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Would this work for a hybrid vehicle?
patrickl:
--- Quote from: danny_galaga on July 03, 2008, 03:26:27 am ---i was quoting very rough figures. im going to check it out now, but id be very surprised if the prius is both 1.5L AND 70HP. thats a very inefficient sounding motor.
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Well if you think that 140hp is a rough figure for 70hp ::)
--- Quote ---regenerative braking is great. but pretty useless if you arent moving ;)
--- End quote ---
The energy loss through braking is what drives up the fuel consumption while driving in cities. The Prius has the same fuel consumption in a city as on the highway. You lose a serious amount of energy while braking. Amazingly it's about the equivalent of pulling the car back up to speed :P
--- Quote ---if this is what the prius does (no engine generating electricity for the batteries) then its no wonder the electric motor only drives it up to 5km/h or so!
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It only charges the batteries from the petrol engine when it absolutely has to (ie battery is low)
--- Quote ---i think someone else mentioned in another thread that the prius doesnt get much more milage than their diesel car (although im not for diesel cars).
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Yes so? You need less diesel per mile yes. Actually, some hybrids are now coming with diesel engines. Thought it was BMW or Mercedes with their SUV hybrids.
I still think they should ban diesel though. Or make sure they actually clean up the exhausts.
--- Quote ---charging the batteries via a petrol motor is actually quite efficient. this is because, yes there are some losses involved because of the conversion of one type of energy into another, BUT the net effect is a lot less petrol used (and thus much higher MPG) because the engine isnt always running. and when it is, it runs at a constant speed rather than accelerating and decelerating all the time.
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Really that's just nonsense. You lose energy three times instead of just once. Which is exactly why the Prius uses this as little as possible.
--- Quote ---just checked the toyota prius wiki. good god! youre right about that motor! i guess its a whole different ball game. those specs are more like light aircraft engines. which now i think about it makes sense since both the electric motors AND the engine in the prius are running when accelerating. the electric helps pull the revs of the petrol engine quickly, actually starting it, it seems to me.
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Yes, it helps in the lower RPM ranges so the petrol engine doesn't have to run at an inefficient speed. I think the electric motor it accelerates further than 5km, but it depends on how much you floor it.
Indeed if you are really in a hurry it will use both motors to the full. Obviously you will not be driving very fuel efficient then.
--- Quote --- also from the toyota prius wiki:
"Auto Express magazine performed independent fuel efficiency tests, on public roads, on a number of hatchbacks, and in August 2007 published their list of the ten most efficient. The Prius achieved 10th place in the list, returning 41.5 mpg–imp (6.81 L/100 km / 34.6 mpg–U.S.). A Citroën C4 Coupé 1.6 HDi got 1st place with 49.6 mpg–imp (5.7 L/100 km / 41.3 mpg–U.S.).[41]"
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It's probably the most fuel efficient petrol driven car. I really don't see what the point is in mixing diesel and petrol cars in the same list.
--- Quote ---and it also mentions the top gear episode that im guessing rayb has youtubed for us (im guessing because i have teh sux innernets and cant wait an hour or so to look at the clip!)
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Lol, yeah that was funny. Of course it's just Top gears way of making something ridiculous. They know damned well that if you drive the Prius like a race car it's not going to save gas. My Audi TT was more fuel efficient when driving over 180km/h than my Honda is now.
One problem with the Prius is that it is not very fuel efficient on the highway. To be honest I think it needs a bigger engine.
--- Quote ---i dont know why you mentioned cars doubling in weight? my 70s model cars were/are about 1000 kg. the equivalent kind of car now is not 2000 kg!
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you have got to be joking. I had a big old Renault and it weighed about 800kg. It's counterparts today really do weigh 1600kg. My tiny Honda already weighs 1200kg.
--- Quote ---anyway, gourami thanks for the thread. its got me thinking about hybrids a bit more (",)
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Yeah. My dad has one and he loves it. I'm still not convinced it's actually a good idea. Actually the more I read about it the more I think it's not a good idea. It's currently "state sponsored" though, which is mostly why he drives one. It brings down the price of what is essentially a super luxury car (it really has the coolest features) down to the price of a standard car.
--- Quote ---also from toyota prius wiki:
"The engine is used both to propel the vehicle and to recharge the batteries. Because of the availability of extra power from the electric motors for rapid acceleration the engine is sized smaller than usual for increased fuel efficiency and lowered emissions with acceptable acceleration;"
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Indeed, but they use it as little as possible.
danny_galaga:
--- Quote from: patrickl on July 03, 2008, 04:19:00 am ---
--- Quote from: danny_galaga on July 03, 2008, 03:26:27 am ---i was quoting very rough figures. im going to check it out now, but id be very surprised if the prius is both 1.5L AND 70HP. thats a very inefficient sounding motor.
--- End quote ---
Well if you think that 140hp is a rough figure for 70hp ::)
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well, i admit i was way off there. i knew roughly the capacity of the prius. i had no idea they would have made an engine so 'unpowerful'! my 1971 vw is almost as powerful! but with the engine toyota are using, its apples and oranges i guess...
danny_galaga:
--- Quote from: patrickl on July 03, 2008, 04:19:00 am ---
--- Quote ---charging the batteries via a petrol motor is actually quite efficient. this is because, yes there are some losses involved because of the conversion of one type of energy into another, BUT the net effect is a lot less petrol used (and thus much higher MPG) because the engine isnt always running. and when it is, it runs at a constant speed rather than accelerating and decelerating all the time.
--- End quote ---
Really that's just nonsense. You lose energy three times instead of just once. Which is exactly why the Prius uses this as little as possible.
--- End quote ---
having a hybrid the way i described does not preclude it from having regenerative braking. it wont be as noticable though if its electric. i think regenerative braking is a brilliant idea. they are also looking at using a mechanical system where the energy is stored in a flywheel. apparently they want to use that in F1! this would also work in the system i was describing...
danny_galaga:
--- Quote from: patrickl on July 03, 2008, 04:19:00 am ---
--- Quote ---i dont know why you mentioned cars doubling in weight? my 70s model cars were/are about 1000 kg. the equivalent kind of car now is not 2000 kg!
--- End quote ---
you have got to be joking. I had a big old Renault and it weighed about 800kg. It's counterparts today really do weigh 1600kg. My tiny Honda already weighs 1200kg.
--- End quote ---
i guess it depends what you consider 'big'. my type 3 vw is 880kg. heavier than your 'big' renault. but i wouldnt consider a type 3 to be big. if we only talk about small cars then surprisingly, you arent far off the mark. i searched for a vw golf as an example. looks like the first models weighed between 800 and 900 kg. the latest weighs 1447kg. but we tend to still think of larger cars as normal in australia. i looked for ford falcon as an example since they are a popular australian family sedan. the first model, the XP, from the 60's (which looks friggen awesome in the 2 door model 8)) weighed 1170kg, while the latest model weighs about 1700kg. which is obviously not double. regardless, i still dont see the significance of that. you design the system around what the car weighs...
SithMaster:
--- Quote from: gourami on July 01, 2008, 10:43:54 pm ---Does this constitute a perpetual motion device, which, if created, would cause the end of the universe? The way I see it, as long as the car is moving, the batteries would be charging. As long as the batteries are charging, the car will be moving.
My head hurts. :banghead:
--- End quote ---
What about using a solar panel to power a lamp that shines onto said solar panel to in turn power the said lamp?
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