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Author Topic: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - USB probs solved (I think!)  (Read 202517 times)

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TEKNYNE

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Yup that will work.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2010, 09:30:52 am by TEKNYNE »

gryhnd

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For the most part I have your typical consumer power strip style protectors, except for my H.T. rack which has a high end rack mounted unit.

However about a year ago I picked up two of these off eBay for about $60-$70 apiece.

After losing the third controller board in my furnace, it dawned on me that it was probably about the only electronic item in my house that wasn't protected.  One of these Leviton units is hardwired "in line" to the furnace circuit. The other I haven't installed yet (although you're motivating me) but is destined to protect my expensive minifridge and convection/microwave, also in the H.T.

They were really simple to install too, especially if you have enough slack in the line coming out of your breaker box. Essentially you just splice it in. If not, it's only a skosh more difficult to run a bit of new romex from the breaker to give you the slack you need.

Teknyne comments though, made me go look at its specs. Not sure how the protection modes relate:

•UL 1449 TVSS rated.
•IEEE C62.41-1991 Category A&B Combination Wave and
Ringwave Suppression.
•Three protection modes -- L1-L2, L1-G, L2-G.
•Two suppression stages -- primary and backup.
•Fused for suppression protection failure.
•EMI/RFI filtration circuitry.
•Two diagnostic modes include LED and audible indicators
for suppression failure or open ground condition
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TEKNYNE

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gryhnd: Levitons site I am having trouble with but I am sure that UL 1449 is based on MOV's (metal oxide varistor) and it stating  L1-L2, L1-G, L2-G protection modes I think put it in the mode 3 category.  But I could be wrong.

TEKNYNE

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drventure by the way amazing cab! Absolutely love it!

drventure

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@Teknyne

Thanks! Wish I wasn't having to rebuild quite so much of it but ah well.

And thanks for the Suppressor info. I think i'll do a bit more research and pick up a few of these Mode 1 units.

You have any suggested models?

TEKNYNE

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Hey drventure: try surgex.com residential line they are the only ones I have personally installed but there are many others. they are crazy expensive though and you can probably google for cheaper ones. surgex xn120 is just under 2 grand but it is one that mounts at the panel or as a sub panel, it is a small and compact unit. they also have strip type versions sorry I have no cost on there other ones yet. hope this helps some. I might google it myself or check my trade mags for more brands and see what I come up with. might give me a day or two though.

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Just under 2 grand???

For that price, you're better off with best surge protector in the world...  when not in use, unplug!   :afro:

TEKNYNE

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Was just waiting for some one to say that. Did a quick google and found many products, looks like a company called hlstores.com has single units that you plug a ups or strip into starting at $199.

BobA

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Why not protect your whole house by installing one of these in your main panel.

Whole House Surge Prot

Bender

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Why not protect your whole house by installing one of these in your main panel.

Whole House Surge Prot

if anyone can verify that that thing would work against a lightning strike I'm getting one!
« Last Edit: August 08, 2010, 12:00:46 am by Bender »

TEKNYNE

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The surgex xn120 is of the same installation type as the Leviton, the problem with the leviton whole house surge that BobA listed is that it is a MOV or the same as a standard surge suppressor. mode 1 surge arrestors are very different and until recently not as common for residential applications, but are becoming more so, so the price will come down more as people become more aware of them I would think. I have installed some of surgex a/v equip for people in upscale nice homes for home theater, besides the xn120 but have not purchased them directly. Sorry I cant be more help other than googling some more and see what other manufactures and price there is.


note: if a surge suppressor has a joule rating on it, it is a MOV or standard suppressor that send the surge to the ground conductor. mode 1 do not have joule ratings. at least as far as I know.

note 2 just check the levitons site on the whole house one and it said it is not for a lightning surge also.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2010, 01:24:43 am by TEKNYNE »

Bender

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so what is the cheapest way to protect your whole house from a lightning strike?
sounds like the MOV type actually make computers MORE at risk :banghead:

TEKNYNE

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@ Bender, kinda if you have some electronics that use a 3 prong plug (grounding) than ya could be taking a risk if a outside surge happens.

HarumaN said it best if you cant afford good protection, the best is keep it unplugged when not in use.


@ Bender and any-one else standard surge suppressors still do there job which is primarily if a surge happens it keeps YOU SAFE if you happen to be by the equipment during a surge or strike, I dont want to keep people from using surge suppressors that would be unwise also. better to kill your electronics than kill you!

Lightning Arrestor Intermatic AG2401C-IND www.aplussupply.com $60.
@ drventure sorry I kinda went nuts with this on your page.

Edit: i re read the AG2401c-IND and it appears you can use it on the service entrance to protect the whole house also, good news and cheap probably only cost a hour of labor to install.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2010, 09:06:39 pm by TEKNYNE »

TEKNYNE

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Also if you have a older home with possibly no protection on the cable and phone lines there is IG1300-2T which protects the ac, phone, and cable lines.  $240

Benevolance

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The best protection is to move up to the Pacific northwest where we see lightning storms maybe once every 5 years. I'll buy you a beer, and we can hang out at the local arcades wearing pseudo-victorian costumes and complaining about how things were better in our day. :)

TEKNYNE

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That is funny I live in the Pacific Northwest and see lightning storms every year..,couple of weeks ago one struck about 3 blocks from my work.

saurian333

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so what is the cheapest way to protect your whole house from a lightning strike?
sounds like the MOV type actually make computers MORE at risk :banghead:

@TEKNYNE: Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't most typical surge strips designed to protect against normal surges?  i.e., the smaller surges that happen all the time, which are part of the nature of home electricity.  The power coming out of your outlets isn't necessarily 100% constant; there are brief spikes up and/or down that don't actually fry your electronics outright, but do wear on them over time.

At least, that's the way I understood it.  I'm not an electrician.

KagatoAMV

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Such an impressive job, I'm sorry to hear about the lightening strike. I hope you're able to get it up and running again.


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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Best Buy fails, but some good news!
« Reply #538 on: August 13, 2010, 12:12:24 am »
Well, as I suspected, Best buy failed miserably with their diagnosis.

Almost verbatim from their report

"The machines don't boot. Don't post, recommend new motherboards"

Duh!

I asked if the harddrives, memory, cpu, PS, etc tested out ok.

"We can't test individual components"

WTF!?

I paid 70$ EACH for two machines to be diagnosed and THAT'S what they come back with!

Needless to say, I bitched until I got my money back.

Now Fry's has the machines. Still waiting on their verdict.



And the good news....

I picked up a replacement Altec Lansing VS2321 2.1 speaker set off ebay. Got it in. I was dreading hooking it up. I pretty much expected the controller board (that I'd removed from one of the speakers and hotglued into place in the buffet itself) to be fried.

But lo and behold, it appears that it was only the powersupply in the subwoofer that was toasted.

Plugged the existing controller board into the new subwoofer and the Arqadium sounds good as new!

So, I gotta do a little steam punkification to the new sub and that part'll be good to go!


saurian333

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Best Buy fails, but some good news!
« Reply #539 on: August 13, 2010, 03:17:20 am »
That is good news!  Glad to hear you're getting somewhere.

Your story is yet another example of why never to go to Geek Squad on purpose.  If they can't test individual components, how can they honestly recommend a motherboard?  They can't, of course; they're committing highway robbery.  Geek Squad started out as a guy on a bicycle making house calls, and Best Buy bought it and perverted it into just another scam.  They should be sued, hard.  If everyone who took their cars with dead batteries to Midas got told they needed new engines, Midas would be out of business within a month.

drventure

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Best Buy fails, but some good news!
« Reply #540 on: August 13, 2010, 07:40:43 am »
Hey Saurian

Yeah, i pretty much knew that, but I figured I'd humor my insurance company. But no way was I paying 140$ for essentially nothing. I gotta at least get a written down diag of all the components.

Never been a huge fan of Best Buy anyway, now, definitely not.

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Best Buy fails, but some good news!
« Reply #541 on: August 13, 2010, 11:39:41 am »
Hey Saurian

Yeah, i pretty much knew that, but I figured I'd humor my insurance company. But no way was I paying 140$ for essentially nothing. I gotta at least get a written down diag of all the components.

Never been a huge fan of Best Buy anyway, now, definitely not.

I loe best buy for their deals on DVDs and Blu-Rays but I always give the support counter a wide berth when I walk in, Im afraid their sleeze will contaminate me or something.

I hope Fry's takes care of you though.

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Best Buy fails, but some good news!
« Reply #542 on: August 14, 2010, 12:16:42 am »
I'm not an EE, but I asked one about lightning protection a few years back.  He basically said that there is no circuit that activates fast enough to stop the lightening current from getting through before it shuts off.  Even the best protection circuits will allow some of the power through before the kick off.  Considering that a lightening strike is millions of amps, even if a fraction got through, everything that's plugged in at the time and is struck will be AFU.

The only protection from lightening strikes is not having the equipment plugged in at the time a lightening strike hits.   :dunno

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Best Buy fails, but some good news!
« Reply #543 on: August 15, 2010, 05:29:46 am »
I'm not an EE, but I asked one about lightning protection a few years back.  He basically said that there is no circuit that activates fast enough to stop the lightening current from getting through before it shuts off.  Even the best protection circuits will allow some of the power through before the kick off.  Considering that a lightening strike is millions of amps, even if a fraction got through, everything that's plugged in at the time and is struck will be AFU.

The only protection from lightening strikes is not having the equipment plugged in at the time a lightening strike hits.   :dunno

that is not entirely true. I'm having this in my mame cabinet:

It has a fuse and is fast enought to stop any overvoltage coming thru.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2010, 08:23:49 am by XNIF »

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Best Buy fails, but some good news!
« Reply #544 on: August 23, 2010, 04:15:56 pm »
Any more steampunkification ? I just read all pages again...  when this is done you should bundle it and release it in a bookform.  
I found the cover this is how it should look:




Dunno why this pic, but i love it :P


drventure

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Best Buy fails, but some good news!
« Reply #545 on: August 31, 2010, 09:05:47 am »
Well, I had a little time over the weekend to rework the new Altec Lansing sub to replace the burnt one.

This time, I went for a tad more steampunkification  :)

(Plus, I just loves me some red pintuck taffeta!)



You can see the older unit in the background. The stamping was nice but the padded fabric and upholstery nails look a little more polished.

And yeah, the grill has been "aged" a bit. Originally, I had it sprayed with this "real metal" paint, which, in reality, looked very much like metal plate (and not the typical frosted metal look of most "metallic" spray paints), but it still didn't look quite right.

Heck, the whole thing hangs UNDER the cab, so it's not like it makes a huge amount of difference, but, if you're standing across the room, you can just see it poking out from under the buffet, so I figured it needed to look decent.

Just for reference, here's the shot of the old unit in place.


Next weekend, I hope to get the main PC box reassembled and reinstalled.

Phillips came through and sent me a  new surge suppressor (one with the master switch), and a check to cover the burnt parts. Very cool. and the first time I've ever had to make a claim like that. They were very reasonable about it all, so definitely keep your paperwork for you surge suppressors (at least from Phillips).


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Quote
(Plus, I just loves me some red pintuck taffeta!)

LOL that is funny

Congrats on the fundage cant wait to see what is coming down the pipe!  :cheers:
Manuals and info on Dynamo cabs!

Benevolance

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It lives again! Tally-ho and pip pip! Looking forward to seeing some more progress soon.

drventure

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Thanks benevolance. Me too!

@xnif
Love that book.
Have you seen Datamancer's Scanner, Awesome stuff.

http://www.datamancer.net/projects/optitran/optitran.htm


drventure

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - LEDWiz problems
« Reply #549 on: September 09, 2010, 06:25:37 pm »
Well, I've been out sick from work for two days, but even hacking and weazing, I'm not one that can just lay around (that is, unless I'm +really+ bad off, which fortunately doesn't happen much).

So, a little time for the Arqadium!

Got it all pretty much back together, rebuilt the PC, replacing the Mobo, replaced the subwoofer to get the sound going again.

Had some trouble getting the new gigabyte drivers for sound/lan/onboard video, etc installed (since the old board was an asus, and I didn't completely reinstall windows, the old drivers seemed to be pretty tough to get rid of).

But eventually got all that sorted.

Fired it up and tested out all the input devices. Still golden!

So, how about all the new LEDs and elwire?

Ugh. Load up LEDBlinky and fire off one of the canned animations and I get USB device drop "boings" all over the place.

I figure I've got an over current issue, but yuck. Here's what the underside of a quad player cab with dual trackballs, a spinner, 2 u360s, 2 LEDWizes, and miles of wire looks like.



Ok, its not normally that bad. I've got some jumper clips out bypassing some of the normal power wires to use an external power source for the LEDWiz for testing (plus the ever present voltmeter!)

So I start disconnecting USB devices, rebooting, wash repeat.

Eventually, I was able to narrow the problem down to....

1) the big one is the USB ELWire driver module. It says 100ma, but I'm thinking it's drawing way more than that, esp since I'm using the LEDwiz via a couple of optoisolators to control the ELwire, so it's switching on and off very fast, just like it does LEDs.
2) 2 Jumbo super bright LED's I picked up from radio shack ages ago. I'm using them to light the trackballs. The specs say 20ma, but I'm thinking it's considerably more. If I power JUST THOSE TWO led's via the USB 5v that's available on the LEDWiz, it's enough to take down the hub it's attached to.

Moral of the story. If you're driving anything other than just the small usual LED's, it's probably safest to pick up a 5v power brick (mine came from an old DLink router, and can do 2.5amps), then wire an inline fuse on the line, just to be safe. If you get any weird behavior, esp from your other USB devices, that's most likely the issue.

But, bottom line is, now the Arqadium can run all the canned animation patterns that come with LED Blinky, with no issues at all!

I'll get some video once I get everything battened back down.

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Troubles with LEDWiz, but not for long
« Reply #550 on: September 09, 2010, 07:15:57 pm »
I'm not an EE, but I asked one about lightning protection a few years back.  He basically said that there is no circuit that activates fast enough to stop the lightening current from getting through before it shuts off.  Even the best protection circuits will allow some of the power through before the kick off.  Considering that a lightening strike is millions of amps, even if a fraction got through, everything that's plugged in at the time and is struck will be AFU.

The only protection from lightening strikes is not having the equipment plugged in at the time a lightening strike hits.   :dunno


Actually it is more accurate to say that a lightning strike is millions of VOLTS and about 50,000 to 100,000 amps.  But hey maybe he need a 1.21 gigawatt strike to power this contraption.  I have to say it's better that than trying to get it up to 88 MPH.  Heh heh.


drventure

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Troubles with LEDWiz, but not for long
« Reply #551 on: September 09, 2010, 08:55:09 pm »
@Bender

Quote
Why not protect your whole house by installing one of these in your main panel.
Whole House Surge Prot
if anyone can verify that that thing would work against a lightning strike I'm getting one!

Sorry I missed that comment, bender. Actually, I +had+ a whole house surge suppressor installed when I got hit. Damn thing didn't do squat. I called the electrician and complained pretty bitterly. He did stand up, though, came out, told me that they'd stopped installing that particular model in favor of a different make that works differently (according to him).

No idea if it'll work better or not. Also, no idea whether the suppressor prevented damage to other equipment that "could have been" had it not been installed.

Personally, i think you're better off with one that without, but I'm still not 100% convinced.



@Jigenjuke

Quote
Actually it is more accurate to say that a lightning strike is millions of VOLTS and about 50,000 to 100,000 amps.  But hey maybe he need a 1.21 gigawatt strike to power this contraption.  I have to say it's better that than trying to get it up to 88 MPH.  Heh heh.

Not sure who's quote that is but it's pretty damn funny. Early on in this thread, i talked about wanting to put a Jacob's Ladder in it, till I discovered those things can actually kill you if they're powerful enough to be big and visible.

I decided against it  :)

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Troubles with LEDWiz, but not for long
« Reply #552 on: September 09, 2010, 09:24:13 pm »
Not sure who's quote that is but it's pretty damn funny. Early on in this thread, i talked about wanting to put a Jacob's Ladder in it, till I discovered those things can actually kill you if they're powerful enough to be big and visible.

I decided against it  :)

In progress: Rat Rod Jukebox ** 99% Complete **
Completed: The Island Cocktail, and here
Completed: No Name Upright

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Troubles with LEDWiz, but not for long
« Reply #553 on: September 09, 2010, 09:48:31 pm »
Good use of  'sickie' days   :) , great to see this coming back online  :cheers:  The lightening strike is now a part of the cabs history, maybe I should re-do the vid, it does after all have the Jacobs ladder effect at the end  ;)
« Last Edit: September 09, 2010, 09:50:15 pm by Ond »

drventure

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Well, the Arqadium is back online, so it's actually been getting some play, and not much work :-[

Still, I've done a few little things.

First, almost all the lighting is up.
The CP and most of the accent lights are operational. Still need to get power to some of the el wire, but, here's a vid showing the Arqadium running Animation #7 from LEDblinky's default arsenal of animations (no time yet to build up a custom one).



You can't really get a good look at them, but each button has a light wired to it embedded beside it in the CP that will light up when that button is active in a game. Still working through getting LED Blinky setup for all that.

I also realized that with all the power bricks in the CP, and given the fact that it is TOTALLY closed up, could lead to some heat problems.

So, I pulled out an adjustable circle cutter I picked up ages ago, but never had had a chance to use, and gave it a workout.

Worked great!



And from beneath....



There's one fan, an intake port, and exhaust port. They're underneath, so nobody will ever see them, but I found some gold colored fan guards and just used brass screws for everything. The fan's not adjustable, but I can pick up any ol case fan with a speed adjuster to take care of that later.

One bonus, I suppose, is that you can actually feel the air blowing out from beneath the sticks and trackballs. In the long run, i'm not sure that's a good thing (what with dust and all), but it feels nice while you're playing.

Now I've got to get Visual Pinball and FuturePin reset and operational.

Then, I can test those nudge switches!

@ond
Too true, a lightning strike vid could be very cool.

I also need to work up a good sound set. The sounds that come with mala are ok, but don't quite fit the theme  :)
« Last Edit: October 01, 2010, 11:32:21 pm by drventure »

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Playable again!
« Reply #555 on: October 02, 2010, 02:43:29 am »
Soooo glad to hear it is up and running again!  I could say the whole build looks awesome or incredible but those words fall far short of just how amazing that mild mannered antique buffet really is!  Great idea on the fans!
« Last Edit: October 02, 2010, 05:40:18 am by JustMichael »

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Playable again!
« Reply #556 on: October 02, 2010, 04:26:16 am »
Great video drventure, looks superb.
 :cheers:



jimmy2x2x

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Playable again!
« Reply #557 on: October 02, 2010, 08:01:55 am »
It lives.... Again!!

Great to see you back up and running ;)

drventure

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Playable again!
« Reply #558 on: October 02, 2010, 09:29:34 am »
Thanks guys. Getting things back on track, little by little!

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Re: A Mame machine in an antique buffet - Playable again!
« Reply #559 on: October 02, 2010, 01:04:09 pm »
Glad to see the Buffet back up and running!