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What kind of gas mileage do you get?

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patrickl:

--- Quote from: danny_galaga on April 29, 2008, 07:07:47 am ---but lets talk your language then. lets take my car as an example again. imagine i will sell it after 4 years. 2500 plus 2000 for repairs. 4500 (2,697.45 EUR  ;)) divide by 48= 93.75 a month. ok, new small car 15000. divide by 48= 312.50. so, where is this 30% of which you speak?

--- End quote ---
Mostly in the fact that you forget to add all the other costs like the insurance, fuel, taxes. My car costs 618 a month (with 340 in added costs). Add that to yours and it's 618 vs 434 and presto driving a junker is only 30% cheaper.


--- Quote from: danny_galaga on April 29, 2008, 07:07:47 am --- you better hope this is the case, if second hand cars were as unreliable as you and wade make out, you wont be able to GIVE your car away after your 4 years is up ;)
--- End quote ---
A 4 year old cars is still lightyears away from the state and maintenance/reliability misery of an old junker.

Everyone in my family has driven an old junker. A lot of friends of mine did. All these cars had maintenance costs that were way higher than 2000 over 4 years. Many ended in catastrophic failures. Racking up amazingly high depreciation costs.

shardian:
I refuse to continue reading this thread until Paige fixes his link. WTF dude, you should know better!

danny_galaga:

i still think you are adding euros to dollars for an interesting result  ;D

ok, when i commuted, it was about $30 per week for fuel. lets just call that $120/month. insurance is about $150 per year (third party fire and theft) so 12.50/month. plus the actual cost of the car plus repairs 93.75/month. almost forgot registration  $43/month total cost is about $295.50 per month for my car if you work it like that.

the toyota yaris would have used roughly $20 per week fuel if i were driving it. so lets say $80/month. you should have full insurance for a new car. using the same company i used (AAMI) it is 43.75/month (cheaper per year, but you like these monthly figures  ;)) the car itself $312.50/month (and as you say, no extra costs in four years if still in warranty), registration $43/month so total is $419.50/month.

i can see what you are getting at now. that is roughly 42% more, which is in the ballpark to your 30% figure. but i still think that is considerably more expensive. perhaps we should debate what the definition of 'considerably' is. to me 42% is considerably more. using the car dealers trick of making it look like nothing by making it monthly doesnt disguise the fact that in four years i would have spent about $7000 dollars more. the difference would be even more if my second hand car was more fuel efficient. in fact the new yaris would be about 100% more than my junker (nee, niet JUNKERS-het vliegtuig  :D) if it had similar fuel economy (which is entirely possible, cars havent become terribly more fuel efficient. swap my car for an old corolla or similar).

 i can quite easily drive the car i have for  ten years (if we still have any fuel by then). that works out to about $193/month. allowing for money back on the new car (about $7500 after five years) and the cost of another ($15000) works out to about $311/month or about a 60% premium to my costs. this is about the cost of the new car ($14160) over a ten year period!

edit: forgot the rego on that last example but i think that figure just strengthens my case anyway...

anyway, i think really the question is what you consider 'considerably more expensive'  :dunno

oh, and shardian, link is fixed. read away  ;D

shardian:
Okay, there is a ton of ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- here, so I'll just hit the points that I remember off the cuff:

About Taxis: Paige, I think your idea of Taxis is heavily influenced by movies set in NY. In real life, a Taxi can take up to an hour to reach you. In my area, there might be 1 or two mom and pop operations with a car or two each. And where do you get your idea that Taxi's are safer?!? I have seen the taxi's around here - they are whatever beater the company has on hand with a sticker on the side! Even the big cities are switching to the "tin cans" that you despise.

And here are several facts that need to be considered when driving an older used car:
1. Liability insurance
2. blue book value
3. Finding a good value replacement used car when yours bites the dust

If you get in a wreck in a car with liability and you are at fault then bye bye $2k car - good luck finding another $2k car with the $2k you do not have. This can happen the day after you buy your car and you would be so screwed it would not be funny - especially if you buy a $5k used car and have liability.
The other issue is Blue Book Value. I refuse to buy a used car that will have liability anywhere near blue book value. I treat the gap between sale price and BB value to be "car equity", and keep the upfront repair cost below this amount. This fact paid off huge on my last car. I got a $3300 BB value Volvo for $850 and did upfront and intermediate repairs that brought my total investment to about $2500. The car was hit and totalled in a parking lot, which means I actually got paid to own the car for 2 years.
That brings me to #3, finding a replacement. With the way people are jacking there prices through the roof for good mpg beaters, finding a car for $3k or less that met my requirements has been next to impossible. Luckily I listened to the birdy in my ear and kept my other beater sitting in the driveway all this time.

Bottom line, going used or beater is a gamble that can turn out awesome, or can be a nightmare. I've been on both ends of the gamble, and except for extreme examples (such as wrecking two or mroe beaters at your fault in a year), it will end up being cheaper than new.

On the other end of the spectrum, if someone buys new and drives the car more 10 years or more without any issues and then sells or trades, they will come out smelling like roses too - and with many less headaches than a person who blew thru 4-5 used cars in that same 10 year span.

In summary, here are your two best cost effective options:
1. buy cheap used and hope for the best
2. buy affordable, good rep, high mpg new and drive for 10+ years

HaRuMaN:

--- Quote from: shardian on April 30, 2008, 09:13:42 am ---2. buy affordable, good rep, high mpg new and drive for 10+ years

--- End quote ---

This is what my wife and I do...  we pretty much drive it until the wheels fall off, then get a new one.  The only thing I had to replace in my wife's '99 Civic (with 256K miles on it) was the coil (other than normal maintenance items).

Then we got totalled by some idiot driving way too fast in 6 inches of wet snow with a '68 Camaro...   :badmood:

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