New Frontend (Coming Soon)

[BadBoyBill]

Hi everyone,

Been lurking in and out of this forum for many years, I decided to write my own FE (HyperSpin) for fun for myself and am thinking of sharing it now.  I know there are lots of FE's out there but I wanted something like the old Arcade Legends/Ultracade feel.  I want to put together full documentation and a site during the next few weeks, so it'll be a bit before theres a download.  For now though here's a sneek peek.  I'll link a download to a better quality video if anyone is interested.  The video doesnt show submenus and game launching, I'll put that video up later.  This is just the main menu that I took to show animation, and the different things you can easily do with your artwork, sorry no sound. 

Youtube:


Higher Quality Download:
http://rapidshare.de/files/38579841/Frontend1.avi.html

Some features:

-Smooth continuous animated wheel. 
-Individually skinnable games and menu items.
-Skin and Animate videos
-Animate any artwork easily with a couple settings and achieve lots of different animations and transitions.
-Individual  settings for each game, allows for custom lists(ie. combine all street fighters from all emu's into one wheel cps2, cps3 , mame etc...)   or make a taito legends are capcom classics list etc...
-Multiple Emu's(One main wheel with sub wheels) or Single Emu mode (Run just one wheel with one emu), wheel
  animates in and out to see new wheels.
-Basic features(Attract mode, Intro Vid, List building, Controls , FPS Counter, etc...)

-Working on right now
  -Additional wheel styles, (horizontal flat, horizontal half moon)
  -Text effects, stroke text, shadows, color glow)
  -Backend software to help with skinning.
  -Joypad support

Let me know if theres any interest. Thanks.

[bent98]

Wow this is nice!

As long as I can use LED Blinky.

When are you going to release it to public?

[RyoriNoTetsujin]

Hi!

Video looks VERY intriguing!  Your artwork animation options give me TONS of potential skin ideas!

Make it relatively simple to set up lists and emulators, and make it relatively easy to skin (just not as cumbersome as 3DArcade, please!) and you've got my interest for sure!

Looking forward to more info and more videos! 

[Space Fractal]

Look awesome.

Any plans for make a Jukebox and PC games as "emulators" as well to the wheel (etc start a Jukebox or PC game(s) of your own selection)?

[bent98]

Are there any min requirements for video cards?

[Howard_Casto]

I really really really really really like it.  Keep in mind, I hate everything!

Could you post video of what happens when you actually go into one of the lists?

Also can it be done without the wheel?  I'm not sold on the wheel.  When ultrastyle first did it I thought it was great.  The more I played with it the more I hated it though... it just doesn't allow for maximum screen usage and it's hard to read elements on the outer edges. (They are at a 90 degree angle!)

[SGT]

Very nice, I'm impressed. 

[Havok]

Looks awesome - can't wait to see more..

 

I really really really really really like it.  Keep in mind, I hate everything!

That is a serious testimonial: Howard even hates the stuff he codes...

 

[loadman]

Cool.

Will it have native rotation options?

Will it have Plug-In Support? 

[fatfingers]

I really really really really really like it.

*heart attack ensues*

*fatfingers dies*

[BadBoyBill]

Very nice, I'm impressed. 

bent98 - LED Blinky support might be later on, I'm not really familiar with it yet.  Release will be soon hopefully,
I won't put a date on it yet, till I've tweeked everything But maybe a few weeks I'm guessing.  I will consider releasing it without a backend so all editing will be through ini, and I'll package a generic list  builder(dat to xml) compatible with no intro and other dat sets, and list from folder option.  My main holdup is the backend which is twice as tedious as writing the frontend.

Hi!

Video looks VERY intriguing!  Your artwork animation options give me TONS of potential skin ideas!

Make it relatively simple to set up lists and emulators, and make it relatively easy to skin (just not as cumbersome as 3DArcade, please!) and you've got my interest for sure!

Looking forward to more info and more videos! 

I think set up is fairly simple,  nothing on the level of 3DAracade.  All your skin ideas can come to life for sure,  just a breakdown.
All artwork follow this setup: 
1) Determine a final resting spot for an artwork and angle. 
2) Choose 1 style: Bounce, Ease, Grow, Grow X, Grow Y, Fade, Sweep Left, Sweep Right, or None(Linear Motion).
3) And last, choose where the artwork should animate from: Top, Bottom, Left, Right, or None.
Easy as that!  Combo any of those settings and you have hundreds of animation possiblities without having to know how to animate.

Look awesome.
Any plans for make a Jukebox and PC games as "emulators" as well to the wheel (etc start a Jukebox or PC game(s) of your own selection)?

I dont have the slightest clue of whats good for jukeboxes, but I definitely want it for my machine.  If you have a recommendation let me know, and I'm sure I can incorporate it.
Also yes PC games will run.  You can have a wheel image for PC games, select that wheel and a whole new wheel will have all your PC games.

Are there any min requirements for video cards?

Well, Im not for sure yet, but yes you do need a good PC/VideoCard, I'm running an older 9800XT Pro Radeon and I'm pullin 60 FPS on the animation continous with the down button, but... my Laptop Dell XPS older version 9700 256MB Video, the animation runs fast at first then gets a little bogged down.  Not sure why, but I do need to reload the laptop.  We will find out when people start testing.

I really really really really really like it.  Keep in mind, I hate everything!

Could you post video of what happens when you actually go into one of the lists?

Also can it be done without the wheel?  I'm not sold on the wheel.  When ultrastyle first did it I thought it was great.  The more I played with it the more I hated it though... it just doesn't allow for maximum screen usage and it's hard to read elements on the outer edges. (They are at a 90 degree angle!)

Thanks Howard, I agree on some points you make, I have only once seen an ultracade and it was pretty choppy going from game to game.  I don't really have a problem making out items on the wheel.  They do angle up at the top and bottom of the screen, but I dont think it interferes with selecting a game.  But it would be very easy to just have an option to not have a wheel, I will impliment it before release.  Text list arent built in yet.  I'm working on it now, but all FE's that I've seen have text lists so I figured people would just use them where I wanted an artwork based FE. I will get  a video up soon for your request.  I gotta borrow a camera again.

Very nice, I'm impressed. 

Looks awesome - can't wait to see more..

Thanks SGT and Havok

Cool.
Will it have native rotation options?
Will it have Plug-In Support? 

Sorry no rotation options.  That would be something I would really have to think about.
There isnt anything in place for plugins so far.  Are there certain plugins that provide features for other FE's in particularl. Or just in general for people to add functionality to this software?

I will be posting a better video of the first video so you can download it in a few minutes.

[Circo]

This looks like it has alot of potential, very exciting!!! 

[SGT]

Sorry no rotation options.  That would be something I would really have to think about.
There isnt anything in place for plugins so far.  Are there certain plugins that provide features for other FE's in particularl. Or just in general for people to add functionality to this software?

Below is a link to Mala plugins *and* the Plugin SDK.  How cool would it be if the current Mala plugins would work with your FE out of the box! 

http://mala.arcadezentrum.com/plugins.html

If you add plugin functionality and rotation, I predict an explosion of interest for this FE.  Don't get me wrong, it has great appeal already. 

[Havok]

Will it have Plug-In Support? 

Don't mind loadman - he's just jealous that yet another front end is graphically superior to Mala...

[bent98]

I dying to see sub menus

[loadman]

Will it have Plug-In Support? 

Don't mind loadman - he's just jealous that yet another front end is graphically superior to Mala...

It's strange that you took it that way,  It was a ligit question. If I wanted Bling Bling I would have switched to GameEx long ago.. Anything but Atomic    Just Kidding 

Anyway....
I was very impressed, but I like to make Plug-ins to add custom functionality hence the question.  Such a thing could make me switch FE's   

[Dazz]

Very very hot... can't wait to see how easy it is to skin and also how end user friendly it is.  I have kids and when using Mala and MameWah in the past I would always find the configs out of wack somehow.  I switched to Maximus Arcade and absolutely love it so far and NOTHING has been screwed up yet by the kids.  If your FE comes close I might just have to see what this can do. 

Thanks for your awesome contribution to the scene!

[Havok]

Such a thing could make me switch FE's   

Yeah, riiiiiight...

 

[headkaze]

Fantastic! Very similar looking animation system to the engine I'm currently writing. It looks like you even have some of the bouncing and ease in/out type effects it has too.

I really can't fault the overall look, it's very impressive! There are quite a few new 3d accellerated (next gen) FE's coming out this year and it will certainly be an exciting one for arcade gamers! I can't wait to see the new skins people make for them.

[youki]

Very Impressive. Looks very promising.   I love it.

If you do a good follow up , and activily support it , it will be surely a Killer App! 

Looks quite similar to my Atomic "NextGen" engine can do.

[headkaze]

Looks quite similar to my Atomic "NextGen" engine can do.

So you finally decided to drop DirectDraw for Direct3D Welcome to the party!

[youki]

Yes.     but i don't drop DirectDraw. 

The "Next Gen" will be a brand new Front end  for modern PC. And could be  .NET/XNA too... (yes ,i'mgetting old, i'm becoming a lazy coder  )

AtomicFE ,as it is ,is still evoluing. But less on the "bling bling" part.  I'm doing a very hard work on Configuration tools.

Anyway, don't wait for Atomic "next gen"  for short term. It is not ready at all. It is just a set of  nice routines for now.


I'm curious, in what language did you developpe your Front End BadBoyBill ?

[headkaze]

Yes.     but i don't drop DirectDraw. 

The "Next Gen" will be a brand new Front end  for modern PC. And could be  .NET/XNA too... (yes ,i'mgetting old, i'm becoming a lazy coder  )

AtomicFE ,as it is ,is still evoluing. But less on the "bling bling" part.  I'm doing a very hard work on Configuration tools.

Anyway, don't wait for Atomic "next gen"  for short term. It is not ready at all. It is just a set of  nice routines for now.

I'm curious, in what language did you developpe your Front End BadBoyBill ?

Lol! You finally see the light in .NET! You can call it lazy coding or you can call it "rapid development". You get alot more done in a shorter time.

BTW I looked at XNA for my engine and decided not to go with it for now. XNA has no support for DirectShow so there is no way to do 3d accellerated video on textures AFAIK. Maybe they have added it now but when I last looked they didn't. The main reason for that I believe is support for XBox 360; no DirectShow on XBox 360! So I decided to stick with MDX 1.1. One other avenue I think worth persuing is SlimDX but I haven't looked alot into it.

I don't want to sound like I'm putting this excellent new FE down, but after watching this video a few times I realised my engine was capable of this type of animation over a year ago. I just don't have a nice skin to show it off yet. I know Atomic could do things like this but software alpha blending using DirectDraw API is always going to limit what it can do. But I think AtomicFE with a 3d engine could be a different story, especially if you support your current skins. Now with Khameleon and DK are both 3d it's going to be interesting to see all the different opinions on those.

[youki]

Lol! You finally see the light in .NET! You can call it lazy coding or you can call it "rapid development". You get alot more done in a shorter time.

You know, i work with .NET since 2000 . I really like it. Just that for what i wanted for Atomic it would have limited the target plateforms.

software alpha blending using DirectDraw API is always going to limit what it can do.

There is no software support for Alpha Blending in DirectDraw API. I had to write my own routines.   

In fact , what is really limitating me with Direct Draw , are bitmap "rotations". Like for instance , doing a Wheel List with directDraw...  It is in these case you really regrets Direct3d.

[Cakemeister]

Very, very cool. It takes Youki's trajectory files to the next level.

[RetroBorg]

Great video, frontend looks great and I like the name "Hyperspin" too. 

With Khameleon and Howard's frontend coming out shortly, plus all the other current frontends already out, we are really going to be spoiled. 

[Popcorrin]

Very nice!  I've seen a few ultracades in action and it's hard to tell yours apart.

Once it's released, I think it would be a cool idea to have a repository that people could add their per game animations to and that way people could share rather than trying to make a few hundred per game animations on their own.

[unclet]

Would it be possible to add a "Most Played" emulator?   It would be nice to have one game list which lists the Top25/50/75/100 games played.  Basically the most popular games from all other configured emulators would be listed in this one "most played" emulator list.   

[BadBoyBill]

Thanks to everyone showing interest.

Its really encouraging and makes me want to keep hard at work.

Some features already implimented that might be interesting that I didnt mention.

From the video.  You can see some videos have overlay png's that animate along with the video.  You have 3 options with video.  Plain square.  Overlay png.  Or border.  The border option allows for a quick visual skin.
You choose the border width and color and the border will be are rounded corner frame for the video.  This is for those not wanting to spend time creating a picture but do not want a plain square video.  I might add another option so you can set the roundness of the border in pixels.

Also from the video.  You can see 2 things at the bottom of the video.  The words press start/free play blinking in and out, and also Some kind of info in the center of the screen showing the user what to do.  These two items come from the same class and show you what can be done with different settings. 
You have tons of possibilites with these special artworks.  They are differnt than your normal artworks which your allowed up to 4 on the screen.  Your allowed 2 of these artworks and they have different kind of settings.  They are basically artwork that switches out.  For example the free play/ press start are just 2 pictures that rotate out.  Advantage of pictures in this case is obviously you design your text on your own.  Gradients etc... Like in the video.

Settings Include:
How long each pic stays on the screen in the press start case (about 1 second)
Type of animation, in the press start case(fade)
How long the animation lasts and where it starts, in the press start case (about half a second)
Delay between pictures to show up, in the press start case(about half a second)

With these four settings you can create hundreds of possible scenarios.  The second example the info at the bottom center of the screen is cycling 3 pictures(no limit though), with a different animation type(ease). Think of the posibilities, artwork slideshow, game controller viewer, FE instructions, etc...

Everything you see on the screen has default settings via ini files, if no per game settings are set.  So if you want to build a 1000 game wheel and just want boxart moving in and out , then just set your artwork defaults for a quicker setup.

This is a flash9 based frontend for those who care.  It is wrapped with third party software that allows me to extend flash way beyond its normal capabilities and make use of .NET.  The reason I chose this route was time mainly and to see what AS3 can do when combined this way.  Everything you have seen so far was made in just weeks on my spare time.  The best part to me is that it doesnt have a flash feel, and with the Virtual Machine 3, animation is much better.  There are no internal assets, everything is defined by the user.  All dialogs are normal windows, no cheesy flash stuff.  I have two versions available ready to go so far and not sure which I'm going with, one requiring .NET.  I'm feeling them out right now.  If your not feeling it then thats cool, but from what I've been playing with I havent seen any major issues so far and am very happy with the outcome.  Perfect for a frontend.

All the extra details will be given about the FE on the website.
An artwork repository will have to be on a seperate site.
Creating a top played list automatically wont be an issue.  To take it a step further, my idea for a better attract mode will be this.  One or any combo of these in order:

First play random video from a specified folder.
Second display a nice screen with hi scores from the top played games(MAME). With Logos for each of the games with a score to the right.  All customizable of course.
Third. Animated instruction screen or something else.

Will try to get the top played lists  going as one of my first post release projects.

****
I'm not sure if anyone is interested but I'll just put it out there anyways.  If there is any interest in contributing with writing backend I could really use the help. I only have a few hours a night to work on this(12-14 hour a day job), and it would be nice to spend my time working on the frontend and documentation and just overall have a partner to work with.
If someone wants to help you will be the first to have access to play with and all releases, plus artwork.
And all credit for your work of course.
If your good with forms are very comfortable working with xml, then let me know, I can release this alot sooner otherwise I'll probalbly get started on it in the next few weeks.

[headkaze]

Very interesting you used Flash, I guess that is why it reminded me alot of my animation system as it's based on Flash's animation system (Tweening/Frames/Easing). My engine is in pure .NET and I'm a little disappointed yours isn't as I would possibly be interested in working with you.

I have a lot of the backend code in .NET for dealing with emulators in other software I've written. Including a plugin for LEDWiz as metioned earlier in this thread. My guess is you would like to keep using your own engine but I would want to keep using mine. Also another problem is I might want to use my engine for commercial projects which means it would be impractical to share code. I am interested in getting your skin running through my engine though

I smile because there are alot of your ideas in my own engine, like masking for videos and transitions. My themes are broken up into layout files where everything from animation to layout is defined in an xml file. It has alot of flexibility and is very powerful.

My guess is you have a strong Flash/Actionscript background because alot of the animation stuff, for me anyway, is inspired by Flash.

Oh well I can still help you with anything related to .NET if you encounter any problems. You know I once wrote a FE in pure Flash + OOP ActionScript 2 but I found it rendered too slow so I gave up on it. I wrote it because MCE only allowed plugins using HTML so I wanted to imitate the look of MCE in Flash so plugins looked nicer. It looks like ActionScript 3 and this software to integrate with .NET has improved it's performance alot.

[BadBoyBill]

It's nice to here that someone else has attempted this.  I did an AS2 version about 5 years ago, ran games fine and everything, and I had the same issues as you, waaay to slow.  Now its a different ball game and AS3 is making my visions come alive, so I'm rebuilding an old project.  I'm sorry that its not fully .NET, but I'm glad you can still apprciate what it can do. 

I wanted animation to be easy for the user without needing to import swfs which some FE's support.  Anyone can animate without flash for free.  So I made premade animations that can be set by the user and a simple name like ease.  And like you all themes are XML. But not in indiviual layouts, the "List" database is the theme. Something like this:

<System>
      <Description>Nintendo Entertainment System</Description>
      <Artwork1 x="512" y="200" r=360" time="2" animation="ease" start="top"/>
      <Artwork2/>
      <Artwork3/>
      <Artwork4/>
      <Video/>
</System>

Will animate an object from the top of the screen to 512,200 rotate in a full 360, eased into position in 2 seconds.

From the backend would be real fast to setup animation for your png file.
The videos is the fun part, same as above with a couple extras for borders and scaling.

I appreciate the offer for help, I might need it.  No shame in my game.
Obviously the drawback with Flash is that it will never be as good as anything you can make speed wise,
but I'm just happy I'm getting the speeds that I am right now.  Just worried about others trying to run it.

[headkaze]

Yeah it's almost scary how close they are lol. But I put it down to Flash really which was my inspiration. I was really excited about this feature in my engine and thought it was ingenious to use Flash animation techniques in Direct3D. Lol now I don't feel like it's so unique

Here is a snippet from a test theme that shows the tweening syntax

Code: [Select]

<Video Name="VideoSnap" Source="Video.avi" X="0.0312" Y="0.3017" Z="0.5" Width="0.3047" Height="0.3613" Loop="True" Mute="False">
<Mask Name="VideoSnapMask" Source="masktv.png"></Mask>
<Tween Ease="Bounce" EaseType="InOut">
<Frame Duration="5"><Rotate X="0" Y="0" Z="0"></Rotate></Frame>
<Frame Duration="5"><Rotate X="0" Y="0" Z="5"></Rotate><Scale X="0" Y="0" Z="-1"></Scale></Frame>
<Frame Duration="5"><Rotate X="0" Y="0" Z="0"></Rotate></Frame>
</Tween>
<Reflection Name="VideoReflect" X="0.0312" Y="0.72" Z="0.5" Width="0.3047" Height="0.1806">
<Translate X="0.08" Y="0" Z="0"></Translate>
<Shear X="1" Y="0"></Shear>
</Reflection>
</Video>
So as you can see it's a little similar (in concept), although I don't have any "built in" animation types yet but it seems like a good idea to simplify common movements/transitions into single commands. Right now I'm just adding as much flexibility as I can.

I'm very impressed by the speeds too. Never belived you could do anything like that in Flash without it chugging. Macromedia/Adobe have obviously pulled their fingers out this time.

[nipsmg]

Let me just say, wow.  I absolutely love it, and the skin for it is great.  I would definitely use this, without question.

That being said, I would love to help you with coding, but again, I'm a .net guy, so like headcaze I don't think I could be much help.  I can't wait to see a release of this, it looks amazing.  Keep up the good work!

[BadBoyBill]

So as you can see it's a little similar (in concept)

Sheesh, you got that right, very similar, I had a similar setup at first, then I tried pretty hard to simplify everything.

For instance the game description pretty much defines everything the video name and overlay name. 

I didnt even think about loop.  Its automatic loop, but your right maybe the user doesnt want a loop.  Need to add.  I thought to add reflection to video but didnt add it since my themes are all cartoony lookin, but again need to think about the user here, some people like that. 

Ya I felt premade but yet customizable animations were the way to go for simplicity sake.  For instance if you watch the video the very last part for MAME uses one I call Sweep Left or Sweep Right.  Sweep take your png fly's it across the screen out the other side of the screen  then moves it into location from the top of the screen all with one keyword.  The user still defines the speed of the animation, the timing and final location, and rotation.

Let me just say, wow.  I absolutely love it, and the skin for it is great.  I would definitely use this, without question.

That being said, I would love to help you with coding, but again, I'm a .net guy, so like headcaze I don't think I could be much help.  I can't wait to see a release of this, it looks amazing.  Keep up the good work!

Thanks, I still could use any help with the backend, which can be in done in anotherer language.  But I know thats booring work for most, and I'm not looking forward myself.  But would definitely put your name on this FE.  Working alone on this is driving me nuts. LOL.

Also I will be designing a logo this week, if any Graphic guys out there want to toss up any ideas lemme know. The official name will be HyperSpin.

There is also a higher quality video of the youtube vid in the original post if anyone is interested.

[Hoopz]

There is also a higher quality video of the youtube vid in the original post if anyone is interested.

OF COURSE!  Where is it please???

Very cool!   

[BadBoyBill]

In my first post of this topic, it uses rapidshare, so click the link, scroll to the bottom and click the free button to get your file.

[RetroBorg]

BadBoyBill,

Any chance the skin and setup we saw on the video could be the default skin and setup that we download and all we have to do is add roms, emulators and fine tune a few settings to run straight out of the box.

Second display a nice screen with hi scores from the top played games(MAME). With Logos for each of the games with a score to the right. 

Can you describe how this might work? e.g. will your frontend be able to read the high score files from those games and display on some custom screen?

The more I read about your frontend the more I'm impressed, I look forward to seeing the finished project.

[Cakemeister]

Are skins going to be XML, some other plain text format, or binary files?

[BORIStheBLADE]

Nice work. Hope to see it out soon.

[Dazz]

I am really curious to see what the emulator config is going to be like for this? 

Is it going to be all .ini and .xml files like others or a simple easy to use interface?   I found MameWAH and Mala to be excellent front ends, but configuring them to work nicely takes a lot of work.  When I was using them I was doing more configs and re-configs than I was playing anything.  I've switched to Maximus (which costs) for it's nice and easy way to setup new emulators. 

[Howard_Casto]

I am really curious to see what the emulator config is going to be like for this? 

Is it going to be all .ini and .xml files like others or a simple easy to use interface?   I found MameWAH and Mala to be excellent front ends, but configuring them to work nicely takes a lot of work.  When I was using them I was doing more configs and re-configs than I was playing anything.  I've switched to Maximus (which costs) for it's nice and easy way to setup new emulators. 

Word of warning...  no matter how fancy it ends up looking the configuration is what's gonna decided if people use it or not.  One of the things that killed dk initially is the steep learning curve for advanced configuration... something I intend on fixing this go around.  There are a lot of other fes that bit the dust as well, either because setting things up was too dang hard or there wasn't any configuration at all, meaning users couldn't tweak things the way they wanted.

Work on your backend is what I'm saying I guess.

[BadBoyBill]

Are skins going to be XML, some other plain text format, or binary files?

Are skins going to be XML, some other plain text format, or binary files?

Skins will be through xml with defaults in an ini file but you should have to edit them directly just through the backend.

I am really curious to see what the emulator config is going to be like for this? 

Is it going to be all .ini and .xml files like others or a simple easy to use interface?   I found MameWAH and Mala to be excellent front ends, but configuring them to work nicely takes a lot of work.  When I was using them I was doing more configs and re-configs than I was playing anything.  I've switched to Maximus (which costs) for it's nice and easy way to setup new emulators. 

Word of warning...  no matter how fancy it ends up looking the configuration is what's gonna decided if people use it or not.  One of the things that killed dk initially is the steep learning curve for advanced configuration... something I intend on fixing this go around.  There are a lot of other fes that bit the dust as well, either because setting things up was too dang hard or there wasn't any configuration at all, meaning users couldn't tweak things the way they wanted.

Work on your backend is what I'm saying I guess.

Im pretty sure that the learning curve is pretty low.  Maybe some light reading to get started.  I've got half a backend working but not final, and it fly's through the xml lists so far and provides easy editing and skinning.   Skinning isnt the hard part I find, its having the artwork to make it look nice, now thats what might turn people off.  But with all the good skinners out there including myself I'm sure we can come up with some stuff for people. 

Heres a shot.  Nothing special but functional.  I'll probably make something more modern after. Right Click to view better image. Sorry, dunno how to do thumbs.

[Howard_Casto]

I wasn't referring to the skinner, that part is always optional.  I think we were both referring to configuration in terms of how do you add gamelists and emulators and link to their artwork files ect....

[headkaze]

I wasn't referring to the skinner, that part is always optional.  I think we were both referring to configuration in terms of how do you add gamelists and emulators and link to their artwork files ect....

I think BadBoyBill understands the amount of work involved in writing the back-end stuff which is why he asked if anyone wanted to help.

BadBoyBill: I wrote the Setup Wizard for GameEx so I would suggest checking it out for the ideas I've used to make setup as painless as possible. The Setup Wizard has been important for new users which is why the effort to write it was important. It has features like auto-downloading emulators, different levels of config, search etc. It does seem like many people compare FE's based on how easy/hard it is to set up. To solve this FE's like GameEx have the Setup Wizard / docs, AtomicFE has it's Plugin and Play system / docs and Mala has (?) / documentation.

I also wrote the Theme Editor for GameEx but I am not the author of GameEx (Tom Speirs is). So it's a bonus if you can find someone else to do these back-end programs for you. They are huge applications in themselves.

Don't let Howard put you off, there is alot of work involved but if you have a great engine with great themes and features (which is the case thus far) then people will be willing to help take some of the workload off you for things like config programs and skin editors.

[DaveMMR]

Oh my God, I love this! 

Admittedly, when it comes to my arcade cab, I like to keep the interface simple and the selection limited to only arcade games.  But your FE is inspiring me to build a less "arcadey" dedicated game box for classic consoles and such.  I'll be keeping an eye on this! 

[BadBoyBill]

I wasn't referring to the skinner, that part is always optional.  I think we were both referring to configuration in terms of how do you add gamelists and emulators and link to their artwork files ect....

I know the above picture doesnt show alot, but as far as configuring gamelists and linking to artwork files is easily handled from that screen to.  Here are my thoughts and what it does so far, I know its nothing on the level of GameEx and your DK, but that functionality is there.

So far there is not much of an installer, just unpack and run the editor above.
The initial list is a blank main menu with dummy items in a treeview.
Simply rename those items to what you feel you will have in your frontend. ie. emulators, categories you want.
If an item in this main list doesnt have an emulator setup the button above the treeview enables[Create Submenu]
The part you dont see here is a wizard the guides you through configuring that item including building a list either from a folder of roms or converting a dat etc.. very easy.
The thing here is that this FE is designed with a wheel interface.  Currently there is not major bundle of artwork for the wheel items.  Marquees might be used but its ugly.  My goal is to create these wheel art for people with the upmost hardwork and dedication.  This is my main concern and will consume most of my time.  Which is another reason why I need help.  I'm so addicted to game artwork its not even funny.  I will sit there for hours in Photoshop busting out these wheel images for all of us.  I would like to concentrate efforts on that to. 

I know I don't have all the greatest featues including downloading emulators n stuff for you.  If this is the kind of stuff people are expecting then I don't want to get their hopes to high.   Tom Speirs is very lucky to have someone like you on his team HeadKaze, and it is a great FE, with more funcitonality than I can ever achieve.  I definitely want yours, Howards and anyones advice and take what you guys are saying into serious consideration. 

There is alot of work involved but if you have a great engine with great themes and features (which is the case thus far) then people will be willing to help take some of the workload off you for things like config programs and skin editors.

On my to church to start praying for some helping hands.

Oh my God, I love this! 

Admittedly, when it comes to my arcade cab, I like to keep the interface simple and the selection limited to only arcade games.  But your FE is inspiring me to build a less "arcadey" dedicated game box for classic consoles and such.  I'll be keeping an eye on this! 

One wheel is possible so far, you can just run only arcade games upon startup.  In my collection I have all kinds of USB game controllers, nintendo, genesis, snes, tg16, sms, all coverted to USB, and even the old N64 Adaptoids.  I want to incorporate stuff like this for people like you.  I want to have usb ports under my main control panel for that to.  Good luck.

[headkaze]

I know the above picture doesnt show alot, but as far as configuring gamelists and linking to artwork files is easily handled from that screen to.  Here are my thoughts and what it does so far, I know its nothing on the level of GameEx and your DK, but that functionality is there.

DK as in Dragon King? I'm not the author of DK Howard is. You might have got confused because he was talking about adding tweening animation recently which is an idea he took from my engine last year. Not that I care but he likes to take other peoples ideas and call them his own. The engine I'm writing is still in the works.

[SGT]

DK as in Dragon King? I'm not the author of DK Howard is. You might have got confused because he was talking about adding tweening animation recently which is an idea he took from my engine last year. Not that I care but he likes to take other peoples ideas and call them his own. The engine I'm writing is still in the works.

You're confused. He referenced "Your DK" to a quote by HC. 

[Dazz]

Man, imagine the front end possibilities that could be if only the different developers got along with each other... 

[youki]

It will be a knightmare!!!   

[SGT]

BadBoyBill,

Is plugin capabilty a possiblity or has it been ruled out?  I skimmed through the thread, but I never saw a definitive answer on that.  Sorry if I missed it.  Thanks!

[BadBoyBill]

Sorry didnt mean to confuse anyone there. 

Is plugin capabilty a possiblity or has it been ruled out?  I skimmed through the thread, but I never saw a definitive answer on that.  Sorry if I missed it.  Thanks!

Sorry bout that, Plugin funtionality is definitely doable.  It will be something I think about down the road here.

[loadman]

Sorry didnt mean to confuse anyone there. 

Is plugin capabilty a possiblity or has it been ruled out?  I skimmed through the thread, but I never saw a definitive answer on that.  Sorry if I missed it.  Thanks!

Sorry bout that, Plugin funtionality is definitely doable.  It will be something I think about down the road here.

Please do 'down the road'.  Think of it this way, a bit of work from you to enable plug-ins could save YOU a lot of work to add extra funtionality     Anyway I won't pester you .......for a while anyway 

[loadman]

Man, imagine the front end possibilities that could be if only the different developers got along with each other... 

It is getting better      I was pretty nasty not so long ago 

[headkaze]

BadBoyBill: I wrote the plugin system for GameEx so I'm happy to help with any technical challenges you face there. One thing to note is if your going to support both managed and native dll's you will have to write separate routines to deal with them. BTW loadman I did write code to allow support for non-managed dll's and Tom has it ready to implement.

One question though, what part of the FE is C# and what part is Flash/Action Script? I'm assuming here that all the visual stuff is in Flash and the back-end stuff will be C# or is it ActionScript 3? Also did you say you don't need the .NET framework? I'm a little confused here as to how it's been put together.

It is getting better      I was pretty nasty not so long ago 

I don't even think I've seen you "nasty"

[BadBoyBill]

Pretty much the whole FE is AS3.  I'm just using some 3rd party softwares to bring it to the desktop plus the ability to extend my script past its limitations.  I'm almost sure by now you will not need .NET framework.  I have 2 versions I'm playing with which is why you might have gotten confused.  Both versions are equal in speed from my tests so I'll probably use the non .NET version. 

[headkaze]

Pretty much the whole FE is AS3.  I'm just using some 3rd party softwares to bring it to the desktop plus the ability to extend my script past its limitations.  I'm almost sure by now you will not need .NET framework.  I have 2 versions I'm playing with which is why you might have gotten confused.  Both versions are equal in speed from my tests so I'll probably use the non .NET version. 

Can AS3 deal with dll's or call API functions? Just wondering about how a plugin system might work in AS3.

[BadBoyBill]

Can AS3 deal with dll's or call API functions? Just wondering about how a plugin system might work in AS3.

In a roundabout way, yes.  This is what makes it possible for me to do things like access the filesystem, read/write files from flash, read joystick movements.  Things not normally capable by flash itself. 

[headkaze]

In a roundabout way, yes.  This is what makes it possible for me to do things like access the filesystem, read/write files from flash, read joystick movements.  Things not normally capable by flash itself. 

Ahh yes I remember using the javascript function ActiveXObject() to use dll's in AS2. So yeah shouldn't be a problem adding support for plugins. Actually when I was writing "fhome" which was my little MCE looking FE in AS2 I wrote my accompanying fhome.dll which contained OS specific stuff in C#.

That is actually great, because you get the engine capabilities of Flash and the rapid development of C#. I highly recommend you code your back-end stuff in C# and keep the dependancy on .NET. It will mean you can get alot of the painful back-end stuff done with the help of the .NET Framework, and trust me it will save you alot of time by using it.

[Demon-Seed]

Hey
Wow i like it alot..looks great.. BUT I must agree that FE have to be more userfriendly to config... when can we download it??

thx
Jim

[DeLuSioNal29]

You may want to take a look at the FE "Maximus Arcade" for some ideas.  It has great backend features and is easily configurable.

http://www.maximusarcade.com/max.htm#config

~ DeLuSioNaL

[BadBoyBill]

You may want to take a look at the FE "Maximus Arcade" for some ideas.  It has great backend features and is easily configurable.

http://www.maximusarcade.com/max.htm#config

~ DeLuSioNaL

Good lookin out, I'll take a look.

Hey
Wow i like it alot..looks great.. BUT I must agree that FE have to be more userfriendly to config... when can we download it??

thx
Jim

Download in a couple few weeks I'm guessing, I'm progressing very well on some some new features.  And the backend is coming along also. 

[SGT]

BadBoyBill,

Is there or will there be a way to have a single gamelist that uses multiple emuls?  For example, if you wanted to run multiple versions of Mame, you wouldn't want to have multiple Mame gamelists.  Or another example is if you wanted to run El Semi's M2 emulator along with Zinc.  These emuls all run arcade games that you would want in the same gamelist with the Mame emulated games.  Do you follow what I'm trying to ask?  My current FE can do it, but not without a bit of "manual engineering".

Thanks!

[BadBoyBill]

BadBoyBill,

Is there or will there be a way to have a single gamelist that uses multiple emuls?  For example, if you wanted to run multiple versions of Mame, you wouldn't want to have multiple Mame gamelists.  Or another example is if you wanted to run El Semi's M2 emulator along with Zinc.  These emuls all run arcade games that you would want in the same gamelist with the Mame emulated games.  Do you follow what I'm trying to ask?  My current FE can do it, but not without a bit of "manual engineering".

Thanks!

Yes this is possible, like yours it does take some manual editing,  on per game basis.  I'm still trying to figure out the best way to do this and the only way I've come up with so far is just and alternate path exe as an option in the list database.  Like you could make a complete cps2 list, then manually add in some cps3 games with alternate paths in the list xml file.  I don't find it taking to long to make custom lists. 

[gonzo90017]

You might want to talk to Youki of AtomicFE. His way seems to be the easiest way of having all emus in one list. With Mamewah you have to make an ini file for each game. But with batch files you can make hundereds of the inis in seconds.

[mccoy178]

Looks fantastic.  Thanks for putting the effort in!

[XtraSmiley]

Looks great!

Some things you may have already considered, but I'll add here:

1.  Make it usable with an AVGA card, if possible.
2.  Make it so you can spin your wheel with a spinner, since many of us have them on the cabs.
3.  Since MAME's game list is so huge, how are you handling the second, game wheel?  Maybe the next level in can have all the letters, plus a favorites, then when you select a letter all of that letter appear.  Ignore this if you have a better system already set up.  Your video just didn't show the sub menu selection.

Keep up the great work!

[Demon-Seed]

What about having the track ball spin the wheel? just an idea.. I am sure you thought of it.  I have always wondered too why not build in some sort of "how to play" the particular game? like show the panel or something..and the control panel layout explaining which buttons etc do what..  I hate with mame when you have 1000's of games and you forget the keys for a certain game.. I think someone made a program like this cpviewer or something..anyways what about building something like that in?

later
Jim
PS- when can we expect a release?

[headkaze]

What about having the track ball spin the wheel? just an idea.. I am sure you thought of it.  I have always wondered too why not build in some sort of "how to play" the particular game? like show the panel or something..and the control panel layout explaining which buttons etc do what..  I hate with mame when you have 1000's of games and you forget the keys for a certain game.. I think someone made a program like this cpviewer or something..anyways what about building something like that in?

later
Jim
PS- when can we expect a release?

To be honest CP Viewer applications like CPViewer, Johnny 5, and my own CPWizard are harder to write than you might think. It took me a long time to get CPWizard to a level I was happy with, and that was even with the rapid development of .NET. The good news is these CP Viewer apps should work with any FE anyway. So they should all work with HyperSpin too. He just might need to do some minor testing to make sure they work together okay, but it shouldn't be a problem. Actually to run CPWizard for Mame you don't even need to send it a command line arg. For recent versions of Mame it will actually detect it running and retreive the controls for you. All you have to do is design your own CP and press pause during Mame to show the controls for the game your playing. Not only that but you can chose to not have CPWizard running in the background at all and instead apply the bezel diff file so your CP will display INSIDE Mame when you press the pause button. So you have some options there already, and BadBoyBill doesn't have to spend months or weeks writing the code to do it himself.

[BadBoyBill]

Looks great!

Some things you may have already considered, but I'll add here:

1.  Make it usable with an AVGA card, if possible.
2.  Make it so you can spin your wheel with a spinner, since many of us have them on the cabs.
3.  Since MAME's game list is so huge, how are you handling the second, game wheel?  Maybe the next level in can have all the letters, plus a favorites, then when you select a letter all of that letter appear.  Ignore this if you have a better system already set up.  Your video just didn't show the sub menu selection.

Keep up the great work!

1. Yes will work.
2. Already works
3. Working on now, push a button and brings up genre list.  It will be pretty nice.

What about having the track ball spin the wheel? just an idea.. I am sure you thought of it.  I have always wondered too why not build in some sort of "how to play" the particular game? like show the panel or something..and the control panel layout explaining which buttons etc do what..  I hate with mame when you have 1000's of games and you forget the keys for a certain game.. I think someone made a program like this cpviewer or something..anyways what about building something like that in?

later
Jim
PS- when can we expect a release?

Well I guess you can use the CPViewer indepedently , but I've been working on a control screen based on controls.ini, this screen will be customizable and will be a pretty neat part of the FE.  Yes you launch a game and based on a main category, will load a animated or static background,  and will be very simple and clean.  I will have  a little hand or arrow pointing to each button in speedy order to show available keys for that game.  You can press any key to exit this screen or wait till and will resume automatically. 

As far as a release, I'm just testing on different emu's right now, and adding small but cool features.  I cant promise a date but I know it will be soon.  I still have to put docs together also.  This is pretty much a solo project and am not really recieving any outside help which is no big deal, it will just take a little longer since its so much work involved.

[XtraSmiley]

Awesome man!  I see you said it will work with the AVGA, but earlier in this thread didn't you say it ran slow on a 9700pro?  I didn't think the AVGA was a better card than that.  Also, do you mean the original AVGA and the newer AVGA2 or just the newer one?

Either way, thanks for the hard work.  I can't wait to test it out.

[BadBoyBill]

Awesome man!  I see you said it will work with the AVGA, but earlier in this thread didn't you say it ran slow on a 9700pro?  I didn't think the AVGA was a better card than that.  Also, do you mean the original AVGA and the newer AVGA2 or just the newer one?

Either way, thanks for the hard work.  I can't wait to test it out.

Ya I've done further testing since, my laptop is crapped up, so I can really go off that, I tested it on my work computer which is just a cheepo and just onboard video, and it runs perfect, and my buddy tested it on a win2k older computer and he said it runs great.  Best way to know it once its released and see how people do.  I'm guessing the minimum requirements would be what flash's requirements are since it seems fine to run in these situations.

[Ginsu Victim]

Your FE looks awesome! I'm currently building a machine and trying to decide which frontend to use, and I may have found it.

Question: Since you already answered the question about the spinner, which was going to be my original question, can you change the graphic that shows selecting with the joystick to a graphic of turning the spinner?

Thanks.

[Demon-Seed]

Hey
I can't wait.. well I have too. I have a few bills to pay before I can commit to a new build :(no big deal..... cant wait to try this...

thanks
Jim

[Cakemeister]

What I want to know is where the artwork came from. Obviously a lot of work went into that skin.

[headkaze]

What I want to know is where the artwork came from. Obviously a lot of work went into that skin.

Lol I can tell Cakemeister is dying to write an importer for this skin I agree it's a fantastic looking skin and it must have taken ages just to get all the artwork together for it

[Dazz]

Ok, it's been a couple weeks... Where is our download?

[BadBoyBill]

What I want to know is where the artwork came from. Obviously a lot of work went into that skin.

Well proably 90 percent of the artwork from the video I did on my own all in vector format then converted to png's.  I actually enjoy doing the artwork more the writing the program.

Lol I can tell Cakemeister is dying to write an importer for this skin I agree it's a fantastic looking skin and it must have taken ages just to get all the artwork together for it

It is things like this that makes me very hesitant to release HyperSpin with all the skins,  and rather just have users share amongst eachother their creations which I'm sure there will be some good ones.   It did take along time to make all that art and it is time consuming,  I'd rather it go to good use than be used to promote other frontends. We'll see though.

Ok, it's been a couple weeks... Where is our download?

Please be patient, alot of work is going into this right now, no I'm not just sitting around, I'm just wrapping up my mame listxml converter(list maker) and will integrate it into the rest of the backend I'm working on.  The frontend is fully functional and ready to go I think.  Theres just no simple way to get started yet without manual editing of the ini files and lists.  And there are no docs yet.  I'm trying. 

[headkaze]

It is things like this that makes me very hesitant to release HyperSpin with all the skins,  and rather just have users share amongst eachother their creations which I'm sure there will be some good ones.   It did take along time to make all that art and it is time consuming,  I'd rather it go to good use than be used to promote other frontends. We'll see though.

I don't think I've seen a skin like the one you've created ever. So obviously the interest in your FE stems from it's skin. People are going to want to have that skin, because it really is the best one out there IMHO.

Unfortunately it's going to happen whether you like it or not but that's just the way it is. It's happened to every other FE in the past already so your not the first. Take a look a Khameleon, even it's name has some implications there, it can import most other well know FE formats. It proves that it's not the skin that makes the FE. That's why it's the engine and back end that has alot of baring on it's success. I think it might bother other FE authors that someone will write an importer for their skin format, but what is wrong with that really? This is not a commercial arena. People will still use your FE if it does the things they want it to. Personally I think the new 3d FE authors should get together and make a standard format. So I think people need to ask themselves what makes a FE, the skin or the engine and back end? Don't let it put you off, this is a hobby and it's supposed to be for fun afterall.

Personally I get more enjoyment sharing my creations with people than competing with them. Don't forget there is a whole community here and there is more to success than writing the best FE.

[Cakemeister]

I'd rather it go to good use than be used to promote other frontends.

That remark leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

[protokatie]

So I think people need to ask themselves what makes a FE, the skin or the engine and back end?

As a newb, I think it is the editor. The MALA editor (for instance) doesnt seem to like VISTA, and wont save certain aspects of the skins I make (even tho the preview seems to show it just fine). This is why I switched to atomicFE, as it worked with Vista perfectly, and the layout editor was rather (but not very) intuitive.
So I say to this new "intruder" with the really cool looking FE project, "Dont forget about making the skin editor very easy to use, and as quirk free as possible".

(Yes, I do realise that the editor is only a minor aspect of an FE, esp since many FEs can read other FEs skins, but it is a really nice thing to have and can make someone stick to a particular FE if its layout editor is decent)

[paulstevens]

I'd rather it go to good use than be used to promote other frontends.

That remark leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Why?

[Havok]

I'd rather it go to good use than be used to promote other frontends.

That remark leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Makes perfect sense to me - that's his baby, and you're looking to rip apart the stuff you want and put it into something else. There's a lot of hard work he's doing, and I can see where he's coming from...

[Yarb]

This front end looks like what I have been looking for for years. The only thing I see missing is the ability to use all those RGB LEDs I wired into my CP (Shudders at the memory). I have always felt that the finishing touches are what make a great cab (Mine is painted with Midnight Metallic Blue 1960's Mustang car paint and clear coated). I have sought a front end that allows for an arcade feel without a windows look (Read no freaking text lists). Ultrasytle is the closest to what I want but it has some severe handicaps. I cannot contribute code assistance but if you need testers I would be glad to help and I will be putting it to use as soon as it is released.

    

Mike B

[Ginsu Victim]

^We'll all be testers soon enough. Just give it time (though in the process of waiting I've discovered the goodness of MameWAH, so I may not switch)

[massive88]

^We'll all be testers soon enough. Just give it time (though in the process of waiting I've discovered the goodness of MameWAH, so I may not switch)

The biggest problem with Mamewah is its learning curve I think.  But since getting the program down fairly well, it seems like every time I come across a "man I wish I could do this with my frontend" theres a way to do it.

Im speaking mainly of execution and organization of lists, but still, hell of a frontend.

Ill keep trying the new ones, but now that Im familiar with Mamewah, it will really have to have a solid setup and customization options for me to switch now.

[Ummon]

The biggest problem with Mamewah is its learning curve I think.  But since getting the program down fairly well, it seems like every time I come across a "man I wish I could do this with my frontend" theres a way to do it.

One could probably say the same about DOS, for approximately the same reasons.

[Dazz]

^We'll all be testers soon enough. Just give it time (though in the process of waiting I've discovered the goodness of MameWAH, so I may not switch)

The biggest problem with Mamewah is its learning curve I think.  But since getting the program down fairly well, it seems like every time I come across a "man I wish I could do this with my frontend" theres a way to do it.

Im speaking mainly of execution and organization of lists, but still, hell of a frontend.

Ill keep trying the new ones, but now that Im familiar with Mamewah, it will really have to have a solid setup and customization options for me to switch now.

Personally I liked MameWAH a lot, but I found myself screwing with the configs more then playing games.  Once I, thought, I had it all setup and let people play on the cabinet for some reason the configs were always screwed up after.  Not sure if button inputs were causing it, but I found myself doing more configs then playing.  I switched to Maximus Arcade and have never had any issues with configs ever again.  So freaking easy my 5 year old son can use it and I don't have to worry about anything getting screwed up.

Really looking forward to this Front End though...

[loadman]

As a newb, I think it is the editor. The MALA editor (for instance) doesn't seem to like VISTA, and wont save certain aspects of the skins I make (even tho the preview seems to show it just fine).

Hi, sorry to hijack this thread

Why do think Vista has anything to do with it? I have not heard of any MaLa vista problems before. If there are issues I would love to know about it.

Did you try it on any other OS or just assume MaLa had a problem with Vista? I know you said 'doesn't seem' but I want to nail this down please 

It sounds more likely you had the layout directory options set out incorrectly

Check the wiki section here:

http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/wiki/Mala_Layout#F.A.Q.

If you have any comments about MaLa and Vista probably best to start a new thread

[headkaze]

Jeez guys comon this has nothing to do with MaLa. If you have a problem with another FE then make a new post. Sheesh. Why annoy this guy with totally unrelated stuff.

[SGT]

Actually we need a Pebkac forum for such things.   Now.... back to the New Frontend......

[Neilyboy]

watched the quick vid.. gets my approval!! very nice work man! I cannot wait to see how this comes out.
Neil

[arzoo]

bent98 - LED Blinky support might be later on, I'm not really familiar with it yet.  Release will be soon hopefully,

BBB - If your FE can launch an external app before starting a game, and pass the rom name, then it can use LEDBlinky.

[Goshen]

This looks fantastic! I mean...really really fantastic!  I love how visual it is my kids are going to love it! 

To go along with what the others have said about ease of use...

One thing I love about GameEx is that somehow it knows which version of the game is best and uses that on the list, I also love that when you install it is comes with all of the game lists, 4 players, multiplayers, trackball, light gun, classics, ect...  Thats one thing I hate about Mala is that it doesn't come with any game lists, and I don't want to make one, and haven't found one to download.(I am sure someone will point out the error of my ways).  But the point is, having something that you install, point it at the roms and it just works...thats golden.  Then you can customize it from there.

[BadBoyBill]

Hey everyone, sorry for no updates for those that are interested, I've been very busy on the FE, and been making lots of improvements.  I had to rewerite the wheel  to make it more effiecient, I think its running really great now. 

I'ts goint to be slightly different from the video(better), if you notice when going from game to game the background simply fades out and a new background for the next game fades in.  I added about 20 and soon more random transitions to the background.  There will be no black screen between backgrounds, one will transition to the next with nice effects, like elevator doors closing in, sliding in backgrounds, blinds, and things like that.  With more advanced effects later.  I also added swf background support and have already created some nice moving backgrounds. 

My MAME coverter is just about finished for the backend, with just a few clicks youre able to make lots of lists easily, remove clones and non working games and create lists with catver.ini.  You will be able to name your genres, since catver.ini has some funky names and lots of weird categories.  Pick some catver categories, give it a name and your good.

As for the comment about running an external app prior to the game, this isnt incorporated but I'll add it in for those who need it.

Also as for the custom premade lists, Im sure I can post those in my forum but it will be very easy to make your own lists with what I'm writing now,  just follow the instructions and you'll be fine. 

Thanks

[MiKman]

Just a quick question, is there anyway you could write into it to load/unload the ultrastik 360 game configuation files similiar to the way some of the other front ends handle it?

like implement some sort of pre/post emulator commandlines that can run before mame is run and after it exits...

If you already have this implemented I apologize for not reading the thread entirely.  If not and you have any questions about this, let me know I'll try and help anyway I can...

PS love the front end :-) 

[fatfingers]

I would be willing to supply some code I wrote for the U360 plugin for MaLa if you're interested.

Let me know.

Joel

[BadBoyBill]

I personally don't own a ultrastik so I wouldnt be able to test this, but, after reading the ultrastik page I know I can add this in, maybe I'll buy one in the future, since it would be nice to have one on hand for testing.  So for now it woul'dnt have this functionality yet, but thanks for bringing this up.

[Ummon]

But the point is, having something that you install, point it at the roms and it just works...thats golden.  Then you can customize it from there.

All of them have their quirks and failings here.

[BadBoyBill]

Well I dont want to assume which rom sets naming people are using nor what roms they actually own.  But are you guys saying you want premade lists ready to go and just dump your roms and emulators in for it to be a good frontend.

The only way I think that this would be, is:
1. To have ready to go emulator folders come with the install that you would install the emulator into, which I can do.
2. Have premade lists (good naming or no intro) ready to go in the database directory.
3. Each wheel genre needs its own XML file. So premake genre lists for MAME.
4. Have the backend support the making of any other lists you need.

I can do these things I guess, but the tools and documentation will be there to do these things yourself.  I think it will be very important to have easy to read step by step documentation to get you going, which I am working on. 

On a side note:  I just moved in my new arcade machine in today, so I just gotta put a computer together so Im super motivated to get all this off the ground as soon as possible, seems like every time I turn around I find more fixes I need to do and additions I need to make. 

[arzoo]

Just a quick question, is there anyway you could write into it to load/unload the ultrastik 360 game configuation files similiar to the way some of the other front ends handle it?

MiKman,
This is a bit of a long shot, but LEDBlinky does have a feature to control the 360 based on the game config. But this is still dependent on BBB adding the ability to launch an external app prior to launching the game (which he has said he will do), and that you will be lighting your cp with an LEDWiz or PacDrive.

[screaming]

Wow, very impressive!  I can't say that enough... It's nice to see someone take FEs seriously for a change.

I second the notion that making the backend is harder and more tedious (partly because it's boring as hell) than the front end part. I spent untold hours on MAMEWAH Config (incidentally, people were all kinds of p'ed off because it was done in .NET 1.1. It's funny to come back after a couple years and see the shift of opinion ).

Any plans on getting the backend lists in a database using, say, the free sqlite?  It saves a ton of burden down the road, especially if you do it now while you're just ramping up. Also, it gives you a unified interface to pull all your game info from and you can sort it and parse it every-which-way but Sunday.

  Not to mention saving users (like me) from writing simple apps to sort favorites lists in AtomicFE.

Lastly (sorry), did I miss the demo video of you launching a game list and a game?  I'm interested in checking that out.

[joebells]

would that require us to install sqlite on our systems like mymovies does of my sql or some sql program I hate that and don't run it because of that.

[btoddkelley]

One feature that I really like in Mamewah is the ability to control the system volume from the frontend. One button increases volume, one decreases it. Not trying to bug you for features, just thinking you might find this handy in your cab as well. With volume control the user does not need to open the cab to lower the volume when the neighbors complain! Absolutely great looking frontend BTW!

Todd

[screaming]

would that require us to install sqlite on our systems like mymovies does of my sql or some sql program I hate that and don't run it because of that.

Nah, BadBoyBill would include a small .dll file with his front end and you're good to go.  None of that MS SQL Server crap...

[BadBoyBill]

Wow, very impressive!  I can't say that enough... It's nice to see someone take FEs seriously for a change.

I second the notion that making the backend is harder and more tedious (partly because it's boring as hell) than the front end part. I spent untold hours on MAMEWAH Config (incidentally, people were all kinds of p'ed off because it was done in .NET 1.1. It's funny to come back after a couple years and see the shift of opinion ).

Any plans on getting the backend lists in a database using, say, the free sqlite?  It saves a ton of burden down the road, especially if you do it now while you're just ramping up. Also, it gives you a unified interface to pull all your game info from and you can sort it and parse it every-which-way but Sunday.

  Not to mention saving users (like me) from writing simple apps to sort favorites lists in AtomicFE.

Lastly (sorry), did I miss the demo video of you launching a game list and a game?  I'm interested in checking that out.

There are not plans crrently for building databases using free sqlite.  Though its possible, Im just trying to get alot of the basic stuff out of the way right now first, and kinda just see how people like the list generating features I inlcude, and if there arises needs for more advanced listing features then I can impliment that stuff later.

One feature that I really like in Mamewah is the ability to control the system volume from the frontend. One button increases volume, one decreases it. Not trying to bug you for features, just thinking you might find this handy in your cab as well. With volume control the user does not need to open the cab to lower the volume when the neighbors complain! Absolutely great looking frontend BTW!

Todd

Ok I can add this feature, actually I kinda already added something already, but it isnt routed to buttons, I'll add it in.

[screaming]

doesn't seem "advanced" to me, it seems like quality programming form.

The gui looks great though and the fact that it's all customizable is incredible!  Great job.. I'm excited to see this FE come out for real.

[BadBoyBill]

doesn't seem "advanced" to me, it seems like quality programming form.

The gui looks great though and the fact that it's all customizable is incredible!  Great job.. I'm excited to see this FE come out for real.

Well what I mean by advanced is that I dont think that most people need to make lists like (all games made by midway, only 4 way, of the fighting genre, working, favorited and is not mature), catch my drift, I want to keep it simple, cuz thats what this fe is gonna be, just some genre lists, favorites, and maybe a few other common filters, it might not be advanced to you or me, but I dont want to confuse a typical user either, and if not having tons of listing possibilities is poor programming form then i guess I'm barking up the wrong tree. But thanks for the input, i personnaly
will probably have some nice and simple genre lists like ultracade does, and keep it at that for personnal machine, which is the primary reason im writing this. If you ever get a chance to see one you will immediately appreciate the simplicity and fun it is.

[Neilyboy]

Very awesome badboybill. glad to see you have not lost interest in this project. you have a really great thing going man with lots of potential! Keep up the good work man

Neil

[mybrainhurtz]

I have been following this thread since it started, and I just wanted to say that I think things are looking great BBB! Having an interface that has flash-based transitions brings some freshness into the rather plain world of frontends... I am currently building my first mame cab and have already decided that your FE will be the one that I run on it. Keep up the good work!

-Chad

[ErikRuud]

doesn't seem "advanced" to me, it seems like quality programming form.

The gui looks great though and the fact that it's all customizable is incredible!  Great job.. I'm excited to see this FE come out for real.

Well what I mean by advanced is that I dont think that most people need to make lists like (all games made by midway, only 4 way, of the fighting genre, working, favorited and is not mature), catch my drift, I want to keep it simple, cuz thats what this fe is gonna be, just some genre lists, favorites, and maybe a few other common filters, it might not be advanced to you or me, but I dont want to confuse a typical user either, and if not having tons of listing possibilities is poor programming form then i guess I'm barking up the wrong tree. But thanks for the input, i personnaly
will probably have some nice and simple genre lists like ultracade does, and keep it at that for personnal machine, which is the primary reason im writing this. If you ever get a chance to see one you will immediately appreciate the simplicity and fun it is.

On the other hand I have never used the default lists for any FE that I have tried.  Even way back when I was using GameLauncher I had my own category lists.  It did mean that I had to do a lot of ini editing because GL did not really support categories.

One of my favorite features in Khameleon is the ability to use SQL statements to build my game lists.  I should add this disclaimer: I am a programmer and I write SQL on a daily basis.

[btoddkelley]

[/quote]

Well what I mean by advanced is that I dont think that most people need to make lists like (all games made by midway, only 4 way, of the fighting genre, working, favorited and is not mature), catch my drift, I want to keep it simple, cuz thats what this fe is gonna be, just some genre lists, favorites, and maybe a few other common filters, it might not be advanced to you or me, but I dont want to confuse a typical user either, and if not having tons of listing possibilities is poor programming form then i guess I'm barking up the wrong tree. But thanks for the input, i personnaly
will probably have some nice and simple genre lists like ultracade does, and keep it at that for personnal machine, which is the primary reason im writing this. If you ever get a chance to see one you will immediately appreciate the simplicity and fun it is.
[/quote]

Once again I am not trying to encourage you to add features, just wanting to offer another prospective. One of the things I have done in my cab (in which i use Mamewah) Is to create custom lists for the console emulators that allow the user to view games that are released by region. Almost all systems have the following lists:

Lists 1,  which is titled "Labeled List" Is the complete lists of all games available for the emulator with the no intro codes visible.
List 2, which is titled "United States"  Is a list of all US released games
List 3, which is titled "Japan"  Is a list of all Japan released games
List 4 which is titled "Europe" is a list of all European releases

The final list 4 which is titled "Main List". This is the lists that is used most often and is viewed by default.
List 4 is a prioritized list that is put together as follows:
 All US games,
 Any game that is not in the US set but is in the Europe set,
 any game that is not in the US or Europe set but is in the Japan set,
finally, any games that are from other regions but are not in the US, Europeor Japanease sets.

This list shows only ONE version of each game, with US games having priority, then European game, the japanease games and then anything left over from other regions.

You can see why this is the main list, the user can view a complete set of all games released for the platform prioritized by region.

The reason for the other country specific lists is that I view my arcade cab as an "encyclopedia of video game history". The lists by country allow the user to see what games were released and where. I know that anyone looking at the labeled list could do the same thing, but this creates a nice clean way of doing "game research"!

Some of you are probably wondering how I managed to sort all of the lists by hand. I DIDN'T. John Crouse (CPV2 author) wrote an app that that scans the ROM folder, displays the codes and the allow you to select what is you want the list to contain, and then creates a Mamewah list.
Whether you use any of my ideas or not, I think your FE is going to be great!

Todd

[BadBoyBill]

Some of you are probably wondering how I managed to sort all of the lists by hand. I DIDN'T. John Crouse (CPV2 author) wrote an app that that scans the ROM folder, displays the codes and the allow you to select what is you want the list to contain, and then creates a Mamewah list.
Whether you use any of my ideas or not, I think your FE is going to be great!

Todd

Well I could include this kind of funtionality for sure, I definitely mainly keep my lists US, and obviously some games are US and EU, which Id like to seperate EU games not made in the US and have those greate EU games to.  And also give others options for JP games.  I think I've decided to stick with the No-Intro naming for my theme files for a couple reasons, primarily so I dont have to rename emu movies also.  But as far as trying to use this FE as your game encyclopedia and all that, I'm sure it might not be the right choice for you primarily because I dont use text lists which is not standard for and FE. The text lists give you a better visual of what region your games are and all that espcecially if you keep the names in your text lists with the region in the name.  This FE's lists are all going to be done with artwork in the wheel.  The artwork doesnt usually change from a EU game to US game and I'm not going to provide JP artwork titles unless all other US stuff is done first.  I've had a few offers already to begin artwork for wheel images so I think we will have a strong graphic community to provide this stuff over time.  Its quite a challenge to provide an FE that is both visually entertaining and strong in providing all those features that dedicated enthusiasts and collectors need to. But I'll do my best.

[btoddkelley]

Well I could include this kind of funtionality for sure, I definitely mainly keep my lists US, and obviously some games are US and EU, which Id like to seperate EU games not made in the US and have those greate EU games to.  And also give others options for JP games.  I think I've decided to stick with the No-Intro naming for my theme files for a couple reasons, primarily so I dont have to rename emu movies also.  But as far as trying to use this FE as your game encyclopedia and all that, I'm sure it might not be the right choice for you primarily because I dont use text lists which is not standard for and FE. The text lists give you a better visual of what region your games are and all that espcecially if you keep the names in your text lists with the region in the name.  This FE's lists are all going to be done with artwork in the wheel.  The artwork doesnt usually change from a EU game to US game and I'm not going to provide JP artwork titles unless all other US stuff is done first.  I've had a few offers already to begin artwork for wheel images so I think we will have a strong graphic community to provide this stuff over time.  Its quite a challenge to provide an FE that is both visually entertaining and strong in providing all those features that dedicated enthusiasts and collectors need to. But I'll do my best.
[/quote]

If you add this funtionality I don't believe you would need a different artwork for different lists. (or different wheels in this case) Just something that tells you what "wheel" you are on. Japan,  Europe US, or the main list. (The name "Main List" sucks BTW, I just havent came up with anything better!)
     I don't think a list is needed that shows the no-intro codes, I leave it because it is the first list Mamewah generates and if roms are updated its a starting point. Ideally, having lists by regeon negates the need for displaying the codes.
     Good call on going with the No-intro lists, since I switched I have never looked back. Who really needs the hacks and bad dumps that are in goodsets???

Todd

[BadBoyBill]

If you add this funtionality I don't believe you would need a different artwork for different lists. (or different wheels in this case) Just something that tells you what "wheel" you are on. Japan,  Europe US, or the main list. (The name "Main List" sucks BTW, I just havent came up with anything better!)
     I don't think a list is needed that shows the no-intro codes, I leave it because it is the first list Mamewah generates and if roms are updated its a starting point. Ideally, having lists by regeon negates the need for displaying the codes.
     Good call on going with the No-intro lists, since I switched I have never looked back. Who really needs the hacks and bad dumps that are in goodsets???

Todd

Ok i see what your saying, and actually that goes along perfectly with how I plan on handling genres anyways.  When you hit the genre button, it brings up a cool looking scrollable list of say fighting games, paddle, or whatever.  But it doesnt have to be a genre selector per say, just an overall list selector you have for that system, this is where you can choose, Fighting, Japan, US, All Games, etc....   Im going to get on writing this over the weekend.  Each item on the genre selector is its own XML file.  These XML's will be very easy to make with the tools I'll provide. My MAME one is working great so far.  After selecting the genre the list will flip out and back in with the whole new wheel of games.  This is great, and I cant wait to make it!  Shouldnt take to long.

And as far as Good Sets, I wonder what percent of people use those vs. no intro.  Just to save me time for now I'll only make a no-intro to hyperspin xml converter for the backend. 

[btoddkelley]

I glad you think the idea can work. One more thing I forgot to mention, Of all the funtionality in list creation, The absolute most important for console use, (IMHO) is the ability to create the prioritized list. I dont know how far along you are in your cab build, but popoular consoles will always have multiple region releases of good games. A common question from users is "Which version of XXXXX do I select?". Once the no-intro codes are stripped off the ends of the roms, even the expert user has a hard time knowing which release is a US release. (Or a Japanease release for user on the otherside of the world!)
     Once a prioritized list is created, all unique game titles are displayed AND the most relevant version for the user is the one diplayed. You may have already figured this out and if you have, sorry to waste your time, but this was something that made console use frustrating for (non cab building) users until John created a way to prioritize a list in Mamewah.
     I used to manually sort roms by region in windows explorer, generate a list and then copy all the roms back to a single rom folder. AHHH the good old days! Almost as much fun as DLing roms from Mamedk ONE AT A TIME.  Thank the Lord for torrents!

Todd

[youki]

Its quite a challenge to provide an FE that is both visually entertaining and strong in providing all those features that dedicated enthusiasts and collectors need to. But I'll do my best.

It's summarize very well the situation. 

[btoddkelley]

Its quite a challenge to provide an FE that is both visually entertaining and strong in providing all those features that dedicated enthusiasts and collectors need to. But I'll do my best.

It's summarize very well the situation. 

I'm with you Youki! I dont want BBB to think I am pushing for anything, only pointing out challenges that I have faced in the past when trying to make a cab friendly for non arcade fanatics!
I have been meaning to try your FE BTW.

Todd                   

[BadBoyBill]

I glad you think the idea can work. One more thing I forgot to mention, Of all the funtionality in list creation, The absolute most important for console use, (IMHO) is the ability to create the prioritized list. I dont know how far along you are in your cab build, but popoular consoles will always have multiple region releases of good games. A common question from users is "Which version of XXXXX do I select?". Once the no-intro codes are stripped off the ends of the roms, even the expert user has a hard time knowing which release is a US release. (Or a Japanease release for user on the otherside of the world!)
     Once a prioritized list is created, all unique game titles are displayed AND the most relevant version for the user is the one diplayed. You may have already figured this out and if you have, sorry to waste your time, but this was something that made console use frustrating for (non cab building) users until John created a way to prioritize a list in Mamewah.
     I used to manually sort roms by region in windows explorer, generate a list and then copy all the roms back to a single rom folder. AHHH the good old days! Almost as much fun as DLing roms from Mamedk ONE AT A TIME.  Thank the Lord for torrents!

Todd

I dont think your pushing, I know this is a legitimate want for alot of users including myself.  Alot of great games only came out in Europe only or both here in the US.  The way it will work with my FE is that the lists will be premade, by me or you for instance and not sorted on the fly in the FE.  So youll have an XML for "All Games", an XML for "US Games" and an "XML" for EU Games" , or US/EU Combo set with only unique titles.  etc.. etc..., The great thing about those lists is that they only need to be created once by you or I to share.  So on my site , I'll have a repository of Genre Lists for people to get, or they can make theyre own if they want with the tools.  The no-intro codes probably will never get stripped anyways since theres no text lists.  As far as telling whats more relevant to play from a both US release and EU release, im not sure about, but it will proably be one or the other for all games I guess. 

It's summarize very well the situation. 

I know you've been through all this before.  I look forward to learning all that you've picked up in your time doing this.


Also... as soon as I make the genre selector this week, I'll post a way better video, showing all the new background transitions, the new artwork animations, a few more skins for MAME, game launching, animated backgrounds, the genre selection, wheel hyperspin, attract mode example, sound effects plus any other stuff I've worked on over the last 3 weeks.  I've actually done alot since my first post here. 

Oh and one thing that ultracade does thats really nice is that if there is no single theme for a specific game it can default to say a Capcom theme or a Taito theme for example. This is a really nice feature to give lots of games of a certain kind a common theme when you dont have a spefic skin for that game.  I havent added this in yet but will for add it for sure this week.

[Dazz]

I don't think I have ever looked forward to a front end release....   I think I've watched the video at least a dozen times and read this thread daily.

BBB - If you need a serious beta tester please let me know.  I do professional beta testing for a living, but would be more than happy to help you test this.

[Yarb]

I don't think I have ever looked forward to a front end release....   I think I've watched the video at least a dozen times and read this thread daily.

Hey I know what you mean, I've been stopping frames to examine the details in the video. My Machine kinda fizzled a couple years ago because I could never find a front end that did what I wanted, I absolutely HATE the text lists that most use and subbing in Marquees still does not feel right. BBB single handedly rekindled my fire to finish this project and since he released the Video I have finished a new CP I had in the works (With no less than 13 RGB lit buttons, updated all the roms, recompiled mame (0.124 of course, only to have it RECALLED  )

A buddy and I (Mostly my friend) made a lot of custom Marquees to use in Ultrastyle, this allowed the wheel in that FE to work with games that have odd shaped marquees or ones that did not have large enough text to tell what the game was on a miniature marquee. I am very curious to see how BBB is handling individual games in the wheels and launching them. My style was to have a favorites list wherein everything is perfect, all with videos, full history, CP, Cab art etc... (I see it like a museum in a way). Then have a "All Games" list that has any playable game. That way the cab runs as pretty on the FE as it looks in RL but the hundreds of playable games that have yet to be prettied up are still accessable.

BBB Thanks for rekindling my MAME fire 

[deadsoulz]

I need this front end like yesterday    I am going insane waiting to try it out.

[nipsmg]

Keep up the good work.  You've got a lot of people salivating here..   

I can't wait to get my hands on this for testing.

[BadBoyBill]

For those looking to test and provide feedback, I think I'll be starting a private beta next week, maybe 10 to 20  people, just for starters, as long as they have time to test and give the feedback.  Im working on the second video right now which will be released soon.  Thanks.

[nipsmg]

Well, count me in for applying for testing. 

I've just got my cabinet rebuilt and am actually a software developer by trade and have some software QA experience as well, so i'd be happy to help with the testing process.  Let me know if you need me

Thanks in advance!

[IG-88]

I'd be a willing tester if you need one. I don't know the minimum specs for your FE but I have lots of older computers that I could try it on. I also have one of every release of Windows O/S plus a couple of "lite" versions as well. PM me if you want me to try it.

[Yarb]

I would be more than happy to help test in any way I can.

Mike

[_Iz-]

I've been watching this thread with interest and would love to be a tester as well... 

[btoddkelley]

I would be glad to be a tester.

Todd

[joebells]

yep I would be glad to test also, running vista x64 sp1 so probably different than most on here

[deadsoulz]

I would like to test as well.

[RetroBorg]

I'm keen. 

[waveryder]

Does look good but smells like vaporware to me 

[Yarb]

Does look good but smells like vaporware to me 

WOW, 6 weeks since he announced it and it is already vaporware? Somebody needs to play some Duke Nukem 2 

Mike

[paulstevens]

Does look good but smells like vaporware to me 

It's not vaporware.   It is a ton of work.   The work (and the wait) will be worth it.

[waveryder]

I love it! Have you ever noticed that when a new piece of software is announced there are a ton of posts all about how "I cant wait" and "oh I can beta test for you". It only takes some little devil to make a comment about it being vaporware and then they all the comments change to "It will be worth the wait" and "Programmers work really hard give em a break".

Does look good but smells like vaporware to me 

This comment was ment light heartedly.....hence the smiley.  BBB will im sure release his stuff when ready. I think the real concern that all these. "I cant wait posters" have is that they are concerned the reason for delay and limited beta test is that this frontend aint gonna be free 

[Ginsu Victim]

The frontend sounds great, but I'm not waiting. I'm using MameWAH currently and love it. I don't feel the need to change unless this new frontend really bowls me over.

Once everything is setup perfect on my cabinet, I'm probably not going to change it.

[billpa]

Does look good but smells like vaporware to me 

I actually tested it out last night as I am helping out with some of the artwork. It is definitely NOT vaporware. BBB is putting in a ton of work into this and you can definitely see it. Lots of eye candy (my favorite part), but also really intuitive and surprisingly simple to customize.

The most time consuming part will be artwork for every game. However, I believe once there are more users and designers trying it out, there will be equally as much artwork being created.

[Ginsu Victim]

It is definitely NOT vaporware.

What part of the joke did you not get?

[Yarb]

This comment was ment light heartedly.....hence the smiley.

Hey I DID get that you were posting lightheartedly, please note the :Grin: smiley on my post indicating a lighthearted response.

BBB will im sure release his stuff when ready. I think the real concern that all these. "I cant wait posters" have is that they are concerned the reason for delay and limited beta test is that this frontend aint gonna be free 

I personally have been trying to provide constructive and encouraging posts because I have seen some NICE front ends die because the programmers get a TON of criticism because their front end does not include a feature or style that someone wants. Each Frontend is the vision of the maker and should remain so. Suggestion posts are great, the programmer can see what people would like and it gives them a bank of possibilities of what they want for their vision. My interest in this project is due to the fact that BBB's vision closely matches what I have been looking for.

As for it not being free I personally think all nice front ends should charge at least a token fee, why is it that I should pay for my Ipaq, hardware, PC, OS, Artwork and MORE but the hard work these guys put into the front ends get little but a few donations? I think you make excellent art and deserved to be paid for it but how do we convince people that a front end is also worth paying for?

Yarb

[billpa]

It is definitely NOT vaporware.

What part of the joke did you not get?

Calm down there buddy. Had this reply open for about 20 minutes because the boss came in to see some work I was doing Didnt see waveryder's response.

I was assuming he was joking but figured I would squash any notion of this merely being a half baked piece of software. I was pleasantly surprised last night when I tested it out briefly and can't wait for the kids to go to sleep tonight so I can play around some more

[Ginsu Victim]

Calm down? I just asked a simple question...

As for not seeing the response, I meant that even without seeing it, how could you not tell it was a joke? Seemed pretty obvious...

[billpa]

Calm down? I just asked a simple question...

Here's my simple answer...no, I didn't realize he was joking.

There 

[BadBoyBill]

Please dont argue, hey at first when he said that.. I guess I can understand what hes saying in a way, when I first posted that it might be a couple weeks, and now its as someone pointed out 6 weeks, I really was way ahead of myself, now that im ready for private beta soon, I can say that I'm confident we have a functional frontend.  It might not have all the superior features yet, but those come with time.  For now though, its even blowing me away, and theres alot of great features already.  Hey I'm all about free stuff, I would never charge for stuff.  Alot of the little mini programs I use  to help with day to day problems are free, so I in exchange give back to you guys.  I will contribute, and I want others to contribute back for free.  Plus theres alot of great artwork people work on for free, that I find useful for this project.  Sorry for the delays, I didnt think that it was this much work.  But I guarantee you I been very very active on this, and have come along way in those 6 weeks. 

[waveryder]

No offense intended to BBB or anyone else on here. Been gone a while and figured I would make a joke rather than another "your so great hurry up and release" post. 

Dont worry though my wife doesn't think im funny either

[joebells]

Please dont argue, hey at first when he said that.. I guess I can understand what hes saying in a way, when I first posted that it might be a couple weeks, and now its as someone pointed out 6 weeks, I really was way ahead of myself, now that im ready for private beta soon, I can say that I'm confident we have a functional frontend.  It might not have all the superior features yet, but those come with time.  For now though, its even blowing me away, and theres alot of great features already.  Hey I'm all about free stuff, I would never charge for stuff.  Alot of the little mini programs I use  to help with day to day problems are free, so I in exchange give back to you guys.  I will contribute, and I want others to contribute back for free.  Plus theres alot of great artwork people work on for free, that I find useful for this project.  Sorry for the delays, I didnt think that it was this much work.  But I guarantee you I been very very active on this, and have come along way in those 6 weeks. 

No need to be sorry your providing us with something

[waveryder]

lol
Thanks for beautifully exemplifying my point        

[sp33dy]

I'd love to be a beta tester. Got an XP system with Quad Core, 2GB Mem, NVidia GForce 8800 GTS (half Sli mode.. Nope, not got the second card yet).

If you would like me to help, then say.

[Lilwolf]

I can definately understand how a frontend which you think will take a week or two to clean up takes a lot longer.  JFront / Animame would be a step from release and 6 months later still be working on it.  Mainly because I had an hour to program every day, but 8 hours at work to think of cool new things to add. 

btw it looks great!  Will you allow for more then one version of mame with different graphics?  (ie, maybe a racing graphic for all racing games... select it and only show racing games?)  how configurable is it going to be?

Good luck!

[mybrainhurtz]

I forget to check this thread for a week, and of course that is when BBB asks for testers haha... well count me in when the time comes. I have a few generations of computers that I can test on and would love to do my part in bug squashing, so the community can get this great frontend asap.

As far as the question of cost, I have no problem giving back if the product does what I need it to do... especially an innovative project like this one!

Keep up the good work!

[BadBoyBill]

Oops, I should of said please PM me if your interested in testing.  I think I'm close to the point for the limit of people for now.  Thanks.

[Dazz]

I tried PM'ing you but the PM will not go through.  I do want to test.... I was one of the first ones to even ask about it in this thread.  I am a beta tester by profession and love testing new pieces of software.  I have tested over 50 MMO games and many many more console and PC games.  I have also experience in hardware testing from HP, IOmega and several other hardware companies.  Would love to help out with this FE.

[BadBoyBill]

All the Pm's were recieved, even yours Dazz. Thanks to those who signed up. I think theres plenty of people now to help out.  If you already had a post before this one asking to test, then just PM me.  Thanks.

[dntaskwho]

BADBOYBILL asked my to state that there are no more sign ups for beta testing. Please don't flame me for this he asked me to do this personally

[psychotech]

Oh, really?

Well., anyway..

CCL

[BadBoyBill]

Actually , not to post that here dntaskwho, I meant on my website so that no one signs up after you. 

[dntaskwho]

im sorry got confused by the original post i was just so excited about it i must of read incorrectly

[Encryptor]

Any new news?



Encryptor

[Yarb]

I was wondering the same thing myself, any word or new Video?

Yarb

[brian_hoffman]

Everything is coming along quite well actually. I believe it may be released sooner than most people may think. I know its been a long wait for the FE and the Videos.. It seems one thing comes up after another. All I can say is Billy is working hard to get everything stable before the main release.. With setting up the various emus and command line issues (That have been mostly worked out)

Just though Id pop in and let you guys know things are moving along.

Happy Gaming

[Dazz]

Hey Guys,

After testing this front end for the past couple days... All I can say is WOW.  The wait will definitely be worth it.  The team is putting a lot of work into the front end and the speed and capabilities of this front end are amazing.  No more static images and screenshots. 

My graphic skills suck, but I've been able to pump out a couple themes.

[Games001]

Any word as to when this FE might be made ready enough for the average joe here in BYOAC to test out?

It looks excellent thus far.  Keep on the job folks.

[RetroBorg]

Screens look great Dazz, I can't wait to try out hyperspin.

[t0ucan]

Bump, hows this going? Im building my first cabinet as we speak and after watching the preview to this software the interface blows the others out of the water.

[joebells]

It's coming along nicely(I'm a beta tester) small bug fixes here and there, themes being cranked out. No idea personally when it'll be released to a bigger audience. But I say hold out as it is real and it does work like the movie shows.

[Dazz]

Honestly I think it works better then the video shows...  That video is of an early version.  I think BadBoyBill is going to release a new video shortly after we crank out a couple more skins. 

[nipsmg]

I have to agree, it really is a beautiful frontend.

The major issue now is the lack of completed skins/themes.  Besides that, I've been using it pretty heavily and trying to break it, and have been having increasingly more trouble finding bugs.  They've been being fixed at an incredible rate, BBB is doing an EXCELLENT job.

-- Be patient.  It'll be worth the wait once it's completed.

[massive88]

I have to agree, it really is a beautiful frontend.

The major issue now is the lack of completed skins/themes.  Besides that, I've been using it pretty heavily and trying to break it, and have been having increasingly more trouble finding bugs.  They've been being fixed at an incredible rate, BBB is doing an EXCELLENT job.

-- Be patient.  It'll be worth the wait once it's completed.

Yeah I agree.  And it works on 64bit XP!  Yay!

[The Evil Collector]

Just curious but what kinda monster machine is this thing gonna take to run? Any ideas from you beta testers of what the minimum hardware specs are going to be?

[billpa]

Im running it on a P4 2.4 ghz with 1g of RAM...and it runs just fine.

[Dariusz]

Curious,

Does this new FE when released, does it allow:

Easy configuration for emu's like mame, zinc, daphne, model2.
Allow for one faverot games list which can consists of games from all types of emus, and is easy to do (configure).

Dariusz

[Dazz]

Curious,

Does this new FE when released, does it allow:

Easy configuration for emu's like mame, zinc, daphne, model2.
Allow for one faverot games list which can consists of games from all types of emus, and is easy to do (configure).

Dariusz

The backend/config utility is still being developed, but it should have an easy to configure system.  More than likely the first release will not have the config backend and will be .xml driven like it currently is in beta.  However, all of the configs for the emulators and command lines should be ready to go.

I believe that the favorites list with multi system is still being talked about at this time.  Not much info on it has been released yet.

[Spiderstyle]

The backend/config utility is still being developed, but it should have an easy to configure system.  More than likely the first release will not have the config backend and will be .xml driven like it currently is in beta.  However, all of the configs for the emulators and command lines should be ready to go.

I believe that the favorites list with multi system is still being talked about at this time.  Not much info on it has been released yet.

Hey Dazz.. Not sure when Bill is going to release HyperSpin publicly, but I'm really hoping to get the backend ready before that time (or at least a beta of the backend)..

To answer Dariusz question: Yes, there will be easy configuration.. :-) Actually, I'm building the backend with this goal in mind: "Each and every aspect of the HyperSpin frontend MUST be able to be configured through the backend."..

This means all settings and all gamelists (even generation, filtering and editing) can be done through the backend..

The only thing it will not do is actual theme creation as that's a completely different ballgame.. (p.s., talking about theme creation, you guys are doing an AMAZING job on those theme's.. There are some real gems there.. Great work!)..

wkr,
Spidey

[joebells]

Yeah there are some cool themes being created

[Organic Jerk]

Im running it on a P4 2.4 ghz with 1g of RAM...and it runs just fine.

Minimum.... That's kinda steep for alot of people on this board.

[Dariusz]

Thanks guys for the information.

I'm look forward to trying the FE out once its released.

One other aspect I'm looking for in a FE is the ability to update the emu which is already configured in the FE easily (ie. Mame 123 to mame 124). Especially if an faverot game list is configured from multiple emulators.

If themes cannot be created at this stage, can I request from the development team an 'game launcher' style theme, but with an animated background?

Thanks

Dariusz

[Goz]

Im running it on a P4 2.4 ghz with 1g of RAM...and it runs just fine.

Minimum.... That's kinda steep for alot of people on this board.

So far the lowest spec processor I've tested it with is a P4 1.5Ghz and I saw no signs of performance issues in theory it should be usable on PIII systems

[billpa]

Im running it on a P4 2.4 ghz with 1g of RAM...and it runs just fine.

Minimum.... That's kinda steep for alot of people on this board.

I did not say that was the minimum. Just what was working for me.

[joebells]

Thanks guys for the information.

I'm look forward to trying the FE out once its released.

One other aspect I'm looking for in a FE is the ability to update the emu which is already configured in the FE easily (ie. Mame 123 to mame 124). Especially if an faverot game list is configured from multiple emulators.

If themes cannot be created at this stage, can I request from the development team an 'game launcher' style theme, but with an animated background?

Thanks

Dariusz

There's not really an overall theme like you are thinking. On the first screen you come to are all the systems, They all already have unique themes for each one, then you select a system and it loads all the games you have for that system and as you scroll the wheel themes for each game animate in. Like for super mario bros for the nes a goomba and mario animate in, the background animates in, and the video animates in. Ideally each game has its own unique theme. That of course isn't going to happen,or at least not for a good while, so for each system, possibly genre and such also, you can define some default artwork and animations. Like you can set the mame logo as default artwork 1 for mame and a location and animation style and then any game that doesnt have a custom theme will show that mame logo.

Also a gamelauncher theme wouldn't work because its wheel based only, BadBoyBill has said he won't have any option for lists or anything like that, Just the wheel.

[Dazz]

If themes cannot be created at this stage, can I request from the development team an 'game launcher' style theme, but with an animated background?

Actually themes can be created at this stage...  However, themes in this front end are unlike themes that I have seen in other front ends.  You can have a default theme like other front ends; which all basically consists of a background, title image and a video.  But where this front end really shines is that each individual game can have its own theme.  

Theming is actually quite easy at this point.  Right now themes consist of a couple artwork items, a background, and an xml file that has the position and animation attributes given to the images.

Honestly I had high hopes of this front end from seeing the first video... Now that I've actually played with and have created themes for this front end I have even higher hopes for the end product.  Even at this point in development, I would say that this front end is more polished then others that have been out for many years.  BadBoyBill has done an incredible job thus far and I am really looking forward to the future.

[AllisterFiend]

Im running it on a P4 2.4 ghz with 1g of RAM...and it runs just fine.

Minimum.... That's kinda steep for alot of people on this board.

I for one, welcome the newer more powerful frontends.

If you want a frontend that runs on an older machine, you have numerous choices out there.

If you want a "next gen" frontend, then you might want to consider an upgrade.

[joebells]

yeah I was going to edit my post to mention creating your own theme

If you are going to create your own theme create it for 1024x768. Thats what your background image should be and thats what you should lay your other items out around. It scales to whatever resolution you run.

[Dazz]

Im running it on a P4 2.4 ghz with 1g of RAM...and it runs just fine.

Minimum.... That's kinda steep for alot of people on this board.

I for one, welcome the newer more powerful frontends.

If you want a frontend that runs on an older machine, you have numerous choices out there.

If you want a "next gen" frontend, then you might want to consider an upgrade.

I agree 100% and I think that is what BadBoyBill stated somewhere in this thread as well.
 
My computer in my cabinet is an AMD X2 4200+ with 2gb of RAM and a 7800GT.   One can easily pickup a 2+ ghz machine fairly cheap now days.

[XtraSmiley]

yeah I was going to edit my post to mention creating your own theme

If you are going to create your own theme create it for 1024x768. Thats what your background image should be and thats what you should lay your other items out around. It scales to whatever resolution you run.

And this will still display fine on people using AVGAs and Multisync monitors?  I would think it would have no problems in 800x600, but you never know...

[Onji]

I have no idea how i missed this. I have been waiting for a frontend like this for years. Man it is amazing! THANK YOU for taking the time to do this.

[t0ucan]

Bump, cant wait till release. I can see this becoming one of the most used Frontends 

[Dariusz]

V.6 was released the other day the hyper forum says. I cannot locate the download, so I gather it a private release , atleast it look like its progressing well.

http://hyperspin-fe.com/index.php?option=com_fireboard&Itemid=26&func=view&id=1161&catid=3

[iano]

I wish someone would lock this thread - i'm sick hearing about it . A public release announcement (when it's finished) would be nice.

 

[Organic Jerk]

I for one, welcome the newer more powerful frontends.

If you want a frontend that runs on an older machine, you have numerous choices out there.

If you want a "next gen" frontend, then you might want to consider an upgrade.

True enough... Progress is progress...


I just hope that it's at least optimized for what it is and so it doesn't eat needlessly...  But so far from what I've heard it seems to the be quite the gem..

[scrapple]

Ok, I just saw this for the first time, and Im in love with it..
I just got my 4 player cp completed, and Im ready to throw a front end on my system! I have my $20 in paypal ready to register-donate and/or become a beta tester (whatever it takes baby)...

[albrigsr]

This FE has made me have a renewed interest in FEs, however, I am now getting disappointed with the lack of postings re: progress.  Does anyone have an update?  Is testing ongoing?  Expected release date?  Thanks!

[Havok]

Somebody call the whaaammbulance. This is a part time endeavor. Be patient - the guy has other things to do in his life. Don't like the lack of updates, how about submitting some code to help him out?

[RetroBorg]

This FE has made me have a renewed interest in FEs, however, I am now getting disappointed with the lack of postings re: progress.  Does anyone have an update?  Is testing ongoing?  Expected release date?  Thanks!

You can always join the HyperSpin forum and get the latest updates.

http://hyperspin-fe.com/index.php?option=com_fireboard&Itemid=26

[JinxedSoul]

Make sure you check out hyper-spin forum the themes look amazing.

[Dazz]

Development is ongoing and so is testing, the basic front end is very stable and works great.  There are a few minor annoyances that I hope change, but even with those annoyances the FE is great.

One of the things holding back the release is how themes are going to be tracked/updated.  That is under discussion now, but I think Bill knows the direction he is going to go with it now.  The theme creating application is coming along very nicely and is one of the major milestones.  This will allow people to easily create the much needed themes that are the lifeblood of this front end.  I believe that we will be testing the theme program soon.  Once we have tested it and crushed game stopping bugs, I think Bill will be doing a open beta release shortly after.  Just be patient, of course come over and join in our community on the HyperSpin forums.

[Dariusz]

Dass, Being a beta tester, does Hyperspin now support a favorite games list (from selecting from a master list)?

[scrapple]

I am beta testing Hyperspin, and you guys are going to love this front end. Very stable, and the theme creation is pretty easy, but the new skin tool will make pumping out themes for all emulated games pretty fast. All of the themes ive tested are pretty sick....
I just got Silverjuke jukebox support running in it as well, so jukebox software is also a go.

[brian_hoffman]

No there is no favorites list ability yet. But alot has been done. All the emus on the main page have working configs.. All you should have to do is point to the emu paths in the INI. What we are waiting on now is the theme editor to be complete. The theme tracking system to be in place and some small odds and ends... I know you guys are ready to check it out.  It should be availabe in the next few weeks.. (That is unless something else pops up)  I know Billy wants to include alot artwork (or at least have it availabe) for the more popular systems. It is because of this that things are taking a while.. Lets face it.. The artwork really makes this FE.

About the system specs... Its uses flash heavily so 900mhz and up  ... However most people cant emulate mame games at 900mhz decently anymore.  It is pretty fast navigation and coming in and out of emulators.

So lets be patient... I really want to see this released also... I can imagine once it is out people will want to make themes.. Thats why we're discussing the best way to organize/manage them..

Take care guys
Brian Hoffman

[Dazz]

Hey Guys,

Just wanted to give you all a heads up...  There are just a couple items that are hanging up a public/open beta of HyperSpin.  At this point in development Bill has been focusing on the development of HyperTheme, our Theme Creation application.  This application is a graphical interface that will allow you to easily create and package themes for use in HyperSpin.  Since HyperSpin is based heavily on themes and graphics, this is a much needed part of the front end and will hopefully spark interest in people looking to create themes.   

If you haven't checked out the site in a while please do so.  We have just launched a new forum system that will host our community and also our HyperSpin downloads.   We have added several fun community features that we hope will encourage a fun/interesting community.  In order for HyperSpin to really work we need to encourage theme and graphic designers to pitch in and help create game themes.  Come by and check out the new themes that are being posted in our Graphics & Themes forum.

[NOP]

Hi,

can you PM/email me some details as to how your game lists are stored and what format they're in?  I'm the developer of ROMLister and I'd like to add support for your FE as a list output type in my application.

I'm currently getting my hands dirty in the next release of it, and thought this might be a good time to investigate what file formatting you're using.

http://www.waste.org/~winkles/ROMLister

[BadBoyBill]

PM Sent, thanks.

[CathalDublin]

Has anyone tested with an AVGA card?

[ulao]

Does or will is fully support goodmerge sets and 7z handling?

[billpa]

Has anyone tested with an AVGA card?

Yes and it works fine.

[brian_hoffman]

No it doesnt support goodmerged and 7zipped roms... Only what the emu would natively support.
The FE is geared to conform to no intro standards. Just as emumovies adopts. Do you really need 100 entrys for the same game anyways? Remember it is a theme driven FE and not a list.. Although adding the ability to use text may be an option in future releases.

You can however run programs before and after which comes in handy to load custom profiles , mount cds, etc.....

[mighty1]

Awesome can't wait.  Now I have to get my cab built.  The more bling the better.

[FrizzleFried]

Met some of the HyperSpin folks at CAX....seem like a cool group of guys and I can't wait for the release of the FE...

[Circo]

I also got to spend time with Brian and Bill at CAEX and was given a fairly complete hands-on preview of Hyperspin.  Let me first say that both Bill and Brian were really great guys and are just full of passion for the project and it shows.  Also I am a fan of all FE's (That support video at least  ) and each one somwhat serves a slightly different niche and feature set.  Now I havent followed this thread too closely as I stay pretty much slammed with my day job and website so I apologize if any of this is old news but I felt that I should put my own two cents in.  Ok let's get down to business......

I have seen the you tube videos and even reported on it early on, but I really wasn't prepared for what I saw.  I must say that when I first saw it fired up on that little laptop I was just floored, it was beautiful.  First it booted up very fast, just about 10 seconds from executing the program.  Suprising for a front end that is this graphics rich.  The first thing to hit the screen was the system selection, which started with an amazing MAME animated theme.  This was not enough however, as we then cycled through many of the major consoles and other emulated game systems, each one had an equally impressive animated theme.  Everything was just so incredibly smooth, I really couldn't believe it.  Then we browsed through a couple of game lists, first we looked at the MAME game lists.  I was really impressed by the individual game themes and I had the impression that this was the first time I felt that an FE gave me the feeling that it was a commercial product.  What I mean is that when navigating the very simple interface with its very glamorous presentation, it was what I would expect from a machine that I would find at Dave & Busters or another modern arcade.  Mind you as I am watching this, it occurs to me that while it looked so great, the vast amount of time and expertise it must take to create these these might be a bit more than any team could pull off.  But my fears were soon put to rest when I was shown the back end programs that come with hyperspin.  Let's just say that it was all very professional and simple to use, now I can't imagine that most will have any difficulty creating themes or animations in a very short amount of time.

My next thought was that while great for individual game themes, it was probably going to be a long time if ever before an individual theme was created for every game.  Then we fired up a system that didnt have any individual themes for the games but it did use video and artwork in such a way to still be just as impressive.  Realize they are also supplying all of the artwork, which takes much of the guesswork out of thing and should make for a fairly quick and painless install and for the casual user would be satisfied.  But it is open enough, and has the right tools available for even the most anal of us .

All in all while not as feature rich (at least to begin with) as GameEx or Mala for example, it is just one of the slickest presentations for an arcade cab that I have ever seen.  And finally it seems that there is now a solution to getting that commercial product feel out of your arcade cabinet.  If I had any cons it would be that there is no LCD or LED support built in, as I use a Beta Brite, LED Wiz, and 4x40 LCD Display on my cab, but I am fairly sure that I will be able to use a third party app to get my desired results. 

It is obvious that Bill, Brian and the rest of the team are putting a lot of work into this new FE and I encourage folks who were looking for something like this to help and support this project.   There is no reason that this product should be free, yet it is and that is really generous of these guys.   

- Tip of the hat to the Hyperspin team, it's going to be a zoo in the next couple of weeks when this beast comes out of private beta!

- Wave of the Finger to any haters out there on this project, it's looks like it's going to be an amazing package of software!

[Dazz]

I am really glad that the guys were able to take a laptop or something to give a little presentation with.  It really looks MUCH better than the youtube videos and really is something to see in person.

[mighty1]

I can't wait.  I have used most other FE's and really like the look of this one.

[Dazz]

Public beta announced:  August 6th

BadBoyBill has been plugging away and trying to get a public release ready.  Beta testers should have access to the final closed beta release on Monday.  Shortly after testing a public beta should be expected around August 6th if all goes according to plan. 

New Future Pinball theme preview.



The theming community is really starting to pickup.  Even people that are not part of the beta have started showing themes that they are creating for HyperSpin.  If you are not yet a member of the HyperSpin forums at http://www.hyperspin-fe.com now is the perfect time to join!

[Loafmeister]

This past weekend, I had made up my mind to get off my butt and was about to start using one of the existing front ends for my cab, no more mame32.  Don't want to do the job twice so thanks a lot guys, now I have to wait again!  Mame32 forever! )well, until the 6th anyway! ) 

Seriously nicely done thus far, can't wait to test this out.

[billpa]

Its only 10 days  There will be a lot of artwork already in place and hopefully we can get some more theme creators...especially for MAME!

[iano]

I'm delighted to hear this will be out August 6th. It seems like i've been waiting an eternity for a public release. Thanks to everyone involved for their hard work.

 

[Banacek]

I haven't been around these parts in a while. I just stopped by to buy some parts, and I figured I'd check out the software forum. Imagine my surprise to find a FE that will make me finally give up Mamewah. This is amazing! Thanks for all the hard work, and I can't wait to check it out!