The NEW Build Your Own Arcade Controls

Main => Main Forum => Topic started by: dan_ram on June 15, 2011, 03:00:20 pm

Title: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 15, 2011, 03:00:20 pm
A lot of people on this forum have wanted to know what is really going over at Ram Controls and with David Adams. This post will cover what has happened and what will be happening in the near future.

As most of you know David Adams is the guy who started Ram Controls and as everyone is aware, has not been taking care of business, and owes a lot of people Ram Controls stock, other merchandise, and money. I was one of those people, and was owed around $25K by David. He has been going through an immense level of personal turmoil that one effect has been the loosing of his residence. Under this current situation I have taken possession of the stock, intellectual property, and website of Ram Controls as payment of his debt to me. I have taken eight pickup loads of stock from David’s residence and transferred it to my warehouse. If I had not taken this stock it would have been lost forever, and nothing would ever become of all those who are owed. I am planning on continuing the Ram Controls business, releasing new products, and taking care of all past and current customers.

Since I took over on March 15th I have made a number of efforts to fix the previous problems and take good care of new customers. I have made a number of changes to the way that Ram Controls does business and have been working behind the scenes to try to take care of the many customers who are owed Ram Controls product.

Key Changes:

1: The primary focus of my endeavors will be to satisfy everyone who is owed stock or refunds and take care of current and future orders.

2:  There will no longer be any sales of product that is not currently in stock. There will be no pre-orders or advance sales. If a project is not complete it will not be order-able. If you buy something and I cannot ship it within 7 days I will issue you a refund, period. I do not take the money out of PayPal until the order ships so if there is a problem I can immediately give a refund.

3: There will no longer be any store credit sales. In times past David had offered things like $1000 store credit for $500. This kind of stuff will not happen in the future. I may periodically do sales to increase business but will be only offered as a discount on orders or specific items that are available to ship immediately.

4: Anyone who is owed stock I will try to resolve their situation ASAP. If you have store credit or wish to take your debt in Ram Controls stock I will take care of this quickly. If you want cash refunds I will attempt to process them as sales come in but understand that no money came to me from David as part of the sale of assets so I have to issue refunds based on income from stock sales.

If you are owed anything from Ram Controls please send me an email at:
 sales@ram-controls.com

I cannot resolve all of the problems immediately but I will work to do it as fast as I can. To date I have shipped over $5000 worth of product to 20 people who were owed one thing or another. I have also processed 62 new orders and every one of those orders has gone out in a timely manner usually within 1-2 business days. The bottom line is that all new orders are being processed quickly and those who are owed will eventually be compensated. If you have any questions please send me an email at sales@ram-controls.com or PM me here.

Dan Johnston
Owner – Ram Controls.com
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: HaRuMaN on June 15, 2011, 03:13:25 pm
 :applaud:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: HaRuMaN on June 15, 2011, 03:21:38 pm
Can I get a refund for those 10 prepaid Star Wars cockpits?
:whap
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 15, 2011, 03:24:19 pm
I think my post answers that question. I will eventually take care of the SW cabinet people too, but it will take time.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 15, 2011, 03:32:21 pm
Emailed.  This isn't the first person to step forward and claim to be resolving Dave's nonfillled orders.  The last guy didn't get it done any better than Dave.  Maybe this guy will.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: yotsuya on June 15, 2011, 03:33:14 pm
I'd be happy to vouch for Dan. I got in contact with him after some people here talked about dealing with the new ownership at RAM. I contacted him and he was very polite and reasonable, assuaging any concerns I might have had. Although I previously had no intention of dealing with RAM and Dave, I gave Dan a chance based on other people's recent experiences here as well as my interactions with him. I was upfront with my concerns and expectations, and he was very clear about what had happened previously as well as his plans for making things right. I placed an order, and that day I received a tracking number. My stuff came two days later, but there was an issue (not Dan's fault- UPS punctured the box and damaged an overlay). I contacted him about it, and he had a replacement out to me that same morning (even though he probably could have told me to file a claim with UPS). Within the span of 5 business days, I received two shipments from Dan. He's a good guy, and I wouldn't hesitate to do business with him again. He's in a tough position, but based on our conversations, I can tell he wants to make things right. Just my $0.02.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: spoot on June 15, 2011, 04:58:05 pm
Good luck Dan.   :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: GibsonRiddler on June 15, 2011, 06:39:22 pm
Wish you the best of luck. Would hate to think these items would disappear from the scene.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 15, 2011, 06:41:14 pm
Many would consider Ram Controls name to be damaged however I am confident that I can turn it around. The company has excellent products; all it needs is time and good customer service. I have been an EBay power seller and have shipped tens of thousands of products to buyers so I know how to run a mail order business. I have an engineering background and will be working to complete some of the unfinished products. There are three projects in production that David never finished and I will be releasing them through the summer.

Ram Controls has a LOT of stock and all of it is good and sell-able. I have a batch of Star Wars, Major Havoc, and Lunar Lander controllers completed ready for immediate shipment and dozens of other parts available.  I also have possession of the build documents and parts supplier documents so I can resupply the parts as needed.  This process will take time but in the end I will take care of those who are owed.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: isucamper on June 15, 2011, 07:56:56 pm
Weren't there Star Wars cabinet preorders on the order of 100,000 dollars that never got filled?  It sounds like in the transition of the company from Dave to you he took all that money and ran and you don't have control of a single cent of what he stole.  I hope you are aware of just how upset people are over what he did.  He criminally stole from a relatively small community of enthusiasts.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Encryptor on June 15, 2011, 08:01:41 pm
Good luck in your venture!
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 15, 2011, 08:07:05 pm
If you want to quote numbers you probably should make sure that your numbers are somewhat close. I think the actual number from the documentation I have, the conversations I have had with people, and the data provided on the KLOV database is somewhere in the 6-8 cabinet range. Probably in the $15 - $20K range. At least one of those people and perhaps two of them were successful in getting charge backs. I am aware of the amount of money involved and I can understand that people are upset, but I think it would be better to try to find ways to help all of those people at this point.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: KonkeyKong on June 15, 2011, 08:31:59 pm
Say someone was really really interested in a part, like maybe a handle weldment for a yoke  ;D and this part was not in stock yet... what would be your preferred method for said individual to know when part was available for purchase?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 15, 2011, 08:59:22 pm
Most of the time I remove the add to cart button from the website if something is not available for immediate shipping. If there is any doubt send me an email. - sales@ram-controls.com

Unlike Dave I actually answer emails. I check the my email multiple times each day during the week and usually at least once each day on the weekend. If there is any part you want to verify that is in stock send me an email at sales@ram-controls.com and Ill let you know. Remember I do not take the money out of PayPal until I ship your order so if by some reason a part is not available Ill give you a refund right away. Someone else made a comment about the clunky website and it was a valid point. I am looking at other e-commerce options that do a much better job of inventory tracking.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on June 15, 2011, 09:06:15 pm
Welcome Dan and I sincerely hope things work out.

 :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: KonkeyKong on June 15, 2011, 09:14:10 pm
Unlike Dave I actually answer emails.

I'll vouch for this!!  I've sent a few e-mails to you already and each one has been answered promptly and rather in depth as well.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: JustMichael on June 16, 2011, 01:10:32 am
I just hope this isn't a case of new dancer but same old tune...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SavannahLion on June 16, 2011, 01:31:35 am
 I also have possession of the build documents and parts supplier documents so I can resupply the parts as needed.  This process will take time but in the end I will take care of those who are owed.

Looks like this answers my question. So we can expect these parts to be "restocked" over time. I would so love to have a Star Wars yoke but at this time the poor economy has forced me to go "on guard" with my money. In a nutshell, things are getting really ugly where I live and arcade cabinets don't offer a means of defense. :bat
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: shrunkenmaster on June 16, 2011, 02:59:04 am
Recently I ordered a SW Yoke Interface & overlay. I can say two things:

1. I received the products in good time.

2. Communication with Dan was answered in good time.

I wish Dan all the best for the future of Ram Controls and look forward to doing business again.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 10:39:42 am
I think my post answers that question. I will eventually take care of the SW cabinet people too, but it will take time.

Until the time those folks are paid back your company and your product are tainted.  Anyone who buys from this guy BEFORE everyone has been paid back is adding to the problem.  Period.

Go away... pay back the people Dave Adams STOLE from... come back and try again.

Anything less... and you're par of the problem too Dan.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 10:40:50 am
I'd be happy to vouch for Dan. I got in contact with him after some people here talked about dealing with the new ownership at RAM. I contacted him and he was very polite and reasonable, assuaging any concerns I might have had. Although I previously had no intention of dealing with RAM and Dave, I gave Dan a chance based on other people's recent experiences here as well as my interactions with him. I was upfront with my concerns and expectations, and he was very clear about what had happened previously as well as his plans for making things right. I placed an order, and that day I received a tracking number. My stuff came two days later, but there was an issue (not Dan's fault- UPS punctured the box and damaged an overlay). I contacted him about it, and he had a replacement out to me that same morning (even though he probably could have told me to file a claim with UPS). Within the span of 5 business days, I received two shipments from Dan. He's a good guy, and I wouldn't hesitate to do business with him again. He's in a tough position, but based on our conversations, I can tell he wants to make things right. Just my $0.02.

You are part of the problem.

To do business with RAM before EVERY CENT has been paid back is a slap to the communities face.

Thanks!
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 10:43:30 am
If you want to quote numbers you probably should make sure that your numbers are somewhat close. I think the actual number from the documentation I have, the conversations I have had with people, and the data provided on the KLOV database is somewhere in the 6-8 cabinet range. Probably in the $15 - $20K range. At least one of those people and perhaps two of them were successful in getting charge backs. I am aware of the amount of money involved and I can understand that people are upset, but I think it would be better to try to find ways to help all of those people at this point.


Again...bravo... when that happens,  come back and lets get a conversation going.

Until that happens.  YOUR PRODUCT AND YOUR COMPANY IS TAINTED and anyone giving you a SINGLE CENT is contributing to the problem.  They are dealing with a company that has STOLEN MONEY FROM THE COMMUNITY. 

Pay everyone back for the money/product that Dave stole from them... THEN come back and talk.

To do anything less is a slap in the face.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 10:45:28 am
Recently I ordered a SW Yoke Interface & overlay. I can say two things:

1. I received the products in good time.

2. Communication with Dan was answered in good time.

I wish Dan all the best for the future of Ram Controls and look forward to doing business again.


It sucks you disrespect this community so much you'd do business with someone who STOLE FROM IT.

One more to add to my list... oh well.

You people have ZERO respect for this community if you purchase ANYTHING from SCAM CONTROLS until this guy pays back all that's been stolen.

ZERO.

Sad.

EDIT: And you with ZERO respect can pile on me all you want.  All I have to say is ... WHO WAS RIGHT LAST TIME?   ---Bad words, bad words, whatcha gonna do? Whatcha gonna do when saint censors you?--- right... I WAS.  So take that,  stuff it in your bowl and smoke it.

You should be ASHAMED.

PS: DAN... you could be the nicest guy in the world with all good intentions... but I will be SCREAMING this message from hilltops until the day SCAM CONTROLS pays back every last cent that Dave STOLE from the community.  Once that happens... I'll shut up...but not until then.

How's the LAWSUIT going btw?



Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: HaRuMaN on June 16, 2011, 10:57:05 am
How's he going to pay back people without selling product and turning some kind of profit?  :dunno
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 16, 2011, 11:01:49 am
How's he going to pay back people without selling product and turning some kind of profit?  :dunno


Honestly, that's not our concern.  He took over a business with a large outstanding debt burden.  If he wasn't willing to capitalize in order to repay those debts it isn't our problem.  It is completely unreasonable to do new business with a crooked company with the promise that all new money is going to be used to repay the prior victims.  The whole idea may as well be step 5 in a book called How To Con A Community - Again and Again.

Maybe this guy is on the level.  We'll see.  Don't forget that this isn't even the first time a "new guy" has stepped in and "taken over customer service for Dave".

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Woodshop Flunky on June 16, 2011, 11:04:52 am
...pay back the people Dave Adams STOLE from...

It sucks you disrespect this community so much you'd do business with someone who STOLE FROM IT.

I thought you said Dave was the theif?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 11:08:10 am
...pay back the people Dave Adams STOLE from...

It sucks you disrespect this community so much you'd do business with someone who STOLE FROM IT.

I thought you said Dave was the theif?

Welp.... I now know what folder to "file" you under.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: davespicer on June 16, 2011, 11:09:45 am
I'm quite encouraged by the fact that Dan is discussing the RAM situation in the open like this.

Friz, you seem to get very angry on the behalf of other people.  Those who joined the cockpit preorder list are the ones who have cause to complain.  Maybe they'd like to come here and join the discussion?

Having dealt with Dan recently, I'm inclined to take him on face value and believe that he intends to sort things out.

--
Dave
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 11:10:39 am
Seriously people.

Who here deals with a KNOWN THIEF who still owes $$$ to people who are supposed to be "your friends"?

Come on people... it's not that hard to figure out.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: matsadona on June 16, 2011, 11:12:46 am
Hm... having an ordinary business with new customers may be necessary to be able to refund the people that have outstanding orders or cash to claim.
Anybody who has been running any kind of business understands that you need a cash flow. Else you can't do anything.
It cost money to send stuff. So if Dan needs to sell some stuff to get money so he can ship previous orders that is perfectly fine with me.

From my point of view it is a good thing that somebody actually tries to do something good of a terrible situation.
Bashing Dan for things Dave is responsible for and calling him a thief isn't maybe the best way to encourage him...

With that said, I have full respect for people that is pissed off for being fooled by Dave. And yes, in one way he stole money from people here.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 11:13:34 am
I'm quite encouraged by the fact that Dan is discussing the RAM situation in the open like this.

Friz, you seem to get very angry on the behalf of other people.  Those who joined the cockpit preorder list are the ones who have cause to complain.  Maybe they'd like to come here and join the discussion?

Having dealt with Dan recently, I'm inclined to take him on face value and believe that he intends to sort things out.

--
Dave


Dave...i'll give you a pass since your a newb.

This is an "issue" i've been harping on for 5 years now.  Dave/RAM didn't JUST start screwing people.  Dave/RAM has been screwing people for  years.

You don't know the history.  You're commenting from zero perspective.

Don't buy from a thief... just that simple... and RAM is a company that has been stealing from the community.  I don't know how to make that more clear?

If you're really interested in the history...it's all right here on the forums...and at KLOV.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 11:14:51 am
Hm... having an ordinary business with new customers may be necessary to be able to refund the people that have outstanding orders or cash to claim.
Anybody who has been running any kind of business understands that you need a cash flow. Else you can't do anything.
It cost money to send stuff. So if Dan needs to sell some stuff to get money so he can ship previous orders that is perfectly fine with me.

From my point of view it is a good thing that somebody actually tries to do something good of a terrible situation.
Bashing Dan for things Dave is responsible and calling him a thief for isn't maybe the best thing to encourage him...

With that said, I have full respect for people that is pissed off for being fooled by Dave. And yes, in one way he stole money from people here.

A fool and his money will soon part.

That's about all I can muster at this point.   :dizzy:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 16, 2011, 11:20:26 am
Hm... having an ordinary business with new customers may be necessary to be able to refund the people that have outstanding orders or cash to claim.
Anybody who has been running any kind of business understands that you need a cash flow. Else you can't do anything.
It cost money to send stuff. So if Dan needs to sell some stuff to get money so he can ship previous orders that is perfectly fine with me.


So the reality is that he took over a business with too high a debt to income ratio to dig out from under.  That is Dan's problem.  Customers would be stupid to do business with Ram Controls until the outstanding orders are settled.  He made a bad decision doing so much business with Dave, like so many of us did, and now in my opinion the man is further under the bus than he was before.  The only way I would ever do business with Ram Controls at this point would be through a known good third party like Ebay.  Something that provides better consumer protection than Paypal alone.

Yes, he needs cash flow to start his process, but it should not be coming from new orders.  Nobody should be ordering from Ram Controls.  I'm not with Frizz that it is some sort of community solidarity issue.  My point of view on this is that it's just plain stupid to place new orders with Ram Controls right now.  Why risk it as a customer?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 16, 2011, 11:25:42 am
I sincerely hope Dan Johnston realizes how deep of a hole he's in.

It would really suck if he didn't have a complete picture of how many people have been scammed over the years by RAM Controls:
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: matsadona on June 16, 2011, 11:29:26 am
In one way maybe new (foolish) customers is the only way to help the old customers with outstanding orders?
Of course, I totally second that the oldest orders should be expedited first hand, before the new orders....

And yes I have read all old post in this matter, and it is my understanding that Dave's booking and records of orders isn't the best. So that might also be a reason for why it takes time to track down all outstanding orders.

And I also agree that Dan has taken on a quest that isn't easy to accomplish. RAM Controls has a really bad name and there is a lot to do before everything is OK.
As far as I understand he has been shipping out some old orders, so lets all hope he is the real thing and will continue doing that.
It would be very sad if it is just another smart scam getting new orders (=money) and it all ends up the same way as before.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Woodshop Flunky on June 16, 2011, 11:31:54 am
...pay back the people Dave Adams STOLE from...

It sucks you disrespect this community so much you'd do business with someone who STOLE FROM IT.

I thought you said Dave was the theif?

Welp.... I now know what folder to "file" you under.


Sorry... I don't get that response.   :dizzy:

I'm not defending this new guy, but I've read plenty of bad things about Dave.  I haven't heard anyone yet indicate that Dan is trying to steal from folks.  If he does what he says (still a big IF), and steps in and makes these products available to this community while trying to make right what Dave has done, then this is good.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 11:33:43 am
A company is two things, the products that they sell and the people who run it.. The products that Ram Controls sell are unequaled in quality and no one else makes many of the parts we sell. The other part of the business is the people who run it. The people involved are basically myself and my soon to be wife, and we are the people running the business not Dave. I have not defended what David did, in fact I think he ran the business like his own personal piggy bank. He ran it fast and free and really did not care about the truth, telling the truth only when it served his needs. I could go on about my personal opinions about how he ran Ram Controls but at this point it is not helpful.  

I have run many businesses before and I have instituted real management procedures, I have included those who are owed as part of the liabilities in the profit / loss statements of the company. I have a real accounting system in use. It is in my best interests to take care of all of the people who are owed. As to the comments discouraging people from buying from me you are actually harming the community by your posts. One you are increasing the level of controversy rather than trying to solve the problem. Secondly, as many other people who understand business have posted, if there is no revenue there is no money to pay for postage / UPS fees, no money to resupply parts so others can get what they might want for what is owed, and no survival of the company. Another has stated that I should come up with some other revenue stream then sales. I ask how, the only revenue stream that Ram Controls has and can have is sales. This kind of posts actually are harming all of those who are owed something from Ram Controls. I understand that many of you may have your own personal opinions but if you are owed something by Ram Controls send me an email and I will take care of it, if you are not then help me help those who are owed not sabotage it.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 16, 2011, 11:37:51 am
In one way maybe new (foolish) customers is the only way to help the old customers with outstanding orders?


It is not the only way.  The harder way for him, but the most ethical way, would be to capitalize himself in order to pay off outstanding obligations.  It would be the best way to repair the Ram Controls name.  I can't believe anyone would actually assume the Ram Controls business anyway.  I think it is damaged beyond repair.  The smart thing would have been to accept Dave's inventory as settlement for Dan's outstanding balance and leave Dave with the Ram Controls business.  That way Dan could have liquidated those assets through ebay, recovered his damages, and been done with the issue.  Dave would still be on the hook to us for everything because Dave would still own Ram Controls.

I'm not sure I believe this situation because it seems like such a foolish burden to assume.  I will wait and see but Dave has played the "new guy who wants to help" card before.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: smalltownguy on June 16, 2011, 11:44:02 am
Making the statement that hobbyists (both members of the forums here and at KLOV AND non-members alike) not do business with Ram Controls until the company has made good on past debt is a counter-intuitive generalization. You can't expect a business to stop conducting new business just because it has a debt load. I can't think of very many businesses that operate that way.

Sure, Dan's underwater. But the only way he's going to get out is by conducting new business. Yes, he'll need to capitalize the company to improve solvency. But that process will take time. Any attempt that anyone here makes to discourage new business with Ram Controls does nothing to improve their chances of ever getting their transaction completed. I for one encourage Ram Controls to keep pushing forward with new business. For those who have old business with Ram Controls, you have his email address. Stay in communication with Dan, and make sure he's staying in communication with you. As long as the lines of communication are open and you feel that Dan's doing what he can to make your situation right, then there's no need to complain. Let the man get his work done, and stop trying to sabotage his business model.

EDIT: I see that Dan has responded in kind to my comments. Please listen to what he has to say. Bashing Ram Controls at this point is not the best path forward.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 11:47:36 am
A company is two things, the products that they sell and the people who run it.. The products that Ram Controls sell are unequaled in quality and no one else makes many of the parts we sell. The other part of the business is the people who run it. The people involved are basically myself and my soon to be wife, and we are the people running the business not Dave. I have not defended what David did, in fact I think he ran the business like his own personal piggy bank. He ran it fast and free and really did not care about the truth, telling the truth only when it served his needs. I could go on about my personal opinions about how he ran Ram Controls but at this point it is not helpful.  

I have run many businesses before and I have instituted real management procedures, I have included those who are owed as part of the liabilities in the profit / loss statements of the company. I have a real accounting system in use. It is in my best interests to take care of all of the people who are owed. As to the comments discouraging people from buying from me you are actually harming the community by your posts. One you are increasing the level of controversy rather than trying to solve the problem. Secondly, as many other people who understand business have posted, if there is no revenue there is no money to pay for postage / UPS fees, no money to resupply parts so others can get what they might want for what is owed, and no survival of the company. Another has stated that I should come up with some other revenue stream then sales. I ask how, the only revenue stream that Ram Controls has and can have is sales. This kind of posts actually are harming all of those who are owed something from Ram Controls. I understand that many of you may have your own personal opinions but if you are owed something by Ram Controls send me an email and I will take care of it, if you are not then help me help those who are owed not sabotage it.

I commend you on attempting to right the ship.  That said... you bought/obtained a company with a bad reputation and THOUSANDS of dollars owed for product that never saw OR WILL SEE the light of day.  You can not expect the community that was screwed the the company to step up and help out until those who were screwed by said company are righted.   At that time and ONLY at that time will I back off.

The community is not responsible for your decision to purchase/obtain RAM controls.

From my perspective it would go a lot further for you to get the folks who got screwed by RAM/DAVE paid up FIRST before trying to market your product to the very same community that still has THOUSANDS of dollars unaccounted for.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 11:50:11 am
EDIT: I see that Dan has responded in kind to my comments. Please listen to what he has to say. Bashing Ram Controls at this point is not the best path forward.

...and I disagree wholeheartedly.

It would be a slap in the face to those who've been screwed by RAM to take a single part from them until they are paid back.

If Dan couldn't cover what was owed by RAM when he acquired it,   he shouldn't have acquired it int he first place.

That is just bad business.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: smalltownguy on June 16, 2011, 11:52:40 am
Frizz, I applaud your efforts to stand up for the community here, but I have to respectfully disagree with your approach. Your continued comments about Ram Controls being a tainted company is doing further damage to the reputation that you just commend Dan for attempting to fix. Please stop shooting yourself in the foot, so to speak.

I'm not asking you to back off. But I am asking you to take the high road here and be patient while you allow Dan to do his work.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: matsadona on June 16, 2011, 12:10:34 pm
As it looks right now, Dan is actually trying to do something good.

He always had the option so get the stock from Dave and just put it on ebay, without giving the outstanding orders a single thought, and make some money and screw the whole community. Then he would have cleared out his debt from Dave and all others would still be screwed. And there wouldn't be any products like this available ever after.

I really think this is a better situation, though not the optimal situation. Give Dan a break and let him proof that he is the real thing and that he actually tries to make things right for others he doesn't really have to care about.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: channelmaniac on June 16, 2011, 12:10:49 pm
I can see where Frizz is coming from as we've seen Dave try to fix things in the past only to screw more people out of money... Also there was "Adam" and others that have stepped in to try and right the ship before so I can see why Frizz is weary of Dan's claims of paying or compensating people for what they are owed as it has been seen before.


Dan, one thing you can do to help with the situation is to cooperate with the police and with the attempts at the lawsuits against RAM Controls. Mediation is cheaper than lawyers and is legally binding. Seeing progress on the legal front and via paybacks to the folks who are owed the most would be a massive step forward.

Frizz, would that satisfy your need for blood?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 12:11:55 pm
Frizz, I applaud your efforts to stand up for the community here, but I have to respectfully disagree with your approach. Your continued comments about Ram Controls being a tainted company is doing further damage to the reputation that you just commend Dan for attempting to fix. Please stop shooting yourself in the foot, so to speak.

I'm not asking you to back off. But I am asking you to take the high road here and be patient while you allow Dan to do his work.



I disagree.  Frankly,  RAM should be banned here and at KLOV until the company pays back what is owed.  Period.  But that's not my call.  Dan should just do what he needs to do to get people paid off...and then... and ONLY then should he be posting here or on KLOV in an attempt to drum up sales.

Would you be OK with Slick Stick coming back and attempting to drum up sales BEFORE he paid back those he scammed?

Why is this any different?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 16, 2011, 12:13:52 pm
Im with Frizz on this.
Yes please purchase items from RamControls. a company known for ripping people off for +25k
Asumming Dan is a real person and not just another Dave/adam (yes they were one of the same)
or other alias hes been known to use.

But Im hear to report Dave is still alive and still ripping people off -FACT
I recently helped identified a voice recording that should be used in court against him.
Ram Controls is responsible and youll end up going down with Dave or in place of him if its now really now
"your company."
But seriously Ram as a name is about as good as Enron.
Not to worry others have allready been stepping up and doing products suposly only Ram and China couldve magically done


The Ram name has been tainted for years and its not just cockpits
ever figure out what happen to all those Lunar Lander and Missile Command control panels??
must have been on that same pallet with the cockpits

Funny how "Dan" can post here and not on KLOV where most of the problems are

if Dave owed you I would think you wouldve been better off taking whatever leftovers he had and power selling them on ebay to recoupe your loss and start a new name for yourself if you wished to continue making these suposedly wonderful products.
Just my 25c



Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 16, 2011, 12:15:09 pm
As it looks right now, Dan is actually trying to do something good.

He always had the option so get the stock from Dave and just put it on ebay, without giving the outstanding orders a single thought, and make some money and screw the whole community. Then he would have cleared out his debt from Dave and all others would still be screwed. And there wouldn't be any products like this available ever after.


That would not be screwing the community.  That would be one large debtor coming to a settlement.  There is a difference between acquiring the company and buying its physical assets.  Acquiring the company puts Dan on the hook to us.  Acquiring its assets, while it would not help us, would not be Dan screwing anyone.  When an underwater company starts to liquidate the race is on to get what can be had before the assets are gone and remaining debtors end up a claimant in bankruptcy proceedings.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 12:17:03 pm
I can see where Frizz is coming from as we've seen Dave try to fix things in the past only to screw more people out of money... Also there was "Adam" and others that have stepped in to try and right the ship before so I can see why Frizz is weary of Dan's claims of paying or compensating people for what they are owed as it has been seen before.


Dan, one thing you can do to help with the situation is to cooperate with the police and with the attempts at the lawsuits against RAM Controls. Mediation is cheaper than lawyers and is legally binding. Seeing progress on the legal front and via paybacks to the folks who are owed the most would be a massive step forward.

Frizz, would that satisfy your need for blood?

No need for blood... just tired of this company screwing people over... and over... and over... SINCE 2006 that I am aware of.

If it came out that Dan was working with Steph and the Police... that would be a HUGE step forward for sure.

That said... I don't feel bad for Dan at all... he should have known what he was buying...

EDIT: BTW- Riki makes a HELL OF A POINT.  Why are you posting only here Dan and not at KLOV where the majority of the big issues are?  That, in of itself,  seems pretty freakin' suspicious... slick... par for the course when it comes to RAM.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 12:20:20 pm
I just want to make it clear that if I had not stepped up and taken over the company then all of the stock I hold would have ended up in a big dumpster. None of the 20 people I have already shipped stock to who were owed something would have received anything. Several other people in the community were offered Ram Controls and they chose not to do so. I did knowing it would be an uphill battle and I will continue to take care of those as I can. solved.  

Frizz, I have a question, are you owed anything from Ram Controls personally? If so send me an email and I will work to take care of you. If not then please help me take care of those who are. ChadTower is owed something by Ram Controls and has a legitimate issue. He contacted me and I am going to take care of him.

P.S. I am working with Steph, We talk via email every week or two. I have spoken on the phone with him, he can verify that I am not in fact Dave, and I am trying to get him taken care of too.

EDIT: I started here because there was less issue here.. As I have mentioned many times I am working on the problem gradually and systematically and several people in the community recommended that I start here first.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: channelmaniac on June 16, 2011, 12:21:41 pm
No need for blood... just tired of this company screwing people over... and over... and over... SINCE 2006 that I am aware of.

If it came out that Dan was working with Steph and the Police... that would be a HUGE step forward for sure.

That said... I don't feel bad for Dan at all... he should have known what he was buying...

Thanks,

Just wanted to see if there was a reasonable way to show progress and to let Dan find a way out of this mess.

Raymond
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 12:23:50 pm
I am owed the same thing RAM owes the rest of the community... RESPECT.  RAM has provided none over the last 5+ years.  I called RAM a tainted company 4+ years ago and nothing has changed.  For the sake of future possible victims it may have been better if those parts ended up in the dumpster.

Prove me wrong.  Stop promoting RAM... get people paid up... come back then.  If not... this is going to be an REAL uphill battle for you.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: davespicer on June 16, 2011, 12:24:17 pm

Dave...i'll give you a pass since your a newb.

This is an "issue" i've been harping on for 5 years now.  Dave/RAM didn't JUST start screwing people.  Dave/RAM has been screwing people for  years.

You don't know the history.  You're commenting from zero perspective.

Don't buy from a thief... just that simple... and RAM is a company that has been stealing from the community.  I don't know how to make that more clear?

If you're really interested in the history...it's all right here on the forums...and at KLOV.


I have a fairly long history in the arcade community (Google is your friend) and have dealt with RAM Controls on a number of occasions over the past couple of years.  I was on the dreaded yoke preorder list for starters and had every reason to be unhappy about the way things went there.  After the protracted delays on the yoke, any further dealings I had with DaveA were smooth and problem-free.  As a result, I don't have a beef with him personally, although I'm well aware (and shocked by) what went on with the cockpit preorders and would not have ordered from RAM again without some clear sign that things had changed.

Surely if the intention was to take the money and run, Dan would've purchased RAM's stock and sold it under a different company name?  Showing a willingness to take responsibility for all of the company's baggage is encouraging I think.  I know I'd rather see RAM succeed and pay back its debtors than crash and burn leaving everybody out of pocket.  I'm not sure what the situation is in the US, but in the UK companies regularly go under without their owners ever being held to account for their liabilities.

People will make up their own minds and don't need to be patronised or labelled as traitors to the community if they don't fit in with the Friz world view.

--
Dave
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 12:32:49 pm
...and I call it as I see it.  I don't mince words and I don't ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---.  If that's too much for you to deal with,  I respectfully apologize and invite you to add me to your "ignore" list.  

---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- is one thing I don't do well... and when it comes to this situation... RAM controls has been for 4 years... a pet-peeve of mine.  That a company can take pre-orders for parts that will never... CAN NEVER see the light of day just doesn't bide well with me and I will... am... and will continue to point out the ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---.

Sorry if that offends your sensibilities.

EDIT: Furthermore... if pointing out that it's not "kosher" to purchase from a company who has STOLEN from the very community you're poking around in makes me a bad person... so be it.  I'm a bad person.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 16, 2011, 12:40:48 pm
Id also suggest updating the website
removing products that dont exist and particaularly those claimed to be made from "Original Atari Art Films"
which will NEVER happen.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: HaRuMaN on June 16, 2011, 12:42:41 pm
(http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a19/lildreamer316/beatdeadhorse.gif)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 12:49:12 pm
Fritz,

By your posts it would seem that you are not owed anything by Ram Controls other than some vague concept of 'respect'. My appearance on the forums to explain the situation and ask for people to contact me so that I might take care of those who are owed is showing a LOT more 'respect' then you seem to be exhibiting. Just so you and everyone else understands the name Ram Controls is just a brand name. I did not buy the business entity. I own the web domain ramcontrols.com but my business is a new entity and is not even called Ram Controls. The only thing that is the same from David's time is the stock of the company and its intellectual property.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 16, 2011, 12:53:43 pm
Quote
the name Ram Controls is just a brand name. I did not buy the business entity. I own the web domain ramcontrols.com but my business is a new entity and is not even called Ram Controls. The only thing that is the same from David's time is the stock of the company and its intellectual property.

That cerainly clears things up :laugh2:

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 16, 2011, 01:02:13 pm
Just so you and everyone else understands the name Ram Controls is just a brand name. I did not buy the business entity. I own the web domain ramcontrols.com but my business is a new entity and is not even called Ram Controls. The only thing that is the same from David's time is the stock of the company and its intellectual property.

 ??? ??? ???
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 01:02:22 pm
Look my goal here is not to promote the business, it is to let people know what is going on and ask for those who are owed something to contact me.. There are so many people who are owed that there is no way that I could find them all without making my presence known and posting my contact methods. It is not my intent to promote new products or services on the forums at this time as I see taking care of those who are owed as my first priority. If a few people here and there want to try buying something small to test the waters so be it but my primary goal was to open communication and make sure everyone knew what I was doing and to have a way to contact me.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: isucamper on June 16, 2011, 01:04:45 pm
Well, I gotta say if Dan can legitimize RAM controls, it would be a huge asset to all of us, and he would desearve a great deal gratitude for going to the trouble of fixing the unfixable.  He seems competant and respectful, and if he's taking care of the people that got ripped off, that's all that matters right now.

It's a lot more than what I was expecting of the situation, that's for sure.  
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 16, 2011, 01:10:39 pm
I just want to make it clear that if I had not stepped up and taken over the company then all of the stock I hold would have ended up in a big dumpster. None of the 20 people I have already shipped stock to who were owed something would have received anything. Several other people in the community were offered Ram Controls and they chose not to do so. I did knowing it would be an uphill battle and I will continue to take care of those as I can.

I'm having trouble reconciling this earlier comment by you with the one that says you didn't buy the business.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bkenobi on June 16, 2011, 01:16:31 pm
I have no stock in the RAM Controls business as their products are out of my ball park, but I'm confused as to why you are fulfilling orders that RAM Controls owe when you only bought "The only thing that is the same from David's time is the stock of the company and its intellectual property."  If that's the case, and you're business ID is not the same as Dave's, then why would you fulfill any of the orders that Dave and RAM Controls (circa Dave) is responsible for?  I understand good will buying credibility in the community, but, if that's the case, shouldn't you point that out from the beginning?   :dunno
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 01:17:18 pm
Fritz,

By your posts it would seem that you are not owed anything by Ram Controls other than some vague concept of 'respect'. My appearance on the forums to explain the situation and ask for people to contact me so that I might take care of those who are owed is showing a LOT more 'respect' then you seem to be exhibiting. Just so you and everyone else understands the name Ram Controls is just a brand name. I did not buy the business entity. I own the web domain ramcontrols.com but my business is a new entity and is not even called Ram Controls. The only thing that is the same from David's time is the stock of the company and its intellectual property.

So you want you cake and eat it too?

Well guess what Dan.  You're going to have to deal with me calling it like it is.  Like it or not.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 01:20:49 pm
Look my goal here is not to promote the business, it is to let people know what is going on and ask for those who are owed something to contact me.. There are so many people who are owed that there is no way that I could find them all without making my presence known and posting my contact methods. It is not my intent to promote new products or services on the forums at this time as I see taking care of those who are owed as my first priority. If a few people here and there want to try buying something small to test the waters so be it but my primary goal was to open communication and make sure everyone knew what I was doing and to have a way to contact me.

More BS.  Can you explain then the EMAILS you've been sending people asking them to post that they've gotten their parts and that RAM is back?

I'm still waiting to hear about your thoughts on RAM taking orders and money for products that can never be produced.

Or the fact the site still has a lot of inaccurate information....

...or...or...or...


EDIT: Here is the email for reference:

Quote
Ram Controls Satisfied Customers List
Friday, June 10, 2011 2:37 PM
From:
"Ram Controls Dan" <sales@ram-controls.com>
Add sender to Contacts
To:
xxx
Hi xxx,

As a recent customer of Ram controls I am sending you this email to ask for your help. As you may or may not know I took over the operation of Ram Controls on March 15th 2011 from David Adams, the company founder. Due to a number of personal issues he was not able to give Ram Controls the attention it deserved and in some cases customers had placed orders that were not delivered. The problems in question have been resolved and I am working dilligently to take care of these back orders and make sure all current clients receive good customer service.

I am putting together a list of recent customers who would be willing to assist in spreading the word that I am taking good care of people who are ordering from Ram Controls. This help can be in a number of ways. The first is way is for those of you who are members of KLOV or BYOAC to post on those forums that the orders you placed were processed in a timely manner and you received your product. The second is to allow me to refer potential customers to you who might want some verification that I am taking care of Ram Controls orders quickly. I will only refer potential customers to past clients who explicitly allow me to do this. If you say no or do not respond I will NOT add you to this list. Both of these are totally voluntary but there is an old saying that goes if you don’t ask the answer is always no, so I am asking.

If you cannot or do not want to help I totally understand, but for those who choose to help I very much appreciate the effort. I am working on several new parts and controllers and expect to make several product announcements soon. Thank you for your past business and I look forward to taking good care of you in the future.

Sincerely,

Dan Johnston

Owner: Ram Controls

(Note the OWNER; RAM CONTROLS)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 16, 2011, 01:22:44 pm
I just want to make it clear that if I had not stepped up and taken over the company then all of the stock I hold would have ended up in a big dumpster. None of the 20 people I have already shipped stock to who were owed something would have received anything. Several other people in the community were offered Ram Controls and they chose not to do so. I did knowing it would be an uphill battle and I will continue to take care of those as I can.

I'm having trouble reconciling this earlier comment by you with the one that says you didn't buy the business.

That and so far theres only been 3 people posted on KLOV I got this back but still waiting on this...
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=174435 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=174435)
and no one posting holy ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- batman I got my cockpit, lunar lander and missile comand control panels in the mail today!!!

sending out some tubes of nyogel and missing yoke overlays dont make up for the fraud of the rest of it.

From another post less than a month ago a paypal transaction with Ramcontrols and phone number was still Daves voice. Dont be fooled Daves not dead and is still ripping people off and still has access to these parts-FACT
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: smalltownguy on June 16, 2011, 01:23:44 pm
I have no stock in the RAM Controls business as their products are out of my ball park, but I'm confused as to why you are fulfilling orders that RAM Controls owe when you only bought "The only thing that is the same from David's time is the stock of the company and its intellectual property."  If that's the case, and you're business ID is not the same as Dave's, then why would you fulfill any of the orders that Dave and RAM Controls (circa Dave) is responsible for?  I understand good will buying credibility in the community, but, if that's the case, shouldn't you point that out from the beginning?   :dunno

That one's easy. There's no way Dan could sell this merchandise -- even under another company name -- without someone in the arcade collection/restoration/building community noticing it and publicizing it. Should Dan ever expect to have a long-term business relationship with members of this hobby, this is probably his only course of action.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 16, 2011, 01:24:03 pm
I'm confused as to why you are fulfilling orders that RAM Controls owe when you only bought "The only thing that is the same from David's time is the stock of the company and its intellectual property."  If that's the case, and you're business ID is not the same as Dave's, then why would you fulfill any of the orders that Dave and RAM Controls (circa Dave) is responsible for?

Yes, my questions exactly. Where is Dave Adams in all of this?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: smalltownguy on June 16, 2011, 01:25:16 pm
Where is Dave Adams in all of this?

Why would anyone care? That's a dead end road.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 16, 2011, 01:27:23 pm
Why would anyone care? That's a dead end road.

Not if Dave Adams still owns the business entity, which is what Dan seems to be saying. If Dave owns the business, he owns its liabilities.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 16, 2011, 01:28:51 pm
Where is Dave Adams in all of this?

Why would anyone care? That's a dead end road.

Really??
hes still ripping people off for these parts and still has access to them.

Its a small community Dave/Adam/Ram Controls.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Mikezilla on June 16, 2011, 01:36:00 pm
IS there a thread on the BYOAC forums about what happened before? I checked over on the KLOV forums, but I dont like how those threads read. Im with Frizzle on what has been transpiring, based on what I have read so far. So the guy screwed a bunch of people out of preorders, then pretended to be someone taking over, then screwed them again, and now there is a "new guy" doing it all over? Thats insane!

I did however think it was funny that one of the machine shops the guy uses is literally down the street from where I live. In San Diego.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 16, 2011, 01:39:26 pm
IS there a thread on the BYOAC forums about what happened before?

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=110148.0 (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=110148.0)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bkenobi on June 16, 2011, 01:40:30 pm
Where is Dave Adams in all of this?

Why would anyone care? That's a dead end road.
Well, that may be true, but it depends on the way the business was licensed.  There are a lot of ways to open a business and the debt and liability implications vary from one form to another as well as where the business is founded (different states, different laws).  My wife would be able to answer this better than I as I don't have an MBA, but I know that LLC's are different than SCorp etc.

In the end, Dave's name is on the business license, so he minimally has some limited liability.  In any case, if the business closes it's doors with people owed money, then the debtors don't follow the assets, they follow the business ID.  Thus, they would be owed by whoever has the financial obligation of Dave's RAM Controls business ID.  That's likely Dave.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Mikezilla on June 16, 2011, 01:42:40 pm
IS there a thread on the BYOAC forums about what happened before?

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=110148.0 (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=110148.0)

 :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: smalltownguy on June 16, 2011, 01:44:32 pm
Well, that may be true, but it depends on the way the business was licensed.  There are a lot of ways to open a business and the debt and liability implications vary from one form to another as well as where the business is founded (different states, different laws).  My wife would be able to answer this better than I as I don't have an MBA, but I know that LLC's are different than SCorp etc.

In the end, Dave's name is on the business license, so he minimally has some limited liability.  In any case, if the business closes it's doors with people owed money, then the debtors don't follow the assets, they follow the business ID.  Thus, they would be owed by whoever has the financial obligation of Dave's RAM Controls business ID.  That's likely Dave.

None of which matters, because Dan has made a public proclamation that he intends to take care of everyone who has been wronged. He stated it in his first post in this thread.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 01:45:28 pm
That is just one of many...

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 16, 2011, 01:49:58 pm
In the end, Dave's name is on the business license, so he minimally has some limited liability.  In any case, if the business closes it's doors with people owed money, then the debtors don't follow the assets, they follow the business ID.  Thus, they would be owed by whoever has the financial obligation of Dave's RAM Controls business ID.  That's likely Dave.


That is exactly what I've been talking about.  I didn't explain the concept like bkenobi did.  I was talking about the actual implications rather than the legal.  It is important to know who actually owns the business because the business owes money.  The inventory and IP of Ram Controls doesn't know anything to anybody.

FWIW, Dan and I have been emailing back and forth today, and I will let everybody know if a completed settlement happens.  That won't address everybody but it would be a positive report in this ugly situation.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 16, 2011, 01:55:17 pm
None of which matters, because Dan has made a public proclamation that he intends to take care of everyone who has been wronged. He stated it in his first post in this thread.

His original message also implied he was the owner of the company. Now he says he's not.

The owner of the business entity is the one who is legally liable and subject to prosecution for fraud.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 01:57:05 pm
Some of you are making the claim that I am Dave.. I refer you to the MANY post's Steph has made on KLOV that he has spoken to Dave and myself and he can verify that I am not in fact Dave. Shilmover who is on this board as well has made a similar post as he knows Dave well and has spoken to both him and myself on the phone and can verify that we are not the same person.

I am taking care of the past debts because it is good business. I am taking care of those who are owed past debts because it is the RIGHT thing to do. I am taking care of past customers because it is always easier to take care of past customers to keep a business alive than generate new customers.  It is my hope that some of those people I have taken care of will buy from me in the future, and you know it has worked. Some of those I have fulfilled orders for who were owed in the past have bought from me again and I have shipped their new orders quickly. As to why people who I have taken care of have not posted that fact on the forums, just look at the flames that are being fanned by certain people who are not owed anything by Ram Controls. Would you want to jump in to that fray???
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 02:00:56 pm
No one is saying you aren't taking care of past customers... because it seems like you are.

And I, for one,  do believe you are not Dave (based on a number of posts at KLOV).

But the bottom line is the bottom line.  RAM is a tainted company.  Until RAM has paid back every cent it ripped off people,  it will remain so.

I hope you can do it for the sake of those who've been ripped off... but it's NOT cool to solicit new business from the same community that the company you now own (that is what OWNER means in your signature on the emails,  right?) until past due debts have been satisfied.

Simple concept.

Why does it seem to be so hard to understand?

Hell,  I'd jump on your bandwagon had you SHUTTERED your website for new orders and put a statement up saying no new orders will be taken until past due debts have been satisfied.

But that's not going to happen... now is it?

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on June 16, 2011, 02:06:10 pm
To be fair to Frizz and Rikitiki, the last time that this happened in the community, people continued to get ripped off until those who weren't owed anything stepped up.

Having said that, if Steph says that Dan is not Dave, that is good enough for me.

I would, however, as a concerned member of the community like more details than perhaps Dan would like to share about what happened, what Dan's role has been in the past, etc. Also curious why not cut the cord, take the inventory and open a new business as "DAN Controls -- we got the inventory from RAM because Dave owed me money".

I have no dog in this fight except for some friends who are out of pocket and the good of the community.

/me still hopes that Dan can find a way to climb out of the hole that Dave dug

EDIT: I actually think I know why Dan didn't take the inventory ... because he really can't just pick assets of a company in trouble just because he knows the guy. There are rules as to how creditors are taken care of in situations like this (I'm in Canada, but I bet the rules are similar). I'll bet Dan thought that his (and everybody's) best chance to get even was to take it all on (and shield himself as best he can) and do what Dave couldn't ... run a business.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 16, 2011, 02:08:46 pm
Some of you are making the claim that I am Dave.. I refer you to the MANY post's Steph has made on KLOV that he has spoken to Dave and myself and he can verify that I am not in fact Dave. Shilmover who is on this board as well has made a similar post as he knows Dave well and has spoken to both him and myself on the phone and can verify that we are not the same person.

Do you work for or with Dave Adams? Does he have any access to the materials you acquired from him? And, is he receiving any money from any of your sales?

Quote
I am taking care of the past debts because it is good business. I am taking care of those who are owed past debts because it is the RIGHT thing to do. I am taking care of past customers because it is always easier to take care of past customers to keep a business alive than generate new customers.

Unless you are legally liable for the past debts, or a business partner for Dave Adams, your argument makes no sense whatsoever. If what you've said is true, and you did not buy the business from Dave Adams, you are basically risking a lot to try and rehabilitate someone else's business name (because that company committed fraud.)

EDIT: I want to clarify... I am a business owner, so I'm very well informed about liability issues. My adamant tone here is not to trash you, Dan, I just honestly don't understand what you're thinking to involve yourself actively in someone else's issues of fraud.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 02:16:16 pm
I know there was a lot of money owed by Dave when I took this thing over. I had an attorney draw up the paperwork to shield myself somewhat should this get out of control. The way it was structured is that I took over the assets, the intellectual property, and the web domain as payment for the debt he owed me. David does not own any part of my business or the stock. He has no control over my business or how I choose to run the Ram Controls brand. I do have an agreement where he will answer any questions I may have about the stock, past orders, and guidance to create new products. I do not come from an arcade background so I put it in the contract that he would provide this help. I do have regular contact with him by text message and occasionally via phone, but he is trying to put his life together and he knew he could not continue Ram Controls so this was the best possible solution. I pretty much felt I would never see any of my money back so I made the deal.

Spunkmeyer: He is NOT receiving money from sales. He and I have a contract where he helps me from time to time since I did not come from an arcade background. I have owned many games in my life (Spy Hunter, APB, Assault, Smash TV, SW Upright) I have never repaired them so I needed training on how to assemble the controllers, identify the parts, etc. If I came on the scene and tried selling Ram Controls parts people would make that connection pretty easily and I would still be in the same situation. I think that the brand name is worth salvaging and I am putting in the effort to do so. Some may not agree but that is my choice.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 16, 2011, 02:31:29 pm
It sounds like you are a creditor who secured assets as payment to forgive your own debts, but Dave Adams is still liable for all of the other business that was conducted by him, unless your agreement said you were assuming his debts as well.

I agree with CheffoJeffo that the best thing to do would be to open "DAN Controls" ... and Dave Adams should be held accountable for his own actions.

Don't think the RAM Controls brand name is in any way salvageable.

I know there was a lot of money owed by Dave when I took this thing over. I had an attorney draw up the paperwork to shield myself somewhat should this get out of control. The way it was structured is that I took over the assets, the intellectual property, and the web domain as payment for the debt he owed me. David does not own any part of my business or the stock. He has no control over my business or how I choose to run the Ram Controls brand. I do have an agreement where he will answer any questions I may have about the stock, past orders, and guidance to create new products. I do not come from an arcade background so I put it in the contract that he would provide this help. I do have regular contact with him by text message and occasionally via phone, but he is trying to put his life together and he knew he could not continue Ram Controls so this was the best possible solution. I pretty much felt I would never see any of my money back so I made the deal.

Spunkmeyer: He is NOT receiving money from sales. He and I have a contract where he helps me from time to time since I did not come from an arcade background. I have owned many games in my life (Spy Hunter, APB, Assault, Smash TV, SW Upright) I have never repaired them so I needed training on how to assemble the controllers, identify the parts, etc. If I came on the scene and tried selling Ram Controls parts people would make that connection pretty easily and I would still be in the same situation. I think that the brand name is worth salvaging and I am putting in the effort to do so. Some may not agree but that is my choice.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Ginsu Victim on June 16, 2011, 02:34:39 pm
Holy ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---, this thread gave me a headache.  :dizzy:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 16, 2011, 02:36:16 pm
I haven't been following this whole thing too closely, but if there are a number of major outstanding debts, then there is a very clear and prompt solution to taking care of this issue.

1) Pay off everything you can. Ship everything you can.

2) File for ch. 11 bankruptcy, because if you are not able to pay off or fulfill orders on everything right away, then only only reason for that is you as a company are bankrupt. Every screwed customer will file a claim with you through the courts and you will avoid the impending legal fees. The people getting screwed do not want to be forced into a legal battle either. The quicker you file for bankruptcy, the quicker everyone will get their money back, as opposed to being jerked around forever on this and in the end nobody wins.


Making promises to pay back past debts based on hopes for future profits is total BS.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: smalltownguy on June 16, 2011, 02:36:52 pm
I know there was a lot of money owed by Dave when I took this thing over. I had an attorney draw up the paperwork to shield myself somewhat should this get out of control. The way it was structured is that I took over the assets, the intellectual property, and the web domain as payment for the debt he owed me. David does not own any part of my business or the stock. He has no control over my business or how I choose to run the Ram Controls brand. I do have an agreement where he will answer any questions I may have about the stock, past orders, and guidance to create new products. I do not come from an arcade background so I put it in the contract that he would provide this help. I do have regular contact with him by text message and occasionally via phone, but he is trying to put his life together and he knew he could not continue Ram Controls so this was the best possible solution. I pretty much felt I would never see any of my money back so I made the deal.

FYI....I had questions about Dave's involvement with Dan, so I went to the source and emailed him directly, at 10:30am central time. At 1pm, 2 and 1/2 hours later, his response came back to my email, with the above mentioned text, word for word.

@ pinballjim> Can YOU make your own Lunar Lander thruster? I think the intellectual property here would be the supply chains, cad drawings, production run specs, injection molder contacts, etc.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Mikezilla on June 16, 2011, 02:37:04 pm
So wait, why did the guy do this, just to scam people and make the cash, or was he in trouble and needed it for something? How can you be in contact with him, since he is obviously a criminal? What is he doing now?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 02:37:20 pm
Absolutely not so..

What about the countless hours David and other engineers spent drawing up all of this stuff in Solid Works. What about the build documents that specify exactly where a certain part came from and how much it cost. What about the website with all of it's pictures and descriptions of parts. What about the contact info I have for vendors and past customers. That is all VERY much intellectual property. Intellectual property is defined on Wikipedia as:

Intellectual property (IP) is a term referring to a number of distinct types of creations of the mind for which a set of exclusive rights are recognized—and the corresponding fields of law.[1] Under intellectual property law, owners are granted certain exclusive rights to a variety of intangible assets, such as musical, literary, and artistic works; discoveries and inventions; and words, phrases, symbols, and designs. Common types of intellectual property include copyrights, trademarks, patents, industrial design rights and trade secrets in some jurisdictions.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: smalltownguy on June 16, 2011, 02:38:58 pm
See? Told you ;)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: (+_+) on June 16, 2011, 02:41:14 pm
Undeleted. It applies here too.

"There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — [pauses] — shame on you. Fool me — [pauses] — You can't get fooled again."

Hence, I guess you can't get fooled again.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 16, 2011, 02:43:17 pm

Wont Get Fooled Again (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rp6-wG5LLqE#)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 02:50:21 pm
Mikezilla,

No, most of the money he took in for pre-orders was to pay for the completion of future products. He also took on too many projects at once and ran into a number of issues in their production. As I understand it most of the money taken in for those SW cabinets was to have some company make a batch of XY monitors brand new. He was hoping to keep the cash flow going to get this HUGE batch of projects completed. At the same time he lost his engineering job and it all fell apart. He started using Ram Controls money to survive. He has a wife and five kids and sometimes being on the brink of homelessness when you have a big family will make people do things they should not do. I personally do not approve of the methods he used and I think it showed a serious lack of business ethics, but I cannot in any way know how I would react if in the same position.

Dan
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: smalltownguy on June 16, 2011, 02:51:35 pm
Just because the intellectual property isn't covered by patent or copyright doesn't mean it doesn't have VALUE.

Again I ask - can you fabricate your own Star Wars yoke? I know I can't. But if I had Dan's IP I could. That's valuable information.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 16, 2011, 02:53:06 pm
So your saying Dave has no conection to Ram or its inventory??
be careful becasue unless hes got a private stash I know this not to be true.
and he still continues to rip people off this is RECENTLY weeks not months ago.

still making claims art is done using orginal films and IP on copying someone elses work :laugh2:

its not rocket science they are joystick parts :banghead:

@smalltownguy and yeah I can fabrication shops are aplenty and theres lots of chineese who work cheap.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 02:53:11 pm
I was going to PM this but after Dans last response I figure I'll post it here...

Since we're all about coming clean here...

Here are some issues that should be addressed with YOUR website Dan:

1.

From the ABOUT US link:

Quote
Founded in 2004, RAM Controls produces quality reproduction controls for classic arcade games.  Our staff is made up of several experts in the arcade manufacturing industry, with extensive experience in electronics & mechanical R&D, manufacturing, repair and part sourcing.  Our key designers and production personnel have over 80 years of combined experience in the arcade business. RAM Controls strives for the utmost quality, and our reproduction controls and parts are made to strict quality standards, often much higher than those installed in the original games.

The very first production item from RAM Controls was a reproduction Major Havoc controller, originally designed by James Marous in 2000.  He came up with a solid design but, unfortunately, only manufactured a one-off for his own use.  A few years later, Mark Davidson of Basement Arcade produced a couple of runs of the same exact design and quickly sold out.  Having a personal need for one of these controls and nobody having them available, RAM Controls was conceived overnight.  Starting with James original design and making a few modifications, RAM Controls has produced a quality product which has some notable improvements.

Our next reproduction item was the Atari button cones, released June 2006.  Our design is an exact replica of the original anodized aluminum parts which Atari used in their early machines.  This includes all three versions:  short aluminum, short black, tall black.  All three of our versions are made from machined aluminum stock, tapped to exact spec, polished and anodized.  Both the short and tall black cones are hard black anodized.  Hard black anodizing offers an additional level of coating which is not likely to "rub off" as normal anodizing is prone to.  In other words, these are quality parts with a tough, sleek finish.  Compared to NOS anodized counterparts, ours are actually better looking.  Interestingly, another vendor started supplying the tall black cones at the exact same time we did.  This caused the infamous "cone wars" between them and at least one vendor we supplied with our parts.  The "cone wars" was a short lived situation which resulted in low prices for the end user.

I've bolded the problematic area...

The first paragraph is a bunch of crap.  RAM's staff consists of... YOU.  It was crap when Dave was running the show...unless he's 90+ years old.

And then right on the main page...

Quote
Founded in 2005, RAM Controls produces quality reproduction controls for classic arcade games.  Our staff is made up of several experts in the arcade manufacturing industry, with extensive experience in electronics & mechanical R&D, manufacturing, repair and part sourcing. Our key designers and production personnel have over 80 years of combined experience in the arcade business. RAM Controls strives for the utmost quality, and our reproduction controls and parts are made to strict quality standards, often much higher than those installed in the original games.


How can people take you seriously when you throw out the BS right on the main page?  At least you took down the photo of the "RAM FACILITIES" that used to run on the page...


Then there is the news item:

Quote
3/15/11 - Please welcome Dan Johnston to the staff here at Ram Controls. Dan has taken the helm of the mail-order and wholesale departments of the company. His primary responsibility is to make sure the mail order and wholesale customers are well taken care of.

So Dan... have you taken over the mail order/whole sale departments or do you now run the show?   May want to update this?

Quote
07/02/10 - Missile Command control panels and Lunar Lander control panels with artwork screened directly onto metal are in-process.  Due for completion in November.

Quote
08/15/10 - Lunar Lander mission select panel and mission select panel wood base are in-process and due for November delivery.

These news item is nice... were those control panels completed in November?  How about the LL panels?  Hmmm... wait.  This is your site now Dan (Was it 3/15 or 5/15 that you took over Dan,   you've mentioned BOTH dates)... why not go for ACCURACY over FLUFFY BS?

One would think that someone who recently took over a tainted company like RAM would ensure the website was as accurate as possible before trying to boost business... no?

EDIT: Dan... i feel bad for you.  I really do.  You could be...and probably are... the nicest guy around.  But the bottom line is that RAM is tainted... and there isn't going to be any comeback for RAM until everyone gets paid back.  Where does that put you?   I am not sure... but I sure as hell wouldn't want to be in your shoes.  You may want to consider suing your buddy rather than taking on this stinker of a situation... that is,  of course,  you're in to being beat the hell by the very people you're trying to market to.  Dave has tarnished the RAM name and like others have said,  I doubt it will EVER be something  you can pin to yourself with pride.  RAM has become synonymous with SCAM. 

I'd reconsider the DAN CONTROLS name personally...

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Mikezilla on June 16, 2011, 02:54:03 pm
Mikezilla,

No, most of the money he took in for pre-orders was to pay for the completion of future products. He also took on too many projects at once and ran into a number of issues in their production. As I understand it most of the money taken in for those SW cabinets was to have some company make a batch of XY monitors brand new. He was hoping to keep the cash flow going to get this HUGE batch of projects completed. At the same time he lost his engineering job and it all fell apart. He started using Ram Controls money to survive. He has a wife and five kids and sometimes being on the brink of homelessness when you have a big family will make people do things they should not do. I personally do not approve of the methods he used and I think it showed a serious lack of business ethics, but I cannot in any way know how I would react if in the same position.

Dan

Thank you for clarifying that. I asked because I had a guy I know rob a bank he worked at because one of his kids was kidnapped and he needed the money for the ransom. Yeah... Living next to mexico kind of sucks some times but hey, what are you gonna do?  :P
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 02:57:23 pm
FrizzleFried

Your right about the website, it really sucks.  I have been spending my time trying to take care of the major issues and really have not had the time to fix every thing that is wrong on the website. Since you helped me identify those issues Ill work to clean them up.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 16, 2011, 03:01:23 pm
If it's wrong, take the web site offline or remove the wrong pages temporarily.

And redesign it, so people know they are not dealing with Dave Adams anymore.


Your right about the website, it really sucks.  I have been spending my time trying to take care of the major issues and really have not had the time to fix every thing that is wrong on the website. Since you helped me identify those issues Ill work to clean them up.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 03:02:40 pm
Quote
So your saying Dave has no connection to Ram or its inventory??
be careful because unless hes got a private stash I know this not to be true.
and he still continues to rip people off this is RECENTLY weeks not months ago.

I cannot be absolutely sure that I have every scrap of inventory, in fact I know I don't. There is another guy who was selling off some of David's other crap and ended up with a few items of Ram Controls stock and was selling them on Ebay. I don't think he is doing it any more but I have not looked in like a week or so.

If there are other people selling Ram Controls stock, I want to know about it!!!!

Dan
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 16, 2011, 03:06:21 pm
not other people but DAVE himself just curious how connected he still is to this inventory/company.

on the webiste how are those ampliphones coming along??
and lets not stop fixing the site where frizz left off theres more lots more
it may have been better to just launch a new site. if wait dave tried that allready.

dont stop there
Star Wars Cockpit Control Panel Overlay (CPO)
Reverse screened onto .010" polycarbonate, textured matte finish with 3M adhesive backing. Made from original Atari films, colored matched to Atari spec.  Die cut from original Atari specification as well.  This is a modern day (superior) equivalent to the OEM decal.  Artwork is completely matched to OEM spec.

Atari Part # 040520-03
 $50  
 Star Wars Cockpit Canopy Decal Set (set of 6)
Decals located on left/right canopy "hoops" - 3 per side for a total of 6 decals.  Silk screened vinyl with 3M adhesive backing.  Made from original Atari films, colored matched to Atari spec.  Die cut from original Atari specification as well.  This is a modern day (superior) equivalent to the OEM decals.  Artwork is completely matched to OEM spec.

Atari Part # 040527-03
 $100  
 Star Wars Cockpit Display Housing Decal Set (set of 3)
Decals located on left/right/center of Display Housing for a total of 3 decals.  Reverse screened onto .010" polycarbonate, textured matte finish with 3M adhesive backing. Made from original Atari films, colored matched to Atari spec.  Die cut from original Atari specification as well.  This is a modern day (superior) equivalent to the OEM decal.  Artwork is completely matched to OEM spec.

Atari Part # 040382-05, 040532-04, 040532-06
 
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 03:25:03 pm
I am going to remove all of the references to the monitors, they are just cluttering the site anyway.

Can you give me some more insight to your statement about the artwork. I don't know too much about this product. How do you know that this was or was not the case? I am not disputing what you are said I just want to know why you say it.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 16, 2011, 03:33:43 pm
well for starters the films are currently in my possession
and have no intentions of screening them for RamControls
and Dave was told this numerous times as well as to remove that information.
I dont think I need to get into the details of the absolute ridiculas claims Dave was making and of his delusions of grandure.

Not to mention most of this artwork has allready been screened and is allready available.
with the final piece the sideart now in production.

Im assuming your IP came with who I am??
So how about those Lunar Lander and Missile comand control panels?
those must be small potatoes to the cockpits not quite ready.
and we still havnt heard that DAve dosnt have acess to the company/inventory??
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 04:00:11 pm
David has no access to my inventory. I am aware however that he has told a number of people that I have taken over Ram Controls and that orders are being shipped quickly. This might be the root of this issue. It is my understand that he has directed people to the website and told them to buy from me, but to the best of my knowledge he has not been selling any of the Ram Controls stock.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 04:02:32 pm
I have made a few changes to the website and I will be making more soon..
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: audiomidiman on June 16, 2011, 04:18:26 pm
Dan, time to step up and POST over at KLOV and not hide over here!
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 04:24:29 pm
I am not hiding but I only have a set number of hours per day to be on the forums. I was advised by a number of members of the community that I have corresponded with to start here and work into it. I will be making some posts on KLOV soon but there is only so much I can do at once.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 16, 2011, 04:49:23 pm
I have to say that was probably wise... as you're going to have a much easier time here than KLOV (if that tells ya just how much Dave ---fouled up beyond all recognition--- things up over at KLOV).

PS: Tell Mr. Adams "Friz says QUACK!" ... that thief will know exactly what I mean.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: WindDrake on June 16, 2011, 04:56:25 pm
I'm just glad someone has the grit to pick up that mess and try to make something worthwhile out of it.

I'm glad you're doing what you're doing, Dan. Once the debts with others are settled up, I'll look forward to RAM (or whatever you company decides it's name will be, if you decide to change it) making reproductions of other impossible-to-find things, headed up by an actually competent individual.

Good luck, and good on you for getting even this far with everything.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Malenko on June 16, 2011, 06:13:16 pm
LOUD NOISES!


G'luck Dan.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on June 16, 2011, 07:01:10 pm
Dan...

Something makes no sense to me, but you don't owe me an answer (I'm not a customer of RC):
Why did you assume debts of RAM controls rather than just buy up the inventory (for $XX minus what you were owed) and let Dave be sued?

Is RAM Controls incorporated? If not, then Dave is still liable AFAIK.


Also, I'd like to point out that the domain name records show the following:

Record expires on 21-Jun-2011
Record created on 21-Jun-2006
Database last updated on 28-Jun-2010


This means that the domain has NOT been transferred to you, otherwise the database update date would be more recent than almost a year ago.

You'd gain more faith by:
1. Opening your own business & website
2. Renewing the RAM domain, but set it to redirect to the new website
3. Open up the RAM domain registration info to 'public' so people can see it's truly been transferred (it's currently set to private)

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 16, 2011, 08:07:31 pm
I am not too concerned with what liabilities Dave has, that is really not my concern. If people can get blood out of that turnip I will commend them. My concern is to salvage the business, make things right with those owed, and release some new products.

As for the domain name issue, I have control of ramcontrols.com and ramcontrols.net which are on my registrar account already. I have access to the account where ram-controls.com is registered and am trying to move it over to my registration account right now. If I cant get it done by the time the domain expires at the current registrar I will just renew it for a year, but that is not my first choice. As for making the registration details public, I will politely say no. I have about a dozen domains for my other businesses all of which are privately registered and I am not about to change that.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: pinballwizard79 on June 16, 2011, 09:01:55 pm
Want to sell me a complete working USB yoke with decals for $250 shipped in order to regain trust in the community?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Delgar on June 16, 2011, 09:23:28 pm
Hello everyone,

I'm a lurker here but have been registered for 6 years and have been reading this site long before that.  I read this site often and have learned a lot from the posters here.

I also have some expertise in debtor/creditor laws including bankruptcy, and since I can finally comment on something here where I have knowledge, I will! For the purposes of this post I'll assume Dan is being truthful (and I believe he is).

What Dan has done will likely benefit the creditors of the former RAM Controls entity and the retro arcade community as a whole.  Dan's other option would have been to obtain a judgment and seize assets on that judgment, then selling the assets at auction or through a broker for pennies on the dollar.  If there were other registered creditors, they would have shared in the proceeds of the sale of those assets.  Those that were owed money but whom didn't sue and obtain judgment would have gotten nothing.  The know-how generated by Dave would have been lost.  I suspect Dan had a judgement or was close to getting one.  I say that because having read all the posts about RAM Controls over the years its clear Dave only acted when forced to do so, and for Dan to achieve what he has, he needed Dave's cooperation.  Dave probably cooperated once faced with real consequences instead of internet threats.  That's just a guess though.

The creditors of the old RAM Controls have the same rights against that legal entity as they do now.  Dan will have transferred the assets of the old RAM Controls into a new corporate entity which is legally free from the debts racked up under Dave's control.  As Dan stated, if you think you can get money out of Dave, go for it, but its like getting money out of a turnip, to use his words.  I would add that to get a judgment against Dave personally instead of his legal entity requires you to prove fraud, and while it seems there may have been fraud here, the bar is set high to prove that and its generally a hassle.

Dan appears to have been of the view that the value of the assets as an ongoing business were greater than the value of the assets breaking them up.  I think he's right, but it takes a lot of work to make the business work.

Dan can legally refuse to satisfy any and every creditor of the former RAM Controls entity.  He has chosen an alternative route, which is to try to salvage the reputation of RAM Controls by paying the creditors based upon profits from ongoing sales.  That's more than most would do.

Some in this thread are suggesting that Dan should take out a loan (or dip into his bank account), pay all the creditors up front, then carry on the business.  I suggest that is financially foolish, and were that Dan's only option, he would have simply obtained judgment, got a partial refund from the sale of assets, and walked away having learned a lesson like others have.  He's instead tried to make himself whole and in the process is trying to make the other creditors whole too.

He's making the best of a bad situation, and he should be encouraged not piled upon.  I've read complaints about RAM Controls for years and how people are going to sue him and make him act, but the only person who really achieved anything is Dan.  He deserves credit for taking action and not just complaining.

Well done Dan, I hope it works out for you.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 16, 2011, 10:53:23 pm
Obviously Delgar is a shill planted by Ram controls over 5 years ago to use at this precise moment. GET YOUR PITCHFORKS BOYS! We'll stop by Delgars place on our way to Ram Control headquarters!


Seriously, I'd be ok if RAM made good on all the back orders...  except Chads.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 16, 2011, 10:58:08 pm
@delgar thats the bigest crock Ive ever heard, and the sad part is its proably all true.
lets split things apart so much transfering entitys and properties so much that nobodys accountable.

like you said Dan has no legal resposblity to do so.
and basically good luck getting blood from a turnup.
god bless america and its loop hool thinking :angry:

lets fund everybody owed with 10 dollar tubes of nyogel and other misc parts in stock
Im sure those that paid thousands into cockpits will be happy to hear that.
 :applaud:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on June 16, 2011, 10:59:50 pm
Dan, what's your Ebay seller name?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: JustMichael on June 17, 2011, 02:05:12 am
He started using Ram Controls money to survive. He has a wife and five kids and sometimes being on the brink of homelessness when you have a big family will make people do things they should not do.

Hopefully the State of California will give Dave a nice "home"...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SavannahLion on June 17, 2011, 02:43:31 am
well for starters the films are currently in my possession
and have no intentions of screening them for RamControls
and Dave was told this numerous times as well as to remove that information.
I dont think I need to get into the details of the absolute ridiculas claims Dave was making and of his delusions of grandure.

Hang on here.... Going O.T.

Are you the dude who snagged crazy amounts of old Atari materials when Atari closed their headquarters? I recall someone snagging oodles of manuals, memos, films and pallets of other stuff. I know he started scanning and posting the more interesting bits but since a particular install of an annoying OS that shall remain nameless decided to barf all over my files I haven't been able to recover the URL or the name of the person.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Ragtag83 on June 17, 2011, 03:12:59 am
Outside perspective:

Dave screwed over many people. Ram Controls lost all respect in the community. The community demands repayment. - I understand this.

Dan aquires the company after vague legal mumble jumble i don't understand. Instead of running with whatever repayment he could have made he decides to attempt to salvage Ram Controls, worth it or not is one's own opinion and only time will tell who is correct. Dan also decides, to accomplish this, he should do his best to repay those that are owed. - I also understand this

What I don't understand is the argument against him. Yes, if he was indeed Dave, it would make sense but all evidence says he is not. Alright. Next argument I see is why? Why didn't he grab what money he could and run? Maybe I am naive, but is there no one left with good business ethics out there any more? I think it will help recover the business in respect to the community and is just the right thing to do.  Changing the name would have only made things worse in my opinion. It would come out where the inventory came from and all hell to pay from the community from there. Also I see argument of advertisement. I admit, I don't scour this site but I do love it, I have seen no advertisment but only an attempt to right past wrongs that are not Dan's. People demand things be made right and rightfully so. But why argue to the one that is currently attempting to do so. I am not saying that he will right all wrongs or will indeed accomplish what he says, but as of now, the evidence says that is the direction.

I guess what I am really wondering is if Dan was able to grab all of the inventory and sell it with no connection to Ram Controls would anyone have a problem with that? That no one will get repayed for what was owed.  The inventory would dry up. How is that any better than what he is currently doing it? I doubt my confusion is being portrayed in my post but I just don't get the argument against Dan. Makes absolutely no sense other than an anger to company that really doesn't exsist any more.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 17, 2011, 08:42:36 am
Ragtag, This is another outside perspective, but there would be no issue as soon as people get their money back or get their product owed. From my understanding, there is no inventory on a number of product that were ordered. The issue is that people were screwed, and they haven't got anything yet. Talk is worthless, and Dan will just have to prove himself, that's all.

He has the opportunity to turn things completely around, and nobody will show any anger once he sets things straight. It is understandable why everyone is once bitten, twice shy.

From the way I see it, it would take a day to cut refund checks, and only a few weeks max to ship out all the inventory owed if it exists. We will see if that happens.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: milkit on June 17, 2011, 09:28:51 am
one thing that confuses me...

you say you took over ram controls because he owed you $25k worth of stuff. Yet you also say you aren't from an arcade background.. so why were you dealing with RAM?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Malenko on June 17, 2011, 09:32:28 am
one thing that confuses me...

you say you took over ram controls because he owed you $25k worth of stuff. Yet you also say you aren't from an arcade background.. so why were you dealing with RAM?

I took it as he bought stock, as an investment.

Dan, what about the money Ram controls owed to people like GameRoom mag for advertising? Im pretty sure him not paying is what was the nail in the coffin of that awesome mag (well, it needed more pinball too)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 17, 2011, 09:33:36 am
Seriously, I'd be ok if RAM made good on all the back orders...  except Chads.


You're out of luck.  I already have a tracking number.   :oldman

Dan has been fully reasonable in private conversation.  We had a long and civil conversation about Ram Controls' legacy.  I am fairly convinced this will all work out.  Of course, I had high hopes for the last "new guy" brought in to salvage Ram Controls, and he did nothing but stretch people out via empty promises.  This doesn't feel like that did.  I'll post again when the parts arrive from Dan.  So far, in my direct experience, Dan has been everything he says he means to be.

That was a great post from Delgar.  Thanks for the expert opinion.  I was one of the ones who mentioned that he could issue all of the refunds out of his own pocket.  Note that I did also say it wouldn't be the most viable option for Dan.  I was pointing out that there are options besides new orders here.  The "if you don't give him new business then nobody gets refunds" pressure is not the only way.



Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SuprSprint on June 17, 2011, 10:12:27 am
I am not too concerned with what liabilities Dave has, that is really not my concern. If people can get blood out of that turnip I will commend them. My concern is to salvage the business, make things right with those owed, and release some new products.

You would do well to be *very* concerned about what happens with Dave. Your contracts with Dave don't mean a hill of beans here.  When a business engaged in fraud dumps assets, especially large percentages of the total assets, the court can (and often does) seize those assets until the issue is resolved. Also, unless you paid fair market value the court will likely go over your transaction with a microscope to see if you were unfairly enriched. And if they feel you were, they may well seek to enjoin you in the case as a co-conspirator.

At the very least, you stand find yourself owning nothing more than a domain name, an empty warehouse, and a pile of debt.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: smalltownguy on June 17, 2011, 10:38:53 am
Apparently Dan's an exceptionally busy business man with all the time in the world to post on forums and respond to e-mail from Chad. 

 :applaud:

He responded quickly to my requests too.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Zakk on June 17, 2011, 10:44:31 am
I am not too concerned with what liabilities Dave has, that is really not my concern. If people can get blood out of that turnip I will commend them. My concern is to salvage the business, make things right with those owed, and release some new products.

You would do well to be *very* concerned about what happens with Dave. Your contracts with Dave don't mean a hill of beans here.  When a business engaged in fraud dumps assets, especially large percentages of the total assets, the court can (and often does) seize those assets until the issue is resolved. Also, unless you paid fair market value the court will likely go over your transaction with a microscope to see if you were unfairly enriched. And if they feel you were, they may well seek to enjoin you in the case as a co-conspirator.

At the very least, you stand find yourself owning nothing more than a domain name, an empty warehouse, and a pile of debt.



Legal advice from a first time bandwagon poster!  Well at least we now know KLOV people have smelled blood in the water.   :laugh2:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: milkit on June 17, 2011, 10:53:27 am
one thing that confuses me...

you say you took over ram controls because he owed you $25k worth of stuff. Yet you also say you aren't from an arcade background.. so why were you dealing with RAM?

I took it as he bought stock, as an investment.

Dan, what about the money Ram controls owed to people like GameRoom mag for advertising? Im pretty sure him not paying is what was the nail in the coffin of that awesome mag (well, it needed more pinball too)

he said in first post that like many people, dave owed him money. $25k. so, why did dave owe him 25 grand if this guy doesnt have an arcade background is my question. why else would an arcade company owe him that
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Zakk on June 17, 2011, 11:02:14 am
one thing that confuses me...

you say you took over ram controls because he owed you $25k worth of stuff. Yet you also say you aren't from an arcade background.. so why were you dealing with RAM?

I took it as he bought stock, as an investment.

Dan, what about the money Ram controls owed to people like GameRoom mag for advertising? Im pretty sure him not paying is what was the nail in the coffin of that awesome mag (well, it needed more pinball too)

he said in first post that like many people, dave owed him money. $25k. so, why did dave owe him 25 grand if this guy doesnt have an arcade background is my question. why else would an arcade company owe him that

Cocaine.  duh. 
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: milkit on June 17, 2011, 11:20:17 am

Also, I'd like to point out that the domain name records show the following:

Record expires on 21-Jun-2011
Record created on 21-Jun-2006
Database last updated on 28-Jun-2010


This means that the domain has NOT been transferred to you, otherwise the database update date would be more recent than almost a year ago.

the who is info actually does show a change on june 9

   Updated Date: 09-jun-2011
   Creation Date: 07-jul-2006
   Expiration Date: 07-jul-2012
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 17, 2011, 11:43:47 am
 :censored:
one thing that confuses me...

you say you took over ram controls because he owed you $25k worth of stuff. Yet you also say you aren't from an arcade background.. so why were you dealing with RAM?

I took it as he bought stock, as an investment.

Dan, what about the money Ram controls owed to people like GameRoom mag for advertising? Im pretty sure him not paying is what was the nail in the coffin of that awesome mag (well, it needed more pinball too)

he said in first post that like many people, dave owed him money. $25k. so, why did dave owe him 25 grand if this guy doesnt have an arcade background is my question. why else would an arcade company owe him that
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on June 17, 2011, 11:46:04 am
the who is info actually does show a change on june 9

   Updated Date: 09-jun-2011
   Creation Date: 07-jul-2006
   Expiration Date: 07-jul-2012
Ah yes. That would be for ramcontrols.com, which redirects to ram-controls.com

ram-controls.com is the one expiring soon and that doesn't show any update since 2010.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: saint on June 17, 2011, 12:06:52 pm
one thing that confuses me...

you say you took over ram controls because he owed you $25k worth of stuff. Yet you also say you aren't from an arcade background.. so why were you dealing with RAM?

I took it as he bought stock, as an investment.

Dan, what about the money Ram controls owed to people like GameRoom mag for advertising? Im pretty sure him not paying is what was the nail in the coffin of that awesome mag (well, it needed more pinball too)

he said in first post that like many people, dave owed him money. $25k. so, why did dave owe him 25 grand if this guy doesnt have an arcade background is my question. why else would an arcade company owe him that

If I recall correctly, he didn't say he didn't have arcade machines, just that he wasn't an arcade tech.

Guys (not directed at anyone in particular), keep this civil please. Snarky comments are not helpful. Speak your mind if you're pro or con, but civility please. Thanks!

--- saint
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 17, 2011, 12:08:38 pm
(not directed at anyone in particular)

FRIZ GOT IN TROUBLE!  ;D
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 17, 2011, 12:11:21 pm
civility please


I nominate this for Friz' custom title.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on June 17, 2011, 12:12:32 pm
(not directed at anyone in particular)

FRIZ GOT IN TROUBLE!  ;D

Usually I read "not directed at anyone in particular" as being directed at me ... or Xiaou ... but I think rew hit this nail on the head.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: milkit on June 17, 2011, 12:20:01 pm
one thing that confuses me...

you say you took over ram controls because he owed you $25k worth of stuff. Yet you also say you aren't from an arcade background.. so why were you dealing with RAM?

I took it as he bought stock, as an investment.

Dan, what about the money Ram controls owed to people like GameRoom mag for advertising? Im pretty sure him not paying is what was the nail in the coffin of that awesome mag (well, it needed more pinball too)

he said in first post that like many people, dave owed him money. $25k. so, why did dave owe him 25 grand if this guy doesnt have an arcade background is my question. why else would an arcade company owe him that

If I recall correctly, he didn't say he didn't have arcade machines, just that he wasn't an arcade tech.

Guys (not directed at anyone in particular), keep this civil please. Snarky comments are not helpful. Speak your mind if you're pro or con, but civility please. Thanks!

--- saint


well, he said " I do not come from an arcade background " which to me seems odd that he had been owed $25k in arcade parts. having some machines doesnt warrant that much $ out, unless it was for something totally unrelated
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 17, 2011, 12:20:19 pm
Usually I read "not directed at anyone in particular" as being directed at me ... or Xiaou ... but I think rew hit this nail on the head.


I think he's turning Japanese I think he's turning Japanese I really think so.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SuprSprint on June 17, 2011, 12:22:00 pm
Legal advice from a first time bandwagon poster!  Well at least we now know KLOV people have smelled blood in the water.

And I caught a troll on my very first cast. Nice!  :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on June 17, 2011, 12:26:17 pm
Legal advice from a first time bandwagon poster!  Well at least we now know KLOV people have smelled blood in the water.

And I caught a troll on my very first cast. Nice!  :cheers:

Best hold on to your rod ...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 17, 2011, 12:59:06 pm
well for starters the films are currently in my possession
and have no intentions of screening them for RamControls
and Dave was told this numerous times as well as to remove that information.
I dont think I need to get into the details of the absolute ridiculas claims Dave was making and of his delusions of grandure.

Hang on here.... Going O.T.

Are you the dude who snagged crazy amounts of old Atari materials when Atari closed their headquarters? I recall someone snagging oodles of manuals, memos, films and pallets of other stuff. I know he started scanning and posting the more interesting bits but since a particular install of an annoying OS that shall remain nameless decided to barf all over my files I haven't been able to recover the URL or the name of the person.

No Im not the owner of nor was the person who aquired all the Atari art and memos
But I am currently printing this art from those SW films and have been for the past year or so
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 17, 2011, 02:25:26 pm
(not directed at anyone in particular)

FRIZ GOT IN TROUBLE!  ;D


May I direct your attention to the quote in my sig (specifically the last sentence).  It applies here as well.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on June 17, 2011, 02:41:37 pm
well, he said " I do not come from an arcade background " which to me seems odd that he had been owed $25k in arcade parts.
Did he say he was owed parts? I thought he said he was owed cash. He might even be owed rent or value related to other activities. We shouldn't assume it was parts.

I think he should post his Ebay Power Seller account name so people can check his feedback history. A good feedback might go a long way toward assuaging any fears of this "new management".
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 17, 2011, 02:45:38 pm

If you go back this thread is nearly impossible to follow now thanks to all of the edits that happened 5 posts after the fact.  Way too many people are editing after hitting post rather than before.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 17, 2011, 03:00:19 pm
The debt Dave owed me has nothing to do with the arcade industry. I have known Dave for a very long time and his debt to me is for other business ventures that I put money into and were never repaid. There is a statute of limitation that covers even written contracts and that time was approaching so I figured this was the best way to get 'something' for that debt. I knew he owed a lot of money to a lot of people but I was not aware of the scope of the problem when I made this deal with him. That being said, I did the deal and now I have to live with it and make the best of all of this I can. Some of you told me that I should have immediately changed the name well I believe all of you would have seen through that and I made decisions based on the information I had at the time. Hindsight is always 20-20 and given the facts that I know know I would have definitely done things differently but it is what it is. 
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: matsadona on June 17, 2011, 03:11:00 pm
It is a bit amazing that the people crying most about the whole thing is people that have not done any business with RAM controls, less have been screwed.
People that has been screwed are of course entitled to yell about what a bad person Dave (or whomever it was behind that company before) and that they want their money back. Strangely there hasn't been many of those who surfaced here yet.

Now we have a situation that somebody stepped in and took over not only the stock, but also some of the business. As it appears it also seems that this person is trying to help thoose who has been screwed by the previous owner. He had no obligation what so ever to do that. As stated before, he could just put it all on ebay and try to do as much profit as possible, to reclaim his debt from Dave.
Now, he is trying to salvage the business and keep the parts accessible to the comunity and also has the intention to keep up the business in the future.
It is amazing that more people are bashing than supporting him. I really thought that this communit was more supportive than that.

Of course, in the best of worlds Dan had a lot of cash and paid back all debts. Not because of that he has to, just because he has the intention to reclaim a good reputation of a business that hopefully will be successful in the future and bring more parts to the arcade community.

Give him some slack and a fair chance to show he is the real deal. It might take 1, 2 or maybe 6 months before he has enough time and cahsflow worked out to go through all back orders. I think that is just fine, if the alternative is to be screwed forever by Dave.
If he can do some paralell business with new customers, to both guarantee future business and the continued back orders delivered that should be fine too.

It would be more constructive if those with delivered back orders step forward rather than having the same person spamming this thread with constant wining about how tainted the company and pourly updated the webpage is.

So once again - what is the best situation for those with backorders/debts and the comunity in total?
* everything goes down the drain and a lot of people will be screwed forever and no more part available
* somebody actually gets a fair chance to make things right (even if it take some time before everybody is happy)

Of course, everybody is entitled to an opinion, and as a soldier it is my job to make sure you are also allowed to express it. But some songs are getting old here now. We all know already that Dave messed up and that he ows a lot of money to a lot of people. That is history. Pleae look forward and help Dan to help others!
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 17, 2011, 03:24:42 pm
And just to keep this info within easy access:

If you are owed something from Ram Controls please send me an email at:

sales@ram-controls.com

and I will work to take care of you. I have a business plan that includes compensating all buyers of Ram Controls items EVEN those who purchased the ill fated Star Wars Cabinets. This will take time to implement and I will cover more details of this plan soon. I have a lawyer, CPA and other past business executives helping me with this but I need to make sure I have the details correct before I make a bunch of public posts about it. I am already in a rough situation I do not need to make it worse by shooting myself in the foot. The best thing to do if you are owed something is send me an email and start the conversation going.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: newmanfamilyvlogs on June 17, 2011, 04:28:20 pm
So let me get this straight... Duke Nukem Forever has actually been released AND Ram Controls looks like it has a future?


We are so doomed.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on June 17, 2011, 04:58:52 pm
So let me get this straight... Duke Nukem Forever has actually been released AND Ram Controls looks like it has a future?


We are so doomed.

 :laugh2:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 17, 2011, 05:14:59 pm
I have a business plan that includes compensating all buyers of Ram Controls items EVEN those who purchased the ill fated Star Wars Cabinets. This will take time to implement and I will cover more details of this plan soon.

Just as long as this business plan does not involve time shares in Tijuana, selling sets of knives and encyclopedias, or a wealthy prince in Nigeria, we can't wait to hear about your plan!   ;)  8)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Cakemeister on June 17, 2011, 11:34:49 pm
I will be following your career with great interest.....
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: pinballwizard79 on June 17, 2011, 11:50:20 pm
Personally I think a review of IP addresses on this thread would be quite interesting.

I sometimes secretly think we live in the matrix & Saint is not only himself here but also Xiaou2, Dave Foley, Christian, Ram Controls, Pixel Hugger, Fritz, that woodcarving girl & when unable to figure out plywood sheets Chad too.....

You know, to keep things interesting  ;D

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Woodshop Flunky on June 18, 2011, 12:03:25 am
Personally I think a review of IP addresses on this thread would be quite interesting.

I sometimes secretly think we live in the matrix & Saint is not only himself here but also Xiaou2, Dave Foley, Christian, Ram Controls, Pixel Hugger, Fritz, that woodcarving girl & when unable to figure out plywood sheets Chad too.....

You know, to keep things interesting  ;D



 :laugh2: Love it!
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 18, 2011, 02:33:08 am
I am not Friz!

-saint
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Hoopz on June 18, 2011, 08:53:13 am
I will be following your career with great interest.....
Nice reference!   :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: taylormadelv on June 18, 2011, 10:05:23 am
It is SO RARE that I AGREE with Frizzle that you know something is very fishy going on here. First off, I hope that people in the arcade community can show some solidarity in NOT ordering from RC until all the people that were ripped off get restitution, PERIOD. Look, I understand just how "hard up" one can become for  very difficult/impossible to find parts but this particular situation deserves another level of tact here. Ordering more stuff from RC just grinds more salt into the wounds of those ripped off, really think this through.
Another thing, when "Dan" has sold off his inventory of MH rollers and SW Yokes, where do you expect to get more built? From Dave, really??? So Dan must still be buying more stuff from Dave, since nobody else makes those parts.
If Frizz and I agre on ANYTHING, something is going on.....
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: TheShanMan on June 18, 2011, 12:28:09 pm
The sad thing to me in all of this is how it divides the community. I'm really not a fan of the name calling ("you'd have to be an idiot...", etc) or putting people on a "do not deal with" list as we have been seeing, particularly on klov. But at the same time it's hard to argue with some of the arguments being made on that side of the fence. There's no question that RAM is tainted. Whether Dan fixes that or perpetuates that will ultimately be seen in time. I hope he does fix it but by no means do I have full confidence in that. I hope that no one puts in any expensive orders because I don't want to see the list of screwed people balloon in 3 or 6 months. But on the other hand, personally I'm content to sit on the sidelines and watch things play out. If some people decide to place orders (I hope small ones, like < $50) and that gives Dan the cash flow to gradually take care of more people who are owed products and/or refunds, then I'm happy to see progress gradually made. But that hinges on whether or not Dan is legit, and that is obviously a big "if" at this point, which again is why I hope people don't jump in with both feet right away, placing $100, $200, $1000 orders (start small and slowly work up to bigger stuff as trust is gained). And that's also why I worry about people outside of the online community who don't know what's happened still being able to jump in and place expensive orders.

Dan, if you're legit, I think it's in your best interest to distance yourself from Dave as much as possible as fast as possible. As long as you're dependent on Dave for technical information or whatnot, it's going to be that much harder for people to support what's going on. And that certainly includes a major revamping of the website (not just change a little wording here or there) as well as not operating under the RAM name. Have the website redirect to a different one. If you're insistent on perpetuating the RAM brand, how about using it just in product names like "RAM SW Yoke" rather than using it as the business name and website? And on that note, it seems you've muddied the water regarding the degree to which you own the RAM company. I think it would behoove you to make that crystal clear even if it means introducing a little legal mumbo jumbo into the discussion. Finally, you mentioned being an ebay seller. Well why not start doing a lot of your selling of RAM products (if not all) on ebay where customers will have more protection and doubters and fence sitters can see your feedback? Include an obvious reference to your ebay store on your website so people can easily connect the dots and see the evidence of how legit you are. Since it's hard to hide there it would seem to be your fastest route to gaining trust.

Time for me to go back into lurk mode, sitting on the fence to quietly watch what happens with great interest, hope, and fear.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: WareWolF on June 18, 2011, 01:15:40 pm
Well I decided to give this guy a good faith chance and ordered a SW Yoke USB interface.  I expect either one of three things will happen.  

1) Order cancelled-not in stock,  2) Order actually shipped and recv'd in 2 weeks,  3) screwed out of $70.00.

Will report back.   #3 is assumed if no action after two weeks and is not convertable to #1 or #2 even if resolved.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 18, 2011, 02:34:50 pm
Well I decided to give this guy a good faith chance and ordered a SW Yoke USB interface.  I expect either one of three things will happen.  

1) Order cancelled-not in stock,  2) Order actually shipped and recv'd in 2 weeks,  3) screwed out of $70.00.

Will report back.   #3 is assumed if no action after two weeks and is not convertable to #1 or #2 even if resolved.


unbo-leavable :banghead:

and the circle of life continues.....
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: taylormadelv on June 18, 2011, 03:31:31 pm
This is exactly why RC is still doing business, peeps just HAVE to have SW yoke parts.:facepalm:
When I personally finally read that ALL the SW Cockpit people have been made good, with actual testimonials; then I will believe that RC has come clean. If Dan took over, then he took the responsibilty of making those unshipped cabinet orders good. I still have not read that they have been made good. Since the guy that cuts the wood for the cabinets and the two guys that make the artwork are not doing(or will ever do) anything for RC, it sure looks like a big chunk of CASH will have to be refunded.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on June 18, 2011, 09:09:10 pm
(Warning! Gratuitous use of the phrase “Screwing” ahead! Not for the faint of heart.)
I recognize that I am fairly new here, so my post will mostly be devalued or dismissed because I can’t have an opinion without having been here for years and years. But I had to say something. Having read this thread in its entirety, I disagree with a lot of what’s being said here.
It will be said that I wasn’t here, I didn’t personally experience it blah blah, but I’m pretty sure I get the gist of it. This dude (Dave), from this company name (Ram controls) took a lot of money, and delivered little/no product, right? Lies, stealing, lawsuits and all that?
I don’t need a deep background in arcade building/dealing to be able to understand financial screwery (you like that word?) It’s done in every form of business possible, so the people who were screwed here are not exclusive as far as screwing goes.
So, the situation as I see it, is
Dave/ram controls screwed you all out of money.
Dave/ram controls screwed Dan out of money.
Dan gets Ram controls as restitution for his personal screwing.
At this point, Dan doesn’t owe anybody anything. He didn’t steal from you, he doesn’t owe you anything. He got his piece of the pie back from Dave, and technically all the others who were stolen from are still owed by Dave.
Dan has options here; let’s look at the options and consequences of each.
Dan scuttles the ship, sells it off in auction, doesn’t actually make his restitution back and is still out of money from Dave. (remember, this business is HIS payment for a 25K dept. Selling it like this is NOT going to get him 25k back.) (everyone else who was owed gets nothing.)
Dan changes the name of Ram Controls to Dan Controls. Is this really an option? He was INSTANTLY (and still is, after being confirmed as a different person) accused of still being Dave. If he started selling Ram stock, would ANYBODY really believe he was Dan of Dan Controls, and not just Dave changing his business name? As vehemently as people on here are campaigning against Dan now, it would be 10 times worse if he tried to sneak by with the same stock under a new name. NOBODY would trust this action. Again, everyone else owed gets nothing
Dan sells his stuff independently, not as a shop, on ebay. He would make a decent amount of money this way, probably even his debt amount back. People might suspect the ebay name was in fact Dave, but it would be hard to argue that when his feedback is consistently good as items were continuously being sold and shipped. Again, people who were robbed get nothing.
These were all options people suggested, and they all result in either profit to none, or only profit to Dan. With the amount of grief he is getting, these options don’t even sound so terrible.
But Dan took a higher route, and decided to try and make things right. He’s coming out, open and honest, and I’ve seen no actual negative feedback from his efforts thus far. We technically have no reason to distrust a person who has been proven to be different from the one that robbed you.
He kept the name, and that seems to be a huge point of contention. I get that, you distrust the very concept of Ram Controls, and that’s understandable. But what are his options? The ones above. Keeping the name is assuming the responsibility and problems that come with it. He did this understanding this fact.
People say he should make no money until everything is paid back. This is absurd. If Dave screwed you out of tons of money, and screwed Dan out of tons of money, doesn’t that make him you? If you all want your piece of the pie back, where is Dan’s piece of the pie? Is he really expected to inherit the business only to turn around and even go into complete debt himself to fix the problem Dave created? That doesn’t seem fair, or sensical to me.
The road he is taking is the ONLY choice that could be made to A: Get Dan what he is owed. And B: Get the people who were screwed what they are owed. To me, it looks like he is trying. Maybe he will be proven to be a thief and a liar himself, I’m not going to say this is impossible. And sure, you don’t have to trust him… yet, but he is really doing the only thing he can possibly do to make things right for EVERYBODY (himself included).
This is a very precarious situation, for all parties involved. I’m not saying go all in, but at least give him a fair shake. Ram controls was once a decent company that offered a lot of custom rare products. People still want those products, they just don’t like the brand.
Why hasn’t he stepped up on KLOV? Are you reading the responses here? Let him test the piranhas of the Nile before braving the great whites of the Pacific. (It’s no hotdogs/trampoline but a decent enough metaphor, right?)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: GibsonRiddler on June 18, 2011, 09:19:40 pm
 :applaud:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Ragtag83 on June 18, 2011, 10:28:56 pm
Hmmmm, a logical statement.  :applaud:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: stan2323 on June 18, 2011, 10:41:45 pm
 :applaud: :applaud: :applaud: :applaud: :applaud:

Now I got to put my 2 cents in.
 
You can take it for what it is worth because I am owed nothing by RAM Controls, bought nothing from Dan or Dave, but I do want some products DAN sells and I will get them when I feel the time is right. 

So far Dan is doing well.  He is shipping what people buy and making good to others that got shafted.  He may be a crook in sheep’s clothing but we have no proof yet and a crook would not have taken on the task of making good to others that got shafted.  I ask has anyone been shafted by DAN yet?  If so tell us I want to know before I buy something from him.  The way I see it he owes the others that got shafted nothing.  He is trying to help them and save a niche business.  That shows he has the moral courage to take the high road.  The community needs more people like him and this niche business. 

People who are owed nothing need to sit back, wait, and reserve judgment.  People who are against doing business with him until everyone is paid back go ahead and sit on your high horse, buy nothing from him.  Problem solved.
   
Too many people get too upset about what other people do when they are not involved.  Everyone needs to make up their own mind and decide what they feel is the right thing to do, then do it.  Let others do what they feel is the right thing to do.  We live in a country that allows people to make their own decisions.   

Stan     
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 18, 2011, 10:50:13 pm
(Warning! Gratuitous use of the phrase “Screwing” ahead! Not for the faint of heart.)

I think what you said was well laid out. Those who have seen the screwing before and swear it will happen again with Dan, do not believe Dan got screwed out of any money and is just a friend or hired gun of Dave to make the "scam" work this time. They could in the end be right, but I personally don't think that makes any sense. Dan has stopped all stupid business practices that reek of scam, yet those are the ones that allow one enough time to screw a lot of people out of money before running for the hills. Things like prepay for products not yet completed or store credit sales, stuff like that. Then again, I am fairly new to collecting and just got my license to post here and have been on KLOV for a few months so as you said some think I am not even entitled to an opinion. I think people should obviously be careful, but I think it is beneficial to be open minded. The alternative is Dan goes away and those owed are never repaid unless they proceed with legal action that will likely cost them more than they are owed.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on June 18, 2011, 11:02:19 pm
I think the shenanigans will be called wayyyy before any scam could be worth it.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 18, 2011, 11:55:50 pm
Many have wondered how I ever hope to take care of all of those who are owed. Here is one little piece of the puzzle.

I have in my possession the parts to build 200 Star Wars Yokes. I do have to have several parts welded and powder coated but I have all of the parts to make them.  At the current retail price of $350 that works out to $70K, MUCH more than the debt that is outstanding. And that is just ONE item. It takes me about two hours to build each one so the the only limitation right now is my time. I am fortunate enough to have a fiance that wants to help and understands how to build these controllers so it is not just me.  I am also working to complete several of the projects that Dave started, specifically the BZ bellows, the Tempest Spinner, and the SD - MH conversion boards.  Believe me there is more than enough assets in the company to take care of everyone, it will just take time.

Dan

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 19, 2011, 01:05:59 am
  Believe me there is more than enough assets in the company to take care of everyone, it will just take time.

While this is a great final goal, paying one person off who is owed a cockpit as a start would go a very long way to proving the legitimacy of your intentions. This I would think would not require a great influx of cash orders or some kind of business loan.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bradx on June 19, 2011, 01:43:15 am
i have a new business slogan for your website:

"RAM controls, slowly paying back the people we defrauded, one at a time as orders come in to fund it."

LOL
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 19, 2011, 02:31:47 am
i have a new business slogan for your website:

"RAM controls, slowly paying back the people we defrauded, one at a time as orders come in to fund it."

LOL

 :blah: As far as we know, Dan has yet to defraud anyone, so that statement wouldn't quite fit! Again, the options are slowly, but surely or not at all. I would think those who lost money would rather have slowly, but surely. Maybe I'm wrong. Did you lose out?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bradx on June 19, 2011, 02:37:24 am
bp leaked a bunch of oil into the gulf of mexico.  afterwards, they got a new CEO.  so now did BP not leak a bunch of oil into the gulf of mexico?

ram controls defrauded a bunch of people.  afterwards, the company was transferred from dave to dan.  so now did ram controls not defraud a bunch of people?

"RAM controls, slowly paying back the people we defrauded, one at a time as orders come in to fund it."

if the shoe fits...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: amendonz on June 19, 2011, 02:57:05 am
I just hope frizzle fried gets the respect he has deserved for so long.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 19, 2011, 03:00:10 am
bp leaked a bunch of oil into the gulf of mexico.  afterwards, they got a new CEO.  so now did BP not leak a bunch of oil into the gulf of mexico?

ram controls defrauded a bunch of people.  afterwards, the company was transferred from dave to dan.  so now did ram controls not defraud a bunch of people?

"RAM controls, slowly paying back the people we defrauded, one at a time as orders come in to fund it."

if the shoe fits...

That's just silly! I don't think anyone has said RAM has not defrauded anyone. So far I have no problem with either BPs new CEO or Dan. I do still believe both companies should make the people affected whole again.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bradx on June 19, 2011, 03:10:00 am
i am glad you agree it is an accurate statement.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bradx on June 19, 2011, 03:10:35 am
I just hope frizzle fried gets the respect he has deserved for so long.
i respect him.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on June 19, 2011, 04:31:08 am
bp leaked a bunch of oil into the gulf of mexico.  afterwards, they got a new CEO.  so now did BP not leak a bunch of oil into the gulf of mexico?

Maybe if the entirety of the staff of BP were changed out, leaving only a new owner and the name, and the new owner began making reparations as well as he can, then yes, this analogy stands.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 19, 2011, 12:22:51 pm
I do not! :o

I just hope frizzle fried gets the respect he has deserved for so long.
i respect him.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Zakk on June 19, 2011, 12:24:46 pm
bp leaked a bunch of oil into the gulf of mexico.  afterwards, they got a new CEO.  so now did BP not leak a bunch of oil into the gulf of mexico?

ram controls defrauded a bunch of people.  afterwards, the company was transferred from dave to dan.  so now did ram controls not defraud a bunch of people?

"RAM controls, slowly paying back the people we defrauded, one at a time as orders come in to fund it."

if the shoe fits...

That's just silly! I don't think anyone has said RAM has not defrauded anyone. So far I have no problem with either BPs new CEO or Dan. I do still believe both companies should make the people affected whole again.

So BP should give something to every living thing on the planet?  Wow, that would be generous.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 19, 2011, 01:30:32 pm
I do not! :o


...says the guy whose entire post count consists of defending Dave/RAM/Dan.

 :cheers:

Cheers mate!

 :laugh2:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 19, 2011, 03:46:19 pm
...says the guy whose entire post count consists of defending Dave/RAM/Dan.

 :blah: I never defended Dave or RAM or Dan. Further there is no need to defend Dan, he hasn't done anything wrong here to anyone in the community. I am simply stating my opinion of the situation. I hope hope Dan succeeds and gets everyone in the arcade communities who are owed, made whole as well as providing good products that are needed.

Furthermore you know full well that my posts on KLOV are not all about Dan, I'm just new to this forum and chose this topic to start off on so stop trying to mislead.

As for the respect part....respect is earned and from the beginning you have not talked to me with respect even though I attempted to be civil with you so you get none from me.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: matsadona on June 19, 2011, 05:34:32 pm
I think I lost it somewere... - is it cleared out once and for all exact what the legal status is regarding the business take over?
What legal consequences does the take over put Dan in, regarding old debts from previous customers?

But based on the rhetoric here, Dan would have been out of debt to all that got screwed by Dave if only he didn't keep the RAM Controls name and website? Perhaps that would have been the best way, based on a lot stupid comments here?
But I'm pretty sure that kind of stunt would have unleashed an even worse storm from the same people bashing him for trying to do something good...
Even though there is of course the thought of personal profit, I really think Dan is taking a higher road than most would have done if they got the RAM Controls stock in their posession.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on June 19, 2011, 05:36:42 pm
bp leaked a bunch of oil into the gulf of mexico.  afterwards, they got a new CEO.  so now did BP not leak a bunch of oil into the gulf of mexico?
Incorported businesses (corporations) have different legal structures and liabilities than sole proprietorships and parnterships.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on June 19, 2011, 05:41:03 pm
I just hope frizzle fried gets the respect he has deserved for so long.

 :laugh2:

Wait, wat ?

 :dizzy:

 :afro:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: nick3092 on June 19, 2011, 05:58:06 pm
I think I lost it somewere... - is it cleared out once and for all exact what the legal status is regarding the business take over?
What legal consequences does the take over put Dan in, regarding old debts from previous customers?

But based on the rhetoric here, Dan would have been out of debt to all that got screwed by Dave if only he didn't keep the RAM Controls name and website? Perhaps that would have been the best way, based on a lot stupid comments here?
But I'm pretty sure that kind of stunt would have unleashed an even worse storm from the same people bashing him for trying to do something good...
Even though there is of course the thought of personal profit, I really think Dan is taking a higher road than most would have done if they got the RAM Controls stock in their posession.


I'm dealing with a similar issue with the company that installed my A/C unit.  It never worked right from day one.  They covered it under warranty, until they went into receivership and another contractor bought their assets.  They also kept the same name.  Now the "new" company made a small number of good will visits (which they still failed to fix the unit) and have since started billing me.  I spoke to a lawyer and she said it's possible they may not be liable, based on the asset purchase agreement.  I'm guessing this is a similar type of deal.

I think Dan is doing an honorable thing by trying to make things right, when legally, he probably doesn't have to.  Based on that, I think he should be given some leeway on things for a while until he either proves he doesn't operate like Dave, or he proves he operates like Dave.

And for the record, I was one of the people who was almost ripped off by Dave.  I was one of the people who preorderd, and it took me 9 months, a double credit card billing, and a bad yoke that took a month to get replaced.  But I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: wbassett on June 19, 2011, 09:11:59 pm
I'm not sure I understand why Dan is being attacked.  I agree the people that paid for orders need to either finally get their item, or get a refund- and it sounds like Dan is doing that, and sounds sincere in wanting to make things right.

To me he has two options, the first is to take all his inventory and fill all the back orders... probably leaving him with just a handfull of parts, not enough to make full units.  Now he would have to spend a boat load of money to get things rolling again, and who knows if he ever would.  Or even if he'd want to after all the expenses with no return to put back into the company.

The second option would be to slowly fill back orders while also selling some new units.   I can't say for sure, but the Star Wars yoke looks like the price went up just a bit since Dave was 'selling' (taking money and not shipping).  I just assumed that this is to cover expenses and be able to get new units out while also getting some money flowing to keep the business afloat while all the people that got screwed are being taken care of.

Just because someone buys a business doesn't make them a bad guy or the same as those that previously owned the company.  Of course it could be a con job too... a good con man always builds confidence and is likeable at the same time, otherwise the con wouldn't work.  So yeah that could be what's going on, but me personally I am not one to crucify someone without first letting them prove themselves.

Let's just say I'd never want to be an innocent man on trial with some of you here as the jury!  It wouldn't matter what evidence is shown, I'd be guilty before the trial even started!  Give Dan a chance to prove himself.  If he starts screwing people then he'll never sell anything in this community again.  I look at it this way,  If Dan didn't take over the company, nobody would be getting anything right now.  Everyone would be screwed.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 19, 2011, 09:27:53 pm
I look at it this way,  If Dan didn't take over the company, nobody would be getting anything right now.  Everyone would be screwed.

According to Dan (earlier in this thread) he didn't buy "the company," he just took its inventory and intellectual property as settlement for his debt from Dave.

If true, Dave Adams is still the liable person for all of the fraudulent activity.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: wbassett on June 19, 2011, 09:49:19 pm
I look at it this way,  If Dan didn't take over the company, nobody would be getting anything right now.  Everyone would be screwed.

According to Dan (earlier in this thread) he didn't buy "the company," he just took its inventory and intellectual property as settlement for his debt from Dave.

If true, Dave Adams is still the liable person for all of the fraudulent activity.
Yet he seems to be trying to resolve past issues and fill those orders, but it sounds like he doesn't have to.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 19, 2011, 10:08:41 pm
I just hope frizzle fried gets the respect he has deserved for so long.

 :laugh2:

Wait, wat ?

 :dizzy:

 :afro:

Shush Jeffo....

...I'm enjoyin' this!

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 19, 2011, 10:11:22 pm
All this conjecture is based on something someone said... and that is it.  That someone happens to be representing a company that has had a history of saying things that weren't entirely true... a long history of "less than truths".

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 19, 2011, 11:39:15 pm
No way, man, he's mailed some vinyl stickers so he's totally legit.

I guess Wiz over on KLOV must have gotten $500 worth of vinyl stickers.  :dunno
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Donkey_Kong on June 20, 2011, 12:06:48 am
Let's just say I'd never want to be an innocent man on trial with some of you here as the jury!

Yea, sometimes I wonder if Friz is actually Nancy Grace in disguise.    :lol



PS: Friz, no offense. I'm a big fan of Nancy...   ;D
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Paul Olson on June 20, 2011, 01:48:44 am
Let's just say I'd never want to be an innocent man on trial with some of you here as the jury!

Yea, sometimes I wonder if Friz is actually Nancy Grace in disguise.    :lol



PS: Friz, no offense. I'm a big fan of Nancy...   ;D

I am almost curious enough to google who Nancy Grace is...almost.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 20, 2011, 09:54:07 am
We technically have no reason to distrust a person who has been proven to be different from the one that robbed you.


FYI:  Dave has previously appeared on the forums as "the new guy at Ram Controls", closed off a couple minor past orders, and then took in many new orders that he never fulfilled.  At first it looked just like Dan looks now.  I'm not saying Dan is really Dave, or Dan is anything other than what he says he is, but we have a legit reason to be skeptical.  We're all in "wait and see" mode for a reason.  We've been in this place before.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Zakk on June 20, 2011, 10:09:22 am
We technically have no reason to distrust a person who has been proven to be different from the one that robbed you.


FYI:  Dave has previously appeared on the forums as "the new guy at Ram Controls", closed off a couple minor past orders, and then took in many new orders that he never fulfilled.  At first it looked just like Dan looks now.  I'm not saying Dan is really Dave, or Dan is anything other than what he says he is, but we have a legit reason to be skeptical.  We're all in "wait and see" mode for a reason.  We've been in this place before.

When you say 'we' you of course mean people that actually ordered something from ram controls, right? 
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 20, 2011, 10:15:41 am
When you say 'we' you of course mean people that actually ordered something from ram controls, right? 


I mean the whole community.  You can't take in new victims without convincing those who are not yet burned.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 20, 2011, 10:27:37 am
I think a way Dan could take orders in a trusting manner would be to use a trusted 3rd party. For example, if UserA wants to purchase a star wars yoke, UserA sends paypal funds to the 3rd party. The 3rd party gets the part(s) from Dan.

It would also be a good idea for Dan to disclose whom all is owed something as well as a schedule of repayment. Random people posting who are owed nothing aren't helping. If Dan wants to untarnish Ram Controls and begin selling again, he'll need transparency.

It's a convoluted way to do business, but it would Dan to build up trust and begin repaying those that were left high and dry.

The question has been raised "Should you do business with Ram controls?" Well, I wouldn't. At least, not without some assurances. Those assurances would need to be a trusted 3rd party, a delivery date, and a payment method that protects me. I am not opposed to purchasing from Ram controls and I'm not opposed to anyone else purchasing from Ram controls, but the phrase "buyer beware" has never been more true.

If Dan were me, and everything he says is true, I would do the following:
1. Post pictures of all the excess stock
2. Post a spreadsheet of whom all is owed what
3. Create a schedule of either repayment, or parts for all those owed
4. Use a trusted 3rd party for transactions until all people owed are repaid
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 20, 2011, 10:45:27 am
Or, uh, you just pay him with a credit card and zap with a chargeback if you don't have your parts in 10 business days?

 ::)

You make it sound so easy. I've never had to do that. Is that difficult to do? Is any one credit card easier than the others?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: upprc04 on June 20, 2011, 10:47:10 am
Why doesn't Dan provide some contact information?  Most likely through PM, but I think a phone call would be a good step in the right direction.  Maybe he has been doing this with people who actually have an outstanding order and have contacted him.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 20, 2011, 11:10:07 am
Or, uh, you just pay him with a credit card and zap with a chargeback if you don't have your parts in 10 business days?

 ::)

You make it sound so easy. I've never had to do that. Is that difficult to do? Is any one credit card easier than the others?

Very easy... all credit cards have protections.

EDIT: But then you're back to the whole "supporting a company who screwed the community" thing we've been discussing this whole thread.

BTW... The above suggestions aren't bad.  And every day Dan stays away from KLOV it's just getting worse and worse there.  If he's legit and this isn't some RAM rouse... he'd be best served to go over there say SOMETHING.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 20, 2011, 12:13:48 pm
Or, uh, you just pay him with a credit card and zap with a chargeback if you don't have your parts in 10 business days?
::)

You make it sound so easy. I've never had to do that. Is that difficult to do? Is any one credit card easier than the others?

You've never had to file a chargeback but you're dispensing purchasing advice? 



Dude.  Seriously.


I didn't realize I needed to be an expert to comment. It hasn't stopped you from commenting on nearly ... well, nearly everything.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 20, 2011, 12:18:32 pm
EDIT: But then you're back to the whole "supporting a company who screwed the community" thing we've been discussing this whole thread.
I agree with you however, I don't think there is much that can be done about this Friz. People still buy gas from BP, people still buy music discs from Sony, etc. etc. What you want is some united front of arcade builders/users who will stand up to Dan/Dave until he makes everything right. You might as well try to train an army of cats.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on June 20, 2011, 12:37:12 pm
We technically have no reason to distrust a person who has been proven to be different from the one that robbed you.
FYI:  Dave has previously appeared on the forums as "the new guy at Ram Controls", closed off a couple minor past orders, and then took in many new orders that he never fulfilled.  At first it looked just like Dan looks now.  I'm not saying Dan is really Dave, or Dan is anything other than what he says he is, but we have a legit reason to be skeptical.  We're all in "wait and see" mode for a reason.  We've been in this place before.

Having said that, if Steph says that Dan is not Dave, that is good enough for me.
People have spoken to both individuals and have confirmed that they are not the same person. Having stated that, I am  not going to say it is impossible for him to be a partner of Dave’s (though I don’t believe it at all.) I mean, come on, if Cheffo isn’t vehemently against something that has to be a sign! He’s one of the first to shoot down some BS with a fifty caliber machine gun and he actually seems to be pretty neutral on the subject, and honestly, that impresses me.
Also, Chad; aren’t you actually already receiving something from Dan? Has it arrived yet?
I'm not pointing this whole post at you, Chad. You actually seem one of the lesser skeptics. We should wait and see, but if I needed something he sells I would be willing to test the waters a bit based on what I’ve seen and I'm a tightwad.
As I said before, if there WERE some kind of partnership with Dave, I don’t think it would be going like this. The gig would be up INSTANTLY if something seemed legitimately suspicious. How far did Dave get with his last scheme? This level of distrust isn’t going to go away in volume for a while and I think even down the line people are going to complain instantly if ANYTHING goes awry. It really wouldn’t be worth it to be a scheme of some kind. Unless Dan/Dave is a super idiot and thinks he’s got mad-crazy sheep wool pulling skills. This wool is woven pretty tight this time around. (Again, no hotdog/trampoline..) I just don’t think another person is going to buy into a stupid scheme like that.
As for him going to KLOV, I still don’t think he should do this yet. His ass is red raw even coming here and has spent a significant amount of time trying to help and defend himself. It’s going to be worse there, and he will have to balance defending himself in both places, stretching himself even thinner. I wouldn’t go there until some significant event of trust is established here.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on June 20, 2011, 01:41:02 pm
I mean, come on, if Cheffo isn’t vehemently against something that has to be a sign! He’s one of the first to shoot down some BS with a fifty caliber machine gun and he actually seems to be pretty neutral on the subject, and honestly, that impresses me.

Make no mistake -- I'm vehemently against all of you -- just ask Xiaou2!

 :duckhunt
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 20, 2011, 01:59:20 pm
The gig would be up INSTANTLY if something seemed legitimately suspicious.


This whole crowd looks suspicious.  It's all dudes in here except for these bitches.

(http://www.project-blu.com/images/misc/8mile.jpg)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 20, 2011, 03:17:56 pm
Two more packages going out today..

One for a recent order and one for someone owed. I am making progress..

Dan
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Donkey_Kong on June 20, 2011, 04:05:09 pm
Or, uh, you just pay him with a credit card and zap with a chargeback if you don't have your parts in 10 business days?

 ::)

You make it sound so easy. I've never had to do that. Is that difficult to do? Is any one credit card easier than the others?

What about using paypal vs regular credit card?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 20, 2011, 04:42:55 pm
You've never had to file a chargeback but you're dispensing purchasing advice?  
Dude.  Seriously.


Hmmmmmm......Who do I trust more with buying advice. The one who had good enough buying sense to not have to process a charge back or the one who has had to? Now let me think.  ;)   On the flip side I do know who to go to for processing a chargeback advice.  :lol
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 20, 2011, 04:58:47 pm
You've never had to file a chargeback but you're dispensing purchasing advice? 
Dude.  Seriously.


Hmmmmmm......Who do I trust more with buying advice. The one who had good enough buying sense to not have to process a charge back or the one who has had to? Now let me think.  ;)   On the flip side I do know who to go to for processing a chargeback advice.  :lol

Hey, I have enough buying sense to never have had to process a chargeback. My financial advice: Invest everything in flamingo shoes.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 20, 2011, 05:30:48 pm
Hey, I have enough buying sense to never have had to process a chargeback. My financial advice: Invest everything in flamingo shoes.

 :laugh2: Buying advice not investing advice. They are related, but quite different in my eyes. I only trust myself for investing advice.  :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 20, 2011, 06:08:25 pm
Hey, I have enough buying sense to never have had to process a chargeback. My financial advice: Invest everything in flamingo shoes.

 :laugh2: Buying advice not investing advice. They are related, but quite different in my eyes. I only trust myself for investing advice.  :cheers:

:lol Yep, I know. My point was just to trust yourself first and foremost on all matters financial.  :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: tbombaci on June 20, 2011, 07:13:45 pm
Two more packages going out today..

One for a recent order and one for someone owed. I am making progress..

Dan


LOL

(http://howtowritearticlesfast.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/reel-300x192.jpg)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 20, 2011, 10:07:06 pm
LOL
(http://howtowritearticlesfast.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/reel-300x192.jpg)

Dude that's a big one! Free Willy!!! :lol
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: WareWolF on June 22, 2011, 05:38:01 pm
My item came today.  Thanks Dan.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 22, 2011, 06:34:52 pm
FWIW, Dan and I have been emailing back and forth today, and I will let everybody know if a completed settlement happens.  That won't address everybody but it would be a positive report in this ugly situation.


I received my parts today.  Dan even put in an extra part that's much better than a Bob Roberts moonpie.  The parts are of typical Ram Controls quality.  They are actually overengineered.   ;D

I know this doesn't address everybody but it is one more positive report of Dan's actions.  It also means Ram Controls now only owes me $5 so I have a lot less reason to complain in these threads.   :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: JustMichael on June 22, 2011, 10:22:03 pm
It also means Ram Controls now only owes me $5 so I have a lot less reason to complain in these threads.   :cheers:

 :soapbox: Whether its $5 or $5,000, I cannot in good faith deal with a "company" like Ram Controls that has so blatantly ripped off the community.  Perhaps once the community receives a full refund then I can order a star wars yoke but not before.  IMHO Dave should spend some quality time in prison to help teach him right from wrong...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Crazy Cooter on June 22, 2011, 11:16:02 pm
:soapbox: Whether its $5 or $5,000, I cannot in good faith deal with a "company" like Ram Controls that has so blatantly ripped off the community.  Perhaps once the community receives a full refund then I can order a star wars yoke but not before.
I'm on this train.  I've been waiting for quite some time to order and will continue to sit on the sidelines.

As a comment to the new ownership, there is nothing to save in the brand name 'Ram Controls'.  For the next 10+ years any internet search will continue to bring up threads filled with bad press and will result in less sales (if the  plan is to continue this business).  My advice would be to square things up with people and then change the sign outside.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Gray_Area on June 23, 2011, 06:44:23 am
So BP should give something to every living thing on the planet?  Wow, that would be generous.

They could, as well as make themselves uber kings, by coming out with some kind of Tesla-like energy generator.


You might as well try to train an army of cats.


I remember a story of a few years ago where an old guy's cat dialed 911 for him when he collapsed.


This thread is a classic, "These are the Days of Our Lives"....
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Malenko on June 23, 2011, 08:15:05 am
It also means Ram Controls now only owes me $5 so I have a lot less reason to complain in these threads.   :cheers:

Whats your paypal? $5 to get you to shut the ---fudgesicle--- up is a sound investment. :)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: newmanfamilyvlogs on June 23, 2011, 08:23:17 am
They could, as well as make themselves uber kings, by coming out with some kind of Tesla-like energy generator.

Don't get me wrong, I love Tesla as much as the next geek, but I don't think the Wardenclyffe could really scale out without getting dangerous (:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 23, 2011, 09:14:18 am
It also means Ram Controls now only owes me $5 so I have a lot less reason to complain in these threads.   :cheers:

 :soapbox: Whether its $5 or $5,000, I cannot in good faith deal with a "company" like Ram Controls that has so blatantly ripped off the community.  Perhaps once the community receives a full refund then I can order a star wars yoke but not before.  IMHO Dave should spend some quality time in prison to help teach him right from wrong...

If you're all bent up over $5 go buy your star wars yoke from the competition.

What else is owed to you Chad? 
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 23, 2011, 09:21:28 am
What else is owed to you Chad?  


Just the $5.  Dan offered me a settlement amount of credit and I accepted it.  I couldn't come to the exact total with parts I needed so I came up $5 short and said just leave it as store credit.  I'm good with that.

Now that I think about it, though, he did put an extra of one part in there, and that is worth more than the $5.  I hadn't connected the two until just now.  Either way I consider myself settled with Ram Controls.  Dan did the right thing by me.  I'm hoping this continues with more outstanding customers.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 23, 2011, 09:36:33 am
Well, there you go JustMichael. You can continue to be mad at the company if you want. People are getting their orders. What else do you want?

You still mad at Microsoft for Windows ME or Windows Vista? You done using Windows I presume? Hows that Mac or Linux computer working out for you?  :lol
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 23, 2011, 10:03:11 am
Well, there you go JustMichael. You can continue to be mad at the company if you want. People are getting their orders. What else do you want?

I think he wants all debts to be settled before trusting ram controls again.  I mean, let's be honest here. If it was only chad who was out a lot of money, there would be no community outrage.  :lol
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 23, 2011, 10:08:36 am
Well, there you go JustMichael. You can continue to be mad at the company if you want. People are getting their orders. What else do you want?

I think he wants all debts to be settled before trusting ram controls again.  I mean, let's be honest here. If it was only chad who was out a lot of money, there would be no community outrage.  :lol

True, but Chad left the $5 out there to be interpreted. People are saying how Dan should start a new company, but how would that work? Selling arcade controls isn't such a huge market that his new company wouldn't have a new pool of buyers. He would have the same problems he's having now. Probably more.

If Slikstik came back under a new name and new ownership there would STILL be an outrage and demand that the new company make good on all it's old debts. His only choice is to bring Ram Controls back online.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 23, 2011, 10:33:13 am
I think with the current situation, you are right. Window dressing ram controls with a new name will not get far around here. Dan took on the entire company and all it's problems with it. He is stuck with a company with a bad name until he is done getting through all the crap that was left there for him. It probably would be good to change the name after cleaning up this mess though.

Maybe Dan should have just settled for taking the inventory and product designs and left the festering mess of a company for Dave to keep to himself. I think Dan would have a lot easier time selling the goods around here if people knew he was entirely separate from ram controls. Ah well, hindsight is 20/20 and it seems Dan didn't know the scope of the mess when stepping into it. Also, it seems like people here are starting to get their goods without having to resort to legal action or a court claims process. So it does seem that Dan's burden is our benefit here.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on June 23, 2011, 11:24:58 am
Maybe Dan should have just settled for taking the inventory and product designs and left the festering mess of a company for Dave to keep to himself. I think Dan would have a lot easier time selling the goods around here if people knew he was entirely separate from ram controls. Ah well, hindsight is 20/20 and it seems Dan didn't know the scope of the mess when stepping into it. Also, it seems like people here are starting to get their goods without having to resort to legal action or a court claims process. So it does seem that Dan's burden is our benefit here.
I'm starting to get on this bandwagon myself. If doing the right thing gets you shat on by tons and tons of people, then why do it? Why accept responsibility when so many people would rather him just go private and not pay back anybody owed? That actually seems to be the general consensus, at least among what seems like quite a lot of people. Maybe it's not a lot of people, just a set amount of folks pooping their non-logic out. For what? I sincerely hope anybody reading this thread can wrap their brains around the situation instead of making opinions based on emotions and not thinking. Really, I do.
I'm getting so annoyed of people saying he has to pay back everybody before doing anything. This is one of the stupidest things.
Dan = NOT DAVE
He doesn't owe anybody ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---, yet he's trying to make amends specifically to save the brand name, any future of selling the products ram controls offers, and doing what’s right by people who are actually out money. He’s doing it LITERALLY the only way possible. And so many of you think he should just open the floodgates and pay evvvvverybody back for someone else’s debt, leaving him ---smurfing--- destitute because petulant babies who aren't even owed anything can feel a sense of justice. Make your own thread titled “Ram controls ripped off somebody who’s not me, but I’m mad about it”
This is awesome, leapinlew:
If Slikstik came back under a new name and new ownership there would STILL be an outrage and demand that the new company make good on all it's old debts. His only choice is to bring Ram Controls back online.
 
Really, if a “new” store came out run by “Kris” selling the “slipperystick ternado spinner” I’m so sure nobody would suspect anything.

*edited for misquote
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 23, 2011, 01:18:14 pm
Well, there you go JustMichael. You can continue to be mad at the company if you want. People are getting their orders. What else do you want?

You still mad at Microsoft for Windows ME or Windows Vista? You done using Windows I presume? Hows that Mac or Linux computer working out for you?  :lol

When Microsoft blatantly steals thousands of dollars from you for a product that doesn't exist at all (not even half-assed versions)... then you can compare the two.

You disappoint me Lew.  You've been around long enough to have seen this ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- pulled 3 or 4 different times...

(http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa111/PapaFriz/Funny/crap.gif)

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ark_ader on June 23, 2011, 01:41:15 pm
What is wrong with using escrow?

If you have enough people wanting the same device, costing $200 or more, just put it all in escrow.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 23, 2011, 01:42:45 pm
Well, there you go JustMichael. You can continue to be mad at the company if you want. People are getting their orders. What else do you want?

You still mad at Microsoft for Windows ME or Windows Vista? You done using Windows I presume? Hows that Mac or Linux computer working out for you?  :lol

When Microsoft blatantly steals thousands of dollars from you for a product that doesn't exist at all (not even half-assed versions)... then you can compare the two.

You disappoint me Lew.  You've been around long enough to have seen this ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- pulled 3 or 4 different times...


heres what I see:
Dan comes forward and says he will try to make good on peoples orders
The people at BYOAC who was owed something, is getting their orders
Meanwhile Dan is here getting his butt handed to him... and for what?
Lots of people crying for blood.

I'm not vouching for Dan or saying you should place an order with him without taking some precautions. But it SEEMS like he is responding to previous orders as best is possible.

If I was in the market for a star wars yoke... I'd probably place an order with Dan and take the precautions I listed earlier in this thread.  
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: wp34 on June 23, 2011, 02:03:33 pm

If I was in the market for a star wars yoke... I'd probably place an order with Dan and take the precautions I listed earlier in this thread.  

+1

It seems like Dan is making progress towards restitution.  An all out boycott at this points seems like cutting off your nose to spite your face.  If we start to hear new reports of shenanigans well then I'll change my tune.  Until then I think we need to give him the benefit of the doubt or nobody will get anything they are due.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on June 23, 2011, 02:51:08 pm
For the next 10+ years any internet search will continue to bring up threads filled with bad press and will result in less sales (if the  plan is to continue this business).  My advice would be to square things up with people and then change the sign outside.
This

(how come I'm the only one who wants to see his Ebay Power Seller feedback????)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 23, 2011, 03:05:24 pm
EDIT:

(http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa111/PapaFriz/lemmings.jpg)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on June 23, 2011, 03:35:49 pm
[... I think Dan buying RAM is a bunch of hogwash.  If Dan truly was interested in recouping his "investment" he'd have taken the stock ONLY... and not the name... the name is tainted and a liability at this point and why would anyone who is owed money from someone take on a tainted liability when it's not "required"?   Answer: No one.  Conclusion:  Dave still owns RAM and Dan is just doing his best to save Dave's skin..


As I and others have stated, if Dan had taken only the stock and ditched all the rest, he would literally have no need or reason to pay back anybody. Is this something the community really wants? Most of the alternatives that are being suggested actually harm the community more than help. People are getting back what they are owed, and it might be a slow process but it is happening, and it’s happening the only way it could happen.
Again, if Ram Controls equipment was being sold under a different banner, would this really raise no suspicion? Seriously, if he did get the stock and change the name people would be out-right certain that it is Dave under a new name, and they’d be 10 times more angry because he wouldn’t be owning up or paying back anybody. He’d be in this boat, but with more holes in it. Even if he did that, and came out and told the truth, “I got all of Ram stock, and am now selling it under the name “Dan Controls”” This would be disastrous. Answer truthfully; would you, we, not decry this action? Would “Dan Controls” really be accepted and not slandered?
I 100% agree that people should be paid back. People who were harmed deserve restitution. Absolutely. That this is happening is great. But paying back everybody all at once without any income is economically impossible. The company name is tainted, but what is a company if not its employees and stock? It’s just a name. If he did change the name, he would be under heavy suspicion, and nobody would get anything. I am 100% for people getting what they are owed, but we need to be reasonable about it.
I agree about the ebay powerseller name. Honestly, I don’t think that’s a thing that’s going to happen. Divulge what you want from that; I don’t like it myself. But until he’s proven to be / be with Dave, we shouldn’t rally against him so much.
Honestly, if he does start dealing in an unsavory manner, get the lynch mob. I will be in the front with my pitchfork because I would be one of the biggest fools for defending the ass. Let’s just give it a chance.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 23, 2011, 04:31:51 pm
(how come I'm the only one who wants to see his Ebay Power Seller feedback????)

You are not alone in that. That would be helpful. Dan?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 23, 2011, 04:35:08 pm
EDIT:

(http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa111/PapaFriz/lemmings.jpg)

So let me make sure I got your side of the story right. We should shun RAM controls even though people are getting their orders? We should be just as vicious as you are until EVERY LAST CENT (as you put it) is repaid. And then what? Then all of a sudden RAM is ok? How are you going to verify every last penny has been repaid?

I think your mixing up your real identity with an alter ego who's job it is to protect arcade enthusiasts. Thanks for protecting us SuperArcade Man
(http://media.gamerevolution.com/images/misc/image/super-nerd.jpg)

Let me know when it's safe to order!

And for the record: I'm not saying it's safe to order from RAM. I'm saying order with caution. The company has a bad track record.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 23, 2011, 05:06:42 pm
I think Dan is nothing more than hired PR.
like a crooked politician or declining movie star that screws up in the public eye
they'll hire a team to reconstruct and handle PR to put them in a new shinning light.
and I think Dan knows alot more than hes letting on.

(http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa111/PapaFriz/lemmings.jpg)
LMAO


and from the sounds of some of these posts it seems to be working  ???
But when I start seeing people on the cockpit list or even the LL/MC Control Panel list...
Sorry but the BYOC really needs to get out more
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 23, 2011, 06:08:34 pm
So let me make sure I got your side of the story right. We should shun RAM controls even though people are getting their orders? We should be just as vicious as you are until EVERY LAST CENT (as you put it) is repaid. And then what? Then all of a sudden RAM is ok? How are you going to verify every last penny has been repaid?

I think your mixing up your real identity with an alter ego who's job it is to protect arcade enthusiasts. Thanks for protecting us SuperArcade Man

Let me know when it's safe to order!

And for the record: I'm not saying it's safe to order from RAM. I'm saying order with caution. The company has a bad track record.

How long have you been here Lew?  How many times have you seen RAM pull this SAME ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---?  

Don't you feel somewhat obligated to point out the history of this company Lew?   Wouldn't you feel even a little bad if someone contacted you in 6 months and said "Lew,  based on a post of yours it pushed me over the edge and I decided to spend $X with RAM and got screwed"?

Will I know when ALL people have been paid off?  Nope... but I am sure I'll get wind of when some of the cockpit victims get restitution... that's when I'd be convinced that "whoever" is running RAM is serious about getting people paid... not until then.

The fact that Dave/RAM fraudulently ADVERTISED, SOLD and COLLECTED MONEY for a phantom product (SW Cockpit) appalls me...

...and the fact that he LIED to more than one person stating "It's READY TO SHIP" to get MORE MONEY from these folks... well,  I'll leave it at that.

If you folks want to do business with a company that would pull that kind of ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---... so be it.  I for one WILL NOT. 

PS: I've still not seen a shred of evidence that Dave's still not running the show.




Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: GibsonRiddler on June 23, 2011, 06:40:22 pm
Thread of rikitiki on coinopspace

http://www.coinopspace.com/forum/topic/show?id=2467396%3ATopic%3A147400 (http://www.coinopspace.com/forum/topic/show?id=2467396%3ATopic%3A147400)

Post By Joaquim D states he went to Dan's to get the yoke control in person.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 23, 2011, 07:18:41 pm
You guys could easily be right, Dan could be a PR guy, friend or Employee doing a crooked stunt of Dave's.. A lot of things don't quite add up, and this being a stunt is always a possibility. Who really knows though.  :dunno

I don't think anyone should jump down Dan's throat based on an assumption like that, though. Mostly because isn't really productive. Dave wasn't about to fulfill any orders a month ago, now at least we are seeing a spark of something. I don't know if it is legit or a stunt, but I think a much more productive use of this anger is to find out what Dan's plan is for resolving this mess and if it is a reasonable plan, holding him to it. If this is a scam, then we are doing exactly what Dave wants; being too busy bickering to notice whether or not they are doing their job. A little maturity on our end might make a difference here, so let's put the ball in Dan's court and give him a chance to tell us his plan and prove himself.

If he has accountants and advisors helping him put together this plan, then the plan will follow a schedule. I think it also goes without saying that the customers have a right to know what that schedule is on when they will be paid back or supplied with their goods. So why don't we:

1) Hear out Dan's Plan and verify that it would in some way settle everybody's debts.
2) Assuming the plan and the schedule are reasonable, give Dan the benefit of the doubt, be respectful and lets try to make things work. Try to meet him half way and be fair. Agree to support him just as any other seller in the community once the debt is resolved.
3) If he fails to follow through, we should all agree to hold his feet to the fire as hard as we can. Take any and all action necessary to keep scam controls from screwing anyone in the community again.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rbarr110 on June 23, 2011, 07:45:14 pm

If you folks want to do business with a company that would pull that kind of ---That which is odoriferous and causeth plants to grow---... so be it.  


ALL OF WHAT I SAY BELOW IS PREDICATED ON THE PRESUMPTION THAT DAVE IS NO LONGER A PART OF RAM CONTROLS

I have been here for several years...not necessarily an incredibly active member, but well aware of the RAM Controls announcement of a yoke in progress with pre-orders being taken.  I was incredibly disappointed when the whole thing went down hill after the yokes had been completed and alot of people never received a prepaid yoke.

But it is statements like the one quoted above that I find ridiculous.

It baffles me that people cannot differentiate that a company name is not necessarily the same old company when someone new takes it over.  

For example my father, now retired, owned and ran a business for 25+ years.  Wanting to retire, he sold the company and its assets to new ownership.  The new owner completely changed the way the business ran...in my opinion, the new management took it downhill...but the business has the same name but is being managed completely different, the original owner having ZERO involvement.  Did my father drive the business downhill??? No, he isn’t the business, and neither is DAN necessarily the old “Ram Controls”.

So now we have a company, that had been piss poorly managed, essentially taken over by a new person, that on initial appearances, is making things right, yet people can not differentiate the two.

DAN technically owes nothing to anyone, the issue is with DAVE and not Ram Controls.  I, however, am choosing to wait things out a bit longer before making a purchase.  I can completely agree with choosing not to do business with Ram Controls because of the past, but trying to be a moralistic, elitist ass, pointing fingers at those that choose to do business with DAN is ridiculous because it is not the same as purchasing from DAVE.

If you are owed something from DAVE, hopefully DAN is making good on it now, and that appears to be happening.  I for one am reserving my judgement on DAN and the new Ram Controls….as far as DAVE is concerned, string him up.

Writing all this wont change the minds of those that are so vehemently and angrily arguing their point that doing business with DAN is wrong, but hopefully will add a more level headed perspective to those that don’t necessarily know the history.

If you choose to buy, "buyer beware", there is a shady past to the name "Ram Controls", that is all that really needs to be said by anyone.  

Hopefully it is true that DAN is taking care of things the way they should have been done in the first place.  
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 23, 2011, 08:12:03 pm
So let me make sure I got your side of the story right. We should shun RAM controls even though people are getting their orders? We should be just as vicious as you are until EVERY LAST CENT (as you put it) is repaid. And then what? Then all of a sudden RAM is ok? How are you going to verify every last penny has been repaid?

I think your mixing up your real identity with an alter ego who's job it is to protect arcade enthusiasts. Thanks for protecting us SuperArcade Man

Let me know when it's safe to order!

And for the record: I'm not saying it's safe to order from RAM. I'm saying order with caution. The company has a bad track record.

How long have you been here Lew?  How many times have you seen RAM pull this SAME ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---?  

Don't you feel somewhat obligated to point out the history of this company Lew?   Wouldn't you feel even a little bad if someone contacted you in 6 months and said "Lew,  based on a post of yours it pushed me over the edge and I decided to spend $X with RAM and got screwed"?

Will I know when ALL people have been paid off?  Nope... but I am sure I'll get wind of when some of the cockpit victims get restitution... that's when I'd be convinced that "whoever" is running RAM is serious about getting people paid... not until then.

The fact that Dave/RAM fraudulently ADVERTISED, SOLD and COLLECTED MONEY for a phantom product (SW Cockpit) appalls me...

...and the fact that he LIED to more than one person stating "It's READY TO SHIP" to get MORE MONEY from these folks... well,  I'll leave it at that.

If you folks want to do business with a company that would pull that kind of ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---... so be it.  I for one WILL NOT. 

PS: I've still not seen a shred of evidence that Dave's still not running the show.

We both know all the evidence as it is available today. You feel that doing business with RAM controls under any circumstance is a bad idea. I feel that doing business with RAM is acceptable if you take precautions. That just about sums it up.

The last thing I want to do is be put in a position of trying to defend RAM controls. I just think that since we see a few orders being delivered, they deserve a chance.

If someone does things based on something someone online says, they have bigger problems than not getting a Star Wars yoke.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 23, 2011, 08:31:50 pm
Quote
I feel that doing business with RAM is acceptable if you take precautions. That just about sums it up.


wow really?
Im sure those that were lied to and still waiting on refunds/products will be happy to hear that.

Im sure that getting out some small orders of instock parts and 10 dollar tubes of nyogel those guys will be paid off in no time. :laugh2:

and then we can all restore our game in a new magical world of lollipops and gumdrops free of the RamEffect.

its not just phantom cockpits there were also suposely SCREENED Lunar Lander and Missile Command Control Panels
that were "in stock and ready to ship"

FYI Dave called me around the time he was posting for those looking for information and advise on how to screen them and I dont think he was any where nears where we was claiming and later proved him wrong and full of...
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=175338 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=175338)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 23, 2011, 08:52:10 pm
Lets make the distinction...  Dave lied to a lot of people, myself included. I have not lied to anyone. If I don't have something ready to ship I wont take your money, period! I cannot take care of everyone who is owed instantly that is true, and I have been completely honest about that fact.  I am however making progress towards resolving the problems of the past. Just today I have taken care of two people who ordered products yesterday and today and I have two boxes packed and ready to go out tomorrow that will take care of two more people who are owed something from the past. Those two packages take care of another $500 in past orders. Everyone who is ordering new is getting their stuff and people who are owed from the past are getting taken care of. This is a process and will take time.

Dan

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on June 23, 2011, 09:24:32 pm

Im sure those that were lied to and still waiting on refunds/products will be happy to hear that.


Who are these people? Specifically. Who. I haven't seen ONE single person who has been owed something say they haven't been treated fairly, or that they have been ignored, or that they are in ANY way dissatisfied with how things are going. Not a SINGLE one in this thread. Are these ripped off people just holding their tongues, being polite? The only detractor I saw who was legitimately owed anything was ChadTower, and he came out of his situation satisfied.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: jimmy2x2x on June 23, 2011, 09:37:53 pm
Lets make the distinction...  Dave lied to a lot of people, myself included. I have not lied to anyone. If I don't have something ready to ship I wont take your money, period! I cannot take care of everyone who is owed instantly that is true, and I have been completely honest about that fact.  I am however making progress towards resolving the problems of the past. Just today I have taken care of two people who ordered products yesterday and today and I have two boxes packed and ready to go out tomorrow that will take care of two more people who are owed something from the past. Those two packages take care of another $500 in past orders. Everyone who is ordering new is getting their stuff and people who are owed from the past are getting taken care of. This is a process and will take time.

Dan



You are doing an admirable job, please keep it up.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: wp34 on June 23, 2011, 09:55:46 pm

Who are these people? Specifically. Who. I haven't seen ONE single person who has been owed something say they haven't been treated fairly, or that they have been ignored, or that they are in ANY way dissatisfied with how things are going. Not a SINGLE one in this thread. Are these ripped off people just holding their tongues, being polite? The only detractor I saw who was legitimately owed anything was ChadTower, and he came out of his situation satisfied.

You might want to check out the forum over at KLOV.  They have an entire section dedicated to Ram Controls and don't tend to post on BYOAC.
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78)

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on June 23, 2011, 10:09:32 pm
You might want to check out the forum over at KLOV.  They have an entire section dedicated to Ram Controls and don't tend to post on BYOAC.
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78)

True enough. Has any word been mentioned over there about this? I would hope people who are owed over there can at least view this article. Dan's put his contact info in, so they can contact him that way.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 23, 2011, 10:39:08 pm
Quote
I feel that doing business with RAM is acceptable if you take precautions. That just about sums it up.


wow really?
Im sure those that were lied to and still waiting on refunds/products will be happy to hear that.

Thanks, at least someone will be happy.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 24, 2011, 01:55:21 am
Im sure that getting out some small orders of instock parts and 10 dollar tubes of nyogel those guys will be paid off in no time.

lets fund everybody owed with 10 dollar tubes of nyogel and other misc parts in stock

sending out some tubes of nyogel and missing yoke overlays dont make up for the fraud of the rest of it.



Those two packages take care of another $500 in past orders.

Quote from: Wiz;1667405
I received some parts up front but was still owed several hundred bucks worth of credit. I was contacted by Dan recently and he let me know that he knew I was owed some level of credit for the transaction I had made with Dave prior.

I went out to the RAM site and selected a few parts I needed and a few I knew others would need and they arrived safely and well packed yesterday via UPS. I was owed 500 and I got 500 worth of parts.


Heck! There's 100 $10 tubes right there. I wonder what they could want with all that nyogel?  :dunno
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Xiaou2 on June 24, 2011, 03:35:03 am
Quote
But then you're back to the whole "supporting a company who screwed the community" thing we've been discussing this whole thread.

 Actually, if all is True, people would be supporting an enterprising arcade fan who is looking to make some side cash on his hobby.


 And actually David was quite amazing.  He got Starwars yokes reproduced in small quantities, with extremely high quality, for a seriously low price. (compared to equivalent arcade quality equipment)

 Today, you cant buy something half as complex, in cheap Plastic, for the same amount of money... and thats in MASSIVE quantities.

 Take a look at the Race Sim scene.  Small companies make Pedals, Wheels, and Shifters of the same kind of high quality machined parts, with even less complexity, and charge +2x what he was charging.

 Even when he ran into production issues, which cost him a lot of money, time and effort... he never raised the prices for the pre-orders. I would have had to raise them.  But then again, I never would have taken pre-orders either.

 The people that got messed over the most, were the well-to-do.  No poor person is gona drop several thousands on a video game remake... especially from a company that doesnt even have a remade vector monitor in stock.  And when the delays started to roll in, any one of them could have pulled their money back out.  Some did.  A crook wouldnt have allowed that... nor would a crook actually build starwars yokes, in addition to sinking money into about 10 other controllers (that each required a Ton of custom parts each)

 And even as things soured, he ALMOST got the tv mfg. plant to make the brand new vector monitors.  Its pretty much a historic moment that the yokes came to be remade.. but new vector monitors would have been monumental.

 Look at Gene Cunningham.  He started he was going to produce Bing Bang Bar (pinball machine).  It took him YEARS, lots of complaints and poor communications, project setbacks that ended up costing him more money than he was to make... and yet he Still pulled it off.  He could have packed it in, taking others money to cover expenses... and disappearing under bankruptcy.

 It really sucks that these people may have lost their money.  Its equally sucky that people had to endure all the lies and bs that dave layed down, as well as several years of torment and frustration.  However, in the end, there are people that got something that never would have been made by any other company had it not been for dave.

 You wont see Randy or Andy making SW yokes.  Its simply too costly.  And if they did, it probably wouldnt be of the same caliber of quality. (to save money / costs.  not that they are not capable of it)   They also dont seem to want to invest in the low quantity, low popularity, custom specialty controllers like 720 or Frontline.  Theres too much money to produce, too much risk, and probably low returns on investments even IF sales were good, AND if there were no complications in manufacturing.


 It would scare me a bit to order from Ram Controls,.. but, by using paypal, one should be able to get the funds back if needed. Most especially with ebay purchases.

 Still, I think it would be nice to get out a camcorder, introduce yourself Dan, and show us the inventory via youtube.  A great way to put your face to your reputation to instill confidence.  The all-black website needs an overhaul too.  .. as well as fixing all the 'no picture' place-markers, and poor part browsing / ordering layout.
 
 Ebay sales would also be a good option, because they are all handled with ebay & paypal protection combined, as well as a good feedback system, which makes people feel much safer about things.  Even if it costs people a few more dollars , people will pay for the added security..  at least, till your reputation gets well established.

 I really hope you can turn the game around, and furthermore, get those vector monitors made as well... before theres no possibility for them to be produced at all.  (are there even any tube crt mfg. left???)

 Finally, I dont know if it would be a good thing or not.. but you might get more orders with slight 'part' cost reductions.  Imop, $25 for a single 14 tooth gear is very hard to swallow... even for a specialty part.

 You get stuck in a sort of limbo.  Do you spend a possible 150$ in parts and time fixing your existing used assembly... or buy a brand new one?   What do you do with the broken one?  Cant sell it with a broken gear & deformed spring.  Cant recoup the costs already lost on it..  if its going to cost a lot to repair, PLUS the time and energy restoring it.

 Finally. to be clear, I dont agree with what Dave did.  Hes a poor business man, and has poor understanding about the meaning and value of Honesty and good communication. 

 I agree that people should be suspect and cautious.  However, I dont agree with constant trolling.  Unless its towards someone like David Foley, cause he deserves it 1000x over.  DF is also a predatory snake in the grass... who had no problem cheating/using others, for personal gains... where as David Adams just tried to use the money towards furthering reproduction efforts.  Theres a huge difference between the two.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SavannahLion on June 24, 2011, 03:51:46 am
About those CRT Vectors....

What was the story behind that? Is it the same as the SW art, the manufacturer refused for some reason?

I feel I already know this story, but I can't recall what part of the deal fell through.

There may still be a chance down the road for new CRTs to be manufactured yet. I just learned of a small cottage producing vacuum tubes by hand. The guy basically needed tubes for his radio so he figured out how to make them then just started manufacturing them for other radio enthusiasts. Even better he's taken on an apprentice to teach the art to. The tubes cost a pretty penny, but those radio operators got their tubes.

My only hope is that despite CRT's death, the knowledge doesn't disappear with it but holds on until equilibrium is found again.... :-\
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: davespicer on June 24, 2011, 08:09:00 am
About those CRT Vectors....

What was the story behind that? Is it the same as the SW art, the manufacturer refused for some reason?

I feel I already know this story, but I can't recall what part of the deal fell through.

There may still be a chance down the road for new CRTs to be manufactured yet. I just learned of a small cottage producing vacuum tubes by hand. The guy basically needed tubes for his radio so he figured out how to make them then just started manufacturing them for other radio enthusiasts. Even better he's taken on an apprentice to teach the art to. The tubes cost a pretty penny, but those radio operators got their tubes.

My only hope is that despite CRT's death, the knowledge doesn't disappear with it but holds on until equilibrium is found again.... :-\

There are differing stories regarding the CRTs.  Dave originally talked about getting them made in Asia I believe, although later posts by others on Klov alleged that they were actually going to be regunned units from Hawkeye.  I'd speculate that both avenues were being looked at.  Only Dave/Dan can say how far along things went.  Personally I'd treat them as vapourware as far as RAM goes.

Hawkeye no longer regun tubes and their equipment has been donated to the Early Television Museum in Hilliard Ohio (source: email from Scotty at Hawkeye).

VDC also used to regun suitable 25" tubes for the Amp and still had stock up until a few weeks ago (source: Erv at VDC).  They've now sold out and have no plans to produce any more.

Anyone based in the US could probably find a 25" TV with a suitable 100 degree CRT.  The chances of finding one in the UK are pretty remote because most of our so-called 25" TVs typically contain a 23" tube.  Not sure about the rest of Europe.  A SW cockpit would require some creative mods to safely mount the smaller size.  Not sure about the uprights.

--
Dave


Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Alpha1 on June 24, 2011, 08:18:16 am
Quote
But then you're back to the whole "supporting a company who screwed the community" thing we've been discussing this whole thread.

 Actually, if all is True, people would be supporting an enterprising arcade fan who is looking to make some side cash on his hobby.


 And actually David was quite amazing.  He got Starwars yokes reproduced in small quantities, with extremely high quality, for a seriously low price. (compared to equivalent arcade quality equipment)

 Today, you cant buy something half as complex, in cheap Plastic, for the same amount of money... and thats in MASSIVE quantities.

 Take a look at the Race Sim scene.  Small companies make Pedals, Wheels, and Shifters of the same kind of high quality machined parts, with even less complexity, and charge +2x what he was charging.

 Even when he ran into production issues, which cost him a lot of money, time and effort... he never raised the prices for the pre-orders. I would have had to raise them.  But then again, I never would have taken pre-orders either.

 The people that got messed over the most, were the well-to-do.  No poor person is gona drop several thousands on a video game remake... especially from a company that doesnt even have a remade vector monitor in stock.  And when the delays started to roll in, any one of them could have pulled their money back out.  Some did.  A crook wouldnt have allowed that... nor would a crook actually build starwars yokes, in addition to sinking money into about 10 other controllers (that each required a Ton of custom parts each)

 And even as things soured, he ALMOST got the tv mfg. plant to make the brand new vector monitors.  Its pretty much a historic moment that the yokes came to be remade.. but new vector monitors would have been monumental.

 Look at Gene Cunningham.  He started he was going to produce Bing Bang Bar (pinball machine).  It took him YEARS, lots of complaints and poor communications, project setbacks that ended up costing him more money than he was to make... and yet he Still pulled it off.  He could have packed it in, taking others money to cover expenses... and disappearing under bankruptcy.

 It really sucks that these people may have lost their money.  Its equally sucky that people had to endure all the lies and bs that dave layed down, as well as several years of torment and frustration.  However, in the end, there are people that got something that never would have been made by any other company had it not been for dave.

 You wont see Randy or Andy making SW yokes.  Its simply too costly.  And if they did, it probably wouldnt be of the same caliber of quality. (to save money / costs.  not that they are not capable of it)   They also dont seem to want to invest in the low quantity, low popularity, custom specialty controllers like 720 or Frontline.  Theres too much money to produce, too much risk, and probably low returns on investments even IF sales were good, AND if there were no complications in manufacturing.


 It would scare me a bit to order from Ram Controls,.. but, by using paypal, one should be able to get the funds back if needed. Most especially with ebay purchases.

 Still, I think it would be nice to get out a camcorder, introduce yourself Dan, and show us the inventory via youtube.  A great way to put your face to your reputation to instill confidence.  The all-black website needs an overhaul too.  .. as well as fixing all the 'no picture' place-markers, and poor part browsing / ordering layout.
 
 Ebay sales would also be a good option, because they are all handled with ebay & paypal protection combined, as well as a good feedback system, which makes people feel much safer about things.  Even if it costs people a few more dollars , people will pay for the added security..  at least, till your reputation gets well established.

 I really hope you can turn the game around, and furthermore, get those vector monitors made as well... before theres no possibility for them to be produced at all.  (are there even any tube crt mfg. left???)

 Finally, I dont know if it would be a good thing or not.. but you might get more orders with slight 'part' cost reductions.  Imop, $25 for a single 14 tooth gear is very hard to swallow... even for a specialty part.

 You get stuck in a sort of limbo.  Do you spend a possible 150$ in parts and time fixing your existing used assembly... or buy a brand new one?   What do you do with the broken one?  Cant sell it with a broken gear & deformed spring.  Cant recoup the costs already lost on it..  if its going to cost a lot to repair, PLUS the time and energy restoring it.

 Finally. to be clear, I dont agree with what Dave did.  Hes a poor business man, and has poor understanding about the meaning and value of Honesty and good communication. 

 I agree that people should be suspect and cautious.  However, I dont agree with constant trolling.  Unless its towards someone like David Foley, cause he deserves it 1000x over.  DF is also a predatory snake in the grass... who had no problem cheating/using others, for personal gains... where as David Adams just tried to use the money towards furthering reproduction efforts.  Theres a huge difference between the two.


Hi there,

Please don't take this as offensive. But that is the biggest crock of ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- I have ever heard. Anyone that has know RAM Controls and Daves ethics over the last 8 years will know he genuinely does scam people. He took me for around $1200USD about 5 years ago.

Dave is also a predatory snake in the grass. He has gone through this cycle a million times.

Please tell me how telling people the SW cockpits were READY is not predatory - even going so far as to take shipping money also? For the KLOV members from Australia and New Zealand?

And in regard to the monitors, please go and read all the RAM threads. A KLOV user bought the remaining NOS Amplifone tubes from Hawkeye, all bought and paid for and was waiting on getting them shipped. When Dave found out about this, he phoned HAWKEYE, pretended to be the guy, and then tried to make them ship them to his address!!! OUTRAGEOUS.

It seems you guys on this forum aren't really aware of them complete scams Dave has done, and I don't know you Xiaou2, so I will give you the benefit of the doubt, but posting what you posted is just so far off the mark it is unreal.

People like you posting this just adds to the cycle of people that will get ripped off from RAM in the future (If Dan doesn't turn out to be the honest guy he says he is) I hope it works out, but I still believe Dave has very real dealings with this company and I don't believe Dan is letting us know the entire picture.

Please find out the entire 8 year history of RAM and all the scams that have taken place before posting stuff like you did above. Because you are way way WAY off the mark.

Oliver
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 24, 2011, 08:25:21 am
I don't know you Xiaou2, so I will give you the benefit of the doubt, but posting what you posted is just so far off the mark it is unreal.

Theres your problem right there....
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Alpha1 on June 24, 2011, 08:43:08 am
I don't know you Xiaou2, so I will give you the benefit of the doubt, but posting what you posted is just so far off the mark it is unreal.

Theres your problem right there....

Go through KLOV, and you will see the Tube story yourself. You will also see the victims of the chip bulk deals, sw cockpit deals, parts that were never made but sold as shipping deals, the is my tracking number a real one deals, and all the other scams that affected us, the collectors. After to speaking to Dave on the phone multiple times, I honestly believe that he actually believes the lies he says. It's pretty sad, he's a classic conman. I almost feel sorry for him in a way.

I challenge anyone that doesn't really know the full story and the 8 year train wreck to read the ENTIRE victims stories at KLOV and on many other places like the Vector List before posting an opinion. The classic opinion is the one above 'Dave just started making too many things and he fell behind and isn't it all so bad, I feel sorry for him really' when in reality it is a far far far different story.

I may have 2 posts to my name on these forums (including this one) but i've been collecting for 14 years and am well known on all the other major collecting sites and I have personall history in dealings with Dave. I am not one that is making this up, I was affected, like many others were. Hell he owed his supposed friend/investor Dan 25 THOUSAND DOLLARS. Does that honest to God not ring alarm bells for people? Really? That's why people like Frizz put the lemmings picture on here. Heed the warnings and read the real stories by collectors that have been affected by this on KLOV.

Oliver
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 24, 2011, 09:02:13 am
I don't know you Xiaou2, so I will give you the benefit of the doubt, but posting what you posted is just so far off the mark it is unreal.

Theres your problem right there....

Go through KLOV, and you will see the Tube story yourself. You will also see the victims of the chip bulk deals, sw cockpit deals, parts that were never made but sold as shipping deals, the is my tracking number a real one deals, and all the other scams that affected us, the collectors. After to speaking to Dave on the phone multiple times, I honestly believe that he actually believes the lies he says. It's pretty sad, he's a classic conman. I almost feel sorry for him in a way.

I challenge anyone that doesn't really know the full story and the 8 year train wreck to read the ENTIRE victims stories at KLOV and on many other places like the Vector List before posting an opinion. The classic opinion is the one above 'Dave just started making too many things and he fell behind and isn't it all so bad, I feel sorry for him really' when in reality it is a far far far different story.

I may have 2 posts to my name on these forums (including this one) but i've been collecting for 14 years and am well known on all the other major collecting sites and I have personall history in dealings with Dave. I am not one that is making this up, I was affected, like many others were. Hell he owed his supposed friend/investor Dan 25 THOUSAND DOLLARS. Does that honest to God not ring alarm bells for people? Really? That's why people like Frizz put the lemmings picture on here. Heed the warnings and read the real stories by collectors that have been affected by this on KLOV.

Oliver

I understand, and I think everyone understands that Dave did terrible things. Do you think that at this point, ordering from Ram is a bad idea? We have a few users here who have received long standing orders from Dan which is what would influence my decision to cautiously place an order with Ram.

Not to mention a few users at KLOV seem to be getting their orders:
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 24, 2011, 10:47:28 am

I was taken care of by Dan but my order was very small potatoes in the big picture.

I am cautiously optimistic.  I think for now we should be continuing to wait and see.  I don't have a lot of hope for Dan's ability to make those large order customers whole but he probably can clear up all the small ones like myself.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 24, 2011, 11:14:51 am
I understand, and I think everyone understands that Dave did terrible things. Do you think that at this point, ordering from Ram is a bad idea? We have a few users here who have received long standing orders from Dan which is what would influence my decision to cautiously place an order with Ram.

Not to mention a few users at KLOV seem to be getting their orders:
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78)

You know what BYOAC members should take a look at? This Google Docs spreadsheet that's been compiled over at KLOV of people who have been ripped off by RAM Controls.

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0An_RLk7EK5WtdFVhbnJBMDBCbzBoamlQZldvRTQwYXc&hl=en&authkey=CPDFuqsL#gid=0 (https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0An_RLk7EK5WtdFVhbnJBMDBCbzBoamlQZldvRTQwYXc&hl=en&authkey=CPDFuqsL#gid=0)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 24, 2011, 11:24:19 am
I am cautiously optimistic.  I think for now we should be continuing to wait and see.  I don't have a lot of hope for Dan's ability to make those large order customers whole but he probably can clear up all the small ones like myself.

My thoughts as well...filling some smaller orders is a nice first step, but there is major, major damage out there still. I think we should hear Dan out, but he has to deliver some solid plan. As far as the 'wait and see' bit. he deserves a chance to prove himself, but how long should Dan be given before being declared another con artist?

Dan, what is your plan that you promised? If you don't have it ready yet, what time frame can everyone expect to hear your plan by? Your talk has been open and sincere, but without any solid facts or a real time frame. Everyone is still essentially left in the dark. I hope you see the problem here.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: yotsuya on June 24, 2011, 11:28:03 am

You know what BYOAC members should take a look at? This Google Docs spreadsheet that's been compiled over at KLOV of people who have been ripped off by RAM Controls.

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0An_RLk7EK5WtdFVhbnJBMDBCbzBoamlQZldvRTQwYXc&hl=en&authkey=CPDFuqsL#gid=0 (https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0An_RLk7EK5WtdFVhbnJBMDBCbzBoamlQZldvRTQwYXc&hl=en&authkey=CPDFuqsL#gid=0)


Is that going to be revised when people like Chad are squared away with Dan?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: HaRuMaN on June 24, 2011, 11:32:09 am
Is that going to be revised when people like Chad are squared away with Dan?

There are no other people like Chad...   ;)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 24, 2011, 11:35:59 am
I have reviewed this list, but if it isn't kept up to date, what's the point?  :dunno Case-in-point = ChadTower and I'm pretty sure looking at that list there are others.

I understand, and I think everyone understands that Dave did terrible things. Do you think that at this point, ordering from Ram is a bad idea? We have a few users here who have received long standing orders from Dan which is what would influence my decision to cautiously place an order with Ram.

Not to mention a few users at KLOV seem to be getting their orders:
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78)

You know what BYOAC members should take a look at? This Google Docs spreadsheet that's been compiled over at KLOV of people who have been ripped off by RAM Controls.

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0An_RLk7EK5WtdFVhbnJBMDBCbzBoamlQZldvRTQwYXc&hl=en&authkey=CPDFuqsL#gid=0 (https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0An_RLk7EK5WtdFVhbnJBMDBCbzBoamlQZldvRTQwYXc&hl=en&authkey=CPDFuqsL#gid=0)

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spunkmeyer on June 24, 2011, 11:39:40 am
I have reviewed this list, but if it isn't kept up to date, what's the point?  :dunno Case-in-point = ChadTower and I'm pretty sure looking at that list there are others.

I am not the author or keeper of the document. There's a link inside it where people can send their info to be updated.

I think its important that everyone keep this as up-to-date as possible, so BYOAC/KLOV members can be properly informed as to their status.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 24, 2011, 11:53:33 am
There are no other people like Chad...   ;)

 :blah:

Quote from: gregbl;1668902
FWIW.......Several weeks went by, some emails back and forth, and we came to an agreement on parts that he had available that would make me mostly whole. Basically, I got some parts that I may need at some point, and the dollar value was right around what I had spent after the big discount that Dave had given when I originally placed the orders last fall. So, for now, I've gotten restitution from RAM Controls, via Dan.QUOTE]

Quote from: Wiz;1667470
I was owed 500 and I got 500 worth of parts.

Quote from: mort;1659057
Wow, I received parts ordered back in November 2010 today. I was not expecting that.

Quote from: slots;1658460
I settled my order with Dan after he took over.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: yotsuya on June 24, 2011, 12:04:51 pm
There are no other people like Chad...   ;)

 :blah:

Quote from: gregbl;1668902
FWIW.......Several weeks went by, some emails back and forth, and we came to an agreement on parts that he had available that would make me mostly whole. Basically, I got some parts that I may need at some point, and the dollar value was right around what I had spent after the big discount that Dave had given when I originally placed the orders last fall. So, for now, I've gotten restitution from RAM Controls, via Dan.QUOTE]

Quote from: Wiz;1667470
I was owed 500 and I got 500 worth of parts.

Quote from: mort;1659057
Wow, I received parts ordered back in November 2010 today. I was not expecting that.

Quote from: slots;1658460
I settled my order with Dan after he took over.



HarumaN was making teh funnay, bheineck.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 24, 2011, 12:09:18 pm
I think its important that everyone keep this as up-to-date as possible, so BYOAC/KLOV members can be properly informed as to their status.

Me too. I think the problem is there were a couple lists and people got tired of sending the info several times of how they got ripped off. The easiest thing both to follow and to create would be for Dan to post a list of all those who have been made whole and amounts, but I'm not sure everyone who has, would want their info posted. It's just not as easy as everyone's opinions make it out to be.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 24, 2011, 12:11:57 pm
HarumaN was making teh funnay, bheineck.

Got it!  :cheers:  But is that Japanese right there?  ;D
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 24, 2011, 12:24:37 pm
"We've got a DONKEY KONG KILL SCREEN coming up folks"

 :laugh2:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: yotsuya on June 24, 2011, 12:28:02 pm
I'd love to see a Donkey Kong kill screen. That would mean I had scored more than 48,000.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 24, 2011, 12:29:47 pm
how long should Dan be given before being declared another con artist?


Dan has done nothing so far to indicate he is any sort of con artist.  If we ever get new reports of new orders not being filled then we can think about this. 
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 24, 2011, 12:52:13 pm
how long should Dan be given before being declared another con artist?


Dan has done nothing so far to indicate he is any sort of con artist.  If we ever get new reports of new orders not being filled then we can think about this. 

I know, I was not implying that he was either. I guess my point is that there should be a time frame that Dan is accountable for, because this sort of thing can be left to drag on for years. The whole wait and see thing has to have a limit.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on June 24, 2011, 12:54:45 pm
Ugh. Stupid sleeping making it difficult to follow this. Why can't you people be courteous, with respect to my inactivity schedule. I post during work hours, what more can be asked of me!! ;) :D

I'm totally sorry, Alpha1. Please don't take that opinion as the typical belief held here. Nobody, NOBODY, myself included, has been holding beliefs that Dave did not give the elgrande shafto to everyone. I'm even going to say he actually did harm the arcade community as a whole. I wasn't there for all that stuff, but I have read many of the threads regarding it and; God. Damn.

As far as a schedule goes, I think something like that would be difficult to lie out. It would be difficult or impossible to predict the amount of (basically) donations. Monies will be available for the reparations. *I think the best we can hope for is a constant and moderately steady/stable level of payments.* As far as the current situation is going, even for the people with giant debts owed, I think they will get repaid. Though it may take a while, and certainly (I was going to say very likely, but no) be paid back in pieces at a time.
As far as this being a scam, as many have said, let's wait and see. I feel like so much of this discussion is based on what could happen, while there is no actual evidence that it is or will. As I've said before, we can be ready for some sweet mob justice, but let's not jump the gun!

Mark my words though, somebody WILL cry foul. Soon I believe. I am of the opinion that it will be a false alarm, so I implore Dan to continue the high level of communication he has been. Give no reasons for doubt. Keep up the good work!

Edited for clarification, represented with asterisks
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 24, 2011, 01:00:32 pm
As far as a schedule goes, I think something like that would be difficult to lie out. It would be difficult or impossible to predict what amount of (basically) donations.

The schedule doesn't need to be fixed to dollars. It can be fixed to units sold. So, for example, for every 3 X items he sells he can send a previous person their unit. The best thing he could do is provide as much transparency as he can. He has a "plan" but so does Billy Mitchell.

Share the plan.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on June 24, 2011, 01:04:43 pm
The schedule doesn't need to be fixed to dollars. It can be fixed to units sold. So, for example, for every 3 X items he sells he can send a previous person their unit. The best thing he could do is provide as much transparency as he can. He has a "plan" but so does Billy Mitchell.

Share the plan.

I can get behind that, though I think it would be better represented with profits. Say for instance, one third of profits gained go towards a total owed. (the man's got to make a living, as well)
This doesn't mean the total owed because obviously a large portion of the payments have and will be product, so the profit percentage will be going into shipping and handlings, making the reparations come along at a decent rate.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bkenobi on June 24, 2011, 01:04:50 pm
This won't be popular, but I don't think Dan should try to make the big ticket orders whole.  I think the people who ordered SW cabinets that were impossible for DAVE to build (since he was, you know, missing all the parts...) would be even more impossible for DAN to finish.  The cost of those units is enormous and even giving store credit wouldn't make things right.  IMO (again, just my opinion), Dan can fill back ordered parts that he has and nothing more.  I still say people are pushing too hard as he's not liable, just trying to do what he feels is best for his new company (Dan's RAM Controls...as opposed to DAVE's RAM Controls).  The people who will never get what they paid DAVE for should continue to pursue legal action against DAVE.

But, that's my opinion as an outsider to this whole mess.   :dunno
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on June 24, 2011, 01:08:29 pm
Rawhide!

I agree bkenobi, but I know for a fact the majority will not. It's a huge point of contention, and the trust levels will not be gained by the group as a whole if this isn't attended to. I can't imagine the nightmare it would be if he stated this.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 24, 2011, 01:17:31 pm

I would like to see legal action continue against Dave.  Absolutely.  The man has committed felonies over and over again.  I can't figure out why nobody has ever gone looking for him given how many he scammed.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: wbassett on June 24, 2011, 01:44:40 pm
Dave is the one everyone should be focusing their anger on.

This thread amazes me... 
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 24, 2011, 02:04:03 pm
Dave is the one everyone should be focusing their anger on.

This thread amazes me... 

While I don't think people should be jumping on Dan and should give him a fair shake, it isn't unreasonable that people expect the company who screwed them to be responsible.

It doesn't matter who is in charge. If I order from Amazon and the company shifts hands, I still expect Amazon to fulfill my order, not go on a manhunt for the previous owner of Amazon. A customer shouldn't have to decipher who is the current owner, what drama unfolded, where the inventory is located, etc.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on June 24, 2011, 02:32:29 pm
But that's the same old "If amazon was renamed Ma'amazon under that new ownership would they still owe people?" (shrug) It's a sticky situation. All kinds of grey.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 24, 2011, 03:05:04 pm
I've had friends and family walk away from multi-million dollar deals that went just as bad as this one - it's simply not worth anyone's time.  If the guy's as broke as everyone says, he's civil judgement proof anyway.


That's why I said felony and not lawsuit.  If he has no money he has no money.  That doesn't absolve him of his crimes.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 24, 2011, 03:18:49 pm
What's he done that's criminal?



He solicited funds for a "non existent" product (Star Wars Cab).  He did so domestically and internationally.

He emailed people who'd put a down payment on a cab saying that the CABS WERE READY TO SHIP and that he needed the other half of their payment to ship it.

I call that "criminal"... no?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 24, 2011, 03:20:03 pm
What's he done that's criminal?


Fraud.  Very clearly he committed fraud.  He committed it across state lines, national lines, and via electronic means.  That's a whole lot of laws broken.

That's why I just don't get why people could never find the leverage on him.  He shouldn't be facing a civil attorney.  He should be facing a district attorney.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Mikezilla on June 24, 2011, 04:00:56 pm
Where the hell is Shmokes, isnt he a damn lawyer?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 24, 2011, 04:07:21 pm
Where the hell is Shmokes, isnt he a damn lawyer?

 :lol Which goes to prove that you only get schmokes to jump in when you don't want it.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Donkbaca on June 24, 2011, 04:23:14 pm
Having actually worked on fraud cases, they are a waste of time.  In order to prove fraud, you have to prove intent.  If you report it to the cops, then its completely out of your hands and up to the government to decide if they want to pursue it.  We aren't talking millions of bucks here, don't think the cops are chomping at the bit to get after someone because of a few broken promises to arcade nerds.  Now if he was passing bad checks, or ripped off a bank, that would be different, but I really doubt the cops care about stuff like this, they have better ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- to do.  That leaves civil recourse, of course, that is also a huge waste of time.  You spend all of this time and money hoping to get your money back, but you never do.  Most people that steal money or commit fraud do so so they can spend the money, people don't rip off other people so they can put money in their 401(k).  So even IF you win, and get a judgement, chances are the person you have the judgement against has no assets with which to satisfy the judgment. 

Its best to just cut your losses and move on.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 24, 2011, 05:21:03 pm
Great points except the last one. If ChadTower had just cut his losses and moved on he'd be out several hundred dollars in parts. Same as a bunch of others.

Having actually worked on fraud cases, they are a waste of time.  In order to prove fraud, you have to prove intent.  If you report it to the cops, then its completely out of your hands and up to the government to decide if they want to pursue it.  We aren't talking millions of bucks here, don't think the cops are chomping at the bit to get after someone because of a few broken promises to arcade nerds.  Now if he was passing bad checks, or ripped off a bank, that would be different, but I really doubt the cops care about stuff like this, they have better ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- to do.  That leaves civil recourse, of course, that is also a huge waste of time.  You spend all of this time and money hoping to get your money back, but you never do.  Most people that steal money or commit fraud do so so they can spend the money, people don't rip off other people so they can put money in their 401(k).  So even IF you win, and get a judgement, chances are the person you have the judgement against has no assets with which to satisfy the judgment. 

Its best to just cut your losses and move on.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bkenobi on June 24, 2011, 05:27:54 pm
Right, he moved on to the guy that also got screwed and accepted a small percentage of his debt in products.  That guy doesn't owe anyone anything, but since he took the web site, people are trying to move on to him.  Now, in this case, Dan's actively trying to help so I just don't understand people's animosity towards the guy.  I'm just intrigued by what's going on.  I have no intention to place an order (as I said earlier, I'm not in the market for any of this stuff).
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Donkbaca on June 24, 2011, 05:38:39 pm
Hey if anyone wants to sue I'd happily offer my forensic accounting services for 165 bucks an hour and a $5,000 retainer.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on June 24, 2011, 05:40:49 pm
There was a chick here (Ontario Canada) who solicited donations under the guise that she had cancer. She only got a total of about $4500 but she was still successfully prosecuted for fraud. I seriously doubt fraud laws here are all that different from those of California where they wouldn't go after a guy who took in over $25k worth.

It wouldn't take a forensic genius to sort out if he got money and sent nothing.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Mikezilla on June 24, 2011, 06:08:05 pm
Where the hell is Shmokes, isnt he a damn lawyer?

 :lol Which goes to prove that you only get schmokes to jump in when you don't want it.

Shut up Vigo, quit blowing my cover!  :lol
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Donkbaca on June 24, 2011, 06:24:29 pm
Hey yeah someone should totally do something... other... than... me.....
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 24, 2011, 06:59:55 pm
Someone is...

http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=176040 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=176040)

Where will it go?  Who knows.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: wbassett on June 28, 2011, 12:46:35 am
Can anyone else get to Ram-Controls website?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SavannahLion on June 28, 2011, 01:24:50 am
Can anyone else get to Ram-Controls website?

The domain expired and wasn't renewed. Here is the Whois:

Quote
Registrant:
Pending Renewal or Deletion
   P.O. Box 430
   Herndon, VA. US 20172-0447
   

   Domain Name: RAM-CONTROLS.COM

   ------------------------------------------------------------------------
   Promote your business to millions of viewers for only $1 a month
   Learn how you can get an Enhanced Business Listing here for your domain name.
   Learn more at http://www.NetworkSolutions.com/ (http://www.NetworkSolutions.com/)
   ------------------------------------------------------------------------

   Administrative Contact, Technical Contact:
      Pending Renewal or Deletion  pendingrenewalordeletion@networksolutions.com
      P.O. Box 430
      Herndon, VA 20172-0447
      US
      570-708-8786


   Record expires on 21-Jun-2011.
   Record created on 21-Jun-2006.
   Database last updated on 28-Jun-2011 01:14:30 EDT.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: wbassett on June 28, 2011, 09:34:24 am
That's what I got too...  doesn't look good considering all the drama going on.  Could be a simple oversight, but still...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 28, 2011, 09:40:48 am
Maybe that's the kill screen Friz was talking about.  :dunno  It is concerning that Dan hasn't posted in several days. Still doesn't make much sense that he would send a bunch of product out as repayment and then skip town.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Malenko on June 28, 2011, 09:58:17 am
if you all were riding my nuts when I was trying to help out, I'd take a few days off too. Lighten up Nancy
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on June 28, 2011, 10:36:41 am
Yeah, it's not like they've ever made good on a few orders, collected a bunch of money, and then disappeared before....

 :lol
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: yotsuya on June 28, 2011, 10:44:09 am
Maybe that's the kill screen Friz was talking about.  :dunno  It is concerning that Dan hasn't posted in several days. Still doesn't make much sense that he would send a bunch of product out as repayment and then skip town.

FWIW, based on the previous conversations I had with Dan, he was getting married on the 26th.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 28, 2011, 10:56:35 am
well heres another piece the puzzle   :dizzy:
http://www.wix.com/empireproto/empire-prototyping#!gallery (http://www.wix.com/empireproto/empire-prototyping#!gallery) (URL fixed by moderator)

(http://www.thisoldgame.com/Pics/CEmashedPs.jpg)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 28, 2011, 10:59:34 am
Yeah, it's not like they've ever made good on a few orders, collected a bunch of money, and then disappeared before....

I don't think he's collected a bunch of money though. It seems like much more product went out than money came in. Sounds like he's taking a break to be with his new bride.....you know honeymoon! If it was him and his then fiance doing everything before, that would make sense that nothing is being posted. Doesn't explain the website going down though.  :dunno
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 28, 2011, 11:04:39 am
well heres another piece the puzzle   :dizzy:
http://www.wix.com/empireproto/empire-prototyping# (http://www.wix.com/empireproto/empire-prototyping#)!gallery


Rich, is that new? How did you find it?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 28, 2011, 11:15:17 am
it was posted on KLOV
interresting
that website lists Atari as on of its clients along with Williams.
it certainly would be interresting if they actually did those bitd.

Or a crazier thought Dave worked there and road the company making all these parts
as "goverment projects" and then selling them out underneath them
including charge offs for overnight UPS shipping.
beacuse the address on the site sure looks familar.

It was reported he lost his "engineering job" recently. hmmm
job losses of today are nothing like they were say a year ago.
I wonder what happened?
just sayin...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 28, 2011, 11:35:17 am
I hear ya. It's definitely and intricate web and it seems nobody here really knows exactly what is going on. It looks like it is an older known associated site to Dave according to a post recently made over on KLOV. I was concerned it was recent.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: BadMouth on June 28, 2011, 11:59:49 am
Only a year old....

(http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=103207.0;attach=168725;image)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 28, 2011, 12:15:53 pm
and the regestred names adds even mroe confusion
(http://forums.arcade-museum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=63842&stc=1&d=1299270267)

(http://forums.arcade-museum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=63843&stc=1&d=1299270604)

address is the same as whats listed on the EmpireProto site
which is a house
there was a party there in april
http://www.evite.com/pages/invite/viewInvite.jsp?x=1&event=GAYDUNVUSSXLKXDPKWWC&viewAll=true (http://www.evite.com/pages/invite/viewInvite.jsp?x=1&event=GAYDUNVUSSXLKXDPKWWC&viewAll=true)
 funny James Blooquist name is list along with another name I delt with when dealing with Ram Controls
a few years back Jeremy Boucher

Registrant:
James Bloomquist
6512 Rome Circle
Huntington Beach, California 92647
United States

Registered through: GoDaddy.com, Inc. (http://www.godaddy.com (http://www.godaddy.com))
Domain Name: EMPIREPROTOTYPING.COM
Created on: 21-Apr-09
Expires on: 21-Apr-11
Last Updated on: 11-Jun-10

Administrative Contact:
Bloomquist, James jim.bloomquist@gmail.com
6512 Rome Circle
Huntington Beach, California 92647
United States
(714) 841-2220 Fax --

Technical Contact:
Bloomquist, James jim.bloomquist@gmail.com
6512 Rome Circle
Huntington Beach, California 92647
United States
(714) 841-2220 Fax --
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on June 28, 2011, 12:29:55 pm
Derrrrr, didn't I already warn Dan that he didn't actually have the domain and it was expiring soon?

ramcontrols.com forwards to:
ram-controls.com

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bkenobi on June 28, 2011, 12:39:39 pm
Dan also mentioned that if he couldn't get things transferred the way he wanted, he would simply let the domain expire so he could reregister the way he wanted it.  Perhaps that's what has happened and his nuptials are impeding the new registration process.  Priorities, pffft....   :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 29, 2011, 03:12:33 pm
Sigh..... Here is what happened.. I tried to transfer the domain ram-controls to my account at godaddy and the process failed. I have fixed the problem and my email is working again and the website will be back up later today. I decided to take my wife on a little mini vacation / honeymoon and well as to be expected all kinds of crap happened. I am still here, sorry for all of the website problems.

Dan
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 29, 2011, 03:17:58 pm
Correction, the website is back up now.... Again, sorry to all for the website problems.

Dan
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 29, 2011, 03:40:40 pm
Correction, the website is back up now.... Again, sorry to all for the website problems.

Dan

Strange that Dave is now the contact... being that it was "Jim Bloomquist".   Why would you put Daves info in to your domain registration?

Quote
RAM Controls 16912 Gothard Street Suite M Huntington Beach, CA 92647 US Domain Name: RAM-CONTROLS.COM Administrative Contact , Technical Contact : RAM Controls daviea@ca.rr.com 16912 Gothard Street Suite M Huntington Beach, CA 92647 US Phone: 714-873-7381
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Gray_Area on June 29, 2011, 08:23:16 pm
Correction, the website is back up now.... Again, sorry to all for the website problems.

Dan

Strange that Dave is now the contact... being that it was "Jim Bloomquist".   Why would you put Daves info in to your domain registration?

Quote
RAM Controls 16912 Gothard Street Suite M Huntington Beach, CA 92647 US Domain Name: RAM-CONTROLS.COM Administrative Contact , Technical Contact : RAM Controls daviea@ca.rr.com 16912 Gothard Street Suite M Huntington Beach, CA 92647 US Phone: 714-873-7381

Don't you remember Dan said he pings Dave for technical knowledge and stuffs.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on June 30, 2011, 12:47:40 pm
Don't you remember Dan said he pings Dave for technical knowledge and stuffs.
I hope you're joking. The "technical contact" in a domain registration is meant to be the webmaster or person who handles the domain's settings, etc (ie: the "IT guy").
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 30, 2011, 01:49:00 pm
If your talking about the ram-controls.com that domain is still in Dave's account on Network Solutions, I was trying to get it moved over to my godaddy account but the process failed. I am going to renew the domain on network solutions and transfer it at my leisure. I also need to fix the DNS over at my hosting provider so that all of my domains work independently so if one of them has a problem it wont take down the whole website. Something to do after I get back however. My wife is being tolerant but I don't want to push the issue, heh!

Dan
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 30, 2011, 01:59:47 pm
Something to do after I get back however.

Back from what? You're updating here on your honeymoon?   :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: saint on June 30, 2011, 02:47:44 pm
No pics, no wife.



With any due respect, if someone asked me for pictures of my wife to prove myself I'd tell them to go screw themselves, were I the most honest of businessmen in the world. Also, a picture won't prove a thing that I can see. I understand the doubts and concerns, but imho a man's family is off limits.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Nephasth on June 30, 2011, 02:52:59 pm

With any due respect, if someone asked me for pictures of my wife to prove myself I'd tell them to go screw themselves, were I the most honest of businessmen in the world. Also, a picture won't prove a thing that I can see. I understand the doubts and concerns, but imho a man's family is off limits.


+1 :applaud:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on June 30, 2011, 02:53:33 pm
No pics, no wife.



With any due respect, if someone asked me for pictures of my wife to prove myself I'd tell them to go screw themselves, were I the most honest of businessmen in the world. Also, a picture won't prove a thing that I can see. I understand the doubts and concerns, but imho a man's family is off limits.

Yeah, agreed.


Of course if someone here brags about having a supermodel for a wife/girlfriend, then pics are a requirement.  ;)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on June 30, 2011, 03:01:32 pm
It shouldn't PinballJim... it's pretty much the status-quo for RAM.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on June 30, 2011, 03:21:28 pm
Thanks to my Iphone I can stay somewhat in contact without pissing off the wife to much, heh!

Dan
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on June 30, 2011, 03:33:21 pm
Taking a bunch of orders and then disappearing for two weeks instantly raises a few flags, I'd think.

So are you asserting that somebody you know of has paid Dan for product and did not get it? I think the arcade community would like to know the details.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on June 30, 2011, 03:34:38 pm
Sure, sure, I agree, but there's been a lot of wild claims tossed around lately.  Taking a bunch of orders and then disappearing for two weeks instantly raises a few flags, I'd think.



Dan went five days between posts.

What new orders?  Where are people claiming they have new unfilled orders?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Malenko on June 30, 2011, 04:29:53 pm
Dan went five days between posts.


I wish more people would do that.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on June 30, 2011, 05:54:39 pm
 :duckhunt
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ark_ader on June 30, 2011, 06:24:01 pm
When is the movie of this thread coming out?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: scofthe7seas on July 01, 2011, 06:49:43 pm
Mark my words though, somebody WILL cry foul. Soon I believe. I am of the opinion that it will be a false alarm, so I implore Dan to continue the high level of communication he has been. Give no reasons for doubt. Keep up the good work!

Marked.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on July 02, 2011, 01:56:03 pm
Well, I am going to keep plodding away at this and keep taking care of those owed. This week is a special exception as I am on my honeymoon, but I am still trying to log in every day or two and stay in touch.. Ill be back this weekend so everything will be back to normal next week.

Dan
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: GibsonRiddler on July 02, 2011, 02:18:00 pm
@Dan

There are people out there who just want to see you fail just so they can say " I told you so" to everyone else.

It has been proven on this forum and others that you are not Dave. People have emailed, talked, and seen you in person. People want to believe what they want to believe and nothing you say or do will change their minds.

I also tend to wonder if some of the naysayers have business's of their own and wanting you to fail to get rid of eventual competition to themselves. I say eventual because you have a huge mess that Dave left to clean up, and until that is done it will be hard to move the company forward.

I wish you the best of luck you have a large hill to climb. It would be a loss to see these parts disappear.

And before anyone bombards me, YES, I have read the forums on here, KLOV and coinopspace I am well aware of what has happened and also the reason I never made an order to Ram Controls.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: amendonz on July 02, 2011, 04:03:07 pm
The best bit about this thread was the people who weren't owed anything jumping in and potentially ruining getting anything back for the people who are. Funny ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: GibsonRiddler on July 02, 2011, 04:34:59 pm
The best bit about this thread was the people who weren't owed anything jumping in and potentially ruining getting anything back for the people who are. Funny ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---.
:applaud:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on July 02, 2011, 11:25:17 pm
Ill be back in town tomorrow, hoping to enjoy a little celebrating on the Fourth, and be back in the office on Tuesday. If you have any questions you can always email me at:

sales@ram-controls.com

Dan
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bkenobi on July 03, 2011, 12:26:39 am
Not trying to "ruin" anything.  Simply trying to suggest that piling on isn't necessarily helpful in promoting a new business owner to keep up the effort.  Also, trying to understand where liabilities lye in case things can't get resolved sufficiently for whatever reason.  Dan is taking the heat for Dave's ---fudgesicle--- up's.  People should have an understanding of whether he is doing it out of obligation or out of good will to resurrect the business' name.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on July 03, 2011, 12:15:21 pm
Also, trying to understand where liabilities lye in case things can't get resolved sufficiently for whatever reason.  .......People should have an understanding of whether he is doing it out of obligation or out of good will to resurrect the business' name.

Dan has stated that he has taken ownership of the inventory and the web site and most people seem to agree that this does not constitute taking ownership of the "business" as a whole and therefore the liabilities as well. This seems to be the information you are seeking, but it is nothing new.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 05, 2011, 01:31:45 pm
Also, trying to understand where liabilities lye in case things can't get resolved sufficiently for whatever reason.  .......People should have an understanding of whether he is doing it out of obligation or out of good will to resurrect the business' name.

Dan has stated that he has taken ownership of the inventory and the web site and most people seem to agree that this does not constitute taking ownership of the "business" as a whole and therefore the liabilities as well. This seems to be the information you are seeking, but it is nothing new.


My guess is that the folks who are owed thousands of dollars for phantom Star Wars cockpit machines would disagree with you and your "general consensus"...


...but maybe Dan could ask them directly over at KLOV... that is if he had the intestinal fortitude to take the heat over there... which it appears he doesn't (or hasn't up until this point).


That said... thus far I've heard of nothing but positive about Dan and his efforts.


Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on July 05, 2011, 03:02:22 pm
My guess is that the folks who are owed thousands of dollars for phantom Star Wars cockpit machines would disagree with you and your "general consensus"...

Wrongo! or they would be going after Dan legally instead of Dave. I know you just love to disagree with me though.  :blah:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on July 05, 2011, 03:16:43 pm
That said... thus far I've heard of nothing but positive about Dan and his efforts.

Brother lemming, welcome to the glass half full side.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on July 05, 2011, 03:35:39 pm
My guess is that the folks who are owed thousands of dollars for phantom Star Wars cockpit machines would disagree with you and your "general consensus"...

Wrongo! or they would be going after Dan legally instead of Dave. I know you just love to disagree with me though.  :blah:

That's not really true. You can't assume control of a companies name, inventory, property etc without taking the liabilities as well if you are intending to continue to do business under that name. That would be fraud at least when it comes to business tax purposes. You would either have to register an entirely new business with the state under a new entity name, or file with the state that you acquired either a percentage of the company or the company as a whole. With the company acquisition comes liability. Ram controls cannot legally continue business without accepting it's own liability, no matter who is in charge.

Now if Dan received the only inventory and started his own company called "Dan's controls", that's a horse of a different color. Technically in that sense, he only purchased product and is reselling under his own new-formed company.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on July 05, 2011, 04:23:00 pm
That's not really true. You can't assume control of a companies name, inventory, property etc without taking the liabilities as well if you are intending to continue to do business under that name. That would be fraud at least when it comes to business tax purposes. You would either have to register an entirely new business with the state under a new entity name, or file with the state that you acquired either a percentage of the company or the company as a whole. With the company acquisition comes liability. Ram controls cannot legally continue business without accepting it's own liability, no matter who is in charge.

Now if Dan received the only inventory and started his own company called "Dan's controls", that's a horse of a different color. Technically in that sense, he only purchased product and is reselling under his own new-formed company.

Yah understood! However, my statements were based on the assumption as also stated in my post that Dan just took control of the inventory and domain name as he stated. Nodoby here other than Dan knows how he is reporting to the government. I am certainly no expert at business law, but maybe you are. :)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on July 05, 2011, 04:57:58 pm
That's not really true. You can't assume control of a companies name, inventory, property etc without taking the liabilities as well if you are intending to continue to do business under that name. That would be fraud at least when it comes to business tax purposes. You would either have to register an entirely new business with the state under a new entity name, or file with the state that you acquired either a percentage of the company or the company as a whole. With the company acquisition comes liability. Ram controls cannot legally continue business without accepting it's own liability, no matter who is in charge.

Now if Dan received the only inventory and started his own company called "Dan's controls", that's a horse of a different color. Technically in that sense, he only purchased product and is reselling under his own new-formed company.

Yah understood! However, my statements were based on the assumption as also stated in my post that Dan just took control of the inventory and domain name as he stated. Nodoby here other than Dan knows how he is reporting to the government. I am certainly no expert at business law, but maybe you are. :)

Yeah, I end up doing too much work with legal entities and business tax matters. It is the part of my job I like the least, but ended up getting recruited into the business tax dept from HR. I ended up mucking through the paperwork for acquiring a couple multi-state businesses with serious outstanding debt, splitting them and adding a percentage of the business to our own entity. A hideous, hideous mess.  :banghead:


I don't mean to pry into Dan's business affairs either. Dan's making good on the orders, and as long as that continues I don't think there would be a need for anyone to pry.  :dunno

I would guess that if any serious serious litigation came about to Ram Controls, Dan could be considered liable. Which is the reason why I believe that Dan set up a contract defaulting everything back to Dave in case it all hit the fan. I'm sure Dan is also interested in making good on the orders because he doesn't want to be stuck going back into a legal fight that wasn't his to begin with. Better to just repair the company reputation and look to the future.


Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Havok on July 06, 2011, 10:33:55 am
(http://i421.photobucket.com/albums/pp293/urticashoo/drama_llama.jpg)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on July 06, 2011, 06:35:37 pm

Time for bheineck and bkenobi to bquiet.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on July 07, 2011, 02:20:10 am

Time for bheineck and bkenobi to bquiet.

That's A-list material right there!!!   :applaud:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bkenobi on July 07, 2011, 03:23:41 pm
blah...   ;D
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on July 07, 2011, 10:26:31 pm
That's A-list material right there!!!   :applaud:
More like B list.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on July 08, 2011, 11:04:13 am
RayB list?

Hint: I tend to be sarcastic!   :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on July 10, 2011, 03:18:06 pm
RayB list?

Hint: I tend to bsarcastic!   :cheers:


fixt
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on July 11, 2011, 12:57:20 am
RayB list?

Hint: I tend to bsarcastic!   :cheers:


fixt

Ebonics???   :laugh2:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on July 11, 2011, 03:53:13 pm
Hey I just wanted to check in to let you know I am still around..

I will be shipping out two more packages today to people who are owed from the past, plus one for a current order. If you need to get a hold of me you can email me at sales@ram-controls.com

Dan
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: LASooner on July 13, 2011, 01:42:02 am
I was the current order he mentioned above and received it today in good working order. For what it's worth.
 
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: jimmy2x2x on July 13, 2011, 01:45:11 am
I was the current order he mentioned above and received it today in good working order. For what it's worth.
 

Are you suggesting the product or service you received was worthless?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: LASooner on July 13, 2011, 01:46:13 am
Negative, It's a high quality product. A guy with only 1 post on this forum might be worthless.  :)  Dan was very responsive to questions I had.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on July 13, 2011, 08:52:45 pm
FYI I am finally in a position to restart some of the projects that David Adams never completed. The three main things that are in production are:

1: A batch of 50 more SW yokes. Once this batch is complete I should be able to take care of everyone who is owed a Star Wars Yoke but has not received it.

2: The centering bellows project. The metal rings for the bellows are done and I took possession of them this week. I delivered them to another company that is adding the urethane component. I should have an first article (example) done in a few weeks.

3: The Tempest Spinner. The frame assembly is in production and should be done in a few weeks. That is one of the last major parts necessary to complete this project.

As always if you have any questions feel free to email me at sales@ram-controls.com

Dan
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: newmanfamilyvlogs on July 13, 2011, 10:49:04 pm
Maybe something like a blog with updates like that would work toward repairing Ram's image. Just something to show some life behind the web page other than a tumultuous thread on a forum somewhere.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 14, 2011, 01:32:46 pm
When the cockpits are done and being delivered to those who are owed... you make sure to post here so I can take RAM off my shitlist...

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on July 14, 2011, 06:08:14 pm
The cockpits will not be completed as you probably already know. I am planning on giving a full refund to those who paid for them, I just don't have the money for that yet.

Dan
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on July 17, 2011, 05:37:19 pm
*bump*

(shoudln't let this fall off the main page)  ;D
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: wonder1 on July 20, 2011, 08:05:00 pm
The cockpits will not be completed as you probably already know. I am planning on giving a full refund to those who paid for them, I just don't have the money for that yet.

Dan

As being one of the people that was scam for a cockpit and paid in full, can you tell me when you think this is going to happen.Will i get it a lump sum or will you expect me to accept it in small amounts over the next couple of years.Coming up to nearly 9 months now and my credit card could do with a payment.

Until I and the rest of the victims are paid in full your still on my ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- LIST. ;D
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Paul Olson on July 20, 2011, 10:54:21 pm
The cockpits will not be completed as you probably already know. I am planning on giving a full refund to those who paid for them, I just don't have the money for that yet.

Dan

As being one of the people that was scam for a cockpit and paid in full, can you tell me when you think this is going to happen.Will i get it a lump sum or will you expect me to accept it in small amounts over the next couple of years.Coming up to nearly 9 months now and my credit card could do with a payment.

Until I and the rest of the victims are paid in full your still on my ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- LIST. ;D

I am in no way involved, but as a general rule, that seems like a really good way to get placed on the bottom of a list.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: wonder1 on July 21, 2011, 06:50:38 am
Quote
I am in no way involved, but as a general rule, that seems like a really good way to get placed on the bottom of a list.


Have you seen the list,it up to $42,000 owing to people.And being in Australia I am sure I will be at the top to start with.

Im I going to wait in the back ground and hope that something will happen, I don't think so. :angry:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on July 21, 2011, 11:03:30 am
Quote
I am in no way involved, but as a general rule, that seems like a really good way to get placed on the bottom of a list.
Have you seen the list,it up to $42,000 owing to people.And being in Australia I am sure I will be at the top to start with.
Im I going to wait in the back ground and hope that something will happen, I don't think so. :angry:

42K :o
Wait I thought this list was shrinking Dan??
thats almost double the orignal spreadsheet
https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0An_RLk7EK5WtdFVhbnJBMDBCbzBoamlQZldvRTQwYXc&hl=en&authkey=CPDFuqsL#gid=0 (https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0An_RLk7EK5WtdFVhbnJBMDBCbzBoamlQZldvRTQwYXc&hl=en&authkey=CPDFuqsL#gid=0)

Another FACT for you NON belivers I know ALOT of collectors who opted to stay off that list
either because they dont frequient KLOV or didnt want their amounts publicly known.
KLOV memeber STEPH took matters in their own hands and began legeal procedings against Dave/RamControls
and kept a private list of his own which would then go to the courts. Post #138 from 6-20-2011
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=176040&page=14 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=176040&page=14)
some Highlights for your readin enjoyment

2- Because of this thread (and KLOV Forums) I was contacted
by non-arcade victims which make our plight look like small potatoes
(... we're talking 6-figure amounts here... )
This has opened-up an entirely new dimension on the scope of Dave's thievery
and has attracted more legal and law enforcement attention.

3- Not surprisingly, alot of dirt on Dave is being uncovered
including prior convictions and court appearances.
I'd like to say more, but I know this info gets back to Dave
so I'm guarded on what I can say.


Dan not trying to derail your train here but posts and claims that your shipping back orders when theres a continued growing list
is a very false impression and if you truly dont owe anything to anybody why waste your time, money and "newly aquired inventory"
to help right someone elses wrongs??
This part has never made any sense not even to "save the brand name."
Ram Controls will ALWAYS be known for this.


 

Lets save the clock tower instead
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: yotsuya on July 21, 2011, 12:10:18 pm
Out of curiousity, who's maintaining this public list? For example, I see ChadTower's on that list, but I also know that he has stated that he's squared things up with RAM, so that number should drop, right?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on July 21, 2011, 12:22:24 pm
The list I referred to as being current would be the private one thats being updated as of 6-20-2011
and NOT the spreadsheet. The spreadsheet was a starter to see what was at the time currently owed
and proably hasnt been updated.
The current Private list by Steph on KLOV is (42k) for legal proceedings and was posted to be current and updated.

However if Chad is on this private list he should contact Steph.
My understanding is This list is complied of victims who have been in contact directly with Steph
for legal comp and are still currently owed.

Care to coment Dan?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: hatrick on July 21, 2011, 02:09:46 pm
There is absolutely no logical explanation for this other than Dan is fronting for Dave to try and please the masses before the crap hits the fan with legal troubles. Think about it. Dave owes you money/product that you are pretty sure you will never see. In steps the hero Dan that promises SOMETHING to pay you back. Getting anything is better than nothing, so you accept alternate parts to cover what you are owed. You don't get what you paid for, but you get something, so Dave no longer has to worry about you coming after him. Mission accomplished.

50 Star Wars Yokes at about $250 each? That's $12,500. Lets be conservative and say they cost Ram $100 in parts & labor. That leaves a whopping $7500 for Dan to live off of, and recover his massive debt that Dave owes him? Dan would have to be the WORST business man in history (behind Dave) to accept this arrangement as payment for his debt. He would never make a dime off of this sinking ship. The only logical explanation is that Dan is fronting for Dave to cover Dave's ass.

Think about it people. Don't be so naive.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 21, 2011, 03:17:21 pm
There is absolutely no logical explanation for this other than Dan is fronting for Dave to try and please the masses before the crap hits the fan with legal troubles. Think about it. Dave owes you money/product that you are pretty sure you will never see. In steps the hero Dan that promises SOMETHING to pay you back. Getting anything is better than nothing, so you accept alternate parts to cover what you are owed. You don't get what you paid for, but you get something, so Dave no longer has to worry about you coming after him. Mission accomplished.

50 Star Wars Yokes at about $250 each? That's $12,500. Lets be conservative and say they cost Ram $100 in parts & labor. That leaves a whopping $7500 for Dan to live off of, and recover his massive debt that Dave owes him? Dan would have to be the WORST business man in history (behind Dave) to accept this arrangement as payment for his debt. He would never make a dime off of this sinking ship. The only logical explanation is that Dan is fronting for Dave to cover Dave's ass.

Think about it people. Don't be so naive.

BYOACians have a storied history of being RAMmed by RAM.   Over... and over... and over again.  
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on July 21, 2011, 03:43:35 pm
There is absolutely no logical explanation for this other than Dan is fronting for Dave to try and please the masses before the crap hits the fan with legal troubles. Think about it. Dave owes you money/product that you are pretty sure you will never see. In steps the hero Dan that promises SOMETHING to pay you back. Getting anything is better than nothing, so you accept alternate parts to cover what you are owed. You don't get what you paid for, but you get something, so Dave no longer has to worry about you coming after him. Mission accomplished.

50 Star Wars Yokes at about $250 each? That's $12,500. Lets be conservative and say they cost Ram $100 in parts & labor. That leaves a whopping $7500 for Dan to live off of, and recover his massive debt that Dave owes him? Dan would have to be the WORST business man in history (behind Dave) to accept this arrangement as payment for his debt. He would never make a dime off of this sinking ship. The only logical explanation is that Dan is fronting for Dave to cover Dave's ass.

Think about it people. Don't be so naive.

This is what Dan said:
Quote
I have in my possession the parts to build 200 Star Wars Yokes. I do have to have several parts welded and powder coated but I have all of the parts to make them.  At the current retail price of $350 that works out to $70K, MUCH more than the debt that is outstanding. And that is just ONE item. It takes me about two hours to build each one so the the only limitation right now is my time. I am fortunate enough to have a fiance that wants to help and understands how to build these controllers so it is not just me.  I am also working to complete several of the projects that Dave started, specifically the BZ bellows, the Tempest Spinner, and the SD - MH conversion boards.  Believe me there is more than enough assets in the company to take care of everyone, it will just take time.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on July 21, 2011, 03:46:14 pm
There is absolutely no logical explanation for this other than Dan is fronting for Dave to try and please the masses before the crap hits the fan with legal troubles. Think about it. Dave owes you money/product that you are pretty sure you will never see. In steps the hero Dan that promises SOMETHING to pay you back. Getting anything is better than nothing, so you accept alternate parts to cover what you are owed. You don't get what you paid for, but you get something, so Dave no longer has to worry about you coming after him. Mission accomplished.

50 Star Wars Yokes at about $250 each? That's $12,500. Lets be conservative and say they cost Ram $100 in parts & labor. That leaves a whopping $7500 for Dan to live off of, and recover his massive debt that Dave owes him? Dan would have to be the WORST business man in history (behind Dave) to accept this arrangement as payment for his debt. He would never make a dime off of this sinking ship. The only logical explanation is that Dan is fronting for Dave to cover Dave's ass.

Think about it people. Don't be so naive.

BYOACians have a storied history of being RAMmed by RAM.   Over... and over... and over again.  

You are totally coming off like an ass dude. I realize you are coming from a good place and trying to do good, but really all you've done is bully anyone who disagrees with you.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 21, 2011, 03:47:41 pm
Dan has also said he's now the sole owner of RAM yet has provided exactly ZERO proof.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 21, 2011, 03:50:20 pm
There is absolutely no logical explanation for this other than Dan is fronting for Dave to try and please the masses before the crap hits the fan with legal troubles. Think about it. Dave owes you money/product that you are pretty sure you will never see. In steps the hero Dan that promises SOMETHING to pay you back. Getting anything is better than nothing, so you accept alternate parts to cover what you are owed. You don't get what you paid for, but you get something, so Dave no longer has to worry about you coming after him. Mission accomplished.

50 Star Wars Yokes at about $250 each? That's $12,500. Lets be conservative and say they cost Ram $100 in parts & labor. That leaves a whopping $7500 for Dan to live off of, and recover his massive debt that Dave owes him? Dan would have to be the WORST business man in history (behind Dave) to accept this arrangement as payment for his debt. He would never make a dime off of this sinking ship. The only logical explanation is that Dan is fronting for Dave to cover Dave's ass.

Think about it people. Don't be so naive.

BYOACians have a storied history of being RAMmed by RAM.   Over... and over... and over again.  

You are totally coming off like an ass dude. I realize you are coming from a good place and trying to do good, but really all you've done is bully anyone who disagrees with you.

If me "coming off like an ass" saves a single person a single dollar... I've done my job.  I'll accept the "ass" label gladly.  

On the other hand... if you encouraging people to give Dan a chance causes a single person to LOSE a single dollar... where does that put you Lew?

You've been around long enough to have seen this pattern.  My quoted comment applies...  Backside still sore or has it healed up enough to take another round?  

I'm an "ass"...

You're possibly helping a copy known to have "scammed people out of thousands of dollars"...

I'll be the ass... thank you.

EDIT: Handle temporarily changed in honor of Lew.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: HaRuMaN on July 21, 2011, 03:54:42 pm
lol who changed your name?  :laugh2:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 21, 2011, 03:55:48 pm
lol who changed your name?  :laugh2:

I did... of course.

I'd rather be an ass than a fool.

PS: Anyone who has a problem with my campaign against RAM CONTROLS to the point they think "less of me" isn't the type of person I would want to associate with anyway.  Y'all can take that as you wish... I think it's pretty apparent I couldn't care less.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on July 21, 2011, 03:59:06 pm
There is absolutely no logical explanation for this other than Dan is fronting for Dave to try and please the masses before the crap hits the fan with legal troubles. Think about it. Dave owes you money/product that you are pretty sure you will never see. In steps the hero Dan that promises SOMETHING to pay you back. Getting anything is better than nothing, so you accept alternate parts to cover what you are owed. You don't get what you paid for, but you get something, so Dave no longer has to worry about you coming after him. Mission accomplished.

50 Star Wars Yokes at about $250 each? That's $12,500. Lets be conservative and say they cost Ram $100 in parts & labor. That leaves a whopping $7500 for Dan to live off of, and recover his massive debt that Dave owes him? Dan would have to be the WORST business man in history (behind Dave) to accept this arrangement as payment for his debt. He would never make a dime off of this sinking ship. The only logical explanation is that Dan is fronting for Dave to cover Dave's ass.

Think about it people. Don't be so naive.

BYOACians have a storied history of being RAMmed by RAM.   Over... and over... and over again.  

You are totally coming off like an ass dude. I realize you are coming from a good place and trying to do good, but really all you've done is bully anyone who disagrees with you.

If me "coming off line an ass" saves a single person a single dollar... I've done my job.  I'll accept the "ass" label gladly. 

On the other hand... if you encouraging people to give Dan a chance causes a single person to LOSE a single dollar... where does that put you Lew?

You've been around long enough to have seen this pattern. 

I'm an "ass"...

You're possibly helping a copy known to have "scammed people out of thousands of dollars"...

I'll be the ass... thank you.

If the asshat fits...

From what I can tell, people are getting their orders accordingly to how Dan said they would. All you've done is bullied people who have placed orders into not posting, since they are "part of the problem" they are scared to post. I see no proof that all your chest thumping is stopping a single person from ordering. I've said my warnings and I'm not encouraging people to purchase from RAM without protecting themselves. You don't have to be an ass to get your point across.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 21, 2011, 04:02:39 pm
There is a lot going on that you don't have a clue about Lew.  I'll leave it at that.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on July 21, 2011, 04:08:59 pm
There is a lot going on that you don't have a clue about Lew.  I'll leave it at that.

Are you saying I'm Clewless?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on July 21, 2011, 04:15:34 pm
Leap also stated by Dan days ago

Quote
1: A batch of 50 more SW yokes. Once this batch is complete I should be able to take care of everyone who is owed a Star Wars Yoke but has not received it.

I guess you missed my post where the list of parts and moneys owed was not shrinking but growing
and as of to date its 42k  and I dont argue Dan isnt sending out any new orders.
but with the legal procedings why would he even need a plan to compensate those on that list
its techinacally not his problem and theres nothing to gain from a buisness stand point.
Yeah yeah save the Name Ram Controls.
Nevermind the fact that 200 let alone 50 sales of yokes is something that will take years to do.
if RamControls was profitable or for that matter any other arcade repro biz was (including my own)
Ram wouldnt be where it is today-IMO

still waiting for Dan to chime in
still waiting for Dan to prove he is sole owner (just not enough of an owner to avoid being sued)
and still waiting for "Dan" to reveal his ebay power seller stats despite the multiple requests.
 
theres something else at play here and only CaptAss can save us
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 21, 2011, 04:16:38 pm
There is a lot going on that you don't have a clue about Lew.  I'll leave it at that.

Are you saying I'm Clewless?

Hahaha... naw... just uninformed RE: this specific situation.

I still love ya though.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on July 21, 2011, 04:26:16 pm
theres something else at play here and only CaptAss can save us
:laugh2:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 21, 2011, 04:39:48 pm
theres something else at play here and only CaptAss can save us
:laugh2:

I so need a new avatar...

 :angel:

EDIT: Fixed
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Donkey_Kong on July 21, 2011, 06:06:20 pm
theres something else at play here and only CaptAss can save us
:laugh2:

I so need a new avatar...

 :angel:

EDIT: Fixed

Where is the Capt. Ass' cape?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 21, 2011, 07:06:42 pm
theres something else at play here and only CaptAss can save us
:laugh2:

I so need a new avatar...

 :angel:

EDIT: Fixed

Where is the Capt. Ass' cape?

Better?

 :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: nick3092 on July 21, 2011, 09:23:29 pm
Not sticking up for Dave/Dan/Ram/Whoever. But keeping a private list of who is owed what in this situation is pointless. I could tell you all ten people owe me a total of $1,000,000 each. But I can't tell you who.

BS. If it's a public lawsuit, and you are in fact owed that, then say so. I'm not saying it isn't true, but people accuse Dan of keeping secrets, so how is this different?

And for the record, I had a year of drama with Dave in acquiring a yoke. And if this is Dave pulling a scam pretending to be Dan, then he deserves this. But if it is someone trying to make Ram legit, then last time I checked our country ran on the innocent until proven guilty platform.

Not to mention in this day and age there is plenty of consumer protection with credit cards. You don't get a product in 30 days, file a dispute. You get your money back right away. So there is no reason any one should have to get ripped off.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Donkey_Kong on July 21, 2011, 09:54:22 pm
theres something else at play here and only CaptAss can save us
:laugh2:

I so need a new avatar...

 :angel:

EDIT: Fixed

Where is the Capt. Ass' cape?

Better?

 :cheers:

Perfect!  :lol
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Nephasth on July 21, 2011, 10:04:27 pm
theres something else at play here and only CaptAss can save us
:laugh2:

I so need a new avatar...

 :angel:

EDIT: Fixed

Where is the Capt. Ass' cape?

Better?

 :cheers:

KLOV Police? Aren't you out of your jurisdiction?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 21, 2011, 10:10:19 pm
I moonlight as BYOAC Secret Security... just be quiet about it... it's a secret.

Also... there is a new interesting development over at KLOV.  It seems the guy who's paypal account was being used at some point in RAM's history is posting that Dave Adams is actually named Adam Judd...

Of course the guy is a newb and could just be spouting off BS... but he DID post his phone number...

This ordeal is getting really really strange...

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Nephasth on July 21, 2011, 10:38:38 pm
I moonlight as BYOAC Secret Security... just be quiet about it... it's a secret.

 :laugh2:

It is kind of weird that Dan has made much more communication over here than at KLOV. Also he registered here on 6/14/11 but registered at KLOV on 3/14/11...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on July 21, 2011, 10:50:03 pm
especailly since the BIGGER problem was on KLOV

but as this continues to unwravill new info on "Dave" seems to have surfaced
time to start sculpting the mash potatoes again because if any of this new news is true
Im sure this means something

http://www.courtreference.com/Riverside-County-California-Courts.htm (http://www.courtreference.com/Riverside-County-California-Courts.htm)

Link (http://www.peoplesmart.com/psp.aspx?_act=resultsgo&search=public&firstName=adam&lastName=judd&city=&state=CA&recordType=1&cam=1305&utm_source=CourtReference.com&utm_medium=banners&utm_campaign=728x90&utm_content=728public)

(http://www.thisoldgame.com/Pics/RiversideCourt.jpg)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: wonder1 on July 21, 2011, 10:52:36 pm
Quote
Not to mention in this day and age there is plenty of consumer protection with credit cards. You don't get a product in 30 days, file a dispute. You get your money back right away. So there is no reason any one should have to get ripped off.

Unbelievable

I have many email from David stating that they are ready and SOME have all ready been shipped.Mine will be the next one,so don't panic.
When you don't have anything to sell me and tell me you do and then take my money its called FRAUD.

I was fed tons of bull,just so I could go over the 30 day with all the emails to prove it.Yes i have been in contact with Dan?????,but how long do you think I be waiting to get my$3250.00 returned.The list just keeps getting bigger.

Quote
BS. If it's a public lawsuit, and you are in fact owed that, then say so. I'm not saying it isn't true, but people accuse Dan of keeping secrets, so how is this different?

Some people are to embarrassed to admit that they got stung by this scam,i couldn't care less and i am owed $3250.00.

Quote
And for the record, I had a year of drama with Dave in acquiring a yoke. And if this is Dave pulling a scam pretending to be Dan, then he deserves this. But if it is someone trying to make Ram legit, then last time I checked our country ran on the innocent until proven guilty platform.

That right, all this is made up and my cockpit is in transit. :laugh2:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: wonder1 on July 21, 2011, 11:01:21 pm
I moonlight as BYOAC Secret Security... just be quiet about it... it's a secret.

 :laugh2:

It is kind of weird that Dan has made much more communication over here than at KLOV. Also he registered here on 6/14/11 but registered at KLOV on 3/14/11...

more people are probably owed money.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on July 21, 2011, 11:05:53 pm
So how about it "Dan" "Dave" "Jim Bloomquist" care to comment on any of this new info?
or even adress questions and concerns brought up many times over here just to be ignored?
Im sure inquiring minds would like to know and help you continue to save the Ram Brand
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Nephasth on July 21, 2011, 11:09:24 pm
I moonlight as BYOAC Secret Security... just be quiet about it... it's a secret.

 :laugh2:

It is kind of weird that Dan has made much more communication over here than at KLOV. Also he registered here on 6/14/11 but registered at KLOV on 3/14/11...

more people are probably owed money.

As rikitiki said, the BIGGER problem is on KLOV, and he only has 5 posts over there. All within the past few days, yet he's been registered over there for months (even a day before he took control of RAM). WTF.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: channelmaniac on July 21, 2011, 11:24:18 pm
As rikitiki said, the BIGGER problem is on KLOV, and he only has 5 posts over there. All within the past few days, yet he's been registered over there for months (even a day before he allegedly took control of RAM). WTF.

Fixed.

As Frizz said, there has been no proof brought forward that he actually did take control of RAM.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on July 21, 2011, 11:28:07 pm
But if it is someone trying to make Ram legit, then last time I checked our country ran on the innocent until proven guilty platform.

Actually in this country, financial matters like this are often the quite the opposite. Ask anyone who has had their wages garnished if they were subject to a trial. Ask anyone who has had their wages levied if they were found guilty by a judge first.

This is because legally, any purchase is considered a binding contract. Any purchase made with RAM controls is a financial obligation for RAM to either fulfill the agreement, or void the agreement by repaying the debt. In short, the fact that people have unfulfilled purchases alone deems RAM controls liable and must in turn be the ones to prove innocence.

Like I mentioned before, I worked for a company that went bankrupt. Before then, we were not paying for a number of goods and services, in turn we got levied up the ass by everyone we screwed. The only thing we could do is file bankruptcy to stop the bleeding.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SuprSprint on July 22, 2011, 10:39:49 am
then last time I checked our country ran on the innocent until proven guilty platform.

Actually in this country, financial matters like this are often the quite the opposite. Ask anyone who has had their wages garnished if they were subject to a trial. Ask anyone who has had their wages levied if they were found guilty by a judge first.

I was about to post a similar comment, but I need to correct yours a bit. You cannot execute a garnishment without first obtaining a judgment in open court.  The defendant may not show up (and often does not), but you still have to present to the judge and have a ruling. As a former landlord I've been there, done that, many times....

That said, "innocent until proven guilty" ONLY applies to the government in criminal cases where the state is attempting to deprive you of life, liberty, or property. Civil matters are a simple preponderance of the evidence, with "fractions" of responsibility being common. You can even be the victim (of a car crash for example) and still be found to be 10% (or whatever) responsible.

Also, a private citizen is under no burden to uphold the standard of innocent until proven guilty. For example, I have deemed Casey Anthony and will impose my sentance of her being a persona non grata should we ever cross paths.  Absolutely nothing "illegal" about that.  But the state/government could not prove her guilty (of a felony), and they must treat her as any other citizen henceforth.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SuprSprint on July 22, 2011, 11:26:36 am
Which they should, because she didn't do it.

I disagree, but that is way OT.  Let's take it here;

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=113231.0 (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=113231.0)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on July 22, 2011, 10:10:39 pm
Yeah BAck on topic.

Wait for it.... :timebomb:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SuprSprint on July 23, 2011, 12:49:04 am
Dan Johnson is a actually Jim Bloomquist.  :dizzy:

http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showpost.php?p=1708876&postcount=607 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showpost.php?p=1708876&postcount=607)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 23, 2011, 11:16:45 am
I fail to see how someone could NOT see this as a shady operation...

Signed,

Capt. Ass

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on July 23, 2011, 12:24:28 pm
Dan Johnson is a actually Jim Bloomquist.  :dizzy:

http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showpost.php?p=1708876&postcount=607 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showpost.php?p=1708876&postcount=607)

and for those that dont know what that means
go back and read my post #325

then maybe reread this entire thread and see if you come to the same conclusion.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Nephasth on July 23, 2011, 12:42:03 pm
...many names, one ugly face. So there was no "transfer of stock", just the same people trying to run the same scam with a different name...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: bheineck on July 25, 2011, 11:18:25 pm
There is so much new information coming to light on this over on the KLOV forums. Who knows where this will go. Dan/Jim still sounds like he is planning to continue. There are a lot of lies so trust is a big issue. I personally don't know what to think. I still don't see a scam in what Dan/Jim is doing, but proceed with extreme caution if you dare.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SuprSprint on July 25, 2011, 11:26:13 pm
I still don't see a scam in what Dan/Jim is doing

Really???  You don't see history repeating itself?  You see nothing wrong with lying about who you are and your relationship with a crook who has ripped off many of your friends? For reference;

Jim/Dan Lie #1
Quote from: Dan_Ram;1708876
As far as my connection to David / Adam, when I took this over the contract stipulated that he would assist me in continuing this venture. This assistance included training on how to assemble controllers, assisting me with resupply of parts, and help in designing new products. We are not financially connected.

Jim/Dan Lie #2
Quote from: Dan_Ram;1711869
while I am not happy with the situation until I am completely up to speed on all aspects of Ram Controls I unfortunately still need his help.

Jim/Dan Lie #3
Quote from: Dan_Ram;1711992
at the time I took Ram Controls over I considered both him and Errol a friend.

Jim/Dan Lie #4 (contradiction pending)
Quote from: Dan_Ram;1711869
Adam is a friend of mine and I am trying to help him out.

Bottom line, he lied because he knew people would not buy from him if they knew.  i.e. he defrauded his customers.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Bender on July 26, 2011, 08:22:55 am
so what IS Jim's relationship with Dave/Adam?


Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Nephasth on July 26, 2011, 08:34:57 am
Either his partner in the scam (knowing or not), or one of Dave/Adam's split personalities he's created to cope with himself.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 26, 2011, 08:56:51 am
so what IS Jim's relationship with Dave/Adam?




Per Jim/Dan - Good friend,  ex-roommate.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on July 26, 2011, 12:10:04 pm
An interresting post from KLOV from your "Non Arcade guy/Victim" Jim Bloomquist AKA Dan Johnston
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=49165&highlight=arcademovers (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=49165&highlight=arcademovers)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on July 26, 2011, 01:06:35 pm
so what IS Jim's relationship with Dave/Adam?

Per Jim/Dan - Good friend,  ex-roommate.


(http://willmorecity.com/frankackerman/furley.jpg)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ahofle on July 26, 2011, 01:11:28 pm
 :laugh2:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 26, 2011, 03:16:47 pm
So can I call Dave/Adam & Dan/Jim a --cream-filled twinkie-- now without being PMed by the masses accusing me of conspiring to keep them from a SW yoke?

  :soapbox:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on July 26, 2011, 07:54:15 pm
So can I call Dave/Adam & Dan/Jim a --cream-filled twinkie-- now without being PMed by the masses accusing me of conspiring to keep them from a SW yoke?

You've been holding back?!
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Donkey_Kong on July 26, 2011, 09:01:16 pm
An interresting post from KLOV from your "Non Arcade guy/Victim" Jim Bloomquist AKA Dan Johnston
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=49165&highlight=arcademovers (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=49165&highlight=arcademovers)


Does that mean that Dan = Jim = Dave ?  Sorry I can't quite keep up anymore...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on July 26, 2011, 10:38:55 pm
An interresting post from KLOV from your "Non Arcade guy/Victim" Jim Bloomquist AKA Dan Johnston
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=49165&highlight=arcademovers (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=49165&highlight=arcademovers)


Does that mean that Dan = Jim = Dave ?  Sorry I can't quite keep up anymore...

The whole thing is really quite simple, honestly people, you should follow this better.

It all started one day when Jim wished on a magic zoltar machine to be big. The next day he grew 15 years older and moved to the city to start his new life. He met Dave, a man who he was switched at birth with, but they only found out just now. Coincidentally, they were also twins separated at birth at the same time. Quickly after Jim and Dave met, they became close friends. They decided to trade places with each other when Jim wanted to be a smelly hobo. Unfortunately, Jim was instead mistaken to be a federal agent by a ring of spies that were out to kill him. In Desperation, Jim and Dave decided to move into an all female apartment complex disguised as women. This plan was foiled, however, when a furry cat eating alien crashed into their garage which caused them to move in with their cousin from the island of Mypos. Jim, being constantly duped into Dave's half-brained schemes was tricked into to joining an all girls soccer team as means to pay for their next residence. He donned a wig and went by the name Danielle. At least until Dave died. Luckily he was given a second chance at life by coming back as a multimillionaire named Adam. Adam spent fortune in stock for Head-on roll on headache reliever and lost it all. As a last ditch effort to win it all back, he borrowed from intergalactic loan sharks to finance Ram Controls. The failed pyramid finance strategies angered the Jabba the Hutt, who had lost substantial credits to Adam's phoney venture. Adam reassumed the name Dave, but was still hunted down for the credits he never returned to the godfather of Tatooine, and was soon captured and frozen in carbonite. Danielle, now shortened to Dan, decided to do whatever it takes to repay the debt and bring Dave back from his carbon stasis. Dan tried to bring back Ram Controls and get money however he could. After ruffing up potheads for their debt and eating their cheeseburgers, he was shot 6 times point plank with a magnum revolver but every shot missed him. Now after having a personal revelation, Dan decided come clean about his shenanigans on the KLOV forum and then set off to wander the earth and hitchhike down lonely roads, only to find he cannot escape his past as he turns into the incredible hulk on a weekly basis.

See, it's really not that hard to follow this at all.  :dunno
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: vorghagen on July 26, 2011, 11:35:52 pm
 :laugh2:

The sad thing is, that probably makes more sense than the truth.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: saint on July 27, 2011, 09:17:16 am
Anyone here who hasn't read the KLOV forum threads on Ram Controls should. Caveat emptor.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Hoopz on July 27, 2011, 09:23:53 am
Anyone here who hasn't read the KLOV forum threads on Ram Controls should. Caveat emptor.
That's like saying someone here should read the 48 page light gun thread.   :dizzy:

Just don't buy from thieves and it's all good.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on July 27, 2011, 09:30:05 am
How many people on this forum are still owed?  I guess we can rule out people on both.  We have to be getting close enough for saint to flick Ram Controls off the BYOAC countertop.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on July 27, 2011, 11:26:53 am
LMAO  :laugh2:
makes perfect sense now.
and pay no attention to the man behind the curtin

An interresting post from KLOV from your "Non Arcade guy/Victim" Jim Bloomquist AKA Dan Johnston
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=49165&highlight=arcademovers (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=49165&highlight=arcademovers)


Does that mean that Dan = Jim = Dave ?  Sorry I can't quite keep up anymore...

The whole thing is really quite simple, honestly people, you should follow this better.

It all started one day when Jim wished on a magic zoltar machine to be big. The next day he grew 15 years older and moved to the city to start his new life. He met Dave, a man who he was switched at birth with, but they only found out just now. Coincidentally, they were also twins separated at birth at the same time. Quickly after Jim and Dave met, they became close friends. They decided to trade places with each other when Jim wanted to be a smelly hobo. Unfortunately, Jim was instead mistaken to be a federal agent by a ring of spies that were out to kill him. In Desperation, Jim and Dave decided to move into an all female apartment complex disguised as women. This plan was foiled, however, when a furry cat eating alien crashed into their garage which caused them to move in with their cousin from the island of Mypos. Jim, being constantly duped into Dave's half-brained schemes was tricked into to joining an all girls soccer team as means to pay for their next residence. He donned a wig and went by the name Danielle. At least until Dave died. Luckily he was given a second chance at life by coming back as a multimillionaire named Adam. Adam spent fortune in stock for Head-on roll on headache reliever and lost it all. As a last ditch effort to win it all back, he borrowed from intergalactic loan sharks to finance Ram Controls. The failed pyramid finance strategies angered the Jabba the Hutt, who had lost substantial credits to Adam's phoney venture. Adam reassumed the name Dave, but was still hunted down for the credits he never returned to the godfather of Tatooine, and was soon captured and frozen in carbonite. Danielle, now shortened to Dan, decided to do whatever it takes to repay the debt and bring Dave back from his carbon stasis. Dan tried to bring back Ram Controls and get money however he could. After ruffing up potheads for their debt and eating their cheeseburgers, he was shot 6 times point plank with a magnum revolver but every shot missed him. Now after having a personal revelation, Dan decided come clean about his shenanigans on the KLOV forum and then set off to wander the earth and hitchhike down lonely roads, only to find he cannot escape his past as he turns into the incredible hulk on a weekly basis.

See, it's really not that hard to follow this at all.  :dunno
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Hoopz on July 27, 2011, 11:47:49 am
LMAO  :laugh2:
makes perfect sense now.
and pay no attention to the man behind the curtin

James Van Der Beek?   :laugh2:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 27, 2011, 11:57:53 am
So can I call Dave/Adam & Dan/Jim a --cream-filled twinkie-- now without being PMed by the masses accusing me of conspiring to keep them from a SW yoke?

You've been holding back?!

Funny way to say "I'm sorry Friz... you were right again."

 >:D
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Donkey_Kong on July 27, 2011, 12:01:05 pm
So can I call Dave/Adam & Dan/Jim a --cream-filled twinkie-- now without being PMed by the masses accusing me of conspiring to keep them from a SW yoke?

You've been holding back?!

Funny way to say "I'm sorry Friz... you were right again."

 >:D

Just a weee subtle for sig fodder? 
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 27, 2011, 12:38:23 pm
So can I call Dave/Adam & Dan/Jim a --cream-filled twinkie-- now without being PMed by the masses accusing me of conspiring to keep them from a SW yoke?

You've been holding back?!

Funny way to say "I'm sorry Friz... you were right again."

 >:D

Just a weee subtle for sig fodder? 

I've been warned... only 2 ego-boosts per sig says brother saint...

 :dunno
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on July 27, 2011, 02:46:37 pm
So can I call Dave/Adam & Dan/Jim a --cream-filled twinkie-- now without being PMed by the masses accusing me of conspiring to keep them from a SW yoke?

You've been holding back?!

Funny way to say "I'm sorry Friz... you were right again."

 >:D

Seeing as how I don't disagree with your message, just the delivery. No apology needed.

In this case, killing the messenger is appropriate.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on July 27, 2011, 02:48:13 pm

Gotta say constantly saying that Ram Controls is a scam is a little like constantly saying the KC Royals are going to suck.  It's not exactly putting yourself out there on a risky limb.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on July 27, 2011, 02:53:28 pm
Gotta say constantly saying that Ram Controls is a scam is a little like constantly saying the KC Royals are going to suck. 

Don't you mean "TAINTED SCAM CONTROLS!!! I WILL PERSONALLY KILL YOU AND YOUR FAMILY IF YOU BUY A STAR WARS YOKE FROM SCAM CONTROLS YOU SACK OF CRAP!!!!"
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 27, 2011, 02:54:30 pm
Gotta say constantly saying that Ram Controls is a scam is a little like constantly saying the KC Royals are going to suck. 

Don't you mean "TAINTED SCAM CONTROLS!!! I WILL PERSONALLY KILL YOU AND YOUR FAMILY IF YOU BUY A STAR WARS YOKE FROM SCAM CONTROLS YOU SACK OF CRAP!!!!"

Hyperbole anyone?

 :laugh2:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on July 27, 2011, 02:57:09 pm
Gotta say constantly saying that Ram Controls is a scam is a little like constantly saying the KC Royals are going to suck. 

Don't you mean "TAINTED SCAM CONTROLS!!! I WILL PERSONALLY KILL YOU AND YOUR FAMILY IF YOU BUY A STAR WARS YOKE FROM SCAM CONTROLS YOU SACK OF CRAP!!!!"

Hyperbole anyone?

 :laugh2:

 :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Namco on July 28, 2011, 04:47:14 pm
Geez. I come back with a renewed arcade thirst to see what new projects people are working on and end up wasting my time reading hundreds of posts about RAM controls.  :dizzy:

However it was a pretty entertaining way to spend my lunch hour.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Paul Olson on July 29, 2011, 04:18:32 am
Geez. I come back with a renewed arcade thirst to see what new projects people are working on and end up wasting my time reading hundreds of posts about RAM controls.  :dizzy:

However it was a pretty entertaining way to spend my lunch hour.

That must be a really long hour!
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on July 29, 2011, 08:31:33 am
I have added a quick update to my prior warning posted on the RAM Controls page in the wiki:

http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/wiki/Ram_Controls (http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/wiki/Ram_Controls)

Mclemore over at KLOV has suggested the perhaps we should remove the stuff that "Dave" wrote which can't be verified as much of it may be false. I dunno -- I think that the entry shows the depth of the scam and, to my mind, that is a good thing.

Thoughts on what to do with the wiki entry ?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Hoopz on July 29, 2011, 08:35:26 am
Leave it in.  It not only shows the depth of the scam but also shows the history of what's been happening.  The fact that the line is included showing that "Dave" wrote it AND that it may not be accurate gives everyone enough information to base their opinions on.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Hoopz on July 29, 2011, 08:37:27 am
Any reason that the stickied thread on Ram and this thread haven't been merged?  Would it make sense to do so?  I know multiple (?) people have posted wondering where the rest of the thread went because they were in one thread and got confused that they weren't in the other.

Odds of Dave/Dan/Harpal Jr ever posting again here?   :dunno
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: saint on July 29, 2011, 09:14:20 am
The conversations will be threaded amongst each other, and I thought that would be confusing. I can merge them if people want.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Hoopz on July 29, 2011, 09:16:59 am
The conversations will be threaded amongst each other, and I thought that would be confusing. I can merge them if people want.
I thought that may be the case.  I dont know if it would be more confusing to merge them or not.  I'd say this thread may need to be stickied either in addition to the other one or in place of. 
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: GibsonRiddler on July 29, 2011, 07:14:12 pm
I have added a quick update to my prior warning posted on the RAM Controls page in the wiki:

http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/wiki/Ram_Controls (http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/wiki/Ram_Controls)

Mclemore over at KLOV has suggested the perhaps we should remove the stuff that "Dave" wrote which can't be verified as much of it may be false. I dunno -- I think that the entry shows the depth of the scam and, to my mind, that is a good thing.

Thoughts on what to do with the wiki entry ?

I would leave it the way it is with the warning. With as big as this is getting. All info out there will help people learn what has happened.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Gray_Area on July 30, 2011, 08:50:40 pm
I don't know how frequented the wiki is.....

I suggest archiving the two threads, and creating a new, stickied thread containing a summarized 'statement of events', with the archived threads linked for those wanting to....research.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on July 31, 2011, 09:04:45 am

Wouldn't it be easier to just say DO NOT BUY FROM RAM CONTROLS rather than all that work documenting what are pretty much unsubstantiated claims from all sides?  Yeah, we all have a decent idea of the truth here, but nobody really knows exactly which claims from any party are true.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on July 31, 2011, 02:06:01 pm

DO NOT BUY FROM RAM CONTROLS

...there must be an echo in here?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on July 31, 2011, 03:44:23 pm

DO NOT BUY FROM RAM CONTROLS

...there must be an echo in here?

You must be thinking of when I said it earlier.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SavannahLion on July 31, 2011, 10:41:19 pm
The conversations will be threaded amongst each other, and I thought that would be confusing. I can merge them if people want.

Leave them be or sticky them. It's hard enough keeping up with all the ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- without having to sort through which post belongs to which conversation thread.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on August 02, 2011, 01:42:18 pm
Both should be stickied for a time...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on August 03, 2011, 12:47:28 pm
Where/how does this Brett guy fit into the scam? Accomplice or victim?
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=102047.msg1080341 (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=102047.msg1080341)

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: saint on August 03, 2011, 01:48:09 pm
Where/how does this Brett guy fit into the scam? Accomplice or victim?
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=102047.msg1080341 (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=102047.msg1080341)



Victim as far as I understand from reading KLOV. Had some partnership agreement to make the sit-down cabinets, got short end of stick.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Spyridon on August 03, 2011, 04:48:02 pm
Where/how does this Brett guy fit into the scam? Accomplice or victim?
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=102047.msg1080341 (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=102047.msg1080341)



Victim as far as I understand from reading KLOV. Had some partnership agreement to make the sit-down cabinets, got short end of stick.

Yeah, Brett is a good guy and got screwed by Ram Controls.  Definitely not part of the problem.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: DashRendar on August 04, 2011, 05:54:51 pm
Just spent the afternoon reading through all 12 pages of this thread...good Lord.

Seeing Brett's work shows that the SW cabinets can be made.  Guessing they each take a long time to do though.

Since he's not part of RAM Controls, I wonder if someone else would want to pick up that project...

 :applaud:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: HaRuMaN on August 05, 2011, 10:00:45 am
Just spent the afternoon reading through all 12 pages of this thread...good Lord.

Seeing Brett's work shows that the SW cabinets can be made.  Guessing they each take a long time to do though.

Since he's not part of RAM Controls, I wonder if someone else would want to pick up that project...

 :applaud:

I would say the biggest problem to that would be a source for color XY monitors...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: newmanfamilyvlogs on August 05, 2011, 11:21:38 am
Just spent the afternoon reading through all 12 pages of this thread...good Lord.

Seeing Brett's work shows that the SW cabinets can be made.  Guessing they each take a long time to do though.

Since he's not part of RAM Controls, I wonder if someone else would want to pick up that project...

 :applaud:

I would say the biggest problem to that would be a source for color XY monitors...

Meh, just re-wind the yoke and have someone repo new HV boards:
http://www.jrok.com/xfer/xystuff/ (http://www.jrok.com/xfer/xystuff/)

(:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on August 05, 2011, 03:30:29 pm
These guys make vector to vga convertors. Just use a new LCD.
http://www.teamist.com/vectorvga.html (http://www.teamist.com/vectorvga.html)

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: HaRuMaN on August 05, 2011, 03:33:55 pm
These guys make vector to vga convertors. Just use a new LCD.
http://www.teamist.com/vectorvga.html (http://www.teamist.com/vectorvga.html)



I would think that you would know that's hardly the same...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on August 06, 2011, 02:53:16 pm
These guys make vector to vga convertors. Just use a new LCD.
http://www.teamist.com/vectorvga.html (http://www.teamist.com/vectorvga.html)
I would think that you would know that's hardly the same...
I wouldn't bet on there ever being a repro of a real one. Not enough demand.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Xiaou2 on August 08, 2011, 01:49:40 am
Quote
I wouldn't bet on there ever being a repro of a real one. Not enough demand.

 I dont know about that.

 There are hundreds of thousands of vector games out there in the wild.  Even if the game has been gutted.. people who love the things could easily pick up a new vector monitor and power it by a vector-mame equivalent.

 The sales to people to make their own dedicated Tempest alone would probably be quite numerous.  Starwars is also a huge draw. 

 There simply is nothing like a true vector monitor... except possibly a laser projector.   However, from what I understand, is that a good 3 color laser projector is mega expensive.  Much more so than a typical vector monitor.  They are not as fast and fluid as a VM either.  (a lot more flicker)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on August 08, 2011, 10:07:58 am
Quote
I wouldn't bet on there ever being a repro of a real one. Not enough demand.

 I dont know about that.

 There are hundreds of thousands of vector games out there in the wild.  Even if the game has been gutted.. people who love the things could easily pick up a new vector monitor and power it by a vector-mame equivalent.

 The sales to people to make their own dedicated Tempest alone would probably be quite numerous.  Starwars is also a huge draw. 

 There simply is nothing like a true vector monitor... except possibly a laser projector.   However, from what I understand, is that a good 3 color laser projector is mega expensive.  Much more so than a typical vector monitor.  They are not as fast and fluid as a VM either.  (a lot more flicker)

Let me see, do I consider the opinion of Ray, who has owned classic machines and actually sold me the oldest machine in my collection (older than my vectors).

Or do I believe Xiaou2, who has apparently never actually owned a vector.

There simply aren't hundreds of thousands of vector games out in the wild.  A simple look at the build numbers for the games in question, coupled with the number of G08 fires,  would put that silly notion to rest.

VectorVGA has been around for a long time ... hasn't really rung any bells as yet.

 ::)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Xiaou2 on August 08, 2011, 10:25:18 am
Cheffo, the unwitting troll...  Ohh yes, I DO in fact own a Vector game.  Asteroids Delxue to be exact.

And in fact, currently, I also have a Sega Turbo, Spy Hunter, Black Knight 2000, Williams Indiana Jones pinball, Willaims Fire pinball.  Sold off the TX-1, and the Ice Cold Beer, and a non-working outrun cause I got sick of getting bad boards labeled as good off of ebay.

 Vectors were Huge in the 80s.  Almost every arcade in the world had at least one, if not several.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on August 08, 2011, 10:58:16 am
Almost every arcade in the world had at least one, if not several.



Even so, that does not equal "hundreds of thousands of vector games out there in the wild." Being incredibly generous and exaggatory, Lets say there were, oh, 15,000 arcades out the world in the early 80's. And if each of those arcades averaged 5 vector games. That would still equal only 75 thousand vector games. Not to mention the real numbers do not even come close.

Then you take the absolute decimation of cabinets since that time and you would cut even my silly exaggerated numbers down to a third of that.

Your math is bogus, calling Cheffo a troll doesn't change that fact.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Mikezilla on August 08, 2011, 12:17:33 pm
Holy ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- is Xiaou ruining another thread!?! I dont believe it!?! (Im labeling my posts with the appropriate tags now. This is obviously sarcasm.)

To say that there are hundreds of thousands of vector games out there is utterly ridiculous. Vigo was being nice when he mentioned those numbers. You are deranged if you think that. Cheffo isnt a troll, he is just putting you in your place, but you refuse to go there. Every. Single. Time.  ::)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Malenko on August 08, 2011, 12:24:57 pm
And in fact, currently, I also have a Sega Turbo, Spy Hunter, Black Knight 2000, Williams Indiana Jones pinball, Willaims Fire pinball.  Sold off the TX-1, and the Ice Cold Beer, and a non-working outrun cause I got sick of getting bad boards labeled as good off of ebay.

Those aren't vectors /pun. Hundreds of thousands in the wild? citation needed.

http://www.brentradio.com/ProductionNumbers.htm (http://www.brentradio.com/ProductionNumbers.htm)
Asteroids 47,840
Asteroids(cocktail) 8725
Asteroids (factory Lunar Lander conversion) 200
Asteroids Deluxe 18142
Asteriods Deluxe (cabaret) 1005
Asteroids Deluxe (cocktail) 3252
Battlezone 13022
Battlezone (cabaret) 2000
Red Baron 1500
Red Baron (cockpit) 504
Star Wars (cockpit) 2450
Star Wars (upright) 10245
Tempest (cabaret) 2176
Tempest (cocktail) 1663
Tempest 25112
War of the Worlds 10


That's about 135,000 but doesn't include every vector game, I cant find numbers on games like Omega Race. But it does include the most popular ones. I doubt its an additional 65,000 and even if it did, we'd have to assume every single vector ever made still works and none were destoryed, scrapped, broken, and or lit on fire/left in a barn.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: HaRuMaN on August 08, 2011, 12:37:55 pm
I have one of the 13022 Battlezones...   ;D
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on August 08, 2011, 01:05:39 pm
Quote
I wouldn't bet on there ever being a repro of a real one. Not enough demand.

 I dont know about that.

 There are hundreds of thousands of vector games out there in the wild.  

Huh?  Hundreds of thousands?  Orly?

...and then take in to consideration that different manufacturers X/Y monitors don't work with each other (for the most part)... and you can see... it would be a huge losing proposition to "manufacture" new X/Y monitors.  I also think it runs counter to current law as I think CRT monitors under a certain size are now illegal to manufacture in the U.S.


Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: tbombaci on August 08, 2011, 01:07:42 pm
Space Duel Upright : 11,017
Space Duel Cocktail : 1,019
Black Widow Upright : 1,550
Gravitar : 5,427
Quantum: ~500
Major Havoc dedicated: ~500 to ~600

There is another 20,000 for you.



Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: tbombaci on August 08, 2011, 01:20:21 pm
Then there are these:

Space Fury
Star Trek Upright
Star TrekCaptains Chair
Eliminator Upright
Eliminator Cocktail
Eliminator 4-player
Tac/Scan
Zektor

And these:

Armor Attack
Aztarac
Barrier
Cosmic Chasm
Demon
Earth Friend
QB-3
Rip Off
Solar Quest
Space Wars
Speed Freak
Star Castle
StarHawk
Sundance
Tail Gunner
The War of the Worlds
Warrior

So, there probably are hundreds of thousands.

Just Sayin.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on August 08, 2011, 02:24:21 pm
Then there are these:

Space Fury
Star Trek Upright
Star TrekCaptains Chair
Eliminator Upright
Eliminator Cocktail
Eliminator 4-player
Tac/Scan
Zektor

And these:

Armor Attack
Aztarac
Barrier
Cosmic Chasm
Demon
Earth Friend
QB-3
Rip Off
Solar Quest
Space Wars
Speed Freak
Star Castle
StarHawk
Sundance
Tail Gunner
The War of the Worlds
Warrior

So, there probably are hundreds of thousands.

Just Sayin.


Even with them all... and every one working... I'd be surprised if the number hit 200K which would be the point where it becomes "hundreds" of thousands.

... and what would you'r best guess be as to the percentage of Vector games still in operation?   Maybe 20% of the total number... maybe?  If that... and then there is the thing about the incompatibility between the different manufacturers... between color/b&w... etc... etc... etc...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: tbombaci on August 08, 2011, 02:35:07 pm

Even with them all... and every one working... I'd be surprised if the number hit 200K which would be the point where it becomes "hundreds" of thousands.

... and what would you'r best guess be as to the percentage of Vector games still in operation?   Maybe 20% of the total number... maybe?  If that... and then there is the thing about the incompatibility between the different manufacturers... between color/b&w... etc... etc... etc...


Probably less than 20%. I would say that the above titles would possibly add 30000 to the total number of vectors. With Star Castle at 14,000 and Space Wars at 10,000 confirmed and an additional 20,000 that possibly sold. (how exactly does that happen anyway).
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: HaRuMaN on August 08, 2011, 02:49:21 pm
I also think it runs counter to current law as I think CRT monitors under a certain size are now illegal to manufacture in the U.S.

Wot?  Source??
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on August 08, 2011, 02:52:53 pm
Yikes. All I am saying is the probability of anyone going through the trouble of making such a repro (even though it did come very close to happening some years ago) is very very low due to the complexities of making it and then recouping the investment. We're talking about large, heavy and to some extent fragile devices that will be expensive if run in low numbers; Expensive to ship to customers; Expensive to provide customer support. New CRT tubes are rare now and have to be imported from asia.

Anyone doing such a repro project would have to be rich and ready to lose money on the effort. Maybe this hobby has such a person, but I doubt it.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on August 08, 2011, 03:14:14 pm
I also think it runs counter to current law as I think CRT monitors under a certain size are now illegal to manufacture in the U.S.

Wot?  Source??

A quick google search found nothing but I put about 5 minutes in to it.  2-3 years ago W/G and others stopped manufacturing CRT monitors and I had read the reason was because regulations forbid CRT monitors under a certain size (25" I think it may be) from being manufactured in the states.  That is why all new 19" CRT's you get these days are from Korea, etc...

Perhaps Ken Layton or someone else more familiar will chime in.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: newmanfamilyvlogs on August 08, 2011, 03:22:58 pm
http://www.photonlexicon.com/forums/showthread.php/1073-My-homemade-laser-show-X-Y-scanner-%28pictures%29 (http://www.photonlexicon.com/forums/showthread.php/1073-My-homemade-laser-show-X-Y-scanner-%28pictures%29)

This is probably the closest to the original method of display that you'll be able to get, for vector monitor replacement. The prices for Red/Blue/Green laser diodes are dropping.. Someone could probably spec out a standard list of parts and sell it as a kit and generate output for it directly from mame (create the XY output as three discreet stereo waveforms (one pair per color) using something like a USB soundcard (there are USB soundcards that have 6 channel output for under $25)).
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on August 08, 2011, 03:51:03 pm
I also think it runs counter to current law as I think CRT monitors under a certain size are now illegal to manufacture in the U.S.

Wot?  Source??

I think that Frizz may actually be referring to the 25" limitation that worked the other way ... hence the emergence of the 24.8" CRT monitor.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on August 08, 2011, 03:57:44 pm
Even with them all... and every one working... I'd be surprised if the number hit 200K which would be the point where it becomes "hundreds" of thousands.

... and what would you'r best guess be as to the percentage of Vector games still in operation?   Maybe 20% of the total number... maybe?  If that... and then there is the thing about the incompatibility between the different manufacturers... between color/b&w... etc... etc... etc...

Exactly right ...

I have no doubt that there were hundreds of thousands of vector games on location.

If I choose my personal experience as a barometer (and I am willing to bet that I have seen more live vector cabs than most), then we are looking at less than a 10% survival rate.

Subtract from that the folks who wouldn't go for the VectorVGA (which is most, since Vector VGA has been around for years) and you end up with a number that is pretty damned small.

Not a new product and, while Xiaou2 may think otherwise, the market ended up being smaller than even the creator expected.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on August 08, 2011, 04:08:24 pm
calling Cheffo a troll doesn't change that fact.

But it is entertaining ...  ;D
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on August 08, 2011, 04:12:33 pm
Anyone doing such a repro project would have to want to be rich and ready to scam anybody on the effort. This hobby already has one of those and this thread is about him.

Fixt that for you
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SuprSprint on August 08, 2011, 04:52:11 pm
Anyone doing such a repro project would have to want to be rich and ready to scam anybody on the effort. This hobby already has one of those and this thread is about him.

Fixt that for you

That was my first thought.  Anyone heard from Dan/Jim/Errol lately? They have been mighty quiet here and on KLOV.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: DashRendar on August 08, 2011, 05:20:26 pm
I suspect he/they are still lurking, but probably not logged in.  They must be trying to figure out their next move.   :dizzy:

I did think it was interesting that Dan outed himself like that on the KLOV thread though.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Xiaou2 on August 08, 2011, 09:20:08 pm
So as, said, a LOT of vector games were made.  How many are still operational, and salvageable?  Who knows.   It seems that driver boards tended to fail more than the actual monitors themselves.

 Vectormame has been in existence for some time.  However, the biggest problems besides getting the funds together... was the fact that the Zector hardware needed to power the monitors was ran in limited runs few and far between.  Couple that with the idea of trying to pick up a used vector CRT in unknown and not so easily (if not impossible) for most to test (without the zektor available).. means poor acceptance / sales.

 And thats not even counting the fact that the software itself was not updated.


 And of course, then you have to consider that even if "X" amount of vectors were produced... does not mean that many More people would want their own.  If 1 Vector arcade machine was played by 500 individual people in the area, and only 2 of those previous players wanted to make their own replica cabinet today.. that could theoretically produce over 200,000 vector devices. (considering every vector game having the same level of interest)

 Realistically?  Not sure.  But there are a lot of classic fans, as well as collectors, who just cant accept the dismal results of a typical pc monitor.

 Didnt know about the MFG size changes, however, almost anything you want to actually make money on today has to be MFG in another country.  Especially if it has any level of complexity.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on August 08, 2011, 09:27:02 pm
Vectormame has been in existence for some time. 

Man, it would suck to confuse VectorVGA and VectorMAME ...  ::)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Mikezilla on August 09, 2011, 01:38:18 pm
Vectormame has been in existence for some time. 

Man, it would suck to confuse VectorVGA and VectorMAME ...  ::)

 :lol
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on August 09, 2011, 07:20:37 pm
Baby step... baby steps... little tiny baby steps... thats right... now big steps... 1... 2... 3... 4!

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: newmanfamilyvlogs on August 10, 2011, 05:41:34 am
Baby step... baby steps... little tiny baby steps... thats right... now big steps... 1... 2... 3... 4!


great, now all I'm going to hear all day is dj lance telling me how awesome everything is.

talking about ram controls with my friends .... is... AWESOME...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on August 10, 2011, 12:23:39 pm
Meh, just re-wind the yoke and have someone repo new HV boards:
http://www.jrok.com/xfer/xystuff/ (http://www.jrok.com/xfer/xystuff/)

(:


That's just crazy talk!
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: newmanfamilyvlogs on August 10, 2011, 04:16:44 pm
Meh, just re-wind the yoke and have someone repo new HV boards:
http://www.jrok.com/xfer/xystuff/ (http://www.jrok.com/xfer/xystuff/)

(:


That's just crazy talk!

no dude, that's the FUTURE!
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: LASooner on August 11, 2011, 02:14:21 am
Baby step... baby steps... little tiny baby steps... thats right... now big steps... 1... 2... 3... 4!


great, now all I'm going to hear all day is dj lance telling me how awesome everything is.

talking about ram controls with my friends .... is... AWESOME...


Wow, you guys are just hitting me where I'm currently living. Those songs haunt my nightmares.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on August 11, 2011, 05:19:03 pm
 :laugh2:

Oh yeah...

There's a party in my tummy... so yummy! so yummy!


Hahaha... at least it's not "I love you... you love me!"

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: spoot on August 11, 2011, 05:21:35 pm
I have a feeling I'm very glad I have no clue what you guys are rambling on about atm.   :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on August 11, 2011, 05:29:00 pm
I've only seen a couple episodes with my nieces, but it is a little kids show starring this DJ Lance guy and he has a box of toy people or something and they have a dance party.

(http://nocostl.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/DJ_Lance1.jpg)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: newmanfamilyvlogs on August 11, 2011, 11:17:51 pm
Yo gabba gabba is perhaps childrens programmings finest hour. I'm not even joking.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on August 12, 2011, 12:27:36 am
From the little that I saw, they were actually featuring real musicians. Something that I haven't seen since Sesame Street.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: amendonz on August 12, 2011, 01:44:28 am
yeah, its kinda an interesting watch.   8) 8) ;)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Woodshop Flunky on August 12, 2011, 11:44:57 am
Yo gabba gabba is perhaps children's programmings finest hour. I'm not even joking.

Seriously?  :dizzy:

That show is the most disturbing thing I've ever seen.  I watched about a minute of it and felt like I needed a shower. :)

All the kids shows these days seem like they'd just make kids dumber.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on August 12, 2011, 11:49:35 am
I would put it a step above telly tubbies and that nonsensical, repetitive stuff that was out around 10 years ago.

Nontheless, for my kid, I am currently preparing for his tv age by getting him vintage sesame street.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Mikezilla on August 12, 2011, 12:14:28 pm
I would put it a step above telly tubbies and that nonsensical, repetitive stuff that was out around 10 years ago.

Nontheless, for my kid, I am currently preparing for his tv age by getting him vintage sesame street.

Teletubbies are creepy as ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---. Not to mention there is some other show that shows half baby heads in some sort of blob, and they make all kinds of weird, creepy, blair witch sounds. I hate it!  :scared

You cant go wrong with vintage Sesame Street, that is timeless. That, and a healthy dose of Thundercats, He Man, and Transformers. Im going to be a sad panda if I dont have any boys.  ;D
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on August 12, 2011, 12:29:15 pm
I would put it a step above telly tubbies and that nonsensical, repetitive stuff that was out around 10 years ago.

Nontheless, for my kid, I am currently preparing for his tv age by getting him vintage sesame street.

Teletubbies are creepy as ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---. Not to mention there is some other show that shows half baby heads in some sort of blob, and they make all kinds of weird, creepy, blair witch sounds. I hate it!  :scared

You cant go wrong with vintage Sesame Street, that is timeless. That, and a healthy dose of Thundercats, He Man, and Transformers. Im going to be a sad panda if I dont have any boys.  ;D

hell yeah, my kid is gonna have some class.  :cheers:

 I think I know the show baby head show you are talking about. Those things that looked like sparkly breast implants with baby heads that pop out. Then they sit and roll around for 20 minutes. :scared
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Mikezilla on August 12, 2011, 01:04:17 pm
I would put it a step above telly tubbies and that nonsensical, repetitive stuff that was out around 10 years ago.

Nontheless, for my kid, I am currently preparing for his tv age by getting him vintage sesame street.

Teletubbies are creepy as ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---. Not to mention there is some other show that shows half baby heads in some sort of blob, and they make all kinds of weird, creepy, blair witch sounds. I hate it!  :scared

You cant go wrong with vintage Sesame Street, that is timeless. That, and a healthy dose of Thundercats, He Man, and Transformers. Im going to be a sad panda if I dont have any boys.  ;D

hell yeah, my kid is gonna have some class.  :cheers:

 I think I know the show baby head show you are talking about. Those things that looked like sparkly breast implants with baby heads that pop out. Then they sit and roll around for 20 minutes. :scared

THATS IT!!! THATS THE SHOW!!! I want to beat the crap out of whoever thought of those little horrors. Ugh. Now Im all creeped out.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: yotsuya on August 12, 2011, 01:26:48 pm
That show is called Boo-bah.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Vigo on August 12, 2011, 01:33:23 pm
Somehow, the name doesn't surprise me....


I found a clip...

Boohbah - WTF! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJvHrx1X-Gk#)


 :o Scarier than I remember...  :o

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: spoot on August 12, 2011, 01:43:04 pm
 :o  OH GAWD!  My eyes are BLEEDING!    :dizzy:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on August 12, 2011, 01:55:27 pm
Yo gabba gabba is perhaps children's programmings finest hour. I'm not even joking.

Seriously?  :dizzy:

That show is the most disturbing thing I've ever seen.  I watched about a minute of it and felt like I needed a shower. :)

All the kids shows these days seem like they'd just make kids dumber.

Great way to judge a program... 1 minute...  you fail.

Yo Gabba Gabba ROCKS... and is very educational (for toddlers)... and fun!  My 2 year old loves it... and the 80's retro and video game segments kick ass!  ...and any show that has Biz-Marque rockin the Biz's Beat of the Day is OK in my book.

Sheesh... 1 minute and you're an expert?

I say...

(http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa111/PapaFriz/Funny/crap.gif)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: newmanfamilyvlogs on August 12, 2011, 02:14:25 pm
Not to mention Mark Mothersbaugh from Devo doing a drawing segment. The musical guests are almost always a Who's Who list of Indie rockers.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: DashRendar on August 12, 2011, 02:24:48 pm
But how is this connected to the current status of Ram Controls?

 :lol
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on August 12, 2011, 02:26:26 pm
Not to mention Mark Mothersbaugh from Devo doing a drawing segment. The musical guests are almost always a Who's Who list of Indie rockers.



...and what is cool is they play original kidcentric stuff... not their own tunes.

But this is getting WAAAAAYYYY off topic.  Back to RAM = SCAM.

:D

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Woodshop Flunky on August 12, 2011, 02:58:49 pm
Yo gabba gabba is perhaps children's programmings finest hour. I'm not even joking.

Seriously?  :dizzy:

That show is the most disturbing thing I've ever seen.  I watched about a minute of it and felt like I needed a shower. :)

All the kids shows these days seem like they'd just make kids dumber.

Great way to judge a program... 1 minute...  you fail.

Yo Gabba Gabba ROCKS... and is very educational (for toddlers)... and fun!  My 2 year old loves it... and the 80's retro and video game segments kick ass!  ...and any show that has Biz-Marque rockin the Biz's Beat of the Day is OK in my book.

Sheesh... 1 minute and you're an expert?

I say...

(http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa111/PapaFriz/Funny/crap.gif)

Wow Friz, for someone who seems to love lauding his own brilliance, you really missed the mark here.  My statement was not that I've ONLY watched one minute of the show, but that after only one minute I felt like I needed a shower. :)

Also, I didn't even say this particular show was bad.  I said this show creeped me out and then made a generalization about modern kids shows; emphasis on generalization.

Sheesh... my apologies to your hypersensitive feelings toward toddler programing.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on August 12, 2011, 03:35:50 pm
Re-read your post my friend...

"I watched about a minute of it and felt like I needed a shower."

I'd say that anyone with even a semblance of aptitude in reading comprehension would take away from that sentence that you've watched "about a minute of it".  I'd say that perhaps your statement was a little confusing,   no?

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Woodshop Flunky on August 12, 2011, 03:43:33 pm
Re-read your post my friend...

"I watched about a minute of it and felt like I needed a shower."

I'd say that anyone with even a semblance of aptitude in reading comprehension would take away from that sentence that you've watched "about a minute of it".  I'd say that perhaps your statement was a little confusing,   no?

I can see how it could have read that way. :)

Of course, one doesn't even need to be able to read to take away what you thought of my opinion with your big pile of animated crap.   :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on August 13, 2011, 03:41:48 pm
Frizz would read it that way, as would many kids who watch "Yo Gabba Gabba", I expect.

Reading comprehension is an important aspect of educational programming.

So, WF, what do you have your kids watching ?

 ;)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: ChadTower on August 13, 2011, 06:36:11 pm

That's funny.  When I wanted my kids to learn to read I read them books.  I didn't turn on the TV.   :cheers:

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: LASooner on August 14, 2011, 03:15:28 am
Yo gabba gabba is perhaps children's programmings finest hour. I'm not even joking.

Seriously?  :dizzy:

That show is the most disturbing thing I've ever seen.  I watched about a minute of it and felt like I needed a shower. :)

All the kids shows these days seem like they'd just make kids dumber.

Great way to judge a program... 1 minute...  you fail.

Yo Gabba Gabba ROCKS... and is very educational (for toddlers)... and fun!  My 2 year old loves it... and the 80's retro and video game segments kick ass!  ...and any show that has Biz-Marque rockin the Biz's Beat of the Day is OK in my book.

Sheesh... 1 minute and you're an expert?

I say...

(http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa111/PapaFriz/Funny/crap.gif)


I bemoan Yo Gabba Gabba because it's songs get lodged in my head and won't come out, but my little guy says please and thank you, mainly because that's the kind of stuff they drill into the kids who watch that show. So I can not fault it for what it's teaching him.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: popsicle on August 14, 2011, 11:30:13 am
http://www.themeparkreview.com/coastertube/play.php?vid=yo_gabba_gabba
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: newmanfamilyvlogs on August 15, 2011, 08:07:01 pm

That's funny.  When I wanted my kids to learn to read I read them books.  I didn't turn on the TV.   :cheers:



Such a good thing that so many shows have decent closed captions.  :burgerking:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on August 16, 2011, 07:40:14 am
Change the topic of this thread to "The current status of Yo Gabba Gabba"
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on August 29, 2011, 11:44:39 am
FYI I am still around but I have picked up a few IT related projects that have made it difficult to keep up with the forums. I will post from time to time to let you know that I am still around and to let you know about any developments that are occurring.

I am still shipping out orders and EVERYONE who has ordered from me since I took over in March has had their product shipped quickly. I am still to this day taking in orders and shipping them out all quickly. Anyway if you have any questions please feel free to PM me here or send an email to sales@ram-controls.com

Jim
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SuprSprint on August 29, 2011, 05:10:19 pm
Dan forgot to mention that he's been paying Adam with money made from the sales of RAM products.  Which seems quite an odd thing to do since he also said; "Adam has taken me and my family for about $59K"

But don't worry, unless Adam pays him back Dan/Jim is going to rat him out to the cops. All of which seems to imply that as long as Jim gets paid, he really doesn't give a crap what happens to you guys....

Good luck doing business with SCAM Controls...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on August 29, 2011, 08:08:18 pm
Pldoolittle, you forgot to mention that you flat out LIED on a forum about placing an order with me and kept LYING many many times until you were cornered and then you admitted that you fabricated everything to supposedly get a piece of information that was common knowledge.

Here is the page on the post where you admitted to perpetuating a lie on the forums basically to create more drama. 

http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=172867&page=109 (http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=172867&page=109)

You are nothing other than a liar and a troll... Growl TROOOOOLLLLLL!!!!

Jim
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: tbombaci on August 29, 2011, 08:13:49 pm
Oh the irony...

(http://danwoodcomms.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/black-pot-kettle1.jpg)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on August 29, 2011, 08:15:52 pm
At this point, the only response to Jim calling someone else a liar is ... Say it with me ...

Pot. Kettle. Black.

Spare us the sanctimony.

 ::)

Edit: damned iPad typing ... Tom beat me to it!
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SuprSprint on August 29, 2011, 08:25:02 pm
You forgot to mention that you flat out LIED on a forum about placing an order with me and kept LYING many many times until you were cornered and then you admitted that you fabricated everything to supposedly get a piece of information that was common knowledge.

Nice effort at diverting attention away from yourself. Yes, I lied. Unfortunately, when dealing with characters like yourself, it is necessary to crawl into the gutter and get dirty.  As for the information I gathered, it was a bit more than your local UPS drop box. I just posted that pic because I found it humorous.

Oh, and unlike yourself I did not have to be backed into a corner to tell the truth. I told a number of notable people *before* the effort began, and more as it went along.  You, on the other hand, lie your ass off until cornered and then you pipe up with yet another line of transparent bulls**t. Like today....

That said, it still pales in comparison to lying about Adam still getting paid from RAM sales while victims remain unpaid....

Here is the page on the post where you admitted to perpetuating a lie on the forums basically to create more drama.

To "create more drama" are your words. You conveniently skipped the part where I said; "The purpose was to force this very confrontation to take place. Took weeks of waiting, but eventually Jim had to pop his head up and comment about it."

You are nothing other than a liar

Said the man who has lied about everything since day one....  Again, Nice effort at diverting attention away from yourself.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: dan_ram on August 29, 2011, 08:51:25 pm
pldoolittle, I hate to burst your self important bubble, but me popping back onto the forums had nothing to do with your efforts at fabricating a false story to try to cause drama on the forums. You really think I care about someone who wasted my time telling me and everyone else that you placed an order but never did? A person who in three weeks of conversations never presented the slightest shred of proof that you were actually a customer who might have been owed something? I talked to you at length because I wanted to make sure that if you were in fact a customer that you would be taken care of. If you had actually presented some proof that you had ordered something, I would have taken care of you, but you did not so I could not.

I came back on the forums because I had the chance to check out a number of stories that Adam had told me, I came back because I wanted to let people know that I do in fact believe that Adam has told lies to people around this community, that I know he took money for both arcade and non arcade related projects that he never completed. That I know that he took money from me to support his own lifestyle. It took time to research all of these things and I had to do it on the cheap because I have limited resources. I was angry about all of that so I came on here to vent. But that is the reason I came back, not because of you!

Jim
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SuprSprint on August 29, 2011, 09:13:32 pm
fabricating a false story to try to cause drama on the forums.

You want so badly to make this about me (or anyone else) that you can almost taste it in the air when you post. I would almost feel sorry for you if you weren't such a dirtbag...

Ignoring your obvious attempt to introduce a red herring, let's recap the issue: 

 - You are in business with Adam.
 - Adam is getting paid from the sales of RAM parts.
 - You have lied about all of this.
 - The jackals are now turning on one another.

From my viewpoint, it seems to have played out pretty much as predicted...
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on August 30, 2011, 11:40:58 am

Quote
I came back on the forums because I had the chance to check out a number of stories that Adam had told me, I came back because I wanted to let people know that I do in fact believe that Adam has told lies to people around this community, that I know he took money for both arcade and non arcade related projects that he never completed.

Really?
 it took you this long to figure this out? Really?
months ago you admitted you knew he took orders for products that you knew didn't exist.
Really?
you knew he did this under multiple alias, and felt it was better to not tell the community as to not to add to the drama, Really?

you yourself lied about your name, connection to Ram Controls, and how you were also the "non/arcade guy victim"
Really?
I cant think of any one else in this business that uses fake names and alias's to "protect themselves."
Collecting Arcade games for 10+years doesn't count? Really?
Having a Business ArcadeMovers which was also blamed for RC lost shipments, still doesn't make you an arcade guy?
Really?
Having Empire Controls as your own company where you also claim to have engineered and  advertises most of the controls sold by Ram has you
still  "hiring Dave/Adam" to mfg more product.? Really?
Recently giving him more money that came from Ram Controls sales and now seems to have vanished with that as well? Really?
someone who owed you money enough money to take control of RC stock and still owes money from other ventures you give him more??
Really?
and with all the posts on these forums you still don't know how to assemble a SW yoke? Really?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on August 30, 2011, 11:43:08 am
Dan forgot to mention that he's been paying Adam with money made from the sales of RAM products.  Which seems quite an odd thing to do since he also said; "Adam has taken me and my family for about $59K"

But don't worry, unless Adam pays him back Dan/Jim is going to rat him out to the cops. All of which seems to imply that as long as Jim gets paid, he really doesn't give a crap what happens to you guys....

Good luck doing business with SCAM Controls...

Needs to be said again
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on August 30, 2011, 02:44:07 pm
For the record, I really hate that SNL bit. Really.
 ;)

PS: Still no link to his Ebay Power seller account.
PPS: Still no photos of the inventory he acquired.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: JMB on August 30, 2011, 02:59:06 pm

PPS: Still no photos of the inventory he acquired.


(http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=103207.0;attach=172015)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: drawfull on August 30, 2011, 03:25:47 pm
Erm, not happy at the insinuation. Unless I misunderstood.

But that cab has nothing to do with RC.

I can't post where I am getting it from, or the rest of the stuff that I am getting, but using my picture in this thread is out of order.

A
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: drawfull on August 30, 2011, 03:38:19 pm
Yawn. That pic is my pic. Sent to me privately by another collector which I chose to share with the 'community'. It ain't Dan's fckin template. 

The insinuation by posting it is I am somehow linked with RC, I don't like it, I certainly don't appreciate it, and it in no way makes it nerd drama. Lose the caps dude.

edited cos not fair to bring forum into my grumpiness. 
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: HaRuMaN on August 30, 2011, 03:41:05 pm
Settle down, Francis
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: drawfull on August 30, 2011, 03:47:50 pm
Touche

:)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: JMB on August 30, 2011, 04:16:19 pm
Erm, not happy at the insinuation. Unless I misunderstood.

But that cab has nothing to do with RC.

I can't post where I am getting it from, or the rest of the stuff that I am getting, but using my picture in this thread is out of order.

A

Relax. You just happened to have a pic of a mint cab handy.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: drawfull on August 30, 2011, 04:35:15 pm
Ya, I know, implied and all that.

Anyway, I don't care. I know it ain't me :)

 :cheers:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on August 30, 2011, 04:56:38 pm
girls girls your both pretty.

For the record, I really hate that SNL bit. Really.
 ;)

PS: Still no link to his Ebay Power seller account.
PPS: Still no photos of the inventory he acquired.



LOL
yeah the 2 most important things that could help justify some of his claims
continue to go unanswered...wonder why that would be? :dunno
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on August 31, 2011, 04:11:00 pm
Jesus... really Dan,  er,  I mean Jim?   You're now trying the "I was just a dumbass who didn't know ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---" angle again?   REALLY?  Well guess what Dan,  er... uh...I mean Jim... no one is buying it.

Yours and Dave,  er,  um,  Adam's ---steaming pile of meadow muffin----slingin' days are over. 

Only the occasional sucker/newb is going to buy your story.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: spoot on August 31, 2011, 09:53:33 pm
Jesus... really Dan,  er,  I mean Jim?   You're now trying the "I was just a dumbass who didn't know ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---" angle again?   REALLY?  Well guess what Dan,  er... uh...I mean Jim... no one is buying it.

Yours and Dave,  er,  um,  Adam's ---steaming pile of meadow muffin----slingin' days are over. 

Only the occasional sucker/newb is going to buy your story.



Dammit Friz.....where is your cape?  But yeah.......wow. popcorn. 
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Rick on September 08, 2011, 01:30:06 am
I'm going to wager Jim is sorry he ever got involved with any of this.  I'm also going to wager those people that are actually getting things from him are surprised as hell.  I've read everything in this thread, and then, I found the (presently) 111 pages over at KLOV.  I don't think I have the heart to read on.  I don't have a need for a Star Wars yoke, but might like one in the future, as I really love the stand-up SW cab I read about in anothe thread.  As it is, I'm not going to tell anybody where I would buy one, as I value being a Member of the Community and since we're so split on this, I'm not going on anybody's ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- list.

...well, unless someone has a "Hey, this guy is gutless! I'm putting him on my list!" ... err ... list.

 ;D
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: BadMouth on September 08, 2011, 12:33:50 pm
I'm going to wager Jim is sorry he ever got involved with any of this. 

He's been involved from the beginning.  Keep up!
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Rick on September 08, 2011, 12:55:44 pm
He's been involved from the beginning.  Keep up!

I read that he's somehow involved with taking over operations - not that he was involved with Dave from the beginning of the issues.  Am I incorrect?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: BadMouth on September 08, 2011, 01:26:17 pm
He's been involved from the beginning.  Keep up!

I read that he's somehow involved with taking over operations - not that he was involved with Dave from the beginning of the issues.  Am I incorrect?

You'll have to read the book.  (at KLOV)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on September 08, 2011, 01:33:05 pm
He's been involved from the beginning.  Keep up!

I read that he's somehow involved with taking over operations - not that he was involved with Dave from the beginning of the issues.  Am I incorrect?

Yes... you are incorrect.  Jim Bloomquist has been attached to RAM CONTROLS since at least 2006.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Rick on September 08, 2011, 02:10:39 pm
Yes... you are incorrect.  Jim Bloomquist has been attached to RAM CONTROLS since at least 2006.

I stand corrected.  Please accept my apology.  I read this thread really, really, really late last night.  Some of the words undoubtedly blurred together.

So, Jim gets a "Tip o' The Hat" for at least coming forward and doing something positive - credits, getting people stuff, etc - that seems to be proven by a minimal number of people in this thread, and a "Wag o' The Finger" for the deceptive nature of ... well, everything else.

Damn, and I really, really wanted to think happy thoughts about this today.  GDI.
Title: Re: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SuprSprint on September 08, 2011, 02:34:50 pm
You need to go read the KLOV thread. Jim deserves a hell of a lot more than a wag of the finger.  Adam/Dave still works at RAM and Jim has been funneling him thousands of dollars while lying to everyone here about it. Jim deserves a permanent ban....
Title: Re: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Rick on September 08, 2011, 02:40:05 pm
You need to go read the KLOV thread. Jim deserves a hell of a lot more than a wag of the finger.

Oh, I didn't mention which finger, did I?

Adam/Dave still works at RAM and Jim has been funneling him thousands of dollars while lying to everyone here about it. Jim deserves a permanent ban....

I might tend to disagree on the ban.  The lying, sure.  That's really, really ---smurfy---.  Would I purchase anything from RAM knowing this information now?  No.  I'm not that type of person.  There are, however, people online who do seem to be benefiting from Jim somewhat, whether that be through credits or getting their orders - whatever.  Banning Jim could remove the only line of communication people who have been cheated from getting any remuneration.  I would definitely go with banning offers of new business until past issues have been settled, that's for certain.

I really wanted a white knight on this one.  Sad to see it's come around to this, once again.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: RayB on September 08, 2011, 02:40:21 pm
So, Jim gets a "Tip o' The Hat" for at least coming forward and doing something positive - credits, getting people stuff, etc - that seems to be proven by a minimal number of people in this thread, and a "Wag o' The Finger" for the deceptive nature of ... well, everything else.
Dude, don't even give him credit for that. It's part of any con-man's MO to ingratiate himself with the marks. Dave Adams, or whatever his real name is did the same by offering free parts and sales. (Parts he likely didn't even pay for, now that it's been revealed some Chinese companies were ripped off). Just use this site's search for threads by "DavieA", keywords "sale" and "free".

Don't be naive.
Title: Re: Re: Re: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: SuprSprint on September 08, 2011, 07:54:37 pm
There are, however, people online who do seem to be benefiting from Jim somewhat, whether that be through credits or getting their orders - whatever.

People are getting trinkets while Adam/Dave gets thousands.  I'll take that deal all day long. Send me your PayPal login/password and tell me where to ship your "free" buttons. I'll even toss in a new trackball!

Banning Jim could remove the only line of communication people who have been cheated from getting any remuneration.

No, he still has his website, email, and phone. And he could post a nice page informing victims how to file for compensation.  But he has not, and will not, because the compensation flowing is nothing but a loss leader for future "sales".  Banning him simply cuts off one of his largest sources of referrals.


I would definitely go with banning offers of new business until past issues have been settled, that's for certain.

Because if he pays off *this* batch of victims, it's all cool? I think not...  RAM has *decades* of catching up, then they will have elevated to the level of "not in debt scumbag". And why would you deal with a scumbag???

Sorry Rick, we disagree. RAM needs to go away forever.
Title: Re: Re: Re: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Rick on September 08, 2011, 08:00:27 pm
No, he still has his website, email, and phone. And he could post a nice page informing victims how to file for compensation.  But he has not, and will not, because the compensation flowing is nothing but a loss leader for future "sales".  Banning him simply cuts off one of his largest sources of referrals.

That's a good point.

Because if he pays off *this* batch of victims, it's all cool? I think not...  RAM has *decades* of catching up, then they will have elevated to the level of "not in debt scumbag". And why would you deal with a scumbag???

Sorry Rick, we disagree. RAM needs to go away forever.

Damn, and I so didn't want to be swayed so easily.  You caught me on a good day, it seems!  Let me jump on your collective bandwagon.  (I'll be that calm, not-so-abrupt guy, but will still support your position.)

Cheers.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: TPB on September 10, 2011, 11:51:37 am


Don't be naive.



It's funny the way the tide can turn.  Just like politicians and opinion polls, I guess.  A President can be loved by the people at a certain point in time, but despised by those same people a few years down the track.

There was once a day when none less than Saint himself, defended Dave's integrity (perhaps that's wording it too strongly ... although he certainly preferred to give him the benefit of the doubt), and deemed him to be a personal friend.  You probably can't retrieve these posts from the search history, as they were relegated to Post Hell.

In those days, all the pre-order folks, Havok especially, valiantly defended Dave's honour.  Mind you, Havok's personal faith in Dave was richly rewarded, as he received his Star Wars yoke, user manual and all.

Roll forward to the present ... I understand that Saint's now of a different mindset, since more facts have came to light.  The fact he's stickied this post, is testament to that.  And full credit to him for that.

I don't know quite what's brought about the community's change of mindset, as I'm not intimately familiar with the last couple of years of history that's occurred in this matter.

I guess my point is, Rick isn't the first person to want to believe that something good can come out of RAM Controls.  He shouldn't be written off as naive.  Good on him for having some faith in the human spirit, and hoping that everything can conclude in a happy ending.  Let's hope all the folks who are owed money by RAM Controls, end up being reimbursed their dues.


P.S.  Saint ... I hope you don't take my comments as being disrespectful.  Please delete this post if you deem it inappropriate.  This is your site, so I respect your rules.  You provide the best service to the community by running BYOAC free of charge.  I really appreciate that.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Rick on September 10, 2011, 01:20:39 pm
Thanks, man.

I don't take any offense to the comments made in this thread - I recognize there are a LOT of hurt feelings and a lot of anger here, and I also recognize that the situation has made all of this well deserved.  I've got a pretty thick skin, so I'm good.  I'm hopeful that everybody gets what's coming to them.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: saint on September 10, 2011, 07:28:39 pm
P.S.  Saint ... I hope you don't take my comments as being disrespectful.  Please delete this post if you deem it inappropriate.  This is your site, so I respect your rules.  You provide the best service to the community by running BYOAC free of charge.  I really appreciate that.

Eh... my perspective is a bit different than yours on my opinion on RAM then and now, but I've never that I can recall deleted or edited a post because of what it said about me :)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: TPB on September 10, 2011, 09:21:38 pm


Eh... my perspective is a bit different than yours on my opinion on RAM then and now, but I've never that I can recall deleted or edited a post because of what it said about me :)



Saint, that's a measure of your class.

I reckon the magic of BYOAC, apart from the treasure trove of arcade hardware goodness, is it's a place where you're genuinely free to state your opinion, whatever it is (provided it's conveyed with reason and good manners), without having to be concerned about fear or favour.    :cheers:

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: leapinlew on September 12, 2011, 01:25:47 pm
I reckon the magic of BYOAC, apart from the treasure trove of arcade hardware goodness, is it's a place where you're genuinely free to state your opinion, whatever it is (provided it's conveyed with reason and good manners), without having to be concerned about fear or favour.    :cheers:

You must not have read any of Frizz's posts.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: TPB on September 12, 2011, 09:42:00 pm


You must not have read any of Frizz's posts.



Well, to Frizz's credit, if we look back to that time a few years ago, he was virtually the lone voice sounding the warning about RAM Controls.  But at that time, most just dismissed him as "Frizz being Frizz".

Turns out he was right.

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on September 14, 2011, 12:41:51 pm


You must not have read any of Frizz's posts.



Well, to Frizz's credit, if we look back to that time a few years ago, he was virtually the lone voice sounding the warning about RAM Controls.  But at that time, most just dismissed him as "Frizz being Frizz".

Turns out he was right.



Jesus... a new quote... and I'm limited to only 2... I guess I'll have to drop one to put this one in...

;)

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: saint on September 14, 2011, 03:47:24 pm
Can't believe I got bumped.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: FrizzleFried on September 14, 2011, 04:08:31 pm
Can't believe I got bumped.

Never!  Cheffo was the one bumped... You're quote is my prized possession here...

:D
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: CheffoJeffo on September 14, 2011, 07:18:41 pm
Can't believe I got bumped.

Never!  Cheffo was the one bumped... You're quote is my prized possession here...

:D


That's only because Chuck Fitch says that I am the biggest idiot!
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: saint on September 15, 2011, 09:19:44 am
Can't believe I got bumped.

Never!  Cheffo was the one bumped... You're quote is my prized possession here...

:D


Heh.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on November 30, 2011, 11:44:49 am
They're back and dont fall for it. Nothing has changed people are still owed and legal battles continue
Im posting this here in this thread as I found it Ironic how Dan Johnson AKA JimBloomquist "New owner"
stated he had no plans of doing any of those crazy blowout sales
Ram Controls circulated this email.

"Dear .....,

It is time again for the Ram Controls Winter Blowout Sale. If you have been waiting for a good time to stock up on parts for your classic arcade games, the time is now!

From now until the end of 2011 you can use the coupon codes below to take 30% off any arcade parts order from Ram Controls.

30% off seems like a good deal but it gets better. If your order totals $200 or more you can take an amazing 40% off your order using the special coupon code below.

This is the best deal we have offered all year!

If you want to take advantage of this offer you will need the following coupon codes.

30% off any parts orders DEC302011
40% any order of $200 or more DEC2011SUPER

Remember this sale ends December 31, 2011 so act now!

Ram Controls Website- www.ramcontrols.com (http://www.ramcontrols.com)"
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on November 30, 2011, 11:46:52 am
and for Jims claim to not be connected to Dave
currently courst pending

Case No. Case Title Case Type Filing Date Category
30-2011-00496959-CU-FR-CJC
CARA HONIGSFELD VS. ADAM JUDD
FRAUD 08/01/2011 CIVIL - UNLIMITED

Participants
JAN JUDD DEFENDANT 08/03/2011
JOSE AVALOS DEFENDANT 08/03/2011
JIM BLOOMQUIST DEFENDANT 08/03/2011
ADAM JUDD DEFENDANT 08/03/2011
CARA HONIGSFELD PLAINTIFF 08/03/2011
BENJAMIN PRINCE ATTORNEY 08/03/2011
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: BrentRadio on November 30, 2011, 02:29:00 pm
Rikitiki,

you are missing the "e" on the word "one" in your tag line.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Donkey_Kong on November 30, 2011, 02:42:16 pm
Talk about a turd that won't flush.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: BadMouth on December 02, 2011, 03:17:24 pm
rikitiki, has anyone ordered a copy of the original complaint in the fraud case to see what the lawsuit is about?
https://ocapps.occourts.org/civilwebShopping/SearchCase.do#top_page (https://ocapps.occourts.org/civilwebShopping/SearchCase.do#top_page)
(search for adam judd, report is $8.50)

I've had no dealings with them, but it's been an interesting situation to follow.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Gray_Area on December 03, 2011, 05:15:50 am
Who's Jose Avalos??
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on December 03, 2011, 02:02:09 pm
rikitiki, has anyone ordered a copy of the original complaint in the fraud case to see what the lawsuit is about?
https://ocapps.occourts.org/civilwebShopping/SearchCase.do#top_page (https://ocapps.occourts.org/civilwebShopping/SearchCase.do#top_page)
(search for adam judd, report is $8.50)

I've had no dealings with them, but it's been an interesting situation to follow.

I havent and not sure if anyone else has
current legal action on "Ram Controls" seems to have hit a dead end and not sure where that cuurently lies.
but its getting tempting to start paying for some of those reports on both criminal and other pending court cases.

as there is another one pending
CASE SUMMARY
Case No. Case Title Case Type Filing Date Category
30-2011-00502029-CU-BC-CJC
ERROL MIHALIK VS. ADAM DAVID JUDD
BREACH OF CONTRACT/WARRANTY 08/22/2011 CIVIL - UNLIMITED

Participants
ADAM DAVID JUDD DEFENDANT 08/22/2011
ERROL MIHALIK PLAINTIFF 08/22/2011
LAW OFFICES OF HARRISON LONG ATTORNEY 08/22/2011

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on December 03, 2011, 02:04:04 pm
Who's Jose Avalos??

Have no idea thats a new name that hasnt been brought into this yet
at least on the arcade side of things.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: BadMouth on December 03, 2011, 03:38:34 pm
The short version is that beginning in 2009, Adam talked someone into making him various loans totalling $66,000 for sure fire "business opportunities" involving Ram Controls and Empire Engineering.
He only ever made a couple payments.  Odd thing is that there were 3 loans from the same person and Adam used a different alias for each one...Charles Sparta, Adam Starr & then after he failed to pay those loans, another promissory note was drawn up and signed by Adam Judd.

It doesn't go into who Jose Avalos is, but $4,000 of the loans was wired to his bank account.
It doesn't look like the plaintiff had any contact with Jim, but named him because he is doing business under both the company names.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on December 04, 2011, 11:45:58 am
Thanks Badmouth a VERY interresting read and certainly puts into perspective how the over all scam worked.
From collectors to "Investors" :applaud:
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: tbombaci on February 14, 2012, 09:47:58 am
Beware. The scam is ramping up again. Watch out for the smooth talking scum bags.  #youvebeenwarned
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: mytymaus007 on June 03, 2012, 08:57:12 am
Did anyone get any YOKES YET JUst wanna get one! :lol :lol
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: rikitiki on June 25, 2012, 06:29:27 pm
RIP
www.RamControls.com (http://www.RamControls.com)

But dont seem too suprized when these Ram parts start resurfacing again
and proably under a new site labeled "Under new Managament"
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: BadMouth on June 25, 2012, 07:38:30 pm
RIP
www.RamControls.com (http://www.RamControls.com)

But dont seem too suprized when these Ram parts start resurfacing again
and proably under a new site labeled "Under new Managament"


They wouldn't be dumb enough to use that name ever again.
I'm sure they'll also come up with aliases that aren't recycled versions of old aliases.

"Hello, my name is Bill.  I am new here and I just started building Star Wars yokes.
I am from Texas, but the package will arrive from California"  ;)
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: mytymaus007 on June 25, 2012, 09:04:26 pm
RIP
www.RamControls.com (http://www.RamControls.com)

But dont seem too suprized when these Ram parts start resurfacing again
and proably under a new site labeled "Under new Managament"


They wouldn't be dumb enough to use that name ever again.
I'm sure they'll also come up with aliases that aren't recycled versions of old aliases.

"Hello, my name is Bill.  I am new here and I just started building Star Wars yokes.
I am from Texas, but the package will arrive from California"  ;)
:lol Just recieved my volcano switches just in time! :lol
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: tbombaci on June 25, 2012, 10:36:57 pm
RIP
www.RamControls.com (http://www.RamControls.com)

But dont seem too suprized when these Ram parts start resurfacing again
and proably under a new site labeled "Under new Managament"


They wouldn't be dumb enough to use that name ever again.
I'm sure they'll also come up with aliases that aren't recycled versions of old aliases.

"Hello, my name is Bill.  I am new here and I just started building Star Wars yokes.
I am from Texas, but the package will arrive from California"  ;)
:lol Just recieved my volcano switches just in time! :lol

I really hope you are ---smurfing--- kidding....

Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: Justin Z on June 27, 2012, 07:50:18 am
Seconded.  Seriously?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: saint on July 02, 2012, 09:47:02 am
Unstickying since the domain is gone.
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: wcndave on August 29, 2012, 08:11:36 am
Wow, so after a very long read.... I checked if the site was still there, and they both are!

Seems amazing they can stay in operation after so many years of clear fraud, deceit, and downright bare faced dishonesty.

perhaps needs to be stuck again?
Title: Re: The current status of Ram Controls:
Post by: PL1 on August 29, 2012, 12:44:17 pm
The *other* Ram Controls thread has already been re-stickied.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,110148.0.html (http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,110148.0.html)

Two stickies just would be overkill.


Scott