" seems like nothing more than lip service.
I don't disagree with the fact that the philosophy of non-violence doesn't work in tribal society, but I think that's kind of the point... if you ever want to elevate your community out of a tribal society then you need to institute such philosophies, regardless of the consequences. Some things are more important than survival... like living a proper life.
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I don't disagree with the fact that the philosophy of non-violence doesn't work in tribal society, but I think that's kind of the point... if you ever want to elevate your community out of a tribal society then you need to institute such philosophies, regardless of the consequences.
I think my brain just exploded. The way tribal societies, and humanity in general, became "elevated" was to cast out those with violent tendencies, who acted on them in ways which were not beneficial to the tribe. This was a death sentence in times where solitude made survival virtually impossible. Of course, if the case warranted it, they just cut to the chase and eliminated the threat...violently. Violence is an unsavory component of human nature, and to be completely rid of it, you'd pretty much need to "breed it out" of us. Or continuously cull the herd, which is violent in itself. I think both methods have been tried in the past, and are still in practice to a lesser extent (at least in this country.)
And what happens when one tribe achieves "non-violence", and twenty others have not? TWD poses a lot of these questions, which is part of what makes it so interesting. Even with the constant and formidable shared threat posed by the walkers, we don't cease being who, and what, we are.
Eastman's actions are a conundrum. He watched a man die for 47(?) days, and somehow lost the will to kill after the deed was done. He could have easily dispatched him at any time, which would have at least demonstrated some compassion on his part. No, if you have it in you to watch someone die at your own hands for that long, you are not likely to have an epiphany to the contrary. Everything he did after that were acts of contrition, fueled by guilt, not a higher sense of purpose. In other words, the shrink needed a shrink.
Some things are more important than survival... like living a proper life.
Living a proper life is what one strives to do. Survival is what makes it possible. What Eastman did was not survival at the most basic level, so the parallels are poor. Even the act of converting Morgan was not pure. He needed him, and stated so. In a different context, the outcome may have been quite different. This was demonstrated in the final scene with one of the "wolves", where Morgan did lock the cage before leaving.
It was still good TV, poor concepts aside. Oh, and Glenn can't not be dead :)
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Everything he did after that were acts of contrition, fueled by guilt, not a higher sense of purpose.
Couldn't agree more.
I hope Morgan regains some sense of balance, especially if they intend to keep him around longer than his comic counterpart.
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I don't disagree with the fact that the philosophy of non-violence doesn't work in tribal society, but I think that's kind of the point... if you ever want to elevate your community out of a tribal society then you need to institute such philosophies, regardless of the consequences.
I think my brain just exploded. The way tribal societies, and humanity in general, became "elevated" was to cast out those with violent tendencies, who acted on them in ways which were not beneficial to the tribe. This was a death sentence in times where solitude made survival virtually impossible. Of course, if the case warranted it, they just cut to the chase and eliminated the threat...violently. Violence is an unsavory component of human nature, and to be completely rid of it, you'd pretty much need to "breed it out" of us. Or continuously cull the herd, which is violent in itself. I think both methods have been tried in the past, and are still in practice to a lesser extent (at least in this country.)
And what happens when one tribe achieves "non-violence", and twenty others have not? TWD poses a lot of these questions, which is part of what makes it so interesting. Even with the constant and formidable shared threat posed by the walkers, we don't cease being who, and what, we are.
Eastman's actions are a conundrum. He watched a man die for 47(?) days, and somehow lost the will to kill after the deed was done. He could have easily dispatched him at any time, which would have at least demonstrated some compassion on his part. No, if you have it in you to watch someone die at your own hands for that long, you are not likely to have an epiphany to the contrary. Everything he did after that were acts of contrition, fueled by guilt, not a higher sense of purpose. In other words, the shrink needed a shrink.
Some things are more important than survival... like living a proper life.
Living a proper life is what one strives to do. Survival is what makes it possible. What Eastman did was not survival at the most basic level, so the parallels are poor. Even the act of converting Morgan was not pure. He needed him, and stated so. In a different context, the outcome may have been quite different. This was demonstrated in the final scene with one of the "wolves", where Morgan did lock the cage before leaving.
It was still good TV, poor concepts aside. Oh, and Glenn can't not be dead :)
Nope. We elevated ourselves out of tribal society by creating civilized society... were you have rules and laws, and just punishments for anyone who breaks those laws. "He's a bad guy so let's kill him!" is NEVER justified even though it continues to this day.
Survival is in no way necessary to live a proper life for the record. You pick a moral code and you try to live by it. If you die quicker because of said code that is ok because you lived without regret. Living is all about quality, not quantity.
Also you are confusing different societies with some sort of global society. What happens when one tribe is non-violent and 20 others aren't? Well That one tribe is only non-violent towards members of it's own tribe. The other groups aren't part of their society. You still try to resolve things between outsiders peacefully though. Note that Morgan still whipped the tar out of many of those wolves.... he just didn't kill them... because he's civilized.
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While I hate to steer away from the can of worms I opened with the tribal comment.
Steven Yeun's name was missing from the credits. If he's not dead, the producers are trolling at best and if Daryl is the replacement for Glen's comic fate by proxy, I'm done.
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That's a nice catch. I honestly don't know. The night of that episode they were all buy saying he was dead but this last talking dead they were talking about "seeing what happened to glen" as if it wasn't all said and done. Honestly it's just ticking me off....if it was further along in the season I think I might be ok with it as the Negan stuff is going to happen soon anyway, but this was just a cheap ploy for ratings if you ask me.
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What you say, and what I say, about what elevated society are not different. Capturing someone is a violent act, as they won't give up willingly without the fear of said violence. Tribal laws are also laws, and punishments ranged from severe to not so much (i.e giving a family an animal in payment for misdeeds against it, etc.) A society incapable of directing violence against violence, simply breeds more violence, as there is little to deter it.
Note that Morgan still whipped the tar out of many of those wolves.... he just didn't kill them... because he's civilized.
That's what makes Morgan dangerous to every person in that community. They ran away to regroup, and they will return to kill more of the community, or others they happen upon outside it. Letting them go with a "butt-kicking", after they slaughtered so many from the community, was a selfish act, not a civil one.
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"He's a bad guy so let's kill him!" is NEVER justified even though it continues to this day.
Can I ask why? Is it because of your morality? And what defines that?
In other words, finish the following sentence:
Killing a person who committed crimes that are unforgivable is wrong because _________.
The reason I ask is because it is really the central core of my next book and I had to really dive into what is "moral" and what isn't.
In the simplest form of what I came up with, morality is a cultural ideal, not an instinct. I also believe it has religious roots. Take those two things away: the instilling of morality from your parents (ie "don't do that, it's wrong") and the religious repercussions for doing so (ie "you will suffer for all eternity, not just until you die"), and what is left to prevent it? Without those things holding you back, when someone is a threat that will never go away until you kill them, why would it not be a clear choice?
Keep in mind, this is a Post Apocalyptic world. If you were religious (at least Christian based religion) you were left behind because this was, by definition, the Apocalypse. The ending of humans on earth. If you are left, you are Forsaken. Sorry, but regardless of what you do now, you no longer have a place in Heaven.
And even if you never believed in an eternity, the culture that restricted you from committing murder no longer exists. In fact, nobody would blame you for killing someone because chances are every stranger is a threat. There could even be a good argument that it is necessary. You let him go and he will find more people and tell them you have food, shelter, weapons, etc. and they will return to try to kill you again.
I think the episode does a good job of diving into this issue. Morgan's moral base was gone, completely. He had devolved into an animal that had one purpose: kill everything that gets close. There was nothing he cared about enough, including himself or his soul, to tell him there is something better, and nothing he did made him feel better. Then he meets a man who shows him a way that he can feel better about himself. With no other stimulus and no consequences, would you live your life in a way that felt better, that allowed you to sleep better at night and have positive emotions, or would you choose to keep living a life that was empty?
When you start to look at the bigger picture, you have to ask what makes these people tick now that that moral base from culture and religion is stripped away. The culture that arises from the chaos will not be influenced by what society used to be, it will be born first of necessity and then from tradition. "Why do we kill people who commit crimes, dad?" "Because that's what we do, son."
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Based on Negen's comic book fate, I believe that we will see the survivors eventually trend towards Morgan's point of view.
I expect this to remain a central theme throughout the series. I just want to make sure that whatever we see on screen has a believable motivation behind it. I'm eager to discover what it may be for the Wolves, I will reserve judgement until that is revealed.
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"He's a bad guy so let's kill him!" is NEVER justified even though it continues to this day.
Can I ask why? Is it because of your morality? And what defines that?
It happens to align with my morality if that's what you mean, but there is a far more practical reason. Everyone has friends or family or followers/admirers of some kind, even if they are a really sick puppy. When you kill a person you might have gotten "revenge" or "justice" but you've potentially made an enemy of anyone associated with the person and now they want revenge on you. Violence begets more violence until the violence is so horrific that neither side can tolerate anymore... this isn't an opinion but rather a proven fact. Just ask the Japanese if you don't believe me. I'm not saying that a person or a community will never be forced to violence, but understand that when they do they have lost... because they couldn't resolve their differences peacefully and the likely outcome will be even more violence in the near or distant future.
I think people take a bad reaction to that stance because they think I'm some kind of loopy hippie tree hugger when in reality I feel that way mainly because of cold logic and common sense.
And yeah, unless the show really goes in a different direction, you better enjoy Eastman's teachings, because they are going to be implemented on a massive scale pretty soon. The current books are trying to answer the question of how a truly civilized society can exist when surrounded by savages so it's a very worthwhile topic if you are into TWD.
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Keep in mind, this is a Post Apocalyptic world. If you were religious (at least Christian based religion) you were left behind because this was, by definition, the Apocalypse. The ending of humans on earth. Sorry, but regardless of what you do now, you no longer have a place in Heaven.
That is not correct, but I am not getting into it because I really dont want this thread sent to P&R.
If you want, you can PM for my explanation.
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Everyone has friends or family or followers/admirers of some kind, even if they are a really sick puppy. When you kill a person you might have gotten "revenge" or "justice" but you've potentially made an enemy of anyone associated with the person and now they want revenge on you. Violence begets more violence until the violence is so horrific that neither side can tolerate anymore... this isn't an opinion but rather a proven fact.
I also don't want this to end up in P'N'R, so I'll refrain from too many examples. But unfortunately, when "the violence is so horrific that neither side can tolerate anymore", it has reached the point where wars can be ended, and the two sides can agree on the terms of peaceful co-existence. Only when the losses are so severe, and further losses inevitable, does one side succumb. That is history. People aren't bits and bytes which can be manipulated by pure logic. They (we) just don't work that way.
Individuals prone to unchecked violence, and/or extremely violent societies, cannot be reasoned with. If they could, they probably wouldn't be as they are. They are a cancer on civilization and humanity in general. When dealing with cancer, you tear it out at it's root, by any means possible. At the center of the cancer, it is the most severe. You start there and work your way outward, removing what you must, and treating what you can. If it's not completely eradicated, you haven't finished the job.
If Eastman's philosophy becomes entrenched in the story line (which is already becoming a bit disconnected from the show's "reality"), I'll likely give up on it. The visceral challenges posed by the human condition are what makes it interesting. When they start watching people die around them because they want to be "civilized", I'll start rooting for the zombies.
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I like the opposite viewpoints on this. I do think morality comes into play extensively, but any situation where your personal morality comes into question (whether it be religion based or not), other factors will influence your decisions, and the direction of the new culture, extensively.
I think in a world where people are desperate to do anything and in particular have seen first hand how trusting people they don't already know usually ends up killing them, there is no concern for the repercussions. Someone comes close and you kill them or they will kill you. You can introduce compassion but in a world where compassion is already rare if not extinct, it would just be met with even more distrust. Look at Eastman: He shows compassion and nearly ends up dead. The only thing that saved him was his own skill and propensity for violence. If Morgan had been accompanied by friends there is no way Eastman would have survived his own compassion.
Frankly the message I am starting to see is: You can be compassionate if you are the most dangerous person in the room.
That doesn't bode well for most people though. Just ask the people of Alexandria who fell victim to the Wolves attack. They had the tools to fight back but chose not to learn how because they wanted things to return to how they were before. That isn't going to happen. The only way you can have that philosophy is when you can back it up with the ability to do violence. Alexandria could grow as long as it has people like Rick in place to make sure that anyone threatening it in any way will be dealt with swiftly and decisively. Examples would need to be clearly displayed to any newcomers to show, without a shred of doubt, that not following the rules would have severe consequences.
There is a lot of irony in a situation like this because the only ones able to make the choice not to kill are the ones who are best at killing.
This show is about the "human condition." I always saw the "Post Apocalyptic" genre as the perfect platform for exploring this. Humankind will never live in perpetual peace. Sooner or later the power that keeps the peace will grow complacent and someone will realize they can take what they want. It will always lead to violence and war. Is there really any way the human species will not end up committing violence against itself? Randy makes a very strong point: eventually the losses of war and violence will cause one side to cave in and surrender. But what happens when the next generation comes to power and does not have the insight of the ones who found out how much war can really hurt? Once the memory of the cost of war fades, there is nothing to stop a human from waging war again. Perhaps you could say Humankind's biggest weakness is shortsightedness.
Food for thought.
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Without giving too much away in the books, planet earth on a grander scale is kind of where they are in the books. You've got this massive nation (the first world) which has, for the most part, learned the lesson that war is pointless and lives in a truly civilized society, under constant bombardment by these pockets of savagery (the meanest and most fanatical members of third world nations).
If you are paying any attention to the news at all, it should be apparent that violence DOES NOT WORK against these nuts. It's like trying to squash out an entire anthill one ant at a time. So the solution? You do the bare minimum in offensive moves and build a stronger defense. Eventually they will die off on their own because that level of fanaticism/lunacy isn't sustainable.
Randy you pose the argument that "people" aren't logical. I think you mean "some people" aren't logical. You know what your momma said about following others what with the bridge jumping and all. You have to be a better person than the people around you, or else you aren't worthy of survival. By your own logic the only way to get rid of evil is to kill evil off, the only problem is if you go to the same extremes as the evil, then you are evil. So if we go with your logic then it is impossible for good to win. Sorry but I'm more of an optimist than that.
There is a lot of truth to the concept that the more powerful you are, the more you have to restrain yourself and keep the moral high ground. When violent solutions are the easiest solutions is when it's time to stop using violence. If you don't then you will have a very lonely, very fascist planet real quick.
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you pose the argument that "people" aren't logical. I think you mean "some people" aren't logical.
I can't speak for Randy, but I would counter this by saying that while individual people might very well be logical, a culture is not.
There is a demotivational poster (one of the originals) that says "Meetings: None of us is as dumb as All of us." This is insanely true. As a nation, we are a bunch of idiots and we aren't learning from our mistakes. As a race, we are not peaceful. We never will be peaceful. Sooner or later someone who is stronger will realize he can have what he wants and he will not have the "decency" or "morality" to see that it is wrong to just take it, and violence will happen. In some cases this will lead to more violence and it will only end when there is war and one side is finally hurt so bad that it surrenders or will face complete annihilation.
You say there are nuts out there who you cannot stop with violence, and that is true: they WANT violence, so the only thing you can do to stop them is eliminate them. History has shown that when you just shut yourself off and leave them to destroy themselves they don't, they just sit there waiting until you drop your guard and then come at you again. History also shows that eventually we also always drop our guard. Complacency. The next generation doesn't grow up fighting them so they start to think they can love them, so they open the doors to them and BAM, they are being hurt again. The only way to end it is to eliminate them completely, which of course is not possible if you are trying to be moral. You can't fight a war (and have it end) against a culture who believes the best thing that could happen to them is they could die fighting you.
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I'll add this, Homer had this figured out ages ago... He wrote
"In All things, balance is better" or as I like to translate "In all things, balance is best"
I also agree with DK, when he says only the baddest mother ---smurfs--- can be compassionate. It makes me think of Jules from Pulp Fiction. Morgan's trying REAL hard to be the Shepard.
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If you are paying any attention to the news at all, it should be apparent that violence DOES NOT WORK against these nuts. It's like trying to squash out an entire anthill one ant at a time. So the solution? You do the bare minimum in offensive moves and build a stronger defense. Eventually they will die off on their own because that level of fanaticism/lunacy isn't sustainable.
As dkersten stated, that doesn't work. People aren't static. They reproduce, and when ideology is entrenched in a society, and that ideology include heinous acts of violence, it is passed on to the offspring. It is sustainable because we, as part of nature, always find a way. And the anthill analogy is a bit odd. I'm not sure how you deal with an anthill, but it sounds like you would advocate constant patrol of the perimeter with a magnifying glass on sunny days :). No, you deal with an anthill by soaking it in a flammable substance, burning it out, digging up what's left and doing it again. You go after the queen, and deal with the stragglers as necessary. Otherwise, it just comes back.
By your own logic the only way to get rid of evil is to kill evil off, the only problem is if you go to the same extremes as the evil, then you are evil. So if we go with your logic then it is impossible for good to win. Sorry but I'm more of an optimist than that.
Reality always trumps optimism. The effects of reality are a constant. Optimism can help to change the nature of reality, but on it's own it has little, if any, weight in a situation. It's neither possible, nor impossible for good to win. What is "good" is merely a concept. As humans, we assign specific criteria to both good and evil, and they usually end up being related to personal or societal, needs, desires and beliefs. When these opposing desires meet in conflict, it can be said that both good and evil always win. They also always lose.
Your statement also paints police and military organizations as "evil", or at least on par with those who perpetrate your version of it. Without these organizations as part of "peaceful" society, chaos would reign supreme. It's no accident that Rick, the primary focus of the show, was in law enforcement. He represents what is necessary for a civil society to exist, and that doesn't mean he must remain "civil" at all times in supporting the endeavor. It simply means that he must operate within accepted boundaries.
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So, is tomorrow nights show going to be about Rick getting out of the RV? Or is it going to be another walk about episode?
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Horrible episode with nothing but commercials and soap opera ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---.
Glenn's character deserved a better end then this ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---. And he better be dead, if you took his name out of the credits only to have him miraculously survive you are the biggest ---punks--- in television that have resorted to trolling the audience instead of writing compelling material.
I seriously am at the point of abandoning this ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- show.
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I can't really get that upset because I saw this coming but....
I thought initially that Glenn's ambiguous fate might have been an accident on the part of the production staff but after seeing tonights show.... nope it was engineered. That whole little speech with Maggie about how they don't get to know what happened to Glenn... that was directed towards the audience. It was kind of a dickish thing to say at that. The last minute line about a pregnancy was b.s. as well... it just gave them a cop-out to keep the show somewhat inline with the comics if they kill Glenn off.
I'm pretty sure he's dead now, but we can tally him up with Otis, Dale, Hershel and nearly all of the rest as implausible and totally illogical death #369. Intestines don't come out of your chest and one guy shooting himself next to you doesn't make you trip and fall in after him. Also notice the fence, and the fire escape and how they don't even attempt to make it to either.
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Did I miss how Rick got out of that RV, ran a good distance with thousands of walkers behind him, and even some trying to intercept him?
So is Rick going to hook up with the blonde and even win over her son who hated him?
Is the girl who Carl had a crush on gone?
Is Glenn gone?
And what about Michone?
Tune in tomorrow for the next episode of As The Walkers Turn.
Yep, soap opera.
This show needs to change its direction. Or it may be time to end it as the whole group turning into walkers.
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I think the show was only about 32 minutes long after commercials.
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Did I miss how Rick got out of that RV, ran a good distance with thousands of walkers behind him, and even some trying to intercept him?
No you didn't. There are only three episodes left, so I'm sure one of them will be a flashback episode detailing the incredibly boring and irrelevant tale of how Rick got out and how that cut on his hand was magically better. It looks like next week is an episode about how survivalist Daryl is a survivalist. Seriously how many times have they done that episode over the course of the show? I'm placing my bet right now... we won't see Glenn's ultimate fate until the end year finale, possibly not resolving itself fully until next year.
As for your other complaints.... you've read the comics right?
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I figured the lackluster "character development" episode was coming soon. :dunno Still been a high octane season.
I guess I was more scratching my head why they kept mentioning Carol and she didn't even show up for a brief second. Alos, you think there would be somebody mentioning how their quiet little Betty Crocker went full solid snake on a dozen barbarians. The pantry scene would have been much cooler with Carol, too. Give them a baking tip to stretch their rations out, then while keeping a full smile, threaten to slit their throats in their sleep if they touch one more can of food than they are allowed.
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I'm beginning to wonder if maybe they blow all the show's budget on sfx and that's why characters are often absent. It's an old trick. Every few shows you only feature one or two characters and if you are paying your actors per appearance you only have to pay those two.
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I figured the lackluster "character development" episode was coming soon. :dunno Still been a high octane season.
I guess I was more scratching my head why they kept mentioning Carol and she didn't even show up for a brief second. Alos, you think there would be somebody mentioning how their quiet little Betty Crocker went full solid snake on a dozen barbarians. The pantry scene would have been much cooler with Carol, too. Give them a baking tip to stretch their rations out, then while keeping a full smile, threaten to slit their throats in their sleep if they touch one more can of food than they are allowed.
Wasn't Carol in disguise for most of the Wolves attack? How many Alexandrians actually saw her killing anyone?
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Well, the townsfolk can't be stupid enough to think that the wolves got killed by a ghost, there was nobody around in the beginning but Carol to fight them. The chubbier gal for sure saw carol off one of the wolves, and she taught her how to shoot a gun quick. Rick mentioned it in a matter-of fact matter way to Deanna after she was attacked that one of the bodies of a wolf carol downed was missing, so there were no secrets that she was going around wolf hunting.
I guess, maybe they could be that ignorant, but I sounds like the townsfolk are pretty gossipy if the blond chick stabbing a walker in the head is "big news"
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As for your other complaints.... you've read the comics right?
I have not.
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You probably should at this point, at least up until the Alexandrian massacre. 10+ years of books after all. The thing is, they are getting dangerously close to catching up with the books, so I don't know what they are going to do after next season unless they do something stupid and try to stretch it out.
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Jeffrey Dean Morgan cast as Negan...
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/walking-dead-negan-jeffrey-dean-836243 (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/walking-dead-negan-jeffrey-dean-836243)
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was I the only one that assumed it was Rick on the walkie at the end there? Talking dead didn't seem to think so. I was Just assuming it was him stuck in the RV. They really just skipped past how the hell be got out.
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was I the only one that assumed it was Rick on the walkie at the end there? Talking dead didn't seem to think so. I was Just assuming it was him stuck in the RV. They really just skipped past how the hell be got out.
They're giving this season the Tarantino treatment - jump the timeline around, to keep everybody guessing. Effective, really.
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was I the only one that assumed it was Rick on the walkie at the end there? Talking dead didn't seem to think so. I was Just assuming it was him stuck in the RV. They really just skipped past how the hell be got out.
I thought it was obvious.. he stepped out of the RV and ran.. or why would he show up only a few dozen feet ahead of the horde, covered in sweat and about to collapse from running?
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Well it doesn't make sense timeline wise, but they've made such errors before.
I think it was those guys that stole Daryl's bike.
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was I the only one that assumed it was Rick on the walkie at the end there? Talking dead didn't seem to think so. I was Just assuming it was him stuck in the RV. They really just skipped past how the hell be got out.
My first thought was that it was going to end up being Glenn on the walkie talkie.
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I assumed it was the new bad guys. If it were Glenn, that would be a cool twist although I'll be pissed that they went too far in making it look like he really died.
If he did survive, I'll be rolling my eyes and complaining about the soap opera style of bringing back dead characters.
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I bet it's Jesus.
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I bet it's Jesus.
I really like this theory and wouldn't hate it if it were true, but I read some junk interview with Norman Reedus and supposedly he claims that it's someone from Alexandria but NOT Glenn. Enid perhaps?
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Not unless Enid became a dude. It's not Rick because a ridiculous fake southern accent wasn't heard. That is, again, if they try adhere to any sense of show continuity... but at this point they might be willing to pull any dirty trick in the book.
The only two from Alexandria (Glenn aside) that could potentially be outside the wall are Carl and that blonde ladies kid looking for Enid. Remember all unaccounted for had an on screen death and there is a horde of zombies around the town. So only stupid people (read the kids) would try to leave right now.
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it sounds like a really wimpy @$$ voice if it's a dude.... It's definitely not Glen. We haven't seen Aaron's boyfriend for a while, but I hardly see any reason he'd leave Alexandria.
Eugene would most definitely not venture out, and he's pretty deep voiced regardless.
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Trolled us so hard...
Looks like my Enid theory could still be true.
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Well that was some utter b.s.
I'll allow it though because we get Glenn back. Probably just in time for him to die, but whatever.
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Ok now that the drama is over how about a lack of logic alert?
This whole episode we keep hearing the idea "If only we could get to one of the cars outside we could drive off and lure the herd away."
So let's say you are in Alexandria and you have a gate at the entrance to the town wide enough to drive a car through. Do you keep your car:
a. Inside the town so that in a worst case scenario like what happened tonight, you can drive the hell away.
or
b. Park it outside because LOL you need the exercise or whatever excuse the show runners want to make up.
Seriously I thought with last season all the dumb writing was finally out of everyone's system but this season is like the revenge of the stupid.
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They couldn't pay rights for any more NIN music.
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Ok now that the drama is over how about a lack of logic alert?
This whole episode we keep hearing the idea "If only we could get to one of the cars outside we could drive off and lure the herd away."
So let's say you are in Alexandria and you have a gate at the entrance to the town wide enough to drive a car through. Do you keep your car:
a. Inside the town so that in a worst case scenario like what happened tonight, you can drive the hell away.
or
b. Park it outside because LOL you need the exercise or whatever excuse the show runners want to make up.
Seriously I thought with last season all the dumb writing was finally out of everyone's system but this season is like the revenge of the stupid.
I agree, but if you used logic then you wouldn't have a story..
I have to add though, it's tough to stay logical when trying to craft a situation in a story. There is always a point where you just have to decide someone did something illogical or even just plain stupid that led to the situation. Perhaps the people of Alexandria got rid of the cars so nobody would be tempted to suicide into the walls. Perhaps they decided that there was nowhere to go so they didn't need cars. Perhaps they figured driving a car into the place would pull walkers to the gates. Or maybe they are just that dumb. If they had a car, or better yet, a big ass truck with mud tires that won't get stuck on zombie guts and has big swords sticking out the sides so they can mow down and chop up zombie hordes, then the story wouldn't be dramatic. They would open the gates, drive out yelling "Yeeee-Hawwww!" and the episode would be over. Granted, it would be a cool episode, but no drama. Unless they got into the middle of the horde and it stalled and they were stuck with a thousand zombies around them.. that would be fun, but maybe they could all just crawl under a dumpster and the zombies would go away...
What I find illogical is building walls like that but without a fallback or even gating off sections in case one section fails.. I can sit here and think of a hundred things that would make perfect sense in that kind of world for making a "safe" place to live but I guess the writers just decided to make all the characters really dumb.
BTW, if that wall used 4" I-beams set in the ground every 4 feet, the walls would have bent *maybe* but not just come down completely.. It might have allowed a small gap for walkers to get in but if the town rallied they could stem the flow, fight them as they come in one at a time, and soon the pile of bodies would be a new wall. My brother drove into a fence built with 3" I-Beams, and it tore the car up to pieces but didn't even scratch the fence. A wooden house, even a few tons of it, wouldn't do that. But again, if you use logic you end up with no drama.
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What I find illogical is building walls like that but without a fallback or even gating off sections in case one section fails.. I can sit here and think of a hundred things that would make perfect sense in that kind of world for making a "safe" place to live but I guess the writers just decided to make all the characters really dumb.
BTW, if that wall used 4" I-beams set in the ground every 4 feet, the walls would have bent *maybe* but not just come down completely.. It might have allowed a small gap for walkers to get in but if the town rallied they could stem the flow, fight them as they come in one at a time, and soon the pile of bodies would be a new wall. My brother drove into a fence built with 3" I-Beams, and it tore the car up to pieces but didn't even scratch the fence. A wooden house, even a few tons of it, wouldn't do that. But again, if you use logic you end up with no drama.
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Its almost like you've read the comic. Sometimes I feel like they should just follow the book, but then again the book may translate terribly to the screen. Case in point is Negan, and Ezekiel. I don't know how the hell they are going to pull off making either of these characters believable as human beings.
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Or Shiva for that matter...
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Its almost like you've read the comic. Sometimes I feel like they should just follow the book, but then again the book may translate terribly to the screen. Case in point is Negan, and Ezekiel. I don't know how the hell they are going to pull off making either of these characters believable as human beings.
Nah, they just gotta find a kid that's had half his head blown off rather than try to do the CGI on Carl.
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Or Shiva for that matter...
God I hope they get a real tiger.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PYxsZT4Mas (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PYxsZT4Mas)
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Its almost like you've read the comic.
Nope, never read it. I get to judge the show on its merits alone.
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In regards to what you said. Nope plot isn't an excuse to throw logic out the window. It's a sign of inferior writing. If your goal is to make an adequate story then knock yourself out, but if you want to make art... everything has to make sense AND drama and character development has to take place.
The criticism I've had about this show since day one is that the writers seem to think up death scenes or dramatic exchanges between characters and then write plot around them. That's backwards. Write a general plot, make sure it doesn't have any holes in it, and then go back and discover how the characters would react to the situation and what kind of exchanges can be written. It's a lot harder to write that way, but the end result will be more genuine. It's pretty obvious which episodes are written that way and which ones aren't.
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I wouldn't disagree, Howard, but I have also sat in that chair trying to write a story. It IS difficult to just try to write a plot and get it to where you want it to be while still keeping it exciting and unpredictable. Logic is predictable and boring. So you have to make your characters do stupid things, make mistakes in logic. Some of it can be excused with character development (ie show why that character would make that dumb choice), but it is easy to end up with a bunch of really illogical characters. Add to it producers who are constantly evolving the story to fit what the audience wants most and you have a situation where even the best writers will be forcing situations rather than letting them happen naturally.
If the story was completely logical, it would have ended a long time ago at the prison where they would have fortified it, fixed it up, and made life too boring for a TV show.
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that little son of porch dick. Both of them actually. Did anybody watch yet?
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that little son of porch dick. Both of them actually. Did anybody watch yet?
Yup, watched last night...
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I'm not sure what is more annoying, 25 minutes of commercials or AMC forcing "Into the Badlands" down my throat by making the next episode preview during the first commercial break.
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Into the Badlands is atrocious...
But yeah I was disappointed that we didn't get to see what's going to happen after Sam starts attracting all of the zombies.. That has potential to be as disturbing as the Terminus trough scene.
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Into the Badlands is atrocious...
But yeah I was disappointed that we didn't get to see what's going to happen after Sam starts attracting all of the zombies.. That has potential to be as disturbing as the Terminus trough scene.
Oh I know. I was sitting there, thinking "stfu, sam"
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I think into the Badlands has potential but unfortunately none of it is showing yet. They seem to think that everything they are doing is ground breaking for television. I'll just kindly direct them to Buffy for the fake-fu chop-suey action and Firefly for the overall aesthetic of the show. Basically it's a Joss Weadon show without all the interesting characters.
So yeah, work on the characters and there *might* be something interesting.
Also they REALLY need to explain why people from the south are acting like samurai and have somehow removed guns from the equation. That's the most improbable thing ever. Find a southerner willing to keep slaves and essentially be an 1800's plantation owner and tell them they have to get rid of guns and adopt the clothes and traditions of a non-white race. That'll go real well. Also note that none of the slaves are black...and it's the south.... yeah, I think they might be over compensating a little.
Back to Walking Dead....
Anyway if you read the comics you know that the annoying kids won't be around much longer. I doubt they'll last the first 5 minutes of the mid-season premiere. At least I'm hoping. Shoot I was hoping Diana would eat that annoying baby that somehow magically never causes trouble for the group. We had to suffer through Carl's dumb kid antics all through season 2...I'm done with kids.
The real news is Negan. As per usual Hardwick has absolutely nothing bad to say and all I can say is they must pay him an awful lot of money to lie like that. It's the worst casting I've ever seen. Negan is kind of fat, wears a ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- eating grin all the time, has a Fred Flintstone beard, slicks his hair back, and has a potty mouth worse than Jason Mewes. So of course they get a thin, low key actor that looks, talks and acts nothing like him. Also no Lucille. No Lucille means no Negan.
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am I the only one who hates Carol? I hope she dies soon. as for the wolf I think he's gonna throw DR. what's her face to the board as a distraction and make a clean get away (that's what I would do)
I am interested in this mid season premier they kept amping up on talking dead.
And the Negan thing in the sneak peek. They could've just sped up and plowed through the bikes and been done with it, but I guess that would be too easy.
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.....And the Negan thing in the sneak peek. They could've just sped up and plowed through the bikes and been done with it....
the vehicle is a fuel truck....
all of the biker guys had guns.
needless to say, they dont want a single bullet shot at the fuel truck while they are in it.
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Except.... that's not how guns work. Don't feel bad, Hollywood as conditioned you to believe that firing into a tank of gas will make it explode, but it's just a myth. Gasoline is a rather stable fuel believe it or not. It's technically possible that a big enough spark couple with the optimum mix of gasoline vapors to oxygen could be made to ignite, but it's very unlikely.
I'm pretty sure the reason they stopped were those assault rifles the bikers were holding and how those tend to make short work of a person.
Carol just has unbelievably bad timing. She's been able to keep herself emotionally closed off this whole time and she decides to have a moment of (lack of) conscience now? Morgan was right (he's always right btw) now wasn't the time and if she was in her right mind she'd know that but she has to prove some stupid point to herself. They need a doctor for upcoming events, so I think she'll be fine.
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Into the badlands is post apocalyptic, hundreds of years from now after devastating wars, and they explained that guns were banned by the barons when they came to power. I think it has potential, but face it, it's regular TV, so they can't make it as gritty as it should be. The Japanese martial arts style fights with the wires and all that are fun to watch.. We all know it isn't realistic but that isn't why fans of that genre watch them. Please don't compare it to Buffy though, that's like comparing a post 90's VanDamme flick to Enter the Dragon or even Bloodsport... I think Buffy was choreographed by some white guy with a green belt in karate... As for the setting, well sure it's not far from Firefly, but then how many ways can you make a futuristic-regressed setting? It fits the show. It isn't called "Into the Forest" or "Into the Suburbs", it's "Into the Badlands" and the badlands look just like I would imagine so far.. sort of old west throwback in the city and the estates are old plantation like fortresses.. I like how they still have cars and oil is a big thing, and the doctors have some really rudimentary tech like old x-rays but nothing high tech at all...
Frankly the only thing I have against it so far is the lack of ranged weapons. Even banning guns, I can't see the logic in not having some kind of bows. Why go toe to toe with the most feared hand to hand fighter when you can have a half dozen guys with bows shooting at him from all directions.. I don't care if he were a frickin Jedi, he isn't going to dodge a half dozen arrows all coming from different hidden locations. But I assume that's why they don't have them (aside from the few crossbows in the last episode)... add the bows and arrows and you no longer have a viable premise for the show. Tough to say if it will fall apart, it very well might, but honestly it is better than 95% of the shows on TV this season. Most of the stuff on regular channels is just a rehash of the same crap from the last two decades.. we've got some 75 different CSI type dramas (I think CSI Two Dot, Montana is airing over the Christmas break, followed by CSI Buffalo, Wyoming.. they're running out of even small towns now), a few fireman/doctor/police dramas (Is it Chicago Fire now, Police? EMT? Or maybe it's Chicago Streetsweepers this year... Chicago MeterMaids?), and some really weak comedy that isn't worth flipping to. Yay. The only stuff even halfway original might be on sci-fi but then production quality is down to what a few high school students could do in an afternoon with a camera phone and a makeup kit.
I mostly watch the pay channel shows now, some of the streaming originals, and a few shows on AMC. (Oh and Street Outlaws.. that show rocks) If I had more time for TV, I might watch one of the attempts at DC comic shows, like Gotham, flash, arrow, or Supergirl, but *yawn* wait, what was I saying? Oh yeah, most non-pay channel stuff sucks.
The only thing I have to say about TWD is it sucks to have to wait 2 and a half months for more...
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No, they didn't explain that guns were banned, they stated that guns were banned. That's my point... they need to explain because that's impossible. Ok let's say you are a Baron or what have you and you get together with all the other Barons and agree that there will be no more guns. Well the first thing that will happen is any gangs or criminal organizations left in the area will shoot your gang down and take power. So the only way to take down these remaining gangs is with, your guessed it, guns. Now you can give up your guns and hope the other barons do the same, or do what every ruler has done since the dawn of time, keep your superior deterrent on hand just in case. Don't get me wrong, I'm a pacifist, I'm against violence, but it doesn't mean I'm blind to how "normal" people think.
You must not be very familiar with Firefly. The show is an Asian and old west fusion of a setting. I can't think of many other shows that came up with that concept or have used it since, except for this one.
I WILL compare it to Buffy, because like Buffy the use of the martial arts as it pertains to the story really sucks. All these really, really white Barons somehow know kung-fu because .... reasons? All of society revolves around martial arts... again... no reason... because it looks cool? At least Buffy was written well enough to where a lot of that nonsense could be ignored.
There is such a thing as suspension of disbelief. If the entire world doesn't make sense then you are on pretty shaky ground. It's exactly what I was talking about in regards to TWD last week. You can't think of a really cool look or concept and just write around it expecting people to ignore the rather obvious plot holes... stuff has to make sense first and you can create a visual style or concept out of your thoroughly thought out, air-tight story.
You are really stabbing yourself in the foot because the DC tv series is some of the best shows on TV paid or otherwise. Mind you the CW shows are decidedly skewed to a young audience... they aren't for me... but I can appreciate what they are doing. Gotham is pretty fantastic. It's a slow burn and a lot of people just don't get the show because they superficially just want to see Batman, but it has a lot going for it. I don't agree with a few of the plots going on as it pertains to some of the characters, especially the Riddler, but it reminds me of those extremely rare instances in the comics where they allow a guest writer to go nuts ignoring canon and it actually turns out amazing, like Frank Millers Dark Knight Returns (the original, not the questionable sequels).
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So after hundreds of years of people barely surviving in a post apocalyptic world, is there supposed to be some massive stash of ammunition for guns that never went bad? Ever shot a case of ammo from Vietnam era military surplus? After only a few decades, you start getting a lot of misfires. So a century or two later where would they get their ammo? Why is it so hard to believe guns are no longer readily available, particularly when the people in power are killing anyone in possession of one? I could believe nomads with muskets maybe, and like I said, other missile weapons like bows and crossbows (which they do use), but even in TWD, guns are getting scarce. Look at books (and movies) like The Road... he has a gun but nobody believes he has bullets for it because nobody has bullets anymore... One of the worst parts of TWD is how they managed to scrounge up so much ammo. In Montana I might believe it, lol, I have friends with stashes of well over 100,000 rounds, but where are they finding all this ammo in a world where they can't even find a car that runs or gas to fill the tank?? Especially Rick's very oddball hand cannon... Fast forward another hundred years in TWD and tell me how much ammo they are finding..
I can totally believe a post apocalyptic world without guns, just as I can believe a world without new models of cars, new televisions, new computer processors, or any other kind of advanced technology that can't be reproduced with rudimentary tools or basic farming equipment... Guns are precision tools, and ammo is not as simple as finding some bat ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- and mixing it with sulfer.. smokeless powder, precision casings.. all things that a technology poor population would be lacking.
Buffy's "martial arts" were "Americanized". The fight scenes in this show are in the same style as you would see in Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon. YES, it is unrealistic, you can't do half the things they do in reality, but it isn't always about being 100% real. If everything had to be possible, TWD wouldn't even be a story. A plague hit, people died, the end. No zombies because a body can't move without fuel and oxygen. Period. So you have to have SOME kind of leeway in the suspension of disbelief. Frankly, I didn't start watching TWD until the end of the second season because I could care less about zombies. Zombies sell books right now but I didn't write zombies into my own books.. I don't like them. But the zombies are the "fun" part that people enjoy - the makeup effects and CGI that people think is cool to see. The real story though is about the people.. the "human condition", and TWD does that well. In Badlands, the martial arts is the "fun" part that isn't realistic but cool to watch anyway. I love a badass character who is practically impossible to stop. Mix the two and I like it already, just like some were drawn to TWD because of zombies. The story and characters are what will decide if it has legs, and so far it isn't horrible. It will take a few more episodes to figure out if it has any longevity. If TWD's story and characters had ended up sucking, the makeup and cgi would have carried it maybe to season 3, but it wouldn't have gone any further. Most fans would stop watching after the novelty of the makeup effects got old.
I tried to watch Flash once.. acting and dialogue and general writing were godawful. Same with Arrow. I thought about Supergirl but the commercials alone scream cheese and if they can't make a preview look good, the actual show must really suck. I heard Gotham might be worthwhile, but I have enough shows on my plate, so if it has legs, I might binge watch it after a few seasons.
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About the Into the Badlands: I like it, so far so good. You have to take it that guns are not there. They were outlawed, destroyed, or something (Guy at work said obama must have got his way LOL).
Anyway, I can see where it will start to drag, if they focus too much on the baron with the tumor and start to let the action lag.
Now about TWD: Morgan should have let Carol kill the wolf. I mean it wasnt like he would have been doing it.
I can now see that the end of this episode could be a lot like the end of the prison, where everyone gets separated. I hope they dont make a habit of using this scenario on all the (mid) season finales.
Also about the baby Judith, are the writers saving her for something later?
Now on a side note: who caught the commercial for Better Call Saul? I am looking forward to that show coming back.
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I'm watching Into the Badlands but am an episode behind. I must have missed where they stated guns were banned. It would be nice to know more of the back-story concerning guns and whatever happened to the world to put them in that predicament. It seems to be a bit of lazy writing and I agree with Howard that just banning guns doesn't seem practical. Don't get me wrong not having guns makes the show much more interesting. I'd just like to know more about how this world came to be.
The "no guns" scenario reminds me of the S.M. Stirling series "Dies the Fire." There are actually a number of elements in the show that remind me of that book series.
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Remind me to make a season 6 Talking Dead post in February...
While we're on the subject though ITBL seems to be just a rehash of that one movie with Woody Harrelson, what was it? Bunraku? or some junk?
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so I just saw the trailer for "The Boy" starring Lauren Cohan (Maggie) So is it safe to say she gets killed off soon?
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so I just saw the trailer for "The Boy" starring Lauren Cohan (Maggie) So is it safe to say she gets killed off soon?
No, they aren't always working on Walking Dead. They do have other projects.
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so I just saw the trailer for "The Boy" starring Lauren Cohan (Maggie) So is it safe to say she gets killed off soon?
Well, then by your logic Daryl, Carol, Glenn, Eugene, Father Gabriel, Jessie, and Morgan will all be getting killed off soon, as they all have movies coming out in 2016.
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so I just saw the trailer for "The Boy" starring Lauren Cohan (Maggie) So is it safe to say she gets killed off soon?
Well, then by your logic Daryl, Carol, Glenn, Eugene, Father Gabriel, Jessie, and Morgan will all be getting killed off soon, as they all have movies coming out in 2016.
well besides daryl, I think all of them will die soon. unless they give glenns beating to someone else. but I see your point.
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Speaking of Lauren Cohan...
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/12/30/00/2FAC6E6200000578-0-image-a-23_1451435542354.jpg)
And just because...
(http://www.hawtcelebs.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/lauren-cohan-sharp-magazine-photoshoot_2.jpg)
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Speaking of Lauren Cohan...
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/12/30/00/2FAC6E6200000578-0-image-a-23_1451435542354.jpg)
And just because...
(http://www.hawtcelebs.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/lauren-cohan-sharp-magazine-photoshoot_2.jpg)
now I hope she lives...
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Its not easy to type after seeing those pics of Lauren, but....
Tonight is the season opening of TWD!!!!!!
AMC 8:00 PM CST
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I'm not feeling super good about it. They've mis-cast Negan horribly. Finally a character on the show that looks like me and they cast a sad, soft-spoken old man instead.
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He played The Comedian...I think he'll do fine.
(http://blogs-images.forbes.com/insertcoin/files/2015/11/mrogan-1200x960.jpg)
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Well I thought it was the old biker dude from the way they shot it... my bad.
This was a paint-by-the-numbers re-hash of the comic so it didn't do a lot for me, but damn... when he whipped out the rocket launcher I had the urge to shout "E C Dubya!, E C Dubya!" Pretty shocked they went through with the Carl bit as well. The episode was shot and paced beautifully, but it's a shame that all the major plot beats are taken directly from the comic, so there isn't much for the comic readers to get excited about.
Anyway, all I want to know is when do we get to see the frikkin tiger?
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Pretty good show.
Almost thought Carl finally bit the dust.
When Glenn was getting pinned against the fence, I thought "Oh no, here we go again."
Very good season opener. I hope they keep the excitement going.
I've been thinking, we dont know much about Eugene's past. I figure they will eventually do a whole show on him, like they did the guvner and morgan.
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New thread?
I liked it, very inspiring how they took down the entire herd.
It's not exactly like the comic because Morgan is still alive.
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Yeah but they've been doing that since season 1. It's the Rick and Carl show, so you can kind of swap out the deaths of the expendable characters without it meaning much in the overall scheme of things.
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When Glenn was getting pinned against the fence, I thought "Oh no, here we go again."
Me and my girlfriend were screaming at the screen when he got pinned.. I was all "You went through ALL THAT BS with the dumpster only to kill him again?? NOOO!" And then the walkers get mowed down without any bullets passing through their soft weak flesh to hit him, which was all good because they eliminated so many other people so fast. I cheered..
I only knew about Carl living because of comments from here from the comic fans. Oh well, that's what you get for reading the internet, lol.
I was surprised that after all the development with the mom and kids that they offed all of them. The little kid, yeah, he needed to die. The brother, or as they said in Talking Dead "Porch Dick Jr.", yeah, cool. But it would have added some nice drama to keep the squeeze alive and have her degrade from watching her kids die. Hell, drag her through that and turn her into a more bad assed version of Carol.. Oh well, one whole family down in a matter of seconds. The pace felt off though for that whole scene. I like how it moved the story forward, but that scene just felt ill-timed or something..
Great episode overall though. And yeah, I was surprised (pleasantly) when the bikers blew up.. I almost rewound it to watch it again, lol..
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I think the thing that bothered me the most about blowing up the bikers was that I read hundreds of people comment on FB that this is exactly what they expected to happen. Daryl would blow them up with the Missile Launcher after overcoming the guy at the back, so that when it actually happened it almost was like it had been spoiled.
But yeah I wasn't down for our heroes to have to put up with any all your base are belong to us BS so I'm happy the Saviors are waiting for another day.
Oh and guys.... I wouldn't get too comfortable with Glenn or Abraham
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When Glenn was getting pinned against the fence, I thought "Oh no, here we go again."
Me and my girlfriend were screaming at the screen when he got pinned.. I was all "You went through ALL THAT BS with the dumpster only to kill him again?? NOOO!" And then the walkers get mowed down without any bullets passing through their soft weak flesh to hit him, which was all good because they eliminated so many other people so fast. I cheered..
I only knew about Carl living because of comments from here from the comic fans. Oh well, that's what you get for reading the internet, lol.
I was surprised that after all the development with the mom and kids that they offed all of them. The little kid, yeah, he needed to die. The brother, or as they said in Talking Dead "Porch Dick Jr.", yeah, cool. But it would have added some nice drama to keep the squeeze alive and have her degrade from watching her kids die. Hell, drag her through that and turn her into a more bad assed version of Carol.. Oh well, one whole family down in a matter of seconds. The pace felt off though for that whole scene. I like how it moved the story forward, but that scene just felt ill-timed or something..
Great episode overall though. And yeah, I was surprised (pleasantly) when the bikers blew up.. I almost rewound it to watch it again, lol..
Well they swapped some things around due to the fact that the people alive in the comics at this point aren't the same as on the show, but aside from the nice little inserts like the rocket launcher, scene this was scene for scene exactly what went down in the comic. Which is why I was saying it's a shame that the overall arc is the same as the comics and it makes the show a bit of a let down for those who have read it. I liked last years a lot better because aside from arriving at Alexandria, they went off page a lot. This is mostly due to the fact that not a whole lot happens in the comics for some time after they arrive in Alexandria. That's the only bad thing about the comics... the pacing is waaaaaay to slow.
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so people will complain that it's not enough like the comics and some will complain that it's too much like the comics? I'm confused. :lol
I don't read so it was a pretty exciting episode. the biker explosion took me by surprise. and the part with the kid and his mom getting eaten seemed like it was one of their dreams and then it wasnt.
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and the part with the kid and his mom getting eaten seemed like it was one of their dreams and then it wasnt.
Exactly.. the way they cut to it and it was just kind of.. happening.. made my girlfriend ask if this was a dream sequence or was it really happening.. It just didn't seem to fit at that moment. It was almost anti-dramatic. While it happened I didn't really care, at least until Michone's sword went through the kid and the gun went off. When I finally decided it was really happening, my only thought was "Well, that was a waste of character development."
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.
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I think I actually said out loud "Damn, just a little more to the right...."
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I think I actually said out loud "Damn, just a little more to the right...."
I was sooooo happy to see Sam get taken out and his weirdo brother. The wolf dying... I was indifferent, same with the mom.
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Yeah it's too bad it wasn't much of a shock... as soon as they introduced "porch dick" I knew that was the family from the comic that becomes zombie chow, so I pretty much ignored their development.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUkYepOl0Jg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUkYepOl0Jg)
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I like how the tires squealed when they hit the brakes. Even though they are driving in an open field.
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JDM as Negan - Awesome. I knew he was a good pick when I saw the casting and he did not disappoint. I'm looking forward to seeing what he'll do with the character next season.
Steven Ogg as henchman #1 - aka Trevor Phillips of GTA V. I'm glad to see Steve showing up in more stuff lately. His cameo on season one of Better Call Saul was great, but it looks like he's going to be a real nasty bastard next season on TWD.
Anyone think the people Morgan and Carol ran into are from The Kingdom? I'm hoping we see a tiger next season. :)
Now....---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---....
We knew Negan was coming and that he would kill someone, but making us wait until October to find out who.....that's ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---. It's a ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- ending, a ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- cliffhanger.....---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---.
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JDM as Negan - Awesome. I knew he was a good pick when I saw the casting and he did not disappoint. I'm looking forward to seeing what he'll do with the character next season.
Steven Ogg as henchman #1 - aka Trevor Phillips of GTA V. I'm glad to see Steve showing up in more stuff lately. His cameo on season one of Better Call Saul was great, but it looks like he's going to be a real nasty bastard next season on TWD.
Anyone think the people Morgan and Carol ran into are from The Kingdom? I'm hoping we see a tiger next season. :)
Now....---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---....
We knew Negan was coming and that he would kill someone, but making us wait until October to find out who.....that's ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---. It's a ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- ending, a ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- cliffhanger.....---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---.
+1 on all of THIS^.
Now, place your bets on who was killed. Lot's of theories out there on this. It was definitely someone to Negan's left. So probably someone that was inside the Van. My guess is Glenn.
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They are all dead to me.... I wont be back to watch more of that stupid.
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They are all dead to me.... I wont be back to watch more of that stupid.
(https://media1.giphy.com/media/F6W9q4ZYqa4so/200.gif)
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OMG that's funny...Jennifer laughs and laughs. :laugh2:
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Now, place your bets on who was killed.
Carl. Then we get to sit through another umpteen filler episodes watching Rick lose his mind.
Question: How many times will one character or another do something stupid for the sake of pushing an implausible plot line?
Answer: Looks like too many.
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It was most definitely Glenn, if they make it anyone else it will be far too drastic a departure from the Comic though I was happy to see Abraham spared by Denise taking his death.
I mean how can you show the rift between Rick and Maggie if Glenn doesn't bite it?
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Q: Who did Negan kill on the Walking Dead Finale?
A: About 1/3rd of the fan base
I think it was Glenn because of the comics, despite the show deviating from the source material. I believe the line Negan says prior to the whacking, keeps it from being Carl or Rick. Leaving the death as a cliff hanger, for a very loyal fanbase is just a dick move and I think alienated the fanbase more than keeping them salivating for more.
Im significantly less interested in the next season because of it.
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I totally agree, and if it is Glenn his death totally deserves more than being a cheap ratings grab ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- show.... TWICE....
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There is still a very slight possibility that Negan doesn't actually kill anyone. The writers have already deviated from the comic books so they could do it again.
Now hear me out...
Negan doesn't actually say "I'm going to kill one of you". He actual line was "So, now I'm gonna beat the holy hell outta one of you."
So, it's possible that the writers did this on purpose to buy themselves time between seasons, or to test the waters with the audience to see how they would react.
Remember, there is no such thing as "bad publicity". The show has already won because everyone is talking about it. So, if the audience revolts, they will just keep the victim barley alive. And if the audience was OK with the finale, they will let the person die. Either way, the writers win because they can do whatever they want before season 7.
Also, remember that Carol and Morgan meet up with those Horseback dudes earlier in the day...so it's technically possible for them to interrupt Negan's beating before his victim dies.
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I don't think it's Glenn and hear me out on this. I think they were worried about killing a core character, something they haven't done yet, (Sorry Shane, and Hershel fans, those were second tier characters) so the mid-season finale was a test run. Fans lost their minds so they re-thought it... and then the change happened. Eugene now gives Rick instructions on how to make bullets, serving him up to be functionally useless and therefore replaceable in the upcoming war. He even hugged his buddie goodbye and Rick thanked him which is odd because I don't think those two characters have ever spoke more than three words to each other.
I sure hope I'm wrong though. Eugene is a breath of fresh air on the show. Everyone else is all grim-dark and super serious all the time and yet Eugene now just randomly walks into scenes saying something awkward that totally kills the tension. It's like he's winking to the audience saying "you know this is just a dumb show about zombies right?".
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The 2 obvious set ups are Maggie (the whole episode was about saving her) but her arc with Rick in the comics makes me think its not, and Eugene for the reasons you just mentioned. It feels like a really obvious "bait and switch" distraction.
I dont think its Abraham because then it wouldn't make sense to swap his death with Denise's (in the comics) Of all the people Sasha and Rosita seem the most expendable, but I hope its not Christian Serratos, shes very easy on the eyes.
There is such thing as bad publicity if it means fewer and fewer people watch the show.
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Question: Who the hell decided Abraham should have the worst lines of anyone? The things he has said this season have only been met with groans in our household.
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The comics. He's like that in there. Honestly though I find him almost as enjoyable as Eugene.
"You know how to bit a dick Eugene, and I say that with the upmost respect."
That's quite possibly the best line uttered by anyone in history, fictional or otherwise.
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The comics. He's like that in there.
I guess seeing it written didn't give me the kind of reaction that hearing it spoken does. I'm fairly current on the comic and forgot.
"You know how to bite a dick Eugene, and I say that with the upmost respect."
That's quite possibly the best line uttered by anyone in history, fictional or otherwise.
That's not the kind of line I was referring to. That one's GOLD. :lol
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There is still a very slight possibility that Negan doesn't actually kill anyone.
I don't think anyone could survive even one good whack to the skull with a barbed-wire wound baseball bat. Of course, getting shot in the eye socket would have been un-survivable, without seriously advanced reconstructive procedures and medical care as well. So....yeah, anything is possible.
I also doubt it's Glen. Negan gave him a "pass" earlier in the scene, so the gesture would be a bit meaningless to then do him in anyway. Tend also to think it's not a female, for obvious reasons. :)
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The 2 obvious set ups are Maggie (the whole episode was about saving her) but her arc with Rick in the comics makes me think its not, and Eugene for the reasons you just mentioned. It feels like a really obvious "bait and switch" distraction.
I dont think its Abraham because then it wouldn't make sense to swap his death with Denise's (in the comics) Of all the people Sasha and Rosita seem the most expendable, but I hope its not Christian Serratos, shes very easy on the eyes.
There is such thing as bad publicity if it means fewer and fewer people watch the show.
Well all these changes from the comics have also written the characters into a lot of corners. (Massive text incoming)
They made Andrea into a villain screwing hoe-bag, so much so that they had to kill her off even though she is STILL alive in the comics. The relationship that Rick now has with Michonne is supposed to be with her. How is that a problem? Well Michonne is supposed to hook-up with the leader of the Kingdom which starts a major story arc that is playing out in the comics right now. They killed their only doctor as well and while I'm sure they can put a cheap stand-in in place, it's going to cause story issues. Another major corner they just seem to ignore is Judith (the baby). She was supposed to die in the prison attack along with Judith senior in rather spectacular fashion. They didn't have the balls to do it though, so on the show she gave birth and died doing it. They tried to kill the baby off in a more "tasteful" manner later, but the fan-base revolted, so they caved again and put her back the next season. So now they have this baby that is conveniently "somewhere else" whenever all the action goes down. Say what you want about Z-nation... they killed a baby in the first episode.
Anyway my point.... Maggie has her kid in the comics but on the show we already have a baby. So the unexpected and unexplained illness they gave her is to kill off the fetus leaving only one baby on the show. They don't want to make the same mistake twice.
Also I'm not sure how much longer the show has...... they are going to catch up to the "time jump" next season.... they obviously can't jump forward like they do in the books due to the fact that there are teenagers/kids on the show. So one more season and then the whole thing is going to fall apart because the only good parts of the show are direct-adaptations of major arcs in the comics.
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There is still a very slight possibility that Negan doesn't actually kill anyone.
I don't think anyone could survive even one good whack to the skull with a barbed-wire wound baseball bat.
(http://static0.thesportsterimages.com/cdn/864/992/90/cw/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/Mick-Foley-Holds-the-Infamous-Barbed-Wire-Bat.jpg)
Cactus Jack would beg to differ. Seriously how do they introduce Lucille and not even give a passing nod to Foley in Talking Dead?
Don't get me wrong, I think they are dead as well.
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The comics. He's like that in there. Honestly though I find him almost as enjoyable as Eugene.
"You know how to bit a dick Eugene, and I say that with the upmost respect."
That's quite possibly the best line uttered by anyone in history, fictional or otherwise.
I like:
"Why are dingleberries brown? Because ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- happens."
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Wait a second...
If the audience has anything to complain about it's Carol's radical 180 character turn.
So she is a bad-ass for nearly 6.5 seasons, then suddenly can't take it anymore for one episode and turns into a weakling?
THAT is the only dumb writing as far as I'm concerned. The rest of the writing thus far I'm A-OK with.
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My money is on Abraham. He had that whole "I am ready to have kids" moment with Sasha in the camper earlier in the episode and that may have fore-shadowed his death. Also, the first hit from the bat did not kill him or knock him out as Negan exclaimed "you took that like a man" (or close to that). Abraham has a big ole skull that might take a hit without popping like a ripe melon. If it were Glenn it would have been a one hit TKO :)
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There is still a very slight possibility that Negan doesn't actually kill anyone.
I don't think anyone could survive even one good whack to the skull with a barbed-wire wound baseball bat.
(http://static0.thesportsterimages.com/cdn/864/992/90/cw/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/Mick-Foley-Holds-the-Infamous-Barbed-Wire-Bat.jpg)
Cactus Jack would beg to differ. Seriously how do they introduce Lucille and not even give a passing nod to Foley in Talking Dead?
Don't get me wrong, I think they are dead as well.
Negan doesn't do kayfabe.
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Negan exclaimed "you took that like a man"
Exact line was:
Negan: "Ho! Ho! Look at that. Taking it like a champ! "
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The real question is that if they deviate from source material is the resulting story going to be any good?
I mean look at Fear, they have a blank script.... and so far it's garbage comparatively.
I mean can you remember even one character's name?
Let's just forget the fact the the population of Los Angeles circa 2015 is 18.55 million, by comparison Atlanta's population a meager 447,000. But somehow there are no Zombies in sight? or they must have all fit in the Staples center right? (a mere 18k capacity).
I mean c'mon if they get too far from the comics it's going to suck, and not just because the book is always better than the movie.
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The real question is that if they deviate from source material is the resulting story going to be any good?
This is another reason my guess is that it was Abraham. His character dies in the comic around this point in the story. My second guess would be Glenn for the same reasons, but I think Abraham's story has run its course. Glenn is far more integral to the TV show storyline.
Last point on Abraham as my choice: Negan is no dummy. If he is going to kill one of the group, he is not going to kill Rick because he needs the leader alive to work for him. Who is he going to kill then? The next biggest threat. Abraham is the biggest dude in the lineup (something that is emphasized when the camera pans the kneeling group - he is a head taller than any of the others) and if I was Negan I would kill the next biggest threat after Rick. Lets not kid anyone, his eanie-meanie-minie-moe thing was just for show. Damn sure he picked who he was gonna kill, it was not at all random. He is too smart for that.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9sK7fa4ohQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9sK7fa4ohQ)
Someone slowed down the audio from the end as proof it is Glenn... I don't know that it necessarily proves anything, but it makes that final scene much more disturbing.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9sK7fa4ohQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9sK7fa4ohQ)
Someone slowed down the audio from the end as proof it is Glenn... I don't know that it necessarily proves anything, but it makes that final scene much more disturbing.
They can retcon it in s07e01 to be whoever they want.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9sK7fa4ohQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9sK7fa4ohQ)
Someone slowed down the audio from the end as proof it is Glenn... I don't know that it necessarily proves anything, but it makes that final scene much more disturbing.
Disturbing for sure. I saw that clip this morning. Seems to be probable that Maggie screaming Glenn's name was edited in from the a few episodes earlier when she was trapped on the watchtower. That being said, Glenn is a strong possibility as the head banger even without this apparently manufactured "evidence" :)
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9sK7fa4ohQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9sK7fa4ohQ)
Someone slowed down the audio from the end as proof it is Glenn... I don't know that it necessarily proves anything, but it makes that final scene much more disturbing.
They can retcon it in s07e01 to be whoever they want.
Exactly, I am of the belief that the writers/producers haven't even decided who it is yet.
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Exactly, I am of the belief that the writers/producers haven't even decided who it is yet.
Agreed. Word on the street is that the actors in the show still don't know either.
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I'm not sure I'll even care who it was by the time we get to October. THIS had immediate impact and changed the game:
(http://nerdbastards.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/item-472.jpg)
Ending without ANYONE being on the receiving end of that graphic scene....meh...
I say ANYONE because had the death been as brutal as the comic, it would've carried the weight needed to really put Negan over as the number one a-hole.
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Exactly my point about Glenn's death being dishonored by this sideshow...
We're denied the gut punch mentally exhausting reaction as the moment happens, for what purpose?
Kill him and get on with it for cripes sake. Hell I'm sure that his "test death" earlier this season was to gauge audience reaction... So pathetic, nobody important has died in a long time and it takes away from the show.
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My money is on Abraham.
+1
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Wait a second...
If the audience has anything to complain about it's Carol's radical 180 character turn.
So she is a bad-ass for nearly 6.5 seasons, then suddenly can't take it anymore for one episode and turns into a weakling?
THAT is the only dumb writing as far as I'm concerned. The rest of the writing thus far I'm A-OK with.
Nope... that's the best part of her character development. She isn't turning into a weakling, she's turning back into a moral human being with a conscience. It's quite evident from these last couple of shows that she's every bit a badass just like she always was.... she just isn't willing to be the resident serial killer anymore. There is merely surviving and then there is living.... if you can't live with the choices you've made then death is a preferred alternative. Better to be right and dead than wrong and alive. Morgan learned this and the rest of the group needs to learn it pretty damn fast. Thankfully that's what the conclusion of the next story arc is going to be about.
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Negan was cool. The ending was lame. As was the ending of the previous episode. As was the mid-season cliffhanger.
Sweaty, losing his mind Rick is just annoying. Pretty sure I made this same complaint in a previous season.
As far as Carol's flip. It took place way too fast, over only a couple episodes which was ridiculous IMO.
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The real question is that if they deviate from source material is the resulting story going to be any good?
I mean look at Fear, they have a blank script.... and so far it's garbage comparatively.
I mean c'mon if they get too far from the comics it's going to suck, and not just because the book is always better than the movie.
I disagree with this. In short, it is saying that the writers have no talent (or already blew their only original ideas on the comic) and cannot create something worthwhile on their own.
Frankly, the only real upside they have by sticking with the comics is in not alienating fans of the comic, hence keeping a dedicated fanbase. As someone who never read the comic I see the show through different eyes than those who read it, and I think the show as a whole is still as strong as ever, regardless of how much it has deviated from the comic.
When I look at shows I watch that are based on good books that I read, I have a hard time both not judging it and seeing it as its own entity. I don't see Game of Thrones as a show by itself, I see it as a show that is recreating the book and starting to deviate. So in that situation I was happy when they stuck to the story and not happy when they deviated.
BUT, there are shows where deviation works out for the better. Bosch deviated from the story in the first season, but it allowed the story to take an original direction that wouldn't have worked if they had followed the books closer. I get to watch season two with "fresh eyes" and I like it.
So I think a lot of what you are saying has to do with your situation. You KNOW the story and nothing short of following it will "be as good". However, my disagreement is more with that idea that an author can't possibly do better once he does it well the first time. Authors seldom have only one idea in their head, and while some can show talent on one story but then never show talent again, usually it follows that if they can do it well once they can do it well again. If anything, I would say that this is their chance to look back and see how they could make the story better, and by doing so they have a better chance of the story improving the more it deviates.
Fear is, IMHO, a bad example of "original" writing. They had to create a spinoff that does not contradict the main story in any way while keeping the author in a box that has already been built, and still expect him to write a good original story. Not saying it can't be done, but it is far more difficult to be original if you are confined like that. It is FAR easier to write the next chapter than to write what happened before chapter 1. Just my 2 cents as a writer.
Oh, and I was not happy that they left us hanging... Even when Glenn got trapped and we all figured he was dead, my feelings about it only lasted a day or two. By the time they got back to it, I was almost disappointed he was still alive. I had already gotten over it, and I simply didn't care one way or another. Even the characters in the story had written him off. In several months I will start the new season and while I will wonder who died, it will be academic in nature, not an emotional investment. They could kill off any of them, or even many of them, and all that would matter is how the story will change after this. But the other night, watching that scene was downright difficult. I FELT the anger, fear, and regret over the situation, and I couldn't have swallowed that "pill" if I were in their shoes. I wanted Negan dead at any cost. And I was gripping the edge of the seat fiercely waiting to find out who he was going to kill off, hoping it would be the Latino chick, but wondering how it would be to kill Glenn, Maggie, or even Rick or Daryl. But now, just a few days later, I no longer feel it. In fact, I almost don't care. When I find out, it will be interesting, but I will be too prepared for any, none, or even all to die for it to really move me.
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Negan was cool. The ending was lame. As was the ending of the previous episode. As was the mid-season cliffhanger.
Sweaty, losing his mind Rick is just annoying. Pretty sure I made this same complaint in a previous season.
As far as Carol's flip. It took place way too fast, over only a couple episodes which was ridiculous IMO.
That's how PTSD works.... your switch just flips all the sudden and all that repressed emotion overwhelms you. So it's a fairly accurate depiction although I'm fairly certain this happened in spite of the writing staff and not because of it.
dkersten: It isn't about the any deviations from the comics being bad.... Hershel was a welcomed surprise after all... it's about the fact that certain members of the writing staff are hacks, so they need the structure of the comics to help as Kirkman actually is a competent writer. That Dinkel guy.... he's an utter hack. Every time they give him an episode to write he butchers it. Nicotero is ok, but the fact that he's a SFX guy is obvious because all of his shows have these elaborate gags that often detract from the story.
The bad writing on Fear has no excuse. I don't get what you mean about it having the dreaded "prequel-itis" because it is NOT a true prequel... it's a spin-off. It's set in the same universe but it's on the other side of the country and nothing that happens on that show, aside from the fact that it's a zombie apocalypse, has anything to do with the main show nor will any decisions the writing staff make, aside from the zombie rules, have any effect on it. So long as they stay away from Georgia and D.C. the writing staff can do whatever they want without consequence.
It's obvious that they don't know how to write a proper cliff-hanger. It's not that hard... something important is supposed to happen and just when the cast is about to deal with the fallout .... "to be continued". One of the best ones I can think of was the borg two-parter on Star Trek: TNG. They end part one showing that Picard is assimilated... holy crap! Now you knew he wasn't going to die, he's the star, but how were they going to save him and what would be the fate of the crew? That's how you do it.... death is a cheap gimmick because even with a show like this, none of the principal cast is going to die... what you do is put the cast in an impossible situation, so when you cut, the audience can get excited about how they are going to pull it off. The Terminus cliffhanger, despite the lack-luster payoff, was how you do it. I think they stumbled into it at random though.
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Negan was cool. The ending was lame. As was the ending of the previous episode. As was the mid-season cliffhanger.
Sweaty, losing his mind Rick is just annoying. Pretty sure I made this same complaint in a previous season.
As far as Carol's flip. It took place way too fast, over only a couple episodes which was ridiculous IMO.
Keep in mind that this season included a pretty substantial time leap forward. At least a few months went by after Carl got shot in the eye. Carol's transformation could seem sudden in the context of the few weeks between episodes, but it was months in Walking Dead time...
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Oh, and I was not happy that they left us hanging... Even when Glenn got trapped and we all figured he was dead, my feelings about it only lasted a day or two. By the time they got back to it, I was almost disappointed he was still alive. I had already gotten over it, and I simply didn't care one way or another. Even the characters in the story had written him off. In several months I will start the new season and while I will wonder who died, it will be academic in nature, not an emotional investment. They could kill off any of them, or even many of them, and all that would matter is how the story will change after this. But the other night, watching that scene was downright difficult. I FELT the anger, fear, and regret over the situation, and I couldn't have swallowed that "pill" if I were in their shoes. I wanted Negan dead at any cost. And I was gripping the edge of the seat fiercely waiting to find out who he was going to kill off, hoping it would be the Latino chick, but wondering how it would be to kill Glenn, Maggie, or even Rick or Daryl. But now, just a few days later, I no longer feel it. In fact, I almost don't care. When I find out, it will be interesting, but I will be too prepared for any, none, or even all to die for it to really move me.
I had the opposite reaction. I didn't have any emotion watching it because given the last few cliffhangers I knew what they showed or didn't show would have no bearing on anything moving forward. I sat there waiting to get it over with, then rolled my eyes and debated on whether I'd continue to watch the series in the future.
It didn't feel like a cliffhanger. Given the overuse of misdirection I knew it wasn't going to matter what was or wasn't shown.
EDIT: Felt like a cliffhanger on a soap opera where they keep killing off characters and bringing them back later with a lame explanation that doesn't make sense.
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Negan was cool. The ending was lame. As was the ending of the previous episode. As was the mid-season cliffhanger.
Sweaty, losing his mind Rick is just annoying. Pretty sure I made this same complaint in a previous season.
As far as Carol's flip. It took place way too fast, over only a couple episodes which was ridiculous IMO.
Keep in mind that this season included a pretty substantial time leap forward. At least a few months went by after Carl got shot in the eye. Carol's transformation could seem sudden in the context of the few weeks between episodes, but it was months in Walking Dead time...
Weeks passed and Carl never managed to get a badass, guvnor style eye patch. ;)
I don't accept the time passing excuse for bad character development. Carol has every right to change, but showing her write in her dream journal and realize that she killed 18 people doesn't convince an audience. She never objected to Rick and never experienced a real reason to regret her standpoint, and if anything, her time getting kidnapped and getting caught on the road should have taught her that everything she has done has been to protect herself and others. Her entire group would have been dead a few times over without her.
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dkersten: It isn't about the any deviations from the comics being bad.... Hershel was a welcomed surprise after all... it's about the fact that certain members of the writing staff are hacks, so they need the structure of the comics to help as Kirkman actually is a competent writer. That Dinkel guy.... he's an utter hack. Every time they give him an episode to write he butchers it. Nicotero is ok, but the fact that he's a SFX guy is obvious because all of his shows have these elaborate gags that often detract from the story.
I can buy that, but then the issue is getting better writers, not insisting that the only way the show will be good is if they follow the comics.
I have never tracked which writer/director does each show to look for trends, I just watch and enjoy. Sure, some episodes aren't as good, or maybe I don't even like what they did, but I feel like the producers have the final say in how things play out and the director influences more of the quality of the show than the writers, especially given how much talent is there to overcome even some shady writing. So if an episode really stinks then one of two things is going on: either the thing I didn't like was intended and will matter in later episodes, or everyone dropped the ball, not just the writer. Since I don't have a standard to hold against it, I don't judge it by any other criteria than whether I still enjoy the series.
The bad writing on Fear has no excuse. I don't get what you mean about it having the dreaded "prequel-itis" because it is NOT a true prequel... it's a spin-off. It's set in the same universe but it's on the other side of the country and nothing that happens on that show, aside from the fact that it's a zombie apocalypse, has anything to do with the main show nor will any decisions the writing staff make, aside from the zombie rules, have any effect on it. So long as they stay away from Georgia and D.C. the writing staff can do whatever they want without consequence.
What I mean is that we, the audience, already knows what is going on, and how it will end for the characters. There is NOTHING new here, other than the details of how things play out. The entire first season of Fear is just teaching the characters what we already know. That makes it boring no matter how you spin it. The only tension here is the same as you find in an 80's horror flick - you want to yell at the characters on the screen to NOT open that door because you already know there is a guy with a machete or axe on the other side ready to chop them to pieces. Furthermore, any fan of TWD (show or comics) already has preconceived notions of how things were when the zombie apocalypse started, and if the writing doesn't live up to what we already have in our heads, it is going to disappoint. Those are some big handicaps for any writer to overcome.
How often do prequels of well established stories or movies work out well for the fanbase? Almost never, because it is hard to please an audience that already decided what happened. Just because it happened in a different city doesn't make it a whole different story, it just means we have characters that might survive what we know is coming.
I think the second season will determine whether the show has decent writing. The hardest part is over and the cat is now out of the bag, and while the characters don't know the full extent of what is happening yet, they are in the same boat that Rick and his gang were in back in season 1. If they can't pull out a decent show from here then it has no future. I don't think it is a great show yet, but it still has potential.
It's obvious that they don't know how to write a proper cliff-hanger. It's not that hard... something important is supposed to happen and just when the cast is about to deal with the fallout .... "to be continued".
So they are trying to get a primary character to a doctor so she doesn't die, and her health is rapidly declining (something important has to happen for her to survive). All paths are blocked and they soon realize they are puppets in a play they are not controlling. Then ALL the important characters in the story are captured with NO HOPE of getting away. And one is going to die. As the proverbial axe comes down (i.e. the fallout), the show ends. How is this not exactly what you described??
I see it as the cliffhanger being too intense without enough resolution to satisfy while still keeping us dying to find out what happens next. They built the tension up to the highest it has ever been in the show and then stopped right at the peak, leaving us hanging not for a week, but for several months. By the time the show starts up again, the feelings evoked in this episode are going to pass and the resolution that allows the story to continue will feel weak and forced, no matter how well it is done. It would have been better to line everyone up and have Negan come out and say "Hi, I'm Negan, and one of you is going to die tonight." and end it right there... That would leave us in suspense while saving the tension builder for the season opener. BETTER YET, do this at the 75 minute mark, when we expect 15 more minutes of show, so not only is it a cliffhanger, but an unexpected one at that...
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So they are trying to get a primary character to a doctor so she doesn't die, and her health is rapidly declining (something important has to happen for her to survive). All paths are blocked and they soon realize they are puppets in a play they are not controlling. Then ALL the important characters in the story are captured with NO HOPE of getting away. And one is going to die. As the proverbial axe comes down (i.e. the fallout), the show ends. How is this not exactly what you described??
I see it as the cliffhanger being too intense without enough resolution to satisfy while still keeping us dying to find out what happens next. They built the tension up to the highest it has ever been in the show and then stopped right at the peak, leaving us hanging not for a week, but for several months. By the time the show starts up again, the feelings evoked in this episode are going to pass and the resolution that allows the story to continue will feel weak and forced, no matter how well it is done. It would have been better to line everyone up and have Negan come out and say "Hi, I'm Negan, and one of you is going to die tonight." and end it right there... That would leave us in suspense while saving the tension builder for the season opener. BETTER YET, do this at the 75 minute mark, when we expect 15 more minutes of show, so not only is it a cliffhanger, but an unexpected one at that...
1. Who said anyone died? Negan only said he was going to beat the crap out of someone.
There were also a few characters present who nobody would care about being killed.
....so why would I think an important character was killed?
Especially after they've made it look like important characters were killed so often and then didn't follow through.
Hell, they won't even kill off the secondary characters I don't like.
If anyone died, I'm hoping it was mullet genius guy.
He's been kept on way too long, as has the preacher.
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I haven't read most of the newer arcs in the comics, but I'm pretty sure bot Eugene and Father Gabriel are still alive.... Sorry Badmouth.
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I haven't read most of the newer arcs in the comics, but I'm pretty sure bot Eugene and Father Gabriel are still alive.... Sorry Badmouth.
Yeah they are crucial characters in the book. Eugene is the star of the show on tv, so I'm not sure why you'd want him gone.... he's the only one that makes this crappy grim dark orgy of false tension watchable.
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1. Who said anyone died? Negan only said he was going to beat the crap out of someone.
This is true, but that wasn't my point. If you wanted to improve on the cliffhanger, he should come out and say that and then end the season there, leaving the suspense without building the tension to the limits. It wouldn't even matter if it was true or not because the debate would be about whether it will go down that way or not, not about who got their head caved in and whether they will survive. Besides, that is Negan's MO.. Kill one person to set the example and prove that he can and will kill you for ANY reason. The ONLY reason to have him break character and move away from killing someone here is to appease the fans.
There were also a few characters present who nobody would care about being killed.
....so why would I think an important character was killed?
Because they created a dilemma here - if they don't kill someone important off, they will lose fans who think the show is as you say - too chickenshit to kill of anyone important, hence making them all safe. If they DO kill of someone important they will lose fans who only watched because they liked that character. If they just have him beat someone nearly to death they will paint the Negan character as too compassionate and he will just end up being another Governor to deal with.
So who should they kill? At this point to kill the Latino chick (the only really unimportant character as far as I am concerned) is cheap and ultimately doesn't matter. At best the chick (didn't even bother to remember her name because she is expendable to me) is a crush for Eugene. Eugene *might* be considered unimportant at this time (as far as the show is concerned, not looking at comic line) because he already gave the plans to Rick for making ammo. Aside from his "colorful" character, there is no emotional tie to him. Everyone else will either have an emotional tie for me as a viewer, or an important part in the show. Killing one of them would truly change the story.
Personally I am torn over which way to go, and this is the problem... by the time the show comes back on I will be prepared for any kind of outcome and it won't hit me at all. It will just be what it is, and there is no way to not start the next season off on a downhill slide (in terms of tension and emotion).
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1. Who said anyone died? Negan only said he was going to beat the crap out of someone.
I had to go back and analyze the scene from the DVR. Negan smashed the individual, with the some pretty horrific "mushy" thud sounds a total of 8 times before he was done. Not only are they dead, they probably look quite a bit like the drawing posted earlier in the thread.
If anyone died, I'm hoping it was mullet genius guy.
The scene doesn't seem to allow this. Mullet guy is to the right of Carl, and when Negan said something to the effect of "scoop the boy's other eye out" he gestured to his right. There was something else interesting at the end of that scene: it changed briefly from showing the POV of Negan, to the POV of the eventual victim. So, whose face didn't you continue to see when that happened? Maybe a worthless observation, but it might be a hint.
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In my book, the following can kick the bucket without me getting upset in the least:
Captured by Negan:
Glenn
Maggie
Sasha
Carl
Rosita
That recruiter guy
Not captured:
Enid
Tara
Deanna's son
That supply runner guy with the glasses and dreads
Morgan
That guy who was shacking up with Carol
I don't want Eugene to die because I find the gunpowder manufacturing bit interesting. Eugene is clearly the group's Donatello, and he could make things interesting. Although Gabriel's story has been sucking so far, things *might* get interesting with him.
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I am willing to bet my arcade cabinet (its a cheapskate build so take that with a grain of salt) on two things:
1. Someone dies, no one is surviving a caved in skull.
2. The dead person is one of three: Glenn (following comic lore), Abraham (biggest threat), or Daryl (basically a TV show character, not in comics)
Anyone else want to ante up? :)
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Sasha going off the deep end if it's Abraham.... Damn... that girl has lost a lot!!!!!!!!! Plus killing him now really makes killing Denise in his stead a real head scratcher. If this happens one can most certainly infer the producers have no idea who it is or any kind of real tangible plan. Which can be the death of a TV series in my book (I still hate JJ Abrams for not only raping Star Wars but also pissing away everything that was good about Lost by clearly writing with no purpose or plan for the better part of the last three seasons)
Daryl makes sense given that he has a TV show on AMC, a Boondock Saints sequel, and god knows what else lined up career wise. I could see contract negotiations, either now or in the future screwing up the story in a major way.... but just so you know if it is him we most DEFINITELY riot!!!!
I just keep coming back to Glen, it has to be him it will be disappointing if it isn't to me at this point.
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I think killing Glen, then letting Maggie die with him wouldn't be a bad way to end their chapter.
Given the other cliffhangers, he could have been beating a zombie or a pile of steaks though.
It's not much fun speculating if there weren't any hints. :-\
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I think killing Glen, then letting Maggie die with him wouldn't be a bad way to end their chapter.
Probably wouldn't bother me much either. They seem to have become less important plot-wise. I never really bought the idea of her as the "matriarch", and that position seems irrelevant at the moment.
Given the other cliffhangers, he could have been beating a zombie or a pile of steaks though.
It's not much fun speculating if there weren't any hints. :-\
I just offered a couple of possible hints. :) But it's definitely one of the group. Watch the last part of the scene again. It can't not be.
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With as much as has been said in the show about Maggie being the future of Alexandria, it wouldn't make much sense to kill her off. I could care less now, especially after all the build up to Glenn being dead and then not... I feel like they are played out.
Daryl hasn't seemed to have much value lately, it kind of feels like they already removed him. He is like a steady workhorse, valuable because he is solid and reliable (with the exception of his latest stunt), but otherwise not really tied to anyone. They had chances to add love interests and yet they never do. Combined with him being in other shows now it seems like this is the most likely choice.
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I highly doubt they would off Daryl without giving him an epic goodbye episode.
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Daryl hasn't seemed to have much value lately, it kind of feels like they already removed him. He is like a steady workhorse, valuable because he is solid and reliable (with the exception of his latest stunt), but otherwise not really tied to anyone. They had chances to add love interests and yet they never do. Combined with him being in other shows now it seems like this is the most likely choice.
My wife says the same thing about Daryl... he hasn't done much or played a major role at all this season. He used to be the tough guy protector type, but now I think Abraham fills that role. The writers/producers seem to be struggling to find a role for him at this point. But... on the other hand I would bet that as far as Walking Dead merchandise goes, Daryl probably is the top earner, so I doubt they want to risk that.
I said it in a prior post, but I am convinced that the writers/producers have no idea who it is yet. But I do agree with smass that someone is definitely dead.
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(https://cdn-img-0.wanelo.com/p/46d/0a4/b17/8680d1e7609f0a89008ad50/x354-q80.jpg)
(Don't ask me why Chad Kroeger is modeling the shirt)
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I just read something that made a lot of sense.
it has to be someone from the trailer. Glenn, daryl, Michonne, or rosita.
The show opens in a pov from one of them. it's shows that a couple more times. Then it ends in a pov.
so from a film makers stand point that works.
as they are getting out of the trailer you can see daryl from the view of whomever is looking. so this could rule out daryl.
it all leads back to Glenn.
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The more I think about it, the more I feel we are doing exactly what they wanted. By arguing and speculating we are keeping the show in our minds and trending on social media. So I'm done.... I'll find out next season if I still have interest in watching.
Time for Fear. Even though the spin-off is fairly terrible I find it to be a guilty pleasure. It's like watching a train wreck. I've got to admit that zombies on a boat is a fairly novel idea... it has potential.
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(http://images4.fanpop.com/image/photos/21300000/I-m-On-A-Boat-ft-T-Pain-the-lonely-island-21300997-913-514.png)
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(http://truegif.com/pictures/gif/10446.gif)
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Well now motha **** I'm stuck on a boat.
Good thing those moth **** zombies don't float.
Were on a boat motha **** and were gonna survive!
Gonna eat some fishies to keep us alive!
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Well now motha **** I'm stuck on a boat.
Good thing those moth **** zombies don't float.
Were on a boat motha **** and were gonna survive!
Gonna eat some fishies to keep us alive!
I'm now even more sad that Howard will not be joining us at ZapCon. :'(
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Well that was an eye-popping episode... o_O
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Man they really dragged it out only to have Glen, the guy who died in the comics and a non-important character like Abraham die. Seriously we didn't need an hour and 10 minute episode and an hour and 30 minute after show just for that.
It was horseshit that they pulled all that crap with Glen last season only to actually kill him. Eugene is still on there and we haven't seen the Tiger yet, but this show is wearing on me.
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I will be interested how they handle Dwight's story line.... but I agree with Howard on the damn drawn out episode.
They should have had Abraham die in last season's finale and just when everyone thought Glenn was safe kill him in the premiere.
But definitely expected better especially having to stomach 60 commercials for 35 minutes of show.
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I swore that I was done with this show and wasn't going to bother watching any this season.
Got bored last night and watched the premiere.
Same old crap. The writing feels random and not in a good way. Like in an incoherent pointless "nothing from prior or future episodes matters" kind of way. I'm not sure how a series based on an already established story manages to pull that off, but they do.
As soon as last season's cliffhanger aired, I was convinced that they didn't know who they were going to kill off and wanted to keep their options open.
All the analyzing and speculation about who got killed was a farce. The writing in this show just doesn't work that way.
(Game of Thrones does work that way and it's one of the reasons I love that series.)
Walking Dead is more like the old Batman live action series where they leave you with a crazy cliffhanger (how will they escape this time) and then the next episode has letdown of an explanation and then sets up for the next cliffhanger.
I don't care about any of the characters at this point. None of them have had any interesting dialogue for a long time.
Rick who is supposedly the lead character has been a spastic bumbling mess for what feels like multiple seasons now.
I didn't think that could get any worse, but it turns out that I was wrong.
Maybe he gets paid based on lines of dialogue and they save money by having him just make improvised faces instead.
alright. I think I've ranted more than I'm entitled to.
I should just not watch a show that I no longer like.
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Yeah man, but there's a tiger this season. Until I see a tiger rip apart some zombies, I feel my life won't be complete.
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Popey's
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My money is on Abraham. He had that whole "I am ready to have kids" moment with Sasha in the camper earlier in the episode and that may have fore-shadowed his death. Also, the first hit from the bat did not kill him or knock him out as Negan exclaimed "you took that like a man" (or close to that). Abraham has a big ole skull that might take a hit without popping like a ripe melon. If it were Glenn it would have been a one hit TKO :)
Genius... :)
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I was convinced that they didn't know who they were going to kill off and wanted to keep their options open.
They went over this in Talking Dead and they have known for a couple years, and the actors knew 8 months ago and couldn't say anything. That stuff was all shot last season.
From what they said (Kirkman and Gimple), the entire show changes now, and pretty much the last season was lead up to get to this crossroad in the story.
Personally, I look forward to the season, but I think they crossed the line in the graphic violence department with that episode. The gore and violence in this show is fine, normally, sometimes overdone, but tolerable and at worst just not to my taste. I think this is mostly because it is either an animal (zombies aren't people any more) vs man, or violence between people with the end desire to win a fight or maybe to hit you hard emotionally. Even the hardest scenes to watch before this were still done within those bounds. But what they showed in this episode was basically a graphic display of torture and torment that was simply not necessary. I felt like I had accidentally turned on a video of a Muslim cutting off a Christian man's head, something that repulses me at the deepest levels. It was too personal and graphic and in extremely poor taste. Not only was I repulsed by the scene, I was angry for them crossing the line, and it kept me from even caring that they killed off a major character. Ruined the rest of the episode for me.
Hopefully the backlash from it (and there is a lot of outcry over that scene) will keep them in line. There are places where it is entertaining for them to push the boundaries, but this is just not one of them.
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I hope you are joking. It's a horror tv show, there is supposed to be blood and gore. Also it's all pretend. The rubber head they used for the scene looked fake as all get out.
That aside the comic book death is quite graphic and they are just mirroring that. It's supposed to be... you are supposed to care about Glen.
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I hope you are joking. It's a horror tv show, there is supposed to be blood and gore. Also it's all pretend. The rubber head they used for the scene looked fake as all get out.
That aside the comic book death is quite graphic and they are just mirroring that. It's supposed to be... you are supposed to care about Glen.
Agreed 100%. This season premiere was exactly what the series needs to fuel my interest. If they had pussied out and spared Glen, or if they pussied out and did not show murders as graphically as they did - I would have been very disappointed. They got this one right. As a fan of the show and the genre, I am very pleased and very relieved. Walking Dead is supposed to be violent and unpredictable. Good on 'em for getting this episode right.
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I found the Terminus trough infinitely more disturbing.
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Tainted meat!
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Though disturbing (on a number of levels) I think the episode was pretty well done. It demonstrates what is necessary to break an individual's spirit, especially one as strong as Rick's. It's as much a reflection of human history, as anything to do with the show. Brutal dictators engage in this level of barbarism to show the lengths to which they will go, to subdue uprisings and to remain in power. The scene with Carl demonstrated another successful tactic used by some in power: Place the subject into an untenable situation, and then show a small level of benevolence by releasing them from the situation, once they demonstrate willingness to do the unthinkable at the ruler's behest.
It wasn't pretty, but it wasn't far off the mark.
As for Glenn taking the hit (well, several, but who's counting?), the two-fer was a bit of a surprise, but it didn't bother me. In all honesty, Daryl is the only one from the group to which I have any real remaining attachment. It's worth it to continue watching, just to see the rest of them killed off :).
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I was nice to see the Comedian getting another similar role. :applaud:
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It was a little drawn out but in terms of the brutality it was well done I feel.
As Randy said, its only what has happened through history.
And lets face it, worse things have happened for real!!
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Yeah understand that I thought the episode as a whole was crap... it was all a cheap trick to up the suspension and draw things out. The 5 minutes of actual content, including the execution scenes, were done well though.
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Somebody gave Glen an obituary...
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I'm having a hard time getting into this season--Negan is so over the top bad that it becomes hard to believe. I can see if he was only $hitty to the good guys, but when he's stealing his henchman's wives and making out with them in front of them, it's hard to believe one of them wouldn't off him. He literally has no friends or even loyal followers--they are all afraid of him--I can see if he was superman or something but he's just a guy with a bat--shoot him and take his spot...
Also, is Alexandria so great you wouldn't just leave it rather than being some guy's punching bag who steals half your food whenever he feels like it?? Anyways, I need a win for the good guys or this is just too depressing.
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Negan is SUPPOSED to be over the top. Read the comics.... the performance is spot on. 99% of the plot is lifted directly from the comics this season, which is a good thing, because the show runners can't write, but it's a bad thing for me because I pretty much know what is going to happen.
I'm just wondering wtf they are going to do next season. The Negan conflict should be finished up by the other half of this season and then in the comics there is a 10 year time jump, which wouldn't be possible on the show due to Carl. At that point the show will be pretty much caught up with the books. Also the wars that are going on now in the books would be waaay too expensive to do on the show and scaling them down would dramatically reduce the impact of the plot.
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....so after swearing off of it, I watched all of this season. :-[ :lol
I must say that the writing seemed to improve through this season.
Tying the entire story together with Glen was a good touch since the series has seemed to lack direction for the last couple seasons.
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Yeah except they lifted all of that from the comics. Anytime they try to write something unique, they come up with something colossally stupid like the scavengers. Yeah in the story it's been all of 3 years since this all started, so of course people have already devolved to mad max speak. It makes the kingdom (which was from the comics) seem believable by comparison.
The highlight of the season was the tiger.... been waiting all frikkin season for the tiger to start mauling people and I had to wait till the last episode. If Kirkman wants to deviate from the comics he should keep the tiger alive. Hell kill the main characters, I just want to see a tiger roam around eating zombies. Well him and the portly guy with the battle axe. He seems to be the only one that gets the awesome side of their whole situation.
I'm not happy with the Eugene direction. In the comics he ends up stepping up and being one of the most honorable and dependable people in that universe. He didn't just make one bullet, he made enough to arm the army in the books and basically won them the war. They are pulling an Andrea on him and it's not cool.
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This finale really made me like the King. I thought he was going to be a puss, but he turned into a total badass.
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I hated the garbage people from the get go. Im sure not enough fictional time has passed for people to regress to mad max post apocalyptic speech. It just grates how out of sync with everyone else they were.
A good tire fire should end that camp.
Overall i was happy with the ending but alexandria is not a fort and would be hard to defend from the numbers negan has.
And yes shoot eugene the useless nut sack
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Did any of them start wearing skin suits and living with the zombies? That's as far as I got in the comics.
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*shhhh* That's next season. :)
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Skin suits, you say?
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IT RUBS THE LOTION ON IT'S SKIN OR ELSE IT GETS THE HOSE!