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I'm amazed at how many people have the wrong idea...

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ChadTower:
The part that makes me nervous is his lack of understanding of how the alpha male dynamic works.  Sooner or later that dog is going to take its shot at becoming alpha male.  Maybe it will just growl around a bit and back down... maybe it will rip his ribcage out.  Depends on the dog, really.  There is also going to be a time when someone or some other dog challenges that dog's spot in the hierarchy - that will be when it is forced to protect its spot as #2.  Odds are it will be a visiting dog, maybe a dog passing on the street... but god forbid it be a 5 year old niece that somehow challenges for #2 in the pack.  That's the thing that motivates pit bulls more than other dogs.  They are extraordinarily reactive to pecking order challenges.

Cheffo, when I was a kid I used to train dogs with two guys who had been doing it 35 years and had been taught by their own father who did it 40.  These guys developed a breed, training methods, and hunting style.  Took them decades.  Just the concept of what tommy is saying about changing the basic nature of the dog would have gotten him thrown off the property.

shardian:

--- Quote from: tommy on October 23, 2007, 04:44:05 pm ---They NEED to put in the time or they should no be allowed to own a dog, especially a pit bull or other big dogs. When a dog gets out of control the owner is responsible. You gotta take responsibility with these dogs, they are not a toy and just like a child they need direction and need to know what is required of them by you taking charge and leading them, yes by leading.

--- End quote ---
That is true. Unfortunately, they don't which is why lawmakers are being pressured to enact laws banning the ownership of Pit Bulls. So instead of bitching on here, go whine and complain to your fellow Pit Bull owners.

Ed_McCarron:

--- Quote from: ChadTower on October 23, 2007, 04:51:07 pm ---Cheffo, when I was a kid I used to train dogs

--- End quote ---

Can you just post a list of what you -haven't- done?  It might save bandwidth.

shmokes:
My brother is a professional dog trainer.  He used to train obedience and protection but got bored with it and trains/breeds stock dogs exclusively.  He's won many championships in stock dog trialling (think Babe, the sheep pig), including the Utah and Nevada state championships (he actually held those simultaneously at one point).  When he raises and trains a dog it regularly sells in the neighborhood of $10k (a couple of guys with a couple of good stock dogs can turn a three-day trip with 6 or 8 guys to gather a herd of cows or sheep off a mountain into a single afternoon of minimal effort).  He essentially reiterates exactly what Chad just said.

ChadTower:
I've mentioned this particular thing before.  If you come across a copy of this book it talks about the couple of guys in southern NS that are credited with developing that breed and the tolling style it uses.  The name used is my great grandfather and I think my great uncle as well but my memory is foggy on the second one.  I caught the very tail end of my great uncle training the dogs before his health started to fail.  Those guys knew more in their pinky about dog training than most professionals will ever learn.

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