EDID Dongle... what is it and where can I get one?

[PimpDaddyStu]

Subject says it all really

But for those of you looking some background here goes...

I've been using an ArcadeVGA and a Polo Star for a couple of years now, I recently ordered the latest revison of the ArcadeVGA from Andy in the hope that I might be able to get Street Fighter IV working in my cab but it just isn't powerful enough and I'm running Vista x64 which giving me trouble with the latest ArcadeVGA revision when trying to run SSF and Project 64.

I've just changed the graphics card in my modern gaming PC to a GTX 295 so I have a spare 8800GT that I'd like to try and get working with my Polo Star

I've just found what looks like it could be the answer in the form of Soft-15KHz but I've no idea what this EDID dongle is all about
In the Soft-15KHz thread SailorSat says that the dongles will be available from www.arcadeshop.de but I don't see them on that site

All help greatly apprechiated
Thanks
Stu

[Kevin Mullins]

I'm assuming it may be something like this VGA-VGA dongle that opens up otherwise un-selectable resolutions.
http://www.drbottkg.com/prod/ghead.html

EDID - Extended Display Identification Data

[PimpDaddyStu]

Thanks for the info

Now I'm not sure if this is what I need or not, I've ran Soft-15k and all the resolutions are available in quickres but when I tried 320x240 last night it didn't look good, yet the same res works perfect when using my ArcadeVGA, it looked a bit out of sync or something, the icons on my black desktop looked ok but when something bright appears like a window opens or the start menu pops up everything went messed up, I'll take a photo later when I get home from work, I don't know how to describe it.

Will the EDID dongle sort this, from reading the link you posted it looks like it just tricks the computer into thinking the resolutions are available

Thanks for your help
Stu

[PimpDaddyStu]

I've tested the available resolutions with varying results

Some resolutions have a strange sort of black line going top to bottom on the left side of the screen, I've attached a picture

Other resolutions just look messed up with bright and dark bands across the screen

The following resolutions have the black line:

304x240
336x240
352x256
352x264
368x240
392x248
400x256
448x240
512x240
632x264
640x240

These resolutions are bright/dark:
320x240x
352x288x
384x288x
512x288x
512x448x

And these resolutions appear to be just fine:
496x384
512x384
512x512
640x288
640x480
720x480

Does this make any sense to anyone?
I have a 8600GT that I'm hopefully going to try later

Stu

[DillonFoulds]

Maybe this is irrelevant, but you should consider turning off Aero and any and all desktop effects.

Just saying this to rule out that the OS could (unlikely) be having hiccups with effects at such a low resolution.

[PimpDaddyStu]

Thanks but I already have all these switched off

[Epyx]

Any update on this from anyone? I have a spare 8800gtx and would love to try out Soft 15khz with the dongle but not sure about the resolutions reported here.

Thanks in advance!

[lilshawn]

you could always just cut the pin on the vga cable that supplies EDID info and manually configure the computer.

JAT

[atomikbohm]

you could always just cut the pin on the VGA cable that supplies EDID info and manually configure the computer.

JAT

Most Arcade monitors way predate EDID, and that's what causes the problem with NVIDA cards.  It's been a while since I set up my Monitor (WG K7193) to work with my Nvidia 9600 GT so I'm forgetting what the issue was if I didn't use the dongle.  But I seem to recall that "faking" the EDID wasn't an option according to sailorsat.  I'll see if I have the e-mails that explained the why's when I get home tonight and see if I can't get a pick of soft 15k without the dongle.

[DillonFoulds]

Possibly Older driver versions would be a viable solution? Soft15KHz was nearly impossible for me to get working right on my 6600gt, but it came down to using older drivers, and everything was straightened out.

[SailorSat]

I've just found what looks like it could be the answer in the form of Soft-15KHz but I've no idea what this EDID dongle is all about

Basically the dongle looks like this...



All it does is hook up a simple IēC EEPROM to the DDC Pins.
Now the VGA can get EDID Data from the dongle.

Actually I still build them on request as of now there basically was no "big" need for them. I've build about 20 pcs over the last two years.
Thats why you can't find them in any shop.

Fact is, NVidia doesn't seem to know what they want...
There is a "safe mode" for pre-DDC (non EDID capable) displays.
The OLD drivers (like 66.93 to 91.47) didn't have this safe mode at all.
The frist drivers with GeForce 8 support (don't remember the revision) added the safemode for GeForce 8 and newer cards but NOT for the older ones.
The current drivers (192.xx) seem have this safemode enabled for every chip generation...
Somewhere in between the safemode was gone completely...


So what does this "safe mode"?
Actually it limits the card to a hand full of resolutions (640x480, 800x600, 1024x768, each at 60Hz).
Some driver revisions allow other modes too, but output them in "safe" 31-48kHz.

[ghostkiller]

Im sort of in the same boat as well. Im running an 800GTX and running it from a pci-e to vga adapter into a jpac through the jamma harness. I get the split screen which Im assuming is failure to pass a 15khz signal to the monitor. Im also assuming i need this EDID dongle which im having problems locating for sale. Ive been told I need an arcadevga card as well but Im pretty sure this 8800gtx will work since I already have it and ive read elsewhere of people using it on a mame cab with an arcade monitor. The monitor is a cga 27 inch. Im using soft 15khz and quick res, only tried 640x480.

[SailorSat]

You can test if the dongle would help by booting with a VGA monitor attached.
After the windows boot screen your vga monitor should turn off/display "out of range".
Now swap the vga cable to one connected to the jpac and you should have a perfect 15khz picture on your cab

[ghostkiller]

You can test if the dongle would help by booting with a VGA monitor attached.
After the windows boot screen your vga monitor should turn off/display "out of range".
Now swap the vga cable to one connected to the jpac and you should have a perfect 15khz picture on your cab

ok Ill give that a try monday when I can get my hands on this pesky thing again. lol From what ive told you though do you think I just need the EDID dongle or that I may need an arcadevga card or do I need to do this test first before asking more stupid questions?

[SailorSat]

Well I've came up with the whole EDID dongle thing because of a GF 8600GT refusing to boot into 15khz with the arcade screen attached, but running fine booting with my old Dell VGA screen

Until today I got every GeForce to work in 15kHz... At least in XP .)
An ArcadeVGA pretty much is the plug'n'play solution, however it also limits you in several ways.

[ghostkiller]

Well I've came up with the whole EDID dongle thing because of a GF 8600GT refusing to boot into 15khz with the arcade screen attached, but running fine booting with my old Dell VGA screen

Until today I got every GeForce to work in 15kHz... At least in XP .)
An ArcadeVGA pretty much is the plug'n'play solution, however it also limits you in several ways.

That was pretty much my line of thinking as well, I didnt want to be limited to 15khz. By the way, im on vista 64 if that makes any difference. The arcadevga's are just regular ati cards bios flashed with firmware to force them into 15khz signals right?

[SailorSat]

Well, Vista basically is the same sh!t as Seven, as both use the very same nvidia drivers.
In that case your better of with any Radeon based card, or an ArcadeVGA.
And yes, AVGA are just Radeon with special bios and drivers.

[ghostkiller]

Well, Vista basically is the same sh!t as Seven, as both use the very same nvidia drivers.
In that case your better of with any Radeon based card, or an ArcadeVGA.
And yes, AVGA are just Radeon with special bios and drivers.

My only question is if I end up needing a EDID dongle, where would I get one?

[SailorSat]

You can get one from me.

[ghostkiller]

You can get one from me.

ok then, monday when i get a chance to test things out i will let you know what I find. Thanks for your help.

[Epyx]

@Sailorsat,

I would gladly paypal you one...can you msg me cost/instructions for payment?

Thanks!

Epyx

[ghostkiller]

ok update:

I tried to boot into my vga monitor using soft 15khz and set res to 640x480 among other lower resolutions.  It boots into windows desktop just like any other, no garbled screen. Only thing I can think of else to try is maybe some older drivers? I think im using 181.xx or somewhere along those lines.

[ghostkiller]

ok update:

I tried to boot into my vga monitor using soft 15khz and set res to 640x480 among other lower resolutions.  It boots into windows desktop just like any other, no garbled screen. Only thing I can think of else to try is maybe some older drivers? I think im using 181.xx or somewhere along those lines.

Im using 181.22,
http://community.arcadeinfo.de/showthread.php?t=7925&page=5

here is a 8800gtx claims it works with EDID dongle and 182.50 drivers. Doesnt say what OS he is using either. Im on vista 64x Just tried 182.50 and its a nogo as well. I install 15khz, set desktop to 640x480 and reboot and its at 640x480 but i get a clear picture on my computer monitor, no distorted picture so I guess I have to get an arcadevga now? Only other thing I can think of is trying this in xp? Or would that be a waste>?

[SailorSat]

Like I said, Vista/Seven is basically a no-go.
XP will work (with a dongle).

[ghostkiller]

Like I said, Vista/Seven is basically a no-go.
XP will work (with a dongle).

Is this an issue with soft 15khz or with vista in your opinion? Gonna go load up xp and give that a go, also I guess im gonna need a EDID dongle so just let me know. Also what drivers should I use?

[SailorSat]

As I've spend the whole weekend trying to get anything to work on seven... blame nvidia for the vista/seven drivers...
I've blocked nvidia on vista/seven for now, as the drivers only output resolutions ABOVE 31kHz... (and interlace is broken completely...)

[ghostkiller]

As I've spend the whole weekend trying to get anything to work on seven... blame nvidia for the vista/seven drivers...
I've blocked nvidia on vista/seven for now, as the drivers only output resolutions ABOVE 31kHz... (and interlace is broken completely...)

Well in all fairness I dont think they have a big audience with high end card sales and MAME drivers so Cant really say on that. What drivers should I use on xp?

As far as PC gaming goes Ill stick with nvidia though both sides of the fence has issues in vista and seven.

[SailorSat]

Any driver should be fine on xp..

As for nvidia and sales... Well yeah that market is pretty much non existant, however the hardware does support it, the software on xp does support it, so why doesn't the software on vista support it? There actually has to be some intention in blocking those modes.

Also... ībout interlace... Hell 1920x1080i is actually a highend HDTV standard that doesn't work on the vga connector...

Ah whatever Just count nvidia + vista/seven + 15khz = non-working for the time being

[ghostkiller]

Any driver should be fine on xp..

As for nvidia and sales... Well yeah that market is pretty much non existant, however the hardware does support it, the software on xp does support it, so why doesn't the software on vista support it? There actually has to be some intention in blocking those modes.

Also... ībout interlace... Hell 1920x1080i is actually a highend HDTV standard that doesn't work on the vga connector...

Ah whatever Just count nvidia + vista/seven + 15khz = non-working for the time being

Well ill tell ya my theory on this as far as vista, they dont support the old ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- because they wanna sell the new ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- plain and simple. Old hardware that worked just fine on xp had to be upgraded in order to run vista, DX10 needed vista, etc. etc. Its just a way to push sales thats all, they dont care how well it works as long as it sells hardware. Im loading up xp now, let me know on that dongle. :-)

[ghostkiller]

You can test if the dongle would help by booting with a VGA monitor attached.
After the windows boot screen your vga monitor should turn off/display "out of range".
Now swap the vga cable to one connected to the jpac and you should have a perfect 15khz picture on your cab

Tried this with xp and this time the vga monitor finally went out of range so I proceeded to test it on my arcade monitor and it pissed off my flyback transformer something serious which is odd being that ive tested numerous jamma boards on this and never had an issue and it had a beautiful picture as well. Any thoughts?

[SailorSat]

Windows still on 800x600?
Try adjusting your V-Hold then.

Does the J-PAC Sync Leds light up?

[ghostkiller]

Windows still on 800x600?
Try adjusting your V-Hold then.

Does the J-PAC Sync Leds light up?

no I set xp to 640x480 and installed soft 15, then rebooted in wondows and my monitor wouldnt come on so I hooked it up to my arcade monitor which is a k7191 and when I gave the monitor power the flyback arced bad! I got another one on the way it just seems really odd that it did it now and not ever. What would V hold do? JPAC lights all sync up and were good to go.

[SailorSat]

Hum... As long as the sync lights glow on the J-PAC there should be no problem with the input.
May be just bad luck. I have yet so see a flyback go bad Though I had a one screaming... unfiltered 131kHz on a 15kHz screen = not nice.

[ghostkiller]

Hum... As long as the sync lights glow on the J-PAC there should be no problem with the input.
May be just bad luck. I have yet so see a flyback go bad Though I had a one screaming... unfiltered 131kHz on a 15kHz screen = not nice.

MAybe this one was on its way out? I have no clue here. Got another one comin and I guess when I get the dongle from ya and this flyback here and installed ill report what happens.

[ghostkiller]

Well got my new flyback installed and went ahead and did a cap kit on my K7191 and all is well once again. Now once this dongle gets here I can do some damage. lol thanks again.

[SailorSat]

It should have arrived by now. Anything new?

[ghostkiller]

It should have arrived by now. Anything new?

Got it last night and just got to work so I can do some testing. Any idea what resolution or resolutions I should run on a K7191? Tried 640x480 on the K7191 and its double screening on me. Tried one below it and it was single screen but scrambled. Now I cant get it to show right on my pc monitor. lol  grrrrr


update:
I tried 2 resolutions down from 640x480 which I believe was 640x240 but it was hard to see it. Which is the res my monitor should run, Using MALA and MAMEUI it boots to full screen. Now Im not sure how to get some games to display fullscreen in MAME like galaga is centered but its very skinny, if I rotate to vertical I get it full screen that way but no other way. Only way ive even been able to get a useable screen is booting with soft 15khz installed at 640x480 on my mame cab then going into quick res and setting to 640x240 which seems is impossible to do on pc.

[ghostkiller]

another update. I installed soft 15, set to 640x480, shut it down, hooked it up in the mame cab, booted and now everything works. I set mame to all default and started from scratch and now it boots perfectly into MALA though its kind of a ---smurfette--- to navigate all 8k games by using up and down its fully working now. I do get a little screen flicker which is barely noticeable but its doable. MK4 looks beautiful on this monitor too. Thanks for the help, now I just have alot of tweaking to do.

[SailorSat]

Haha, you should to put them into genre or else you WILL spend more time on navigating than playing

[ghostkiller]

Haha, you should to put them into genre or else you WILL spend more time on navigating than playing

hmmm, how do I do that? Also in MALA is it list only or can you get it where you can see sample vids with each selection?