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Fighting a Traffic Ticket in Court - UPDATE: I WON!!!!!!!!!!!

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boykster:
I just don't speed, run stale yellow/ red lights, and even come to a complete stop at stop signs!  Sure, I might get to where i'm going a whole minute or two later than you do, but :dunno

Haven't had a traffic violation in over 18 years  :angel:

patrickl:

--- Quote from: ChadTower on January 09, 2008, 12:55:23 pm ---I'd love to see someone present an "I wasn't paying enough attention to stop safely" defense.    ;D

--- End quote ---
I was in court myself once (I got cought with my radar detector and got called to court instead of a fine) and an elderly couple ahead of me tried to pull off the "I wasn't paying attention so it wasn't my fault" defense. The guy was looking at a speedboat on the water and rear ended the car in front of him. A cop fined him for not paying attention and the guy went to court thinking the judge would be lenient on him since his wife pointed out the boat to him. Seriously bizarre.

The guy after him tried the "I thought the speed sign near road works was just an advisory speed instead of an actual speed limit" defense. Seriously! The judge really ripped that guy apart. It was hilarious. He had to pay something like 800 euro though (120km/h in a 70km/h zone and road works doubles the fine).

In both cases the judge increased the settlement they were offered by 20%. Just for wasting his time.

Jdurg:

--- Quote from: shardian on January 09, 2008, 03:30:29 pm ---I would think that unless you are in a tiny hillbilly town in which the sole income of the town is tickets, you would only get a warning for something like this. Either the cop was on his period, or you did something to piss him off.

I've only been caught with the yellow light thing once and I had the ultimate defense with me - a pissed off pregnant wife. ;D I ended up with a warning, an apology, AND a sympathetic nod. :laugh2:

--- End quote ---

After seeing a boatload of cop cars on the roads in the areas last night and today (all of them in tandem nonetheless), it appears as if the Police Acadamy just graduated a bunch of cadets and now they are out on the roads en masse doing on-the-street training.  I really took note of this when I saw a lot of the cops out there were VERY young, and the other officers with them were of the older variety.

So I think I got hit by a kid who just wanted to "break his cherry" so to speak.

Now for is it worth it?  Yes.  I do believe it is.  I feel 100% that I am right and I am being wronged here.  I do not believe that the "oh well, that just the way it is" philosophy should apply.  When I have been wronged I refuse to just "accept it".  I did that for a great portion of my life and came as close to suicide as you could ever imagine because I just "accepted it" when I was being harassed, screwed over, or crapped on.  If I in any way had any doubts that I was Not Guilty I'd have sucked it up, paid the fine, gotten the two points on my license and gone broke with car insurance for the next two years.  As I read through the state law regarding traffic signals, I gain more confidence in my being correct.  Here is a section pertaining to green lights;


--- Quote ---(1) Circular green alone: Vehicular traffic facing a green signal may proceed straight through or turn right or left unless a sign or marking at such place prohibits either such turn or straight through movement, except that such traffic shall yield the right-of-way to pedestrians and vehicles lawfully within a crosswalk or the intersection at the time such signal was exhibited;
--- End quote ---

Circular green alone: Vehicular traffic facing a green signal may proceed straight through or turn right or left:  This indicates that those with a Circular Green signal have the right of way and can go straight, right, or left.

unless a sign or marking at such place prohibits either such turn or straight through movement:  This indicates that their ability to go straight or turn is not allowed if there is a sign or marking stating that they can not.

except that such traffic shall yield the right-of-way to pedestrians and vehicles lawfully within a crosswalk or the intersection at the time such signal was exhibited:  This means that their right of way does not apply if a car or pedestrian was already in the intersection when their green signal was given.


--- Quote ---(2) Yellow: Vehicular traffic facing a steady yellow signal is thereby warned that the related green movement is being terminated or that a red indication will be exhibited immediately thereafter, when vehicular traffic shall stop before entering the intersection unless so close to the intersection that a stop cannot be made in safety; pedestrians facing a steady yellow signal, except when directed by separate pedestrian-control signals, are thereby advised that there is insufficient time to cross the roadway before a red indication is shown and no pedestrian shall then start to cross the roadway.
--- End quote ---

Yellow: Vehicular traffic facing a steady yellow signal is thereby warned that the related green movement is being terminated or that a red indication will be exhibited immediately thereafter:  This means that your rights and privileges relating to the Green Signal are ending.  It does not mean that they have ended.

when vehicular traffic shall stop before entering the intersection unless so close to the intersection that a stop cannot be made in safety:  This means that cars need to stop before entering the intersection unless stopping would be done unsafely.  (In my case, if I stopped it would mean that I would have to slam on my breaks, possibly losing traction with the damp pavement, and potentially causing someone coming up behind me to slam into my back end).

The red light portion simply states that if a red light is present you must stop before entering the intersection.

By fighting this, the officer has to prove that I could have stopped my car safely prior to entering the intersection, since the green light section indicates that if I am already in the intersection I retain my right of way.  So the cop will need to have measurements of where my car was when his light turned green, how fast I was going, what my light color was when I entered the intersection, etc. etc.  That's a lot that he will need to prove.  He also can't say "Well if he wasn't able to stop safely then he must have been speeding" since you can't serve a speeding infraction without any proof. 

This is the part that my friend said I need to pay close attention to because the officer will have a very tough time proving all of those points without any reasonable doubt.  By taking a look at his notes, I'll easily be able to see where he was positioned and what possible angle he could have of my approach.

It's really the green light section that I had just browsed over before that is going to help.  It clearly states that the vehicles with a green light must yield to vehicles already in the intersection at the onset of their green light.  :D



(This is actually kind of fun reading through the traffic laws).  :D

RayB:
It's amazing how people think that "mistakes" aren't their responsibility. It doesn't matter if you intended to make the mistake or not, its still your responsibility. The purpose of getting ticketed and fined is to ensure people wake up and pay more attention so mistakes don't happen as much.

JDrug: Go to the intersection and measure the timing of the lights (same day and time). You might find it supports your argument, or you might find it does not.

AtomSmasher:

--- Quote from: Jdurg on January 09, 2008, 04:46:31 pm ---It's really the green light section that I had just browsed over before that is going to help.  It clearly states that the vehicles with a green light must yield to vehicles already in the intersection at the onset of their green light.  :D

--- End quote ---
That would be helpful if another car hit you and you were arguing over the fault of the accident, but I really don't see how that would help you out of your ticket.

Good luck with your case, but I agree with several others here in that it will come down to your word against the cops.

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