payphone for gameroom...

[richms]

Just came across this intructable that looks like it would fit into a gameroom quite well... http://www.instructables.com/id/Payphone-in-the-Home/?ALLSTEPS

[shardian]

They are regularly on ebay already modified for home use. I believe it was Bell South that sold a bunch of modified ones for charity a few years back.

[Ken Layton]

Yes you can get genuine Bell Telephone "retired from service" payphones on ebay. Many of the Bell Operating Companies are pulling out of or downsizing their payphone routes. A telephone reseller bought pallets full of them and has been selling them on ebay modified for home use (no coins needed). In general, these are genuine Western Electric/A.T.&T. cases (coin return bucket on the left) or GTE/Palco/Quadrum/hybrid cases (coin return bucket on the right).

Western Electric cases will generally come with a Western Electric 32a, 32B, or 32C series circuit board which was originally designed for telephone operator control of the coin collect/return relay coil.

GTE cases will generally come with a "smart" circuit board designed by the major private payphone manufacturers such as Elcotel, Intellicall, Protel, or Ernest Telecom. Early models (over ten years old) were operated by a small 'wall wart' style power transformer to power the circuit board and make the phone work. Later models (less than ten years old) are operated by the phone line in conjunction with a rechargeable battery similar to the battery in an emergency light or exit sign. If the battery is weak/dead the phone will not work. All "smart" board phones must be programmed in order to work. If you have purchased the respective board manufacturer's phone operating system program, you can program the phone yourself with your own computer, otherwise you must pay another company to program the phone like G-Tel (www.payphone.com). Be advised some older circuit boards from some manufacturers cannot be upgraded to dial area code numbers with anything other than a 1 or 0 as the middle digit.

[MaximRecoil]

Yes you can get genuine Bell Telephone "retired from service" payphones on ebay. Many of the Bell Operating Companies are pulling out of or downsizing their payphone routes. A telephone reseller bought pallets full of them and has been selling them on ebay modified for home use (no coins needed). In general, these are genuine Western Electric/A.T.&T. cases (coin return bucket on the left) or GTE/Palco/Quadrum/hybrid cases (coin return bucket on the right).

Western Electric cases will generally come with a Western Electric 32a, 32B, or 32C series circuit board which was originally designed for telephone operator control of the coin collect/return relay coil.

GTE cases will generally come with a "smart" circuit board designed by the major private payphone manufacturers such as Elcotel, Intellicall, Protel, or Ernest Telecom. Early models (over ten years old) were operated by a small 'wall wart' styler power transformer to power the circuit board and make the phone work. Later models (less than ten years old) are operated by the phone line in conjunction with a rechargeable battery similar to the battery in an emergency light or exit sign. If the battery is weak/dead the phone will not work. All "smart" board phones must be programmed in order to work. If you have purchased the respective board manufacturer's phone operating system program, you can program the phone yourself with your own computer, otherwise you must pay another company to program the phone like G-Tel (www.payphone.com). Be advised some older circuit boards from some manufacturers cannot be upgraded to dial long distance numbers with anything other than a 1 or 0 as the middle digit.

Damn. How do you remember all that specific, detailed information about arcade machines, monitors, jukeboxes, changers, and now...payphones?

I just thought I'd mention that I've been researching payphones lately because I bought one for cheap recently (Intellicall 3003) and everything Ken has typed here aligns with what I've learned (would have saved me a lot of time if I'd just asked Ken to give me the rundown on payphones in general, lol).

Mine is an older model that is powered by a plug-in class II wall transformer (24 VAC 1.67 amps) and of course, it has a "smart" board, manufactured by Intellicall. If anyone gets one of these Intellicalls that have been selling for cheap lately, Intellicall seems to be a very helpful company. Not only will they patiently answer questions on their toll free number, but they will program your board for $25, or if your board is not working, they will repair and program it for $40. For $60 they will repair and program your phone, and give you the correct wall transformer and add an RJ-11 plug to the phone line (which is usually just two wires for hardwiring).

I don't know if my phone actually works or not yet. I'm still waiting for the wall transformer that I ordered from Mouser before I can test it. It is in decent shape cosmetically though (except for the handset, which looks like it was chewed on by a dog—though it is completely intact) and all the parts are there.

[Ken Layton]

Elcotel, Intellicall, Protel, and Ernest Telecom are the "big 4" manufacturers of private payphones and the circuit boards that operate them. These 4 companies have been around since privately owned payphones became legal in 1985.

The reason I know so much about payphones is that the video game/vending operator I worked for over the years was the first to jump on the private payphone bandwagon here in 1986. We had a route of 15 payphones locally. Some did very well indeed money-wise while others were so-so. Plus the fact my dad worked for the phone company and introduced me to all the guys in the phone company payphone division.

[Ken Layton]

More information for those with payphones from these manufacturers:

Ernest Telecom:

Joseph J. Ernest
www.ernestgroup.com
Phone: 1-800-456-8353 or (770) 242-9069
Located in Georgia
At one time Ernest Telecom payphones were sold and distributed by the Amway Company.
I understand they do not support payphones any more, but you'd have to contact them to see if they can help.


Intellicall:

www.intellicall.com
Phone: 1-800-800-9091 or (469) 522-1553
Located in Texas
--- Now out of business 2012 ---

Protel:

www.protelinc.com
Phone: 1-800-925-8882 or (863) 644-5558
Located in Florida
Manuals for Protel phones: http://www.protelinc.com/ProtelWeb/Manuals_usa.asp

Elcotel:

Elcotel was purchased a few years ago by QuorTech Solutions and is still very much in the payphone business.
www.quortech.com
Phone: 1-800-820-4680


For general information, parts, manuals, help, etc on many payphones please check out these links:

www.payphonehelp.com/quan.html

www.payphone.com

www.porticus.org/bell/telephones-payphones-modern.html

www.payphone.com/shop/instructions/Series5Manual.pdf (Elcotel Series 5 and Olympian 5501 installation/instruction manual, free download)

www.payphone.com/shop/instructions/PPayphone.pdf (commercial payphone converted to home use installation/instruction manual)

www.payphone.com/shop/instructions/Gtel1000Manual.pdf (GTel1000/Protel "200BB+" installation/instruction manual, free download)

www.payphone.com/shop/instructions/310Manual.pdf (Protel 310 installation/instruction manual, free download)

www.payphoneproducts.com (Midwest Payphone Supply)

www.paytelephone.com (North Atlantic, Inc.)

www.electronrepair.com/PayTech.html

www.theratecenter.com (programs/downloads current area codes/phone operating parameters to any payphone)

www.payphone2000.com

http://stores.ebay.com/Atomic-Threads    (sells manuals for payphones)

[Level42]

This would be our equivalent of those phones:



Would be nice, but these were only in cells on the streets as far as I remember.

In fact, I can't remember seeing a public phone since YEARS !

[MaximRecoil]

This would be our equivalent of those phones:

Would be nice, but these were only in cells on the streets as far as I remember.

In fact, I can't remember seeing a public phone since YEARS !

Those look cool, but not nearly as cool as the typical Western Electric style of payphone which was common from the '70s on (the private payphones like Intellicall, Protel, etc. look very similar with only minor differences in external appearance—though quite different internally). Here is a picture of a rotary and a touchtone version:



They weigh about 50 pounds and are built like a tank. The front chrome faceplates are solid and about 1/4" thick. The black housings are made from about 14 gauge steel and the vault plates are about 8 gauge steel.

The real Western Electrics are particularly cool because they use a brass bell ringer inside (the same ringer as is found on the legendary Western Electric model 500 desk and 554 wall phones). Those are the type of phones the phone company used to rent out to customers before the breakup of Ma Bell and the availablity of cheap Wal-Mart phones. I have a 554 in my kitchen:



And a 500 in my room:



These things have excellent sound quality and were built to last forever. You can see the brass bell ringer here:

[shardian]

ha, I had one of those 500's as the house phone when I was a wee lad...in the late 80's. I bet I am one of the few of my generation to use a rotary phone that late. IIRC, it was '93 or so before we got a touchtone phone - and even then it was a pulse dial. Definitely made it suck when I tried to call in to win those radio contests.

That thing was built like a tank, and was my favorite toy. I loved dialing it. It just had a "heft" to the dialing mechanism that wasn't the same on my fishcer price phone. I would hold the receiver button down and dial away.

[MaximRecoil]

ha, I had one of those 500's as the house phone when I was a wee lad...in the late 80's. I bet I am one of the few of my generation to use a rotary phone that late. IIRC, it was '93 or so before we got a touchtone phone - and even then it was a pulse dial. Definitely made it suck when I tried to call in to win those radio contests.

There was a 554 in the kitchen and a 500 in my parents' room when I was a kid (both owned by the phone company of course). Mom let the phone company take them back in '86 (they had been there since '68 when my parents got married) and bought a couple of cheap $20 pushbutton phones from a department store. I hated those crappy phones and their pathetic sounding electronic ringers.

When I acquired the house I grew up in about 9 years ago, I made things right and put a black 554 back on the wall in the kitchen (which I searched for and bought online), which still had the metal wall jack that the phone company installed there in '68. It says on the handset:

Bell System Property
Not For Sale
Western Electric

Just like I remember as a kid.

A while later I came across a 500 that had been used as a kid's toy for God only knows how long. I got that for free and it went into my room.

A few years ago my niece was here and she wanted to call her mother. She went out into the kitchen and picked up the handset and just stared at it for a minute. Then she yelled to me, "Uncle? How do I dial this phone??" LOL.

That thing was built like a tank, and was my favorite toy. I loved dialing it. It just had a "heft" to the dialing mechanism that wasn't the same on my fishcer price phone. I would hold the receiver button down and dial away.

Yeah, they really were built to last forever. The last thing the phone company wanted to do was spend all of their time fixing/replacing their phones that they rented out. 

The 500 and 554 are the same internally BTW, aside from the repositioning of a few parts in order to fit their respective housings.

[zudmsc]

Which brand / model is better for home use?

Michael

[Ken Layton]

Which brand / model is better for home use?

Michael

A genuine Western Electric (also known as A.T. & T.) payphone that came from a Bell System company (Bell South, Qwest, Pacific Bell, etc.) as they are the easiest to convert for home use. Plus the fact they have the good old brass gong mechanical ringers to be easily heard in noisy environments.

All Western Electric single slot payphones have the coin return bucket mounted to the left of the coin box ("vault") door. Other manufacturers have it on the right of the vault door so as not to infringe on Western Electric's patents.

[MaximRecoil]

Which brand / model is better for home use?

Michael

If they are converted for home use then it doesn't matter. If you want it to charge for calls, then you'll need a COCOT. All of the brands mentioned by Ken besides Western Electric are COCOTs by default. Some Western Electrics are COCOTs too, like the one in the attached advertisement:

[zudmsc]

A guy in Chicago is selling old Ameritech phones for $50.00.  They dont have the vault or keys, but do have a vault door.  Is this a good deal and where would I get a vault and keys?

Michael

[Ken Layton]

A guy in Chicago is selling old Ameritech phones for $50.00.  They dont have the vault or keys, but do have a vault door.  Is this a good deal and where would I get a vault and keys?

Michael

www.payphone.com is an excellent parts source.

[ChadTower]

ha, I had one of those 500's as the house phone when I was a wee lad...in the late 80's. I bet I am one of the few of my generation to use a rotary phone that late. IIRC, it was '93 or so before we got a touchtone phone - and even then it was a pulse dial.

My grandfather still had one of those 500s as late as 1992.  He wouldn't get rid of it until his county implemented 911.  911 required a touchtone phone, or so they told us.

[shardian]

Ken, can you clarify something here, as I think it needs to be. I am under the impression that home converted payphones CANNOT be operated on coins. Is there a way to do this, or is that a 100% factual statement?

Granted, you can drop coins in for fun, but they wouldn't do anything.

[Ken Layton]

Retired from service Bell System "dumb" payphones required a signal from the telephone company operator to either collect coins into the cashbox or to return the coins to the customer. This is called "coin line service" which is normally only available to Bell system owned & operated payphones. That is why they are called "dumb" phones because they can't do anything without the telephone company's signal to "tell" the phone what to do with the money. If not converted for home use, coins would just sit in the coin hopper and jam up. The "dumb" circuit board in the phone can be set for price required to make a local phone call. As each coin is deposited, a very quick electronic pulse is sent to the telephone company operator or computer which tallies how much money has been put in. Once the correct amount is reached then the call is put through. In a home converted one, the coin hopper may have been removed or the relay coil is mechanically jammed into the "collect" position so that any coin inserted just falls into the cashbox. This can be a problem sometimes as when the coin relay armature is jammed it mechanically pushes a switch closed that shorts the phone line to ground signaling a constant busy signal. This is how the phone company knew the phone needed to be serviced. They'd call it's phone number and if it had a constant busy signal a coin collector was dispatched first. If the collector found the phone jammed with coins, he'd collect the money and clear the jam. If the problem was more serious the collector would have a service tech dispatched. The dip switches on the "dumb" circuit board are set to "free" pricing.

A privately owned payphone from one of the big 4 private payphone manufacturers has a "smart" circuit board inside it which, when properly programmed, will work with money on home phone lines and work as a fully functioning payphone. By law all payphones provide free 911 and operator calls. Many of the private payphones now have "volume control" functions for the receiver of the handset too.

[ChadTower]

Operators could send those pulses manually, too.  When I was small I used to put a penny in, then call the operator and tell her I needed to call for a ride home but the phone wasn't taking my dime... she would tell me to put it in again, when it didn't work, she would just activate the phone.

[Ken Layton]

Exactly. The telephone company operators had "coin phone" control buttons at their consoles. These signals/pulses are not available on home or business lines. That's why the private payphone manufacturers developed the "smart" circuit boards since "coin lines" were not available to them.

[shardian]

Ah, thanks for that. So when is Saint going to give Ken a custom title? Something like "Smartest man in the room."

[ChadTower]

smart circuit board inside

[Ken Layton]

Here is a picture of a Western Electric model 32-C "dumb" chassis (circuit board assembly) for use with telephone company coin phone lines.

[MaximRecoil]

Question for Ken:

Okay, so my phone (older Intellicall 3003) doesn't seem to work, which doesn't surprise me considering the cheap price and "as-is untested" status. When you plug it in (via the 24 VAC transformer), the coin hopper cycles, dumping any coins sitting in it into the cashbox.

However, when I connect the red and green wires in the phone line to the appropriate terminals on a phone wall jack, there is no dial tone—completely dead.

Assuming everything inside is hooked up correctly (which I believe it to be), would you say the  boardset is bad and/or needs to be programmed? Or maybe the handset is bad? Any suggestions for how I can troubleshoot it?

[Ken Layton]

We never had any Intellicalls on our route. However, it's possible that you simply need to reverse the red and green phone wires.

If that doesn't help the phone may need to be "initialized" and/or programmed (contact the manufacturer or www.theratecenter.com).

Handsets are wired depending on the colors of the wires of your particular handset cable as there are several handset manufacturers out there. What color are the wires coming from your handset? There should be 4 wires.

[MaximRecoil]

We never had any Intellicalls on our route. However, it's possible that you simply need to reverse the red and green phone wires.

In the wall jack, I connected the red and green wires from the payphone to the same terminals that the existing red and green wires coming out of the wall were connected to. Are those sometimes backwards? I'll give it a try.

Edit: I tried it, but I guess that wasn't it. Since the coin hopper is cycling when plugged in, that means it is getting power, so that narrows it down to the board or the handset doesn't it?

If that doesn't help the phone may need to be "initialized" and/or programmed (contact the manufacturer or www.theratecenter.com).

Yeah, Intellicall said they can program the boards for $25 or repair and program for $40. I just want to try and make sure I'm not missing something before sending it to them.

Handsets are wired depending on the colors of the wires of your particular handset cable as there are several handset manufacturers out there. What color are the wires coming from your handset? There should be 4 wires.

The handset has 4 wires: green, black, red, and yellow. They connect to the backside of the keypad which has terminals that are labeled for the colors. The black and green go on the same terminal and then the red and yellow go on separate terminals.

[FrizzleFried]

I remember having some sort of "blue box" or "red box" or some color "box" program on my Commodore 64 that would generate tones.  A quarter sounds would be like 4 or 5 short beeps... I recorded that sound and took it to a payphone once and played it...I got a free call.

I didn't think it would work...but it did.

[sarge]

Tip and ring being reversed shouldn't cause your phone not to have dial tone.  Some things you can try is briefly placing a small battery across the two leads going to the speaker of your handset and listening for a pop.  Also check your hook switch.  I don't have much experience with intellicalls but I know Protel boards have a battery, which if dead, will cause the phone to not have dial tone. 

[Ken Layton]

I believe your handset wiring is this:

red and green are the microphone

yellow and black are the receiver

[MaximRecoil]

Tip and ring being reversed shouldn't cause your phone not to have dial tone.  Some things you can try is briefly placing a small battery across the two leads going to the speaker of your handset and listening for a pop.  Also check your hook switch.  I don't have much experience with intellicalls but I know Protel boards have a battery, which if dead, will cause the phone to not have dial tone. 

Well, the speaker of the handset works (the yellow and green wires make a pop through the speaker when connected to the positive and negative terminals of an AA battery). I don't know how to test the hookswitch. It makes a mechanical click sound when you press it down, like it is supposed to (like the click sound of a microswitch).

There is a short, fat, cylindrical-shaped battery on the boardset, a Sanyo "Laser Lithium" 3V, and it is highly dead—dead as in 0.00 VDC on the multimeter (I also tested the AA battery I used to test the speaker in the handset, just to make sure my multimeter was working correctly and I got 1.59 VDC). Maybe I'll call Intellicall and ask if that would cause the problem.

[Ken Layton]

If the battery is dead then the boards builtin test routine will not allow the board to come up. You'll need to replace the battery for sure and then test the phone again. The battery holds the memory of the phone's operating parameters, pricing, and programming. Chances are after replacing the battery the phone will need to be [programmed since the memory has been lost due to the dead battery.

[MaximRecoil]

If the battery is dead then the boards builtin test routine will not allow the board to come up. You'll need to replace the battery for sure and then test the phone again. The battery holds the memory of the phone's operating parameters, pricing, and programming. Chances are after replacing the battery the phone will need to be [programmed since the memory has been lost due to the dead battery.

Well it looks like I'm sending the boardset to Intellicall. Judging from the $13 cost for a 3V Sanyo Laser Lithium at Radio Shack, those things aren't cheap. Since it will cost $25 just to program it, and only $15 more to repair and program it, then I might as well do that. Plus that will ensure that the boardset is working properly, whereas if I just bought a new battery, there could be other things wrong with the boardset that I don't know about yet.

[Ken Layton]

That sounds like a good plan. When sending the board in, ask them for any manuals too.

[Level42]

This would be our equivalent of those phones:

Would be nice, but these were only in cells on the streets as far as I remember.

In fact, I can't remember seeing a public phone since YEARS !

Those look cool, but not nearly as cool as the typical Western Electric style of payphone which was common from the '70s on (t

I totally agree that the US phones look a lot better than that Dutch one....I remember seeing them in movies/tv and the push button dialing, and hearing the dial tones was really cool we thought ! (Was introduced later here).

So would a modified phone like that work when you use IP-phoning ?

[zudmsc]

I am picking up 2 old Ameritech phones today.  What is the best way to tell if they are complete?  I will have a few to choose from, but they will not be plugged in.  Is there a good model or look to which i should choose?  From the photo I saw they said Ameritech and had the volume increse button on them.

Michael

[Ken Layton]

See the porticus.org link in the earlier part of this thread for a look inside a complete phone. Volume controls on payphones are always optional equipment and only work with certain keypads and circuit board assemblies. If the phone already has a volume control on it then it has the correct parts installed.

[zudmsc]

Ok thanks.  What happens if I dont the keys or a T-Bar?  Does someone sell T-Bars and can I drill out the key lock?

Michael

[Ken Layton]

T-keys and locks are commonly available at the parts suppliers in the provided in the early part of this thread.

[zudmsc]

Does anyone know how to pick or drill a lock on a Western Electric / AT&T phone?

Michael

[Level42]

Is anyone soon coming to Europe and willing to carry one of those payphones as hand-luggage